To be born of an "eastward"' father (I'm assuming that means they were born In the east) then it would be to be brought up as a bastard and have the only mother figure in your life hate you?
Jon would of been killed off if, Robert would of known that he was Rhaegar's son. Jon would of had a legit claim to the throne, and Robert was not going to have that.
This is why Ned claimed Jon as his own. No one would question his word as the lord of Winterfell.
Has not read the books, and follows the show closely, this Tower of Joy scene has not been explained well. So, was she Murdered by this guy or was she bleeding from child birth? Was she kidnapped and raped or did she elope and have a relationship that Robert didn't know about? Was the whole thing a lie to make Robert not hate the Starks? Was it Roberts baby or were they in this little castle for a year while she was raped and carried the baby to term? I know to people who read the books these answers are obvious but to real non book readers they aren't.
I THINK...that she was kidnapped, raped, impregnated by Rhaegar Tagareyan, and died in child birth.
No. Watch this scene: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfnl9owFc84
Has not read the books, and follows the show closely, this Tower of Joy scene has not been explained well. So, was she Murdered by this guy or was she bleeding from child birth? Was she kidnapped and raped or did she elope and have a relationship that Robert didn't know about? Was the whole thing a lie to make Robert not hate the Starks? Was it Roberts baby or were they in this little castle for a year while she was raped and carried the baby to term? I know to people who read the books these answers are obvious but to real non book readers they aren't.
Bleeding from child birth.
She ran away with Rhaegar willingly. Rhaegar loved Lyanna but was married to Elia Martell.
Lyanna had Ned say the kid was his bastard so that Robert and the Lannisters didn't kill her kid like they did to Elia and Rhaegar's children.
It was not Robert's baby.
RE: RE: Rhagar is Dany's dead before the show older brother
Just Rhaegar's bastard and not Ned's. So he may or may not have a claim for the throne depending on who's point of view we're looking at.
One interesting thing to note about that was the North just tossing out Jon's bastard status and naming him King of the North. Perhaps the rest of Westeros does the same when finding out that Rhaegar was his father regardless of whether he actually married Lyanna before her death or not.
Next season should be good with the condensed storylines now.
I really didn't think Cersei was THAT evil. I mean I knew she was evil and I knew the rumors about the wildfire, but that was just epic. I agree with the poster who mentioned the music in this episode. The "Cersei theme" in this episode was excellent.
Jon fuckin Snow. Lady Mormont stole the scene again.
Littlefinger smirking at Sansa and Varys lurking behind Dany in the final scene. Those 2 play the game better than anyone else.
There were a couple of just ok episodes in this one, but the highs from this season were probably better than any other IMO. Just an great season from a great show. Can't wait to see how this thing ends.
I think if Varys had an ulterior motive, it would be the surprise
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
Tell the story of the tower to somebody in season 1 or 2? And its not hard to understand that Robert wanted all Targs dead, so Lyanna saying if robert finds him you know he'll kill him kind of connects it all. No need to read the books
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
Didn't she have a discussion with Sir Barrister Selmy about Rhaegar a couple of seasons back? Selmy told her about how noble her brother was.
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
I didn't think Jon Snow would be named king of the North until we got closer to the final battle versus the white walkers. Dany mentioned marrying a King in Westeros I am wondering if she will eye Jon Snow until of course they find out that they are siblings.
I didn't think Jon Snow would be named king of the North until we got closer to the final battle versus the white walkers. Dany mentioned marrying a King in Westeros I am wondering if she will eye Jon Snow until of course they find out that they are siblings.
Either way, the Targaryans are known for their inbreeding so any chance of marrying Jon snow doesn't seem to be hindered by the fact that they are indeed related.
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
I didn't think Jon Snow would be named king of the North until we got closer to the final battle versus the white walkers. Dany mentioned marrying a King in Westeros I am wondering if she will eye Jon Snow until of course they find out that they are siblings.
They are NOT siblings. She is his AUNT.
RE: RE: Rhaegar was mentioned a few times in the series
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
I still walked away from episode 9 feeling a wee bit happier than episode 10. Ramsey's death and Sansa's smirk really elevated the pleasure level that episode 10 was not able to match for me.
