Coach McAdoo has gone on record as saying he wants the "best roster" not the best 6 at WR, best 4 at safety, best 5 corners, best 8 DL's, best 9 OL's, etc. He wants the best roster.
In my mind, that means potentially 4 TE's; 5 safeties, 5 CB's, 6 LB's (or maybe just five....), etc.
I believe in experience and right now the guy with the most playing experience at safety is 2ND YEAR MAN L. Collins - 2nd year!!!! 4th year Cooper Taylor is next up in terms of just time in camps, off-seasons, around NFL football.
I would not be shocked by ANY opening day lineup at free safety. I think D. Thompson is being pushed to be the #1 because of his "potential" but would anyone be surprised if 3rd year man Nat Behre, 2nd year man Mykele Thompson, 4th year man Cooper Taylor or 3rd year man B. Jackson started the season at FS?
Nothing would shock me right now. May the best man win. But I do believe the SS will be L. Collins.
Giants should stop delaying the inevitable and move Berhe in behind Collins which would solidy the in-the-box depth.
Assuming he has not lost speed/quickness, Jackson has that nice ability to cover even WRs. I believe it will come down to a battle of football brains (Thompson) versus range and coverage ability (Jackson) for the starting role. Mykele is the wild card. Cooper is probably now a wrong place, wrong time situation.
Taylor was set to be a starting safety late last summer, until the Giants went in a different direction days before the season opener and moved Brandon Meriweather (and later Craig Dahl) ahead of him on the depth chart. Several weeks later, he was released to make room for an extra cornerback after Prince Amukamara's injury.
This tells you everything you need to know about how this defensive coaching staff sees Taylor....
He seems to have a unique skill set. The injuries make it hard to believe he can ever be anything but the last safety on a roster. Wish the best for him though.
Taylor was set to be a starting safety late last summer, until the Giants went in a different direction days before the season opener and moved Brandon Meriweather (and later Craig Dahl) ahead of him on the depth chart. Several weeks later, he was released to make room for an extra cornerback after Prince Amukamara's injury.
This tells you everything you need to know about how this defensive coaching staff sees Taylor....
Exactly. Sounds silly to even say he was "set" to start in the beginning.
I think you guys will miss Taylor when he's gone...
in the hybrid Safety/LB role (I think that intrigued Spags). He also has to be a big star on special teams.
Don't know why, but I've been rooting for Cooper since he was drafted (maybe because he has a Herzlich like story).
Jackson has the least practice reps with the 1st team
than any other safety on this team despite the fact this is his 3rd training camp.
Last year M. Thompson beat him out in OTAs and training camp for 1st team reps in a straight up competition for a very open roster spot. Remember Jackson only got his opportunity because M. Thompson got hurt first in the 1st preseason game in which he started. Jackson then went on to get hurt in the 2nd game.
This year D. Thompson and M. Thompson have beaten him out for 1st team reps. M. Thompson has beaten him out for 2nd team reps (just going by camp tweets).
Jackson and Behre were drafted the same year and Behre has at least one year of real NFL games.
Taylor drafted a year before Jackson has now more than a year of experience in real NFL games.
Despite the fact that Jackson was already beaten out by McBride, Hosley and a guy on another team's roster his rookie year for a corner spot.
I can see why he is forgettable. Everyone keeps passing him.
It feels like we have two strong safeties starting for us and have 4 starting caliber cbs. Thompson is not only a rookie, but has questionable athleticism to begin with (for a true Centerfielder)
If he struggles they should consider moving DRC to FS, thompson fills the hybrid 3rd safety/lbr role, apple and jenkins on the outside with hall in the slot. Involves some juggling around but the defense is going to suck if the safeties are giving up deep balls.
Why? He's never played Safety before, and it's not like he's going to play special teams.
.
Actually, read in the NYDN this A.M., he has played
some safety and some in the slot.
Yeah, if that was Pat Leonard's article, I'm not so sure he's correct. After Hall was not re-signed by the Bengals, there was some talk about about bringing him back as a Safety, but I don't believe he'd ever played the position in Cincinnati, except, possibly in an emergency situation. Regardless, so far he's been lining up in the slot for us, and that's where I figure he'll stay...unless "destiny takes a hand."
and how smart "they" are. But something 1s wacky. A team with perceived need at OL and two pro bowl type corners passes Tunsil and takes Apple.
