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NFT: Best songwriters of the Rock/Folk Rock years?

yatqb : 5/24/2016 6:24 pm
I think that Dylan is in another universe, but beyond him who do you like?

I think that Lennon/McCartney, Paul Simon, Joni Mitchell and Bruce Springsteen should all be in the conversation.

Thoughts on whom you'd pick?
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To name a few  
Steve in South Jersey : 5/24/2016 6:28 pm : link
Bob Dylan
Joni Mitchell
Stevie Wonder
You hit the ones that immediately come to mind  
pjcas18 : 5/24/2016 6:29 pm : link
I'd add both Mick Jones and Joe Strummer.

and the word "best" is going to cause angst with the tightly wound anal douches on the sites.
Bruce Springsteen and Neil Young are genius song writers  
gtt350 : 5/24/2016 6:30 pm : link
.
Beatle canon is really beyond anything else...  
x meadowlander : 5/24/2016 6:32 pm : link
...the sheer volume of quality songs is simply baffling - the way they evolved, defining writing, arranging, recording techniques is beyond anything before or since. Lennon and McCartney drove each other - there's a book out there - Beatle recording sessions that highlights life at Abbey are in those years, just about every week one or both John and Paul would introduce another classic... The fact that Harrison's material became a force toward the end just really eliminates any competition from consideration for me... Fwiw, I'd rank Lennon slightly ahead of Paul as a songwriter.
Elton John/Bernie Taupin  
CRinCA : 5/24/2016 6:35 pm : link
.
Oh and I'm not saying "THE best"  
CRinCA : 5/24/2016 6:36 pm : link
But among the best.
RE: Beatle canon is really beyond anything else...  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 6:37 pm : link
In comment 12969777 x meadowlander said:
Quote:
...the sheer volume of quality songs is simply baffling - the way they evolved, defining writing, arranging, recording techniques is beyond anything before or since. Lennon and McCartney drove each other - there's a book out there - Beatle recording sessions that highlights life at Abbey are in those years, just about every week one or both John and Paul would introduce another classic... The fact that Harrison's material became a force toward the end just really eliminates any competition from consideration for me... Fwiw, I'd rank Lennon slightly ahead of Paul as a songwriter.


I'm not a rock historian, just a fan, but you've said what I think quite well, except that I like Paul's writing better. John's whimsy and bitterness always simmer below the surface in his songs. Paul often hearkens back to classic modes and standards ("Your mother should know") in fun ways that John wouldn't countenance.
Brian Wilson  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 6:38 pm : link
Stephen Stills
All good so far...  
trueblueinpw : 5/24/2016 6:39 pm : link
I might toss out Carol King to represent the Brill building. Paul Simon is terrific. I love the Dead and Robert Hunter. I suppose Dylan is in a class all by himself.
and if we recognize that great rock songwriting is not  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 6:39 pm : link
always about analytical depth like Dylan, in terms of simple, straight, haiku-style music/lyrics, I'd put Tom Petty in the discussion.
if we look for incredible writing on occasion, if not consistently  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 6:42 pm : link
great, then those fellas who wrote Sympathy for the Devil, Paint it Black, and Gimmie Shelter should be appreciated as more than just a quality band but great writers.
RE: RE: Beatle canon is really beyond anything else...  
x meadowlander : 5/24/2016 6:44 pm : link
In comment 12969785 Moondawg said:
Quote:
In comment 12969777 x meadowlander said:


Quote:


...the sheer volume of quality songs is simply baffling - the way they evolved, defining writing, arranging, recording techniques is beyond anything before or since. Lennon and McCartney drove each other - there's a book out there - Beatle recording sessions that highlights life at Abbey are in those years, just about every week one or both John and Paul would introduce another classic... The fact that Harrison's material became a force toward the end just really eliminates any competition from consideration for me... Fwiw, I'd rank Lennon slightly ahead of Paul as a songwriter.



I'm not a rock historian, just a fan, but you've said what I think quite well, except that I like Paul's writing better. John's whimsy and bitterness always simmer below the surface in his songs. Paul often hearkens back to classic modes and standards ("Your mother should know") in fun ways that John wouldn't countenance.
lennon hated McCartneys goofy stuff. Once, when asked when the moment was that he knew the Beatles were done, he quipped 'Maxwells Silver Hammer'!