RE: RE: RE: Rhaegar was mentioned a few times in the series
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's where Bran comes in...
As far as I know, Bran is the only one who knows the identity of Jon's real dad. How do you see him transferring this knowledge?
RE: RE: RE: RE: Rhaegar was mentioned a few times in the series
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's where Bran comes in...
As far as I know, Bran is the only one who knows the identity of Jon's real dad. How do you see him transferring this knowledge?
I have no idea. Meera will also know. What is the point plot=wise of him learning this information if not to provide it to the people involved?
RE: Jay, assuming you mean Rhaegar being Jon's father
Mountains & Vale: ruled by an immature, possibly disturbed only child.
Westerlands: Tywin is out of grandchildren, and the only one of his kids who wants to lead is a woman, who just exploded the capital.
Riverlands: Tullys are dead or in prison. Frey was just murdered and his children seem feckless.
Iron Islands: King was just murdered and there are two contenders for rule.
The Reach: Tyrells were just slaughtered. Olenna isnt spitting out more kids.
Dorne: Ruling family killed/murdered.
Stormlands: The Baratheons appear extinct. Robert, his purported children, his two brothers, his niece.
Nights Watch: Two straight LC's murdered. Currently without an elected LC.
We'll have to see if the show bothers developing the replacement nobility for the Reach and Stormlands. It very much did in the North (Boltons) and only a little bit did for the Riverlands (Freys). I suspect it wont.
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
I agree, following these threads here on BBI is making it a lot easier to follow. In the first TOJ scenes, young Ned Stark did fight with King's Guard at the tower.
and tells Jon Snow of his true lineage then I can see him stepping down as King of the North naming Sansa as the Queen. He would obviously stay by her side and lead the army against the white walkers.
RE: RE: Rhaegar was mentioned a few times in the series
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's not relevant. The point of the story would be that Rhaegar ranaway/kidnapped Lyanna for love/lust and it cost the Targaryen's their kingdom. If he was responsible and dutiful instead the Targaryen's would still be on the Iron Throne. The story would be told as an example as why Dany needs to put her duty above her love/lust for Daario. Jon Snow wouldnt' even be relevant to the conversation.
The idea would be to bring back up the Rhaegar/Lyanna relationship to the viewers, so they later tower of joy scene would have been clearer to non-book readers.
Any reason why Jon doesn't have silver hair? Is the Stark brown hair gene (they make Lyanna have really dark brown hair) the dominant one over the Targaryen silver? Considering all the Targaryen's we know about on the show are silver-haired, it's interesting how Jon has a jet black emo look.
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
I agree, following these threads here on BBI is making it a lot easier to follow. In the first TOJ scenes, young Ned Stark did fight with King's Guard at the tower.
Yes, and he knew his sister was up in that tower and that she screamed. I didn't associate her scream meaning child being born. I guess I should have. After all, Rhagar Must have had a pretty good reason to have his best guard protecting the tower instead of protecting him.
There is a spell on the wall which prevents the dead from passing correct? Is the spell broken once Bran crosses since he was touched by the Night King?
Dani invading Winterfell
Euron laying in wait
Jaime vs Cersi
Sansa-Jon-Littlefinger trio fighting over the north
Arya now a sick assassin
The Hound doing whatever he does
Bran still north of the wall as the Three Eyed Raven
Brienne just rowing somewhere
Anything else?
Jorah is still wondering around somewhere looking for a cure...
Army of the dead
Dorne & Olenna v Cersi.
Melissandre, the Brothers w/o Banners, and the fire god in Westeros now that the leaders of the followers of the 7 are kaput (and the whole religion is detested by Cersi).
Dani invading Winterfell
Euron laying in wait
Jaime vs Cersi
Sansa-Jon-Littlefinger trio fighting over the north
Arya now a sick assassin
The Hound doing whatever he does
Bran still north of the wall as the Three Eyed Raven
Brienne just rowing somewhere
Anything else?
Jorah is still wondering around somewhere looking for a cure...
Army of the dead
Dorne & Olenna v Cersi.
Melissandre, the Brothers w/o Banners, and the fire god in Westeros now that the leaders of the followers of the 7 are kaput (and the whole religion is detested by Cersi).
There is a spell on the wall which prevents the dead from passing correct? Is the spell broken once Bran crosses since he was touched by the Night King?
