I guess Cruz can run without collapsing. I don't know what that is suppose to mean or how that even translate to a roster spot but okay.
You can't evaluate WRs or expect them to make plays when the QB is running for his life.
So how does Cruz earn a roster spot even he has been absent for most of training camp and had one short yard reception? I learned nothing from Cruz tonight about whether he is real option on this team going forward. Lewis and King look like they deserve a spot on the roster.
Adams looked like the best blocking TE and actual best option at getting real YAC for a TE on this roster and he got the least amount of reps.
I don't know what to say about the OL.
For all the hate Williams get, please evaluate Jennings play this preseason and compare the two.
Jennings actually caught passes!
I think the giants certainly worked running backs to the outside, it seemed... maybe check downs because of bad pass protection tho.
King I think got himself a roster spot he has done it
all camp and he is damn quick .
I'm probably in the minority here but I like Rainey
over Darqua .
I like what I saw in Sheppard MLB Okwara is a keeper
Wynn had a great game .
The Offensive line got tested and Failed sure Pugh wasn't there but talk about Zero Depth . It could foil the season
The WR's have not gotten enough work especially Cruz .
Was glad to see Davis back in there .
Not too bad on the injury front .
Bottom line is Eli is gonna get hurt if they don't get
some more help .
Jerrel Adams just needs time to develop we need to get
Will Johnson up to snuff I have seen enough of Tye ..
For getting a couple of late scores against 3rd teamers?
Hasn't he actually had a great camp as well. Maybe there is something wrong with the depth chart.
The expectation bar for Cruz has been set so low. If he steps on a football field it is now a huge plus. I don't know man. This whole Cruz thing is weird. After not saying he was on scholarship it really looks like he is on scholarship.
But he's had trouble staying healthy every year, and Hart has looked just awful. They are one injury away from being a bad offensive line to a horrendous offensive line.
I'm repeating the exact same thing I said after last week's game...
they're not running their regular offense. It looks like they're working on things like multiple TE sets and jamming the run into the LOS come hell or high water.
During the Giants first 3 series, 7 of their 13 plays had 2 tight ends or a TE/FB combo. That is NOT the Giants offense of the past 2 seasons. What's worse is they ran the ball on half of the 6 plays with Odell, Cruz, and Sheppard on the field. I know the preseason is for "working on things", but my goodness... why can't they just run their regular stuff???????
Outside of Leon Hall, the 1st team defense was spectacular. Even on the TD, Jenkins had excellent coverage. But back to my first point... Leon Hall did not look good at all. Conversely, Eli Apple looked great. He's still holding, but at least they're subtle and not blatant and obvious. OV and Snacks were terrific. The LBs are still a work in progress.
If Orleans Darkwa's path to the 53 man roster is mostly based on special teams, I counted 3 special teams fuck-ups from him alone.
Another stupid non-starter. The Giants are only going to carry nine offensive linemen. You think they are going to cut their starting five?
Eric I think k he was joking saying the giants will cut extra to get down to 65 then sign 10 ol who were cut to try and find some depth/starters lol
Basically saying oline is our only major hole(I agree)
RE: I'm repeating the exact same thing I said after last week's game...
they're not running their regular offense. It looks like they're working on things like multiple TE sets and jamming the run into the LOS come hell or high water.
During the Giants first 3 series, 7 of their 13 plays had 2 tight ends or a TE/FB combo. That is NOT the Giants offense of the past 2 seasons. What's worse is they ran the ball on half of the 6 plays with Odell, Cruz, and Sheppard on the field. I know the preseason is for "working on things", but my goodness... why can't they just run their regular stuff???????
It's not the offense of the past two years, but TE/FB + TE/TE sets (until they had no other choice but to get away from them in games) were often a hallmark of the Gilbride offense, of which Sullivan came from and ran in his stint as OC in TB.
