Lets assume this had legs. It is hard enough to give a guy a contract like Vernon but to give Miller a contract that is bigger than Vernon AND give up a shitload in addition to that would be a tough pill to swallow especially in this upcoming draft where it seems to be loaded in certain spots. Would we be running a 5-2 defense with Miller? He has played in a 4-3 before and done well but if he is going to be rushing the majority of the time that puts a lot of pressure on the other LB, S, and CB. We absolutely could use another pass rusher but I don't know if this is the answer. If we get Miller we would still need to resign Beckham in the not so distant future. We would need to sign Hankins soon. We would need to sign Pugh. And who would be playing opposite of Vernon next year? Honestly, I want JPP back. I think we are better off using our money on our own players, plugging holes in FA, and keeping all of our picks.
Two totally separate thoughts. Von Miller..true there is a guy named Von Miller. Elway and Reese have talked, I assume that has occurred at some point in their lives. I see nothing wrong with this post.
The idea that one wouldn't trade for and sign Von Miller because..
one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
What would be the most likely parts in a trade? IMO it might be JPP for Von Miller.
To what end? Why would both teams desire that outcome?
My only guess is that JPP already signed his deal which is noncommittal for the Broncos long term but maybe they can get more if a bargain from JPP. They may be in rebuild mode and getting something for him versus paying 20+ million to Von might be more bang for the buck.
What if Denver wanted Eli ( not the apple ) in an even trade?
The Riverdales did an album that was nothing but Ramones covers.
Wasn't that Screeching Weasel (same front man and base player as The Riverdales?)
All of them were also in Screeching Weasel - Ben Weasel, Dan Vapid, Danny Panic. No Jughead though, which is kind of funny given the name. Riverdales was a side project that played a different style, very Ramones-like.
What would be the most likely parts in a trade? IMO it might be JPP for Von Miller.
To what end? Why would both teams desire that outcome?
My only guess is that JPP already signed his deal which is noncommittal for the Broncos long term but maybe they can get more if a bargain from JPP. They may be in rebuild mode and getting something for him versus paying 20+ million to Von might be more bang for the buck.
I couldn't imagine the Giants trading JPP. As I have espoused about him this offseason, with what he dealt with last year, he was our best defender and he's a man on a mission this off-season training like a madman. We get the bang for the buck and are also emotionally invested in him. Factor in OV and I just can't see it.
The Riverdales did an album that was nothing but Ramones covers.
Wasn't that Screeching Weasel (same front man and base player as The Riverdales?)
All of them were also in Screeching Weasel - Ben Weasel, Dan Vapid, Danny Panic. No Jughead though, which is kind of funny given the name. Riverdales was a side project that played a different style, very Ramones-like.
But The Ramones cover album was released under The Screeching Weasel name. Semantics, I guess since it's the same guys. I used to have it on vinyl. It's probably in my parent's attic somewhere.
The Broncos at some point, and that point is starting to bite them in the nose, have to consider that they will lose Miller as an FA and their comp will be merely comp draft pick(s).
Reese's has doing better than that merely as the "floor value" for a trade. Oh and the como draft pick(s) take effect a year AFTER Miller would leave, which devalues it by 1 round.
One doesn't need to offer trade value equal to Miller for the deal to make sense to the Broncos.
What is the most a team can get in compensatory trade pucks for a blockbuster FA signing?
has been off so much more than he has been on that I don't even consider him an asshat. Not going to rag on him, and chase him away...because everyone is free to post anything. But I don't take any rumors he posts as fact. If anyone throws enough shit against the wall something will stick. The only poster on this site this offseason who proved to have very accurate information was hitdog.
I suggested the Giants should be exploring a trade for Miller weeks ago!
Long before Slade posted this and long before that nitwit suggested it in the article above linked from Fanboy...
I didn't try to start any rumor but I pointed out that it made sense, shortly after I read about the shortfall in what the Broncos were offering Miller (compared to what the Giants paid OV.)
In comment 13026781 BlueLou said: Quote: The idea that one wouldn't trade for and sign Von Miller because one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
No need to get snarky, Robbie.
What if your premise of "giving up a shitload of stuff [in trade]" is incorrect? What if all the Giants need to give up in trade is something more than the Broncos would get if leaves via FA?
In comment 13026781 BlueLou said: Quote: The idea that one wouldn't trade for and sign Von Miller because one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
No need to get snarky, Robbie.
What if your premise of "giving up a shitload of stuff [in trade]" is incorrect? What if all the Giants need to give up in trade is something more than the Broncos would get if leaves via FA?
You think Denver is letting Miller go for a third round pick?
Denver is not going to give him the money he wants; assume he's a goner.
