NFT: Knicks Chat 6/27/2016- Durant "more interested" with Rose?

ARGH!

To Parsons

massive no on Parsons. Injury prone, terrible fit with Melo/KP and looking for max money. Massive pass from me.

I hope it's three years instead of four, but I have my doubts.

That Lakers, Houston and Washington are ruled out

Then the 6 teams that got the meeting

And somehow the knicks are the team stuck in limbo? Seems a little unfair to the knicks to be basically unsure of what to do, do they wait? Do they just say screw it and move on? Seems weird that they can't get a definitive answer

.

In comment 13010613 nygiants16 said:

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That Lakers, Houston and Washington are ruled out Then the 6 teams that got the meeting And somehow the knicks are the team stuck in limbo? Seems a little unfair to the knicks to be basically unsure of what to do, do they wait? Do they just say screw it and move on? Seems weird that they can't get a definitive answer

My guess is despite fans viewing it was "yes or no", that Durant's camp will/is giving the Knicks a clearer indication of whether a meeting is worth having or not. I'm sure if Melo asked his friend "hey can you just meet with us" he would but there is no "point" to meeting unless he's actually going to consider the Knicks. There is only so much ass kissing the Knicks can do. The roster is X, the pick situation is Y, this is the vision, this is the advantage of NYC and either that is enough to make him think "hmmm yeah maybe" or it's not. I will say if the Knicks don't get a meeting it's a clear knock against the idea Phil's rings = foot in the door with the guys we want.

like Green but are we just going to target all older players? Noah 32 next season, Green 31. Both would presumably get 3-4 years if they are coming here. I'd like to see some more inspired/younger targets.

The West is infinitely more challenging.

Melo-Durant-KP plus the potential of Rose even getting close to the high point of his career again seems pretty intriguing in the East if you ask me.

A few other smart moves this year and it would be difficult to imagine that team not walking to the East finals.

In comment 13010653 Chris684 said:

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The West is infinitely more challenging. Melo-Durant-KP plus the potential of Rose even getting close to the high point of his career again seems pretty intriguing in the East if you ask me. A few other smart moves this year and it would be difficult to imagine that team not walking to the East finals.

But you still need to play a WC team to win it all. Outside GS they had no trouble in the west. And they were up 3-1 against GS. And now they made improvements already going into next season and can still make another splash if they can move Kanter.

not in the WC. They hold zero of a basketball advantage over any of the other rumored suitors for KD.

No more arguing about the rose deal in this thread? Dear lord is it tiring

KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in.

In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said:

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KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in.

In fairness that would suggest he doesn't view the Knicks as being close to contenders even WITH him, that's pretty sobering.

In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said:

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KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in.

But that's my point why not just tell them he is not interested like he apparently did with thr Lakers Washington and Houston?

If he is truly not interested I'd rather him just tell the knicks no so they don't have to wait

Wroten? They didn't have to make a decision on his money for next season until October. Why cut bait now? Seems like something may have gone sour.

In comment 13010691 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said: Quote: KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in. In fairness that would suggest he doesn't view the Knicks as being close to contenders even WITH him, that's pretty sobering.

I mean it's all relative. If he's coming to NY it obviously wouldn't be for basketball reasons, it would be to play with his friends and in the city. GS is the obvious choice for pure basketball reasons, but if he doesn't want to take the easy way out and be ridiculed for going there it's OKC and SA.

Conclusion That his best chance to win is by going through the east. Going into the postseason I don't think it was an unreasonable opinion to say that Cleveland was the 4th best team behind Golden State, San Antonio, and Oklahoma City. Cleveland was able to coast to the finals while the 3 western teams battled and tired each other out, that was definitely an advantage for the Cavs.

Yeah Oklahoma City has improved themselves, but I'm sure Golden State and San Antonio will as well so the west will be just as tough as ever.

And apparently said he heard knicks are in his top 3, I don't know what kind of sources he has but take it with a grain of salt..

Remember Hahn said he heard Durant was interested and would get meeting and we know who is source is

In comment 13010696 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said: Quote: KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in. But that's my point why not just tell them he is not interested like he apparently did with thr Lakers Washington and Houston? If he is truly not interested I'd rather him just tell the knicks no so they don't have to wait

Well I don't think they are waiting. Isn't it reported that Noah is priority #1?

a knick meeting yet. I mean thats not that crazy to think. The knicks seem very hush hush at this point. I mean Phil said they had been talking with CHI for weeks about Rose and we didnt really get any reports until it was basically done. I know its unlikely that someone wouldnt leak it, but the knicks do not seem like they leak anything anymore. Of course you would think someone from Durants camp would.

In comment 13010691 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said: Quote: KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in. In fairness that would suggest he doesn't view the Knicks as being close to contenders even WITH him, that's pretty sobering.

If that's the case, you would think this would register with Dolan at some point - if he's even paying attention. Melo was supposed to be a draw. Phil was supposed to be a draw. Mills is supposed to have "connections" (I know, try not to laugh out loud). There's really no shortcuts when it comes to adding these guys - unless you're the Heat 6 years ago or the best player in the league happens to have been born in the same state where your team plays.

see it posted, but Berman posted an article that has Noah all but coming to the Knicks. Says money won't be a factor but Noah prioritizes:

1. Winning
2. Dont Remember
3. A team that will help his strategy.

I'm at work but if someone could post it that would be appreciated.

*A team that will help his foundation. Noah's Arc I think.

In comment 13010706 giantsfan44ab said:

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In comment 13010696 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said: Quote: KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in. But that's my point why not just tell them he is not interested like he apparently did with thr Lakers Washington and Houston? If he is truly not interested I'd rather him just tell the knicks no so they don't have to wait Well I don't think they are waiting. Isn't it reported that Noah is priority #1?

But as long as he doesn't want a crazy amount of money knicks can sign both him and durant...

If he asks for to much money can the knicks ks just say screw it to Durant if there is still a chance albeit a small one?

And does anyone really know who the knicks #1 priority is? I think reporters think that because of what rose said

In comment 13010707 Italianju said:

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a knick meeting yet. I mean thats not that crazy to think. The knicks seem very hush hush at this point. I mean Phil said they had been talking with CHI for weeks about Rose and we didnt really get any reports until it was basically done. I know its unlikely that someone wouldnt leak it, but the knicks do not seem like they leak anything anymore. Of course you would think someone from Durants camp would.

It was leaked like over a week ago that they were pursuing Rose. It was leaked that it would be a "pipe dream" for him to sign here. So don't really see where the secrecy is a strategic move in all of this.

to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers.

There's no legitimate reason for him to want to play here other than fans projecting eternal glory for being a savior. He can take the money in OKC, or winning at a high level in other situations that actually have more than 5 players under contract.

is silly, if winning is #1 priority for Noah he wouldn't even have the Knicks on his short list.

In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers.

Can't really say he has been avoiding the knicks since he has been working out with Melo and hanging out with the knicks trainer/ player personnel guy..

Winning, the ability to start and finish games, and support for his Fundation.

The Knicks should offer all 3 at a higher level than most other teams interested.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13010723 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said: Quote: to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers. Can't really say he has been avoiding the knicks since he has been working out with Melo and hanging out with the knicks trainer/ player personnel guy..

I think you're reading way to much into this.

In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers.

It'd be more than unfortunate. It'd be a downright slap in the face.

is Durant resigns for a 1+1 and we attempt to impress him next offseason with an improved KP and either a healthy Rose or cap space for Westbrook. Though I think the idea of KD and RW pairing up again on another team is just odd unless it is a revolt against OKC's ownership.

In comment 13010729 giantsfan44ab said:

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In comment 13010723 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said: Quote: to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers. Can't really say he has been avoiding the knicks since he has been working out with Melo and hanging out with the knicks trainer/ player personnel guy.. I think you're reading way to much into this.

I am not reading into anything, but you can't say he has been avoiding the knicks when he has done those things...

Really that simple, never said it meant he is signing with the Knicks or anything like that, just said you can't say he is avoiding the knicks

but Lopez has proven to be able to stay healthy. I'm all for Noah, he's a great fit, but I'd be real careful with the money. I would not sign him to a 4 year deal and I'd be real careful about the 3 year deal. I like that Phil has put us in a position where guys need to come to the Knicks on our terms so that should help.

will not even hold meetings with other teams so unless the Raptors get cutesy with him he's basically off the market already.

In comment 13010723 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said: Quote: to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers. Can't really say he has been avoiding the knicks since he has been working out with Melo and hanging out with the knicks trainer/ player personnel guy..

Players hanging out with their friends should not be looked too deeply into. Melo goes on family vacations with Wade and Lebron. They're always together. Meant nothing.

In comment 13010733 Deej said:

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is Durant resigns for a 1+1 and we attempt to impress him next offseason with an improved KP and either a healthy Rose or cap space for Westbrook. Though I think the idea of KD and RW pairing up again on another team is just odd unless it is a revolt against OKC's ownership.

It'd be pretty damn hard to, if he re-signs for a 1 year deal in OKC I think 60-65 wins is easily in play for them.

love players citing "winning" as the #1 consideration and then joining a non-playoff team with 6 players on the roster.

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Source: Devin Booker, MVP in France, agreed to Summer League deal with New York Knicks.

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In comment 13010742 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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In comment 13010723 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13010717 Ten Ton Hammer said: Quote: to have Durant take his meetings in New York but avoid the Knicks like they're lepers. Can't really say he has been avoiding the knicks since he has been working out with Melo and hanging out with the knicks trainer/ player personnel guy.. Players hanging out with their friends should not be looked too deeply into. Melo goes on family vacations with Wade and Lebron. They're always together. Meant nothing.

But you can't say he is avoiding the knicks, you really think Melo is not recruiting him or talking about the knicks? Come on...

Melo himself said he was going to recruit, Derrick rose who hates recruiting said he was going to recruit...

with Melo I think it would be pretty easy for him to level with him and say "I don't want to waste time bro". Because it would be pretty disrespectful for KD to take a meeting with the team when Melo knows there's 0 chance of him signing here.

In comment 13010750 Anakim said:

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David Pick ‏@IAmDPick Source: Devin Booker, MVP in France, agreed to Summer League deal with New York Knicks.

Booker is also the cousin of Jordan Hill, who has also played in the NBA, with the New York Knicks, Houston Rockets, Los Angeles Lakers, and Indiana Pacers.[3]-wiki

In comment 13010747 DanMetroMan said:

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love players citing "winning" as the #1 consideration and then joining a non-playoff team with 6 players on the roster.

Players always think they can make a team better if they team up...

Maybe he thinks rose Melo kp and himself can win in the east?

In comment 13010760 giantsfan44ab said:

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with Melo I think it would be pretty easy for him to level with him and say "I don't want to waste time bro". Because it would be pretty disrespectful for KD to take a meeting with the team when Melo knows there's 0 chance of him signing here.

