I think it means Flowers may be moving to RT. Beatty really doesn't fit well at RT and Flowers would. They'd both be in the wrong spot if Flowers stayed at LT.
but considering that someone inside the org bashed him pretty good on the way out the door by hitting him with the 'soft' label....I think it's more likely an admission that Flowers is not the solution at LT. \
I think it means Flowers may be moving to RT. Beatty really doesn't fit well at RT and Flowers would. They'd both be in the wrong spot if Flowers stayed at LT.
How much time would Beatty need to knock the rust off? Talk about a move that came out of left field.
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I guess the Giants said "look I know his name" like fatman said us who suggested bringing back him and or schwartz!! Logic prevails in the front office!
Like I said the other day
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
If true, I expect him to be a he swing tackle to begin
I think it means Flowers may be moving to RT. Beatty really doesn't fit well at RT and Flowers would. They'd both be in the wrong spot if Flowers stayed at LT.
How much time would Beatty need to knock the rust off? Talk about a move that came out of left field.
Well, the good news is he did play in Mac's offense in 2014.. so he should be at least semi familiar with that aspect. He did not play for Solari, though.. so that could introduce a few different concepts.
I assume he stayed in football shape if he intended on continuing to play so really he's just got to get a few practices in. Hopefully he can get some reps in Thursday night.
Like I said the other day
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Or it means anyone using logic knows that he is better than any backup and possibly starter. Same w schwartz
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
Given that the Giants are giving him some guaranteed money and had to outbid other suitors to get him back, I would guess he is here to be a starter again. Will that be right away or at LT? I don't know. But I don't think he's here to be a backup.
where it was posted that Beatty pretty much lambasted the idea himself and called Jesus his "cornerstone": Christ may be his cornerstone but he doesn't cut any checks.
Mike Garafolo @MikeGarafolo
Giants are content with Ereck Flowers as their left tackle right now. Will Beatty, on a one-year deal, will have a shot on the right side.
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
This reeks of being obstinate. Playing two players out of position so you don't have to admit you made a mistake in believing Flowers was the long term solution at LT.
My guess is they'll try him at RT as a backup to Newhouse, hopefully eventually pushing him for a starting job, while providing insurance if Flowers continues to crap the bed
gets no push in the running game. And I dont agree with the Flowers cant play LT crowd. And if they move Flowers, you then have a guy who hasnt played in almost 2 years, had no camp,is a five letter word for cat, AND an injury waiting to happen at LT, while then completely mixing up a talented, tough 22 yr old kid who will only have to move back to LT when Mr Softie gets hurt. And if Beatty is so good at a premium position why didnt ANYONE else invite him to camp?
Like I said the other day
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Or it means anyone using logic knows that he is better than any backup and possibly starter. Same w schwartz
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
They used logic. Hes better than any backup and possibly some starters. So is schwartz.
It's gonna be really hard for Beatty to supplant Newhouse by week 1. This probably doesn't change much for the Dallas game. There simply isn't enough time for Beatty to get in game shape and take the spot from Newhouse. Beatty probably won't even play Thursday and he'll have, what, 6 or 7 practices until Dallas?
RT it is.. though I have a sneaking suspicion they are going to wind up flipping EF and Beatty after a few games.
When will Flowers have time to practice being the RT? takes a little time to get comfortable on the other side. I'm sure Flowers is staying there this year.
Let's not read more into the signing than there is. In the near term at least, this has more to do with Stingily than Flowers or Newhouse.
If you're looking for Beatty in the starting lineup, circle the bye week, after the trip to London. Beatty isn't in football shape, and neither he nor Flowers has played right tackle in many years.
Put me in the 'yes' column on on this one. I like the man, and I even like his game. Protecting Eli is Job One for a Giant lineman, and that's what Will Beatty does best.
I am very glad the Giants front office in whole is not as sensitive as the sources who fuel whispers to BBI.
I think there is merit in the Anthony Davis and Will Beatty approach of taking time and actually healing, instead of barely getting functional and going and getting injured again.
It's all business any way you cut it. The players gotta do what he's gotta do, and the teams gotta too.
Glad it those two things aligned to get a quality player back.
RT it is.. though I have a sneaking suspicion they are going to wind up flipping EF and Beatty after a few games.
When will Flowers have time to practice being the RT? takes a little time to get comfortable on the other side. I'm sure Flowers is staying there this year.
If he doesn't improve at LT, they're not going to have much choice. I don't think there would be too much of an adjustment period. It would be different if they were moving him inside to OG.
RE: Pretend Beatty didn't play for the Giants in 2014
used initially as a sixth lineman in goal-line situations and short yardage 3rd downs? At least initially, I think he'll be the swing Tackle and blocking TE in special situations.
Art Stapleton
Can confirm #Giants re-signing OL Will Beatty, as @MikeGarafolo reported. Expectation now is Ereck Flowers stays LT, Beatty competes at RT
Whatever might have happened under TC is over. We need O Line help. Period. If he can help us win games and he, at one point in time, had an attitude or a problem with someone or whatever......who gives two shits? That was then.
We need him. Is he a starter or a backup? Not our job to decide.
I'm actually ecstatic. Now go pick up another lineman or two for backups.
and gets released, but busts his ass knowing the second chance may be his last. My recollection is that Beatty has talent, but his commitment and work ethic were a bit suspect. Maybe now he turns it around. Can we hope?
for Newhouse, Flowers, and Hart. There really is a massive drop off after these guys and its not even close. Honestly what competition have any of them faced. Now maybe a backup to start (Beatty) will be pushing to play hence all the incentives...IMO!
This doesn't surprise me at all. He's not being brought in as a starter, he's been out too long. But he's a known quantity, and we have ZERO depth. Maybe this will light a fire under our current tackles collective asses. After he gets in game shape, maybe he supplants someone... but I'm thinking right now this is for depth and motivation with a known quantity. At least in my mind. Good move I say... Huzzah!
This was a bad move. First of all, its a 1 year contract, for AT WORST depth at the LT spot if Flowers falters. If he proves to be able to beat out Newhouse for the RT spot, that means that the coaching staff clearly sees that he is the better player for the position (I dont think he will be handed the starting job right off the bat). Not sure where the downside is to this?
...but for the Giants to sign a Will Beatty, with the history they have with this player, screams one thing and one thing only:
Coaches and management are back-filling as fast as they can with a current O-line that is a MAJOR concern for everyone associated with this organization.
Not a great state to be in... but there you have it.
I guess all those problems on the OL are correctable....
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Starting Tackle of the SuperBowl Champion Giants, Will Beatty.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't start for the Super Bowl Champion Giants, but Newhouse started for the Super Bowl Chamption Pakers. And it didn't make everyone happy. Irony can be so ironic.
Starting Tackle of the SuperBowl Champion Giants, Will Beatty.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't start for the Super Bowl Champion Giants, but Newhouse started for the Super Bowl Chamption Pakers. And it didn't make everyone happy. Irony can be so ironic.
This is also false. Newhouse wasn't in the league in 2010. His first year was 2011.. he was on the 15-1 Packer team we beat in the Divisional rd.
I'll just go ahead and ask the only truly pertinent question...
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
I'm not sold that there WERE better options. You were picking between a #1 overall pick that the team that drafted him didn't want that badly, or an injury-prone LT the team that drafted him didn't want that badly.
We need to admit that the free agent market wasn't exactly piping hot with solutions for that position.
Please point to specific games where he did, I would like to watch them.
Might have been his first or second year. Started a few games there and was solid. No, I can't tell you the specific week or opponent, it's been a while. But I do remember that sticking out and giving me hope that he could be a viable LT.
Please point to specific games where he did, I would like to watch them.
I don't know if he played it well, but in his rookie year, 2009, he started four games at RT in place of Kareem McKenzie, including the last three games of the season.
Beatty sucked, was hurt, was a cap hit, and apparently had a poor exit. On paper only did this look like a move our FO would make. Reading the tea leaves, particularly his exit, was pretty telling for me. Looks like the differences were resolved and hopefully this move will result in good things.
I didn't, have to eat crow I guess. It didn't seem either
party wanted anything to do with each other.
He has to be better than a Newhouse at RT, please!
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
The Cowboys drafted Tyron Smith at #9 and he spent his first two years at RT before moving over to LT. The Giants did not have that luxury with Flowers.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Flowers is far tougher than Beatty.
I think it means Flowers may be moving to RT. Beatty really doesn't fit well at RT and Flowers would. They'd both be in the wrong spot if Flowers stayed at LT.
I doubt it... Jerry Reese drafted Flowers to be a left tackle so dammit, he's going to play left tackle!!
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Flowers is far tougher than Beatty.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
Dallas drafted Martin to play tackle. He is not their long term pro bowl guard.
Can we please stop these silly but he was drafted at this draft order number so he must play at this position rhetoric.
that all the BBI "resident experts" said he would never be resigned but here we are. Giants must be very concerned about the oline. Oh I forgot it's only preseason.
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
Just reading tea leaves. From everything Reese has said, I never believed he wanted to spend another first round pick on an OL. Yet there was that wave of rumors just before the draft of Giants having interest in Conklin. And I don't buy a disinformation theory for that.
Bringing Beatty back would not have been easy for JR. A nudge from above . . . I can see it.
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
Just reading tea leaves. From everything Reese has said, I never believed he wanted to spend another first round pick on an OL. Yet there was that wave of rumors just before the draft of Giants having interest in Conklin. And I don't buy a disinformation theory for that.
Bringing Beatty back would not have been easy for JR. A nudge from above . . . I can see it.
So, you're just doubling down on the the assumptions here. Do you have any basis for your comments?
as much as Reese or Mara. Eli knows what he has when Beatty is playing at the level he is capable of. That's better than what he has now. Beatty has never dogged it or given reason to be viewed as a malingerer. His injuries were serious: Detached retina, back, broken leg, torn pec. My biggest concern injury-wise is his back. If that checks out, I can live with him choosing surgery last year rather than trying to play through the pec injury. It was a business decision.
One million with 750 guaranteed. A bargain if you ask me.
You don't understand the cap and take things at face value. Add that million onto the cap hit after he was cut and the dead money. Add them together and it's over $10 million I believe with approx. $6 million in actual hard cap dollars (not dead money)
One minute, we're fantasizing about Bavaro or Banks...
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I guess all those problems on the OL are correctable....
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
The Cowboys drafted Tyron Smith at #9 and he spent his first two years at RT before moving over to LT. The Giants did not have that luxury with Flowers.
.
Bingo, other teams have also done it in this league.
there was a lot of competition for the guy. Wonder if he gave a discount or just went highest bidder.?
One million with 750 guaranteed. A bargain if you ask me.