One, no way that gets done. SF probably would have offered that already. They have a 3-4 defense and a shitload of cap room. Two, you have to look at the cap. Miller wants more money than Vernon. Just take Vernon, Miller, Beckham, amd Eli. If they are all making about 20 million per year you have 4 guys eating up $80 million of your cap. Is that smart? I have seen Demarcus Ware kill it in Dallas and them not accomplish shit. I have seen Watt dominate in Houston and them not accomplish shit. I have seen Donald dominate in STL and them not accomplish shit. I have see numerous great players on bad teams. Miller is a stud but he wasn't alone on that defense. You need a team around you. Football isn't about always having the highest priced players.
So you think it was OK to give Vernon 17 mil per year?
A guy that has never made one Pro Bowl squad in his career, than give up a 2nd round pick and pay Miller 21 mil per year, a guy who's a multiple time All Pro and is now 27 years old?
Odd place to draw the line on too high salaries, if you ask me.
RE: So you think it was OK to give Vernon 17 mil per year?
A guy that has never made one Pro Bowl squad in his career, than give up a 2nd round pick and pay Miller 21 mil per year, a guy who's a multiple time All Pro and is now 27 years old?
Odd place to draw the line on too high salaries, if you ask me.
What does that have to do with this situation? Can we go back and change things? No. You have to look at the team as currently constructed. I really have no idea where you are going with this or why you continue to look at this in a vacuum?
Think Elway will send Miller packing for a second round pick?? It would take a player, a first rounder and something else to even make them consider it but even still they probably shoot it down. Did anyone watch the AFC conference championship or the Super Bowl. Von Miller almost won those games on his own.
The Giants refused to give up a draft pick in addition to signing
Monroe which is why he was released. They didn't want to do both. I don't want to give up a huge contract and draft picks. It is that simple. These draft picks aren't going to be as low as a three or even a two. Even then, I wouldn't give up about 20 mil per year and a second round pick. You can disagree with that. That is fine but when you cherry pick information out of a post to poke fun then don't get defensive when I respond. Simple.
Have we all not complained that our draft picks haven't worked out and when they do they sign with other teams. Football is much more about continuity and growing your own talent than soending big in FA. Our own John Mara said a few years ago spending bug in FA rarely works out. They didn't really have a choice this offseason. How many times have we called the Redskins the offseason champs? Hkw about Philly spending all that money in FA and calling themselves the dream team only to fall flat on their face.
We have productive players in Pugh, Richburgh, Beckham, Hankins, JPP, etc. I would much rather keep building througg the draft and keeping our own players who we know do not have to adapt to a new team, city, coaching staff, teammates, scheme, etc. It is much less risky.
I don't think that is hard to understand whether you agree with it or not.
Think Elway will send Miller packing for a second round pick?? It would take a player, a first rounder and something else to even make them consider it but even still they probably shoot it down. Did anyone watch the AFC conference championship or the Super Bowl. Von Miller almost won those games on his own.
No, not even close.
Elway will deal Miller for the best deal he is offered.
Which won't be as much as many here assume because of 1 Miller's salary demands and 2 Miller will eventually be an FA and cost nothing.
Monroe? You compare Miller to Monroe?
GTFOH....
Once again, cherry picking one piece of a post. You are better than this. This is unreal. What is going on with you? You realize that Denver can tag Miller next year too, right? They don't have to trade him.
has threatened to sit out the season as opposed to playing on the tag. that almost never works out for the player.
Exactly. The way the tag works is that if a player is tagged then the next year that player can get 120% of his previous salary or the amount of the FT, whichever is higher. If Miller sits out like he says he will then he is costing himself money even if he just sits out for a handful of weeks like that SD WR did (Vincent Jackson?). Miller can threaten all he wants but in the end he is costing himself money which I truly doubt he does.
What if Denver wanted Eli ( not the apple ) in an even trade?
idinkido : 4:38 pm : link : reply
This would make our pass rush and defense one of the best in the NFL. McAdoo was talking about Nassib's maneurvability as being an asset.
I just don't see this happening to much cap space in a few
Stars Eli Soon OBJ JPP Hankins Pugh ect.
Rather shore up the Oline add a Vet Pass Rusher and Possibly
a Vet WR We can win now without Miller .
I have been quiet in not reporting anything I have heard since the draft when my sources got caught in the smoke and left me embarrassed.
Miller is not being traded and especially not to the Giants. There was some discussion right after the draft but nothing more than a casual dalliance. My understanding is they it wasn't about compensation to the Broncos but rather that the Giants can't afford Miller.