And that's all I am asking, if the knicks have zero chance how come they have not been ruled out like the Lakers Washington and Houston?

Why are they still in limbo, very s easy for durant to tell Melo or rose hey I am not interested tell Phil no meeting...

In comment 13010762 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 13010747 DanMetroMan said: Quote: love players citing "winning" as the #1 consideration and then joining a non-playoff team with 6 players on the roster. Players always think they can make a team better if they team up... Maybe he thinks rose Melo kp and himself can win in the east?

C'mon if that's the case how many spots could a player join and have it "not" be about winning? Which situations are so bad that the Knicks are about winning but they are not? Brooklyn, Sixers, Lakers, Suns, Nuggets and Kings? I'm not a hater but as of today the Knicks are easily a bottom 1/3 team in the NBA, "joining a winner" is silly as an argument for coming here. If they added Durant, that's another story.

But Kevin Durant has played on NBA Finals teams. He knows what it takes to get there and has been in the trenches. I don't see him as this irrational confidence guy to think Melo, Rose, Durant, and some assorted unwanted toys = championship.

He seems to have a pretty low-wattage ego among NBA stars.

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About that time for a # change..
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love Durant and would go bonkers if we added him but he came off as very odd in one of those interview/stories about how one off season he decided to be tougher on the court. It seemed so manufactured/forced.

is all about winning he will take less and sign with GS or sign with the Spurs. I am hoping that he is becoming convinced that his easiest way of making it to the finals is by playing in the eastern conference which would greatly increase the Knicks chances which I think right now are about 20%.

KP is "Unwanted toys"? It just keeps getting better!

claims that Noah money would be more than he's currently making (12+) and "significant" money.

In comment 13010746 giantsfan44ab said:

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In comment 13010733 Deej said: Quote: is Durant resigns for a 1+1 and we attempt to impress him next offseason with an improved KP and either a healthy Rose or cap space for Westbrook. Though I think the idea of KD and RW pairing up again on another team is just odd unless it is a revolt against OKC's ownership. It'd be pretty damn hard to, if he re-signs for a 1 year deal in OKC I think 60-65 wins is easily in play for them.

In play but I think unlikely. Cant project everyone to keep getting better. Im not convinced Adams will continue his playoffs breakout. Nor am I convinced that Oladipo is a good fit. Very good defender, but not much of a shooter and has been affirmatively bad off ball. That's why the Magic turned him into a 6th man (to get him away from Elf) and why I think they ultimately traded him.

But lets say you're right. He sees that now too. So there isnt an argument to get him to leave for NY. But if Rose is a 21-6 PG and KP looks like a guy still on the Dirk-or-better path, the Knicks have an argument next year. Right now, he comes here and we have no SG and no C and little $$ to spend. That's not a good argument.

Durant Melo rose and kp is not a title contender?

You could add me and you on that bench and it would be a title contender...

When the big 3 in miami came together what did Miami have on their roster that was so great?

When the big 3 came together in Boston what did they have that was so great? And don't give me Rondo because everyone thought he was garbage the year before and wanted to fire rivers...

In comment 13010791 DanMetroMan said:

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claims that Noah money would be more than he's currently making (12+) and "significant" money.

He also still thinks blatt is still in the running for the knicks job...

Noah would be on board at a reduced amount. Cause Noah, Melo, KP, KD & Rose is a contender.

but you guys are going to have basically the same conversations about Durant every day for the next week.

And at the same time all of us know he's not coming here.

In comment 13010782 Carl in CT said:

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KP is "Unwanted toys"? It just keeps getting better!

Don't be so dramatic. I accidentally left him out and he's still not the difference between that team being ready to compete for the Finals or not.

When you add him to those other three. Plus a center.

joining the Knicks for "winning" reasons only makes sense if he joins them in conjunction/following a MAJOR addition ie Durant.

Than KP? Assuming (Melo, KD and Rose) are your top three and not knowing who are center is yet. You are out of your mind. Even Golden State with Curry, Thompson & Green doesn't have a KP as their next option.

In comment 13010796 MookGiants said:

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but you guys are going to have basically the same conversations about Durant every day for the next week. And at the same time all of us know he's not coming here.

But isn't it fun! Haha, the best are the people who take it so seriously in thinking that we believe he is coming...

Sure making my slow day today go faster

many teams have a trio better than KP/Rose/Melo, have the cap room to sign noah, and have a massive hole at center where he'd be the obvious starter?

In comment 13010793 nygiants16 said:

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Durant Melo rose and kp is not a title contender? You could add me and you on that bench and it would be a title contender... When the big 3 in miami came together what did Miami have on their roster that was so great?[quote] When the big 3 came together in Boston what did they have that was so great?

Miami shouldn't even be part of the comparison. Lebron took Shumpert and JR Smith to the finals twice. Lebron isn't in this equation.

The Boston comparison works fine, but Boston was 2 hall of famers and a maybe-HOF player all buying in at the same time to desperately get that ring at the end of their careers.

but Durant all but ensures that any team he signs with becomes a contender. The Knicks have Melo, KP and Rose along with cap room and future picks. The team is far from barren. If Durant comes to NY the Knicks will immediately vautl to contender status. The back end of the roster is easy to fill.

Durant probably doesn't come here but the Knicks are basically one big player away from 55-60 wins assuming they can fill out the back end of the rotation, which is pretty easy to do especially when the front end of the team is star studded.

Durant won't pass on the Knicks because they have no shot at winning with him.

Blaming a failed landing of Durant on Phil and conjuring up Riley's name as the better GM is just ridiculous. Riley went to Miami and inherited a well stocked franchise. Phil inherited Fallujah circa 2005.

In comment 13010808 Jon in NYC said:

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many teams have a trio better than KP/Rose/Melo, have the cap room to sign noah, and have a massive hole at center where he'd be the obvious starter?

Jon,
You would really make the argument the Knicks would be on your short list if your #1 most important thing was winning? C'mon that is ridiculous. How about the Spurs for one? Quite a few contenders could use an upgrade at Center. Heck, the Heat sans Whiteside, the Mavs I could go on and on. The Knicks are not near being contenders and joining them because you value "winning" is farcical.

.

teams than the Knicks with potential openings at C

Spurs
Cavs
Mavs
Hawks
Pacers
Celtics

he most certainly has.

In comment 13010813 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 13010808 Jon in NYC said: Quote: many teams have a trio better than KP/Rose/Melo, have the cap room to sign noah, and have a massive hole at center where he'd be the obvious starter? Jon, You would really make the argument the Knicks would be on your short list if your #1 most important thing was winning? C'mon that is ridiculous. How about the Spurs for one? Quite a few contenders could use an upgrade at Center. Heck, the Heat sans Whiteside, the Mavs I could go on and on. The Knicks are not near being contenders and joining them because you value "winning" is farcical.

Do the Spurs have cap room to sign Noah?

I'd take the Knicks trio over the Heat without Whiteside. Same with the Mavs without Parsons (and Dirk for that matter).

Still waiting for a viable option for him other than the TWolves.

In comment 13010804 DanMetroMan said:

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joining the Knicks for "winning" reasons only makes sense if he joins them in conjunction/following a MAJOR addition ie Durant.

Forget durant....

If they added Crabbe and Noah could

Rose/Galloway
Crabbe
Melo/ Thomas
KP
Noah/oquinn/willy

Maybe add Crawford, is that a contender in the east?

In comment 13010818 DanMetroMan said:

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teams than the Knicks with potential openings at C Spurs Cavs Mavs Hawks Pacers Celtics

Cavs + Spurs don't have cap. Mavs I addressed already.

The Hawks, Pacers and C's I'd give you, but not by much. I think you can make an argument that the Knicks have a better core in place than any of those guys.

In comment 13010818 DanMetroMan said:

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teams than the Knicks with potential openings at C Spurs Cavs Mavs Hawks Pacers Celtics

I'm not getting into this vortex again. OF course there are better teams than the Knicks but Durant changes any team and if the Knicks could add 2-3 additional role players like Crawford they would be awesome next season. The celts are better because they have better role players. Role players can be had. Melo is also the best player on both teams right this very moment. Star power goes a long way in the NBA and role players can be had on the cheap.

In comment 13010820 Jon in NYC said:

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In comment 13010813 DanMetroMan said: Quote: In comment 13010808 Jon in NYC said: Quote: many teams have a trio better than KP/Rose/Melo, have the cap room to sign noah, and have a massive hole at center where he'd be the obvious starter? Jon, You would really make the argument the Knicks would be on your short list if your #1 most important thing was winning? C'mon that is ridiculous. How about the Spurs for one? Quite a few contenders could use an upgrade at Center. Heck, the Heat sans Whiteside, the Mavs I could go on and on. The Knicks are not near being contenders and joining them because you value "winning" is farcical. Do the Spurs have cap room to sign Noah? I'd take the Knicks trio over the Heat without Whiteside. Same with the Mavs without Parsons (and Dirk for that matter). Still waiting for a viable option for him other than the TWolves.

So Noah is really good (worthy of a large contract) but no other contender is "viable" in a league weak at C. That's a reasonable statement? The team you would pick based on winning being your #1 priority would be the current Knicks roster?

In comment 13010812 djm said:

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but Durant all but ensures that any team he signs with becomes a contender. The Knicks have Melo, KP and Rose along with cap room and future picks. The team is far from barren. If Durant comes to NY the Knicks will immediately vautl to contender status. The back end of the roster is easy to fill. Durant probably doesn't come here but the Knicks are basically one big player away from 55-60 wins assuming they can fill out the back end of the rotation, which is pretty easy to do especially when the front end of the team is star studded. Durant won't pass on the Knicks because they have no shot at winning with him. Blaming a failed landing of Durant on Phil and conjuring up Riley's name as the better GM is just ridiculous. Riley went to Miami and inherited a well stocked franchise. Phil inherited Fallujah circa 2005.

Who is the 1 big player away that can bring a 32 win team to a 60 win team? Cuz Rose certainly is not elevating this team to any level, especially considering a big piece of that 32 win team is now gone. You guys remember a Derrick Rose that isn't around anymore. The Bulls didn't even make the playoffs this season with a much better roster then the Knicks have currently.

In comment 13010826 djm said:

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In comment 13010818 DanMetroMan said: Quote: teams than the Knicks with potential openings at C Spurs Cavs Mavs Hawks Pacers Celtics I'm not getting into this vortex again. OF course there are better teams than the Knicks but Durant changes any team and if the Knicks could add 2-3 additional role players like Crawford they would be awesome next season. The celts are better because they have better role players. Role players can be had. Melo is also the best player on both teams right this very moment. Star power goes a long way in the NBA and role players can be had on the cheap.

