As for your specific question, no I don't think Reese is in a room by himself, no GM is. But he has a very specific job and its one that is virtually pointless if he needs to get approval from everyone before pulling the trigger. What's the point of having a GM then? (this is a question for any team not just the Giants).
How many teams have outwardly claimed on video they vote by committee for their draft choices?
How many owners outwardly state they did not like the free agent market like Mara did last year?
How many General Managers calling all the shots survive this many losing seasons in a row?
So you ask, what's the point of having a GM then? Based on all the evidence it's pretty clear his role isn't of the typical GM. Now if somebody chimes in with an insult and i respond I'm wondering if you'll stay on topic or just focus on the response despite claims of this being tiresome.
tampa was going to draft apple over hargreaves too,apple is the 2nd ranked CB in the draft behind ramsey,taller and faster than any of the other CB behind him too. all apples problems are coaching and technique they believe they can clean those issues with coaching but you cant coach a slower/shorter player to be taller and faster!
20 was too great a drop the payoff would need to have been high to make up for that obviously what the jets offered wasnt good enough
still surprised the jets didnt trade wilkerson for picks with either cleveland,jacksonville or the titans who all had extra picks and needs at DE
they really cant afford the tag on wilkerson he could end up getting cut instead. has he signed his tender already? after what happened with norman could happen again there too if he hasnt
you were an embarrassment on that. Insulted and and everyone who disagrees with you.
Enjoy your day.
Perfect example of you being a hypocrite. . I expressed an opinion by asking what happened at #10 as did the majority of posters, media, etc. Your type lurks and chimes with the typical insults and then claims innocence. What a hypocrite.
This information is a little painful to me because
you were an embarrassment on that. Insulted and and everyone who disagrees with you.
Enjoy your day.
Perfect example of you being a hypocrite. . I expressed an opinion by asking what happened at #10 as did the majority of posters, media, etc. Your type lurks and chimes with the typical insults and then claims innocence. What a hypocrite.
You embarrassed yourself in that thread. If that's an insult than I apologize. If the above is on the same level of calling people stupid because of the name of their school in their handle then yes, I am a hypocrite.
I'll refrain from interacting with you ever again on BBI from this point moving forward.
20 was too far to go in this mediocre 1st Round...
1) I've been curious who the trade down was with and still very curious about the specifics.
and
2) I would have preferred to trade down and get Darren Lee (who Jets selected) and another pick than take Eli Apple.
Again, as always, I'm very aware that they get paid to do this and I don't so it's not a complaint. I hope Eli turns out to be a beast at CB.
Forgot to mention that I guess that would have made my picks (if it was for Jets 2nd rounder);
Darren Lee
Sterling Sheppard
Cody Whitehair
Admittedly that's also hindsight. For clarity sake, here are the players that were selected at and after Jet's 2nd round pick (players still available in the 2nd round);
QB Christian Hackenberg, Penn State
LB Deion Jones, LSU
LB Su'a Cravens, USA
CB Mackensie Alexander, Clemson (Need option)
WR Tyler Boyd, Pittsburgh
G Cody Whitehair, Kansas State (Need option)
CB T.J. Green, Clemson
DB Sean Davis, Maryland
PK Roberto Aguayo
DB Cyrus Jones, Alabama
Safety Vonn Bell, Ohio State (Need option)
CB James Bradberry, Samford
DT Adam Gotsis, Georgia Tech
Should have done the trade. Unless Apple turns out to be a great player, pretty obvious. I supported Reese for a long time but the lack of talent has been obvious and he is responsible for that. And he was responsible for two SBs? Really?
Do you happen to sell automobiles? Here's why I ask. I really like the Aston Martin Vanquish. It's really nice, fast and the chicks dig it. I'll give you $25,000 for it delivered. With the mentality of I'll trade down with poor value, you'll sell me a high end luxury auto for cheap...So I want to buy a car from you
turns out a poor pick(coincidental pun), it would be back enough to have a poor season that gives you the 10 in the first place,and your pick maybe isnt that good(I think he will be), but to have accepted that deal would have been the trifecta of bad, for all the 'suck' it already took to be at 10. It had to have included a 2, and a 3, or at list their 2 in 16 AND 17.
