Long time buddy of mine works for the Rams front office. He's the guy I got the info that the Giants were interested in trading for Orlando Pace in 2005, which I posted here on BBI several days before the media reported on it.
Most times we talk, it's about non-football topics unless it has something to do related to the Giants. So last night I sent him a text message asking for two things.
1 - What was his thoughts on Eli Apple?
2 - Did he think Apple would have been around if the Giants traded down 5-7 spots and gotten an extra pick?
Here is his reply.....
scouts ranked him as the top cb on our board with ramsey higher as the top s. eli was part of our discussions before we traded up. several scouts said he might not last till 15 and don't think he would have been there if ny traded down
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And Dave Te's.
Respect the grade and respect our round 1 history and also respect that other teams like players we like too! And know what our needs are!
CB is a premium position in today's NFL
He is arguably the best CB in the draft
He has all the elite measureables that you cant coach
He is very young
No off field concerns
Has not yet reached his ceiling
Produced in a premium conference
In essence fans don't know what they don't know, and to the untrained ear, such as mine, their opinions often seem valid. However I suspect, that the people in the know, the professionals, if so inclined, could shoot holes through the theories expressed by us.
Yet it is what we do, because it is fun.
I dont think they were confused at all, it was mentioned they had an offer to trade back with another team and were weighing their options.
I seriously think Apple was #2 on their board all along.
All of these guys in pro scouting departments have tons more insight and info then fans and message-board mockers will ever have. Its highly likely that if one scouting department likes a guy, others will too.
Add this to the basic fact that REESE NEVER TRADES DOWN and hopeufully lets get over it
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while the Giants were on the clock. We were discussing the possibilities and I said that the Giants were likely so confused at this point that they would probably select Eli Apple because of his cool Giants name. Could've knocked me over with a feather when it happened.
I dont think they were confused at all, it was mentioned they had an offer to trade back with another team and were weighing their options.
I seriously think Apple was #2 on their board all along.
Rory, we were joking about all the trades, the Tunsil video etc. A lot of stuff was happening and they were on the clock when a team had just traded one spot in front of them to take the guy they supposedly wanted. It was more a comment on the circumstances than on them.
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while the Giants were on the clock. We were discussing the possibilities and I said that the Giants were likely so confused at this point that they would probably select Eli Apple because of his cool Giants name. Could've knocked me over with a feather when it happened.
I dont think they were confused at all, it was mentioned they had an offer to trade back with another team and were weighing their options.
I seriously think Apple was #2 on their board all along.
I agree, Conklin #1 and I bet Floyd and Apple were pretty close to equal as the #2 on the board.
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In comment 12932531 River Mike said:
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while the Giants were on the clock. We were discussing the possibilities and I said that the Giants were likely so confused at this point that they would probably select Eli Apple because of his cool Giants name. Could've knocked me over with a feather when it happened.
I dont think they were confused at all, it was mentioned they had an offer to trade back with another team and were weighing their options.
I seriously think Apple was #2 on their board all along.
Rory, we were joking about all the trades, the Tunsil video etc. A lot of stuff was happening and they were on the clock when a team had just traded one spot in front of them to take the guy they supposedly wanted. It was more a comment on the circumstances than on them.
understood. my reply was more of a comment as well.
Nah, Reese didn't consider the possibility that "his guys" might be gone, and then he panicked, and Apple was a big reach, and the Giants defense won't be any better, and DOOOOOMED.
Does this mean you won't enlighten us about how much you know, and how little we know about football a few hours from now? Because those posts are delicious.
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The better I feel. I have no doubt about his ability, it was the value I wondered about but I think he'll erase those doubts pretty quickly when we see the uptick in quality from guys like Hosley, Wade and McBride to Apple.
Does this mean you won't enlighten us about how much you know, and how little we know about football a few hours from now? Because those posts are delicious.
I was surprised at your initial reaction last night. Can't remember the last time you reacted like that with a first rounder..When I saw that, I said, "I need to close up my iPad and go to sleep. Too depressing." :)
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
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In comment 12932839 Joey in VA said:
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The better I feel. I have no doubt about his ability, it was the value I wondered about but I think he'll erase those doubts pretty quickly when we see the uptick in quality from guys like Hosley, Wade and McBride to Apple.
Does this mean you won't enlighten us about how much you know, and how little we know about football a few hours from now? Because those posts are delicious.
You want to pick a fight? I have zero doubt that I know more about this game than 99% of the people on this board, you included but sure let's have a personal fight because I'm coming around on our draft pick.
I feel sorry for people that see you on a daily basis.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball. That's why I was kinda shocked at his initial reaction. It's so unlike him re the draft iirc
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This type of info will still not prevent some posters from melting down.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball. That's why I was kinda shocked at his initial reaction. It's so unlike him re the draft iirc
Didnt he do the same thing when we took Jay Bromley? Maybe I am thinking of someone else.
To be honest, I could care less what he said and could care what another Scout from the Rams said. We will find out in the next 2-3 years. My only question is did we pass up on more certain value in Tunsil. That bothers me.
This is a very fair take. The outsider view of the draft certainly did not have Tunsil falling or Apple being so highly valued internally, so absorbing that decision in real-time could have been puzzling.
Tunsil erased himself from a lot of boards. Other smart teams (Baltimore) passed on him.
Meanwhile, setting aside what anyone might think of Apple individually, the utility is clear to see. He's going to play a ton of snaps early and presumably grow into DRC's role. NYG needed good players at any position. If you want to argue the merits of Apple vs. Corey Coleman vs. Taylor Decker ....well, you'll just be wasting a lot of breath because all those guys were graded pretty closely across the league and at some point they'll all strap on uniforms and everything and play the games.
