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To everyone saying not to draft Jack...

Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:19 am
I try to warn people not to become sheeple (people who flock like sheep to a bad opinion or otherwise stated comment). Uninformed fans hear one thing on the radio or TV and quickly change their opinion. Firstly, for anyone posting and writing Miles Jack is automatically discredited, learn the guy's name before conforming to an opinion you heard or read somewhere. Secondly, you cannot coach talent! I get that this is a draft where Jerry Reese has to swing and hit, he can't miss on picks but you know who can? The Giants organization can, they are still going to be here long after Jerry Reese is gone. Giants not having the "Triple Threat" at LB like they did in the 80's, this draft is almost a gift horse. I would take both Myles Jack and Jaylon Smith, two players projected top 10, even top 5 picks at a position of need who are young and talented. I know the trolls will be out and say I'm an idiot because they may never see the field but what if they do? When was the last time someone was able to draft two top 5 1st rounders? Who couldn't see a future defense with the young cornerstones of it being Landon Collins, Eli Apple, Myles Jack, Jaylon Smith and Olivier Vernon...to me the reward here outweighs the risk.
Firstly?  
Cruzin : 4/29/2016 8:21 am : link
.
Im sooooo glad  
LeonofKiev : 4/29/2016 8:21 am : link
you're not the GM.
Jack would look great in street clothes watching the Giants  
ZogZerg : 4/29/2016 8:27 am : link
every Sunday. It doesn't matter how good you are if you can't play. We know that all too well.
RE: Im sooooo glad  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:28 am : link
In comment 12931529 LeonofKiev said:
Quote:
you're not the GM.

Eh, you win some, you lose some, I'll try my hand at running for President next.
It would be phenomenal  
Hot Rod in Florida : 4/29/2016 8:30 am : link
If we ended up with Apple, a legitimate 1st rounder and a legitimate top 5 player without the injury risk with a 2nd round pick. I have no idea whether the guy's knee will hold up or for how long. We'll see what the Giants think soon. If they haven't ruled him out, I'd even trade up to get him.
An interesting concept, and a reasoned opinion,  
Mark C : 4/29/2016 8:32 am : link
from someone who has zero information on which to base it. I want Jack too. I want him to fall to 40, and I really want the Giants to take a chance on him. But if they choose not to, I'm not going to do what 80% of BBI will do, which is to blame Reese for being too cautious or asleep at the switch. I'm going to assume the knee is really bad. Because the only real information I have right now is that 31 teams have passed on arguably the most talented player in this year's draft.
people  
PaulBlakeTSU : 4/29/2016 8:33 am : link
not wanting Jack because of his injury are not trolls.

I haven't examined his knee... none of us have. Any of us would love to have Jack if there were no injury risk. But for a team that perhaps had the worst five-year stretch of injuries in NFL history, it's understandable why some may not want to draft a guy with health problems.
RE: Jack would look great in street clothes watching the Giants  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:33 am : link
In comment 12931548 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
every Sunday. It doesn't matter how good you are if you can't play. We know that all too well.

I guess my question would be are the alternatives really better options? In the 2nd round I would say some are, outside of that, you're talking about players who are a crapshoot anyway...possible starters, role players, practice squad guys or guys who might not even be on the team in a year or two.

I get the injury concern from a fan perspective, I really do but I personally feel the talent is too good to pass up.
You Talk About Uniformed Fans NOT Wanting Jack...  
Jim in Tampa : 4/29/2016 8:35 am : link
But you're just as uniformed as they are.

You think he's worth the risk...based on what?

Have you reviewed his medical information?

Are you an orthopedic surgeon who has taken time out of his busy day to post on a football message board?

We are ALL uniformed when it comes to Jack, but the fact that all 31 teams passed on him in the 1st round speaks volumes.
Yes, a starting CB is much better  
ZogZerg : 4/29/2016 8:36 am : link
Than an injured player
RE: An interesting concept, and a reasoned opinion,  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:38 am : link
In comment 12931563 Mark C said:
Quote:
from someone who has zero information on which to base it. I want Jack too. I want him to fall to 40, and I really want the Giants to take a chance on him. But if they choose not to, I'm not going to do what 80% of BBI will do, which is to blame Reese for being too cautious or asleep at the switch. I'm going to assume the knee is really bad. Because the only real information I have right now is that 31 teams have passed on arguably the most talented player in this year's draft.

