You can just look at the depth chart and see these were our two most glaring needs. It wasn't even close.
Now, Apple may or may not have been worth the #10 pick in your mind, but the Giants (right or wrong) felt he was the best CB in the draft.
The good news? CB position addressed with another starter. Yes, the third CB is a starter. We don't have to rely on Trevis Wade or Leon McFadden or Tramain Jacobs as a starter now.
Reese seems intent on building this defense from the rear backwards. That's why it was a bad pick and it remains a bad pick.
Defenses are built from the DL, then the LB then the Secondary. We seem intent on doing the reverse which is why we'll keep failing IMO.
Did we not just add players to the DL via free agency? Or did I dream that? I'm not sure.
Meanwhile our Offense has more holes than swiss cheese. And our biggest need is OT. The assumption that flowers has the LT position locked down is a very risky game.
Absolutely dead on... you nailed it with this!!!
Reese seems intent on building this defense from the rear backwards. That's why it was a bad pick and it remains a bad pick.
Defenses are built from the DL, then the LB then the Secondary. We seem intent on doing the reverse which is why we'll keep failing IMO.
Like dep026... this is dead on correct. Absolutely. Perfectly said.
There are reasons to knock Reese but the off season plan makes sense. And, the Titans taking Conklin was the only thing that pissed me off yesterday.
You can make do and scheme around a shakey OL. Not so much for your defensive backfield. Hopefully we see a WR or T/G today that can help out immediately.
I probably would rate RT higher than CB. I agree we needed a third CB but I feel we could have waited to the third round and drafted a Will Redmond to play the nickle role. If they put a premium on Apple because they want to replace DRC well to me that is just spinning our wheels. I'm tired of simply replacing roster personnel and not getting better in other areas. I actually have less issues with Apple than I do with the entire off season strategy.
On the right side of the OL we have back ups starting, which means we will have back ups backing up the back ups. We still have a lot of cash under the cap, Reese could have made an aggressive play for a RT early on in FA in addition to Jenkins, Vernon, and Harrison but he chose not to. He could have gone after Mitchell Schwartz or Osemele but we know from Hitdog they weren't even on the radar scope. He looks into Okung who doesn't want to play RT and Penn, who we maybe could have gotten earlier if we were more aggressive, decides to stay in Oakland, despite the Raiders signing Osemele. So, we were forced to rely on the draft and it didn't break our way. Any one who has been following the run up to this draft knows there is a precipitous drop in OT options after the first round. Guards there may be more options but not so much at RT.
The defense was atrocious last year but equally as bad was our four minute offense and our glaring inability to run the ball when needed. Also until we find a way to keep the Eagles from harassing our QB, I find it difficult to envision this team better than 8-8
At the risk of stating hte obvious, we only had one 1st round pick. We are not done and for this to be a productive season we are going to have to get some serious contributors from the middle rounds.
I probably would rate RT higher than CB. I agree we needed a third CB but I feel we could have waited to the third round and drafted a Will Redmond to play the nickle role. If they put a premium on Apple because they want to replace DRC well to me that is just spinning our wheels. I'm tired of simply replacing roster personnel and not getting better in other areas. I actually have less issues with Apple than I do with the entire off season strategy.
On the right side of the OL we have back ups starting, which means we will have back ups backing up the back ups. We still have a lot of cash under the cap, Reese could have made an aggressive play for a RT early on in FA in addition to Jenkins, Vernon, and Harrison but he chose not to. He could have gone after Mitchell Schwartz or Osemele but we know from Hitdog they weren't even on the radar scope. He looks into Okung who doesn't want to play RT and Penn, who we maybe could have gotten earlier if we were more aggressive, decides to stay in Oakland, despite the Raiders signing Osemele. So, we were forced to rely on the draft and it didn't break our way. Any one who has been following the run up to this draft knows there is a precipitous drop in OT options after the first round. Guards there may be more options but not so much at RT.
