championship appearances(1 title) from 1956(my first year) to and including 1963 and THEN having to endure 1964-1978, was a very depressing and painful experience..Very..
It was excruciating to read what many of us witnessed first hand; what a miserably run organization during those years. But you give me a new sense of the financial and territorial pressures that Wellington experienced during that long stretch.
the author forgot the most colorful defensive lineman that the giants traded to the Rams and than became part of the FEARSOME FOURSOME.
ROSY GRIER was a singer, defensive tackle and also subdued the killer of Robert Kennedy .
Those years were tough to be a GIANTS fan. It reminds me of a freezing winter's day in 1987, when garbage was swirling around GIANTS Stadium and me and my dad just witnessed live the destruction of the Redskins and the crowning of the NFC champions. We were so ecstatic after so many years of shit football. I'm so thankful I could share that moment with my dad and so many happy Giant fans
with my father. It was not easy. Saw it all. Shea, Yale Bowl, then Giants stadium, the original Miracle at the Meadowlands game. All of the pain like scars still there underneath all of the good things that have happened since George Young took over.
Didn't read it yet but I watched the Giants during that span Â
and even though there were some horrid seasons, many which were both frustrating and disappointing those were the Giants of my youth and the team I feel in love with. The NFL was a great game which hadn't been overly tinker with at that point and regardless of the losses I will always have fond memories of those years watching the team with my father. And going to games at the Yale Bowl.
My Dad (up until had been a life long Giants fan) abandon the Giants and adopted the Redskins as his team (at the time it was the US Army's team and he was a young Major)
You are on the verge on completing a multi volume treatise on the history of Giants football and we are all richer for it. :-)
As to Tarkenton:
The Giants were awarded the right to select first for purposes of drafting a quarterback in either the 1967 or 1968 drafts or they could trade that right for a quarterback.
Sherman traveled to Gainesville, Florida to visit with Spurrier during the Giants bye week in 1966. The Giants also scouted SD State's Don Horn and UCLA's Gary Beban. Strangely, they spent little time on Purdue's Bob Griese.
The details of the agreement pretty much locked the Giants in to trading for a quarterback. Drafting second behind New Orleans meant that the Giants essentially had their pick of Spurrier or Griese in 1967, once the Saints traded that pick to Baltimore the Giants would in effect have the right to draft the best QB.
If the Giants decided to draft say George Webster or Floyd Little, the 1968 draft class at QB wasn't very promising. So moving to the top of the draft in 1968 had little worth.
But the top overall pick in the draft to offer was valuable trade chip to have, so whether it was Tarkenton or as was rumored earlier John Brodie, the Giants were going to get a veteran.
In doing so however, the leagues worst defense would get little help. The Giants didn't draft until the fourth round of the 1967 draft and only one draft choice LCB Scott Eaton would make the team.
the JETS I liked. The Giants had so many bad years that nobody was really "into them" on my block. The kids liked the Jets more so I went along.
In 1981, the Sack Exchange was in town with Joe Klecko, Mark Gastineau, Marty Lyons and Abdul Salaam - an all-time great DL that had Lance Mehl at LB too.
But 1981 also brought Lawrence Taylor and his heroics. Little by little, I became a convert. By 1985, I loved the Giants a shade more than the Jets. 1986 was our year with a SB win but I only caught the first half as I was in the Army by then and had duty.
I pray when Eli retires we have a worthy QB on the roster. I would NOT be surprised if the Giants picked a QB in round 1 in any of the next 3 years regardless of our draft position. You ain't winning in a passing league without a bonafide QB.
Go Giants! And Go Jets, I still have a little bit of love for you guys too.
These were my coming of age teams with the Giants Â
starting in the late 1960's/1970 with Spider and Ron Johnson (who was definitely much better than Jacobs). My dad had season tickets when the Meadowlands opened in 1976 and I still have the opening day media guide. The game when they were 0-9 and beat the Skins 12-9 for their first win was the loudest game I have ever attended. The stadium was shaking when Steinke picked off Theesman in the end zone. Then of course came The Fumble, still an amazingly bad play even now.
