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NFT: Knicks Chat 6/20/2016-Phil crazed with Baze?

DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 8:25 am
The Knicks have heavy interest in Hawks 6-foot-5 shooting guard Kent Bazemore, but they may be priced out or simply shut out, according to NBA sources.

Between a starting center and shooting guard, Knicks president Phil Jackson has to craftily split his $29 million-plus of cap space. That figure accounts for cap holds on four of his own free agents (Derrick Williams, Kevin Seraphin, Lance Thomas, Langston Galloway).

Bazemore is high on the Knicks list for a shooting guard, but they know resources arent unlimited if they want to sign their own free agents to pacts that will allow them to go over the salary cap.

Bazemore is not setting up any meetings with teams until the Hawks make their intentions clear whether they will go for his large asking price. Meanwhile, a report Tuesday night stated Miami shooting guard and friend of Carmelo Anthony Dwyane Wade, 34, who had been considered a shoo-in to re-sign with the Heat, is supposedly open to offers after early talks didnt go well.
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It's reassuring that theyre  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 8:32 am : link
Looking for a 3-d guy at SG. I'd rather pay Lee 10M than Baze 16, but I won't get too choosy.
Wait why is it only $29M  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 8:36 am : link
In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?
Guess it would help to read  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 8:38 am : link
So they can renounce Afflalo and Williams then to get to around $40M?
RE: Wait why is it only $29M  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/29/2016 8:38 am : link
In comment 13013418 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?


Didn't they take on money with Rose?
RE: It's reassuring that theyre  
Deej : 6/29/2016 8:39 am : link
In comment 13013414 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
Looking for a 3-d guy at SG. I'd rather pay Lee 10M than Baze 16, but I won't get too choosy.


I think they're both getting more than that.
RE: RE: Wait why is it only $29M  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 8:40 am : link
In comment 13013423 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13013418 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?



Didn't they take on money with Rose?


Thought Rose was $21M but RoLo was $14M and Calderon at $7M
RE: Wait why is it only $29M  
Deej : 6/29/2016 8:40 am : link
In comment 13013418 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?


See OP. 29 b/c of holds.
RE: RE: Wait why is it only $29M  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 8:42 am : link
In comment 13013426 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13013418 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?



See OP. 29 b/c of holds.


Yeah I just flat out ignored it. But can't they renounce Williams and seraphin to get immediate space?
Do we have WIlliams bird rights?  
Italianju : 6/29/2016 8:46 am : link
wasnt it only a one year deal?

I like Bazemore at around 15 mill, i know its an overpay, but everyone is going to be an overpay. I think of it as it would be like 10 mill before the cap jump and that seems about right. I dont love Lee, but im ok with him as well.
RE: RE: RE: Wait why is it only $29M  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 8:51 am : link
In comment 13013428 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13013426 Deej said:


Quote:


In comment 13013418 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


In space? Isn't the cap at $94M and they're at $55M? Or does that not include holds?



See OP. 29 b/c of holds.



Yeah I just flat out ignored it. But can't they renounce Williams and seraphin to get immediate space?


Yea.
Someone correct me if this is wrong  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 8:54 am : link
But assuming they renounce Williams and seraphin to get rid of the cap holds (or those 2 sign elsewhere) to get to around $40M:

Re-sign Thomas at around $8M per year and Galloway at $6-7M per year.

Sign Noah for $15-16M on 3-4 years

Sign a SG on a 1 year deal (e.g. Joe Johnson) with remaining cap space.

If we hit the cap we can then use the MLE right? If so, what's that projected to be this season?
It's the 29th  
Anakim : 6/29/2016 8:56 am : link
.
RE: Someone correct me if this is wrong  
mphbullet36 : 6/29/2016 9:01 am : link
In comment 13013441 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
But assuming they renounce Williams and seraphin to get rid of the cap holds (or those 2 sign elsewhere) to get to around $40M:

Re-sign Thomas at around $8M per year and Galloway at $6-7M per year.

Sign Noah for $15-16M on 3-4 years

Sign a SG on a 1 year deal (e.g. Joe Johnson) with remaining cap space.

