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Bill Polian: RB Giants' biggest offensive

That’s Gold, Jerry : 7/20/2016 10:33 am
concern.

Heard this last night on Late Hits on Sirius NFL Radio. Polian believes the Giants' don't have a guy they can give the ball to late in a game that could run down the clock and help preserve victories...ie. the four minute offense. He says that's where Dallas may have a big edge over the Giants offensively. He believes Giants should be much improved defensively and thinks Spags will work with Eli Apple to improve his technique which, Polian says, is his biggest weakness. He also thinks Ben will now input the full West Coast offense including the running game (more zone blocking).

Polian also had a very interesting interview with EA on his being inducted into the Giants' Ring of Honor.
The Giants were a little below average in the league  
Ira : 7/20/2016 10:41 am : link
in both rushing yards per game and yards per carry. If we can somehow get a better right tackle and get some blocking from the tight end position, we should improve on that. Just playing Jennings more and Williams less could help.
Don't disagree.  
Beezer : 7/20/2016 10:43 am : link

See if Jennings can pick up where he left off at the end of last season. See what we have in Perkins.

Could be solid there. But for me (and Polian) ... right now a question.
RE: The Giants were a little below average in the league  
BlueLou : 7/20/2016 10:48 am : link
In comment 13039094 Ira said:
Quote:
in both rushing yards per game and yards per carry. If we can somehow get a better right tackle and get some blocking from the tight end position, we should improve on that. Just playing Jennings more and Williams less could help.


I would not buy the "little bit below average" scenario based on stays at all. They couldn't run when they NEEDED TO and couldn't stop the run when they NEEDED to, either.
I see a lot of room for improvement.  
English Alaister : 7/20/2016 10:49 am : link
1. I think you can look at all 5 players on the OL and say they have more to come.

2. Cohesiveness on the OL ought to be better

3. Will Johnson could make a difference

4. Andre Williams ought to be better

5. Perkins could add a new dimension if #4 doesn't materialise.

6. The blocking at TE could well improve

7. Hart might surprise.

The flip side is Pugh and Richburg get injured and we are utterly awful.
I recall the Giants  
Hades07 : 7/20/2016 10:49 am : link
Using three backs would have Jacobs and Ward doing the heavy work in quarters 1-3 and bring in a fresh Bradshaw for the forth. I wonder if they will do something similar with Jennings, Vereen and Perkins this year.
Perkins is an unknown quantity......  
Doomster : 7/20/2016 11:15 am : link
Neither Williams or Jennings, are the kind of backs that can make something out of nothing, on 3rd and short, which is what usually happens with this OL.....a good OL can make any back look good on 3rd and short.....the line is the key, not the back....it will be interesting to see if there is a huge difference in play calling, now that TC is gone, on third and short...
Honestly..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/20/2016 11:31 am : link
almost every team faces this issue.

There are very few backs who are able to help run out the clock, mainly because teams have to completely change their philosophy, moreso than the talent of the back.

nearly every team is passing first, so once they try to shift the focus to the run consistently, they aren't successful.
English Alaister  
ColHowPepper : 7/20/2016 11:37 am : link
not sure I agree that Paul Perkins is the guy to carry the load designated for AW, if he makes the 53. PP is creative and quick to look for the holes where there are holes (his OL at UCLA was good), but not a pile pushing, tough yardage inside guy, from what I see from his UCLA highlight film.

(Is Alaister pronounced the same way that the former host of our (America's) Public TV's Masterpiece Theater, Alaister Cook?)
IMO Three things to improve  
Reale01 : 7/20/2016 11:38 am : link
Generally consistency as there were some games when the offense disappeared.

1. Red Zone - More TDs. More aggressive play calling should help. Throwing the ball into the endzone instead of to the 2 yard line. Typical scenario last year. Run for little or no gain. Pass to the 2 yard line. Stuffed. Field goal.

2. Short yardage conversion. We seemed to be better converting 3rd and 5 than 3rd and 1. Also see Red Zone.

3. Running out clock. Last year we were very conservative (run, run, pass), and very ineffective running the ball. This year we either need to be less conservative and/or more effective running.