Think Elway will send Miller packing for a second round pick?? It would take a player, a first rounder and something else to even make them consider it but even still they probably shoot it down. Did anyone watch the AFC conference championship or the Super Bowl. Von Miller almost won those games on his own.
Ah, yep. It's going to take at least a 1st rnd pick, or an elite player (how many of those do we have to give up?) to shake Von Miller out of the Denver tree. It's a dreamy scenario, but not likely.
Reese always says. We investigate everybody and we investigate everything. He wouldnt be doing his due diligence as a GM if he doesnt make the call to the Broncos to check in...
I have been quiet in not reporting anything I have heard since the draft when my sources got caught in the smoke and left me embarrassed.
Miller is not being traded and especially not to the Giants. There was some discussion right after the draft but nothing more than a casual dalliance. My understanding is they it wasn't about compensation to the Broncos but rather that the Giants can't afford Miller.
Thank you, LG.
It makes perfect sense that the Giants and Broncos would talk. Interesting to note that the likely stumbling block wasn't the compensation to the Broncos but rather what Miller is demanding in salary...
Which is precisely what prevented JR from going after Monroe.
In Miller's case it must be an astronomical figure he is looking for. 20 mil per and 60 mil guaranteed I guess.
I guess he'll play on the franchise tag as well, and we'll have a replay of this with the Broncos again next summer. Eventually he will hit FA as a 29 year old if the Broncos remain stubborn. How the NFL PA agreed to this is shocking, in a way.
Still, what the Broncos offered Miller as guaranteed dough
You are still Babbling about this?
My god man, get a fucking clue. How many people need to tell you that you this was never an option?
Camp can't get here soon enough.
My lord you are stupid.
A) I was done 2 hours before your last post addressing me.
B) I was right, Reese and Elway did in fact speak if you believe either of the 2 assats posting on this thread.
C) I suggested you shut the FU if you don't answer the question I asked you, which you never did, of course. Thankfully someone answered the question for you. So you're off the hook for making a bullshit statement without any reason or logic behind it.
Do you realize you're a bottom quartile type here with ease? And that's pretty bad.
You are still Babbling about this?
My god man, get a fucking clue. How many people need to tell you that you this was never an option?
Camp can't get here soon enough.
My lord you are stupid.
A) I was done 2 hours before your last post addressing me.
B) I was right, Reese and Elway did in fact speak if you believe either of the 2 assats posting on this thread.
C) I suggested you shut the FU if you don't answer the question I asked you, which you never did, of course. Thankfully someone answered the question for you. So you're off the hook for making a bullshit statement without any reason or logic behind it.
Do you realize you're a bottom quartile type here with ease? And that's pretty bad.
I really feel like someone took over your account.
absolutely LOVE Von Miller. I think he was the best player in the league last year. Not the best defensive player, the best player. However, I dont like him in a 4-3. He is a 3-4 OLB plain and simple. i know Fox used him in the 4-3 and he was good, but his potential was not maximized there. He is great in coverage, but he is a pass rusher, and he needs to be in that role 8 out of 10 snaps. I hate to say pass on such an incredible player, but his contract along with Vernon's, just not possible.
Or something else?
What has he hit on?
OBJ and Von have been hanging.
Could The New York Giants Potentially Trade For Von Miller?
Hey now...Slade was an awesome band! I have one of their songs on my iPod!
probably, they double dipped in the Slade well though with "Mama weer all crazee now", has any band ever done that?
release two covers from the same band on consecutive albums?
I agree.
Quote:
Us for making Quiet Riot a thing.
Hey now...Slade was an awesome band! I have one of their songs on my iPod!
WTF? Who still uses an iPod? Hey grandpa, the 2000's called...they want their portable music device back!
Quote:
In comment 13026675 Rob in CT/NYC said:
Quote:
Us for making Quiet Riot a thing.
Hey now...Slade was an awesome band! I have one of their songs on my iPod!
WTF? Who still uses an iPod? Hey grandpa, the 2000's called...they want their portable music device back!
I'm old and set in my ways...I don't like thinking outside the box. I don't even like getting near the edge of the box.
What makes you say that?
Archie on vocals, Moose on bass, Jughead on drums, Reggie on keyboards, Veronica on Archie. Josie and the Pussycats doing the opener.
:( That makes me sad. Get out of the box, my friend...live! Be free!
I don't want to go outside! - ( New Window )
Wrong Riverdales
one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
Quote:
Archie on vocals, Moose on bass, Jughead on drums, Reggie on keyboards, Veronica on Archie. Josie and the Pussycats doing the opener.
Wrong Riverdales
yeah, but separate albums? one cover song on each from the same band.
weird.