If we hit the cap we can then use the MLE right? If so, what's that projected to be this season?


teams entering the offseason with cap space aren't allowed to use the mid-level exception. They however are able to use the Room-exception. It is less than the middle and I believe its a % of the revenue sharing I believe. It does sound like they are waiting to use the room exception to bring Willy Hernangomez over since I doubt he comes over with a minimum contract.
How do we feel about a team of:  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:02 am : link
Noah/Willy
KP/KOQ
Melo/Lance
Lee/Galloway
Rose/DJ Augustin

Top 4 in the east? A lot of iffy guys injury wise.
I  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:04 am : link
don't love Bazemore but I do like him more than overpaying guys like Gordon or Parsons. That said, if "we" think 13-15 for Bazemore is fair, shouldn't we assume there is a good chance he ends up with silly money?
the key there is the injuries...  
Italianju : 6/29/2016 9:05 am : link
if you can tell me everyone in the starting lineup plays 70 games id say that team can be top 4 in the east for sure. THat team will be able to score very well and You have 3 plus defenders in the starting lineup .
I think your right Dan...  
Italianju : 6/29/2016 9:06 am : link
what we should probably do is decide what we think is fair and then add around 5 mill to that.
Dear god  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:07 am : link
Kent Bazemore is going to end up for like a 5-100M contract, isnt he.
RE: Dear god  
Heisenberg : 6/29/2016 9:08 am : link
In comment 13013466 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
Kent Bazemore is going to end up for like a 5-100M contract, isnt he.


Just gotta be a free agent at the right time. Two summers from now when the cap goes down, things will be very different.
I don't  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:09 am : link
know who does them, but ESPN does a really nice job with their Insider Scouting Reports for NBA players. Here is Lee's

Quote:
Scouting report

+ Ideal 3-and-D role player who started a career-high 74 games in 2014-15

+ Consistently very good 3-point shooter. Can make plays off the dribble as needed

+ Reliable, though unspectacular defender. Poor rebounder


Analysis

With hindsight, Memphis getting Lee for Jerryd Bayless in a trade that also saw the teams swap second-round picks looks like an incredible steal. Lee has started 121 of his 126 games for the Grizzlies, fitting perfectly into their lineup as a role player while making a reserve's salary ($5.7 million this season). Expect him to get a big raise as an unrestricted free agent next summer.


Lee has brought Memphis much-needed shooting. His ratio of 3s to long 2s -- about 3 to 2 last season -- is still lower than it should be, but Lee made a career-high 90 triples at a 40.2 percent clip, the fourth time in seven years in the NBA that Lee has made between 40 and 41 percent of his 3-point tries. He's capable enough as a ballhandler to help relieve pressure on Mike Conley and to make a play when opponents close out too hard, and Lee has historically been a great finisher when he does get to the rim.


The "D" part of Lee's 3-and-D role is more up for interpretation. With the Grizzlies he's had the luxury of defending weaker wing options. At 6-foot-5, he wouldn't be big enough to defend many small forwards on a team that needed him to be its primary stopper on the perimeter. Lee's rebounding also became problematic last season, as he averaged just 3.7 rebounds per 36 minutes. But he's got good feet and can hold his own against most shooting guards and non-threatening small forwards.


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ha Baze is marrying my sister's best friend  
GMenLTS : 6/29/2016 9:09 am : link
Unload the dump truck for that man
RE: ha Baze is marrying my sister's best friend  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 9:13 am : link
In comment 13013470 GMenLTS said:
Quote:
Unload the dump truck for that man


Haha that's actually pretty cool.

If Baze and Lee are wishing like $5M of each other I think I'd go Baze. I've always thought Lee was underrated but he's a declining player. Baze has improved almost every season he's been in the league.
Here's  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:15 am : link
ESPN's report on Bazemore. That first sentence is interesting...

Quote:
Scouting report

+ Lefty corner specialist with tree branches for arms

+ Elite rebounder for size but needs better handles

+ Should be a better defender


Analysis

It's not a good sign for Bazemore that the Hawks brought a similarly skilled Justin Holiday onto the squad. Bazemore is long-limbed and raw offensively, but he worked hard to become a corner threat. He made 42.2 percent of his tries in the corners, which made up nearly a quarter of his shot diet.


The issue with Bazemore is he's not skilled enough to run the occasional pick-and-roll. He can't create his own shot and tends to get out of control the moment he sees daylight. He struggles in transition and on cuts, which is a waste for someone gifted with a wingspan such as his.


Bazemore's top skill is his rebounding. He pulled down six rebounds per 36 minutes in both the regular season and playoffs. Until he becomes a more versatile scorer, Bazemore will have to compete with Holiday for Carroll's minutes. Although he can swat and swipe, his team defense isn't good enough for him to be a 3-and-D weapon. Yet.



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RE: I think your right Dan...  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:15 am : link
In comment 13013464 Italianju said:
Quote:
what we should probably do is decide what we think is fair and then add around 5 mill to that.


I think realistically that is going to be what happens. If we think 13-14 is "fair" then I expect him to get more like 18-19.
RE: RE: I think your right Dan...  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 9:20 am : link
In comment 13013477 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13013464 Italianju said:


Quote:


what we should probably do is decide what we think is fair and then add around 5 mill to that.



I think realistically that is going to be what happens. If we think 13-14 is "fair" then I expect him to get more like 18-19.