Deliverance and at last a return to the playoffs came with the man who was both NFL defensive rookie of the year and NFL defensive player of the year in 1981, no?
RE: What was so great about 1979 (6-10) and 1980 (4-12) Â
Deliverance and at last a return to the playoffs came with the man who was both NFL defensive rookie of the year and NFL defensive player of the year in 1981, no?
LT gave the Giants defense hope and an "attack" attitude. He changed the way the game was played. Ask any DC from the era, especially ask coach Gibbs of Redskins.
I must extend my own gratitude for Eric, who does a great job editing for me.
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
My youth. Watching games on B&W TV with my dad. Wanting just a little bit of hope.
When the Giants finally started winning, I almost didn't believe it. The first Superbowl win was something I didn't think I would ever see. Perkins and Parcells will always be heroes to me for turning the mess that was the Giants around.
the author forgot the most colorful defensive lineman that the giants traded to the Rams and than became part of the FEARSOME FOURSOME.
ROSY GRIER was a singer, defensive tackle and also subdued the killer of Robert Kennedy .
I didn't forget, the 1962 trade for John LoVetere is mentioned in there.
That deal didn't hurt the Giants nearly as much as the 1963 Huff & Modzelewski's trades did though. The Giants (coaches & teammates) had grown tired of Grier's inconsistency and chronic weight issues. LoVetere had a good year in 1963 but hurt his knee in 1964 and wasn't the same afterward.
I also think Grier's role in the Fearsome Foursome is greatly overrated. He just happened to arrive while Deacon Jones and Merlin Olsen were ascending.
It was excruciating to read what many of us witnessed first hand; what a miserably run organization during those years. But you give me a new sense of the financial and territorial pressures that Wellington experienced during that long stretch.
This article was a departure from my usual. Up until this one my main focus was players, football's evolution, exploring significant games and great seasons, but those types of things were secondary to what was happening behind the scenes for this period. It took a lot more research than usual for me to uncover the facts, and I had to try to balance the two sides for the issues that began in the 1970's with the two Maras.
It only gets worse from here. The two month period spanning the end of the 1978 season to the hiring of George Young is absolutely gruesome.
Look at drafts from 70-75. These truly might have been some of the worst in history
1970: 1st - J. Files, no 2nd or 3rd,
1971: 1- R. Thompson, 2-W. Walton, 3-R. Hornsby,
1972: 2 1st rd picks E. Small & L. Jacobson (combined 23 starts) J. Mendenhall. Other 3rd rd pick - 0 games
1973: B. Van Pelt. R. Glover in 3rd lasted 1 yr in NY
1974: 1-J. Hicks, 2- T. Mullen, 3- R. Dvorak
1975: No 1st, 2- Al. Simpson, 3-D. Buggs
Some got hurt, but most were just bad picks. Just awful
I was seven. My older brother, sister, mom and me "chipped in" to buy my dad a new lazy boy chair for father's day. We had to buy him a new one for his birthday in January because he had pounded on the arm of the chair yelling at the Giants so much that season that it had broke.
I must extend my own gratitude for Eric, who does a great job editing for me.
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
You became a REAL fan in '79 because somehow you KNEW, with a new and competent regime in place, we were going places..😎
Look at drafts from 70-75. These truly might have been some of the worst in history
1970: 1st - J. Files, no 2nd or 3rd,
1971: 1- R. Thompson, 2-W. Walton, 3-R. Hornsby,
1972: 2 1st rd picks E. Small & L. Jacobson (combined 23 starts) J. Mendenhall. Other 3rd rd pick - 0 games
1973: B. Van Pelt. R. Glover in 3rd lasted 1 yr in NY
1974: 1-J. Hicks, 2- T. Mullen, 3- R. Dvorak
1975: No 1st, 2- Al. Simpson, 3-D. Buggs
Some got hurt, but most were just bad picks. Just awful
We were able to procure some talent, but far from enough:
Ron Hornsby was a better than decent LB imo, Mendenhall was solid, Files was very good but opted to join the ministry after a few years, Van Pelt was terrific, John Hicks was rather solid..The Thompson and Small picks were ridiculous reaches..