All very good and valid points but that's my point of the sheeple. All it takes is one person to say something is really bad before others think well if they passed it must be bad and then the snowball effect. However, I haven't examined his knee so it could be pretty bad but my argument is talent isn't teachable and usually trumps most other aspects and these two LB's are still there.
RE: people  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:40 am : link
In comment 12931565 PaulBlakeTSU said:
Quote:
not wanting Jack because of his injury are not trolls.

I haven't examined his knee... none of us have. Any of us would love to have Jack if there were no injury risk. But for a team that perhaps had the worst five-year stretch of injuries in NFL history, it's understandable why some may not want to draft a guy with health problems.

The trolls I was referring to are the ones that comment on post just to call people idiots, not those who actually seemed informed or know that the guy's name is Myles not Miles.
32 teams passed on the guy.  
Big Blue '56 : 4/29/2016 8:40 am : link
32 teams who have far more knowledge about him than we fo..

He may or may not be taken in round 2.. He's a medical "hazard." Please let that sink in..
Every team passed on him  
RobCarpenter : 4/29/2016 8:42 am : link
That speaks volumes on the seriousness of the condition of his knee.
RE: You Talk About Uniformed Fans NOT Wanting Jack...  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:43 am : link
In comment 12931577 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
But you're just as uniformed as they are.

You think he's worth the risk...based on what?

Have you reviewed his medical information?

Are you an orthopedic surgeon who has taken time out of his busy day to post on a football message board?

We are ALL uniformed when it comes to Jack, but the fact that all 31 teams passed on him in the 1st round speaks volumes.


Unfortunately I am not an Orthopedic Surgeon unless of course you are offering me a job. I wasn't classifying all fans as uninformed but by reading some of posts on the board, it's pretty easy to distinguish Giants fans from the casual football fan, hence the uninformed group.
RE: RE: An interesting concept, and a reasoned opinion,  
njm : 4/29/2016 8:47 am : link
In comment 12931588 Jints1925 said:
Quote:
In comment 12931563 Mark C said:


Quote:


from someone who has zero information on which to base it. I want Jack too. I want him to fall to 40, and I really want the Giants to take a chance on him. But if they choose not to, I'm not going to do what 80% of BBI will do, which is to blame Reese for being too cautious or asleep at the switch. I'm going to assume the knee is really bad. Because the only real information I have right now is that 31 teams have passed on arguably the most talented player in this year's draft.


All very good and valid points but that's my point of the sheeple. All it takes is one person to say something is really bad before others think well if they passed it must be bad and then the snowball effect. However, I haven't examined his knee so it could be pretty bad but my argument is talent isn't teachable and usually trumps most other aspects and these two LB's are still there.



Were 31 GMs, with access to complete medical reports, sheeple?
RE: 32 teams passed on the guy.  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:48 am : link
In comment 12931600 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
32 teams who have far more knowledge about him than we fo..

He may or may not be taken in round 2.. He's a medical "hazard." Please let that sink in..

I get it Big Blue, especially for a team decimated by injuries and where Beason couldn't get on the field. I just rate their natural God given talent pretty highly, if the their knee ends up being fine easily best LB we would have had in years and if I'm wrong, we blew a pick at maybe getting another position of need.
Some team with an extra pick or two  
David B. : 4/29/2016 8:50 am : link
which is NEVER, EVER the Giants, is gonna take a chance and likely get a few good years out of him. Same with J. Smith.
RE: RE: RE: An interesting concept, and a reasoned opinion,  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 8:54 am : link
In comment 12931636 njm said:
Quote:
In comment 12931588 Jints1925 said:


Quote:


In comment 12931563 Mark C said:


Quote:


from someone who has zero information on which to base it. I want Jack too. I want him to fall to 40, and I really want the Giants to take a chance on him. But if they choose not to, I'm not going to do what 80% of BBI will do, which is to blame Reese for being too cautious or asleep at the switch. I'm going to assume the knee is really bad. Because the only real information I have right now is that 31 teams have passed on arguably the most talented player in this year's draft.


All very good and valid points but that's my point of the sheeple. All it takes is one person to say something is really bad before others think well if they passed it must be bad and then the snowball effect. However, I haven't examined his knee so it could be pretty bad but my argument is talent isn't teachable and usually trumps most other aspects and these two LB's are still there.




Were 31 GMs, with access to complete medical reports, sheeple?