Wasn't that Screeching Weasel (same front man and base player as The Riverdales?)
Quote:
What would be the most likely parts in a trade? IMO it might be JPP for Von Miller.
To what end? Why would both teams desire that outcome?
My only guess is that JPP already signed his deal which is noncommittal for the Broncos long term but maybe they can get more if a bargain from JPP. They may be in rebuild mode and getting something for him versus paying 20+ million to Von might be more bang for the buck.
Quote:
The Riverdales did an album that was nothing but Ramones covers.
Wasn't that Screeching Weasel (same front man and base player as The Riverdales?)
All of them were also in Screeching Weasel - Ben Weasel, Dan Vapid, Danny Panic. No Jughead though, which is kind of funny given the name. Riverdales was a side project that played a different style, very Ramones-like.
Quote:
In comment 13026839 Dan in the Springs said:
Quote:
What would be the most likely parts in a trade? IMO it might be JPP for Von Miller.
To what end? Why would both teams desire that outcome?
My only guess is that JPP already signed his deal which is noncommittal for the Broncos long term but maybe they can get more if a bargain from JPP. They may be in rebuild mode and getting something for him versus paying 20+ million to Von might be more bang for the buck.
No. Not even as a hypothetical.
"There's an old saying on Earth, Mr. Sulu:
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
Quote:
In comment 13026718 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
The Riverdales did an album that was nothing but Ramones covers.
Wasn't that Screeching Weasel (same front man and base player as The Riverdales?)
All of them were also in Screeching Weasel - Ben Weasel, Dan Vapid, Danny Panic. No Jughead though, which is kind of funny given the name. Riverdales was a side project that played a different style, very Ramones-like.
But The Ramones cover album was released under The Screeching Weasel name. Semantics, I guess since it's the same guys. I used to have it on vinyl. It's probably in my parent's attic somewhere.
Reese's has doing better than that merely as the "floor value" for a trade. Oh and the como draft pick(s) take effect a year AFTER Miller would leave, which devalues it by 1 round.
One doesn't need to offer trade value equal to Miller for the deal to make sense to the Broncos.
What is the most a team can get in compensatory trade pucks for a blockbuster FA signing?
Long before Slade posted this and long before that nitwit suggested it in the article above linked from Fanboy...
I didn't try to start any rumor but I pointed out that it made sense, shortly after I read about the shortfall in what the Broncos were offering Miller (compared to what the Giants paid OV.)
So you are all wrong twice.
Answer the question or piss off.
same with me first and the gimme gimmes, though their covers are all awesome.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
No need to get snarky, Robbie.
What if your premise of "giving up a shitload of stuff [in trade]" is incorrect? What if all the Giants need to give up in trade is something more than the Broncos would get if leaves via FA?
Quote:
In comment 13026781 BlueLou said: Quote: The idea that one wouldn't trade for and sign Von Miller because one is worried about not being able to re-sign Jon Hankins is a hoot.
Did you really write that or did a Simo steal your handle?
It is not about resigning Hankins. It is the WHOLE picture which I guess you very conveniently ignored. It is about putting the best TEAM on the field. If Miller was a FA then by all means make a run at him. Did I say that Hankins was better than him? Did I say that I don't like Miller? Did I say that he sucks? Try reading the whole thing. Thanks.
No need to get snarky, Robbie.
What if your premise of "giving up a shitload of stuff [in trade]" is incorrect? What if all the Giants need to give up in trade is something more than the Broncos would get if leaves via FA?
You think Denver is letting Miller go for a third round pick?
Denver is not going to give him the money he wants; assume he's a goner.
Denver is not going to give him the money he wants; assume he's a goner.
One, no way that gets done. SF probably would have offered that already. They have a 3-4 defense and a shitload of cap room. Two, you have to look at the cap. Miller wants more money than Vernon. Just take Vernon, Miller, Beckham, amd Eli. If they are all making about 20 million per year you have 4 guys eating up $80 million of your cap. Is that smart? I have seen Demarcus Ware kill it in Dallas and them not accomplish shit. I have seen Watt dominate in Houston and them not accomplish shit. I have seen Donald dominate in STL and them not accomplish shit. I have see numerous great players on bad teams. Miller is a stud but he wasn't alone on that defense. You need a team around you. Football isn't about always having the highest priced players.
Odd place to draw the line on too high salaries, if you ask me.
Odd place to draw the line on too high salaries, if you ask me.
What does that have to do with this situation? Can we go back and change things? No. You have to look at the team as currently constructed. I really have no idea where you are going with this or why you continue to look at this in a vacuum?