That is a pretty popular theory. Similar to how the protection of the cave was broken after Bran was touched.
Any reason why Jon doesn't have silver hair? Is the Stark brown hair gene (they make Lyanna have really dark brown hair) the dominant one over the Targaryen silver? Considering all the Targaryen's we know about on the show are silver-haired, it's interesting how Jon has a jet black emo look.
They preserved that look thru inbreeding. So maybe it is a weak gene.
Jamie will be pissed at Cersei, blaming her for their son, Tommen's death. So, how do you see this playing out?
Anyone else think ARYA will be the one to end Cersei's life, not Danny. I believe Arya has Cersei on her list of people to kill. After watching how she killed Frey, I'm thinking she is going down her list. And she has faces to use as disguises.
Jon would of been killed off if, Robert would of known that he was Rhaegar's son. Jon would of had a legit claim to the throne, and Robert was not going to have that.
This is why Ned claimed Jon as his own. No one would question his word as the lord of Winterfell.
Quote:
Has not read the books, and follows the show closely, this Tower of Joy scene has not been explained well. So, was she Murdered by this guy or was she bleeding from child birth? Was she kidnapped and raped or did she elope and have a relationship that Robert didn't know about? Was the whole thing a lie to make Robert not hate the Starks? Was it Roberts baby or were they in this little castle for a year while she was raped and carried the baby to term? I know to people who read the books these answers are obvious but to real non book readers they aren't.
I THINK...that she was kidnapped, raped, impregnated by Rhaegar Tagareyan, and died in child birth.
No. Watch this scene: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfnl9owFc84
Littlefinger doesn't buy the kidnapping
Whoops - ( New Window )
I didn't get that from that scene at all?
Yes but I think if Bran crosses they can. Bran was touched by the night king and like the cave he was able to enter once Bran was there.
The real quote. lol
Bleeding from child birth.
She ran away with Rhaegar willingly. Rhaegar loved Lyanna but was married to Elia Martell.
Lyanna had Ned say the kid was his bastard so that Robert and the Lannisters didn't kill her kid like they did to Elia and Rhaegar's children.
It was not Robert's baby.
Quote:
.
That makes him rightful heir to the iron throne when the Targerians retake the throne right?
He was already the rightful heir as he was son of the heir, grandson of the mad king.
BBI did very well in the predictions
One interesting thing to note about that was the North just tossing out Jon's bastard status and naming him King of the North. Perhaps the rest of Westeros does the same when finding out that Rhaegar was his father regardless of whether he actually married Lyanna before her death or not.
Next season should be good with the condensed storylines now.
Jon fuckin Snow. Lady Mormont stole the scene again.
Littlefinger smirking at Sansa and Varys lurking behind Dany in the final scene. Those 2 play the game better than anyone else.
There were a couple of just ok episodes in this one, but the highs from this season were probably better than any other IMO. Just an great season from a great show. Can't wait to see how this thing ends.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
Didn't she have a discussion with Sir Barrister Selmy about Rhaegar a couple of seasons back? Selmy told her about how noble her brother was.
Either way, the Targaryans are known for their inbreeding so any chance of marrying Jon snow doesn't seem to be hindered by the fact that they are indeed related.
But shes open to a political marriage
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
They are NOT siblings. She is his AUNT.
Quote:
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's where Bran comes in...
Quote:
In comment 13010527 Scyber said:
Quote:
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's where Bran comes in...
As far as I know, Bran is the only one who knows the identity of Jon's real dad. How do you see him transferring this knowledge?
Quote:
In comment 13010619 5BowlsSoon said:
Quote:
In comment 13010527 Scyber said:
Quote:
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's where Bran comes in...
As far as I know, Bran is the only one who knows the identity of Jon's real dad. How do you see him transferring this knowledge?
I have no idea. Meera will also know. What is the point plot=wise of him learning this information if not to provide it to the people involved?
Yes you are right.
North: A bastard is now King
Mountains & Vale: ruled by an immature, possibly disturbed only child.
Westerlands: Tywin is out of grandchildren, and the only one of his kids who wants to lead is a woman, who just exploded the capital.
Riverlands: Tullys are dead or in prison. Frey was just murdered and his children seem feckless.