? Why is Durant involved in this in any way? We are talking Noah choosing the Knicks because he values winning. Durant isn't here. I already said IF Durant were coming/signs here that 100% changes things and refutes my argument fully. CURRENTLY the Knicks roster is not one an older player joins based on "wanting to win" sorry.

Knicks can't even get a MEETING with KD confirmed though, so I somehow doubt that will be an issue.

the Knicks were 500 or better and then Melo got hurt and soon after KP hit the wall a bit. Couple that with the guard play that was going to bite this team once the dominoes started to fall and it comes as no surprise that the Knicks fell apart mid season. They were held together by two players and both players fell apart at nearly the same time.

Knicks will be better next season by accident as long as KP and Melo stay healthy. If they can add a guard who can defend capably and log 25 plus minutes a night they will be even better.

last season was a different kind of suck for the Knicks in my view. Not as dooming as year's past.

line, if Durant comes to the Knicks players would want to come here with the idea they could win a title as soon as this upcoming season. Sans Durant there is no such argument. The 2016-2017 Knicks will not be title contenders without Kevin Durant and will not have a high pick barring disaster. So, you are Joakim Noah and you are giving up your age 32 season with hopes the Knicks next off-season sign Russell Westbrook? That's your plan? No.

He's going to get paid through the nose to come to a market he enjoys, with a teammate he is close with and might turn down a little more money from a less appealing market/team. If you told me he turned down more from the Wizards? Sure I could buy it.

I because of rose, I think a part of him and rose feel they were done dirty by Chicago and both feel like they have something to prove...

I am not really counting on him to elevate the team like that but I do think he will help. He can penetrate and score. Something the Knicks haven't had in decades.

Like I said in an earlier post. A full year of Melo and KP playing 75 games at relative good health will go a long way. The C spot will be filled. Other role players can be had.

If you add Durant to this team I will gladly bet anyone that the Knicks win 55 without even knowing who is filling out the rest of the roster.

In comment 13010843 DanMetroMan said:

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line, if Durant comes to the Knicks players would want to come here with the idea they could win a title as soon as this upcoming season. Sans Durant there is no such argument. The 2016-2017 Knicks will not be title contenders without Kevin Durant and will not have a high pick barring disaster. So, you are Joakim Noah and you are giving up your age 32 season with hopes the Knicks next off-season sign Russell Westbrook? That's your plan? No. He's going to get paid through the nose to come to a market he enjoys, with a teammate he is close with and might turn down a little more money from a less appealing market/team. If you told me he turned down more from the Wizards? Sure I could buy it.

Unless KP takes a big jump, are the Knicks even a playoff team next season? And now that KP will end up being the 3rd option for some reason, how is he even going to take that jump?

In comment 13010844 nygiants16 said:

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I because of rose, I think a part of him and rose feel they were done dirty by Chicago and both feel like they have something to prove...

Sure and he has ties to NYC, knows Rose well, likes to talk to the media, is into fashion and all of that NYC centric stuff. I get that. But if winning were truly priority #1 the Knicks would be very far down his list. These types of players might take "cheap" deals once the Lebron's and Durants are in place. They don't take that money because "in the future....". If priority #1 is winning, you sign with a team that has a shot to contend "right away". The Knicks sans Durant aren't that.

On the Knicks when our full roster is not set and we have tons of room with or without Durant? Our roster will be 100% better than last year when it's settled cause Rose over Jose makes a huge difference, KP will be better, we should have a better center than Lopez, etc. Some people will eat their words barring no injuries which would hurt any team.

In comment 13010828 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 13010820 Jon in NYC said: Quote: In comment 13010813 DanMetroMan said: Quote: In comment 13010808 Jon in NYC said: Quote: many teams have a trio better than KP/Rose/Melo, have the cap room to sign noah, and have a massive hole at center where he'd be the obvious starter? Jon, You would really make the argument the Knicks would be on your short list if your #1 most important thing was winning? C'mon that is ridiculous. How about the Spurs for one? Quite a few contenders could use an upgrade at Center. Heck, the Heat sans Whiteside, the Mavs I could go on and on. The Knicks are not near being contenders and joining them because you value "winning" is farcical. Do the Spurs have cap room to sign Noah? I'd take the Knicks trio over the Heat without Whiteside. Same with the Mavs without Parsons (and Dirk for that matter). Still waiting for a viable option for him other than the TWolves. So Noah is really good (worthy of a large contract) but no other contender is "viable" in a league weak at C. That's a reasonable statement? The team you would pick based on winning being your #1 priority would be the current Knicks roster?

If I'm Noah, and I have the choice of playing with.

A. Rose/KP/Melo

B. George/?????

C. Isiah Thomas/Jae Crowder/Jared Sullinger

I know who I'm picking.

If the Spurs or Warriors clear cap space and make a push for Noah, I can see him going elsewhere. But until that happens, I like our odds.

In comment 13010847 Sgrcts said:

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In comment 13010843 DanMetroMan said: Quote: line, if Durant comes to the Knicks players would want to come here with the idea they could win a title as soon as this upcoming season. Sans Durant there is no such argument. The 2016-2017 Knicks will not be title contenders without Kevin Durant and will not have a high pick barring disaster. So, you are Joakim Noah and you are giving up your age 32 season with hopes the Knicks next off-season sign Russell Westbrook? That's your plan? No. He's going to get paid through the nose to come to a market he enjoys, with a teammate he is close with and might turn down a little more money from a less appealing market/team. If you told me he turned down more from the Wizards? Sure I could buy it. Unless KP takes a big jump, are the Knicks even a playoff team next season? And now that KP will end up being the 3rd option for some reason, how is he even going to take that jump?

I think the Knicks will challenge for the playoffs with even a moderately decent off-season. I say this because they likely win roughly "playoff amount" of wins if Melo doesn't miss so much time. Even if Rose is only "a little better" than Calderon that's still an upgrade. That said, barring some incredible off-season the Knicks will be far closer to the "batting for .500" type of goal team than a title contender. Let's be realistic.

In comment 13010792 Deej said:

Quote:

In comment 13010746 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: In comment 13010733 Deej said: Quote: is Durant resigns for a 1+1 and we attempt to impress him next offseason with an improved KP and either a healthy Rose or cap space for Westbrook. Though I think the idea of KD and RW pairing up again on another team is just odd unless it is a revolt against OKC's ownership. It'd be pretty damn hard to, if he re-signs for a 1 year deal in OKC I think 60-65 wins is easily in play for them. In play but I think unlikely. Cant project everyone to keep getting better. Im not convinced Adams will continue his playoffs breakout. Nor am I convinced that Oladipo is a good fit. Very good defender, but not much of a shooter and has been affirmatively bad off ball. That's why the Magic turned him into a 6th man (to get him away from Elf) and why I think they ultimately traded him. But lets say you're right. He sees that now too. So there isnt an argument to get him to leave for NY. But if Rose is a 21-6 PG and KP looks like a guy still on the Dirk-or-better path, the Knicks have an argument next year. Right now, he comes here and we have no SG and no C and little $$ to spend. That's not a good argument.

Adams doesn't need to continue his playoff breakout to be an elite piece. He was a .155 WS/48 player and double double on a per 36 basis as a 22 year old. I think its not hard to see the trend go up for him. Also shot 61%.

Also disagree on Oladipo. He's improved his shooting %s across the board in every range category each year he's played in the league. If KD signs, this will give him the best spacing he's had throughout his career. He shot 40% from corner 3s. It didn't work out with Elf because Oladipo himself isn't a pure PG and Elf doesn't draw the double teams that would give Oladipo consistent open 3s. Even though westbrook can't shoot from 3s that well he is more than capable of getting his teammates open looks.

I just picture what would've happened if they had Oladipo instead of Roberson. He certainly spaces the floor more than Roberson and he is capable of attacking steph on PnRs if they switched Steph onto him. That's not completely fair as they had Ibaka and he played alright that series. But Ibaka has been on a clear decline, whether that's because the reports on him lying about his age are true or he has not adapted to his lesser role. He had a pretty mediocre (at best) season and that production is replaceable, whether they get Horford to fill in his role or a committee of Ersan, Mcgary, Adams, and Kanter can do it.

who cares that Noah said he wants to win? I couldn't care less about the lip service crap.

If Noah signs here great, hopefully he stays healthy and his deal is somewhat friendly.

I see people saying Durant won't come here because the Knicks have little to nothing to offer. I disagree. Durant is a game changer that elevates any team that has some important pieces in place and contrary to popular opinion I think the Knicks have important pieces in place. Melo is a made guy so to speak. KP is on his way. That's big.

In comment 13010850 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

On the Knicks when our full roster is not set and we have tons of room with or without Durant? Our roster will be 100% better than last year when it's settled cause Rose over Jose makes a huge difference, KP will be better, we should have a better center than Lopez, etc. Some people will eat their words barring no injuries which would hurt any team.

Carl,
So if you were a soon to be 32 year old player. The current Knicks (which is what Noah wanting to join the Knicks is based on) would be your pick based on winning potential in the near future ie right away?

In comment 13010855 djm said:

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who cares that Noah said he wants to win? I couldn't care less about the lip service crap. If Noah signs here great, hopefully he stays healthy and his deal is somewhat friendly. I see people saying Durant won't come here because the Knicks have little to nothing to offer. I disagree. Durant is a game changer that elevates any team that has some important pieces in place and contrary to popular opinion I think the Knicks have important pieces in place. Melo is a made guy so to speak. KP is on his way. That's big.

My only point is claiming winning is most important is silly. If he signs with the Knicks winning wasn't the most important thing to him and that's fine.

Noah scares me but maybe his injuries are of the temporary variety and he's got 2-3 big years in him. I don't know enough about his injury past. HE's a great locker room guy though. And we desperately need that here.

In comment 13010850 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

On the Knicks when our full roster is not set and we have tons of room with or without Durant? Our roster will be 100% better than last year when it's settled cause Rose over Jose makes a huge difference, KP will be better, we should have a better center than Lopez, etc. Some people will eat their words barring no injuries which would hurt any team.

You can't hedge on "barring no injuries" when Melo is getting less durable with age, and your two top acquisitions are guys with a proven track record of getting hurt. Noah's state of existence is 'nicked up'. These aren't opinions, you can just look up the games played for Rose and Noah. It's downright foolish to bank on that.

I hear you. I just think these guys have to say that crap. It's meaningless.