I must extend my own gratitude for Eric, who does a great job editing for me.
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
You became a REAL fan in '79 because somehow you KNEW, with a new and competent regime in place, we were going places..😎
But it was like watching the first half of a movie. I need part 2 - The Redemption. Even though I know all the spoilers, I need to read part 2 because it heals the wounds of part 1.
Silly. Larry was being kind in describing the depths of the disfunction, the cliques within the team, the constant tampering with Lombardi, the Cult of Tucker, Welly's interventions with the head coach after getting suggestions from his drinking buddies in the sporting press, the mis-evaluations of players . . .
Don't think the last 3 years were anything like the clown car the Giants were in the 60's and 70's.
But it was like watching the first half of a movie. I need part 2 - The Redemption. Even though I know all the spoilers, I need to read part 2 because it heals the wounds of part 1.
painful that era was. Tarkenton gagging against the Rams was one of my first real memories of the Giants. I was never a big fan of his game. Good QB for a bad team, which a guess fit the bill for the Giants.
The Fumble was a day I will never forget. I was 14 at the time, I really thought my father would have a stroke or a heart attack the way he was yelling at the TV. But it set the forces in motion for a quarter century of success.
Well finally had the time to go back and read the article Â
Great job! As I mentioned in my first post having been a fan through all those years this really brought back some memories, both painful and good ones. Thanks for the effort.
That 1970 season ending loss to the Rams still is my most disappointing loss. I can remember than pain like it was yesterday. By this point my father who had always been a die hard Giants fan was a couple season into taking a break from watching them. He couldn't take watching what they had become. So I was in our basement/family room watching it alone. The frustrations of that loss was unbearable, the angriest I had ever been at a loss and out of frustration pounded on the back of the sofa and ended up hurting my hand a little and thinking how I was never going to react to a loss like that ever again. I have never thrown, broken or hit anything after a sporting loss ever again.
Still was the hardest loss in over fifty years of following the team.
Also brought back the sting of the Fred Dryer trade. I was so angry and disappointed when he was traded to the Rams. He was one of my favorites and one of only a handful of real bright spots I latched onto as a young fan.
Going to the games at the Yale Bowl was also some good memories even though those teams were painfully bad.
1964-1978 may have been painful but these were the teams I fell in love with as a boy and will always be some of my fondest memories regardless of the disappointments that went along with it. I lived and died with each win and loss and IMO there is something about living thought that as a fan that makes all the success that came afterwards that much sweeter.
so true Steve. Dryer actually was traded to the Pats first, then the Â
My dad took the die hard route. He would NEVER miss a game. The running family joke was his annual opening day speech how this year he "wasn't going to get aggravated" and would just turn it off. Never happened. But he would tell me stories of how great they were in the '50s and early '60s. He was born in 1930, actually saw Mel Hein play. He was his favorite Giant, was hooked ever since.
I don't remember the Pats part of it for some reason so I learned something.
Yeah my dad has long since returned to watching them, but he did take a considerable break. It was simply too hard on him. I still will occasionally kid with him how I stuck with them the entire time while he didn't. Probably why to this day I still almost enjoy watching games alone the best.
RE: so true Steve. Dryer actually was traded to the Pats first, then the Â
Dryer had become a major prima-donna, malcontent and locker room lawyer. He was the one who went to Larry Merchant at the New York Post as the source of the infamous "Maramania" articles - though at the time he was an "unnamed source" and Fran Tarkenton ended up taking the heat for them, though he had nothing to do with them. I tried very hard to get a copy of those to use in this article, but could only locate second-hand references.
Anyway, Dryer refused to report to the Patriots, who in turn dealt him to the Rams.
RE: RE: so true Steve. Dryer actually was traded to the Pats first, then the Â
Dryer had become a major prima-donna, malcontent and locker room lawyer. He was the one who went to Larry Merchant at the New York Post as the source of the infamous "Maramania" articles - though at the time he was an "unnamed source" and Fran Tarkenton ended up taking the heat for them, though he had nothing to do with them. I tried very hard to get a copy of those to use in this article, but could only locate second-hand references.