Plus you really shake up the draft, and in a draft that had lots of 2nd rd talent in at after 12-15, staying pat was best.
How about looking at the 2 players you got versus the three you could have had.
Myles Jack
Sterling Shepherd
Vonn Bell
Who would sign up for that?
How do you know Jack was still on their board and if so the value they placed on him? Why do you think they wanted Bell? Apparently they didn't like the value of what was on the board further down. They also didn't seem to feel Jack was worth the risk
topic people will use to question the decision making. Hell, you have the term "Reese Apologists" thrown out here as if there needs to be a defense about not getting fleeced in the deal.
Knowing what we know now about the draft, which is we know relatively jack shit about how the players drafted will perform, people would be using "the chart" to call Reese a fucking idiot for taking a deal that is poor value.
They would lament the #20 pick and go on about some other player we could have had at #10, and they would complain loudly that we only got a #2 to get a mid-tier piece of shit in the 1st.
That's the way evaluating the GM goes around here.
topic people will use to question the decision making. Hell, you have the term "Reese Apologists" thrown out here as if there needs to be a defense about not getting fleeced in the deal.
Knowing what we know now about the draft, which is we know relatively jack shit about how the players drafted will perform, people would be using "the chart" to call Reese a fucking idiot for taking a deal that is poor value.
They would lament the #20 pick and go on about some other player we could have had at #10, and they would complain loudly that we only got a #2 to get a mid-tier piece of shit in the 1st.
That's the way evaluating the GM goes around here.
Well then, perhaps Coach Mason's (Jersey Joe) thread will provide some comfort? Link - ( New Window )
"Reese should have traded down" if a) you don't know what the terms of the trade were, b) you don't know who they would have selected and c) we don't know if Apple, or any of the other players they could have theoretically gotten in the trade are even fucking good yet!! Apple could be Darrelle Revis for all we know. He could also suck. "We should have traded back for Darron Lee." Ok cool but like...again. He might not be good.
I posted a Mock with a Tradedown with the Jets for
there 1st 2nd and Third
#20 Doctson WR
#40 Ogbah DE
#51 Spriggs OT
#71 Green FS
#83 Howard DB
#106 Ridgeway DT
Rnd 5 Marshal RB
Rnd 6 McGee TE
So remove Howard since the Jets only offered there #2
Take Goodson at #106
I think my draft would have been excellent .
We took a ScatBack and TE at 5 and 6
took a safety at #3 My I initial pick at one
while we were on the clock was Hargreaves
not to bad but I know I'm not a Member of
the BBI Circle so my Mock thread was ignored
Good Day Sir
Just another layer of pressure for Reese. Apple better be the goods, and the Giants better have more than 6 wins, or the water that Reese is in will get a lot hotter.
"Reese should have traded down" if a) you don't know what the terms of the trade were, b) you don't know who they would have selected and c) we don't know if Apple, or any of the other players they could have theoretically gotten in the trade are even fucking good yet!! Apple could be Darrelle Revis for all we know. He could also suck. "We should have traded back for Darron Lee." Ok cool but like...again. He might not be good.
Since I'm the only one that that said "I" (not "we should have" or "Reese should have") would have traded down for Lee I am assuming you are referring to me. I will say again, to clarify, "I" would have traded down to get Lee. I also admitted that a)"I" don't get paid to do this, b) "I" have the benefit of hindsight, c)"I" am not complaining about what they did do, and d) "I" don't know what the deal was for (my recommendation came after assuming we got an extra 2nd rounder and stated so).