In comment 13010796 MookGiants said:

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but you guys are going to have basically the same conversations about Durant every day for the next week. And at the same time all of us know he's not coming here.

not all of us.

change the subject a bit I think the Knicks summer league crop is more interesting than past years. I could see a few guys at the very least getting camp invites. I dunno about this guy Booker though, looks like a below the rim slug in the videos I've seen.
Link - ( New Window )

�I�m excited because it�s an opportunity for growth,� Randle said. �(Knicks president) Phil Jackson is there doing a great job and they run the triangle, which I ran in college for two years, so I feel really comfortable in that style of offense. It�s an offense that, if run properly, is very hard to guard. I�m excited about that.�

The Knicks, who announced Jeff Hornacek as head coach June 2, acquired former NBA MVP Derrick Rose in a trade with the Chicago Bulls on Wednesday. They had no picks in Thursday�s draft, so Randle will be one of several undrafted free agents on the Summer League team.

Randle said he�s worked to improve his shooting, ball-handling and finishing at the rim over the past year. With his previous experience with the Warriors� Summer League team, he feels he has a more focused mindset as he tries again to earn a place in an NBA backcourt.

�Going in last year I was so happy to be part of Summer League,� Randle said. �Now, I�m kind of focusing on what it is to go beyond Summer League and try to go to training camp and make a team. I think I know the areas that I need to focus on and hopefully I can execute.�
Link - ( New Window )

I mean Teague>Rose (going off last season)

George is maybe two tiers ahead of Melo now.

KP is better than Turner but lets not discount Turner just to make the Knicks look like a better team. He's like a KP-lite, maybe even better on defense.

Ellis, Miles, Stuckey and Solomon Hill is better than any depth we can get this season.

really think Tokoto represents a nice developmental prospect if we are realistic with expectations
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13010869 DanMetroMan said:

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change the subject a bit I think the Knicks summer league crop is more interesting than past years. I could see a few guys at the very least getting camp invites. I dunno about this guy Booker though, looks like a below the rim slug in the videos I've seen. Link - ( New Window )

I feel the opposite. Maybe because no first rounders are on the roster, but seems like a pretty bad Summer League team. It's Ron Baker, Plumlee, Tokoto, Kuzmic' and a bunch of whos. No one really stands out. Maybe if one of them shines like Maurice N'Dour, but I think only the three I mentioned have a real shot to make the roster as of now. Then again, this Booker guy was the MVP of France so maybe we'll have a Copeland/N'Dour situation on our hands.

Rose, Melo & KP over Turner, George & Teague all day. Bench to be determined.

In comment 13010885 Carl in CT said:

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Rose, Melo & KP over Turner, George & Teague all day. Bench to be determined.

Wow surprise, you'd take the Knicks trio over trio "x". You're analysis hasn't exactly been unbiased.

Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you.

In comment 13010883 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13010869 DanMetroMan said: Quote: change the subject a bit I think the Knicks summer league crop is more interesting than past years. I could see a few guys at the very least getting camp invites. I dunno about this guy Booker though, looks like a below the rim slug in the videos I've seen. Link - ( New Window ) I feel the opposite. Maybe because no first rounders are on the roster, but seems like a pretty bad Summer League team. It's Ron Baker, Plumlee, Tokoto, Kuzmic' and a bunch of whos. No one really stands out. Maybe if one of them shines like Maurice N'Dour, but I think only the three I mentioned have a real shot to make the roster as of now. Then again, this Booker guy was the MVP of France so maybe we'll have a Copeland/N'Dour situation on our hands.

I'm not talking about the high picks types. Obviously we don't have a Porzingis (or any pick) there but I like Tokoto, Baker has a shot to be a surprise/Hornacek project. Plumlee sucks, Randle almost broke camp with the Warriors so clearly he has some level of talent. DX previously said this

"Randle is one of the best returning scorers in the country, but will need to show he can do more than that, including creating more for his teammates when his own shot isn't falling, and playing with better intensity defensively. Stanford lost some key players from their roster, so Randle may have to shoulder an even larger scoring role this season. Randle has an intriguing skill set for a point guard, but he will need to show a more rounded game on offense and a more concerted effort on defense to become a viable draft candidate."

not feeding the troll but any reason given why Phil/Hornacek didn't attend the Rose presser?

In comment 13010894 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you.

I have faith in Rose too but if he put up the stats Teague did last year I think we'd all be ecstatic. At best Teague vs. Rose is a wash.

PG vs Melo isn't close. PG is a top 10 player. Melo at best is a top 25 player.

KP and Turner are both good players, KP certainly has the edge but lets not act like hes KAT.

There is very little chance we end up with one player on our bench as most of the guys on Indy's bench.

Not saying Noah is going to Indy at all. They haven't even expressed interest in him. Just saying we are landing FAs this year on reasons besides building a contender (NY, friends, $$$).

After seeing Ndour shine and not even make it to the league.

Just from reading about him

In comment 13010903 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

not feeding the troll but any reason given why Phil/Hornacek didn't attend the Rose presser?

They met the press an hour before draft, so I think maybe it was just a quick conference to appease the media

In comment 13010904 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

In comment 13010894 Carl in CT said: Quote: Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you. I have faith in Rose too but if he put up the stats Teague did last year I think we'd all be ecstatic. At best Teague vs. Rose is a wash. PG vs Melo isn't close. PG is a top 10 player. Melo at best is a top 25 player. KP and Turner are both good players, KP certainly has the edge but lets not act like hes KAT. There is very little chance we end up with one player on our bench as most of the guys on Indy's bench. Not saying Noah is going to Indy at all. They haven't even expressed interest in him. Just saying we are landing FAs this year on reasons besides building a contender (NY, friends, $$$).

Teague had a better year than rose?

14 and 4 on 43% shooting

16 and 5 on 44% shooting

Is Health.

Granted Rose has battled some injuries the last few years. However he put together a very strong second half last year and now is another off season removed from the knee injury and should be even more explosive this year.

The center position in todays basketball is more devalued than ever before. Teams need a mobile guy who can play D and preferably can pass well.

Lopez for Rose is a no brainer if Rose is healthy and if not, Knicks get cap flexibilty for 2 maxes next year.

If he is healthy, Im no cap expert but I beleive depending on the other contracts of the off season, Knicks get Roses bird rights and can sign another max and then resign Rose by going over the cap anyways.

By the same logic, Durant can come here on a one year, we get his bird rights and then sign him for a long term max (and a higher max at that since he played for us the year before).

Noah is the tougher one as he will eat some of the available cap we could use for Durant. But he could sign a smaller 1 year himself if he wants to reunite with Rose and maybe Durant with the 'assurance' he will get a nice deal in 2017.

It will take some creativity and cap manipulation but the Knicks situation is very favorable for players now and if played right they can restock even moreso in 2017.

In comment 13010932 Coach Mason said:

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Is Health. Granted Rose has battled some injuries the last few years. However he put together a very strong second half last year and now is another off season removed from the knee injury and should be even more explosive this year. The center position in todays basketball is more devalued than ever before. Teams need a mobile guy who can play D and preferably can pass well. Lopez for Rose is a no brainer if Rose is healthy and if not, Knicks get cap flexibilty for 2 maxes next year. If he is healthy, Im no cap expert but I beleive depending on the other contracts of the off season, Knicks get Roses bird rights and can sign another max and then resign Rose by going over the cap anyways. By the same logic, Durant can come here on a one year, we get his bird rights and then sign him for a long term max (and a higher max at that since he played for us the year before). Noah is the tougher one as he will eat some of the available cap we could use for Durant. But he could sign a smaller 1 year himself if he wants to reunite with Rose and maybe Durant with the 'assurance' he will get a nice deal in 2017. It will take some creativity and cap manipulation but the Knicks situation is very favorable for players now and if played right they can restock even moreso in 2017.

Everything I have read suggested Noah will get paid very nicely and not some sweet little discounted deal, wanting to be a Knick or not. I suspect 3 for 39-45.

In comment 13010925 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 13010904 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: In comment 13010894 Carl in CT said: Quote: Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you. I have faith in Rose too but if he put up the stats Teague did last year I think we'd all be ecstatic. At best Teague vs. Rose is a wash. PG vs Melo isn't close. PG is a top 10 player. Melo at best is a top 25 player. KP and Turner are both good players, KP certainly has the edge but lets not act like hes KAT. There is very little chance we end up with one player on our bench as most of the guys on Indy's bench. Not saying Noah is going to Indy at all. They haven't even expressed interest in him. Just saying we are landing FAs this year on reasons besides building a contender (NY, friends, $$$). Teague had a better year than rose? 14 and 4 on 43% shooting 16 and 5 on 44% shooting

Teague shot 40% 3. Rose was 37.5% if you go by post ASB.

Do I need to rattle off all the other advanced stats to prove my point or can we just settle the fact that Rose didn't have a good season, not even close to Teague's, and accept that rose had fucked up vision so it's not a clear comparison. But it's also not fair to say Rose will be automatically better than Teague this season. If he put up Teague's exact stat line, regular and advanced, I think we'd all say Rose had a good year.

has remaining on the deal we gave him last summer. If we wind up paying that price for Noah, or even a little bit above due to salary cap inflation, I'd say that's a fair enough deal. You basically would've swapped Noah for Lopez and added Rose for a year. Not bad.

In comment 13010691 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

In comment 13010683 arcarsenal said: Quote: KD may just not want to waste the Knicks' time. It's nice to be wined and dined by all these teams but I doubt he's actually looking at us as a team he's seriously interested in. In fairness that would suggest he doesn't view the Knicks as being close to contenders even WITH him, that's pretty sobering.

I mean, they probably aren't in all seriousness unless Porzingis takes a monster leap and becomes a true star faster than expected. Rose should help but let's be real.. odds are pretty strongly against him staying healthy AND playing like the DRose of a few years ago (which would basically need to happen for this team to truly contend)

Unless he comes on a discounted one year himself. But I think Noahs thinking obvoiusly changes if Knicks got KD in the fold. The one year contract is becoming more prominant nowadays

In comment 13010946 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

In comment 13010925 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13010904 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: In comment 13010894 Carl in CT said: Quote: Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you. I have faith in Rose too but if he put up the stats Teague did last year I think we'd all be ecstatic. At best Teague vs. Rose is a wash. PG vs Melo isn't close. PG is a top 10 player. Melo at best is a top 25 player. KP and Turner are both good players, KP certainly has the edge but lets not act like hes KAT. There is very little chance we end up with one player on our bench as most of the guys on Indy's bench. Not saying Noah is going to Indy at all. They haven't even expressed interest in him. Just saying we are landing FAs this year on reasons besides building a contender (NY, friends, $$$). Teague had a better year than rose? 14 and 4 on 43% shooting 16 and 5 on 44% shooting Teague shot 40% 3. Rose was 37.5% if you go by post ASB. Do I need to rattle off all the other advanced stats to prove my point or can we just settle the fact that Rose didn't have a good season, not even close to Teague's, and accept that rose had fucked up vision so it's not a clear comparison. But it's also not fair to say Rose will be automatically better than Teague this season. If he put up Teague's exact stat line, regular and advanced, I think we'd all say Rose had a good year.

But he did put up his exact regular Stat line and was better post all star game when he put up 17 and 7...