Anyway, Dryer refused to report to the Patriots, who in turn dealt him to the Rams.
Thanks Larry. Above and beyond the call as always
I lay this entire period at the doorstep of Wellington Mara Â
who was out of his depth as an owner. He insisted on making player selection decisions himself, often picking players out of sports magazines and contacts that he made over the years. He did this even after hiring Robustelli. During the Robustelli era, several generals managers reported that they would call the Giants front office and were not able to get an answer until Wellington had been consulted. Recall the degree to which Wellington resisted turning football decisions over to someone more capable and relented only when his nephew threatened to bring down the entire franchise. Thankfully his son didn't inherit his father's hubris or obstinacy.
RE: I lay this entire period at the doorstep of Wellington Mara Â
who was out of his depth as an owner. He insisted on making player selection decisions himself, often picking players out of sports magazines and contacts that he made over the years. He did this even after hiring Robustelli. During the Robustelli era, several generals managers reported that they would call the Giants front office and were not able to get an answer until Wellington had been consulted. Recall the degree to which Wellington resisted turning football decisions over to someone more capable and relented only when his nephew threatened to bring down the entire franchise. Thankfully his son didn't inherit his father's hubris or obstinacy.
What Well did wrong was take on the business responsibility along with the football side when Jack died. As Larry pointed out, Wellington ran football ops, Jack ran the business side. Wellington's real weakness was that he wasn't suited to run a business.
Injury jinx was even worse in the 1970s than now Â
Larry Jacobson broke his foot, vacuuming his pool I think.
And of course in the later 1970s, Troy Archer.
This is really interesting though. By the 1970s, I was living and working in Florida and Wyoming and was completely out of touch. I had no idea what was going on behind the scenes.
That 1970 season ending loss to the Rams still is my most disappointing loss. I can remember than pain like it was yesterday. By this point my father who had always been a die hard Giants fan was a couple season into taking a break from watching them. He couldn't take watching what they had become. So I was in our basement/family room watching it alone.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and my memory may be fuzzy since I was only 10 years old at the time, but wasn't that season ending Rams game on radio only since it was a home game and blacked out in NY/NJ by the TV rules at the time? For some reason I remember all of us kids in the neighborhood listening to the first half on the radio and then going outside to play football instead of listening to the second half.
Or were you living outside the NYC area at that time?
That 1970 season ending loss to the Rams still is my most disappointing loss. I can remember than pain like it was yesterday. By this point my father who had always been a die hard Giants fan was a couple season into taking a break from watching them. He couldn't take watching what they had become. So I was in our basement/family room watching it alone.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and my memory may be fuzzy since I was only 10 years old at the time, but wasn't that season ending Rams game on radio only since it was a home game and blacked out in NY/NJ by the TV rules at the time? For some reason I remember all of us kids in the neighborhood listening to the first half on the radio and then going outside to play football instead of listening to the second half.
Or were you living outside the NYC area at that time?
Well I'm not much older than you so maybe my memory is blurred. I know I don't have the same recall I used to. At that point we moved from the Bronx to the suburbs but we still had the blackouts. I could have sworn I watched the game but if it was blacked out I must have been listening to it on the radio. I always did whichever was available. I had a radio downstairs where the TV was and I sat in the same room on the same sofa whether I was watching or listening to the game so the memory and disappointment are still vivid but I guess I blurred in my mind games I watched and games I listened to. I always immersed myself in the radio call and imagined each play in my minds eye as it was called. I guess I did a good job at it LOL.
Regardless still my most disappointing loss.
Thanks for the correction though. I had a real serious concussion some years back now and ever since then I have more trouble remembering some specific details as I age than I used to. So while I remember the game, the loss, and the disappointment, I don't remember as much of the little things about it anymore.
RE: I lay this entire period at the doorstep of Wellington Mara Â
who was out of his depth as an owner. He insisted on making player selection decisions himself, often picking players out of sports magazines and contacts that he made over the years. He did this even after hiring Robustelli. During the Robustelli era, several generals managers reported that they would call the Giants front office and were not able to get an answer until Wellington had been consulted. Recall the degree to which Wellington resisted turning football decisions over to someone more capable and relented only when his nephew threatened to bring down the entire franchise. Thankfully his son didn't inherit his father's hubris or obstinacy.