Now haveing filled the c.b. pantry they spend money on a CB.
Next, I suspect we'll hear that they traded Eli for a cornerback
many on this site have with Cooper Taylor is just weird.
The guy was a 5th round pick with good measurables, but has battled thru heart disorders and injuries his entire football career. He has barely sniffed the field in the NFL during any of his regular seasons, and has been a healthy scratch probably as many times as he has gotten a game jersey. And last season he went from de facto starter before game 1 to 3rd string in a matter of days, and then later cut altogether. All this, on a team that has been devoid of Safety talent for years.
Giant fans - I implore you...
RE: Man, I know we all love the Giants in our own way. But the obsession
many on this site have with Cooper Taylor is just weird.
The guy was a 5th round pick with good measurables, but has battled thru heart disorders and injuries his entire football career. He has barely sniffed the field in the NFL during any of his regular seasons, and has been a healthy scratch probably as many times as he has gotten a game jersey. And last season he went from de facto starter before game 1 to 3rd string in a matter of days, and then later cut altogether. All this, on a team that has been devoid of Safety talent for years.
Giant fans - I implore you...
Everyone loves the under-dog, the guy who seems to have the tools but hasn't been able to put together a healthy season. One solid season at FS could make him a worthy pick regardless of the first 3 being an injury mess.
Cooper Taylor has flashed when healthy. If he stays healthy through this camp and displays a thorough knowledge of Spags defense how can he not make the team? This assumes we carry 5 safeties and all play specials.
that just ain't gonna happen. And even if Taylor does make the 53-man roster somehow, the chances that he will actually contribute on gameday seem almost astronomical. But lets keep the Cooper Taylor threads going for a few more weeks.
BTW - I really would be happy for anybody to say "I told you so about Cooper Taylor..."
that just ain't gonna happen. And even if Taylor does make the 53-man roster somehow, the chances that he will actually contribute on gameday seem almost astronomical. But lets keep the Cooper Taylor threads going for a few more weeks.
BTW - I really would be happy for anybody to say "I told you so about Cooper Taylor..."
Pat Traina from Inside Football made a remark in the days before camp started to maybe "not count on Cooper Taylor..." or words to that effect for a reason. I just want our best 53 out there on opening day, healthy and ready.
If Cooper Taylor displays skills and does well in pre-season games, his knowledge of the defense from last year could make him a part-time safety at least. I wouldn't doubt it if the safeties rotate a bit with N. Behre or Cooper Taylor the nickel LB/S hybrid at times.
Giants should stop delaying the inevitable and move Berhe in behind Collins which would solidy the in-the-box depth.
Assuming he has not lost speed/quickness, Jackson has that nice ability to cover even WRs. I believe it will come down to a battle of football brains (Thompson) versus range and coverage ability (Jackson) for the starting role. Mykele is the wild card. Cooper is probably now a wrong place, wrong time situation.
Bob you called it and I think it's already happened according to some of the beats... 1st team Collins (SS) D. tThompson (FS). 2nd team Berhe (ss) and M. Thompson (fs).
I thought B Jackson's best bet was nickel corner. Don't think that's happening now. M Thompson is my bet here. C Taylor, I don't see it. 4th year now, come on. Time to move on. Let's set the bar a bit higher.
The most important thing is that Landon Collins succeed. He's taking all the 1st team snaps at SS, (I'm guessing); but that's all we hear, no details as to how good/bad he's looking.
What I don't want to see again is enemy TEs cutting across his face, then him trailing behind, not ever being able to catch up to make a play on the ball.
I think that's the real reason the Giants put up with Taylor's never-ending problems. (Collins was a terrific box safety at Alabama, as he is here), but yet to prove that he can be more.
The Giants liked in the draft or a vet cut in the last week they like which will move one of these players off the roster
There was a safety the Giants liked in the draft - the guy they drafted, Darian Thompson.
As for a veteran, if they didn't sign one when free agency began, when they had ample opportunity (and the money) to do so, why would they do it now? Did they even bring a UFA Safety in for a visit? I don't think they did. Seems to me that the Giants are content to roll the dice with their young Safeties, as there is quite a bit of talent in that group. What they need is good health and as many reps as possible.