The defense was atrocious last year but equally as bad was our four minute offense and our glaring inability to run the ball when needed. Also until we find a way to keep the Eagles from harassing our QB, I find it difficult to envision this team better than 8-8
Another dead-on post.
Very well played!
And I can see the value in a a 3rd CB. That's a starter and we have dross (although I have to think that among the three or four ersatz FS candidates, at least one might be a serviceable CB). Still, its a decent need.
However, the gap up in desperate need from the CB to the WR spot is Grand Canyon-sized. I still feel that there is nothing, nada, zilch left in FA that could fill it effectively and I don't think that there is enough left in the draft to help us this year. We need an impact person and a person who can not only hold the fort but shine if/when OBJ loses time to injury or suspension. I am unshakeable that this is a fatal flaw for this team, no matter who we draft in any spot last night or going forward. For all his flaws, and they were legion, Ruben Randle plus the FA we signed plus this draft gave us divisional championship potential. Now, I feel that, no matter who we draft, next season we are unlikely to be better than who were we this past December.
they too a world class athlete in Apple - and CB is a premium position - and the Giants had him rated higher than Hargreaves who was ranked generally as a top 10 prospect
unfortunately, the prospects in round 2 don;t look great for RT either - so more than likely - and I'm not saying the Giants don't need a RT - but more than likely the value isn;t there.
there are a number of ways to go in round 2 -- there is a good WR still on the board -- we'll see if he's there when the Giants pick -- but there are still some great options available if not -- You can always use a good player
very good DTs will be available at 40 by the way
CB's a different story, particularly for a 3 or 4 year perspective.
From the looks of things the Giants can help themselves this Friday at DT, OG, WR and possibly TE, although I no doubt Hunter Henry lasts until #40.
We'll see what happens.
Meanwhile our Offense has more holes than swiss cheese. And our biggest need is OT. The assumption that flowers has the LT position locked down is a very risky game.
You do know that nickel corner is effectively a starter in today's pass happy league, yes? He will see SIGNIFICANT playing time this year imo..It's one of the most underrated "starting' positions on a team, imv..It's importance nowadays is huge..
So they took the best CB (in their view) of the entire draft.
Our defense was the third worst in NFL history. Let that sink in for a moment.
31, patience buddy..:)
So they took the best CB (in their view) of the entire draft.
Our defense was the third worst in NFL history. Let that sink in for a moment.
Lot of resources went into in FA. I know you have said things about DRC's future, so this is why Apple better pan out. Not only is he needed now, he will expect to start next year plus we have issues on the other side of the ball. While the pick makes sense - it's still a very risky one.
So they took the best CB (in their view) of the entire draft.
Our defense was the third worst in NFL history. Let that sink in for a moment.
I knew Tunsil wasn't going to be in consideration. They are content with Flowers at LT and taking Tunsil with the baggage wasn't going to happen. I'm fine with that. I really have nothing against the Apple selection. Its just the whole off-season strategy that I am perplexed by.
Michael Thomas - Ohio State
Sterling Shepard - Oklahoma
Pharoh Cooper - South Carolina
Tyler Boyd - Pitt
Leonte Carroo - Rutgers
None of them are the second coming of ODB, but they don't have to be.
Spnece is the only DE I would even consider for the line in the 2nd round because of the upside. I know people like Dodd, but Spence was big time recruit, and produced at both schools. Sure he has character issues, but sometimes you gotta take a chance.
Didn't like seeing Ifedi go to Seattle but it still leaves Sprigs in RD #2.
So far Reese, has gone all out on defense......the defense should be better, but still a glaring need at safety.....
Offense, we scored a lot of points playing catch up, in the NO games and Car games.....when we needed to score, or control the clock and keep the defense off the field, we came up woefully short....not to mention the brain farts we had on play calling/execution......
The offense is basically, a one trick pony of Eli to OBj....there are no other weapons......and unless there is some improvement on the right side of the line, via draft or other teams castoffs, this offense will come up short again....like it did in the Dallas, Atlanta, New England, Washington, Jets, and Vikings games...