There were mixed reports in-game on who was calling plays tonight (I haven't checked the post-game comments) and it is only the pre-season, but this type of thing is something to keep an eye on, given how weird hiring him as OC in the first place was.
My only major concern is the offensive line. Even with Pugh this oline is not goid enough. The right side is still weak and Flowers needs to be more consistent. Lets just say the offensive line even plays as good as they did last year, that might not be good enough to get this team to he a playoff contender. They have a good chance this year in this division too. It just surprises me Reese has not done more for a position that is so key, probably the most important position? Smh..
both Lewis and Adams were victims of interferrence, but the refs saw it otherwise. I think if it had been a regular season game, it would have been called.
the Giants would not have wasted so many plays trying to find a running game. Eli would have been flinging the ball downfield.
Wonder if the team saved the phone numbers of Diehl and O'Hara. Not these two literally, but a couple of sturdy vets with a couple of years left in them.
Remember, we won Super Bowl 46 with David Diehl starting at left tackle. He was no Pro Bowl threat, but he was good enough.
In comment 13090508 Thinblueline said:
Quote:
Needs to go.... He Just does not have it... We can't run the ball! Brad wing is a stud... T. King better make this roster, he's a baller...Osawa DE continues to impress... Did I say Nassib needs to go?
Nassib is not going anywhere. That's a non-starter.
Nassib can't go because there is nobody else. He's it in terms of a backup.
Needs to go.... He Just does not have it... We can't run the ball! Brad wing is a stud... T. King better make this roster, he's a baller...Osawa DE continues to impress... Did I say Nassib needs to go?
Nassib is not going anywhere. That's a non-starter.
I WAS making the point that we need OL help, and that, as someone else mentioned, we might be able to get a vet with a year left in the tank that might still be a good run blocker.
If not that, at least someone who might be better than our OL #7, or 8-10.
Nassib's pass is that he actually looked halfway decent in
a few of his regular season performances. If not for those, he would really be on the chopping block. The o-line stinks, but he's missing throws badly... short, long, wide-open guys.
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
They look worse than last year, that's the problem.
Alligator arms. Then gave up on play after INT, choosing to bend over and check out the guy who took him out of the play, instead of trying to chase down ball carrier.
Alligator arms. Then gave up on play after INT, choosing to bend over and check out the guy who took him out of the play, instead of trying to chase down ball carrier.
The way that play was defended, that throw probably shouldn't have been made in the first place. They had a KO shot lined up.
Nobody is asking for the Oline to be amazing and have studs all across the board, just good enough to be consistent. Was the Giants Oline amazing when they had Ohara, Seubert, Snee, and the rest of that group?? No, but they where good enough to get them into the playoffs and contend. That is key.
I mean big time improvement from what I seen. Love the depth on the DL line. Like what I saw from Behre filling in for D. Thompson. Taylor and M. Thompson are making this team.
Okwara continues to impress along with Odi. Spags was able to rotate the 1st team and kept the pressure on Flitz. Nothing exotic either. Very nice showing.
After Apple though the drop off is huge at CB. I'm not sure if Hall is in football shape yet and he looked really concussed. I mean I don't know where I am right now stuff. I hope he goes next week because he needs some reps. I seen enough of Wade myself. If Hall can't go I rather have Jenkins at slot with DRC and Apple on the outside. I really thought Deayon was a possibility but his size is a real issue.
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use
preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
This team was never a top 10 offense. That stat is garbage. After watching the poor performances by our OL the past 3 years I do not see any improvement from this group. After watching 3 preseason games I have no confidence in OL ability to protect and run block.
but did you see the play calling? They were obviously trying to show nothing. Many, many runs on downs which would have been passes during a regular season game. No crossing routes. I think the only complex play they ran was the one deep shot they tried to get to Cruz. Don't get me wrong...I am pissed as hell at Reese for the state of this OL but you are going to see an entirely different game plan against Dallas. Have some faith.
In comment 13090689 Chris L. said:
[quote] but did you see the play calling? They were obviously trying to show nothing.
