I'd certainly welcome hearing all opinions, but does anybody really know what's going on with him? First, disregarding his injury for a moment, there were times during last season when he looked like the best RB on the Giants, including during most of preseason. And when he finally got into a game, I thought we'd traded for Marshawn Lynch as he ran over and around the entire Dallas defense. Other series, he just got stuffed, and looked like an entirely different player. I read one remark intimating he just can't take the pounding. Anybody know, no BS, if that's true? Or is it just conjecture?
Then there's the broken tibia. The tibia is the second largest bone in the human body. But it's only a slight break. What the hell is a slight break? I cracked my radius and couldn't move my arm right for a year and half! How'd it happen? I read another intimation that it happened during S& C. Really!?!? He broke his leg during S& C?
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
I think I recall you mentioning that before, but I believe I've also seen it elsewhere. Too bad if he's a talented guy betrayed by his own body. Some smaller backs seem to know how to play the game hard and still stay healthy, evidently others don't. Tiki was pretty small when he started, though I'd bet he was a lot heavier than listed after Coughlin got here. Tony Dorsett was another smaller back who took care of himself, only taking hits when the situation demanded. But Walter Payton was no bigger than Darkwa and ran hard all the time, finishing every run with a pop. Would be nice if the coaches could think of a way to allow him to stay healthy, and still be effective.
Look, we don't want to use 4 or 5 running backs on gameday regardless. It's going to be Jennings, Vereen, and probably Perkins as the big 3 rotation.
Sorry, but I'll have to disagree. I think Vareen is the only back that is safe. He's too versatile to be at risk.
Lol. Good one.
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if Perkins picks things up quick enough.
Lol. Good one.
Try mounting an argument if you're capable.
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if Perkins picks things up quick enough.
Sorry, but I'll have to disagree. I think Vareen is the only back that is safe. He's too versatile to be at risk.
He's not versatile. He's a passing down player only.
I get that he probably looks like shit running it in practice being that neither the Pats nor Giants ever really fed him the ball as a runner for as long as he's been in the league, but it couldn't have gotten any worse than last year.
Either way, thank god we drafted Perkins.
I said I could see him cut not that I want him to be cut. Being second best on the Giants last year isn't a big achievement - see Randle, Reuben who is no longer on the team.
The point is him being second in receptions isn't a great endorsement because the Giants had no receiving talent after OBJ.
Anyway, he's a good receiver but he's not very explosive and isn't a good runner.
At some point next year
And it's way to early to know if PP is an upgrade over any of the Giants' current RBS; currently defacto he carries a 5th round grade!
Our best back and an invaluable weapon in the MacDoo scheme who helps take the pressure off OBJ and get him open, who would leave dead money, who we invested a fortune on.
It's not that some dolt can write such things it's on us that we read them.
Paul Perkins has by most accounts already become the best HB on the team who has not even worn a Giants uniform yet. This team has a long way to go both talent and depth wise and for whatever reasons just can't get a break for the most part. Right now we could say PP and Vereen are locks to make the team but the rest are in the show me what you can do stage for sure at HB.
I'm certainly not cutting him over Darkwa either.
Darkwa does not. I still think the Giants see something in Williams to not get rid of him
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
I think so as well. Reese has said he gives draft picks every chance to fail. Williams was a fourth round pick that everybody wanted. “Finding Giants” shows the entire Giants staff holding their collective breaths on draft day, hoping that he falls to them. Reese even investigated moving up to the first pick in the fourth round, but the price was too high. Williams has no wiggle, but if he gets past the LOS he punishes people.
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My impression of him is he is a very tough runner who isn't very tough.
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
I think I recall you mentioning that before, but I believe I've also seen it elsewhere. Too bad if he's a talented guy betrayed by his own body. Some smaller backs seem to know how to play the game hard and still stay healthy, evidently others don't. Tiki was pretty small when he started, though I'd bet he was a lot heavier than listed after Coughlin got here. Tony Dorsett was another smaller back who took care of himself, only taking hits when the situation demanded. But Walter Payton was no bigger than Darkwa and ran hard all the time, finishing every run with a pop. Would be nice if the coaches could think of a way to allow him to stay healthy, and still be effective.
I remember an article way back about Tiki Barber highlighting a new workout regimen. Part of that highlighted something he trained on (maybe with a martial arts guy) about absorbing hits. It focused on making his movements more fluid, and instead of fully absorbing a hit, learning to bounce off a hit. Something along those lines. I remember that particular year being a breakout year for him.
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
Obviously the team was higher on Williams, he was a drafted player! Where are you getting "he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly"? He has a fracture and was pulled from practise as a precaution to prevent further injury. He has only carried the ball 45 times with the Giants, last year only 36 times with a 4.3 YPC, he was only targeted 5 times last year while catching 3 with a 10.3/YPR. You might want to consider, he is our fastest RB, he catches the ball, makes would-be tacklers miss and is productive carrying the ball based on his limitted opportunities. Check the facts before making wild ascertions!
It's not like Jennings who also gets hurt, but that's after a lot of action.
I definitely agree with Eric.
What is beneficial about Darkwa, from what I remember is he plays special teams. So Does Jennings, So Does Vereen and Perkins is making the team. To me Perkins and Vereen are sure things on the roster. The rest of the guys are in a battle.