This guy who would go work out about 7 teams. It took Gettleman personally reaching out to him just to get him to show up for a Panthers workout. Very weird IMO.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If he gets his nose bloodied he'll be on season ending IR for cosmetic surgery.
Eli, Pugh and Richburg have always spoke highly of Beatty
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If he gets his nose bloodied he'll be on season ending IR for cosmetic surgery.
See right there. Come on man. He is not some softee.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
Dallas drafted Martin to play tackle. He is not their long term pro bowl guard.
Can we please stop these silly but he was drafted at this draft order number so he must play at this position rhetoric.
..
They had Smith at LT, I think he was drafted to play
where he is playing. He was the 16th pick I believe,
not a top ten pick. There is a difference at OL,
nothing to do with 'rhetoric'.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If these guys are "beat up" already under the new CBA then maybe they need to rethink their career choice. What's going to happen in Week 9? A sudden second wind? Come on. I get what you're saying but there is absolutely no reason these guys shouldn't be ready to go Week 1.
It's really hard for me to feel good about calling a guy "soft"
when he had to have his retina re-attached to his eyeball and then went out to play football again.
A whole lot of lounge chair Spartans in here.
"soft" came straight out of the locker room, fwiw.
A whole lot of 6-10 came out of that locker room too recently.
And he just got a fully guaranteed million bucks again, so how true one curiously anonymous opinion is, who knows. "Soft" isn't a term one typically attaches to career offensive linemen.
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
some immediate doubters: he wrote poetry; there were background pieces about his commitment and whether he really wanted to go NFL; he wasn't a physical tackle (true). A lot of this stuff dogged him during his years with the Giants.
Many questioned his pick as a 2nd, but with all the failures the Giants have had along the OL in the Reese era, Beatty stands out as a relative success, even if he doesn't quite fit the profile some would like as a physical OT who can excel in run game and pass pro. Yet he was likely never a TC favorite, who knows what was said.
After he tore his pec (second serious injury in three years and a bitch to come back from) and they parted ways, the door was wide open for Will Beatty to call it a career. But he did not.
If the long recovery period + not knowing whether he would be re-signed anywhere, I take this as a good sign for his commitment and desire, whatever position he winds up playing.
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
You mean here with the Giants? Or elsewhere because he was in demand with about 6 to 7 teams but he wasn't interested.
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
So are Jerry and Newhouse. Neither of them were ever as good as Beatty. Does it mean they're better today? Doubt it but I find it hard to believe that at some point Will Beatty wont be taking over at either RT or LT.
If you take a look at his Twitter account you'll see he's got two young kids with another on the way. I'm sure he's well motivated not just to hit his incentives for this season but to earn a contact after this as well.
Also, here's what JPP had to say about him around 6 months ago:
Quote:
I'll tell you this Will Beatty, bro you made me a better player. You prepared me to face the best Offensive tackles in the NFL. That's why I made it look so easy at times, all because of you my boy. I know you have plenty more football left in you...
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
So why didn't the Giants sign him 2 weeks ago? What changed so late in the preseason?
If Beatty is at least "serviceable", this is a good move. Anything more is a bonus.
I think the Giants can suffer a loss (I know, knock on wood) to one of the starters (with the possible exception of Richburg) and be able to shuffle things around and be somewhat OK.
Beatty is a good start and I would bring in Schwartz too.. We have the money and he is an upgrade over Jerry and Hart. Its nice to know that Reese is working for his job. The Giants are in a win now mode..
that all the BBI "resident experts" said he would never be resigned but here we are. Giants must be very concerned about the oline. Oh I forgot it's only preseason.
Well played, Sir! This signing exposes a ton of bullshit that's been dressed up as BBI threads over the past several weeks (if not months.) Bottom line: Giants management is scrambling to shore up a painfully obvious weakness. Hope Beatty can help. But he is no panacea.
RE: RE: RE: Ok. Explain this to me. If Beatty is such a good signing then why
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
So why didn't the Giants sign him 2 weeks ago? What changed so late in the preseason?
Health and perhaps they didnt expect their offensive lineman to play so poorly through three games in the preseason.
Beatty is a good start and I would bring in Schwartz too.. We have the money and he is an upgrade over Jerry and Hart. Its nice to know that Reese is working for his job. The Giants are in a win now mode..
This is totally off topic but I"e been trying to send you the madden invite. Do you have the game yet? Email me at madden17bbi@gmail.com
posters who said this would never happen were not irrational, although they might have moderated their stance after the OL had such a poor showing in three straight games, even though it was the preseason.
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If these guys are "beat up" already under the new CBA then maybe they need to rethink their career choice. What's going to happen in Week 9? A sudden second wind? Come on. I get what you're saying but there is absolutely no reason these guys shouldn't be ready to go Week 1.
I'm saying HE is not nicked up - like Pugh and Jerry. He's not being cut by a team and has small injuries. He's clean and should have no reason not to be game ready in two weeks maybe three weeks..nothing to hold him back.
So are Jerry and Newhouse. Neither of them were ever as good as Beatty. Does it mean they're better today? Doubt it but I find it hard to believe that at some point Will Beatty wont be taking over at either RT or LT.
I would say better than 50-50 at some point. But not a certainty by any stretch. Dude has been out of work all offseason for a reason and is now being paid at essentially replacement veteran level. I'm in favor of giving him a shot but it's not clear to me that he will be better than Newhouse. His potential is definitely higher though so it's worth a try.
posters who said this would never happen were not irrational, although they might have moderated their stance after the OL had such a poor showing in three straight games, even though it was the preseason.
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
Good job Jerry.
AcidTest... out of all due respect, the signing of Will Beatty is not really a good job, but rather a move made out of desperation.
Pugh, a 1st round pick, was an "all Big East" OLT and Syracuse for 3 years. Somehow, he can't be an OLT in the pros -- despite that 2013 he started all 16 games and only allowed 3 sacks.
David Diehl - 5th round OG. But apparently HE can play OLT.
Flowers - 9th overall. Two years starting OLT at a major football factory. People HERE don't think he can be an OLT. The Giants do. They're likely correct, but fans are impatient. BIG TOUGH KID with big upside. Just needs to do the work. Sadly for some of you, the Giants LIKE Flowers at OLT. If they thought Flowers was awful and wanted to mess with that, they could have bumped Pugh back to OLT and Flowers to ORT without re signing Beatty. They haven't.
Bobby Hart - late round college ORT who the Giants brass said "projected to OG in the pros." By training camp, he's a backup ORT and backup OG, not winning a starting job over very average Jerry and Newhouse.
Beatty - 2nd round pick -- plays both OT spots (he filled in for McKenzie at ORT for 4 games) Can't stay healthy -- even off the field. He's not being brought in to play OLT. But IF he is healthy -- which is a big IF, he could provide depth at either spot, and maybe challenge Newhouse at some point during the season.
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
posters who said this would never happen were not irrational, although they might have moderated their stance after the OL had such a poor showing in three straight games, even though it was the preseason.
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
Good job Jerry.
AcidTest... out of all due respect, the signing of Will Beatty is not really a good job, but rather a move made out of desperation.
I agree it's a move out of desperation. But it's still good that Jerry didn't let whatever differences originally existed between the Giants and Betty prevent him from reassessing the situation based on our current needs.
1 of you naysayers tell me what the downside is here. Cause I don't see it
Zero downside. Inexpensive. Experience with the Giants and this offense. Quite possibly better than all but three OL on the roster. People calling this signing a joke should realize the joke was the inaction from this offseason, not this signing.
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
Considering all we who are "puffing our chests out" get to see is the game if we could see what the coaches saw with less exposure I'd say that's even more reason to feel good about ourselves.
they should sign Sullivan from the Vikings. This team doenst have a backup C.
He'll probably get a job elsewhere though where he can start.
You don't like the Canadian import?
I thought that dude was suppose to be the best center
in the CFL. Last year he was on IR, don't know what they feel
about him. Nobody ever talks about Jones.
the Giants were considering this move 5-6 months ago. As a matter of fact i'd bet they were. I don't think Newhouse has regressed. And I don't think they plan on starting Beatty at LT. They have certainly been monitoring guys like Beatty and likely figured if camp shakes a certain way, let's say that no other tackle or player emerges as a clear cut starter or reliable backup (Hart, Stingley) they can sign a guy like Beatty IF he's in good shape and wants a fair deal.
It's possible Beatty never starts a game this year.
1 of you naysayers tell me what the downside is here. Cause I don't see it
It was never about any downside. It was more about not much of an upside.
But, as Eric pointed out in another thread, it probably has more to do with Hart playing poorly than it does with Flowers or Newhouse. As a swing-tackle, Beatty is clearly a better option than Hart. Whether or not he becomes a starter remains to be seen.
RE: RE: RE: Wish I could bump the threads from after the bills game
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
Considering all we who are "puffing our chests out" get to see is the game if we could see what the coaches saw with less exposure I'd say that's even more reason to feel good about ourselves.
You're locked in. I won't bother debating this crap with you. It's not always black and white. If beatty doesn't play a game this season can we revisit this thread?
It's a one year deal for a guy that's been out of football for a while now yet this is a move out of desperation? WTF are some of you talking about?
the Giants were considering this move 5-6 months ago. As a matter of fact i'd bet they were. I don't think Newhouse has regressed. And I don't think they plan on starting Beatty at LT. They have certainly been monitoring guys like Beatty and likely figured if camp shakes a certain way, let's say that no other tackle or player emerges as a clear cut starter or reliable backup (Hart, Stingley) they can sign a guy like Beatty IF he's in good shape and wants a fair deal.
It's possible Beatty never starts a game this year.
Newhouse hasnt regressed, he just plain old sucks.
I would be shocked if Beatty doesnt take over a job at some point.
and BEatty wasn't an option last year because he was coming off injury and didn't seem open to playing RT. Now he's healthy and probably humbled a bit.
Maybe the timing just worked out right and Beatty comes in and starts right away. If he's an upgrade, wonderful.
who may or may not take over for Newhouse..BBI has been clamoring/waiting for cuts to begin so that they could shore up their depth..They've done just what was expected. Perhaps not a Beatty, but the effect is the same..I expect another signing or two
Best was Ralph in wfan yesterday chuckling when Richburg was mentioned. He mentioned Beatty by name and said "no way to old friends...they have moved on"
Best was Ralph in wfan yesterday chuckling when Richburg was mentioned. He mentioned Beatty by name and said "no way to old friends...they have moved on"
Dialed in!
I heard that too. The Giants give guys like Ralph table scraps. WFAN would be better off putting me on the air over a guy like Ralph. I may know nothing but I speak the truth!
and will light a fire under our current tackles. I am surprised he is back but it should be a good thing. If he can come back and start at either RT or LT it would be a bonus.