Of course ... and that'll be a huge advantage with a new Head Coach once the season starts as the opposition DC will have no idea much less our Offensive schemes but also tendencies ... but my problem is with the execution ...
Now maybe we are either taking the show nothing strategy to the extreme by deliberately running plays we are weak on ... like rather than work with the quickness and agility our OLine may have as an advantage ... run plays that work only when they outmuscle their opponent - a talent they don't really have ...
Funny you say that because as I was watching the game I was thinking they look like they are running plays they struggled with during the week. I agree execution was poor and needs lots of improvement but if you look at the play selection it contributed heavily to long down and distance situations.
was painfully deliberate. You could see what was coming from you couch. Jets were overplaying the looks we were showing. Watch the reverse and see how well it worked. They jumped at everything.
A lot of vanilla play calling, lack of adjustment, or just poor coaching gets a chunk of blame for the run game.
also I dont know why people say Darkwa's special teams give him an edge. He was horrendous last night on specials.
JT Thomas showed good speed and movement can see the plus side to him. maybe he puts it together sometime.
Preseason or not, the line looks woefully bad. We didn't have ONE run play that was well blocked. The protection for Eli was horrendous.
I didn't expect this line to ever be great but they were serviceable last year and I figured they might even be able to improve a bit and build on that.. right now, it looks like they took a giant step backwards.
It's a shame too because the defense looks so much better. But it would be our luck for the offense to suddenly go back to being completely non-competitive now that the defense looks ready to help us win football games.
If I'm McAdoo, I'd play the starters for a full quarter in the last preseason game. They need to build on something here. Going into Dallas with the offense looking like this is going to be pretty alarming.
But the game thread seem to indicate that the play calling was run heavy. If that was true it seems that the plan was to work on the run game. Not necessarily a bad plan to work on a problem area in the preseason. Would have been nice to see a little success!
I agree. Its preseason, its time to see what we can do going directly into the Jets (a good running D's strength). Its not a time to gameplan an offense to win. Obviously we showed we can't run into them when they know its coming. I doubt this is something we would do in the regular season. Its a judging event.
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
They can't even execute vanilla run plays and basic pass protection. A lot of us saw this coming a mile away. Right now, to be brutally honest, they look like the worst OL in football. Put on any NFL network replay this week. I can guarantee each and every other 31 NFL teams' OL look more competent than our guys.
Some of you guys keep blaming a vanilla gameplan or that we were obviously trying to establish the run and work on that part of the offense.. but that doesn't excuse the lack of fundamental football. Most of our guys are just getting worked up front. They're not executing basic blocks. The play is just sloppy and uncoordinated.
I'm not throwing up my arms and closing the book on the season before it starts but you'd like to see the offense have put together a little something. What we saw the last two weeks from the starters has been absolutely embarrassing. I've watched a lot of preaseason games around the league and haven't seen many offenses look as bad as ours.
and the two big OL blowups so far have been due to 1)Darkwa not even blocking the guy who sacked Eli, and 2)Our backup TE wiffed on Wilkerson and he blew up the play.
I'm sure there are ones I missed, but the point here is there is more involved than just bashing the 5 OL players.
Some of you guys keep blaming a vanilla gameplan or that we were obviously trying to establish the run and work on that part of the offense.. but that doesn't excuse the lack of fundamental football. Most of our guys are just getting worked up front. They're not executing basic blocks. The play is just sloppy and uncoordinated.
I'm not throwing up my arms and closing the book on the season before it starts but you'd like to see the offense have put together a little something. What we saw the last two weeks from the starters has been absolutely embarrassing. I've watched a lot of preaseason games around the league and haven't seen many offenses look as bad as ours.
but with vanilla play calling comes vanilla pass pritections and run blocking..
eli never adjusted a play, they basically just ran what was called in the huddle withiut any regard for what the defense was showing..
you think in the regular season they are running back to back draw plays on 2nd and 3rd down?