I agree. Wellington Mara was still stuck in the old ways of doing things while the rest of the league moved ahead. Tim Mara should be in the Ring of Honor for standing up to Wellington and forcing change.
RE: I lay this entire period at the doorstep of Wellington Mara Â
who was out of his depth as an owner. He insisted on making player selection decisions himself, often picking players out of sports magazines and contacts that he made over the years. He did this even after hiring Robustelli. During the Robustelli era, several generals managers reported that they would call the Giants front office and were not able to get an answer until Wellington had been consulted. Recall the degree to which Wellington resisted turning football decisions over to someone more capable and relented only when his nephew threatened to bring down the entire franchise. Thankfully his son didn't inherit his father's hubris or obstinacy.
I don't think it was hubris at all. I think Wellington was comfortable with the way things had been run in the 1930's through 1950's - which was very successful - and was very slow and maybe even reluctant to a point to change.
Robustelli desperately wanted to modernize the Giants, and was able to do so structurally, but wasn't able to clean house and start completely over, due to Wellington's loyalty to longtime employees who fell under the "Giants Family" umbrella just as players do. This is where you referenced Wellington being consulted on everything. He didn't ask for that, and it was a great strain on him, and it frustrated the hell out of Robustelli.
Tim Mara was right to challenge Wellington's authority, it needed to happen. But his tactics certainly can be questioned. He couldn't done it in a better, more productive way that didn't end up in an embarrassing public feud that needed to be intervened my the commissioner.
"He could've done it in a better, more productive way that didn't end up in an embarrassing public feud that needed to be intervened by the commissioner."
I like several of the posters grew up in this era, watching each game like it was life or death (mostly death). I guess time heals all wounds as I did enjoy reliving the on field play. I was not as familiar with your description of the off field maneuvering. It provided me valuable context.
I can still remember the Fumble like it was yesterday, but it does show us that in football, as well as life, things have to reach bottom before getting better. Although in New York Giant Football it took three years more and a guy whose initials are LT.
Robustelli actually did a much better job than he gets credit for. He Â
Those years were tough, but I don't think you build character as a true fan unless you go through that. It makes the good times all the sweeter. My dad passed away when I was 5, so I never got to share my sports love with him. For me it wad my older brother. We sat through those years, often watching on tv, sometimes getting to go late in the season when they were out of it and friends wanted to get rid of tickets. It was so sweet watching the 86 superbowl together as we both went to college in the same area for that year (he is 3 years older). In fact with him living in Israel now I kind of miss those days in the 70's watching them together. Though my 11 year od daughter is a spirts nut like me and we have a blast watching together.
RE: Robustelli actually did a much better job than he gets credit for. He Â
I am afraid to look!
Or, the teams that make me wanna smack the young, entitled, Giants fans of today in their kissers.
Outside of The 49ers, New England,maybe: Colts, the Ravens, the Cowboys.
What say you guys?
Outside of The 49ers, New England,maybe: Colts, the Ravens, the Cowboys.
What say you guys?
Great stuff per usual Larry
ROSY GRIER was a singer, defensive tackle and also subdued the killer of Robert Kennedy .
John LoVetere made the Pro Bowl in 1963 but suffered a severe knee injury in 1964 that essentially ended his career.
The Giants also received a fourth round draft pick from LA and drafted a great FB from Ohio State named Matt Snell. Snell signed with the Jets.
If LoVetere had remained healthy and the Giants had signed Snell then the Grier trade would have been regarded with greater favor.
The Giants made many, many horrendous moves during that era but at least a few had the potential to succeed.
As to Tarkenton:
The Giants were awarded the right to select first for purposes of drafting a quarterback in either the 1967 or 1968 drafts or they could trade that right for a quarterback.
Sherman traveled to Gainesville, Florida to visit with Spurrier during the Giants bye week in 1966. The Giants also scouted SD State's Don Horn and UCLA's Gary Beban. Strangely, they spent little time on Purdue's Bob Griese.
