NFT: Yanks deal Chapman

Quote:

Yankeesource þ@YankeeSource 11m11 minutes ago What would be even crazier is if Chapman comes back to the Yankees so in essence they would have traded just Brendan Ryan.

If they signed Chapman as an FA, they would have traded:

Brendan Ryan, Eric Jagielo, Rookie Davis, Tony Renda, and Caleb Cotham for....

Gleyber Torres, Starlin Castro, Billy McKinney and Rashad Crawford.

he's under contract affordably for 3 more years after this year and can be dealt at any time during that those three years for possibly even better prospects.

It's hard to get legit front of the rotation talent without paying a ton in FA unless you grow it. this could be a rare opportunity to get that at a discount (one the price comes down).

The Yankees have resources to turn things around quicker than most teams.

the crazy factor is the only thing that scares me about him - though I can't say I've heard a history of it, this incident was the first one I heard about - but admittedly haven't been paying attention.

I suspect they'll use someone like Wade as a chip to package with someone else like Beltran.

but had to go ALL In.
And their farm is prospect rich, and lots of roster talent is young, sans pitching.
I think Torres is #27, McKinney has all the makings of a MLr.

In comment 13044297 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 13044284 DanMetroMan said: Quote: In comment 13044280 Victor in CT said: Quote: at this stage of the Yankees development. Sale is 27. 28 next season. But the Yankees probably won't be ready to do much more than hope for a wild card for 2-3 more years.

Greg,
I'm not disagreeing, I'm just saying "I can't see the Yankees trading their chips for a 30 year old" isn't really fair. He has 2.5 seasons before he's a 30 year old pitcher.

In comment 13044306 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

I suspect they'll use someone like Wade as a chip to package with someone else like Beltran.

Sorry, should've specified location, not position. I meant will Torres start at Tampa or go straight to Trenton? And what other moves with the aforementioned group will also happen?

In comment 13044309 old man said:

Quote:

but had to go ALL In. And their farm is prospect rich, and lots of roster talent is young, sans pitching. I think Torres is #27, McKinney has all the makings of a MLr.

McKinney has not been hitting at AA.

he played this Chapman situation well from the start. When they got him for 10 cents on the dollar from the Reds after the Dodgers trade fell through, the Yankees took a low cost risk. Absorb the suspension and then see what they can do with the big 3. They likely had 2 scenarios worked out. If the Yankees were in first place, or close to it, they'd just assume keep the 3 guys. If not, they would hope that Chapman stayed healthy and remained dominant and start shopping him.

The Yankees had to move him, and they used Miller as a lure to get a bunch of teams in the bidding. Once they more or less took Miller off the market, unless they are blown away, Chapman became the focus. When Chapman hit 105 on the gun, the Yankees almost had to pull the trigger and trade him and not risk him getting hurt, he was at the peak of his game. So Cashman played all these teams against each other and got back a much better package than they gave up to get him. That's smart business in the front office, something we haven't seen much from the Yankees in the past while.

Something like the way we traded away 19 year old Fred McGriff for crap years back. We desperately need hitting...the team sucks and the Stadium is a tomb without better offense.

They're not very happy with Mateo at the moment, and he hasn't played well lately.

Given what the Cubs paid, and the fact that Miller is by far the best of the available reliever, I think they could play the field up enough to get a guy like Gallo from the Rangers or Frazier from the Indians.

and the return for Beltran and whoever else we can deal, We might be half of the way toward trading for Mike Trout. He should play in NY and the Angels can lose without him. Make it so Cashman.

because it inflates Miller's value and if we don't go full rebuild, it actually doesn't leave us noticeably weaker We aren't going to make the playoffs because we have a third closer - we will make it if the older players suddenly turn back the clock the rest of the way.

Since that scenario is unlikely I think this trade just sets the table. I could see Miller and Beltran going for quite a haul and we'll have to see about Nova and some of our overpaid players like Ellsbury and Headley.

In comment 13044329 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Given what the Cubs paid, and the fact that Miller is by far the best of the available reliever, I think they could play the field up enough to get a guy like Gallo from the Rangers or Frazier from the Indians.

Gallo? Why would we want a guy who profiles to strike out 250 times per season in Texas? That would be 300 in the Bronx. No thanks.

In comment 13044329 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Given what the Cubs paid, and the fact that Miller is by far the best of the available reliever, I think they could play the field up enough to get a guy like Gallo from the Rangers or Frazier from the Indians.

I don't think Hal will do it. He will trade the guys who's contracts are up, but I don't see him trading off someone under contract for next year, and not with Miller's track record. I would love to see the Yankees do it, but he wants to find a way to keep fans coming the last few months. The past few years he had Mo and Jeter retire, and they found a way to get in as a Wild Card last year. If they deal a guy like Miller, Yankee Stadium will be empty the last 2 months.