Have we all not complained that our draft picks haven't worked out and when they do they sign with other teams. Football is much more about continuity and growing your own talent than soending big in FA. Our own John Mara said a few years ago spending bug in FA rarely works out. They didn't really have a choice this offseason. How many times have we called the Redskins the offseason champs? Hkw about Philly spending all that money in FA and calling themselves the dream team only to fall flat on their face.
We have productive players in Pugh, Richburgh, Beckham, Hankins, JPP, etc. I would much rather keep building througg the draft and keeping our own players who we know do not have to adapt to a new team, city, coaching staff, teammates, scheme, etc. It is much less risky.
I don't think that is hard to understand whether you agree with it or not.
No, not even close.
Monroe? You compare Miller to Monroe?
GTFOH....
Monroe? You compare Miller to Monroe?
GTFOH....
Once again, cherry picking one piece of a post. You are better than this. This is unreal. What is going on with you? You realize that Denver can tag Miller next year too, right? They don't have to trade him.
Exactly. The way the tag works is that if a player is tagged then the next year that player can get 120% of his previous salary or the amount of the FT, whichever is higher. If Miller sits out like he says he will then he is costing himself money even if he just sits out for a handful of weeks like that SD WR did (Vincent Jackson?). Miller can threaten all he wants but in the end he is costing himself money which I truly doubt he does.
idinkido : 4:38 pm : link : reply
This would make our pass rush and defense one of the best in the NFL. McAdoo was talking about Nassib's maneurvability as being an asset.
I just don't see this happening to much cap space in a few
Stars Eli Soon OBJ JPP Hankins Pugh ect.
Rather shore up the Oline add a Vet Pass Rusher and Possibly
a Vet WR We can win now without Miller .
Miller is not being traded and especially not to the Giants. There was some discussion right after the draft but nothing more than a casual dalliance. My understanding is they it wasn't about compensation to the Broncos but rather that the Giants can't afford Miller.
Ah, yep. It's going to take at least a 1st rnd pick, or an elite player (how many of those do we have to give up?) to shake Von Miller out of the Denver tree. It's a dreamy scenario, but not likely.
However The Giants arent getting Von Miller..
Ok....we can all do the same thing.
Klaatu has it
Fool me once.....shame on you, .......
Miller is not being traded and especially not to the Giants. There was some discussion right after the draft but nothing more than a casual dalliance. My understanding is they it wasn't about compensation to the Broncos but rather that the Giants can't afford Miller.
Thank you, LG.
It makes perfect sense that the Giants and Broncos would talk. Interesting to note that the likely stumbling block wasn't the compensation to the Broncos but rather what Miller is demanding in salary...
Which is precisely what prevented JR from going after Monroe.
In Miller's case it must be an astronomical figure he is looking for. 20 mil per and 60 mil guaranteed I guess.
I guess he'll play on the franchise tag as well, and we'll have a replay of this with the Broncos again next summer. Eventually he will hit FA as a 29 year old if the Broncos remain stubborn. How the NFL PA agreed to this is shocking, in a way.
The Broncos are shameless.
Elway is probably comparing what Miller wants to what he was paid a generation ago.
This team needs more depth, than it needs a Von Miller....
My god man, get a fucking clue. How many people need to tell you that you this was never an option?
Camp can't get here soon enough.
so the SB performance was a one hit wonder..injuries next?
But you might find a pair of those glasses he wears.
My god man, get a fucking clue. How many people need to tell you that you this was never an option?
Camp can't get here soon enough.
My lord you are stupid.
A) I was done 2 hours before your last post addressing me.
B) I was right, Reese and Elway did in fact speak if you believe either of the 2 assats posting on this thread.
C) I suggested you shut the FU if you don't answer the question I asked you, which you never did, of course. Thankfully someone answered the question for you. So you're off the hook for making a bullshit statement without any reason or logic behind it.
Do you realize you're a bottom quartile type here with ease? And that's pretty bad.
Quote:
You are still Babbling about this?
My god man, get a fucking clue. How many people need to tell you that you this was never an option?
Camp can't get here soon enough.
My lord you are stupid.
A) I was done 2 hours before your last post addressing me.
B) I was right, Reese and Elway did in fact speak if you believe either of the 2 assats posting on this thread.
C) I suggested you shut the FU if you don't answer the question I asked you, which you never did, of course. Thankfully someone answered the question for you. So you're off the hook for making a bullshit statement without any reason or logic behind it.
Do you realize you're a bottom quartile type here with ease? And that's pretty bad.
I really feel like someone took over your account.
This team needs more depth, than it needs a Von Miller....
Agreed.
At least I know I dontvhave to click on this thread any more.
hit and miss. he said JPP would never play for the Giants again. I remember that one.