He has actually looked OK when he was in at right tackle. Better than Newhouse actually. As for moving to a position he never played before (LG) and succeeding right away, I am not sure what you were expecting. Point to games and plays at RT where he was worse than Newhouse.
I guess it helps with the depth, but I don't see him as a big upgrade. If he was, he wouldn't have been available.
people are excited b/c the OL looked like a big weakness after 3 preseason games and the NYG did something about it by adding a player with some recent history of being a decent OT. Normally at this time of year, in a situation like this, most teams just roll with what they have.
if the signing of Beatty convinces some of you that the OL is a state of crisis, have at it.
They signed a a guy off the street to a one year deal.
If anything, it's now NOT in a state of crisis. Even if he's only a backup, we now likely have a viable option to plug in somewhere once he's in game shape in a few weeks.
looks a lot better than Flowers-Pugh-Richburg-Jerry-Newhouse.
Beatty will be the RT, not LT. Flowers is the future and doing ok, I think people just blame everything that goes wrong on him. He was fine last week against the Jets.
I have absolutely no idea if Beatty is still a starting caliber
Is if Beatty has problems when in game, the same today who are all estatic, will be the same immediately saying "Beatty is horrible, fire reese!!"
Give it 2 weeks, people will be yelling for Newhouse. It sure seems that Beatty is much more highly thought of now than when he left. I guess time does make the heart grow fonder.
Would be the perfect chip to swap for Anthony Davis.
But all the know it alls acted like he was the 2nd coming
of Satan ......
Beatty was not all world but he was decent and I hope
He is healthy enough to start at LT he will be an Upgrade
at the position and Flowers can still groom to take
over at some point I am glad they made the Move
Beatty is a solid religious dude that loved playing here
I doubt anyone knows all the details when he was not
retained . Some just belched out whatever came to mind
without knowing Jack shit .
The Line has played poorly at least he can provide some
depth .
I am Glad he is Back ..
is when the Giants drafted David Wilson after 99% of this site said "the Giants aren't drafting a RB in the first round". And went so far as to chastise people who suggested they'd take one (not me, I had no idea who they'd draft).
Classic.
I hope we have some saved threads and I haven't read one post on here, but a lot of people have some crow to eat.
arrogance humbled.
RE: Also got to remember the guy has been out of football
But assuming he does in fact regain his previous form and Flowers struggles a bit and they do end up switching... I could seriously see this line going from a weakness to a strength. Lots of "ifs" right now but it's not out of the question all because of one move.
Ok. I'm still not getting it. Why was Beatty not signed by someone
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
Baad, we know that cuts were coming and OL depth was a need..He's versatile depth, who, if he's got gas left in his tank, could fill in as needed..In that sense, I have no problem with the signing, especially for 1 year..As to why he wasn't signed by someone, no idea..Hopefully a few more depth signings are in the offing..
is when the Giants drafted David Wilson after 99% of this site said "the Giants aren't drafting a RB in the first round". And went so far as to chastise people who suggested they'd take one (not me, I had no idea who they'd draft).
Classic.
I hope we have some saved threads and I haven't read one post on here, but a lot of people have some crow to eat.
arrogance humbled.
It's a flawed assumption, especially knowing we had a hard on for Spiller a year or two before Wilson.
RE: RE: Ok. I'm still not getting it. Why was Beatty not signed by someone
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
I don't know, didn't we sign Shawn Andrews in late August of 2010?
I don't remember Arc, but this thread is talking like we just got an all-pro tackle who was sitting home waiting for someone to call ... just doesn't make a lot of sense to me ... if he's a clear cut improvement over the players in camp, what took the Giants (and everyone else) so long?
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
Coming off a series of injuries and his own team questioned his heart, ect. I could certainly see why teams might have been seeing who shook loose before taking a chance on him but supposedly he had multiple deals on the table so there's that too.
Personally, I think we are pretty fortunate he was still available this late in camp.
Finally, I dont care how pessimistic a person you are and even if you think Beatty is worthless, how in Jesus's name can anyone not think he's better than Stingily?
RE: RE: Ok. I'm still not getting it. Why was Beatty not signed by someone
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
Baad, we know that cuts were coming and OL depth was a need..He's versatile depth, who, if he's got gas left in his tank, could fill in as needed..In that sense, I have no problem with the signing, especially for 1 year..As to why he wasn't signed by someone, no idea..Hopefully a few more depth signings are in the offing..
BB'56 - I agree. I'm not trying to put down the signing. It's just that I don't understand all the excitement - it's as though the savior has been found and the OL issues have suddenly been solved. I don't get it.
RE: RE: RE: Ok. I'm still not getting it. Why was Beatty not signed by someone
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
I don't know, didn't we sign Shawn Andrews in late August of 2010?
I don't remember Arc, but this thread is talking like we just got an all-pro tackle who was sitting home waiting for someone to call ... just doesn't make a lot of sense to me ... if he's a clear cut improvement over the players in camp, what took the Giants (and everyone else) so long?
Meh, I think that's an exaggeration. I don't see many (or really, any) people acting that way.
I think a lot of us were a bit concerned with the OL play this preseason and are glad the Giants at least acknowledged that we could use a little help. What do we have to lose here?
Besides, the Cardinals (and Jags + Panthers IIRC) also had interest. So it's not like we're the only team that thought he could help.
is its like Leon Hall he was ready yet. Giants brought him in and he looks healthy and ready. Also the Giants might just have admitted he is better than anyone else on the bench including maybe one of the starters. Another reason and this might be a bigger one is Beatty finally took less money to actually play football.
my comments had nothing to do with Beatty's football prowess or any contribution he could make.
It was simply about the near unanimous cries with 100% confidence and condescension from the usual suspects "the Giants have moved on" "that ship has sailed" "the Giants cut Beatty because he was soft and had a poor attitude" and tons more from the masses of know-it-alls any time Beatty's name came up in a thread.
I just find it awesome for that reason, not that I think Beatty is great. Though I do think he was a little bit unfairly maligned here, I have no idea if he'll even contribute to the team and it was never my point.
RE: Ok. I'm still not getting it. Why was Beatty not signed by someone
my comments had nothing to do with Beatty's football prowess or any contribution he could make.
It was simply about the near unanimous cries with 100% confidence and condescension from the usual suspects "the Giants have moved on" "that ship has sailed" "the Giants cut Beatty because he was soft and had a poor attitude" and tons more from the masses of know-it-alls any time Beatty's name came up in a thread.
I just find it awesome for that reason, not that I think Beatty is great. Though I do think he was a little bit unfairly maligned here, I have no idea if he'll even contribute to the team and it was never my point.
I didn't. I wasn't thinking anyone in particular. Just comments about Beatty actually starting. The just sounds crazy to me. How often do you find a starting OT sitting on the couch in the last 2 days of August?
either Beatty stayed a guy we moved on from for various reasons or he got back in shape with a better attitude and got a second chance. The second scenario seemed highly unlikelg. something had to have changed for us to bring him back and as I posted on the AZ interest thread, I wonder what shape he'd be in right now without a fire lit under his ass.
Do they take the heat off Flowers and move him to the right side of the line, or does Will B. play RT?
The plan right now is for Beatty to play on the right side but I think they're going to flip before mid season and Flowers is going to end up at RT with WB back at LT.
against the Jets. He also played LG the entire first half against the Bills the week before. Got two series at RT in that game in third period.
I know there's also practices, but before the Pugh injury, my recollection is that the competition between Newhouse and Hart was up in the air. And Hart has also had to spend time at LG in practices the last two weeks in anticipation of playing there in the games.
I'm not a huge Hart fan but it seems an odd context to render a verdict on Hart as an OT. There's been a lot more of Newhouse at OT on display the last two weeks.
I guess we'll see.
Not sure how we can be real happy with this development.
We sign a cast-off OL that we know very well (and cut) and somehow fans should be pleased with this move? It wreaks of desperation and of a failure by the team to address a problem that was quite obvious in the offseason. Feel real bad for Eli. He deserves better up front.
Beatty did the right thing for himself - surgery. The Giants wanted him to "play through the pain", he wouldn't go for it, so they showed him the door.
Now he's back, rested and healthy. I think it's going to work out fine for him and the team.
that I don't like Beatty much at all as a player and did not except this at all. I'll root for him to kick ass and eat crow if he does - I just don't think this is a good move.
We sign a cast-off OL that we know very well (and cut) and somehow fans should be pleased with this move? It wreaks of desperation and of a failure by the team to address a problem that was quite obvious in the offseason. Feel real bad for Eli. He deserves better up front.
We cut him in a money move. There is no doubt he can play. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that this was a contingency plan all along and they said "call us before you sign somewhere else."
and Flowers better get the lead out of his ass because there is a lot of talk about how rough and tough he is and we move no one on his side of the field and he is victimized by every speed rusher he faces.
RE: Not sure how we can be real happy with this development.
We sign a cast-off OL that we know very well (and cut) and somehow fans should be pleased with this move? It wreaks of desperation and of a failure by the team to address a problem that was quite obvious in the offseason. Feel real bad for Eli. He deserves better up front.
Simple. He's better than Newhouse. Everything else you mentioned is a sunk cost at this point in time. Split milk
I don't think its very complicated. The team ALWAYS says they are looking for players that can help and make the team better. They've tried on a number of occasions this off season to upgrade the talent level on the OL whether starter or back up. At 31 Beatty should still be able to provide that. Whether he can still be a starter is up to the coaches but he upgrades the talent pool. Most teams need 8-9 players. We now have the 5 current starters and Beatty and Hart. That's 7 and someone like Cleary as a developmental type at the end of the bench playing specials. That should give Solari a bit more to work with.
I do not know how you could possibly think it's better to have zero
Why ?
He wasn't all world and if anyone with two eyes couldn't
see this as a Good attempt to improve the Team is smoking
crack ..
Beatty wasn't all pro and surely wan't chopped liver .
He is more liked then most think and I could see him temporarily unseating Flowers . If big If that he does
end up at some point Starting at LT Imagine Flowers
may even Flourish and Improve the Run Game to respectability
Give the Guy a Chance before making irrational statements
I also hope they can add a back up Center ,,
...given the sieve our right OL has been dating back to last season and how pathetic they've come out of the gate in preseason any upgrade to Newhouse is a welcome addition at this 11th hour. How much of an upgrade Beatty will be remains to be seen.
After reading through this entire thread I swear some people just make shit up to fit their narrative.
Beatty was a good player who was cut A) to free up money for the moves they made this off-season and B) because the organization was trying to move on from injured players. I believe it also rubbed the FO the wrong way that Beatty didn't play last season after it appeared his pec injury healed.
Beatty is a talented player when healthy and motivated. While Flowers projects as a better LT in the future, I think Beatty is better in pass pro now. Beatty is without a doubt an immediate upgrade over Newhouse.
