Afternoon guys: Hoping everyone is well into decompression mode after the weekend. The break did give us a chance to do a little digging and a little thinking and we posted what we believe is pretty close to the timeline surrounding the Apple pick based on what we were able to pull together from several sources over at the GBN for those that haven't seen it. Plus we we have thots on what looks like it could have been a pretty good haul for the Giants. Let me know if you have any comments etc. Here's the
link. Meanwhile, just 360 days until 2017!! Hang in there ...
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
Only way would be if they would have rather dealt with chicago then us unless we paid a signifigantly higher price. Bad blood?
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
Jim, perhaps pick 11 has a lot more value then pick 10. I believe picks 11+ have an 5th year option on the player selected as opposed to 1-10 has only 4 year contract. Also the slot money is a lot less pick 11+ versus 1-10.
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Colin says that the Giants asked Tampa what it would take to go from 10 to 9 and Tampa wanted a 3rd RD pick. Yet they settled on a 4th RD pick from Chicago, even though that pick was worse than the Giants 4th RD pick. Plus with the Chicago trade Tampa was going from 9 to 11 instead of 9 to 10.
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
Jim, perhaps pick 11 has a lot more value then pick 10. I believe picks 11+ have an 5th year option on the player selected as opposed to 1-10 has only 4 year contract. Also the slot money is a lot less pick 11+ versus 1-10.
You are half right
They both have 5 year options but the 11th pick comes at a lower price
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In comment 12943385 Jim in Tampa said:
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Colin says that the Giants asked Tampa what it would take to go from 10 to 9 and Tampa wanted a 3rd RD pick. Yet they settled on a 4th RD pick from Chicago, even though that pick was worse than the Giants 4th RD pick. Plus with the Chicago trade Tampa was going from 9 to 11 instead of 9 to 10.
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
Jim, perhaps pick 11 has a lot more value then pick 10. I believe picks 11+ have an 5th year option on the player selected as opposed to 1-10 has only 4 year contract. Also the slot money is a lot less pick 11+ versus 1-10.
You are half right
They both have 5 year options but the 11th pick comes at a lower price
Thanks for that Ron.
Why wouldn't Tampa have just come back to the Giants to get THEIR 4th RD pick instead of Chicago's 4th?
If you were Tampa and had an offer for a 4th and the Giants asked what did you want, would your first response be a 4th? No, start high and maybe negotiate. Giants didn't pursue it.
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feeling great about this draft the more I read and added insight into the first round drama was very interesting. I do have a question however, you indicated that Hargreaves was faster then Apple....I thought Apple was faster then Hargreaves? In fact I thought one of the knocks on Hargreaves was the fact that he wasn't fast?!
Apple has excellent top-end downfield speed. Hargreaves doesn't. However, Hargreaves has jitterbug feet. He seems uniquely suited to match up with the smaller, shifty WRs
I see how he meant it now. It was a little confusing at first. Thanks
They made the right call standing pat. They couldnt have topped the Titans deal with Cleveland, and the Tampa Bay trade would have been much worse.
This is a far cry from the running around like chickens without heads as their pick approached as has been portrayed by the media that the moronic fans seem to gobble.
Looks like Floyd was their #1 guy (at the position they wanted to address first) and when the Myles Jack knee situation/media leaks started putting pressure on them they tried to throw out a red herring (Conklin) and/or move-up. When neither worked they moved on to their best guy at the next position they wanted to address.
Text book.
Well done. You're on fire today.
Note re the trade talk with TB for the 9th pick; first the Giants 4th round pick was #109; the Bears traded the Bucs #106 three earlier than the Giants pick. after a series of other trades Chicago actually ended up back at 113, but 106 was the traded pick. In fact, its not clear that the Giants countered TB at all and likely opted to take their chances that Floyd would still be there because they really didn't want to give up any picks and felt they had a pretty good consolation prize in Apple if Floyd was gone.
Willie: I am not sure but it was in the early 2000s when we opted to drop the original Giants Report. Right now I am seriously considering reviving it because bottom line Giants football is what we really love.
And thanks for the offer allstarjim. May have to take you up. Fact is I was an analyst/editor with the national stats agency up here for over 30 years and after having read and reread some of the most boring marerial you can imagine I just can't bring myself to reread stuff, although I keep telling myself I should!!
Yup, bingo. Maybe Floyd turns out to be all-world and we regret it, but I'm OK with the Giants deciding we needed to preserve our other picks rather than trading up. Giants need several players, we are more than one impact player away
Of course the rest of the draft went beautifully, so any change in the 1st possibly messes up the who thing. I'll take what we have, but Apple better work the fuck out, REESE!
I see the thinking, it just better work out.
Of course the rest of the draft went beautifully, so any change in the 1st possibly messes up the who thing. I'll take what we have, but Apple better work the fuck out, REESE!