Teams can definitely outsmart themselves thinking someone else might have information that they don't about a player hence the draft slide of Aaron Rodgers. Teams may even think they know something about a player that others don't that warrant that team taking them higher than projected.
With our track record for injuries,  
Doomster : 4/29/2016 8:55 am : link
it's reasonable for the Giants to avoid him like the plague....30 other GM's did......

Possible micro fracture surgery is not really something to take a chance on....
RE: RE: Im sooooo glad  
LeonofKiev : 4/29/2016 9:11 am : link
In comment 12931553 Jints1925 said:
Quote:
In comment 12931529 LeonofKiev said:


Quote:


you're not the GM.


Eh, you win some, you lose some, I'll try my hand at running for President next.



You're not funny........and you played yourself.
Jack's knee just seems like a when, not an if  
Greg from LI : 4/29/2016 9:14 am : link
From how it's described, the only question is how long his knee holds up before it falls apart. If that's five or six years, then maybe it's worth it. One or two? No. Unfortunately, his knee doesn't have an expiration date stamped on it.
HA!  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/29/2016 9:18 am : link
Quote:
I try to warn people not to become sheeple (people who flock like sheep to a bad opinion or otherwise stated comment). Uninformed fans hear one thing on the radio or TV and quickly change their opinion


I love the term sheeple.

It also makes me realize that with all of the GM's hearing things on the TV or radio and turning into sheeple, that any of us can fill that role. I nominate the "0 for 67" crowd so we can trade down and have 17 7th round picks to round out the team. Who needs picks in rounds 1-6.

I know who needs them - fucking sheeple.
RE: RE: RE: Im sooooo glad  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 9:23 am : link
In comment 12931743 LeonofKiev said:
Quote:
In comment 12931553 Jints1925 said:


Quote:


In comment 12931529 LeonofKiev said:


Quote:


you're not the GM.


Eh, you win some, you lose some, I'll try my hand at running for President next.




You're not funny........and you played yourself.

That's a 101 on how to entertain clowns.
RE: HA!  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 9:24 am : link
In comment 12931784 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


I try to warn people not to become sheeple (people who flock like sheep to a bad opinion or otherwise stated comment). Uninformed fans hear one thing on the radio or TV and quickly change their opinion



I love the term sheeple.

It also makes me realize that with all of the GM's hearing things on the TV or radio and turning into sheeple, that any of us can fill that role. I nominate the "0 for 67" crowd so we can trade down and have 17 7th round picks to round out the team. Who needs picks in rounds 1-6.

I know who needs them - fucking sheeple.

Fans=Sheeple fat man...
Then what about..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/29/2016 9:26 am : link
those 32 fuckheads at GM who passed on him.

Sheeple or maybe the Illuminati?
None of us have examined Jack's knee or medical records  
jcn56 : 4/29/2016 9:26 am : link
But you know who has? Dr. Scott Rodeo - who's also part of the Giants medical staff.

So, if they're not buying, I'm inclined to think they know what they're doing here. He got passed up 31 times, and those teams have doctors too.
RE: Then what about..  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 9:30 am : link
In comment 12931818 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
those 32 fuckheads at GM who passed on him.

Sheeple or maybe the Illuminati?

*Sigh*
RE: None of us have examined Jack's knee or medical records  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 9:32 am : link
In comment 12931819 jcn56 said:
Quote:
But you know who has? Dr. Scott Rodeo - who's also part of the Giants medical staff.

So, if they're not buying, I'm inclined to think they know what they're doing here. He got passed up 31 times, and those teams have doctors too.

I'm inclined to agree, I should've just simplified this post by saying I think it's worth a risk because the talent is there.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Im sooooo glad  
LeonofKiev : 4/29/2016 9:42 am : link
In comment 12931802 Jints1925 said:
Quote:
In comment 12931743 LeonofKiev said:


Quote:


In comment 12931553 Jints1925 said:


Quote:


In comment 12931529 LeonofKiev said:


Quote:


you're not the GM.


Eh, you win some, you lose some, I'll try my hand at running for President next.




You're not funny........and you played yourself.


That's a 101 on how to entertain clowns.