Honestly, I think Jennings behind just a semi-decent run blocking line is a solid #1. I think Williams is a poor back, but it is tough to confirm when the right side of the line sometimes outright whiffed on blocks.
He's a key cog in this offense. You need a 3DRB who can run every route out of the backfield and even the slot and Vereen fits that mold perfectly. He's one of the best pass catching RB's in football.
Williams is not a bad athlete. I wouldn't write him off just yet. I can see him being a 80 yard or more back in this offense.
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In comment 12947491 Eric from BBI said:
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My impression of him is he is a very tough runner who isn't very tough.
What I mean by that is he is punishing runner for a few snaps, but he seems to get nicked up pretty quickly.
Bad luck?
Regardless, he has an uphill fight on his hands to make this team. Unlike most on BBI, I think the organization is still higher on Andre Williams.
I think I recall you mentioning that before, but I believe I've also seen it elsewhere. Too bad if he's a talented guy betrayed by his own body. Some smaller backs seem to know how to play the game hard and still stay healthy, evidently others don't. Tiki was pretty small when he started, though I'd bet he was a lot heavier than listed after Coughlin got here. Tony Dorsett was another smaller back who took care of himself, only taking hits when the situation demanded. But Walter Payton was no bigger than Darkwa and ran hard all the time, finishing every run with a pop. Would be nice if the coaches could think of a way to allow him to stay healthy, and still be effective.
I remember an article way back about Tiki Barber highlighting a new workout regimen. Part of that highlighted something he trained on (maybe with a martial arts guy) about absorbing hits. It focused on making his movements more fluid, and instead of fully absorbing a hit, learning to bounce off a hit. Something along those lines. I remember that particular year being a breakout year for him.
It was all the running up the Ramapo Mountains with Greg Comella.
I was waiting for that..
jennings is the defacto starter totally safe
veeren is the primary pass catcher of the group safe
perkins looks like he will be short yardage/3rd down
williams is the best of rest despite the hate alot of fans have for him (unfairly mostly) the team is high on him still so he makes the team
that leaves 2 spots (maybe 3 if they use rainey as the ST kick/punt returner) and 4 running backs paul perkins,orleans darkwa,andre williams and bobby rainey playing for those slots
perkins looks like he will become the short yardage/3rd down back with the OL still a mess they need his elusiveness there so that leaves a 3 way shoot out between williams,darkwa and rainey for the last roster slot
williams is probably the best of those 3 so expect he gets the last slot,rainey could make the team on ST outside of the RB corp and would also give them some injury cover.
depends how they view the special teams play of guys like davis and harris in the WR corp likely they could use harris on kick returns and rainey could be used for punt returns unless geremy davis beats him out?
for the first time in a few years there is competition for most positions on the team,unfortunately this will lead to some tough choices at cuts time
You must be talking about Williams, Darkwa doesn't get much
of an opportunity to prove if he is a JAG.
He can cut back and has some vision, Williams has neither.
You look at a team like Seattle for example, an UDFA proved
he can play at RB...You know what, they got rid of a
3rd Rd. pick. The Giants don't do things like that,
one of their issues.
And it's way to early to know if PP is an upgrade over any of the Giants' current RBS; currently defacto he carries a 5th round grade!
Yes he was drafted in the 5th round, but isn't it the meme here that you don't draft RBs/RTs early? Could be the "scale" changes for some positions.
I love it that he has signed already. Shows his focus is "getting on the field".
The 27-year-old guy who's shifty, can block a little, and catches passes in a passing league on a passing team with a passing coach ... is going to be a surprise cut.
Rashad turned it on late and got the majority of carries and I was not aware of Darkwa having injury issues...
A bit shocked thinking he will not remain with the giants this year.
The biggest reason he might survive cuts is his salary.
If they can properly utilize the top 3, and get an offense that can become more consistent in sustaining drives, the RB position becomes a non-story.
Here's a breakdown of how overrated Vereen is by fans (by the numbers, of course).
Vereen (27 years old) in 2015
59 catches
495 yards
(8.4 average)
4 TDs
61 carries
260 yards
(4.3 average)
+++
Sproles (32 years old) in 2015
55 catches
388 yards
(7.1 average)
1 TD
83 carries
317 yards
(3.8 average)
+++
Bush (31 years old) combined 2015 and 2014
44 catches
272 yards
(6.2 average)
0 TDs
84 carries
325 yards
(3.6 average)
+++
Some of you guys are a little bit cray-cray this morning.
Here's a breakdown of how overrated Vereen is by fans (by the numbers, of course).
Vereen (27 years old) in 2015
59 catches
495 yards
(8.4 average)
4 TDs
61 carries
260 yards
(4.3 average)
+++
Sproles (32 years old) in 2015
55 catches
388 yards
(7.1 average)
1 TD
83 carries
317 yards
(3.8 average)
+++
Bush (31 years old) combined 2015 and 2014
44 catches
272 yards
(6.2 average)
0 TDs
84 carries
325 yards
(3.6 average)
+++
Some of you guys are a little bit cray-cray this morning.
Beez, come on. I obviously meant in their primes. Its a bit unfair to compare a 27 year old with two players over 30 and just about forked.
Sproles and Bush in their prime were dynamic. Vereen is not. He is a good pass catcher with some shiftiness but he's not really anything special.
I certainly hope this isn't the case. Without an offensive line capable of parting the Red Sea, Andre Williams is pretty much 2 yards and a cloud and dust.