The most important thing is that Landon Collins succeed. He's taking all the 1st team snaps at SS, (I'm guessing); but that's all we hear, no details as to how good/bad he's looking.
What I don't want to see again is enemy TEs cutting across his face, then him trailing behind, not ever being able to catch up to make a play on the ball.
I think that's the real reason the Giants put up with Taylor's never-ending problems. (Collins was a terrific box safety at Alabama, as he is here), but yet to prove that he can be more.
SS L. Collins was what all of "21" when we drafted him? He was forced to start at safety for us due to injuries. He was considered more of an "in the box" safety when drafted but his 4.48 speed would have you believe he could potentially develop as a centerfielder type FS. At least that is what I think.
Poor Landon Collins had to learn "on the job" and we had to bring in veterans to "lead the way" cause our rookie crop was damaged by injuries to N. Behre, M. Thompson, and B. Jackson. If these three had not been hurt we'd have had a much different season but alas it was not to be so why review it.
I look for Landon Collins to improve in pass coverage but I don't think he'll ever be a "star" cover guy. The man can tackle, hit and chase tough and he'll lead the team in tackles, watch.
As for Cooper Taylor, you can see flashes of talent: big and fast and smart. But does he have the instincts and the ability to finally stay healthy? I personally haven't seen enough to know, only the coaches do. If I had to guess, I think he makes it to the final round of cuts but doesn't make the team.
SS: L. Collins, N. Behre
FS: D. Thompson, M. Thompson
PS: B. Jackson, Currie
I wouldn't be shocked if a team desperate for a fourth safety signs Cooper Taylor hoping he is better than his cut grade the Giants gave him. I don't believe Cooper is eligible for the PS anymore but I'm not sure.
Jackson and Behre were drafted the same year and Behre has at least one year of real NFL games.
Taylor drafted a year before Jackson has now more than a year of experience in real NFL games.
Collins has one year of NFL experience......Berhe and Taylor don't.....
As for a vet being added, it could happen......another team drafts a guy they are high on and he plays well in preseason, making a cap hit out of a safety.....everyone seems to forget Berhe was lost for a knee, and then a calf.....Jackson has had 2 knee injuries? Taylor adds a sport hernia to his list of injuries.....Thompson coming off an achilles, was a 7th rounder, that probably could have been had as an UDFA.....
So Reese is putting all his eggs in one basket on Darian.....you have to go all the way back to Tuck, to find a 3rd rounder that started......he will be the starter, mainly because, there is no one else......and Reese may finally get lucky, and finally hit on a third rounder.....I for one, hope he has....it's almost imperative that he plays well at safety, because we have no one else.....he is a key piece to this defense....
Mykkele Thompson was drafted in the 5th round, not the 7th.
And while most 3rd round picks probably don't start right from the get-go (certainly not on the Giants), there are always exceptions to the rule, and Darian Thompson appears to be one of them.
While this is but one writer's opinion which I just read only last night, B. Jackson will likely stick at S / CB / ST's (punt gunner) but Cooper Taylor will not. But I've read other observers who don't think much of either as well. I think we'll know a LOT more in the practices AFTER the first pre-season game, when the depth charts start to become more apparent based on play time with #1's and #2's and use (specials).
Giants' Cooper Taylor hopes 'crazy, wild ride' ends with roster spot - ( New Window )
In my mind, that means potentially 4 TE's; 5 safeties, 5 CB's, 6 LB's (or maybe just five....), etc.
I believe in experience and right now the guy with the most playing experience at safety is 2ND YEAR MAN L. Collins - 2nd year!!!! 4th year Cooper Taylor is next up in terms of just time in camps, off-seasons, around NFL football.
I would not be shocked by ANY opening day lineup at free safety. I think D. Thompson is being pushed to be the #1 because of his "potential" but would anyone be surprised if 3rd year man Nat Behre, 2nd year man Mykele Thompson, 4th year man Cooper Taylor or 3rd year man B. Jackson started the season at FS?
Nothing would shock me right now. May the best man win. But I do believe the SS will be L. Collins.
It's obvious that you are finally coming around to my way of thinking....