Teague also played on a better team..

I am not metric guy so that's where we differ, I go by what I saw but we differ on that

In comment 13010946 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

In comment 13010925 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13010904 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: In comment 13010894 Carl in CT said: Quote: Should be benched this year for Schroeder if he stayed in ATL. And I'm sorry I have way more faith in Rose than some of you. I have faith in Rose too but if he put up the stats Teague did last year I think we'd all be ecstatic. At best Teague vs. Rose is a wash. Teague had a better year than rose? 14 and 4 on 43% shooting 16 and 5 on 44% shooting Teague shot 40% 3. Rose was 37.5% if you go by post ASB. Do I need to rattle off all the other advanced stats to prove my point or can we just settle the fact that Rose didn't have a good season, not even close to Teague's, and accept that rose had fucked up vision so it's not a clear comparison. But it's also not fair to say Rose will be automatically better than Teague this season. If he put up Teague's exact stat line, regular and advanced, I think we'd all say Rose had a good year.

Roses ceiling is MVP caliber lets not forget hes 27 without too much mileage (despite the injuries). Teague doesnt touch the impact of a fully healthy D Rose.

With how Rose played in the second half it was worth the risk considering it is only a next year commitment to see of he makes it all the way back.

Rose's atrocious first half took them out of the playoffs. Chicago was up and down all year but let's not act like Derrick Rose wasn't the reason they missed the playoffs. He won them a lot of games during his good stretch. But he lost them a lot more throughout the year.

You say you aren't the stat guy but you're the one who brought up the stats...Rose isn't a 3 point shooter and never will be. Teague is knockdown beyond the arc. Rose is for sure better when he's at the top of his game but that's not very often anymore. Teague is consistent throughout the season. Much more reliable. Anyways that misses the point of my argument. Indy will be a better team because of Paul George. There isn't anyone of George's quality in NY.

and not as good as Teague. We won't know until we see how healthy he is.

In comment 13010999 giantsfan44ab said:

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Rose's atrocious first half took them out of the playoffs. Chicago was up and down all year but let's not act like Derrick Rose wasn't the reason they missed the playoffs. He won them a lot of games during his good stretch. But he lost them a lot more throughout the year. You say you aren't the stat guy but you're the one who brought up the stats...Rose isn't a 3 point shooter and never will be. Teague is knockdown beyond the arc. Rose is for sure better when he's at the top of his game but that's not very often anymore. Teague is consistent throughout the season. Much more reliable. Anyways that misses the point of my argument. Indy will be a better team because of Paul George. There isn't anyone of George's quality in NY.

So Chicago was bad just because of rose? Really?

Had nothing to do with losing noah after 25 games and Butler being hurt?

This is a star driven league. You take the chance on the guys with the monster upside like Rose especially one a one year commitment. That isnt Lopez or Teague.

In comment 13011008 Coach Mason said:

Quote:

This is a star driven league. You take the chance on the guys with the monster upside like Rose especially one a one year commitment. That isnt Lopez or Teague.

That's completely fair. But I was talking about why Indy is a better spot for winning. Which is also not very relevant because Indy isn't considering Noah

In comment 13011005 Heisenberg said:

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and not as good as Teague. We won't know until we see how healthy he is.

I don't think that is the case at all. He was arguably better than Teague last year and that's when including the first few months of the season when he was playing with blurred vision. After the all star break its not even close, Rose was better than Teague. To take it a step further, getting away from Jimmy Butler is going to be a big help too, those two guys just couldn't coexist. They both performed better when they other was off the floor. In the 8 games that Rose played but Butler did not, Rose averaged somethings like 21-6-4 at a 45% clip.

In comment 13011007 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 13010999 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: Rose's atrocious first half took them out of the playoffs. Chicago was up and down all year but let's not act like Derrick Rose wasn't the reason they missed the playoffs. He won them a lot of games during his good stretch. But he lost them a lot more throughout the year. You say you aren't the stat guy but you're the one who brought up the stats...Rose isn't a 3 point shooter and never will be. Teague is knockdown beyond the arc. Rose is for sure better when he's at the top of his game but that's not very often anymore. Teague is consistent throughout the season. Much more reliable. Anyways that misses the point of my argument. Indy will be a better team because of Paul George. There isn't anyone of George's quality in NY. So Chicago was bad just because of rose? Really? Had nothing to do with losing noah after 25 games and Butler being hurt?

Don't recall where I said that. I said they missed the playoffs because of him. They missed it by two games. You don't think if they had Teague instead of Rose for the first 30 or so games where he played like dogshit they would've missed the playoffs? Again, that could be due to his vision. It could also not be.

In comment 13011005 Heisenberg said:

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and not as good as Teague. We won't know until we see how healthy he is.

Even without a great 3 ball Rose is a penetrator and finisher on a level very few in this game ever get to. He more than flashed that same explosiveness in the second half of the season and is still 27.

You add the right guys that can shoot the 3 ball around him, Melo ,KD , KP (possibly) etc. it will be pick your poison for opposing teams as Knicks will have an elite slasher and some great spacing on the floor for Rose to wreak some serious havoc.

In comment 13011020 Lopes1984 said:

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In comment 13011005 Heisenberg said: Quote: and not as good as Teague. We won't know until we see how healthy he is. I don't think that is the case at all. He was arguably better than Teague last year and that's when including the first few months of the season when he was playing with blurred vision. After the all star break its not even close, Rose was better than Teague. To take it a step further, getting away from Jimmy Butler is going to be a big help too, those two guys just couldn't coexist. They both performed better when they other was off the floor. In the 8 games that Rose played but Butler did not, Rose averaged somethings like 21-6-4 at a 45% clip.

Well, when Rose is in a suit on the sidelines, Teague is the far better player. Healthy Rose is better than Teague. But healthy Rose hasn't been around much. Teague has been very durable and durability counts too.

In comment 13010885 Carl in CT said:

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Rose, Melo & KP over Turner, George & Teague all day. Bench to be determined.

Yea agree with you Carl....You lost me at George two tiers over melo. Your dreaming

In comment 13011016 giantsfan44ab said:

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In comment 13011008 Coach Mason said: Quote: This is a star driven league. You take the chance on the guys with the monster upside like Rose especially one a one year commitment. That isnt Lopez or Teague. That's completely fair. But I was talking about why Indy is a better spot for winning. Which is also not very relevant because Indy isn't considering Noah

It depends on what Phil can pull off. Rose on a one year is ideal for so many reasons. On the high side if he shows he can return to form as the second half of last year seemed to indicate, knicks can sign him essentially without affecting their cap space next year. If they bring in Durant or anyone else for that matter on a year deal I beleive they get bird rights on all of them and can have some serious cap flexibility to reshape-restock this team.

Durant may want to do a 1+1 which looks like the go-to contract for the star player wanting some combination of winning a championship ,playing for the team they want, and reuinting with their close friends.

We find out in short order how the dominoes will fall but I wouldnt count out Jackson on pulling something major off here.

In comment 13011063 Tuckrule said:

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In comment 13010885 Carl in CT said: Quote: Rose, Melo & KP over Turner, George & Teague all day. Bench to be determined. Yea agree with you Carl....You lost me at George two tiers over melo. Your dreaming

He's the better offensive player and defense isn't even close. Paul George finished like 12th in all NBA voting and Melo finished like 27th or something. Lots of voters must be dreaming I guess...

Noah is a New York native. Loves the city plus his best friend in the nba is rose. Very simple logic to choose the Knicks if your Noah looking to end your career in the city you grew up in and possibly help the Knicks reach heights they haven't reached since 99. Noah is the absolute perfect fit for this team. Tough tenacious center who can pass the ball and wouldn't be asked to do anything but defend and rebound. Playing alongside a talent like kp is enticing to any big

Maybe it's a stretch but if Rose were to have a big year this coming season but the Knicks struggle maybe they would trade him off at the deadline for a pick. I'd think an expiring star player would fetch a nice return but maybe not.

Then again the thought of the Knicks struggling despite rose's high level of play is pretty scary...

So 12th and 27th is two tiers above?? He's a slightly better player but it's splitting hairs. Let's be real here for a second. Go ask teams for this season who do you want PG or you want melo. Overwhelmingly the answer is melo

In comment 13011079 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

Noah is a New York native. Loves the city plus his best friend in the nba is rose. Very simple logic to choose the Knicks if your Noah looking to end your career in the city you grew up in and possibly help the Knicks reach heights they haven't reached since 99. Noah is the absolute perfect fit for this team. Tough tenacious center who can pass the ball and wouldn't be asked to do anything but defend and rebound. Playing alongside a talent like kp is enticing to any big

Could we see Noah and Durant taking a slightly smaller 1+1 contract with at least Durant getting an assurance for the higher max long term deal from his new hometown team?

Galloway and Lance will likely be signed since we can go over the cap for them.

Hernangomez will likely be signed to a very low cap number.

Its the non-returning FAs that eat into the 30 mill we have available. If Noah and Durant play ball (i.e signung a 1+1 contract) this team could be a star studded lineup with OK depth next year with the chance to really loaded with an even deeper bench the following year.

If they sign Durant that means either no wade or no whiteside, how is that a contender?

In comment 13011089 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

So 12th and 27th is two tiers above?? He's a slightly better player but it's splitting hairs. Let's be real here for a second. Go ask teams for this season who do you want PG or you want melo. Overwhelmingly the answer is melo

LOL is that a fucking joke? Not a single executive in the league would take even think twice about taking PG over Melo. You're the one dreaming here.

PG is now a better offensive player than Melo. Shooting, passing, scoring at the rim. All favors PG now. Melo might have a better pull up jumper but that's it.

Defense is a completely another story, one that appears you're ignoring completely. If you're taking offensive equivalents for the difference in defense between the two you would be arguing that Jeff Teague is a better scorer than Steph curry.

This is laughable.

They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd...

Herangomez you can sign with room exception...

And I'm a huge Melo supporter.

In comment 13011107 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

If they sign Durant that means either no wade or no whiteside, how is that a contender?

I dont know. Miami just seems appealing. Warm, fun, no income tax. As an alternative to your moves, they can likely dump Dragic for some positive return.

But yeah, Wade, Whiteside, and Winslow < Melo, Rose, KP. KP is the difference maker there.

I would take Paul George over Melo but lets not complete disrespect melo

.

Paul George is younger and a much better defender and that's why I would take him

But he is nowhere near the offensive talent Melo is

In comment 13011125 Ten Ton Hammer said:

Quote:

.

Don't own his rightz

In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception...

Right now they have 54.1 committed not including LT and LG. Assuming you're using a 93 million cap, that leaves 36 million. There is no extra room on the 36 million for giving up Lance and Gallo.