It is notable that after the breakup, McCartney continued to produce hits through the 70's while Lennon kind of disappeared after a couple of albums, tragically murdered just as he was coming back.
Neil Young  
aquidneck : 5/24/2016 6:45 pm : link
Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen. Canadians all.

RE: if we look for incredible writing on occasion, if not consistently  
x meadowlander : 5/24/2016 6:45 pm : link
In comment 12969794 Moondawg said:
Quote:
great, then those fellas who wrote Sympathy for the Devil, Paint it Black, and Gimmie Shelter should be appreciated as more than just a quality band but great writers.
Stones 68-72 was flat out awesome.
RE: RE: if we look for incredible writing on occasion, if not consistently  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 6:50 pm : link
In comment 12969801 x meadowlander said:
Quote:
In comment 12969794 Moondawg said:


Quote:


great, then those fellas who wrote Sympathy for the Devil, Paint it Black, and Gimmie Shelter should be appreciated as more than just a quality band but great writers.

Stones 68-72 was flat out awesome.


My favorite Stones album is still Exile on Main Street. I think one could argue that Mick is really a talented "scream" singer. But unlike McCartney, who could belt out a long scream that works in a song, Mick would bark melodically. I know it isn't the right way to say it but on Exile, you can hear it clearly.
RE: RE: RE: if we look for incredible writing on occasion, if not consistently  
x meadowlander : 5/24/2016 6:58 pm : link
In comment 12969805 Moondawg said:
Quote:
In comment 12969801 x meadowlander said:


Quote:


In comment 12969794 Moondawg said:


Quote:


great, then those fellas who wrote Sympathy for the Devil, Paint it Black, and Gimmie Shelter should be appreciated as more than just a quality band but great writers.

Stones 68-72 was flat out awesome.



My favorite Stones album is still Exile on Main Street. I think one could argue that Mick is really a talented "scream" singer. But unlike McCartney, who could belt out a long scream that works in a song, Mick would bark melodically. I know it isn't the right way to say it but on Exile, you can hear it clearly.


The Stones weren't the best at anything... Except being the Stones, and that was plenty during those years, an amazing example of the sum being greater than the parts. The vibe on Exile in particular is really something to behold.
Great names - I'll add a few to the conversation  
Ira : 5/24/2016 7:04 pm : link
Donovan, James Taylor and Pete Townshend.
Tom Waits  
tommy boy : 5/24/2016 7:09 pm : link
Unbelievable and prolific song writer!!!!!
Dylan  
noro9 : 5/24/2016 7:30 pm : link
John Prine
Paul Williams.  
Boy Cord : 5/24/2016 7:34 pm : link
And I'm not talking about his work with The Muppets.
Van Morrison, David Bowie,  
rebel yell : 5/24/2016 7:35 pm : link
David Byrne, Sting.
...and Johnny Cash,  
rebel yell : 5/24/2016 7:36 pm : link
how could I forget him.
some not mentioned yet  
Steve in South Jersey : 5/24/2016 7:41 pm : link
Carole King
Smokey Robinson
Van Morrison
RE: ...and Johnny Cash,  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 7:41 pm : link
In comment 12969858 rebel yell said:
Quote:
how could I forget him.


If we start moving into country, that's a whole 'nother can of worms.
RE: Paul Williams.  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 7:49 pm : link
In comment 12969851 Boy Cord said:
Quote:
And I'm not talking about his work with The Muppets.


How dare you

The soundtrack for Emmet Otters Jugband Christmas is GENIUS
Just worth mentioning  
pjcas18 : 5/24/2016 7:49 pm : link
because of their commercial success I think Bono is at least worthy of mention - unless U2 is considered pure pop, but that's a blurry line then.

I think he has some corny cliched songs, but their early stuff was much different. And the Beatles also capitalized on some corny cliched lyrics.

I never cared for the religious themes, but still can acknowledge Bono's talent.

Billy Joel and Neil Diamond  
Victor in CT : 5/24/2016 7:49 pm : link
.
Glenn Frey, Jackson Browne...  
LadyGiant : 5/24/2016 8:11 pm : link
And, if you want to add Motown into the mix… Smokey Robinson
A name that belongs on this list. The late great  
ciggy : 5/24/2016 8:12 pm : link
Warren Zevon. Maybe not as great as Dylan, Neil Young, Van Morrison but a brilliant song writer with a unique style.