If only you were as knowledgeable as you are entertaining....BOZO
When you here  
HoustonGiant : 4/29/2016 9:49 am : link
former NFL HC's saying, "maybe you roll the dice, get 3 years out of him...." You know they have talked to people that have evaluated the knee.
When you hear  
HoustonGiant : 4/29/2016 9:50 am : link
former NFL HC's saying, "maybe you roll the dice, get 3 years out of him...." You know they have talked to people that have evaluated the knee.
RE: You Talk About Uniformed Fans NOT Wanting Jack...  
Bill L : 4/29/2016 9:52 am : link
In comment 12931577 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
But you're just as uniformed as they are.

You think he's worth the risk...based on what?

Have you reviewed his medical information?

Are you an orthopedic surgeon who has taken time out of his busy day to post on a football message board?

We are ALL uniformed when it comes to Jack, but the fact that all 31 teams passed on him in the 1st round speaks volumes.
Just for the record,

I'm in street clothes.
Bill..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/29/2016 9:54 am : link
I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, but to get to sleep, I had to count sheeple.
I particularly liked the fact  
Bill L : 4/29/2016 10:00 am : link
that the OP felt it necessary to define "sheeple". I suppose that's done as a courtesy to the uniformed.
The perceived risk  
Beezer : 4/29/2016 10:00 am : link
certainly gets less critical the lower we go in rounds.

Someone will likely take Myles Jack tonight. If it's the Giants, I won't have a hernia jumping out of my chair, but I'll be wary. Would feel much better to me if he fell to the third, rather than taking him with our second pick.

Wonder if fans of other teams feel similarly.

Why settle for having the worst injury track record in the league...  
x meadowlander : 4/29/2016 10:03 am : link
...when you can have worse-er!!

Sure, draft ALL the fucking injury risks! DAMN THE TORPEDOES!!!
Is there a point where you would consider drafting Jaylon Smith?  
Bill L : 4/29/2016 10:05 am : link
If so, when?
RE: Is there a point where you would consider drafting Jaylon Smith?  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 10:22 am : link
In comment 12932028 Bill L said:
Quote:
If so, when?

I should have probably never started a post by calling other people uninformed or sheeple. I guess I grew tired of seeing all the expert opinions on the this board about "Miles" Jack. I'm probably no better by the way I was trying to communicate my point.

As far back as a month ago I was supporting taking Jaylon Smith in the 3rd round when Myles Jack was projected to not drop pass the #5 pick. Recently it's been said that nerve isn't severed so Smith might not be as bad as previously thought. I would say someone will take a chance on him in the 3rd but it all depends on what the teams in front of them do. There's always a cause and effect with these drafts.
Well the giants do have an opening  
Scyber : 4/29/2016 10:24 am : link
From Sy'56 on Myles Jack  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 12:15 pm : link
"But on to day 2....

The Myles Jack saga is so unfortunate. I really feel bad for the kid but you know what, its a part of the process. Someone is going to take this kid in round 2. Even if you are scared by the knee...at some point you have to take a chance. If you wanna play the statistics game...you might as well just go for it on Jack. Thats my stance. Take the chance. The potential reward is through the roof and he isn't a guy that only relies on speed/agility."

This has pretty much been my point all along...
I think Jack is worth the chance at #40  
PatersonPlank : 4/29/2016 12:44 pm : link
Then we are potentially getting 2 top 15 guys with our first two picks.IMO the value is tremendous here.
Personally,  
The 12th Man : 4/29/2016 1:14 pm : link
I would love to draft Jack, I really do want us to throw caution to the wind here and go for this kid if he is still there. No one says he will not play this year. Sure he may have to have surgery on his knee. In the past number of years how many new rookies do not even make it out of Rookie Camp without a non contact injury. Injuries suck and I know we have had more than our share of them over the past few years but, Jack's talent is worth the risk. There are plenty of 2nd round busts in fact the Pats just cut one. I like the odds on Jack being a productive player with a 2nd round grade and contract. I do not see any way that he is there at 40 tonight.
I guess...  
Jints1925 : 4/29/2016 7:40 pm : link
I must be hallucinating, everyone said I was crazy for wanting to take Jack or Smith, neither made it to the Giants 2nd pick! Yet I was crazy? Let those glad we dodged that bullet posts start.
RE: RE: Im sooooo glad  
BMac : 4/29/2016 8:02 pm : link
In comment 12931553 Jints1925 said:
Quote:
In comment 12931529 LeonofKiev said:


Quote:


you're not the GM.


Eh, you win some, you lose some, I'll try my hand at running for President next.


Try your "hand' at something a bit more mundane.
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