Did anyone feel like the Yankees accomplished anything by making it last year?

In comment 13044325 yatqb said:

Quote:

Something like the way we traded away 19 year old Fred McGriff for crap years back. We desperately need hitting...the team sucks and the Stadium is a tomb without better offense.

yat this is something all of the "if only George were still alive" crowd need to memorize. Good post.

In comment 13044340 Victor in CT said:

Quote:

In comment 13044325 yatqb said: Quote: Something like the way we traded away 19 year old Fred McGriff for crap years back. We desperately need hitting...the team sucks and the Stadium is a tomb without better offense. yat this is something all of the "if only George were still alive" crowd need to memorize. Good post.

And Doug Drabek
And Jay Buhner
And Tony Armas Jr...who was spun to Montreal to send Pedro to Boston

over the years, as we both know...Ken Phelps, anyone? But he at least swung for the fences and put his wallet where his mouth was. The kids are so much more bottom line than he was. What they seem not to recognize is the way you get fannies in the seats is by investing in the team. The 11 million George paid for the team sure paid off, because he was willing to shell out more money and bring in guys like Reggie and Catfish.

In comment 13044329 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Given what the Cubs paid, and the fact that Miller is by far the best of the available reliever, I think they could play the field up enough to get a guy like Gallo from the Rangers or Frazier from the Indians.

I want them to put out a "take it or leave it" price on Miller. If no one ponies up, you have the best reliever in baseball for two more years, and the opportunity to trade him in the offseason or at next year's deadline.

In comment 13044348 yatqb said:

Quote:

over the years, as we both know...Ken Phelps, anyone? But he at least swung for the fences and put his wallet where his mouth was. The kids are so much more bottom line than he was. What they seem not to recognize is the way you get fannies in the seats is by investing in the team. The 11 million George paid for the team sure paid off, because he was willing to shell out more money and bring in guys like Reggie and Catfish.

you mean like when the building was empty in the late '80s early 90s due to his complete mismanagement? His buffoonery given free reign nearly destroyed the franchise. The biggest ovation at the Stadium in that period was the night the 2 yr suspension of George was announced.

The Yankees current problem is not that they haven't spent money. It's that they have not spent it unwisely and have too much $$ tied up in players who can't perform any more.

In comment 13044338 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Did anyone feel like the Yankees accomplished anything by making it last year?

It was only fun because the Sox sucked so bad. This year, it would be a pretty empty achievement.

Is now that we're about 15 years into the Yankee tax era instituted by Selig, most other teams can also afford to spend with the Yanks in FA.

Big George would have paid through the nose to keep Cano...but few other teams could have or would have beaten us in years or salary either. Now other teams can.

Ellsbury is one prime example of that. The second ARod deal (when we bid against ourselves at Hank's direction) was similarly stupid.

But we're also suffering because the long term deals we had to give guys like CC and Tex have reached the point everyone knew they would, when the guys couldn't cut it any more.

And then there's the non-productive farm system (at least with regard to positional players). Let's not forget that.

The Yankees control this market. They just took the 2nd best reliever available off the market, and hold const-controlled rights to the best.

If they get floored with an offer for Miller, they will take it. If not they keep him and try again next year (either to win or flip him for picks).

Let's not fool ourselves, making the post-season and playing competitive games is still very important to the bottom line. A wildcard/pennant chase is worth millions to the organization, not to mention Girardi's and Cashman's jobs.

In comment 13044338 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Did anyone feel like the Yankees accomplished anything by making it last year?

Yea it's called making the postseason

The moron triumvirate needs to get that through their thick skulls and move Miller.

Would be to leave Ellsbury stranded before getting back to the Bronx

Also Sherman makes it sound like they're not permanently moving him to 2B, only that he'll get reps there as Mateo's teammate. Avelino and Estrada may struggle to get PT.

...
Link - ( New Window )

Are the final players included in the deal.

Tried to see if anyone posted this yet, but it's hard to wade through the exited chattering.

I'm pumped though. Finally have some hope to get the young talent around the league that seemingly avoids a Bronx landing spot.

In comment 13044439 Vin R said:

Quote:

Would be to leave Ellsbury stranded before getting back to the Bronx

We've seen some pretty stupid things in baseball (e.g. that 1 FA a year Boras somehow gets 9 figures), but I can't imagine anyone is dumb enough to take Ellsbury off of our hands. I'd call Seattle though.

Vincente Campos to AAA, which is interesting in its own right.

In comment 13044455 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

Quote:

In comment 13044439 Vin R said: Quote: Would be to leave Ellsbury stranded before getting back to the Bronx We've seen some pretty stupid things in baseball (e.g. that 1 FA a year Boras somehow gets 9 figures), but I can't imagine anyone is dumb enough to take Ellsbury off of our hands. I'd call Seattle though.