3rd and 7 and they are running a screen, i doubt they do that in the regular season..
most drives started run run pass...
i get the well ol should look better regardless of play calling, but when there is zero protection schemes and adjustments are limited and no gameplanning the ol is at a disadvantage
Agree - the only thing this shows is that in a vanilla to vanilla
Cmon, guys... I don't think our starters even ran one play on their side of the 50. Other teams are running vanilla offenses as well.. they're still managing to put a few points up and have a couple of solid drives here and there. Our offense looked abysmal.
Yes, it will get better.. it won't be this bad all year. But there was absolutely nothing reassuring about the offense this preseason. One solid drive in 3 games.
Cmon, guys... I don't think our starters even ran one play on their side of the 50. Other teams are running vanilla offenses as well.. they're still managing to put a few points up and have a couple of solid drives here and there. Our offense looked abysmal.
Yes, it will get better.. it won't be this bad all year. But there was absolutely nothing reassuring about the offense this preseason. One solid drive in 3 games.
colts put up 3 points yesterday against the eagles and that is because the colts intercepted bradford and set them up...
the jets yesterday only scored a td because their defense had an interception...
offense has been bad for a lot of teams in the preseason...
defense is easier to play without gameplanning than offense is...
Quote:
In comment 13090481 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 13090475 Mason said:
Quote:
Are OBJ and Shepard even alive?
I guess Cruz can run without collapsing. I don't know what that is suppose to mean or how that even translate to a roster spot but okay.
You can't evaluate WRs or expect them to make plays when the QB is running for his life.
So how does Cruz earn a roster spot even he has been absent for most of training camp and had one short yard reception? I learned nothing from Cruz tonight about whether he is real option on this team going forward. Lewis and King look like they deserve a spot on the roster.
Adams looked like the best blocking TE and actual best option at getting real YAC for a TE on this roster and he got the least amount of reps.
I don't know what to say about the OL.
For all the hate Williams get, please evaluate Jennings play this preseason and compare the two.
Jennings actually caught passes!
I think the giants certainly worked running backs to the outside, it seemed... maybe check downs because of bad pass protection tho.
For getting a couple of late scores against 3rd teamers?
all camp and he is damn quick .
I'm probably in the minority here but I like Rainey
over Darqua .
I like what I saw in Sheppard MLB Okwara is a keeper
Wynn had a great game .
The Offensive line got tested and Failed sure Pugh wasn't there but talk about Zero Depth . It could foil the season
The WR's have not gotten enough work especially Cruz .
Was glad to see Davis back in there .
Not too bad on the injury front .
Bottom line is Eli is gonna get hurt if they don't get
some more help .
Jerrel Adams just needs time to develop we need to get
Will Johnson up to snuff I have seen enough of Tye ..
Quote:
must make this team
For getting a couple of late scores against 3rd teamers?
Hasn't he actually had a great camp as well. Maybe there is something wrong with the depth chart.
The expectation bar for Cruz has been set so low. If he steps on a football field it is now a huge plus. I don't know man. This whole Cruz thing is weird. After not saying he was on scholarship it really looks like he is on scholarship.
During the Giants first 3 series, 7 of their 13 plays had 2 tight ends or a TE/FB combo. That is NOT the Giants offense of the past 2 seasons. What's worse is they ran the ball on half of the 6 plays with Odell, Cruz, and Sheppard on the field. I know the preseason is for "working on things", but my goodness... why can't they just run their regular stuff???????
Outside of Leon Hall, the 1st team defense was spectacular. Even on the TD, Jenkins had excellent coverage. But back to my first point... Leon Hall did not look good at all. Conversely, Eli Apple looked great. He's still holding, but at least they're subtle and not blatant and obvious. OV and Snacks were terrific. The LBs are still a work in progress.
If Orleans Darkwa's path to the 53 man roster is mostly based on special teams, I counted 3 special teams fuck-ups from him alone.