We will have a solid season if those areas improve. Especially if the defense is also better. Very encouraged that the Giants seem to see things the same way. In the past TC would say its all about poor execution. That is true to an extent, but if you repeatedly can't execute the palys being called then sometimes you need to call different plays. You can live with what should be or adapt to what is. My main criticism of TC is that he did not seem to be able to adapt to what his team could do and instead tried to force them to execute what they he thought they should be able to do.
If that's our biggest concern  
BillT : 7/20/2016 11:48 am : link
We're going to have a great offense. Jenning is more than capable in a 4 minute offense. The OL is the bigger concern really in a 4 minute situation but whatever.
This is actually false..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/20/2016 11:58 am : link
Quote:
Running out clock. Last year we were very conservative (run, run, pass), and very ineffective running the ball.


Fans often have this perception, but it isn't bared out by facts.

Only 28% of 3 and out drives were run, run, pass last year.

I don't know if I'm crazy  
Matt M. : 7/20/2016 12:05 pm : link
But, I'm not worried about RB at all. I think Jennings is a good back and Vereen is an excellent 3rd down back. I honestly think Perkins will be pushing for significant playing time by the second half. I think, right now, he is our most talented and complete back. I don't think that means he will start this year, but he should play.
the 4 min O  
ron mexico : 7/20/2016 12:11 pm : link
is 80-90% about the o-line.

You dont need an all world back to get 4-5 yards in a cloud of dust
RE: This is actually false..  
ron mexico : 7/20/2016 12:12 pm : link
In comment 13039256 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


Running out clock. Last year we were very conservative (run, run, pass), and very ineffective running the ball.



Fans often have this perception, but it isn't bared out by facts.

Only 28% of 3 and out drives were run, run, pass last year.


Out of curiosity, where do you get stats like this?
RE: I see a lot of room for improvement.  
SGMen : 7/20/2016 12:25 pm : link
In comment 13039115 English Alaister said:
Quote:
1. I think you can look at all 5 players on the OL and say they have more to come.

2. Cohesiveness on the OL ought to be better

3. Will Johnson could make a difference

4. Andre Williams ought to be better

5. Perkins could add a new dimension if #4 doesn't materialise.

6. The blocking at TE could well improve

7. Hart might surprise.

The flip side is Pugh and Richburg get injured and we are utterly awful.
Great post reply I agree with every point. Our four minute offense will be very much improved from the last few years. The biggest reasons being I think we have more "mature talent, cohesiveness and understanding" now than ever before during the McAdoo era.

Jennings can definitely run the four minute offense and potentially so could any of the running backs really. FB Johnson leading the way late in a game is a huge upgrade. And as you noted, I also believe the blocking at TE will be much improved as our players aren't as raw as year's past (Donnell, Tye).

Finally, I think if this OL under coach Solari stays healthy through camp and practices together will surprise this year. I honestly can see Pugh and Richburg plying for probowl honors based on ability. LT E Flowers now has a year of technique under his belt and also an off-season workout program to develop that massive physical power that he has. I look for Flowers to be one of the best run blocking LT's in football this year.

Everyone is worried about the right side but what I see are two RETURNING veterans who can pass block well enough and who are in their prime. No mental errors. J. Jerry went to some off-season program to improve his game, his run blocking, and with coach Solari too he may improve and surprise. I think the starting OL will surprise.

We will run better and RB Vereen, who now knows the offense better of course, will really be a 3rd down conversion machine for the NY G's.

Polian is just wrong.
3 very good WRs  
KeoweeFan : 7/20/2016 12:36 pm : link
may discourage defenses from stacking the line on 3rd down.
RBs who can show that they are able to reliably catch short passes will help also.
It will be interesting to see what the new O-line coach brings  
BurlyMan : 7/20/2016 12:44 pm : link
If there is a new approach then it will take opponents, especially NFCEast opponents, time to adjust.
RE: This is actually false..  
BillKo : 7/20/2016 1:07 pm : link
In comment 13039256 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


Running out clock. Last year we were very conservative (run, run, pass), and very ineffective running the ball.



Fans often have this perception, but it isn't bared out by facts.

Only 28% of 3 and out drives were run, run, pass last year.


But one of the biggest of those 28% was versus the Jets, when we couldn't run out the clock..........

On the flip side, we did run out the clock effectively in Week 1 before just giving the game away.
I disagree with Polian.  
Emlen'sGremlins : 7/20/2016 1:16 pm : link
Our biggest concern is the O-Line and in particular their run blocking. These current backs would have success running behind our O-Line from '08, anybody would.
RE: I disagree with Polian.  
SGMen : 7/20/2016 1:50 pm : link
In comment 13039368 Emlen'sGremlins said:
Quote:
Our biggest concern is the O-Line and in particular their run blocking. These current backs would have success running behind our O-Line from '08, anybody would.
Great blocking, OL + FB + TE + WR makes a big difference for sure. We saw last year that the OL outside of Richburg and Pugh was not up to par. We saw last year that we had limitd FB ability. We saw last year that our TE's clearly needed to improve their blocking as well and did as the year moved along.