Signing Beatty for 1 mil is a no brainier given the state of the OL and the Giants got better today.
The posters screaming for any OL get their wish.
The posters who said the Giants would never take him back look out of touch with reality.
The offensive line is so bad they feel Beatty is an improvement.
On the plus side I think? they saved some money lol.
Beatty, 31, may turn out to be the better LT, something he's done a lot of in the NFL and pretty well in his last year before tearing his pec. Not a lot of time to find out about that now, but say it's so. Then he plays LT for the Giants and Flowers learns to play RT.
How many years has Beatty got left, even if it turns out that he's sensational right now? Not too many. Enough for Flowers to develop and get a shot at LT again. This all seems hopelessly optimistic, but what's not to like about it?
After reading through this entire thread I swear some people just make shit up to fit their narrative.
Beatty was a good player who was cut A) to free up money for the moves they made this off-season and B) because the organization was trying to move on from injured players. I believe it also rubbed the FO the wrong way that Beatty didn't play last season after it appeared his pec injury healed.
Beatty is a talented player when healthy and motivated. While Flowers projects as a better LT in the future, I think Beatty is better in pass pro now. Beatty is without a doubt an immediate upgrade over Newhouse.
Signing Beatty for 1 mil is a no brainier given the state of the OL and the Giants got better today.
Beatty at his height was a very good pass protector which is what you need first and foremost at LT. Many of us here wanted gim resigned and he got a strong contract due to a very good year previous.
He is a bit injry prone and there are questions about just how much he loves football. But if healthy and motivated , he should be an above average pass protector which will be huge for us.
RE: RE: Also got to remember the guy has been out of football
Like Prince before him sometimes we BBIers overrate our players. Remember when some suggested we give Prince 5 to 8 million a year. He ended up not even close. My guess is that Mr Beatty might have valued his services more then other teams and BBIers.In the end his best offer was likely the Giants deal, not close to his old deal. Lets hope he is worth it
Teams have found diamonds in the rough with signings like this before. No one here is putting Beatty in the pro bowl much like someone shouldn't dismiss the signing as camp fodder or irrelevant. Teams have gotten lucky before -- Giants included. Beatty actually might be a pretty safe bet to hold his own. He's not a bad player when healthy. He's been humbled seems to be in top shape -- hey why not. It has happened before why not now. At the very least low risk depth move it pushes the incumbents. Competition can't hurt. I assumed no way he was coming back but might as well get on board.
What intrigues me is why Beatty waited until now to sign a contract
I'm guessing, without knowing, that he will make the final roster regardless of his play in what remains of the preseason. If so, did sign now because now he's finally healthy? Or did he sign now because he wanted to avoid the OTAs and most of camp - not because it was work, but because he didn't want to feel as if he had to win a roster spot.
All the people saying, "this isn't a good move," or, "what is there to get excited about," or "nobody signed him, so he's not going to help," need to sit down and relax.
First of all, it is a good move. Why? Because we have a tackle position with Marshall freaking Newhouse as the starter. And I'm sure Marshall is a nice guy, and I'm sure he works hard, but this is a results business, and Marshall was not getting good results. Not this year, and not last year, either.
And if Marshall Newhouse is your starter, then those backups must be even worse... and they are. When your starters can't score any points in approximately 4 quarters of football against the Bills and the Jets, and your franchise QB doesn't even have time on almost every snap to even get the ball to his first read, you cannot go into the season without doing something. It may work, and it may not, but you have to do something.
So Beatty might end up bolstering the OL, or he may never get on the field. But the status quo was a no quo. Criticize Beatty if you want, but he wasn't the one stinking up the field all preseason.
So everyone take a deep breath, cross your fingers, and hope he can give Eli the protection he needs to be effective at RT.
RE: What intrigues me is why Beatty waited until now to sign a contract
I'm guessing, without knowing, that he will make the final roster regardless of his play in what remains of the preseason. If so, did sign now because now he's finally healthy? Or did he sign now because he wanted to avoid the OTAs and most of camp - not because it was work, but because he didn't want to feel as if he had to win a roster spot.
If they've guaranteed him $1M then he's very likely to make the roster, especially considering the reserves we currently have.
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
I prefer Apple over OL. Apple is 6'1" and the Giants need a tall corner to pair with RC who's 6'2". Jenkins is only 5'10" and taller receivers are going to exploit their height advantage (as evidenced by the Decker TD on Saturday). The Giants OL this year is the same as last year and last year the offense was not the problem. It was the horrific defense.
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
I prefer Apple over OL. Apple is 6'1" and the Giants need a tall corner to pair with RC who's 6'2". Jenkins is only 5'10" and taller receivers are going to exploit their height advantage (as evidenced by the Decker TD on Saturday). The Giants OL this year is the same as last year and last year the offense was not the problem. It was the horrific defense.
You must have misunderstood what I said about Apple, I said I was "not unhappy" with the pick. And all you had to do was watch the Eagles game in Philly last year and most of last season then roll it all into this preseason to see that the OL is too often overmatched.
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
It's not an admission of a mistake. It's an ongoing process.
I'm suspecting Giants had targets on the OL in both the draft and FA, but the value relative to draft position and/or contract $ commitment wasn't there.
Bratty is back because none of the other options worked out and no UDFA gem was discovered in training camp. He's also healthy now and wasn't last spring when the cut was announced.
Perhaps Beatty's departure was less acrimonious than many fans assumed. And maybe, a few months after Coughlin and Flaherty left the building, some grudges began to abate.
Whatever Will Beatty may be, he's not David Diehl or Shaun O'Hara or Rich Seubert, and he's sure not Chris Snee. Coughlin and Flaherty seemed to love those guys, and stuck with them through good times and bad. If the grumpy old men were still running the show, I suspect Beatty's return would have been more controversial.
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
It's not an admission of a mistake. It's an ongoing process.
I'm suspecting Giants had targets on the OL in both the draft and FA, but the value relative to draft position and/or contract $ commitment wasn't there.
Bratty is back because none of the other options worked out and no UDFA gem was discovered in training camp. He's also healthy now and wasn't last spring when the cut was announced.
You call it a "process" and I'll call it an experiment that's been ongoing since the last SB. Sure, there are those that will point to the various draft picks but in my opinion there have been reaches in the draft, poor evaluation on the FA side and the "process" itself started too late. We needed, and still do need, more cornerstone OL and we're still seeing the FO shuffling the deck.
For Beatty to contribute more than sitting on the bench
they'd have to break up the left side of the OL and kick Flowers to RT, which means several moves they've been avoiding since Beatty went down a year ago.
NYG swallowed pride to reverse their course, and so did Beatty, to return for $1M.
they'd have to break up the left side of the OL and kick Flowers to RT, which means several moves they've been avoiding since Beatty went down a year ago.
Time will tell. I wouldn't rule out Beatty at RT. Let's see how Flowers and Newhouse fare while Beatty gets up to speed and into football shape.
I agree that WB opens the year as the swing tackle. That means he'll get 2nd team reps (at least) on both sides. Solari can take the evaluation from there.
was not possible, it would be foolish of me to make any strong pronouncements as it pertains to him..That said, I'd be further surprised (shocked?) if EF is moved at this point..Beatty of course is insurance at OLT..
I thought they made the right decision originally, it was time to move on from TC leftovers who were determined to be under-performing, struggling with injuries, not earning the full value of their contract, etc. The tea leaves followed suit, until now.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
I thought they made the right decision originally, it was time to move on from TC leftovers who were determined to be under-performing, struggling with injuries, not earning the full value of their contract, etc. The tea leaves followed suit, until now.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
Agreed..The good news is he's a decent, hopefully versatile depth guy, imo
...it was clear the Giants were going to address OL DEPTH during pre-season - they didn't choose to draft an OL, didn't believe any of the available FA's were worth the asking price, were clearly content with the starters.
Will Beatty was NOT signed to START. He has been signed for DEPTH, and I would expect at least one more signing from the training camp castaways.
The move makes me happy - to me, this was - and IS the Achilles heel of this team. Beatty gives the Giants a MUCH NEEDED solid backup - and if he can regain his form - who knows? Possibly a starting role in the future. His injury history is what got him cut, and his injury history is what will keep him on the bench - you simply can't rely on him.
leave it to the Giants to play a prototype RT at LT and a LT at RT.
The game has changed. Good Pass rushers come off both sides. 3-4 OLBs move side to side.
Look at the Giants, OV moved JPP to the left DE position. The Giants aren't the only team with two good edge rushers that require the opposing team to have two good pass protection OTs.
against the Jets. He also played LG the entire first half against the Bills the week before. Got two series at RT in that game in third period.
I know there's also practices, but before the Pugh injury, my recollection is that the competition between Newhouse and Hart was up in the air. And Hart has also had to spend time at LG in practices the last two weeks in anticipation of playing there in the games.
I'm not a huge Hart fan but it seems an odd context to render a verdict on Hart as an OT. There's been a lot more of Newhouse at OT on display the last two weeks.
I guess we'll see.
This is a good thought process. BBI has been looking for the next Kevin Boothe. It might be Hart. Not quite good enough to start, but a flexible OL that can play Tackle or Guard. When they have him take snaps at center, we will know. IIRC, Boothe could not play OT, just OG and C. At 22 Hart is young enough to still grow and develop his technique.
...it was clear the Giants were going to address OL DEPTH during pre-season - they didn't choose to draft an OL, didn't believe any of the available FA's were worth the asking price, were clearly content with the starters.
Will Beatty was NOT signed to START. He has been signed for DEPTH, and I would expect at least one more signing from the training camp castaways.
The move makes me happy - to me, this was - and IS the Achilles heel of this team. Beatty gives the Giants a MUCH NEEDED solid backup - and if he can regain his form - who knows? Possibly a starting role in the future. His injury history is what got him cut, and his injury history is what will keep him on the bench - you simply can't rely on him.
Maybe it's not so much "hysterics" but rather a great, big "yawn" when it comes to the signing of Will Beatty. He is not the answer in raising the overall quality of the O-line unit. He's the best the Giants can do at this late stage -- he adds a little back-up glue to a thin offense line that will need lots of serious attention in the 2017 off-season.
Starting Tackle of the SuperBowl Champion Giants, Will Beatty.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't start for the Super Bowl Champion Giants, but Newhouse started for the Super Bowl Chamption Pakers. And it didn't make everyone happy. Irony can be so ironic.
This is also false. Newhouse wasn't in the league in 2010. His first year was 2011.. he was on the 15-1 Packer team we beat in the Divisional rd.
I guess irony isn't as ironic as I thought it was.
p.s.-- I think the addition of Beatty is as much about Flowers as it is about Newhouse. Whoever sucks the most will be the guy Beatty replaces and it won't involve a move to the right side by Flowers.