I never said Reese should have traded down. There is a difference. This is a football forum. I just thought I would share what I would have done instead of Reese. I hope to remember this and come back to it. I wonder what kind of players Apple, Lee, and Whitehead will all be 2 years from now.
The Jests didn't want to pay equal value. End of story.
How about looking at the 2 players you got versus the three you could have had.
Myles Jack
Sterling Shepherd
Vonn Bell
Who would sign up for that?
It amazes me that despite the every asshat and beat reporter telling us that Jack was off our board, and despite us passing on him at #12, some knuckleheads here are still yapping on about Myles Jack.
In fact,we should trade up to the top of the draft every year.
As for your specific question, no I don't think Reese is in a room by himself, no GM is. But he has a very specific job and its one that is virtually pointless if he needs to get approval from everyone before pulling the trigger. What's the point of having a GM then? (this is a question for any team not just the Giants).
How many teams have outwardly claimed on video they vote by committee for their draft choices?
How many owners outwardly state they did not like the free agent market like Mara did last year?
How many General Managers calling all the shots survive this many losing seasons in a row?
So you ask, what's the point of having a GM then? Based on all the evidence it's pretty clear his role isn't of the typical GM. Now if somebody chimes in with an insult and i respond I'm wondering if you'll stay on topic or just focus on the response despite claims of this being tiresome.
20 was too great a drop the payoff would need to have been high to make up for that obviously what the jets offered wasnt good enough
still surprised the jets didnt trade wilkerson for picks with either cleveland,jacksonville or the titans who all had extra picks and needs at DE
they really cant afford the tag on wilkerson he could end up getting cut instead. has he signed his tender already? after what happened with norman could happen again there too if he hasnt
Enjoy your day.
Enjoy your day.
Perfect example of you being a hypocrite. . I expressed an opinion by asking what happened at #10 as did the majority of posters, media, etc. Your type lurks and chimes with the typical insults and then claims innocence. What a hypocrite.
and
2) I would have preferred to trade down and get Darren Lee (who Jets selected) and another pick than take Eli Apple.
Again, as always, I'm very aware that they get paid to do this and I don't so it's not a complaint. I hope Eli turns out to be a beast at CB.
Quote:
you were an embarrassment on that. Insulted and and everyone who disagrees with you.
Enjoy your day.
Perfect example of you being a hypocrite. . I expressed an opinion by asking what happened at #10 as did the majority of posters, media, etc. Your type lurks and chimes with the typical insults and then claims innocence. What a hypocrite.
You embarrassed yourself in that thread. If that's an insult than I apologize. If the above is on the same level of calling people stupid because of the name of their school in their handle then yes, I am a hypocrite.
I'll refrain from interacting with you ever again on BBI from this point moving forward.
and
2) I would have preferred to trade down and get Darren Lee (who Jets selected) and another pick than take Eli Apple.
Again, as always, I'm very aware that they get paid to do this and I don't so it's not a complaint. I hope Eli turns out to be a beast at CB.
Forgot to mention that I guess that would have made my picks (if it was for Jets 2nd rounder);
Darren Lee
Sterling Sheppard
Cody Whitehair
Admittedly that's also hindsight. For clarity sake, here are the players that were selected at and after Jet's 2nd round pick (players still available in the 2nd round);
QB Christian Hackenberg, Penn State
LB Deion Jones, LSU
LB Su'a Cravens, USA
CB Mackensie Alexander, Clemson (Need option)
WR Tyler Boyd, Pittsburgh
G Cody Whitehair, Kansas State (Need option)
CB T.J. Green, Clemson
DB Sean Davis, Maryland
PK Roberto Aguayo
DB Cyrus Jones, Alabama
Safety Vonn Bell, Ohio State (Need option)
CB James Bradberry, Samford
DT Adam Gotsis, Georgia Tech
Do you happen to sell automobiles? Here's why I ask. I really like the Aston Martin Vanquish. It's really nice, fast and the chicks dig it. I'll give you $25,000 for it delivered. With the mentality of I'll trade down with poor value, you'll sell me a high end luxury auto for cheap...So I want to buy a car from you
Plus you really shake up the draft, and in a draft that had lots of 2nd rd talent in at after 12-15, staying pat was best.