The details of the agreement pretty much locked the Giants in to trading for a quarterback. Drafting second behind New Orleans meant that the Giants essentially had their pick of Spurrier or Griese in 1967, once the Saints traded that pick to Baltimore the Giants would in effect have the right to draft the best QB.
If the Giants decided to draft say George Webster or Floyd Little, the 1968 draft class at QB wasn't very promising. So moving to the top of the draft in 1968 had little worth.
But the top overall pick in the draft to offer was valuable trade chip to have, so whether it was Tarkenton or as was rumored earlier John Brodie, the Giants were going to get a veteran.
In doing so however, the leagues worst defense would get little help. The Giants didn't draft until the fourth round of the 1967 draft and only one draft choice LCB Scott Eaton would make the team.
In 1981, the Sack Exchange was in town with Joe Klecko, Mark Gastineau, Marty Lyons and Abdul Salaam - an all-time great DL that had Lance Mehl at LB too.
But 1981 also brought Lawrence Taylor and his heroics. Little by little, I became a convert. By 1985, I loved the Giants a shade more than the Jets. 1986 was our year with a SB win but I only caught the first half as I was in the Army by then and had duty.
I pray when Eli retires we have a worthy QB on the roster. I would NOT be surprised if the Giants picked a QB in round 1 in any of the next 3 years regardless of our draft position. You ain't winning in a passing league without a bonafide QB.
Go Giants! And Go Jets, I still have a little bit of love for you guys too.
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
When the Giants finally started winning, I almost didn't believe it. The first Superbowl win was something I didn't think I would ever see. Perkins and Parcells will always be heroes to me for turning the mess that was the Giants around.
ROSY GRIER was a singer, defensive tackle and also subdued the killer of Robert Kennedy .
I didn't forget, the 1962 trade for John LoVetere is mentioned in there.
That deal didn't hurt the Giants nearly as much as the 1963 Huff & Modzelewski's trades did though. The Giants (coaches & teammates) had grown tired of Grier's inconsistency and chronic weight issues. LoVetere had a good year in 1963 but hurt his knee in 1964 and wasn't the same afterward.
I also think Grier's role in the Fearsome Foursome is greatly overrated. He just happened to arrive while Deacon Jones and Merlin Olsen were ascending.
This article was a departure from my usual. Up until this one my main focus was players, football's evolution, exploring significant games and great seasons, but those types of things were secondary to what was happening behind the scenes for this period. It took a lot more research than usual for me to uncover the facts, and I had to try to balance the two sides for the issues that began in the 1970's with the two Maras.
It only gets worse from here. The two month period spanning the end of the 1978 season to the hiring of George Young is absolutely gruesome.
Thanks, you're too kind. Glad you enjoyed it.
1970: 1st - J. Files, no 2nd or 3rd,
1971: 1- R. Thompson, 2-W. Walton, 3-R. Hornsby,
1972: 2 1st rd picks E. Small & L. Jacobson (combined 23 starts) J. Mendenhall. Other 3rd rd pick - 0 games
1973: B. Van Pelt. R. Glover in 3rd lasted 1 yr in NY
1974: 1-J. Hicks, 2- T. Mullen, 3- R. Dvorak
1975: No 1st, 2- Al. Simpson, 3-D. Buggs
Some got hurt, but most were just bad picks. Just awful
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
You became a REAL fan in '79 because somehow you KNEW, with a new and competent regime in place, we were going places..😎
1970: 1st - J. Files, no 2nd or 3rd,
1971: 1- R. Thompson, 2-W. Walton, 3-R. Hornsby,
1972: 2 1st rd picks E. Small & L. Jacobson (combined 23 starts) J. Mendenhall. Other 3rd rd pick - 0 games
1973: B. Van Pelt. R. Glover in 3rd lasted 1 yr in NY
1974: 1-J. Hicks, 2- T. Mullen, 3- R. Dvorak
1975: No 1st, 2- Al. Simpson, 3-D. Buggs
Some got hurt, but most were just bad picks. Just awful
We were able to procure some talent, but far from enough:
Ron Hornsby was a better than decent LB imo, Mendenhall was solid, Files was very good but opted to join the ministry after a few years, Van Pelt was terrific, John Hicks was rather solid..The Thompson and Small picks were ridiculous reaches..