So if they sign Baze for around that much and Noah for around $16-17, can they go over the cap to keep Galloway and Thomas?
RE: How do we feel about a team of:  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 9:22 am : link
In comment 13013455 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
Noah/Willy
KP/KOQ
Melo/Lance
Lee/Galloway
Rose/DJ Augustin

Top 4 in the east? A lot of iffy guys injury wise.


Yeah, I think that's top 4.
RE: RE: RE: I think your right Dan...  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:22 am : link
In comment 13013486 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13013477 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


In comment 13013464 Italianju said:


Quote:


what we should probably do is decide what we think is fair and then add around 5 mill to that.



I think realistically that is going to be what happens. If we think 13-14 is "fair" then I expect him to get more like 18-19.



So if they sign Baze for around that much and Noah for around $16-17, can they go over the cap to keep Galloway and Thomas?


As long as they are under the cap with the cap holds in place, they can go over the cap to sign those two.
The first day of free agency is going to be crazy  
nygiants16 : 6/29/2016 9:23 am : link
I think teams will just start throwing money at players because they can and they have to...

This is going to screw teams like miami and take them out of the Durant sweepstakes right away...

If this was any other free agency period no way Barnes gets a max deal but he is going to get one because teams like the Sixers and nets have to spend money...

I said last week Bazemore will get 20 million a year and got laughed at

RE: RE: How do we feel about a team of:  
nygiants16 : 6/29/2016 9:25 am : link
In comment 13013490 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13013455 Jon in NYC said:


Quote:


Noah/Willy
KP/KOQ
Melo/Lance
Lee/Galloway
Rose/DJ Augustin

Top 4 in the east? A lot of iffy guys injury wise.



Yeah, I think that's top 4.


If rose and noah stay healthy I don't see why that team can't be 2nd best team in the east...

But it is a big if
RE: The first day of free agency is going to be crazy  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:25 am : link
In comment 13013493 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
I think teams will just start throwing money at players because they can and they have to...

This is going to screw teams like miami and take them out of the Durant sweepstakes right away...

If this was any other free agency period no way Barnes gets a max deal but he is going to get one because teams like the Sixers and nets have to spend money...

I said last week Bazemore will get 20 million a year and got laughed at


I think he will get closer to 20 than 10 let's put it that way.
.  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:25 am : link
The Nets have reportedly emerged as the front runners to land Rajon Rondo during free agency.
The Nets are reportedly willing to offer Rondo a max-deal, although sources close to Rondo say that he's not overly interested in being Brooklyn's only major signing this offseason, so the Nets may need to bring in another star to get Rondo to sign his name on the dotted line. Brooklyn is said to also have interest in Jamal Crawford, Jeremy Lin, Brandon Jennings and Kent Bazemore, so perhaps if they can sign one of those guys, Rondo will be more inclined to sign. Rondo would have nice value as the Nets starting PG.
Source: Basketball Insiders Jun 29 - 9:21 AM
Rondo  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:27 am : link
to BK for a max...

HAHAHAHAHA
For the person who asked about mle  
nygiants16 : 6/29/2016 9:28 am : link
Once a team goes under the cap they have to renounce their exceptions to get the cap space, so the only one they have is the room exception..
RE: RE: RE: How do we feel about a team of:  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 9:30 am : link
In comment 13013494 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13013490 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


In comment 13013455 Jon in NYC said:


Quote:


Noah/Willy
KP/KOQ
Melo/Lance
Lee/Galloway
Rose/DJ Augustin

Top 4 in the east? A lot of iffy guys injury wise.



Yeah, I think that's top 4.



If rose and noah stay healthy I don't see why that team can't be 2nd best team in the east...

But it is a big if


Depends on what happens with Toronto. Also gotta keep an eye on what Indy, Detroit and Milwaukee do, can see all 3 making big improvements as well.

Charlotte, Miami, Toronto and Atlanta can really take a big step back this offseason.
Kyler  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:41 am : link
is reporting while Noah is our first choice, the Wolves may yet be able to snipe him if it becomes a bidding war and that the Knicks have Howard as their second choice.
That  
Jon in NYC : 6/29/2016 9:42 am : link
is consistent with what Begley said I believe.

I'm surprised they don't want to put KAT at C and run more of a small ball system though.
RE: Kyler  
nygiants16 : 6/29/2016 9:49 am : link
In comment 13013522 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
is reporting while Noah is our first choice, the Wolves may yet be able to snipe him if it becomes a bidding war and that the Knicks have Howard as their second choice.


They also have Peconic who is locked in for another 3 years and dieng, no reason for them to add noah
RE: RE: Kyler  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:51 am : link
In comment 13013532 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 13013522 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


is reporting while Noah is our first choice, the Wolves may yet be able to snipe him if it becomes a bidding war and that the Knicks have Howard as their second choice.