It's totally amazing to me, the lack of experience we have at both safety positions...
Assuming he has not lost speed/quickness, Jackson has that nice ability to cover even WRs. I believe it will come down to a battle of football brains (Thompson) versus range and coverage ability (Jackson) for the starting role. Mykele is the wild card. Cooper is probably now a wrong place, wrong time situation.
This tells you everything you need to know about how this defensive coaching staff sees Taylor....
Why? He's never played Safety before, and it's not like he's going to play special teams.
This tells you everything you need to know about how this defensive coaching staff sees Taylor....
Exactly. Sounds silly to even say he was "set" to start in the beginning.
If we keep five safeties:
SS L. Collins, N. Behre
FS D. Thompson, M. Thompson, C. Taylor ???
Don't know why, but I've been rooting for Cooper since he was drafted (maybe because he has a Herzlich like story).
Last year M. Thompson beat him out in OTAs and training camp for 1st team reps in a straight up competition for a very open roster spot. Remember Jackson only got his opportunity because M. Thompson got hurt first in the 1st preseason game in which he started. Jackson then went on to get hurt in the 2nd game.
This year D. Thompson and M. Thompson have beaten him out for 1st team reps. M. Thompson has beaten him out for 2nd team reps (just going by camp tweets).
Jackson and Behre were drafted the same year and Behre has at least one year of real NFL games.
Taylor drafted a year before Jackson has now more than a year of experience in real NFL games.
Despite the fact that Jackson was already beaten out by McBride, Hosley and a guy on another team's roster his rookie year for a corner spot.
I can see why he is forgettable. Everyone keeps passing him.
I would concur, keep Berhe for ST's and to back up Collins.
Apparently they REALLY like Thompson, he is getting all
the reps.
If he struggles they should consider moving DRC to FS, thompson fills the hybrid 3rd safety/lbr role, apple and jenkins on the outside with hall in the slot. Involves some juggling around but the defense is going to suck if the safeties are giving up deep balls.
Quote:
works against signing 5 safeties.
Why? He's never played Safety before, and it's not like he's going to play special teams.
Actually, read in the NYDN this A.M., he has played
some safety and some in the slot.
...as a walking, talking medicine cabinet.
He performed very well as an Ace Bandage.
Quote:
In comment 13059745 Ira said:
Quote:
works against signing 5 safeties.
Why? He's never played Safety before, and it's not like he's going to play special teams.
.
Actually, read in the NYDN this A.M., he has played
some safety and some in the slot.
Yeah, if that was Pat Leonard's article, I'm not so sure he's correct. After Hall was not re-signed by the Bengals, there was some talk about about bringing him back as a Safety, but I don't believe he'd ever played the position in Cincinnati, except, possibly in an emergency situation. Regardless, so far he's been lining up in the slot for us, and that's where I figure he'll stay...unless "destiny takes a hand."
Now haveing filled the c.b. pantry they spend money on a CB.
Next, I suspect we'll hear that they traded Eli for a cornerback
No...
You're...
Not...
Yet...
The guy was a 5th round pick with good measurables, but has battled thru heart disorders and injuries his entire football career. He has barely sniffed the field in the NFL during any of his regular seasons, and has been a healthy scratch probably as many times as he has gotten a game jersey. And last season he went from de facto starter before game 1 to 3rd string in a matter of days, and then later cut altogether. All this, on a team that has been devoid of Safety talent for years.
Giant fans - I implore you...
The guy was a 5th round pick with good measurables, but has battled thru heart disorders and injuries his entire football career. He has barely sniffed the field in the NFL during any of his regular seasons, and has been a healthy scratch probably as many times as he has gotten a game jersey. And last season he went from de facto starter before game 1 to 3rd string in a matter of days, and then later cut altogether. All this, on a team that has been devoid of Safety talent for years.
Giant fans - I implore you...
Cooper Taylor has flashed when healthy. If he stays healthy through this camp and displays a thorough knowledge of Spags defense how can he not make the team? This assumes we carry 5 safeties and all play specials.
BTW - I really would be happy for anybody to say "I told you so about Cooper Taylor..."
BTW - I really would be happy for anybody to say "I told you so about Cooper Taylor..."
