I will get more in to the Apple pick in my review, which I hope to have done Monday or Tuesday. But long story short...it was a GOOD pick. Sure, I preferred Hargreaves but they had essentially the same grade on my board and they got there in different ways. Reese prefers the size/speed/long term potential and you can't blame him for that. Apple has as much upside as any CB in the draft.
But on to day 2....
The Myles Jack saga is so unfortunate. I really feel bad for the kid but you know what, its a part of the process. Someone is going to take this kid in round 2. Even if you are scared by the knee...at some point you have to take a chance. If you wanna play the statistics game...you might as well just go for it on Jack. Thats my stance. Take the chance. The potential reward is through the roof and he isn't a guy that only relies on speed/agility.
Otherwise, I don't see a name that stands out. I do see a group of players that NYG should be thrilled about potentially getting. Last night I tried to come up with a list of names that I think Reese will go after. I have to think he wants guys that he knows will contribute right away. His job is on the line and his franchise QB is on the back nine of his career. So with that said, even though I bet they like OT Jason Spriggs and his unreal athletic ability, he won't see snaps in 2016. He isn't ready for the power of the NFL. So I think he is out. I feel they will view TE Hunter Henry the same way although Henry is near the top of my personal board. Henry may not jump Donnell or Tye right away and I don't think this team has any interest in their 2nd rounder sitting for a year. I think he could be the offensive weapon this team is looking for, however.
How about OG Cody Whitehair? He is my top OG (besides OC Ryan Kelly who was drafted already). The debate is, does he fit the athletic, zone blocking scheme that NYG wants? And he may need a year of strength work as well. Again, he is a guy that would have a hard time seeing the field and I think Reese looks elsewhere because of it.
This brings me to WR. There is only one guy I think they see worthy in this upcoming spot, and that is slot WR Sterling Shepard. I would be happy with the pick. He is a year one contributor and I think he can be a mix of Doug Baldwin/Steve Smith/healthy Victor Cruz. The issue with him? If NYG gets Cruz to come back all in, they kind of have two guys that are woefully similar and work best out of the slot. That isn't ideal. That could limit Shepard's snaps and once again, I don't think Reese wants that out of his 2nd rounder. Plus, I'm not sure they will see the upside in him.
Now we move on tot he defensive side of the ball. NYG spent a lot of money at DE/DT/CB, then spent q 1st rounder on a CB. Do they keep adding to that side of the ball? I am leaning towards yes. Its the side of the ball where they can get these kids more snaps and a good defense always keeps you in the game. So with that said I think they are looking at 5 or 6 names here.
Jarran Reed - DT/Alabama
Emmanuel Ogbah - DE/Oklahoma State
]Vonn Bell - S/Ohio State
Sean Davis - S/Maryland
Justin Simmons - S/Boston College
Reggie Ragland - LB/Alabama
Reed gives them a really big, really active DT that can see 10+ snaps per game right away. He has pass rush upside that I don't think NYG gets out of Harrison. That could be a nice rotation to have. Sure, he wouldn't start but he is a safe pick in that you know he will at the very least provide quality depth and run defense. Sticking to the DL....Ogbah is a guy that NYG has always liked. Tall, long, thick, and good straight line speed. Ogbah has tools and maybe the best among DE in this class. NYG always wants more DEs and knowing JPP could be out of here in a year, this is a nice backup plan to have. This kid could see the field plenty in year one too.
The 3 safeties....I am less confident Reese will be looking at. They have so many "homegrown" bodies back there and maybe pride and/or inflated views of them prevents the FO from bringing in another young safety. Bell is somewhat similar tools-wise to what they have. Simmons and Davis have size though and I think Spagnuolo could potentially be pounding the table for them. End of the day it is a position without a starter and adding another body would be a good thing. Davis could even double as an extra CB should injuries arise.
If I had to make a guess right now who the pick is going to be, I am going with Ragland. Ragland might not be a 3 down LB but he is almost a sure bet to be a solid piece that will make the defense better. He is safe. I think Reese wants safe and a guy that will fill a need. Ragland can start at MIKE tomorrow, literally.
I won't get as deep in to what I expect in round 3 because we don't know what is going to happen here at #40....but in terms of where I think the board will be, that is where NYG will go after OL. Shon Coleman, Parker Ehinger, Willie Beavers, and Brandon Shell are a few OTs to look for. They could look at OGs that fit the scheme like Connor McGovern, Rees Odhiambo, Joe Dahl, and Christian Westerman as well. If they don't see the value there, look for them to add a WR liek Charone Peake, Tyler Boyd, Malcolm Mitchell, Kenny Lawler, Cody Core, or Michael Thomas.