Jason Spriggs OT
Henry Hunter TE
Cody Whitehair OG
Sterling Sheppard WR
Michael Thomas WR
One would think they have to be considered .
Not getting a FA OT or WR or FS is a bit of a
head scratchier .
I was Ok with CB at one as a contingency
but now that the Dust has settled this Kid Apple
needs to be a Star .
But since the mocks projected him at about 20, they scream it is a reach. I was surprised, but I have to give the Giants scouts and organization the benefit of the doubt. The thing about Hargreaves was that he was a little slow and small, and may be best at slot corner, Apple will eventually be a starting corner, he is only 20 years old, will help out at slot this season, and be our eventual starting corner.
If it were me making the pick, I would have thought about Rankins there also, but I can live with a corner.
So far Reese, has gone all out on defense......the defense should be better, but still a glaring need at safety.....
Offense, we scored a lot of points playing catch up, in the NO games and Car games.....when we needed to score, or control the clock and keep the defense off the field, we came up woefully short....not to mention the brain farts we had on play calling/execution......
The offense is basically, a one trick pony of Eli to OBj....there are no other weapons......and unless there is some improvement on the right side of the line, via draft or other teams castoffs, this offense will come up short again....like it did in the Dallas, Atlanta, New England, Washington, Jets, and Vikings games...
Agree with everything. Giants could not get the TD to put games away in spite of our crappy defense. We have no red zone threats and very little besides OBJ to worry an DC.
It HAS to be WR in rd two. Shepard ? Boyd? Peake?
Reese seems intent on building this defense from the rear backwards. That's why it was a bad pick and it remains a bad pick.
Defenses are built from the DL, then the LB then the Secondary. We seem intent on doing the reverse which is why we'll keep failing IMO.
^ This is absolutely ridiculous.
The Giants have spent a ton of resources on the D-Line this off-season and have routinely invested resources such as high draft picks in this area in the past several years.
Let's get a grip, people.
With a good defense, or a more reliable defense, he would have stuck with the running game more and trusted our defense if we didn't get the first down, instead of gambling the way he did. It was all due to a horrible defense. Just look at Denver and Seattle the year before the New England miracle. Defense still wins in this pass happy every advantage we can give to the offense league.
2. Some of us have been saying for months this pick would likely be a CB, WR, or DE. Many disregarded this.
The Giants likely felt Apple was the only player that carried the grade at one of those positions.
I didn't expect them to pick Apple at 10, but many of us expected them to have a high grade on him.
2. Some of us have been saying for months this pick would likely be a CB, WR, or DE. Many disregarded this.
The Giants likely felt Apple was the only player that carried the grade at one of those positions.
I didn't expect them to pick Apple at 10, but many of us expected them to have a high grade on him.
But do they really have their Left Tackle? Flowers gets beat with edge speed... he did so on a bad ankle in the pro game and on a good ankle in the college game. He's simply not the nimblest guy out their manning the left side gate. He's huge... and it ain't easy dancing quickly with a body like that.
In any event, it's still a mystery to me why Reese shot his mouth off a thousand times that they are set at LT with Ereck Flowers? That's giving away needless draft information in my opinion.
Also, I want to amend my previous post. When I said DE I should have said edge rusher.
Yes CB is thin, but your starting quarterback isn't going to get killed (and your team's chances along with it) if McFadden happens to be starting.
This is why, to me, OL was and is the most glaring need and why I was pissed they didn't take Tunsil warts and all.
If we don't address the line I'm gonna need the bong/gasmask to get through the season...
Unless you believe both JPP and Hankins will bounce back to what they were at their best and that Bromley will actually contribute to the position.
Again the NYG defense was at its best when it had a relentless pass rush, not a secondary that was stacked.
I know the salary cap precludes teams from having both but what I'm saying is the Jints Front Office has chosen the wrong end to focus on.