They no longer have an absolute moron as their GM.

5 of the top 100 prospects with 3 in the first 30. I have no doubt that Kap ( if he ever gets healthy) will make the top 100 for next year giving us 6 for 2018.

And we still might not be done.

Quote:

This team is not really competing for anything next year either. shockeyisthebest8056 : 2:38 pm : link : reply The moron triumvirate needs to get that through their thick skulls and move Miller.

But what I don't get is the idea that the team needs to get younger and stockpile talent but they would give up a dominant young player to do that. They still will need a closer to be competitive once they have young talent.

I'm not opposed to them selling Miller - they just better have the Brinks truck backed up for him.

In comment 13044186 Rob in CT/NYC said:

Quote:

advocated by one poster.

Depends on the flavor.

In comment 13044471 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

Vincente Campos to AAA, which is interesting in its own right.

whoa - didnt campos throw smoke before the injury? Like high 90s? very interesting. Time to make room for some kids, lets go Cash...

In comment 13044485 FatMan in Charlotte said:

Quote:

Quote: This team is not really competing for anything next year either. shockeyisthebest8056 : 2:38 pm : link : reply The moron triumvirate needs to get that through their thick skulls and move Miller. But what I don't get is the idea that the team needs to get younger and stockpile talent but they would give up a dominant young player to do that. They still will need a closer to be competitive once they have young talent. I'm not opposed to them selling Miller - they just better have the Brinks truck backed up for him.

They would still have Betances to close. And while I like Miller a lot, I just don't trust relievers to not fall off of a cliff. And he's not old but not young either. Think he's over 30.

They'll get a haul for Miller if they want to move him, hope they do.

.

he looks like he could fight Shreve on who will get rejected going into a bar first contest!

In comment 13044378 Victor in CT said:

Quote:

In comment 13044348 yatqb said: Quote: over the years, as we both know...Ken Phelps, anyone? But he at least swung for the fences and put his wallet where his mouth was. The kids are so much more bottom line than he was. What they seem not to recognize is the way you get fannies in the seats is by investing in the team. The 11 million George paid for the team sure paid off, because he was willing to shell out more money and bring in guys like Reggie and Catfish. you mean like when the building was empty in the late '80s early 90s due to his complete mismanagement? His buffoonery given free reign nearly destroyed the franchise. The biggest ovation at the Stadium in that period was the night the 2 yr suspension of George was announced. The Yankees current problem is not that they haven't spent money. It's that they have not spent it unwisely and have too much $$ tied up in players who can't perform any more.

Except, the Stadium was hardly empty in the late 80s. The were 3rd in the AL in 87, 2nd in the AL in 88 (their highest per game average of the decade) and 8th in the AL in 89 with 2.1M fans. In fact, the only years in the 80s they didn't draw over 2M were 84 and 81 (strike shortened season with an average draw of over 30K).

Of course attendance dropped from there and was actually worse in 1995 (a playoff season) than at any point in the 80s.

With his stuff, but problems getting through a lineup 2-3 times, the move to the pen made sense. They may like adding his heat to form another big 3.

I like this deal and would even be fine following it up with a deal including Miller or Betances.

I like sale as a pitcher, but I think dealing for him defeats the purpose of trading guys like Chapman, Miller, Beltran, etc. The entire point is get younger and aquire as much talent as possible. Why would you turn around and package much of that talent for a pitcher who is not likely to make a significant difference to the team's fortunes in the next 1-2 years?

In comment 13044494 Justlurking said:

Quote:

In comment 13044471 Dunedin81 said: Quote: Vincente Campos to AAA, which is interesting in its own right. whoa - didnt campos throw smoke before the injury? Like high 90s? very interesting. Time to make room for some kids, lets go Cash...

Hahaha

Donnie Collins
þ@DonnieCollinsTT
Baseball is an awesome game played in a small world. Vicente Campos will make his AAA debut tonight against Buffalo and Jesus Montero.

Eovaldi, Nova and Pineda will be on the block.

With these moves and some more, there will be a handful of youngsters competing for jobs on the big club, plus a number of names trying to start the year moving to AA or AAA.

If guys like Campos and Severino and Judge et al. don't pan out, it won't be all that interesting. It will be pretty sad here for a while.

is 7-1 in S/WB and he is consistently throwing 95-97.

In comment 13044617 Matt M. said:

Quote:

If guys like Campos and Severino and Judge et al. don't pan out, it won't be all that interesting. It will be pretty sad here for a while.

The problem is that Yankee fans need to be prepared for it not panning out immediately. Some of them are going to struggle, and if we boo them into oblivion after 100 ABs we're going to send the FO a message about whether we actually do have the patience to rebuild.

The more excited I am