Quote:
I must extend my own gratitude for Eric, who does a great job editing for me.
The best part of writing these articles for me is always the research. I always come away having learned something I never knew before.
This time around I learned a lot. The machinations behind all of the coaching changes, Robustelli's strong desire to be the head coach himself, and how the Csonka trade started off the Wellington-Tim Mara fued.
I grew up in the 1970's and while I'd watch games with my father, I can't really say I understood what football was all about until 1979. That was also the year that I consider myself having become a real fan, where I'd anticipate Sunday afternoon all week and would set aside time to watch every game.
You became a REAL fan in '79 because somehow you KNEW, with a new and competent regime in place, we were going places..😎
Ha! I wish I possessed that kind of foresight!
Don't think the last 3 years were anything like the clown car the Giants were in the 60's and 70's.
No worries, more to come soon.
The Fumble was a day I will never forget. I was 14 at the time, I really thought my father would have a stroke or a heart attack the way he was yelling at the TV. But it set the forces in motion for a quarter century of success.
That 1970 season ending loss to the Rams still is my most disappointing loss. I can remember than pain like it was yesterday. By this point my father who had always been a die hard Giants fan was a couple season into taking a break from watching them. He couldn't take watching what they had become. So I was in our basement/family room watching it alone. The frustrations of that loss was unbearable, the angriest I had ever been at a loss and out of frustration pounded on the back of the sofa and ended up hurting my hand a little and thinking how I was never going to react to a loss like that ever again. I have never thrown, broken or hit anything after a sporting loss ever again.
Still was the hardest loss in over fifty years of following the team.
Also brought back the sting of the Fred Dryer trade. I was so angry and disappointed when he was traded to the Rams. He was one of my favorites and one of only a handful of real bright spots I latched onto as a young fan.
Going to the games at the Yale Bowl was also some good memories even though those teams were painfully bad.
1964-1978 may have been painful but these were the teams I fell in love with as a boy and will always be some of my fondest memories regardless of the disappointments that went along with it. I lived and died with each win and loss and IMO there is something about living thought that as a fan that makes all the success that came afterwards that much sweeter.
My dad took the die hard route. He would NEVER miss a game. The running family joke was his annual opening day speech how this year he "wasn't going to get aggravated" and would just turn it off. Never happened. But he would tell me stories of how great they were in the '50s and early '60s. He was born in 1930, actually saw Mel Hein play. He was his favorite Giant, was hooked ever since.
Yeah my dad has long since returned to watching them, but he did take a considerable break. It was simply too hard on him. I still will occasionally kid with him how I stuck with them the entire time while he didn't. Probably why to this day I still almost enjoy watching games alone the best.
Dryer had become a major prima-donna, malcontent and locker room lawyer. He was the one who went to Larry Merchant at the New York Post as the source of the infamous "Maramania" articles - though at the time he was an "unnamed source" and Fran Tarkenton ended up taking the heat for them, though he had nothing to do with them. I tried very hard to get a copy of those to use in this article, but could only locate second-hand references.
Anyway, Dryer refused to report to the Patriots, who in turn dealt him to the Rams.
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Rams, but I don't recall the circumstances.
Dryer had become a major prima-donna, malcontent and locker room lawyer. He was the one who went to Larry Merchant at the New York Post as the source of the infamous "Maramania" articles - though at the time he was an "unnamed source" and Fran Tarkenton ended up taking the heat for them, though he had nothing to do with them. I tried very hard to get a copy of those to use in this article, but could only locate second-hand references.
Anyway, Dryer refused to report to the Patriots, who in turn dealt him to the Rams.
Thanks Larry. Above and beyond the call as always
What Well did wrong was take on the business responsibility along with the football side when Jack died. As Larry pointed out, Wellington ran football ops, Jack ran the business side. Wellington's real weakness was that he wasn't suited to run a business.