Iron Islands: King was just murdered and there are two contenders for rule.
The Reach: Tyrells were just slaughtered. Olenna isnt spitting out more kids.
Dorne: Ruling family killed/murdered.
Stormlands: The Baratheons appear extinct. Robert, his purported children, his two brothers, his niece.
Nights Watch: Two straight LC's murdered. Currently without an elected LC.
We'll have to see if the show bothers developing the replacement nobility for the Reach and Stormlands. It very much did in the North (Boltons) and only a little bit did for the Riverlands (Freys). I suspect it wont.
Quote:
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
I agree, following these threads here on BBI is making it a lot easier to follow. In the first TOJ scenes, young Ned Stark did fight with King's Guard at the tower.
Quote:
But they could have probably done a better job for non-book readers. I think the Tyrion-Dany scene could have easily mentioned Rhaegar and Lyanna as an example of what happens when you choose love/lust over duty/responsibility. Would have fit in nicely after Dany cutting ties with Daario.
One problem I think. Neither Dany or Tyrion even know Jon Snow is Rhagaer's son.
That's not relevant. The point of the story would be that Rhaegar ranaway/kidnapped Lyanna for love/lust and it cost the Targaryen's their kingdom. If he was responsible and dutiful instead the Targaryen's would still be on the Iron Throne. The story would be told as an example as why Dany needs to put her duty above her love/lust for Daario. Jon Snow wouldnt' even be relevant to the conversation.
The idea would be to bring back up the Rhaegar/Lyanna relationship to the viewers, so they later tower of joy scene would have been clearer to non-book readers.
Quote:
In comment 13010435 Jolly Blue Giant said:
Quote:
Rhaegar Was even mentioned in the show as being Dany's older brother. I could be wrong but I've watched the show twice. Without book readers this show would be unable to follow some of the details.
I just read this and posted mine without having read this. I agree. In fact, I don't even recall seeing him. I also didn't read the books so I guess to have thought he was the father of Jon, you must have read the books.
I agree, following these threads here on BBI is making it a lot easier to follow. In the first TOJ scenes, young Ned Stark did fight with King's Guard at the tower.
Yes, and he knew his sister was up in that tower and that she screamed. I didn't associate her scream meaning child being born. I guess I should have. After all, Rhagar Must have had a pretty good reason to have his best guard protecting the tower instead of protecting him.
Quote:
combined most of the storylines now, right?
What is left?
Dani invading Winterfell
Euron laying in wait
Jaime vs Cersi
Sansa-Jon-Littlefinger trio fighting over the north
Arya now a sick assassin
The Hound doing whatever he does
Bran still north of the wall as the Three Eyed Raven
Brienne just rowing somewhere
Anything else?
Jorah is still wondering around somewhere looking for a cure...
Army of the dead
Dorne & Olenna v Cersi.
Melissandre, the Brothers w/o Banners, and the fire god in Westeros now that the leaders of the followers of the 7 are kaput (and the whole religion is detested by Cersi).
Quote:
In comment 13010360 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
combined most of the storylines now, right?
What is left?
Dani invading Winterfell
Euron laying in wait
Jaime vs Cersi
Sansa-Jon-Littlefinger trio fighting over the north
Arya now a sick assassin
The Hound doing whatever he does
Bran still north of the wall as the Three Eyed Raven
Brienne just rowing somewhere
Anything else?
Jorah is still wondering around somewhere looking for a cure...
Army of the dead
Dorne & Olenna v Cersi.
Melissandre, the Brothers w/o Banners, and the fire god in Westeros now that the leaders of the followers of the 7 are kaput (and the whole religion is detested by Cersi).
Sam and Gilly. Sam and a big ass library.
That is a pretty popular theory. Similar to how the protection of the cave was broken after Bran was touched.
They preserved that look thru inbreeding. So maybe it is a weak gene.
To be clear: mad king dies, which elevates first child to King, Rheagar. Rheagar dies which then elevates his son, Jon Snow. Danny gets nada.
Anyone else think ARYA will be the one to end Cersei's life, not Danny. I believe Arya has Cersei on her list of people to kill. After watching how she killed Frey, I'm thinking she is going down her list. And she has faces to use as disguises.