They also have Peconic who is locked in for another 3 years and dieng, no reason for them to add noah


Multiple reports seem to confirm their interest.

Pina-
"League sources tell Sporting News that Thibodeau has targeted Joakim Noah, who is an unrestricted free agent and has interest in leaving Chicago and re-joining Thibodeau. When they were together in Chicago, Noah developed and thrived under Thibodeau, finishing fourth in the MVP voting in 2013-14."
Sporting news  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 9:52 am : link
"League sources tell Sporting News that Thibodeau has targeted Joakim Noah, who is an unrestricted free agent and has interest in leaving Chicago and re-joining Thibodeau. When they were together in Chicago, Noah developed and thrived under Thibodeau, finishing fourth in the MVP voting in 2013-14.

Besides offering tenacious defense and his gung-ho, team-first attitude, Noah fills the role of veteran leader. I think when you see what happened in Chicago, the Bulls really missed Jos leadership this season, first and foremost, Thibodeau said, referring to the Bulls failure to make the playoffs, as Noah had his season end in mid-January due to a shoulder injury."
I think a lot of the rumors involving the timberwolves and noab  
nygiants16 : 6/29/2016 10:06 am : link
Are because of thibideou bit I guess you can say the same thing about knicks and noah...

Who knows
If we had assets  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 10:12 am : link
I would want to make a play for Dieng. He's a rim protector with range. Not exactly sure why he doesn't get more love in Minny.
.  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 10:19 am : link
Per Steve Kyler at Basketball Insiders, Durant is allegedly already gloomy about the prospect of free agency on the horizon again if he signs the one-and-one deal thats his most logical option for a financial windfall:

Sources close to Durant said recently that his looming free agency was incredibly stressful and distracting and that Durant isnt overly eager to go through this again and that these meetings may be more than just going through the motions. He is genuinely planning to listen to options and see whats available to him and may make a long-term commitment with whatever team he chooses.

There is still a sense that Oklahoma City could be the front runner and with the moves the team made around the draft to add even more to the team, they did not hurt their cause acquiring Victor Oladipo, Domantas Sabonis and Ersan Ilyasova.
RE: If we had assets  
Deej : 6/29/2016 10:20 am : link
In comment 13013569 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
I would want to make a play for Dieng. He's a rim protector with range. Not exactly sure why he doesn't get more love in Minny.


Because their other center is probably a year or two away from being the best or 2nd best big in the NBA.
RE: RE: If we had assets  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 10:22 am : link
In comment 13013583 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13013569 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


I would want to make a play for Dieng. He's a rim protector with range. Not exactly sure why he doesn't get more love in Minny.



Because their other center is probably a year or two away from being the best or 2nd best big in the NBA.


Well then who is their 4? I guess it's technically KG right now and I think they were trying to tank with Prince and KG in the starting lineup to get the pick they got. But I'm with 16, doesn't make all that sense to go after noah if you have Dieng and want to ultimately play towns that the 5.
i'd be shocked if Rondo didn't sign with the Nets  
djm : 6/29/2016 10:32 am : link
it just seems preordained...
.  
DanMetroMan : 6/29/2016 10:37 am : link
Moke HamiltonVerified account ‏@MokeHamilton 11h11 hours ago
After polling various sources, I can say the Lakers, Spurs, Bulls, Rockets, Mavericks and Knicks are all going to pursue Timofey Mozgov.
I guess Mozgov...  
Italianju : 6/29/2016 10:43 am : link
would be an ok fall back if we overspend on a 2 guard. Like if we spend 20 on Bazemore (just an example not saying i want to) then you would have to go cheaper at C.

Part of me is scared the knicks are going to go after wade. I wouldnt hate wade on the team (not a great fit) but id hate him for what it will cost to get him to leave MIA.
RE: I guess Mozgov...  
giantsfan44ab : 6/29/2016 10:45 am : link
In comment 13013620 Italianju said:
Quote:
would be an ok fall back if we overspend on a 2 guard. Like if we spend 20 on Bazemore (just an example not saying i want to) then you would have to go cheaper at C.

Part of me is scared the knicks are going to go after wade. I wouldnt hate wade on the team (not a great fit) but id hate him for what it will cost to get him to leave MIA.


If they get Bazemore at 20 couldn't they still go after Noah for around $16M and be under the cap with Thomas's and Galloway's cap hold?
I love Mozgov, but only so much of that is how he actually plays.  
Heisenberg : 6/29/2016 10:45 am : link
He's a limited player. But there's this:

I think we really max at closer to 32 mill...  
Italianju : 6/29/2016 10:46 am : link
then 36 mill, but im not 100%.
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