And of course in the later 1970s, Troy Archer.
This is really interesting though. By the 1970s, I was living and working in Florida and Wyoming and was completely out of touch. I had no idea what was going on behind the scenes.
I need to get this book.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and my memory may be fuzzy since I was only 10 years old at the time, but wasn't that season ending Rams game on radio only since it was a home game and blacked out in NY/NJ by the TV rules at the time? For some reason I remember all of us kids in the neighborhood listening to the first half on the radio and then going outside to play football instead of listening to the second half.
Or were you living outside the NYC area at that time?
Fred Dryer to NE 1-31-1972
• 1972 first round pick (#17-Eldridge Small)
• 1972 sixth round pick (#140-Mike Perfetti)
• 1973 second round pick (#30-Greg Pruitt)
The Giants traded the sixth round pick to Atlanta for Dick Enderle G
The Giants traded the 1973 second round pick and a first round pick to Cleveland for Jack Gregory and Freddie Summers
Fred Dryer from NE to LA 4-26-1972
Richard Cash DE
• 1973 first round pick (#11-Sam Cunningham)
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That 1970 season ending loss to the Rams still is my most disappointing loss. I can remember than pain like it was yesterday. By this point my father who had always been a die hard Giants fan was a couple season into taking a break from watching them. He couldn't take watching what they had become. So I was in our basement/family room watching it alone.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and my memory may be fuzzy since I was only 10 years old at the time, but wasn't that season ending Rams game on radio only since it was a home game and blacked out in NY/NJ by the TV rules at the time? For some reason I remember all of us kids in the neighborhood listening to the first half on the radio and then going outside to play football instead of listening to the second half.
Or were you living outside the NYC area at that time?
Well I'm not much older than you so maybe my memory is blurred. I know I don't have the same recall I used to. At that point we moved from the Bronx to the suburbs but we still had the blackouts. I could have sworn I watched the game but if it was blacked out I must have been listening to it on the radio. I always did whichever was available. I had a radio downstairs where the TV was and I sat in the same room on the same sofa whether I was watching or listening to the game so the memory and disappointment are still vivid but I guess I blurred in my mind games I watched and games I listened to. I always immersed myself in the radio call and imagined each play in my minds eye as it was called. I guess I did a good job at it LOL.
Regardless still my most disappointing loss.
Thanks for the correction though. I had a real serious concussion some years back now and ever since then I have more trouble remembering some specific details as I age than I used to. So while I remember the game, the loss, and the disappointment, I don't remember as much of the little things about it anymore.
I agree. Wellington Mara was still stuck in the old ways of doing things while the rest of the league moved ahead. Tim Mara should be in the Ring of Honor for standing up to Wellington and forcing change.
I don't think it was hubris at all. I think Wellington was comfortable with the way things had been run in the 1930's through 1950's - which was very successful - and was very slow and maybe even reluctant to a point to change.
Robustelli desperately wanted to modernize the Giants, and was able to do so structurally, but wasn't able to clean house and start completely over, due to Wellington's loyalty to longtime employees who fell under the "Giants Family" umbrella just as players do. This is where you referenced Wellington being consulted on everything. He didn't ask for that, and it was a great strain on him, and it frustrated the hell out of Robustelli.
Tim Mara was right to challenge Wellington's authority, it needed to happen. But his tactics certainly can be questioned. He couldn't done it in a better, more productive way that didn't end up in an embarrassing public feud that needed to be intervened my the commissioner.
(I need Eric to edit my forum posts too!)
I can still remember the Fumble like it was yesterday, but it does show us that in football, as well as life, things have to reach bottom before getting better. Although in New York Giant Football it took three years more and a guy whose initials are LT.
But that dammed Craig Morton trade........... :-)
But that dammed Craig Morton trade........... :-)
I agree, Victor. And Robustelli would have done more if not hampered by Wellington.
You're welcome!
I know it was a long stretch of bad football, but my goal was to give it some perspective and explore some of the how's and why's it happened.
The next article I'm already working on, continues right where this one left off and I think will offer more perspective.