Maybe it's not so much "hysterics" but rather a great, big "yawn" when it comes to the signing of Will Beatty. He is not the answer in raising the overall quality of the O-line unit. He's the best the Giants can do at this late stage -- he adds a little back-up glue to a thin offense line that will need lots of serious attention in the 2017 off-season.
I don't think it's a 'Yawn' to add Will Beatty to offset the Hart/Rodgers tackle depth.
I thought they made the right decision originally, it was time to move on from TC leftovers who were determined to be under-performing, struggling with injuries, not earning the full value of their contract, etc. The tea leaves followed suit, until now.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
you make it sound like TC signed these players you speak of lol
To be in this position with the offensive line after an off-season of enormous cap wealth is a managerial failure. We are now relying partially on luck for the line to play well.
No plan.
They brought him back when the word and tea leaves suggested
To be in this position with the offensive line after an off-season of enormous cap wealth is a managerial failure. We are now relying partially on luck for the line to play well.
No plan.
I don't assign fault here. Money was not an issue. Players worthy of that money were..
Having money to spend does not mean that there were players
Then how are the defensive expenditures explained? Even the people that like the signings concede that the Giants overpaid for those players.
I've been a Reese guy but I do assign blame. There were offensive linemen on the market that cost a fraction of what we spent.
We can spend all the money on defense we want. This team is still only going where Eli takes it. To put him behind that right side is tough to justify.
Then how are the defensive expenditures explained? Even the people that like the signings concede that the Giants overpaid for those players.
I've been a Reese guy but I do assign blame. There were offensive linemen on the market that cost a fraction of what we spent.
We can spend all the money on defense we want. This team is still only going where Eli takes it. To put him behind that right side is tough to justify.
WHO? Osemele?
I wanted Conklin, but he went before us.
The defensive expenditures are explained by the fact this year's FA
Who were the two noteworthy LTs out there? Russ Okung, a failed first-round pick his own team didn't really want (and who's name travels a lot more than his actual skill level) or Ryan Clady, a consistently injured big name player his team didn't really want.
The only other player of note is Mitchell Schwartz, who signed a deal that puts him in the highest paid players at his position.
it turns out Beatty may have been the best guy on the market and they got him back at a bargain. They also massively upgraded the defense. That's a great plan, IMO.
If Flowers did stink it up and Beatty took over LT, I am not sure Flowers just "slides" to the right side. I have no knowledge that Flowers has ever practiced on the right side? A switch over Newhouse wouldn't happen right away - at least that is my guess.
You and me both. I thought that ship had sailed.
:)
Me too...They obviously know best. I thought they felt he was too soft?
If Beatty has anything left in the tank, that's what I'd do.
Beatty - Pugh - Richburg - Jerry - Flowers
sounds pretty good to me.
How much time would Beatty need to knock the rust off? Talk about a move that came out of left field.
ESPN Staff Writer
The Giants are signing OL Will Beatty, per source. They released Beatty earlier this year.
Quote:
shocked by this.
Me too...They obviously know best. I thought they felt he was too soft?
I'm floored as well.I don't really care for him as a player, and it sure seemed like the Giants were pissed at him.
with hart and newhouse as backups looks LIGHT YEARS better IMO
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
And yes, the question is, was he signed as a backup, or starter....and if starter, which position....
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I guess the Giants said "look I know his name" like fatman said us who suggested bringing back him and or schwartz!! Logic prevails in the front office!
And yes, the question is, was he signed as a backup, or starter....and if starter, which position....
Giants beat out several other suitors for Beatty, I'm told. Got 1-year deal w/guaranteed salary of over $1M, plus about $750K in incentives.
We told them this was stupid. Now they believe us. So, who is running this team?
Beggars can't be choosy.
This is not depth, this is to start. Haven't you watched the games? We have two guys starting who are not good.
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
After 1-2 games, maybe they change out Flowers or Newhouse.
Giants are desperate for o-line depth and Beatty is best available.
I'd be really nervous if he replaced Flowers at LT. But I can't see that happening right now.
certainly I didn't see this coming.
Quote:
I think it means Flowers may be moving to RT. Beatty really doesn't fit well at RT and Flowers would. They'd both be in the wrong spot if Flowers stayed at LT.
How much time would Beatty need to knock the rust off? Talk about a move that came out of left field.
Well, the good news is he did play in Mac's offense in 2014.. so he should be at least semi familiar with that aspect. He did not play for Solari, though.. so that could introduce a few different concepts.
I assume he stayed in football shape if he intended on continuing to play so really he's just got to get a few practices in. Hopefully he can get some reps in Thursday night.
Beatty had worked out for Panthers and had an offer from Jaguars. The Cards and Saints also wanted to bring him in for a workout
Giants gave their former OT Will Beatty a one-year contract.
Quote:
Like I said the other day
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Or it means anyone using logic knows that he is better than any backup and possibly starter. Same w schwartz
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
Giants beat out several other suitors for Beatty, I'm told. Got 1-year deal w/guaranteed salary of over $1M, plus about $750K in incentives.
Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoSNY 32s32 seconds ago
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
-Sign, a fellow UConn alum.
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
Never mind
Mike Garafolo @MikeGarafolo
Giants are content with Ereck Flowers as their left tackle right now. Will Beatty, on a one-year deal, will have a shot on the right side.
No way is he a backup amigo. Do you honestly feel good about Newhouse? And Flowers is no good on left side. However, will soft Beatty stay healthy?
After 1-2 games, maybe they change out Flowers or Newhouse.
Giants are desperate for o-line depth and Beatty is best available.
I agree with this assessment of the situation. I also hope he's in good shape. Will he play Thursday?
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
This reeks of being obstinate. Playing two players out of position so you don't have to admit you made a mistake in believing Flowers was the long term solution at LT.
First off, what kind of shape is even in?
My guess is they'll try him at RT as a backup to Newhouse, hopefully eventually pushing him for a starting job, while providing insurance if Flowers continues to crap the bed
Dumb move.
Quote:
Quote:
Like I said the other day
Stan in LA : 2:27 pm : link : reply
"Calling Will Beatty! Come to the front desk! Bring your pen."
But I was told he would NEVER come back here.
Was that FatMan?
I was pretty much saying that to ODB though. I said that Beatty left on bad terms and the Giants seemed to be moving on from guys with injury issues and possible motivation issues.
Or it means anyone using logic knows that he is better than any backup and possibly starter. Same w schwartz
Let's see what he's here for. If it is to start, this will mean the line regressed
They used logic. Hes better than any backup and possibly some starters. So is schwartz.
Ralph Vacchiano @RVacchianoSNY 32s32 seconds ago
Beatty, mostly a left tackle in first go-round with the Giants, is expected to play right tackle this time and compete w/Marshall Newhouse.
Any Ballers fans out there? He might have to start jerking off with his left hand for practice.
When will Flowers have time to practice being the RT? takes a little time to get comfortable on the other side. I'm sure Flowers is staying there this year.
Same
If you're looking for Beatty in the starting lineup, circle the bye week, after the trip to London. Beatty isn't in football shape, and neither he nor Flowers has played right tackle in many years.
Put me in the 'yes' column on on this one. I like the man, and I even like his game. Protecting Eli is Job One for a Giant lineman, and that's what Will Beatty does best.
Can he beat out Newhouse? I'd think so.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
I think there is merit in the Anthony Davis and Will Beatty approach of taking time and actually healing, instead of barely getting functional and going and getting injured again.
It's all business any way you cut it. The players gotta do what he's gotta do, and the teams gotta too.
Glad it those two things aligned to get a quality player back.
Glad Jerry swallowed a little bit of his ego.
Any Ballers fans out there? He might have to start jerking off with his left hand for practice.
Haha!!!
Quote:
RT it is.. though I have a sneaking suspicion they are going to wind up flipping EF and Beatty after a few games.
When will Flowers have time to practice being the RT? takes a little time to get comfortable on the other side. I'm sure Flowers is staying there this year.
If he doesn't improve at LT, they're not going to have much choice. I don't think there would be too much of an adjustment period. It would be different if they were moving him inside to OG.
But he did play in 2014.
Where and who plays.....should be determine on the field.....not in an office
Can confirm #Giants re-signing OL Will Beatty, as @MikeGarafolo reported. Expectation now is Ereck Flowers stays LT, Beatty competes at RT
We need him. Is he a starter or a backup? Not our job to decide.
I'm actually ecstatic. Now go pick up another lineman or two for backups.
Beatty was signed for 1 year. He will have to adjust to the right side, regardless of his flaws, imo
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't play in the playoffs or the Super Bowl, he was hurt.
My exact thoughts as well
Well, that's how they broke him in as a rookie, so it's not really that insane.
Will Beatty's one-year deal with #NYG includes $1.1m fully gtd, $750k in incentives, source said.
Quote:
HOW do people know what kind of shape beatty is in? my guess is he has to have been working out for giants to throw him a million lol
My exact thoughts as well
Probably a work out of some intensity went along with the physical.
My question is where were the asshats on this?? Dissapointed...
Link - ( New Window )
...but for the Giants to sign a Will Beatty, with the history they have with this player, screams one thing and one thing only:
Coaches and management are back-filling as fast as they can with a current O-line that is a MAJOR concern for everyone associated with this organization.
Not a great state to be in... but there you have it.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
I don't think there was any doubt, but what do I know..
Link - ( New Window )
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
Pretty excited about both developments.
Quote:
Starting Tackle of the SuperBowl Champion Giants, Will Beatty.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't start for the Super Bowl Champion Giants, but Newhouse started for the Super Bowl Chamption Pakers. And it didn't make everyone happy. Irony can be so ironic.
This is also false. Newhouse wasn't in the league in 2010. His first year was 2011.. he was on the 15-1 Packer team we beat in the Divisional rd.
Pretty excited about both developments.
Still not happy about the tardiness of this though. Ostensibly the same guys in place as last year and now they determine it's not enough.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
Please point to specific games where he did, I would like to watch them.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
And since it's not a street fight...
Point to which specific games where he played RT well, I would love to watch them.
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
I'm not sold that there WERE better options. You were picking between a #1 overall pick that the team that drafted him didn't want that badly, or an injury-prone LT the team that drafted him didn't want that badly.
We need to admit that the free agent market wasn't exactly piping hot with solutions for that position.
Good signing. Helps the starting line and depth as well.
Quote:
and played it well.
Please point to specific games where he did, I would like to watch them.
Might have been his first or second year. Started a few games there and was solid. No, I can't tell you the specific week or opponent, it's been a while. But I do remember that sticking out and giving me hope that he could be a viable LT.
Obviously, the Giants don't make snap decisions except during the draft.
Quote:
and played it well.
Please point to specific games where he did, I would like to watch them.