I see the thinking, it just better work out.
The bottom line is well-stated in this write-up: You DO NOT spend the number ten pick in the draft on a RG. The LT on this team for the next 6-10 years was picked in the first round of last year's draft. Why is it so hard to understand this? How fucking stupid would Jerry Reese be if he picked the same player with a top ten pick in two consecutive drafts?
Apple not a chance? How much have you seen of Apple? Do you realize he was a starter on a national championship team at 19 years old?
Mel on Floyd: "I can see Georgia OLB Leonard Floyd as high as No. 10 to the Giants, but I question if his game lacks power. He didn't bench at either the combine or his pro day, so there's speculation about his strength. No question it's a concern." Both agreed that he was explosive rushing the passer.
On Hargreaves: Todd: "It's a bit alarming to see Vernon Hargreaves, the top cover corner in this year's draft, standing just 5-foot-10 with arms measuring 30 and 5/8 inches. That's close to red-flag territory."
Mel: "And when you factor in an average 40 time (4.50), I actually think he has fallen out of the top ten."
He has just as much chance of being a bust as being an all pro.
Every single year these offensive linemen get pumped up as can't miss cornerstones, and then you look back three years later, and they're on the verge of losing their jobs.
Luke Joeckel - nope
Eric Fisher - barely above water
Greg Robinson - nope
All three were "can't miss" stars until they actually played.
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Apple not a chance. But we can't draft pot heads.
He has just as much chance of being a bust as being an all pro.
Every single year these offensive linemen get pumped up as can't miss cornerstones, and then you look back three years later, and they're on the verge of losing their jobs.
Luke Joeckel - nope
Eric Fisher - barely above water
Greg Robinson - nope
All three were "can't miss" stars until they actually played.
Exactly. There were a number of reports of scouts sating that Tunsil was a bust waiting to happen. And a lot of people like Apple.
I am also an editor and proofreader. I can definitely improve the quality of your work product.
I am an attorney, and was a member of the Law Review and an award winning author in law school. I have years of experience writing and editing action alerts, legislation, press releases, publications, and talking points. I have performance reviews that specifically cite my editing abilities. I am also the author of a critically acclaimed book that has received many positive reviews on Amazon.
Perkins receives a lot of nice commentary for his all around talent, vision, quickness, and elusiveness (avoidance of hits and YA contact), etc. And no doubt he is fun to watch in the clips I've seen posted.
My question is whether playing behind the UCLA line is going to prove a good sample of what he might be capable of in the NFL. It looked to me, in almost all the clips featuring Perkins, that the UCLA OL was utterly dominant against the opposing DL. Either its OL had pushed the DL three or more yards off the LOS by the time Perkins took the handoff and was approaching LOS, or there was a very clean hole through which to run. Don't get me wrong: Perkins saw the holes and burst through them beautifully, and some of the holes were a bit tight, but they were clean.
When over the past four or more years have we seen the Giants' OL capable of that and what does that inadequacy portend for Perkins being able to show his strengths?
They made the right call standing pat. They couldnt have topped the Titans deal with Cleveland, and the Tampa Bay trade would have been much worse.
This is a far cry from the running around like chickens without heads as their pick approached as has been portrayed by the media that the moronic fans seem to gobble.
Looks like Floyd was their #1 guy (at the position they wanted to address first) and when the Myles Jack knee situation/media leaks started putting pressure on them they tried to throw out a red herring (Conklin) and/or move-up. When neither worked they moved on to their best guy at the next position they wanted to address.
Text book.
Unfortunately, there isn't a lot to be pumped about regarding our #10 pick. I sure hope EA is a stud and is a differencemaker from day 1 but, I won't hold my breath. There was a huge drop in need/talent after pick#9. With the talent still available, I personally would have preferred Lawson/Doctson or even Decker. I hope my lack of football-talent acumen is born-out by EA's performance on the field.
I LOVE Annie Apple, fantastic lady, fantastic mom!
I only came for the thots! Where are the thots at? I was promised thots! :)
Heck, why am I typing so much, I am going to need both hands for all the thots....
?
Sy wrote this about Apple:
*Apple is an under the radar guy when it comes to who NYG will be taking at #10 overall. I think Reese and company will like him a lot, enough to warrant that pick. Apple has more upside than any of the CBs in this class and I don’t consider him far off from Hargreaves at all. He has more size and speed with very easy lower body movement. Apple is more physical than you would think initially, too. This guy can get up at the point of attack and really alter guys with the confidence that he can catch up if initially beat. He needs technique work, however. He gets flagged a lot and got away with even more in the games I scouted. His hands are all over the receiver and I’m not sure he trusts his technique enough to rely on his lower half completely. Again, really high upside here but may not be an early contributor.