I lived through the Parcells Era and the Coughlin Era - and they both provided some great thrills - the article linked below says the biggest difference between them is the way they both left and gives the edge to Coughlin for his loyalty to the Giants.
I agree -- and I'll take it one step more -- in terms of the thrilling wins, and surprisingly thrilling wins - there were more under Coughlin -- and they were more frequent then they were through the Parcells era, and he did more with less.
To Date: Tom Coughlin is the GOAT!!!!!
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Come on, it's very obvious we are discussing the tenures as HC.
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If so, that gives him 4 SB victories for the Giants to BP's two.
Come on, it's very obvious we are discussing the tenures as HC.
And the thread title just says coaches. Plus, the discussion had expanded to include how other coaches (Spags, Little Bill), may have contributed to those victories, so TC counts there as well.
From the perspective of a Giants fan twenty years from now I think this era will be much kinder to Eli than it is to Coughlin. The last few years didn't remove all of the luster, but it removed some for Coughlin.
Agree entirely. That 2008 season was a major disappointment, followed by an even bigger one in 2009. Some people think it's silly, but I have a hard time letting go of that loss to Carolina that season. Still in the playoff hunt, last game in Giants Stadium with all the Giants legends in the house, playing a mediocre team with nothing to play for.....and they were humiliated by Matt freaking Moore.
(The ball going through Buckner's legs is maybe a close second for me personally.)
It was a fabulous moment. However, it doesn't come close to 1986 as a season. There's something to be said about being the undisputed baddest sonsofbitches in the league. They were exactly that in 1990, not so much in 2007.
Based on your math, we should elevate Bill B to top dogn then since he has rings with both the Giants and Patriots, more than both combined. then we are all good to go. lol
(The ball going through Buckner's legs is maybe a close second for me personally.)
Me Too -- and I totally agree -- as fabulous as the 80's were under Parcells -- I think TC deserves much more credit for doing what he did with much less - and I also think he gets an extra nudge for his loyalty to the Giants
Philly playoffs in 2008
Carolina 2009
Philly comeback in 2010
The paths were different. The stories were different and PArcells didn't stick around long enough to endure the attrition that occurred 91-94. Maybe he helps to avoid those dark days. Maybe not. Coughlin stayed and suffered from 2013-2015 so that's a mark against him but if you're gonna bring up every high n low under Coughlin I can literally mirror those detriments under Parcells.
They both did great jobs here. They both brought strengths and weaknesses.
While ignoring Parcells warts. It's bizarre behavior for fans.
Which was worse than any Coughlin loss.
But let's discuss an 09 Giants team with absolutely nothing on defense losing at home to a competitive Panthers team and kill Coughlin for that.
Both guys could take a lost franchise to elite heights. The evidence is conclusive.
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Parcells had the Jets loss in 88.
Which was worse than any Coughlin loss.
No it wasn't. It was a tough and bitter loss, but it wasn't anywhere near some of the no shows we had under TC, such as the Carolina 09 or the Philly 08 playoff game Carolina playoff game 05. The Giants showed up that day, they just got beat. We had some total no shows under TC. Please tell me when any Parcells team didn't show up at home in games of that magnitude.
The question is whether he is the best coach of all time, looking under the hood to answer that question is not shitting on him.
But let's discuss an 09 Giants team with absolutely nothing on defense losing at home to a competitive Panthers team and kill Coughlin for that.
The Giants were winning until the last minute. Maybe not our best, but we could have won except for bad special teams. The McConkey fumble and the kickoff right after we scored to go up. PhIlly 08, Carolina 05 and 09 we weren't even competitive and Carolina didn't make the playoffs in 09
Both great, but Coughlin did more with less.
BTW, who hired that shitty defensive coordinator?
Jets loss and the 49ers home run to Rice while in the wrong defense. 49ers the laid down in their season finale so the Giants missed the playoffs. What a missed opportunity 1988 was.
Also, TC's chances for "back to back" SB's was ruined when Plax shot himself. Losing the guy you had to double team allowed the Eagles to pounce on the Giants in 2008 and win that playoff game easy. The team's "psyche" was also damaged with that shot. We also had some injuries late and that didn't help either but if Plax plays we likely win and I believe still make the SB.