So there... I think NYG goes DL or LB in round 2. OL or WR in round 3.
I would be happy with Jack, Ragland, Shepard, Bell, Henry, Spriggs, and Reed. I really hope the Giants take a chance on Jack. That would really be exciting. But the Giants have needs all over the place. Wouldn't mind a good S or OL.
As far as who is left, I would take Billings or Ogbah, but my guess is that the Giants take Fackrell. He is Leonard Floyd “light.” Same lean, lanky, body type at 6’5” and 245. I wouldn’t take him. He’s 25, tore an ACL in September 2014, and that body type is likely to be broken in two in the NFL.
Hargreaves
As far as who is left, I would take Billings or Ogbah, but my guess is that the Giants take Fackrell. He is Leonard Floyd “light.” Same lean, lanky, body type at 6’5” and 245. I wouldn’t take him. He’s 25, tore an ACL in September 2014, and that body type is likely to be broken in two in the NFL.
You know it's the draft, right? Upside is hugely important.
I don't think the owners will switch GMs. They don't want to be in another situation where the GM can say that they didn't get to choose the coach.
Reese being on the hot seat is a fabrication of fans.
If drafting were a science any schmuck could do it. More than potential the b team has once again been focusing on athleticism at impact positions. How many times did we see Wade get burned in coverage last year? Spagnuolo wants to be more aggressive with his CB, but considering our current crop of Safeties that meant we needed to get a more athletic CB with recovery speed
Henry would add a much needed offensive weapon and at a position that is still relevant even IF Cruz is back and healthy.
My gut agrees with Sy re: DL/LB in round 2. Plenty of snaps for the primary DL backups, especially at DT (hopefully Owa can step up at DE), and Hankins & JPP are both potential FAs after 2016. LB - could use an upgrade at every spot.
Upside doesn't mean the production isn't there. Floyd would've been drafted on upside and pass rush potential despite the lack of production, but as Dave Te' pointed out, Eli Apple has the production to match his upside.
And the production we're gonna feel from Apple is all the yellow hankies he draws trying to cover Dez & Co.
I said it before, fix the Lines both offensive and defensive before you worry about either WR or the Secondary.
Don't care what it takes but fix those first and everything else will improve.
Honestly I want the Giants to take Simmons. We need FS.
And the production we're gonna feel from Apple is all the yellow hankies he draws trying to cover Dez & Co.
I said it before, fix the Lines both offensive and defensive before you worry about either WR or the Secondary.
Don't care what it takes but fix those first and everything else will improve.
I completely agree. If you have a weak spot on either line you MUST address those as your highest priority because they effect every other position on their side of the ball. It's just sound Football 101!
• Robinson, A'Shawn (DT)
• Ogbah, Emmanuel (DE)
• Billings, Andrew (DT)
• Spence, Noah (DE)
• Jack, Myles (LB)
• Ragland, Reggie (LB)
On the O, I would be happy with (in no particular order)
• Whitehair, Cody (OG)
• Spriggs, Jason (OT)
• Shepard, Sterling (WR)
• Thomas, Michael (WR)
There are plenty of competent LB coaches around the NFL, and Greg Jones is now in the CFL. I feel confident in stating that he simply wasn't an NFL linebacker.
This is my thinking as well. Ogbah seems like a Giant type DE and we could be set at the position if he and OO pan out.
I think they'd be leaving better talent on the board if they went WR or OT in round 2.
Reed from Bama would be a nice pick. Can't really comment on Jack bc no one here has access to the information to make a decision on the knee.
I think they have their eye on Ogbah as well. It's too bad they don't have about 5 early second round picks, because there are a bunch of players there that would really fill some areas of need.
And yet it happens every draft thread.
This day two years ago people were convinced the Giants blew a draft pick on a 5'10 punt returner.
Sy, were you a scout at one time? You certainly know your stuff.
And the production we're gonna feel from Apple is all the yellow hankies he draws trying to cover Dez & Co.
I said it before, fix the Lines both offensive and defensive before you worry about either WR or the Secondary.
Don't care what it takes but fix those first and everything else will improve.
Agreed
That is where my head is at.
2. DT Andrew Billings (Shocked he hasn't been drafted. This guy is a freak and just 20 years old. His upside is off the charts! At 311 lbs he had like a 35 inch vert!)