Speaking of unique. Randy Newman too
Johnny Cash  
Reb8thVA : 5/24/2016 8:19 pm : link
Bob Dylan, Springsteen, and Neil Young
Stills  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:21 pm : link
Had Buffalo Springfield, CSN, CSNY, solo stuff including the gem Manassas.

Stevie Nicks  
Davisian : 5/24/2016 8:24 pm : link
Im just gonna put her here because the usual (deserved) suspects will ne mentioned and "Sara" came on my playlist on the ride home. Beautiful song.
I will also throw....  
Reb8thVA : 5/24/2016 8:27 pm : link
John Mellencamp out there
RE: Stevie Nicks  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:28 pm : link
In comment 12969922 Davisian said:
Quote:
Im just gonna put her here because the usual (deserved) suspects will ne mentioned and "Sara" came on my playlist on the ride home. Beautiful song.


Good call. She's another one who writes and writes and writes.
Not a single mention of John Prine? For shame...  
j_rud : 5/24/2016 8:28 pm : link
Johnny Cash considers the man Americas greatest songwriter. That's good enough for me.
David Byrne  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:29 pm : link
Paul Westerberg
Jeff Tweedy
Rich Robinson
Lou Reed
Someone I think is a very underrated rock / folk songwriter  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:29 pm : link
and would have developed a following and written songs as prolifically as Van Morrison (as he was somewhat similar but younger) is Ronnie Lane.

Alas, he died from complications due to MS. He is also similar to Buddy Holly as he had still much to do in music if it weren't for his abilities and life being cut short by disease.
RE: Not a single mention of John Prine? For shame...  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:30 pm : link
In comment 12969931 j_rud said:
Quote:
Johnny Cash considers the man Americas greatest songwriter. That's good enough for me.


My wife is making me go to Nashville for his 70th Bday.

He doesn't do it for me, but she's obsessed.
.  
pganut : 5/24/2016 8:34 pm : link
Sam Cooke
John Prine
Johnny Cash
Paul Simon
Gordon Lightfoot
Curtis Mayfield
Bjorn Ulvaeus/Benny Andersson
RE: .  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:36 pm : link
In comment 12969938 pganut said:
Quote:
Sam Cooke
John Prine
Johnny Cash
Paul Simon
Gordon Lightfoot
Curtis Mayfield
Bjorn Ulvaeus/Benny Andersson


Awesome! An Abba shoutout
Not mentioned  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:36 pm : link
but Brian Wilson comes to mind as perhaps the best.
Psht  
feelflows : 5/24/2016 8:39 pm : link
You think I didn't mention Brian Wilson? ME???? Haha
Leonard  
santacruzom : 5/24/2016 8:40 pm : link
Fucking Cohen, anyone?
Because we're talking folk-rock, I would put  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:42 pm : link
John Denver, Cat Stevens, Joni Mitchell and Laura Nyro over some already mentioned.
RE: Psht  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:43 pm : link
In comment 12969948 feelflows said:
Quote:
You think I didn't mention Brian Wilson? ME???? Haha


Shit, that was my eff up.
RE: Leonard  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:43 pm : link
In comment 12969950 santacruzom said:
Quote:
Fucking Cohen, anyone?


Yes, good call.
Actually, let me take that back  
SomeFan : 5/24/2016 8:47 pm : link
when I look at what everyone has posted, it is a kick-ass list. Not sure I would put any above or below those already posted, though I have a huge soft spot for Ronnie Lane.
Lamont Dozier  
Reb8thVA : 5/24/2016 8:47 pm : link
And the Holland brothers from Motown
I think  
NJGiantFan84 : 5/24/2016 8:54 pm : link
Tom Petty deserves mention. He has a tremendous catalog and the back of his catalog doesn't get enough credit, IMO. He has some beautiful and some rocking songs that many people have not even heard.

I wouldn't say he is the best, but he has written songs that charted in every decade since the 1970's. That is pretty impressive.
RE: I think  
Moondawg : 5/24/2016 8:56 pm : link
In comment 12969969 NJGiantFan84 said:
Quote:
Tom Petty deserves mention. He has a tremendous catalog and the back of his catalog doesn't get enough credit, IMO. He has some beautiful and some rocking songs that many people have not even heard.

I wouldn't say he is the best, but he has written songs that charted in every decade since the 1970's. That is pretty impressive.


I mentioned him above.
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