Quote:
Will be to 65, looking for 10 OL cuts to sign.
Another stupid non-starter. The Giants are only going to carry nine offensive linemen. You think they are going to cut their starting five?
Eric I think k he was joking saying the giants will cut extra to get down to 65 then sign 10 ol who were cut to try and find some depth/starters lol
Basically saying oline is our only major hole(I agree)
During the Giants first 3 series, 7 of their 13 plays had 2 tight ends or a TE/FB combo. That is NOT the Giants offense of the past 2 seasons. What's worse is they ran the ball on half of the 6 plays with Odell, Cruz, and Sheppard on the field. I know the preseason is for "working on things", but my goodness... why can't they just run their regular stuff???????
It's not the offense of the past two years, but TE/FB + TE/TE sets (until they had no other choice but to get away from them in games) were often a hallmark of the Gilbride offense, of which Sullivan came from and ran in his stint as OC in TB.
There were mixed reports in-game on who was calling plays tonight (I haven't checked the post-game comments) and it is only the pre-season, but this type of thing is something to keep an eye on, given how weird hiring him as OC in the first place was.
Wonder if the team saved the phone numbers of Diehl and O'Hara. Not these two literally, but a couple of sturdy vets with a couple of years left in them.
Remember, we won Super Bowl 46 with David Diehl starting at left tackle. He was no Pro Bowl threat, but he was good enough.
Quote:
Needs to go.... He Just does not have it... We can't run the ball! Brad wing is a stud... T. King better make this roster, he's a baller...Osawa DE continues to impress... Did I say Nassib needs to go?
Nassib is not going anywhere. That's a non-starter.
Third QB Logan Thomas, WR Myles White, WR Anthony Dable and CB Joe Powell dressed but did not play tonight.
Quote:
Needs to go.... He Just does not have it... We can't run the ball! Brad wing is a stud... T. King better make this roster, he's a baller...Osawa DE continues to impress... Did I say Nassib needs to go?
Nassib is not going anywhere. That's a non-starter.
Truth. And hopefully he remains that way!
If not that, at least someone who might be better than our OL #7, or 8-10.
Quote:
must make this team
For getting a couple of late scores against 3rd teamers?
That's reason to cut him ... if not for that this game would have been a total abortion ... winning the game takes away from reality ... cut him ...
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
The way that play was defended, that throw probably shouldn't have been made in the first place. They had a KO shot lined up.
Okwara continues to impress along with Odi. Spags was able to rotate the 1st team and kept the pressure on Flitz. Nothing exotic either. Very nice showing.
After Apple though the drop off is huge at CB. I'm not sure if Hall is in football shape yet and he looked really concussed. I mean I don't know where I am right now stuff. I hope he goes next week because he needs some reps. I seen enough of Wade myself. If Hall can't go I rather have Jenkins at slot with DRC and Apple on the outside. I really thought Deayon was a possibility but his size is a real issue.
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use
preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
Third QB Logan Thomas, WR Myles White, WR Anthony Dable and CB Joe Powell dressed but did not play tonight.
There's your starting lineup for game #4.
Quote:
Dan Duggan @DDuggan21 3m3 minutes ago
Third QB Logan Thomas, WR Myles White, WR Anthony Dable and CB Joe Powell dressed but did not play tonight.
There's your starting lineup for game #4.
Nope, That's a list of people who will be cut this week. They won't make game 4. Although, I don't know about White being cut in the first cuts.
This is very encouraging.
[quote] but did you see the play calling? They were obviously trying to show nothing.
Of course ... and that'll be a huge advantage with a new Head Coach once the season starts as the opposition DC will have no idea much less our Offensive schemes but also tendencies ... but my problem is with the execution ...
Now maybe we are either taking the show nothing strategy to the extreme by deliberately running plays we are weak on ... like rather than work with the quickness and agility our OLine may have as an advantage ... run plays that work only when they outmuscle their opponent - a talent they don't really have ...