I don't know if he played it well, but in his rookie year, 2009, he started four games at RT in place of Kareem McKenzie, including the last three games of the season.
Quote:
but any chance we might be using Beatty as a 3rd Tackle/Blocking TE during obvious run situations to get his feet wet?
Well, that's how they broke him in as a rookie, so it's not really that insane.
I think they did this in 2012 as well when Locklear was playing LT before he broke his leg.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Am I missing something? Haven't looked at the numbers for him in a while
Pretty excited about both developments.
I used to be a Will Beatty fan, but my take on all of this is that the Giants are quite desperate and concerned about the O-line unit.
Yes we do, so...
Beatty is here for that LT spot. Give it up Flowers.
I didn't, have to eat crow I guess. It didn't seem either
party wanted anything to do with each other.
He has to be better than a Newhouse at RT, please!
Quote:
Thing is, can he over take Newhouse on right side..not having played that side much..How much is really his motivation too?
Beatty is here for that LT spot. Give it up Flowers.
Not a shot in hell UNLESS EF tanks the entire season..
Quote:
But Beatty has considerably better left tackle technique than Flowers.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Beatty does have excellent hands, very fast with the ability to keep himself clean in PP. Probably among the best of the LTs in the league.
You win sir.
Quote:
if you bring in new guys
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
Quote:
In comment 13094530 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
But Beatty has considerably better left tackle technique than Flowers.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Beatty does have excellent hands, very fast with the ability to keep himself clean in PP. Probably among the best of the LTs in the league.
Keep himself clean in pass pro? What do you mean?
Quote:
But Beatty has considerably better left tackle technique than Flowers.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Beatty's hands are better against speed rushers than Flowers'.
Quote:
In comment 13094494 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
if you bring in new guys
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
The Cowboys drafted Tyron Smith at #9 and he spent his first two years at RT before moving over to LT. The Giants did not have that luxury with Flowers.
Quote:
In comment 13094552 B in ALB said:
Quote:
In comment 13094530 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
But Beatty has considerably better left tackle technique than Flowers.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Beatty does have excellent hands, very fast with the ability to keep himself clean in PP. Probably among the best of the LTs in the league.
Keep himself clean in pass pro? What do you mean?
Keep defenders off his body and reroute them effectively.
Pretty excited about both developments.
And you know this......how?
I doubt it... Jerry Reese drafted Flowers to be a left tackle so dammit, he's going to play left tackle!!
Quote:
In comment 13094574 MOOPS said:
Quote:
In comment 13094552 B in ALB said:
Quote:
In comment 13094530 Mr. Bungle said:
Quote:
But Beatty has considerably better left tackle technique than Flowers.
And since it's not a street fight...
Considerably better LT technique? This isn't true. But carry on.
Please tell us what about his technique is considerably superior.
Beatty does have excellent hands, very fast with the ability to keep himself clean in PP. Probably among the best of the LTs in the league.
Keep himself clean in pass pro? What do you mean?
Keep defenders off his body and reroute them effectively.
Huh. I want them in my fuckin pads in pass pro. Locked up nice and tight to create that nice pocket. But what do I know?
Quote:
In comment 13094494 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
if you bring in new guys
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
Dallas drafted Martin to play tackle. He is not their long term pro bowl guard.
Can we please stop these silly but he was drafted at this draft order number so he must play at this position rhetoric.
Quote:
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
Just reading tea leaves. From everything Reese has said, I never believed he wanted to spend another first round pick on an OL. Yet there was that wave of rumors just before the draft of Giants having interest in Conklin. And I don't buy a disinformation theory for that.
Bringing Beatty back would not have been easy for JR. A nudge from above . . . I can see it.
One million with 750 guaranteed. A bargain if you ask me.
Quote:
In comment 13094521 shyster said:
Quote:
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
Just reading tea leaves. From everything Reese has said, I never believed he wanted to spend another first round pick on an OL. Yet there was that wave of rumors just before the draft of Giants having interest in Conklin. And I don't buy a disinformation theory for that.
Bringing Beatty back would not have been easy for JR. A nudge from above . . . I can see it.
So, you're just doubling down on the the assumptions here. Do you have any basis for your comments?
You're just guessing.
In the meantime Beatty can push Newhouse but it makes me wonder if Pugh's injury is more serious.
One million with 750 guaranteed. A bargain if you ask me.
You don't understand the cap and take things at face value. Add that million onto the cap hit after he was cut and the dead money. Add them together and it's over $10 million I believe with approx. $6 million in actual hard cap dollars (not dead money)
WOW!!!
Seriously... wishing Beatty the best - there were stretches where he was very good.
Hoping he can rebuild his career here.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
Quote:
In comment 13094525 26.2 said:
Quote:
In comment 13094494 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
if you bring in new guys
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
The Cowboys drafted Tyron Smith at #9 and he spent his first two years at RT before moving over to LT. The Giants did not have that luxury with Flowers.
Bingo, other teams have also done it in this league.
One million with 750 guaranteed. A bargain if you ask me.
This guy who would go work out about 7 teams. It took Gettleman personally reaching out to him just to get him to show up for a Panthers workout. Very weird IMO.
In the meantime Beatty can push Newhouse but it makes me wonder if Pugh's injury is more serious.
Doubt it. Has more to do with Newhouse. Wonder if Newhouse can play guard?
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If he gets his nose bloodied he'll be on season ending IR for cosmetic surgery.
Quote:
Beatty.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If he gets his nose bloodied he'll be on season ending IR for cosmetic surgery.
See right there. Come on man. He is not some softee.
Quote:
In comment 13094525 26.2 said:
Quote:
In comment 13094494 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
if you bring in new guys
If Beatty ends up at LT at some point and Flowers moves to RT as some suspect that would be an indictment against the organization that allowed other better quality options pass on because they wouldn't move Flowers to RT.
I still hope that they won't be so quick to pull the trigger on Flowers.
Well, if you think about it, had Beatty stayed healthy last season, Flowers never would have played LT.
.
In the short term, yes. In the long term, no.
You draft somebody at #9, to be your LT moving forward.
Dallas drafted Martin to play tackle. He is not their long term pro bowl guard.
Can we please stop these silly but he was drafted at this draft order number so he must play at this position rhetoric.
They had Smith at LT, I think he was drafted to play
where he is playing. He was the 16th pick I believe,
not a top ten pick. There is a difference at OL,
nothing to do with 'rhetoric'.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If these guys are "beat up" already under the new CBA then maybe they need to rethink their career choice. What's going to happen in Week 9? A sudden second wind? Come on. I get what you're saying but there is absolutely no reason these guys shouldn't be ready to go Week 1.
A whole lot of lounge chair Spartans in here.
It's a big plus (he won't stay if he can't pass the physical).
I think Flowers will stay at LT (for the time being); Beatty will challenge Newhouse for RT.
A whole lot of lounge chair Spartans in here.
"soft" came straight out of the locker room, fwiw.
You and me both. He said "look i know his name, lets sign him."
Quote:
when he had to have his retina re-attached to his eyeball and then went out to play football again.
A whole lot of lounge chair Spartans in here.
"soft" came straight out of the locker room, fwiw.
A whole lot of 6-10 came out of that locker room too recently.
And he just got a fully guaranteed million bucks again, so how true one curiously anonymous opinion is, who knows. "Soft" isn't a term one typically attaches to career offensive linemen.
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
Many questioned his pick as a 2nd, but with all the failures the Giants have had along the OL in the Reese era, Beatty stands out as a relative success, even if he doesn't quite fit the profile some would like as a physical OT who can excel in run game and pass pro. Yet he was likely never a TC favorite, who knows what was said.
After he tore his pec (second serious injury in three years and a bitch to come back from) and they parted ways, the door was wide open for Will Beatty to call it a career. But he did not.
If the long recovery period + not knowing whether he would be re-signed anywhere, I take this as a good sign for his commitment and desire, whatever position he winds up playing.
Now just got sign Patrick Lewis from the Seahawks to back up guard / center and lets go.
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
You mean here with the Giants? Or elsewhere because he was in demand with about 6 to 7 teams but he wasn't interested.
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
Thanks. I thought it was Gilbride who questioned his toughness.
So are Jerry and Newhouse. Neither of them were ever as good as Beatty. Does it mean they're better today? Doubt it but I find it hard to believe that at some point Will Beatty wont be taking over at either RT or LT.
Quote:
Gilbride, "We made the gamble that William Beatty was the guy at LT. There's no question he has the physical talent but toughness is the key"
Thanks. I thought it was Gilbride who questioned his toughness.
This could be in relation to recovery from injuries as well. Specifically his back
If you take a look at his Twitter account you'll see he's got two young kids with another on the way. I'm sure he's well motivated not just to hit his incentives for this season but to earn a contact after this as well.
Also, here's what JPP had to say about him around 6 months ago:
Quote:
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
Quote:
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
So why didn't the Giants sign him 2 weeks ago? What changed so late in the preseason?
I think the Giants can suffer a loss (I know, knock on wood) to one of the starters (with the possible exception of Richburg) and be able to shuffle things around and be somewhat OK.
Well played, Sir! This signing exposes a ton of bullshit that's been dressed up as BBI threads over the past several weeks (if not months.) Bottom line: Giants management is scrambling to shore up a painfully obvious weakness. Hope Beatty can help. But he is no panacea.
Quote:
In comment 13094741 baadbill said:
Quote:
wasn't he signed earlier in the pre-season? Did he suddenly get better or did the Giants simply get more desperate? Has to be one or the other (and clearly Beatty didn't suddenly become a better player over the past 3 weeks).
Am I missing something? Are we really expecting to see someone unsigned through the 3rd preseason game become a rock on the OL this year? Is that seriously a valid expectation?
In comparison to what we have I find it hard to believe that Beatty is any worse than our 5th best offensive lineman. You can make a strong argument he's our 3rd best.
Teams with good linemen and/or young prospects they believe in dont need a player like Beatty. we have few good lineman and 1 7th rd pick who may have potential. Coupled with knowing the offense this move was a no brainer!
So why didn't the Giants sign him 2 weeks ago? What changed so late in the preseason?
Health and perhaps they didnt expect their offensive lineman to play so poorly through three games in the preseason.
This is totally off topic but I"e been trying to send you the madden invite. Do you have the game yet? Email me at madden17bbi@gmail.com
Quote:
In comment 13094521 shyster said:
Quote:
and J Mara is the 800 pound gorilla (when he wants to be). Have a hunch he might be the motor behind this move.
Also possible that he was the one who wanted Conklin at draft time, while Reese was stuck on Floyd.
You're really assuming a lot here.
No, he isn't.
How so? Still waiting on Coughlin's 3 offers to coach. ANy news on that?
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
Good job Jerry.
Quote:
Beatty.