TC just had more "bad luck" in terms of injuries, bad draft picks to deal with and a really poor decision by Plax and Pierce.
Tom Coughlin was an excellent coach and an all time Giant. That doesn't make him Parcells.
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Parcells had the Jets loss in 88.
Which was worse than any Coughlin loss.
No it fucking was not. The '88 team wasn't going anywhere. The '08 team was the best in the league and two home wins against flawed teams away from going to the Super Bowl to repeat. An enormous blown opportunity.
The '10 team could have also made serious noise if they didn't spit the bit so terribly against Philly.
there was just not the same parity you see today.
Pairirty in the league ? To me that gives coughlin more cred.
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Yes, Parcells easily. Their similarity mostly ends with each having two glorious titles:
1. Missing the playoffs in six of seven seasons, with an alway-healthy HOF-caliber QB in his prime, is just horrible. Parcells did not have this embarrassment.
2. Someone posted this before, Parcells' team was blowed out (losing by 14 or more) like 3 or 4 times in his 8 years. That number during Coughlin's Giants tenture is like 15 to 20, alarmingly, even laughably, high, for someone we want to send to Canton.
TC also had the only two games over a 10-year period in the entire NFL in which his team led by 21 in the 4th quarter.
3. Almost all opposing coaches feared Bill Parcells as he often outcoached them. He consistently got the best of two of the best HCs of all time, Joe Gibbs and Bill Walsh. Yes I know and I am very thankful that TC beat little Bill twice, but did we have the sense that head coaches around the league genuinely worried or even feared TC -- about his strategy, about his adjustment, about him always having his players 100% ready to play ? Respect, yes. Fear, hardly.
Maybe the only coach who did fear Coughlin is the guy in New England .
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don't understand why. Revisionist history along with no memory at all.
While ignoring Parcells warts. It's bizarre behavior for fans.
Ppl forget, that is a long ass time ago.
not a huge gap between them but I would say Parcells squeezed the most out of the talent and his teams were more consistent. he did have BB as his DC but choosing a good DC is a head coach's responsibility and coughlin chose some duds.
BP also provided with the Pats, Jets and to a lesser extent the Cowboys that he could turnaround a losing franchise and build a consistent winning culture.Coughlin had a great start with Jax but eventually fizzled out as was the case with the NYG albeit over a much longer timeframe.
He coached the team for 23 straight seasons. he took them to the NFL championship game 8 times, made the playoffs 10 times and won the championship 2 times. He had a lifetime record of 151 wins and 100 losses with 12 ties. His playoff record is 2 wins and 8 losses. His win percentage is .602. You can knock his playoff record, but the number of years and the total win percentage makes this question a dumb one in my opinion.
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He took the COWBOYS, an expansion team and made them contenders. He was the a pioneer using the 4/3 defensive line.
5 Super Bowl appearances
2 Super Bowls
13 Division Titles
20 Consecutive winning seasons
Seasons coached (just NYG)
Parcells - 8
Coughlin - 12
Winning %
Parcells - .610
Coughlin - .531
Winning seasons
Parcells - 6
Coughlin - 6
10 win seasons
Parcells - 5
Coughlin - 4
Playoff appearances
Parcells - 5
Coughlin - 5
Division titles
Parcells - 3
Coughlin - 2
Playoff record
Parcells - 8-3
Coughlin - 8-3
Super Bowl titles
Parcells - 2
Coughlin - 2
There is no single category in which Coughlin has managed to be better than Parcells's equal, and in most he is not. The sample size is, relatively speaking for the average head coach career, enormous.
Again Coughlin had an excellent career. He probably just hung around too long. It happens.
He was not, my choice would be Parcells. They were in a lot
worse shape when Parcells took over the Giants.
Ray Perkins left it kind of messy. I know Coughlin took
over a 4-12 team back in 2004, and the players kind of quit
on Fassel... believe me they were worse off when Parcells took over.
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He was not, my choice would be Parcells. They were in a lot
worse shape when Parcells took over the Giants.
Ray Perkins left it kind of messy. I know Coughlin took
over a 4-12 team back in 2004, and the players kind of quit
on Fassel... believe me they were worse off when Parcells took over.
Perkins didn't leave a mess. Holy crap
My bet it was probably one the worst offenses in Giants history. D was talented, but not good enough to cover for that crap on O.