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In comment 12932839 Joey in VA said:
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The better I feel. I have no doubt about his ability, it was the value I wondered about but I think he'll erase those doubts pretty quickly when we see the uptick in quality from guys like Hosley, Wade and McBride to Apple.
Does this mean you won't enlighten us about how much you know, and how little we know about football a few hours from now? Because those posts are delicious.
You want to pick a fight? I have zero doubt that I know more about this game than 99% of the people on this board, you included but sure let's have a personal fight because I'm coming around on our draft pick.
Thrill Ride wants to to briefly point out that YUP he is indeed a 1%-er
Carry on..
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In comment 12932978 speedywheels said:
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This type of info will still not prevent some posters from melting down.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball. That's why I was kinda shocked at his initial reaction. It's so unlike him re the draft iirc
Didnt he do the same thing when we took Jay Bromley? Maybe I am thinking of someone else.
Yeah he wasn't happy but as I said in my first post(above my last one) I was specifically referring to round 1...
40? Come on now... most had him going to the Raiders at 14... that is 4 picks behind and rarely would you see him below pick 20.
CB is a premium position in today's NFL
He is arguably the best CB in the draft
He has all the elite measureables that you cant coach
He is very young
No off field concerns
Has not yet reached his ceiling
Produced in a premium conference
yet people for some reason think he is a reach at 10... I don't get it.
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In comment 12932988 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 12932978 speedywheels said:
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This type of info will still not prevent some posters from melting down.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball. That's why I was kinda shocked at his initial reaction. It's so unlike him re the draft iirc
Didnt he do the same thing when we took Jay Bromley? Maybe I am thinking of someone else.
Yeah he wasn't happy but as I said in my first post(above my last one) I was specifically referring to round 1...
Understood... but his inability to control his emotions over draft picks is comical. Id hate to see his reaction to something of consequence. Plus his "I know more than you, lets fight" attitude towards people on a message board is especially douchey. Even for the internet.
yup...
young, size, athletic, character, premium position, position of need, high end conference experience. Lots to be excited about.
In fact, if we get Jack at 40, then I will have some real confidence in every level of our defense. Just need someone to surprise at FS.
To be honest, I could care less what he said and could care what another Scout from the Rams said. We will find out in the next 2-3 years. My only question is did we pass up on more certain value in Tunsil. That bothers me.
Are you saying that you personally spoke to a NFL GM?
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This type of info will still not prevent some posters from melting down.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball.
No he isn't. That lunatic convinced himself Jay Bromley was "grossly overweight" because of the size of his calves. He's out of his mind.
Bottom line:Giants probably got someone in their first row
Understood... but his inability to control his emotions over draft picks is comical. Id hate to see his reaction to something of consequence. Plus his "I know more than you, lets fight" attitude towards people on a message board is especially douchey. Even for the internet.
Well said. He was indeed the one who bitched about Bromley. ANd it wasn't even that he didn't like him, so much as it was his reasoning - "he has lumpy calves".
A guy who claims to "know more football than 99%" of the people on this board offers THAT bit of wisdom for his analysis!
All the ranting, cursing, whining, crying...
What a flippin' emotional basket case he is...
No disrespect to Sy or any other draft fans who like Apple but the only thing that's going to settle people down is Apple performing well on the field.
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should have settled people down already, as should've the talk of Apple going to TB or Miami.
No disrespect to Sy or any other draft fans who like Apple but the only thing that's going to settle people down is Apple performing well on the field.
That's the bottom line for every college prospect. Point?
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In comment 12932496 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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should have settled people down already, as should've the talk of Apple going to TB or Miami.
No disrespect to Sy or any other draft fans who like Apple but the only thing that's going to settle people down is Apple performing well on the field.
That's the bottom line for every college prospect. Point?
It sure is. You saying you can't see the point I was making there? Thought it was pretty obvious. Everyone just needs to calm down. Tensions are high and alls everyone wants to do is argue. Wait to see how he performs on the field. There's no need to criticize the pick and there's no need to criticize those who are. Just relax, take deep breaths.
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In comment 12933927 Peppers said:
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In comment 12932496 FatMan in Charlotte said:
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should have settled people down already, as should've the talk of Apple going to TB or Miami.
No disrespect to Sy or any other draft fans who like Apple but the only thing that's going to settle people down is Apple performing well on the field.
That's the bottom line for every college prospect. Point?
It sure is. You saying you can't see the point I was making there? Thought it was pretty obvious. Everyone just needs to calm down. Tensions are high and alls everyone wants to do is argue. Wait to see how he performs on the field. There's no need to criticize the pick and there's no need to criticize those who are. Just relax, take deep breaths.
Ok, obviously endorse that 100%
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In comment 12932993 Capt. Don said:
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In comment 12932988 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 12932978 speedywheels said:
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This type of info will still not prevent some posters from melting down.
You know, the guys who claim to have forgotten more football than the rest of ever know, blah blah blah...
The point is, Joey is usually the voice of reason during the draft given his vast knowledge of college ball. That's why I was kinda shocked at his initial reaction. It's so unlike him re the draft iirc
Didnt he do the same thing when we took Jay Bromley? Maybe I am thinking of someone else.
Yeah he wasn't happy but as I said in my first post(above my last one) I was specifically referring to round 1...
Understood... but his inability to control his emotions over draft picks is comical. Id hate to see his reaction to something of consequence. Plus his "I know more than you, lets fight" attitude towards people on a message board is especially douchey. Even for the internet.