1.) He knows the offense already. So very little learning curve. He needs timing and to get his nose bloodied.
2.) He has not been beaten up in camp - and remember camp is not what it used to be, either.
He may not be ready for Dallas as starter, but he's likely the 3rd and short/goal line tackle eligible. By NLT game 3 he's starting RT. Because of the pass rushing of today, I don't know if the traditional LT and RT physical requirements are the same as 10 years ago.
Being cut and seeing how nobody really wanted him probably cut some of the resentment he had toward NYG.
If these guys are "beat up" already under the new CBA then maybe they need to rethink their career choice. What's going to happen in Week 9? A sudden second wind? Come on. I get what you're saying but there is absolutely no reason these guys shouldn't be ready to go Week 1.
I'm saying HE is not nicked up - like Pugh and Jerry. He's not being cut by a team and has small injuries. He's clean and should have no reason not to be game ready in two weeks maybe three weeks..nothing to hold him back.
He'll probably get a job elsewhere though where he can start.
There is none and there never has been. They are just sticking to their guns because they said it would never happen.
Quote:
accordingly.
So are Jerry and Newhouse. Neither of them were ever as good as Beatty. Does it mean they're better today? Doubt it but I find it hard to believe that at some point Will Beatty wont be taking over at either RT or LT.
I would say better than 50-50 at some point. But not a certainty by any stretch. Dude has been out of work all offseason for a reason and is now being paid at essentially replacement veteran level. I'm in favor of giving him a shot but it's not clear to me that he will be better than Newhouse. His potential is definitely higher though so it's worth a try.
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
Good job Jerry.
AcidTest... out of all due respect, the signing of Will Beatty is not really a good job, but rather a move made out of desperation.
Pugh, a 1st round pick, was an "all Big East" OLT and Syracuse for 3 years. Somehow, he can't be an OLT in the pros -- despite that 2013 he started all 16 games and only allowed 3 sacks.
David Diehl - 5th round OG. But apparently HE can play OLT.
Flowers - 9th overall. Two years starting OLT at a major football factory. People HERE don't think he can be an OLT. The Giants do. They're likely correct, but fans are impatient. BIG TOUGH KID with big upside. Just needs to do the work. Sadly for some of you, the Giants LIKE Flowers at OLT. If they thought Flowers was awful and wanted to mess with that, they could have bumped Pugh back to OLT and Flowers to ORT without re signing Beatty. They haven't.
Bobby Hart - late round college ORT who the Giants brass said "projected to OG in the pros." By training camp, he's a backup ORT and backup OG, not winning a starting job over very average Jerry and Newhouse.
Beatty - 2nd round pick -- plays both OT spots (he filled in for McKenzie at ORT for 4 games) Can't stay healthy -- even off the field. He's not being brought in to play OLT. But IF he is healthy -- which is a big IF, he could provide depth at either spot, and maybe challenge Newhouse at some point during the season.
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
Quote:
posters who said this would never happen were not irrational, although they might have moderated their stance after the OL had such a poor showing in three straight games, even though it was the preseason.
I thought the Giants had moved on from Beatty, but started to advocate during the third preseason game that they should at least inquire about bringing him back. I'm glad they did. Before this signing, our best depth was Hart, a second year seventh round pick who has been underwhelming this preseason.
Good job Jerry.
AcidTest... out of all due respect, the signing of Will Beatty is not really a good job, but rather a move made out of desperation.
I agree it's a move out of desperation. But it's still good that Jerry didn't let whatever differences originally existed between the Giants and Betty prevent him from reassessing the situation based on our current needs.
Zero downside. Inexpensive. Experience with the Giants and this offense. Quite possibly better than all but three OL on the roster. People calling this signing a joke should realize the joke was the inaction from this offseason, not this signing.
They signed a a guy off the street to a one year deal.
Quote:
.
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
Considering all we who are "puffing our chests out" get to see is the game if we could see what the coaches saw with less exposure I'd say that's even more reason to feel good about ourselves.
He'll probably get a job elsewhere though where he can start.
You don't like the Canadian import?
I thought that dude was suppose to be the best center
in the CFL. Last year he was on IR, don't know what they feel
about him. Nobody ever talks about Jones.
He's had offers to go to other teams but was waiting on the Giants. He has a townhouse in Secaucus (sp) and wanted to stay!
It's possible Beatty never starts a game this year.
It was never about any downside. It was more about not much of an upside.
But, as Eric pointed out in another thread, it probably has more to do with Hart playing poorly than it does with Flowers or Newhouse. As a swing-tackle, Beatty is clearly a better option than Hart. Whether or not he becomes a starter remains to be seen.
Quote:
In comment 13094472 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
.
Don't be so sure they signed BEatty simply because things looked bad in that game. Some of you are sticking your chest out with the told you so stuff but it's likely the Giants saw things we didn't see that prompted them to sign Beatty. And I don't necessarily think those things took place in the first quarter of a preseason game.
Considering all we who are "puffing our chests out" get to see is the game if we could see what the coaches saw with less exposure I'd say that's even more reason to feel good about ourselves.
You're locked in. I won't bother debating this crap with you. It's not always black and white. If beatty doesn't play a game this season can we revisit this thread?
It's a one year deal for a guy that's been out of football for a while now yet this is a move out of desperation? WTF are some of you talking about?
It's possible Beatty never starts a game this year.
Newhouse hasnt regressed, he just plain old sucks.
I would be shocked if Beatty doesnt take over a job at some point.
He's had offers to go to other teams but was waiting on the Giants. He has a townhouse in Secaucus (sp) and wanted to stay!
Interesting Info Fred. Didn't know that he had offers from other teams. That is good to hear.
Maybe the timing just worked out right and Beatty comes in and starts right away. If he's an upgrade, wonderful.
Dialed in!
Dialed in!
I heard that too. The Giants give guys like Ralph table scraps. WFAN would be better off putting me on the air over a guy like Ralph. I may know nothing but I speak the truth!
Guess they didn't read all the threads on bbi explaining how stupid it would be to do so.
No names necessary!
The odds of finding a player now that will be an upgrade is slim to none. So, depth is something to get excited about.
people are excited b/c the OL looked like a big weakness after 3 preseason games and the NYG did something about it by adding a player with some recent history of being a decent OT. Normally at this time of year, in a situation like this, most teams just roll with what they have.
They signed a a guy off the street to a one year deal.
If anything, it's now NOT in a state of crisis. Even if he's only a backup, we now likely have a viable option to plug in somewhere once he's in game shape in a few weeks.
Well, I have to say in his defense that he wasn't on skates keeping Eli vertical
1 year - not two years, no? Missed 2015. Broke tibia 2014 last game.
Tore pec offseason last year, then had shoulder injury and opted for surgery.
Beatty will be the RT, not LT. Flowers is the future and doing ok, I think people just blame everything that goes wrong on him. He was fine last week against the Jets.
Give it 2 weeks, people will be yelling for Newhouse. It sure seems that Beatty is much more highly thought of now than when he left. I guess time does make the heart grow fonder.
Now *thats* the move that would lead to us doing shots in Manhattan at 8am!
of Satan ......
Beatty was not all world but he was decent and I hope
He is healthy enough to start at LT he will be an Upgrade
at the position and Flowers can still groom to take
over at some point I am glad they made the Move
Beatty is a solid religious dude that loved playing here
I doubt anyone knows all the details when he was not
retained . Some just belched out whatever came to mind
without knowing Jack shit .
The Line has played poorly at least he can provide some
depth .
I am Glad he is Back ..
Classic.
I hope we have some saved threads and I haven't read one post on here, but a lot of people have some crow to eat.
arrogance humbled.
Should be ready by Week 12. Can't wait
To be fair, it's not like the team ever brings back guys they part ways with. It doesn't happen often. Usually once you're out, you're out.
I don't know, didn't we sign Shawn Andrews in late August of 2010?
Baad, we know that cuts were coming and OL depth was a need..He's versatile depth, who, if he's got gas left in his tank, could fill in as needed..In that sense, I have no problem with the signing, especially for 1 year..As to why he wasn't signed by someone, no idea..Hopefully a few more depth signings are in the offing..
Classic.
I hope we have some saved threads and I haven't read one post on here, but a lot of people have some crow to eat.
arrogance humbled.
It's a flawed assumption, especially knowing we had a hard on for Spiller a year or two before Wilson.
Quote:
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
I don't know, didn't we sign Shawn Andrews in late August of 2010?
I don't remember Arc, but this thread is talking like we just got an all-pro tackle who was sitting home waiting for someone to call ... just doesn't make a lot of sense to me ... if he's a clear cut improvement over the players in camp, what took the Giants (and everyone else) so long?
I would bet the Giants have been talking to him for a while about the possibility of his return.
Coming off a series of injuries and his own team questioned his heart, ect. I could certainly see why teams might have been seeing who shook loose before taking a chance on him but supposedly he had multiple deals on the table so there's that too.
Personally, I think we are pretty fortunate he was still available this late in camp.
Finally, I dont care how pessimistic a person you are and even if you think Beatty is worthless, how in Jesus's name can anyone not think he's better than Stingily?
Quote:
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
Baad, we know that cuts were coming and OL depth was a need..He's versatile depth, who, if he's got gas left in his tank, could fill in as needed..In that sense, I have no problem with the signing, especially for 1 year..As to why he wasn't signed by someone, no idea..Hopefully a few more depth signings are in the offing..
BB'56 - I agree. I'm not trying to put down the signing. It's just that I don't understand all the excitement - it's as though the savior has been found and the OL issues have suddenly been solved. I don't get it.
Quote:
In comment 13095171 baadbill said:
Quote:
weeks ago? Please help me understand so I can join in all the hoopla.
I don't know, didn't we sign Shawn Andrews in late August of 2010?
I don't remember Arc, but this thread is talking like we just got an all-pro tackle who was sitting home waiting for someone to call ... just doesn't make a lot of sense to me ... if he's a clear cut improvement over the players in camp, what took the Giants (and everyone else) so long?
Meh, I think that's an exaggeration. I don't see many (or really, any) people acting that way.
I think a lot of us were a bit concerned with the OL play this preseason and are glad the Giants at least acknowledged that we could use a little help. What do we have to lose here?
Besides, the Cardinals (and Jags + Panthers IIRC) also had interest. So it's not like we're the only team that thought he could help.
It was simply about the near unanimous cries with 100% confidence and condescension from the usual suspects "the Giants have moved on" "that ship has sailed" "the Giants cut Beatty because he was soft and had a poor attitude" and tons more from the masses of know-it-alls any time Beatty's name came up in a thread.
I just find it awesome for that reason, not that I think Beatty is great. Though I do think he was a little bit unfairly maligned here, I have no idea if he'll even contribute to the team and it was never my point.