A lot of vanilla play calling, lack of adjustment, or just poor coaching gets a chunk of blame for the run game.
also I dont know why people say Darkwa's special teams give him an edge. He was horrendous last night on specials.
JT Thomas showed good speed and movement can see the plus side to him. maybe he puts it together sometime.
I didn't expect this line to ever be great but they were serviceable last year and I figured they might even be able to improve a bit and build on that.. right now, it looks like they took a giant step backwards.
It's a shame too because the defense looks so much better. But it would be our luck for the offense to suddenly go back to being completely non-competitive now that the defense looks ready to help us win football games.
If I'm McAdoo, I'd play the starters for a full quarter in the last preseason game. They need to build on something here. Going into Dallas with the offense looking like this is going to be pretty alarming.
33, 15, 72, 78 all flashed quite a bit.
Was good to see 55 moving well and leading his unit, as he should.
Count me in with those who are excited about this LBer group!
Not worried about the O.
Let's get to Dallas. No 1's vs NE.
I agree. Its preseason, its time to see what we can do going directly into the Jets (a good running D's strength). Its not a time to gameplan an offense to win. Obviously we showed we can't run into them when they know its coming. I doubt this is something we would do in the regular season. Its a judging event.
Preseason objective 1.
Get out without MAJOR injuries
Preseason objective 2.
Don't show your hand to week 1 opponent.
Some of you guys gotta get your head out of your ass. The coaches use preseason to evaluate and teach. The OL is exactly the same as the one last year from the 8th ranked offense. Did they get shit tier? Yes they aren't great but what team has 5 all pros on the Line? And no...the Cowboys dont.
They can't even execute vanilla run plays and basic pass protection. A lot of us saw this coming a mile away. Right now, to be brutally honest, they look like the worst OL in football. Put on any NFL network replay this week. I can guarantee each and every other 31 NFL teams' OL look more competent than our guys.
I'm not throwing up my arms and closing the book on the season before it starts but you'd like to see the offense have put together a little something. What we saw the last two weeks from the starters has been absolutely embarrassing. I've watched a lot of preaseason games around the league and haven't seen many offenses look as bad as ours.
Eli 20-38-159 1 int
Running game 26 carries 83 YDS 1TD
Just as miserable.
Regular season started and they moved the ball and scored points.
The same thing will happen this year
I'm sure there are ones I missed, but the point here is there is more involved than just bashing the 5 OL players.
I'm not throwing up my arms and closing the book on the season before it starts but you'd like to see the offense have put together a little something. What we saw the last two weeks from the starters has been absolutely embarrassing. I've watched a lot of preaseason games around the league and haven't seen many offenses look as bad as ours.
but with vanilla play calling comes vanilla pass pritections and run blocking..
eli never adjusted a play, they basically just ran what was called in the huddle withiut any regard for what the defense was showing..
you think in the regular season they are running back to back draw plays on 2nd and 3rd down?
3rd and 7 and they are running a screen, i doubt they do that in the regular season..
most drives started run run pass...
i get the well ol should look better regardless of play calling, but when there is zero protection schemes and adjustments are limited and no gameplanning the ol is at a disadvantage
how many times did the linebacker go out wide to cover the running back or tight end, that shows it was man to man a lot...
the giants have talent in the secondary and are grtting pressure with 4 man rush that is why they have looked good
Yes, it will get better.. it won't be this bad all year. But there was absolutely nothing reassuring about the offense this preseason. One solid drive in 3 games.
Yes, it will get better.. it won't be this bad all year. But there was absolutely nothing reassuring about the offense this preseason. One solid drive in 3 games.
colts put up 3 points yesterday against the eagles and that is because the colts intercepted bradford and set them up...
the jets yesterday only scored a td because their defense had an interception...
offense has been bad for a lot of teams in the preseason...
defense is easier to play without gameplanning than offense is...