Don't tell me you are knick fans with all the negativity. So Paul George can have a terrible break and now the is no injury concern he is better than ever but to think Derrick Rose will be injury free is a reach. It goes on and on...

In comment 13011135 Deej said:

Quote:

In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said: Quote: They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception... Right now they have 54.1 committed not including LT and LG. Assuming you're using a 93 million cap, that leaves 36 million. There is no extra room on the 36 million for giving up Lance and Gallo.

Your right I counted wrong so they would Have to get rid of OQuinn

In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception...

What is the cap at now? According to hoopshype we are at 55 mill NOT including Lance or Galloway.

In comment 13011143 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

Don't tell me you are knick fans with all the negativity. So Paul George can have a terrible break and now the is no injury concern he is better than ever but to think Derrick Rose will be injury free is a reach. It goes on and on...

George had a random freak injury came back and played 81 games, he was benched the last game due to seeding. Rose has played in less than 40% of his games since his last big injury. Excuse me for the skepticism Dr. Carl.

That being said I'm optimistic Rose can play in 70+ games this season.

In comment 13011144 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 13011135 Deej said: Quote: In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said: Quote: They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception... Right now they have 54.1 committed not including LT and LG. Assuming you're using a 93 million cap, that leaves 36 million. There is no extra room on the 36 million for giving up Lance and Gallo. Your right I counted wrong so they would Have to get rid of OQuinn

Can you shed a 4 million dollar contract without picking up salary back?

In comment 13011147 Coach Mason said:

Quote:

In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said: Quote: They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception... What is the cap at now? According to hoopshype we are at 55 mill NOT including Lance or Galloway.

Yeah I read it wrong, they would need to trade O'Quinn if noah wants 13

Rose can play 70 games and in the next breath you say Teague (who was traded for Hill) is a wash. If Rose plays 70, Teague is not in the same league as a player. If he plays 70 and is feeling fine, he is an all star something Teague is not. Yes, a good PG but not an all star.

Said he has a torn tendon in his knee?

In comment 13011122 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

I would take Paul George over Melo but lets not complete disrespect melo

I'd say Melo picks his spots better than George did this last season. But George carried a huge offensive load. George gets a lot more space on his jumpers due to his athleticism and I think he's one of the 10 best shooters in the game right now. Melo also struggled mightily at the rim and I don't know if he can get back to his old self in the regard at this age.

Not disrespecting Melo at all. I just don't think PG gets the credit he deserves coming back right away and leading a bunch of decent role players to the playoffs.

I might be higher than George than most but I don't think it's crazy to suggest swapping PG onto the Spurs for kawhi and SA still winning 65 games or so.

In comment 13011158 Coach Mason said:

Quote:

In comment 13011144 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13011135 Deej said: Quote: In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said: Quote: They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception... Right now they have 54.1 committed not including LT and LG. Assuming you're using a 93 million cap, that leaves 36 million. There is no extra room on the 36 million for giving up Lance and Gallo. Your right I counted wrong so they would Have to get rid of OQuinn Can you shed a 4 million dollar contract without picking up salary back?

Easily I think. The prices for free agents are going to be crazy, and teams need to hit really high cap floors the next few seasons.

In comment 13011177 Deej said:

Quote:

In comment 13011158 Coach Mason said: Quote: In comment 13011144 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 13011135 Deej said: Quote: In comment 13011114 nygiants16 said: Quote: They are at 36 now renounce Galloway and Thomas that gives you 40 or trade O'Quinn for a future 2nd... Herangomez you can sign with room exception... Right now they have 54.1 committed not including LT and LG. Assuming you're using a 93 million cap, that leaves 36 million. There is no extra room on the 36 million for giving up Lance and Gallo. Your right I counted wrong so they would Have to get rid of OQuinn Can you shed a 4 million dollar contract without picking up salary back? Easily I think. The prices for free agents are going to be crazy, and teams need to hit really high cap floors the next few seasons.

Actually I meant it in regards to the CBA. I think there are rules in place where you cnat just shed salary without taking back salary within 20-25% of the salary you are trading away.

In comment 13011164 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

Rose can play 70 games and in the next breath you say Teague (who was traded for Hill) is a wash. If Rose plays 70, Teague is not in the same league as a player. If he plays 70 and is feeling fine, he is an all star something Teague is not. Yes, a good PG but not an all star.

That's me being an overly optimistic Knicks fan, something you know about pretty damn well.

But again it's up to watch the season to see how it plays out. Rose has had a significant knee injury in 3 of the last 4 seasons. I don't see how you ignore that completely. The stats that show how much better he is off two days rest as opposed to 1 exemplifies. I don't see how it's not justified to be concerned about Rose's health if you have followed he NBA over the last 5 years. Have you? Or should I just assume you stick to Knicks games and have absolutely no clue?

In comment 13011189 Coach Mason said:

Quote:

Actually I meant it in regards to the CBA. I think there are rules in place where you cnat just shed salary without taking back salary within 20-25% of the salary you are trading away.

No. I think you're thinking of the rule about capped out teams taking on MORE salary. If you're capped out you can still take on a bit more salary in trades, so long as the traded for salaries are within a certain $$.

There is no rule that says you have to take salary back in any trade.

You act as if pg is light years ahead of melo. Defensively it's no contest offensively speaking it's close still even thought melo is clearly diminished. I'm not arguing that pg isn't the better player but your stance is absurd. You act as if pg is top 10 and melo is near 100 its just false. Melo when healthy is right there with pg. he wants healthy last year at all. We'll see this year and I expect big things from him after the olympics. He will come into camp healthy

In comment 13011143 Carl in CT said:

Quote:

Don't tell me you are knick fans with all the negativity. So Paul George can have a terrible break and now the is no injury concern he is better than ever but to think Derrick Rose will be injury free is a reach. It goes on and on...

Paul George played 81 out of 82 games, 35 minutes a night. He's fine. When and If Rose ever does that, people will change their minds.

I think Melo's top 20-25.

In comment 13011233 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

You act as if pg is light years ahead of melo. Defensively it's no contest offensively speaking it's close still even thought melo is clearly diminished. I'm not arguing that pg isn't the better player but your stance is absurd. You act as if pg is top 10 and melo is near 100 its just false. Melo when healthy is right there with pg. he wants healthy last year at all. We'll see this year and I expect big things from him after the olympics. He will come into camp healthy

You're still diminishing defense. It's 50% of the game. George is a top 3 wing on that end. Melo is average at best. Shooting isn't that close anymore, George has eclipsed Melo. I think PG can be the 2nd best player on a championship team. Maybe even #1 if he magically gets a Spurs roster in Indy. Melo is a 3rd wheel at best.

Heres what I have if Phil can pull off the unimaginable:

C Noah/Hernangomez/KP
PF Durant/KP/Melo/Thomas
SF Melo/Durant/Thomas
SG Holliday/Galloway/Baker
PG Rose/Baker

With the top 4 players being the 'stars' and some positional overlap it will be all about rotation and minute distribution.

Could that team providing health and KP making the expected jump next year contend for a title?

In comment 13011215 Deej said:

Quote:

In comment 13011189 Coach Mason said: Quote: Actually I meant it in regards to the CBA. I think there are rules in place where you cnat just shed salary without taking back salary within 20-25% of the salary you are trading away. No. I think you're thinking of the rule about capped out teams taking on MORE salary. If you're capped out you can still take on a bit more salary in trades, so long as the traded for salaries are within a certain $$. There is no rule that says you have to take salary back in any trade.

Ah thanks for clarification.

Who knows what he is thinking. But he has to weigh signing with a team that he believes gives him the best chance at a ring, or possibly living the experience that bringing a championship to NY while playing with two good friends might offer him. No question the latter would be something legendary but is it worth the chance in his opinion?

Can teams meet before then or is midnight 7/1 when they can start.

Seems awfully like he's at least pretty sure where he's heading...or staying...

In comment 13011233 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

You act as if pg is light years ahead of melo. Defensively it's no contest offensively speaking it's close still even thought melo is clearly diminished. I'm not arguing that pg isn't the better player but your stance is absurd. You act as if pg is top 10 and melo is near 100 its just false. Melo when healthy is right there with pg. he wants healthy last year at all. We'll see this year and I expect big things from him after the olympics. He will come into camp healthy

Huh? All I said was I would take George because he is younger and a better defensively player...

Where did I say he was light years better than melo? If they were the same age I would take melo

In comment 13011267 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

Can teams meet before then or is midnight 7/1 when they can start. Seems awfully like he's at least pretty sure where he's heading...or staying...

If he is deciding on July 1st he knows where he is going and not taking meetings

TMZ ‏@TMZ
Spike Lee -- Knicks Need to Sign Joakim ... Doubtful On KD

hasn't gained ANY weight since we took him? Talk about rail thin. Jared Jeffries was listed at 6'11 230 for comparisons sake. Jeffries has a fishing TV show now by the way lol
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13011273 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 13011267 giantsfan44ab said: Quote: Can teams meet before then or is midnight 7/1 when they can start. Seems awfully like he's at least pretty sure where he's heading...or staying... If he is deciding on July 1st he knows where he is going and not taking meetings

Just going off what espn was reporting. I don't see it being that ridiculous. It's the annual dick sucking of star FAs. Getting wined and dined in the most lavish places in Beverly Hills and the hamptons with no downside seems like it would be pretty hard to turn down.

And to go conspiracy theorist here, he gives other contenders hope while other top FAs start signing elsewhere. Helps the prospects of whatever team you choose to go to's chances.

In comment 13011287 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

hasn't gained ANY weight since we took him? Talk about rail thin. Jared Jeffries was listed at 6'11 230 for comparisons sake. Jeffries has a fishing TV show now by the way lol Link - ( New Window )

Don't understand Europe's aversion to weight training when it comes to ball players. You spend one summer here in an LA fitness and a 7 footer puts on 30 pounds easy

80 FA's ranked

They aren't high on Noah at all #39
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In comment 13011287 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

hasn't gained ANY weight since we took him? Talk about rail thin. Jared Jeffries was listed at 6'11 230 for comparisons sake. Jeffries has a fishing TV show now by the way lol Link - ( New Window )

Has the team met up yet? Those could easily be old list weights.

That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up

was listed at 220 so if this guy really is 6'10 200 I find it hard to believe he can handle the NBA game, heck Durant is listed at 240

that is also his listed weight for his French team.

Louis Labeyrie PF 6-10 200 23 Gonesse 2014 Rnd 2 Pick 27 France

know some of you guys liked Seth Curry. Kings intend to match any "reasonable" offer apparently

In comment 13011320 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

was listed at 220 so if this guy really is 6'10 200 I find it hard to believe he can handle the NBA game, heck Durant is listed at 240

KD is not 240.