3. DE Emmanuel Ogbah (very under rated IMO. Still learning I think is why. I love his upside)
4. WR Sterling Sheppard (Ok I have called him a slot WR, but the more I watch him the more I like him. Very good kid also.)
5. DE Kevin Dodd (played on a talented Def and on the other side of Shaq Lawson, but played extremely well. has good size)
6. OT Le'Raven Clark (here is the thing... He is a LT IMO. Good feet and extremely long arms. He has amazing potential to be elite. That is saying something so I can't pass on him)
7. DE Noah Spence (Not sure on the fit, but I think he is very talented as a pass rusher. He has worked hard to stay clean and I don't think his history is as much of a risk as others)
8. FS Vonn Bell (won't happen... they won't draft him, but I like him a lot)
9. WR Tyler Boyd (amazing hands. Under rated because his last year they switched how they used him and his yards per catch went way down. Runs good routes and I think will be a solid #2 WR for years!)
10. DT/DE Jonathan Bullard (I think he is a pass rushing DT. I love his get off. He can play DE though also making him very flexible for a team that had only 2 good DEs and 2 good DTs... That puts his value way up for me.)
Players I really like even though they are probably 3rd rounders... LB Scooby Wright and WR Michael Thomas Southern Miss
Players that will be on most peoples top 10 A'shawn Robinson, Jarran Reed, Carl Nassib, and Reggie Ragland.. I like them all and would be happy with any of them.
Acid, LOL
But, you might only get one
2> Kevin Dodd (too much value Edge > DT)
3> Jarran Reed (too much value.. stud)
4> Sterling Sheppard (plug and play.. Lockett)
5> Cody Whitehair (completes our line and offers versatility).
As far as who is left, I would take Billings or Ogbah, but my guess is that the Giants take Fackrell. He is Leonard Floyd “light.” Same lean, lanky, body type at 6’5” and 245. I wouldn’t take him. He’s 25, tore an ACL in September 2014, and that body type is likely to be broken in two in the NFL.
Sy had a one point difference in grade. He likes the player. You are parsing his words. We get it you don't like the pick. That shouldn't have anything to do a what he's posting. . It's not just about upside w Apple. Hargreaves on his best day can't cover the bigger WRs in the NFL play in and play out. And they just gave Jenkins a deal who is virtually the same player. And don't kid yourself. If DRC falls off at all in the next year or two they plan to slide Apple right in.
And even if you don't like it and I know I don't but the Giants look and certain measurables size wise at positons. It matters to them
Quote:
don’t defend the Apple pick by using the word “upside.” At ten, we needed a more polished player, or for Reese to trade down.
As far as who is left, I would take Billings or Ogbah, but my guess is that the Giants take Fackrell. He is Leonard Floyd “light.” Same lean, lanky, body type at 6’5” and 245. I wouldn’t take him. He’s 25, tore an ACL in September 2014, and that body type is likely to be broken in two in the NFL.
Sy had a one point difference in grade. He likes the player. You are parsing his words. We get it you don't like the pick. That shouldn't have anything to do a what he's posting. . It's not just about upside w Apple. Hargreaves on his best day can't cover the bigger WRs in the NFL play in and play out. And they just gave Jenkins a deal who is virtually the same player. And don't kid yourself. If DRC falls off at all in the next year or two they plan to slide Apple right in.
And even if you don't like it and I know I don't but the Giants look and certain measurables size wise at positons. It matters to them
I wasn’t trying to parse his words. I’m sorry if it came off that way. I know he likes the pick. I like Apple, just not at #10. I certainly agree that the Giants have measurable requirements for positions.
People say that because he wasnt mocked until lower and hardly ever to the Giants. They think they draft board is everyone's draft... even when news gets out that the Rams were thinking of trading up for Apple, Miami was thinking Apple, and i heard the Raiders liked Apple also. I wouldn't be surprised if TB had Apple as their top CB and felt safe that the Giants would take him because he wasn't linked to them
I'll never understand how you can like a guy at 15, but not at 10. Is it really that big of a deal?
If you like a guy, if he fits what you do and fills a pressing need, you take him...and Devil take Mackworth Castle!
Oh, sorry. I channeled Tony Curtis there, for a moment.
Quote:
Do you think he would've been around for our next pick? I doubt it. So if he's good, he's good, whatever spot. Bring him on board.
I'll never understand how you can like a guy at 15, but not at 10. Is it really that big of a deal?
If you like a guy, if he fits what you do and fills a pressing need, you take him...and Devil take Mackworth Castle!
Oh, sorry. I channeled Tony Curtis there, for a moment.
So you're a Bernie Schwartz fan?