This year's team has a much more "mature" group of blockers in the sense that there is now experience, continuity and development plus a true FB in Johnson. We shall see but I have a good feeling that we have an OL returning in tact; year 3 of offense; TE's that should be improved; a true FB; and a group of RB's who should be solid.
I am less concerned with what Polian believes  
Ten Ton Hammer : 7/20/2016 1:52 pm : link
and more concerned with what McAdoo believes. We don't know how he wants to play 4-minute offense.
Can't agree with A. Williams  
gmenatlarge : 7/20/2016 2:41 pm : link
Has shown next to nothing so far, time to move on...
Anyone else remember  
mrvax : 7/20/2016 2:48 pm : link
McAdoo saying that he was going to assemble a crew of an unknown number of folks to help out deciding plays in the final 2 minutes of a game? (This was in response to TC's huge blunders in several game endings last year.)

Anyway, this would help a lot in closing out games.
If the Oline has improved it's run blocking by training or technique from the new line coach would be a HUGE plus.

Actually allow Eli Manning to execute a QB sneak every once in a while would help by forcing the defense to have to consider defending for that play. TC never allowed ELi to do a QB sneak.

There are so many little things that can be improved...
RE: Can't agree with A. Williams  
SGMen : 7/20/2016 4:19 pm : link
In comment 13039532 gmenatlarge said:
Quote:
Has shown next to nothing so far, time to move on...
We need to see how A. Williams does behind an improved OL and with a true FB leading the way. I don't think the formations he has run from have always been the best suited for him. Last year, FB Nikita and the TE's sucked blocking along with the right side of the OL.

Remember, Tiki Barber didn't "get it" right away. He LEARNED how to use his blockers and then BOOM he blossomed. Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing how A. Williams does under coach McAdoo, new FB Johnson and improved TE blocking. He sucked last year as a runner for sure but lets see how he does in camp and early this year. I doubt he gets cut over Dwarka.
Williams  
blue42 : 7/20/2016 9:03 pm : link
is one trick guy....a good one trick but still.
I agree with Polihan,,,,our RB group is average right now.
The rookies may change that...if not....it's avery average group.
RE: Williams  
SGMen : 7/20/2016 10:17 pm : link
In comment 13039944 blue42 said:
Quote:
is one trick guy....a good one trick but still.
I agree with Polihan,,,,our RB group is average right now.
The rookies may change that...if not....it's avery average group.
Maybe he'll develop a few new tricks in camp running behind a bona-fide FB in Johnson. RB A. Williams may be one of those guys that is best running behind certain formations. We shall see.
RE: This is actually false..  
dep026 : 7/20/2016 10:27 pm : link
In comment 13039256 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


Running out clock. Last year we were very conservative (run, run, pass), and very ineffective running the ball.



Fans often have this perception, but it isn't bared out by facts.

Only 28% of 3 and out drives were run, run, pass last year.


And I think that happened 100% of the time to start the 2nd half! haha
I've been saying this all along.  
Spider 67 : 7/21/2016 8:01 am : link
Jennings was rested throughout the season and did well at the end. Can he do it all season? The O line is still a problem. They couldn't score inside the 20 because defenses didn't have to worry about the run. I don't care how good the QB & receivers are, they couldn't run out the clock and settled for field goals when TD's were needed. OBJ is back with 2 question mark receivers.

Manning still doesn't know how to run a screen play. He only uses it when he doesn't like the way a play starts. The quick dump off. He never throws a delayed screen where blockers have time to set up for the back receiving the ball.

RE: I've been saying this all along.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 7/21/2016 8:38 am : link
In comment 13040094 Spider 67 said:
Quote:
Jennings was rested throughout the season and did well at the end. Can he do it all season? The O line is still a problem. They couldn't score inside the 20 because defenses didn't have to worry about the run. I don't care how good the QB & receivers are, they couldn't run out the clock and settled for field goals when TD's were needed. OBJ is back with 2 question mark receivers.

Manning still doesn't know how to run a screen play. He only uses it when he doesn't like the way a play starts. The quick dump off. He never throws a delayed screen where blockers have time to set up for the back receiving the ball.


Who were the receiving backs and offensive linemen that could do it? That always has to be part of the equation.
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