And Lebron is not 250. He's the only non-overweight player they under list the of. There are reports that he might've been between 280-300 when he was first in Cleveland.

be a solid cheap add
Link - ( New Window )

aside maybe you think Hornacek can work his magic
Link - ( New Window )

loves this guy as a potential steal. Kind of scary given the obvious KOQ parallels
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13011325 DanMetroMan said:

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that is also his listed weight for his French team. Louis Labeyrie PF 6-10 200 23 Gonesse 2014 Rnd 2 Pick 27 France

That's my point. It's probably his 2015-16 pre-season weight per his French team. Could be more or less now.

In comment 13011354 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

loves this guy as a potential steal. Kind of scary given the obvious KOQ parallels Link - ( New Window )

Always thought of him more of a SF that plays stretch 4. He reminds me more of Tobias Harris than KOQ

In comment 13011359 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

In comment 13011354 DanMetroMan said: Quote: loves this guy as a potential steal. Kind of scary given the obvious KOQ parallels Link - ( New Window ) Always thought of him more of a SF that plays stretch 4. He reminds me more of Tobias Harris than KOQ

I'm talking about an Orlando RFA who produced in limits minutes that you would be paying X to with the hope he could give you the same production with a larger role. I bet even the money is similar.

like Tyler Johnson on here, apparently the max you can offer on a sheet is 2 years

In comment 13011317 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up

For Team USA, yes. The Knicks? Doubt it.

like E'Twaun Moore as a potential value
Link - ( New Window )

Cleanthony Early
Ron Baker
J.P. Tokoto
Chasson Randle (because Dan likes him)
Louis Labeyrie
Marvelle Harris

In comment 13011378 Anakim said:

Quote:

Cleanthony Early Ron Baker J.P. Tokoto Chasson Randle (because Dan likes him) Louis Labeyrie Marvelle Harris

It's not that I especially "like" him. I just think he was a high level college scorer that that almost made the warriors which leads me to believe he'd have a legit shot making our roster.

sure can dunk for 6'0
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 13011371 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 13011317 nygiants16 said: Quote: That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up For Team USA, yes. The Knicks? Doubt it.

Alex Kennedy ‏@AlexKennedyNBA
Carmelo Anthony told @ESPNSteinLine that he's recruiting Kevin Durant. Sources tell me he's been pitching NY to a few other players too.

and Fournier both sound very unrealistic

In comment 13011392 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 13011371 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 13011317 nygiants16 said: Quote: That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up For Team USA, yes. The Knicks? Doubt it. Alex Kennedy ‏@AlexKennedyNBA Carmelo Anthony told @ESPNSteinLine that he's recruiting Kevin Durant. Sources tell me he's been pitching NY to a few other players too.

We've heard this before. Who has Melo actually "recruited" that has come to the Knicks?

Nothing new here. Does he get credit for Afflalo since they played together? I guess they were friends.

Might be a cheap alternative to Jamal, if we land a bigger fish than expected.

A trade that should still go down before the regular season begins. Via Andrew Porter:

�I would be surprised, [if we started the season with our current crop of big men] ... I talk freely always with my players. This is something that in a different world maybe it�s awkward. It isn�t because it�s true, it�s real, it�s part of pro sport. Sometimes for the players too, like they have to understand that maybe it�s best for them too. And so, all over the place � instead of sort of hiding from this kind of what could be the elephant in the room or an awkward moment � I don�t like doing that. I speak freely with my guys about it.

�It�s just we understand the positional balance of our roster needs to rule the day. We have to find a balanced team.�

In comment 13011172 giantsfan44ab said:

Quote:

In comment 13011122 nygiants16 said: Quote: I would take Paul George over Melo but lets not complete disrespect melo I'd say Melo picks his spots better than George did this last season. But George carried a huge offensive load. George gets a lot more space on his jumpers due to his athleticism and I think he's one of the 10 best shooters in the game right now. Melo also struggled mightily at the rim and I don't know if he can get back to his old self in the regard at this age. Not disrespecting Melo at all. I just don't think PG gets the credit he deserves coming back right away and leading a bunch of decent role players to the playoffs. I might be higher than George than most but I don't think it's crazy to suggest swapping PG onto the Spurs for kawhi and SA still winning 65 games or so.

On what planet is Paul George one of the 10 best shooters in the game? Are we just making things up now to advance our arguments?....He shot 41.9% from the field last year, and 37% from 3 which are respectable, but come on. As a comparison because those are the two players in the conversation, Carmelo shot better overall at 43.4% but had a down year from behind the arc so George was better there.

George shot 56.2% less than 8ft from the hoop, 35.5% from 8-16ft, and 39.7% from 16-24ft.

Anthony shot 49.9% from less than 8ft., 43.3% from 8-16ft, and 45.6% from 16-24ft.

So basically George is really good at the rim/in the paint and shoots under 40% everywhere else on the court.

In comment 13011400 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 13011392 Anakim said: Quote: In comment 13011371 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 13011317 nygiants16 said: Quote: That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up For Team USA, yes. The Knicks? Doubt it. Alex Kennedy ‏@AlexKennedyNBA Carmelo Anthony told @ESPNSteinLine that he's recruiting Kevin Durant. Sources tell me he's been pitching NY to a few other players too. We've heard this before. Who has Melo actually "recruited" that has come to the Knicks?

Well the knicks have had cap room twice since Melo has been here the first time they signed chandler who was the best center on the market and he took less...

Last year by all accounts Aldridge was very interested even talked about getting a 3rd guy but then Phil said he wanted Aldridge to play center...

So really how much opportunity has he had to recruit?

On a smaller scale he got kidd and Kenyon martin

In comment 13011378 Anakim said:

Quote:

Cleanthony Early Ron Baker J.P. Tokoto Chasson Randle (because Dan likes him) Louis Labeyrie Marvelle Harris

plus this 29-year-old dude:

14 Souleyman Diabate G 6-0 165 Jul. 21, 1987 Ivory Coast SPO Rouen/France R

Calling melo a third wheel on a championship team is a joke. I'm not diminishing defense at all I know it's a big part. Melo has shown when it counts he's a good defender. Yes, night in and night out he's more concerned about his offensive game. To act like PG is a better shooter is also a funny comment. I don't think you have actually seen PG play that much because his shooting isn't consistent. He gets to the rim because he's uber athletic and long but Melo is a knockdown shooter and that doesn't go away. Has melo declined around the rim? sure he has but his shot hasn't declined. When in rhythm he knocks down that shot off the dribble at a very high clip. I argued one thing and one thing only. You called melo a 2nd tier player and that isn't true. He can be the best player on a championship team. Look at lebron. He had wade and bosh. Then he goes to Cleveland and had kyrie. Give melo wade and bosh in their prime and he wins a ring as the best player on the court. Yoir very critical of melo while giving the ultimate praise to PG.

In comment 13011436 nygiants16 said:

Quote:

In comment 13011400 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 13011392 Anakim said: Quote: In comment 13011371 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 13011317 nygiants16 said: Quote: That he and kd have been hanging out and they have been talking about teaming up For Team USA, yes. The Knicks? Doubt it. Alex Kennedy ‏@AlexKennedyNBA Carmelo Anthony told @ESPNSteinLine that he's recruiting Kevin Durant. Sources tell me he's been pitching NY to a few other players too. We've heard this before. Who has Melo actually "recruited" that has come to the Knicks? Well the knicks have had cap room twice since Melo has been here the first time they signed chandler who was the best center on the market and he took less... Last year by all accounts Aldridge was very interested even talked about getting a 3rd guy but then Phil said he wanted Aldridge to play center... So really how much opportunity has he had to recruit? On a smaller scale he got kidd and Kenyon martin

Meh, I question how much Melo really had to do with the Chandler S/T. Almost getting Aldridge but not getting him as well as Kidd at the very end of his career and a bench player in KMart who was also at the end of his career aren't really things to write home about, either.

I guess I just don't look at Melo as some big lure for other players at this point. It can't hurt that he's talking to KD and I'm sure he's pitching as best as he can but I doubt he's got a strong enough sell to actually make it happen.

.549 TS% to .545 TS%

One thing I'll say, Melo's numbers, especially from 3, have taken a hit since they moved to the Triangle. Since 2013, he's been pretty bad from 3.

is awesome

Wow imagine how crazy you would go as a kid and had this happen https://vine.co/v/5uUAhXhzqw0

In comment 13011507 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

is awesome Wow imagine how crazy you would go as a kid and had this happen https://vine.co/v/5uUAhXhzqw0

Hope this kids recruited Durant hard :P

I'll be keeping my eye on Akil Mitchell, of course. Still don't know why they're bothering with Fredo Plumlee, even if it's just summer league.

Adam Zagoria ‏@AdamZagoria
'I don't know. We'll see after I leave here' Durant on if he will meet with Knicks

In comment 13011472 Tuckrule said:

Quote:

Calling melo a third wheel on a championship team is a joke. I'm not diminishing defense at all I know it's a big part. Melo has shown when it counts he's a good defender. Yes, night in and night out he's more concerned about his offensive game. To act like PG is a better shooter is also a funny comment. I don't think you have actually seen PG play that much because his shooting isn't consistent. He gets to the rim because he's uber athletic and long but Melo is a knockdown shooter and that doesn't go away. Has melo declined around the rim? sure he has but his shot hasn't declined. When in rhythm he knocks down that shot off the dribble at a very high clip. I argued one thing and one thing only. You called melo a 2nd tier player and that isn't true. He can be the best player on a championship team. Look at lebron. He had wade and bosh. Then he goes to Cleveland and had kyrie. Give melo wade and bosh in their prime and he wins a ring as the best player on the court. Yoir very critical of melo while giving the ultimate praise to PG.

I'm not critical of Melo. He wasn't good enough in his prime to even get to the finals. Now he's magically able to win one against OKC, Cleveland, GS or SA as the best player? I don't think a single person, even on this thread, would agree with that statement. When it comes down to it, he will have to guard the Lebron's, Durant's and Kawhi's of the world. And he will face those guys every offensive play. I'm not sure he's capable of that. He'd be the 3rd wheel in Cleveland, GS and OKC. I'd take him over Aldridge in a vacuum but I'm not sure about the long term.

The Knicks roster has been bad the last two years, but Lebron has taken worse rosters than this past years Knicks rosters deep into the playoffs. Melo couldn't even break .500. Let's not get carried away.

PG took his team to the playoffs at least. Sure, I think the pacers roster was a bit better. But not 13 games better. I mean, KP and RoLo was better than Turner and mahinimi for sure. Afflalo vs Ellis is a wash. They did at least have a true point guard but even George Hill isn't a +13 win player over Calderon.

To think Melo could lead a team to the finals now is what one would consider a dream. He couldn't do it when he was a 30 point scorer he's not even close to that player now.

In comment 13011532 Anakim said:

Quote:

Adam Zagoria ‏@AdamZagoria 'I don't know. We'll see after I leave here' Durant on if he will meet with Knicks

That's a no.