If Cooper Taylor displays skills and does well in pre-season games, his knowledge of the defense from last year could make him a part-time safety at least. I wouldn't doubt it if the safeties rotate a bit with N. Behre or Cooper Taylor the nickel LB/S hybrid at times.
Assuming he has not lost speed/quickness, Jackson has that nice ability to cover even WRs. I believe it will come down to a battle of football brains (Thompson) versus range and coverage ability (Jackson) for the starting role. Mykele is the wild card. Cooper is probably now a wrong place, wrong time situation.
Bob you called it and I think it's already happened according to some of the beats... 1st team Collins (SS) D. tThompson (FS). 2nd team Berhe (ss) and M. Thompson (fs).
It's obvious that you are finally coming around to my way of thinking....
It's totally amazing to me, the lack of experience we have at both safety positions...
Is it really that "amazing"? Have you heard of Kenny Phillips & Chad Jones? Do I really need to solve this mystery for you?
The most important thing is that Landon Collins succeed. He's taking all the 1st team snaps at SS, (I'm guessing); but that's all we hear, no details as to how good/bad he's looking.
What I don't want to see again is enemy TEs cutting across his face, then him trailing behind, not ever being able to catch up to make a play on the ball.
I think that's the real reason the Giants put up with Taylor's never-ending problems. (Collins was a terrific box safety at Alabama, as he is here), but yet to prove that he can be more.
There was a safety the Giants liked in the draft - the guy they drafted, Darian Thompson.
As for a veteran, if they didn't sign one when free agency began, when they had ample opportunity (and the money) to do so, why would they do it now? Did they even bring a UFA Safety in for a visit? I don't think they did. Seems to me that the Giants are content to roll the dice with their young Safeties, as there is quite a bit of talent in that group. What they need is good health and as many reps as possible.
The most important thing is that Landon Collins succeed. He's taking all the 1st team snaps at SS, (I'm guessing); but that's all we hear, no details as to how good/bad he's looking.
What I don't want to see again is enemy TEs cutting across his face, then him trailing behind, not ever being able to catch up to make a play on the ball.
I think that's the real reason the Giants put up with Taylor's never-ending problems. (Collins was a terrific box safety at Alabama, as he is here), but yet to prove that he can be more.
Poor Landon Collins had to learn "on the job" and we had to bring in veterans to "lead the way" cause our rookie crop was damaged by injuries to N. Behre, M. Thompson, and B. Jackson. If these three had not been hurt we'd have had a much different season but alas it was not to be so why review it.
I look for Landon Collins to improve in pass coverage but I don't think he'll ever be a "star" cover guy. The man can tackle, hit and chase tough and he'll lead the team in tackles, watch.
As for Cooper Taylor, you can see flashes of talent: big and fast and smart. But does he have the instincts and the ability to finally stay healthy? I personally haven't seen enough to know, only the coaches do. If I had to guess, I think he makes it to the final round of cuts but doesn't make the team.
SS: L. Collins, N. Behre
FS: D. Thompson, M. Thompson
PS: B. Jackson, Currie
I wouldn't be shocked if a team desperate for a fourth safety signs Cooper Taylor hoping he is better than his cut grade the Giants gave him. I don't believe Cooper is eligible for the PS anymore but I'm not sure.
Taylor drafted a year before Jackson has now more than a year of experience in real NFL games.
Collins has one year of NFL experience......Berhe and Taylor don't.....
As for a vet being added, it could happen......another team drafts a guy they are high on and he plays well in preseason, making a cap hit out of a safety.....everyone seems to forget Berhe was lost for a knee, and then a calf.....Jackson has had 2 knee injuries? Taylor adds a sport hernia to his list of injuries.....Thompson coming off an achilles, was a 7th rounder, that probably could have been had as an UDFA.....
So Reese is putting all his eggs in one basket on Darian.....you have to go all the way back to Tuck, to find a 3rd rounder that started......he will be the starter, mainly because, there is no one else......and Reese may finally get lucky, and finally hit on a third rounder.....I for one, hope he has....it's almost imperative that he plays well at safety, because we have no one else.....he is a key piece to this defense....
So what? I couldn't care less about what "many" thought.
Best post about these 2 yet. Sayonara
Quote:
....
Best post about these 2 yet. Sayonara
;-)