How about looking at the 2 players you got versus the three you could have had.
Myles Jack
Sterling Shepherd
Vonn Bell
Who would sign up for that?
How about looking at the 2 players you got versus the three you could have had.
Myles Jack
Sterling Shepherd
Vonn Bell
Who would sign up for that?
How do you know Jack was still on their board and if so the value they placed on him? Why do you think they wanted Bell? Apparently they didn't like the value of what was on the board further down. They also didn't seem to feel Jack was worth the risk
Knowing what we know now about the draft, which is we know relatively jack shit about how the players drafted will perform, people would be using "the chart" to call Reese a fucking idiot for taking a deal that is poor value.
They would lament the #20 pick and go on about some other player we could have had at #10, and they would complain loudly that we only got a #2 to get a mid-tier piece of shit in the 1st.
That's the way evaluating the GM goes around here.
Knowing what we know now about the draft, which is we know relatively jack shit about how the players drafted will perform, people would be using "the chart" to call Reese a fucking idiot for taking a deal that is poor value.
They would lament the #20 pick and go on about some other player we could have had at #10, and they would complain loudly that we only got a #2 to get a mid-tier piece of shit in the 1st.
That's the way evaluating the GM goes around here.
Well then, perhaps Coach Mason's (Jersey Joe) thread will provide some comfort?
Link - ( New Window )
there 1st 2nd and Third
#20 Doctson WR
#40 Ogbah DE
#51 Spriggs OT
#71 Green FS
#83 Howard DB
#106 Ridgeway DT
Rnd 5 Marshal RB
Rnd 6 McGee TE
So remove Howard since the Jets only offered there #2
Take Goodson at #106
I think my draft would have been excellent .
We took a ScatBack and TE at 5 and 6
took a safety at #3 My I initial pick at one
while we were on the clock was Hargreaves
not to bad but I know I'm not a Member of
the BBI Circle so my Mock thread was ignored
Good Day Sir
Eli Apple
Sterling Shepard
Or
William Jackson III
Sterling Shepard
Cody Whitehair
The three players obviously
Since I'm the only one that that said "I" (not "we should have" or "Reese should have") would have traded down for Lee I am assuming you are referring to me. I will say again, to clarify, "I" would have traded down to get Lee. I also admitted that a)"I" don't get paid to do this, b) "I" have the benefit of hindsight, c)"I" am not complaining about what they did do, and d) "I" don't know what the deal was for (my recommendation came after assuming we got an extra 2nd rounder and stated so).
I never said Reese should have traded down. There is a difference. This is a football forum. I just thought I would share what I would have done instead of Reese. I hope to remember this and come back to it. I wonder what kind of players Apple, Lee, and Whitehead will all be 2 years from now.
I have been as critical of Reese as anyone, but some of the stuff here is grossly unfair. Reese was right to say no.
I like Oreos
CB Apple- WR Shepard- FS Thompson-MLB Goodson-RB Perkins-TE Adams
With the trade they could have gotten:
WR Lee (4.4 40 LB)/Doctson/Treadwell-Shepard/ MLB Ragland- G Cody Whitehair/Carl Nassib/Bullard/ Kaufusi - FS Thompson- BJ Goodson/CB Juston Burris-RB Perkins- TE Adams
The last team we should be taking draft lessons from is the Jests.
How about looking at the 2 players you got versus the three you could have had.
Myles Jack
Sterling Shepherd
Vonn Bell
Who would sign up for that?
It amazes me that despite the every asshat and beat reporter telling us that Jack was off our board, and despite us passing on him at #12, some knuckleheads here are still yapping on about Myles Jack.
Have you just crawled out from under a rock?