Ok, so which shooting guard and backup point guard are joining Noah on the Knicks next year? I'll say Courtney Lee and DJ Augustin.

The Knicks don't get Durant.... What is the point in locking up big money in Noah?
Would seem silly to me-

In comment 13011546 hitdog42 said:

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The Knicks don't get Durant.... What is the point in locking up big money in Noah? Would seem silly to me-

We need a center, he's good, and Noah + Rose probably makes NYK a playoff team.

In comment 13011546 hitdog42 said:

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The Knicks don't get Durant.... What is the point in locking up big money in Noah? Would seem silly to me-

As a Knicks fan, I'd be happy to roll most of the cap space over to next offseason, but that's just not their way. They spent every penny last offseason and will likely do so again. Noah seems like the best reasonably-attainable player for them, though if his price gets north of $15 million I'd rather just try to buy Horford or - gasp! - Howard. Might as well pay for quality.

that Howard ends up in Dallas.

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Chris Herring ✔ @HerringWSJ Durant acknowledged that Knicks have a formidable top-3, w Rose in tow, but said he wouldn't get into what teams he's meeting with.

Sounds like he's avoiding all free agency questions.

In comment 13011541 bceagle05 said:

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Ok, so which shooting guard and backup point guard are joining Noah on the Knicks next year? I'll say Courtney Lee and DJ Augustin.

I like Augustin. I'm hoping Lee is a bargain but he hasn't gotten a big contract yet. The first two years of his next deal will more than likely double his career earnings. If he's getting double digits a year I would honestly want to pay up a bit more to get Bazemore. I like Lee's role as a 3 and D, two things he does tremendously well, but he gives little outside that. When Batum went down in the playoffs, Lee didn't step up all that well.

I'd gladly welcome Lee but I think there's more potential I'm Bazemore. Even though he's 26 I don't think he's fully developed. He's a better slasher, rebounder and passer. He's probably not as strong on defense and he's certainly not as good of a spot up shooter as Lee but I like him as a guy who you can stagger off the bench to give you a scoring punch.

To any non star player. Ideally to win a championship nowadays , you need almost all your cap tied to 3 stars and a bunch of role players taking up the remaining smaller portion.

Thats the problem with this FA so many players not worth a max contract or even a big money comtract who are going to get them.

If a championship is the goal and we are going to go for a big money contract outside of Durant it ideally needs to be a 1+1 type deal.

You get lucky if you have a player who is already a star or close on a rookie contract. We have one in Porzingus.

Unless of course the Knicks feel we CAN contend right now with Melo,Rose and KP with the right supporting cast. We can resign Rose next year and go over the cap to do so we essentially frees up another 22 million (+ the cap increase in 2017).

He didn't want to talk about free agency

In comment 13011570 Jon in NYC said:

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that Howard ends up in Dallas.

Yeah I see that too. But if Dirk dips all bets are off. Kinda wanna see Anthony Davis paired with Howard or Whiteside.

"Obviously they have a good team now with rose, they have a good top3, I have to talk to my team and figure things out"

In comment 13011585 Coach Mason said:

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To any non star player. Ideally to win a championship nowadays , you need almost all your cap tied to 3 stars and a bunch of role players taking up the remaining smaller portion. Thats the problem with this FA so many players not worth a max contract or even a big money comtract who are going to get them. If a championship is the goal and we are going to go for a big money contract outside of Durant it ideally needs to be a 1+1 type deal. You get lucky if you have a player who is already a star or close on a rookie contract. We have one in Porzingus. Unless of course the Knicks feel we CAN contend right now with Melo,Rose and KP with the right supporting cast. We can resign Rose next year and go over the cap to do so we essentially frees up another 22 million (+ the cap increase in 2017).

Not true- Rose would have a 30 million dollar cap hold before you sign him or you'd renounce his rights and not be able to go over the cap to sign him at all.

Kevin Durant is a HUGE fan of JD and The Straight Shot.

Still waiting on my sources.

His salary is 20million this year

In comment 13011618 Coach Mason said:

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His salary is 20million this year

4

Hold is 150% of prior season salary

In comment 13011564 bceagle05 said:

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As a Knicks fan, I'd be happy to roll most of the cap space over to next offseason, but that's just not their way. They spent every penny last offseason and will likely do so again. Noah seems like the best reasonably-attainable player for them, though if his price gets north of $15 million I'd rather just try to buy Horford or - gasp! - Howard. Might as well pay for quality.

At some point this team needs to compete. What are you "rolling the money over" for? So we can win another 30 games this year and then the next crop of free agents can laugh at us next year? This franchise has to get back on the NBA radar and that means competing for a playoff spot. I'm not saying ruin the cap for next year, definitely maintain a max slot, but this concept of sitting things out and waiting for some superstar to come be our savior will not work until the organization proves itself competitive.

In comment 13011891 Stu11 said:

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In comment 13011564 bceagle05 At some point this team needs to compete. What are you "rolling the money over" for? So we can win another 30 games this year and then the next crop of free agents can laugh at us next year? This franchise has to get back on the NBA radar and that means competing for a playoff spot. I'm not saying ruin the cap for next year, definitely maintain a max slot, but this concept of sitting things out and waiting for some superstar to come be our savior will not work until the organization proves itself competitive.

All fair points - I just don't want to sign crappy free agents in an attempt to grab the eighth seed in a shitty conference, especially when we have a full slate of first rounders going forward. As you said, keeping a max slot open next year is of utmost importance either way.

especially if its 4 years north of 13-15 mill. He's always hurt. I agree with you BC if it gets that pricey for him I'd rather go with Horford. Though its near impossible to fit a guy like Horford and the backcourt help they need.

In comment 13011927 bceagle05 said:

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In comment 13011891 Stu11 said: Quote: In comment 13011564 bceagle05 At some point this team needs to compete. What are you "rolling the money over" for? So we can win another 30 games this year and then the next crop of free agents can laugh at us next year? This franchise has to get back on the NBA radar and that means competing for a playoff spot. I'm not saying ruin the cap for next year, definitely maintain a max slot, but this concept of sitting things out and waiting for some superstar to come be our savior will not work until the organization proves itself competitive. All fair points - I just don't want to sign crappy free agents in an attempt to grab the eighth seed in a shitty conference, especially when we have a full slate of first rounders going forward. As you said, keeping a max slot open next year is of utmost importance either way.

Although there will be suitors for Bazemore, Lee, and Noah, I think they will be bargains compared to the flashier players available at their respective positions. I have no basis on these projections other than gut feeling but I think Noah will receive a similar contract to what RoLo received last year, maybe a tad more. I think Lee will be in the $10-13M a year range and Bazemore in the $13-17M a year range. If they can get Noah at $14-16M a year and one of the SGs at those prices, they'll have 2 starters at around 25% of next year's salary cap. That would be a huge win.

If that happens in the offseason, I will come around completely on the Rose trade and consider it a win (well, at least a win in terms of trying to build through the FA route). If you can get a few years of 2015 Noah that may be one of the best deals in the league. 2014 Noah? That may be a stretch, but one can hope.

Depending on what bargain deals we can land in FA to fill out the bench I think we can be looking at a 45-50 win team (assuming Melo, Rose and Noah play 80% of the games). KOQ may be forced into more action than anticipated but I think he will payoff as our 3rd big. Get someone like Augustin or Vasquez on a cheap or short term deal. Re-sign Galloway and Thomas (if possible). Bring in WH to take a few minutes at the backup C spot each night.

That may be a fairly optimistic offseason, but we could be looking at a top 5 seed if something along those lines happens. Might be a bit too early to say. A lot depends on FA for the eastern conference. No shit I guess.

But I think Charlotte overachieved and will lose some Players to FA. I think they miss the playoffs. Atlanta could free fall. They lost Teague, and could lose Bazemore as well. If Horford leaves they may be out of the playoffs.

Big offseason for Maimi. A lot can go wrong with them, don't see much upside. If they go all in for KD they can lose Whiteside. If they bring back Whiteside I don't see how they make any improvements unless Chris Bosh retires, which I doubt he will in 2 weeks. They may lose Joe Johnson and Gerlad Green as well. Same goes for Toronto. They will lose Bismack who shored up their defense pretty well. If Derozan leaves it's game over for them.

I see Detroit and Indy both going up, but not sure how much. Detroit is very young and can make a big leap within the next few years, but this year they don't have much cap space. The Harris trade was essentially their offseason acquisition. Indy has cap space, but I can only see them getting better.

Boston and Cleveland are the only two teams I'd feel comfortable betting gets a top 4 seed right now. Boston can make major moves. It be hard not seeing them improve their frontcourt. Throw in Toronto if Derozan stays but I don't think they will get 56 wins again.

Milwaukee is the only threat I see out of the eastern lottery teams. I think they overachieved two years ago and underachieved last year. A major jump could be in the cards for them. We'll see.

I'm becoming optimistic that we could have home court advantage come next March.

In comment 13011932 Stu11 said:

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especially if its 4 years north of 13-15 mill. He's always hurt. I agree with you BC if it gets that pricey for him I'd rather go with Horford. Though its near impossible to fit a guy like Horford and the backcourt help they need.

Don't think we have much of a shot at Horford because whoever strikes out with KD will turn to Horford (or OKC might be able to get KD AND Horford which would be insane).

And I agree with Noah. ButI'm not sure if the shoulder is a recurring problem to be concerned about. Don't have enough knowledge on that though. But that's what I'm hoping he costs.

They are defensive-minded, fiery competitors who will bring an attitude to this team that's been sorely lacking. If they can be signed those prices -around $30 million or so combined - it'd be a nice haul. Like Lopez, Bazemore is a guy who could easily be moved later on if money is needed for a bigger signing. I just wish I had a little more faith in this organization.

In comment 13011953 bceagle05 said:

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They are defensive-minded, fiery competitors who will bring an attitude to this team that's been sorely lacking. If they can be signed those prices -around $30 million or so combined - it'd be a nice haul. Like Lopez, Bazemore is a guy who could easily be moved later on if money is needed for a bigger signing. I just wish I had a little more faith in this organization.

Noah seems like he's there for the taking, just a matter if another team really wants to outbid us. I doubt Washington drops $60 mil for a backup center. Minnesota is the only other competitor for him I'm worried about. $60M is a lot for a vocal leader. Ideally towns is your center, and they have Dieng who is a more than serviceable starter too.

Bazemore is a bit trickier, it comes down to how much Atlanta is willing to pay to retain him. There's also Lee if Bazemore doesn't work out.

is Phil.

Durant sees the 11 championship rings and buys into what Phil is selling. Nobody bought into it last summer but the addition of KP and Rose makes Phil's job a little easier this season.

Still a big longshot but not out of the realm of possibility.