If you're talking about weeks ago, I believe he still hadn't fully recovered from his injury by the start of camp.
Rotoworld has him turning down tryouts in April, and he didn't even tryout before the Jags in the middle of August.
It was simply about the near unanimous cries with 100% confidence and condescension from the usual suspects "the Giants have moved on" "that ship has sailed" "the Giants cut Beatty because he was soft and had a poor attitude" and tons more from the masses of know-it-alls any time Beatty's name came up in a thread.
I just find it awesome for that reason, not that I think Beatty is great. Though I do think he was a little bit unfairly maligned here, I have no idea if he'll even contribute to the team and it was never my point.
I didn't. I wasn't thinking anyone in particular. Just comments about Beatty actually starting. The just sounds crazy to me. How often do you find a starting OT sitting on the couch in the last 2 days of August?
The plan right now is for Beatty to play on the right side but I think they're going to flip before mid season and Flowers is going to end up at RT with WB back at LT.
I know there's also practices, but before the Pugh injury, my recollection is that the competition between Newhouse and Hart was up in the air. And Hart has also had to spend time at LG in practices the last two weeks in anticipation of playing there in the games.
I'm not a huge Hart fan but it seems an odd context to render a verdict on Hart as an OT. There's been a lot more of Newhouse at OT on display the last two weeks.
I guess we'll see.
Beatty did the right thing for himself - surgery. The Giants wanted him to "play through the pain", he wouldn't go for it, so they showed him the door.
Now he's back, rested and healthy. I think it's going to work out fine for him and the team.
I would bet the Giants have been talking to him for a while about the possibility of his return.
and Flowers better get the lead out of his ass because there is a lot of talk about how rough and tough he is and we move no one on his side of the field and he is victimized by every speed rusher he faces.
Will the Giants remake the line before the opener?
He wasn't all world and if anyone with two eyes couldn't
see this as a Good attempt to improve the Team is smoking
crack ..
Beatty wasn't all pro and surely wan't chopped liver .
He is more liked then most think and I could see him temporarily unseating Flowers . If big If that he does
end up at some point Starting at LT Imagine Flowers
may even Flourish and Improve the Run Game to respectability
Give the Guy a Chance before making irrational statements
I also hope they can add a back up Center ,,
Beatty was a good player who was cut A) to free up money for the moves they made this off-season and B) because the organization was trying to move on from injured players. I believe it also rubbed the FO the wrong way that Beatty didn't play last season after it appeared his pec injury healed.
Beatty is a talented player when healthy and motivated. While Flowers projects as a better LT in the future, I think Beatty is better in pass pro now. Beatty is without a doubt an immediate upgrade over Newhouse.
Signing Beatty for 1 mil is a no brainier given the state of the OL and the Giants got better today.
The posters who said the Giants would never take him back look out of touch with reality.
The offensive line is so bad they feel Beatty is an improvement.
On the plus side I think? they saved some money lol.
How many years has Beatty got left, even if it turns out that he's sensational right now? Not too many. Enough for Flowers to develop and get a shot at LT again. This all seems hopelessly optimistic, but what's not to like about it?
Beatty was a good player who was cut A) to free up money for the moves they made this off-season and B) because the organization was trying to move on from injured players. I believe it also rubbed the FO the wrong way that Beatty didn't play last season after it appeared his pec injury healed.
Beatty is a talented player when healthy and motivated. While Flowers projects as a better LT in the future, I think Beatty is better in pass pro now. Beatty is without a doubt an immediate upgrade over Newhouse.
Signing Beatty for 1 mil is a no brainier given the state of the OL and the Giants got better today.
Beatty at his height was a very good pass protector which is what you need first and foremost at LT. Many of us here wanted gim resigned and he got a strong contract due to a very good year previous.
He is a bit injry prone and there are questions about just how much he loves football. But if healthy and motivated , he should be an above average pass protector which will be huge for us.
Quote:
For a year, off injury, so its going take a bit to get back to par. People expecting to go right off the bat.
Should be ready by Week 12. Can't wait
You're a ray of sunshine.
First of all, it is a good move. Why? Because we have a tackle position with Marshall freaking Newhouse as the starter. And I'm sure Marshall is a nice guy, and I'm sure he works hard, but this is a results business, and Marshall was not getting good results. Not this year, and not last year, either.
And if Marshall Newhouse is your starter, then those backups must be even worse... and they are. When your starters can't score any points in approximately 4 quarters of football against the Bills and the Jets, and your franchise QB doesn't even have time on almost every snap to even get the ball to his first read, you cannot go into the season without doing something. It may work, and it may not, but you have to do something.
So Beatty might end up bolstering the OL, or he may never get on the field. But the status quo was a no quo. Criticize Beatty if you want, but he wasn't the one stinking up the field all preseason.
So everyone take a deep breath, cross your fingers, and hope he can give Eli the protection he needs to be effective at RT.
If they've guaranteed him $1M then he's very likely to make the roster, especially considering the reserves we currently have.
I prefer Apple over OL. Apple is 6'1" and the Giants need a tall corner to pair with RC who's 6'2". Jenkins is only 5'10" and taller receivers are going to exploit their height advantage (as evidenced by the Decker TD on Saturday). The Giants OL this year is the same as last year and last year the offense was not the problem. It was the horrific defense.
Quote:
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
I prefer Apple over OL. Apple is 6'1" and the Giants need a tall corner to pair with RC who's 6'2". Jenkins is only 5'10" and taller receivers are going to exploit their height advantage (as evidenced by the Decker TD on Saturday). The Giants OL this year is the same as last year and last year the offense was not the problem. It was the horrific defense.
You must have misunderstood what I said about Apple, I said I was "not unhappy" with the pick. And all you had to do was watch the Eagles game in Philly last year and most of last season then roll it all into this preseason to see that the OL is too often overmatched.
It's not an admission of a mistake. It's an ongoing process.
I'm suspecting Giants had targets on the OL in both the draft and FA, but the value relative to draft position and/or contract $ commitment wasn't there.
Bratty is back because none of the other options worked out and no UDFA gem was discovered in training camp. He's also healthy now and wasn't last spring when the cut was announced.
I mean, Tunsil fell but we didn't bite so who would you wants?
It is a passing league and the more solid DB's you have the better off you are on defense. Our defense needed a lot of help.
Perhaps Beatty's departure was less acrimonious than many fans assumed. And maybe, a few months after Coughlin and Flaherty left the building, some grudges began to abate.
Whatever Will Beatty may be, he's not David Diehl or Shaun O'Hara or Rich Seubert, and he's sure not Chris Snee. Coughlin and Flaherty seemed to love those guys, and stuck with them through good times and bad. If the grumpy old men were still running the show, I suspect Beatty's return would have been more controversial.
Quote:
admission that the mistake of not addressing the disaster of an OL in the off-season has presented itself. Like many, I wanted an early OL pick in the draft but I can honestly sat that I'm not unhappy with the Apple pick. He looks every bit the part but somewhere, somehow, I would have liked to have seen an OL pick. After coming up empty there I was certain they had a plan B in place but again, nada in FA. No use crying over spilled milk but what frustrates beyond descripition is leaving our franchise QB hanging out to dry in the autumn years of his career ...when he needs the best possible protection the most. The shitty play was evident last season and the personnel hadn't changed along the line, unforgivable IMO. I pray they can put this thing together with spit, glue and tape so that we can witness Eli flourish and make another run to glory.
It's not an admission of a mistake. It's an ongoing process.
I'm suspecting Giants had targets on the OL in both the draft and FA, but the value relative to draft position and/or contract $ commitment wasn't there.
Bratty is back because none of the other options worked out and no UDFA gem was discovered in training camp. He's also healthy now and wasn't last spring when the cut was announced.
You call it a "process" and I'll call it an experiment that's been ongoing since the last SB. Sure, there are those that will point to the various draft picks but in my opinion there have been reaches in the draft, poor evaluation on the FA side and the "process" itself started too late. We needed, and still do need, more cornerstone OL and we're still seeing the FO shuffling the deck.
NYG swallowed pride to reverse their course, and so did Beatty, to return for $1M.
Time will tell. I wouldn't rule out Beatty at RT. Let's see how Flowers and Newhouse fare while Beatty gets up to speed and into football shape.
I agree that WB opens the year as the swing tackle. That means he'll get 2nd team reps (at least) on both sides. Solari can take the evaluation from there.
So, now the front office has bitten the bullet and brought him back, will the coaches do the same and pull musical chairs? Fubar.
He doesn't have that kind of status to do that.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
As in many things with BBI, the most accurate answer is somewhere between the two extremes.
Quote:
Now he's the savior.
As in many things with BBI, the most accurate answer is somewhere between the two extremes.
No doubt. I always liked Beatty, thought he was solid, not spectacular, and was paid for what he was- an average LT. Good in PP.
I'm all for this..Hope he has something left.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
Agreed..The good news is he's a decent, hopefully versatile depth guy, imo
...of the New York Giants, the bar is set very low. The real, significant upgrading of this unit will occur in 2017. Will Beatty is a 2016 stand-in.
Will Beatty was NOT signed to START. He has been signed for DEPTH, and I would expect at least one more signing from the training camp castaways.
The move makes me happy - to me, this was - and IS the Achilles heel of this team. Beatty gives the Giants a MUCH NEEDED solid backup - and if he can regain his form - who knows? Possibly a starting role in the future. His injury history is what got him cut, and his injury history is what will keep him on the bench - you simply can't rely on him.
The game has changed. Good Pass rushers come off both sides. 3-4 OLBs move side to side.
Look at the Giants, OV moved JPP to the left DE position. The Giants aren't the only team with two good edge rushers that require the opposing team to have two good pass protection OTs.
I know there's also practices, but before the Pugh injury, my recollection is that the competition between Newhouse and Hart was up in the air. And Hart has also had to spend time at LG in practices the last two weeks in anticipation of playing there in the games.
I'm not a huge Hart fan but it seems an odd context to render a verdict on Hart as an OT. There's been a lot more of Newhouse at OT on display the last two weeks.
I guess we'll see.
This is a good thought process. BBI has been looking for the next Kevin Boothe. It might be Hart. Not quite good enough to start, but a flexible OL that can play Tackle or Guard. When they have him take snaps at center, we will know. IIRC, Boothe could not play OT, just OG and C. At 22 Hart is young enough to still grow and develop his technique.
Will Beatty was NOT signed to START. He has been signed for DEPTH, and I would expect at least one more signing from the training camp castaways.
The move makes me happy - to me, this was - and IS the Achilles heel of this team. Beatty gives the Giants a MUCH NEEDED solid backup - and if he can regain his form - who knows? Possibly a starting role in the future. His injury history is what got him cut, and his injury history is what will keep him on the bench - you simply can't rely on him.
Maybe it's not so much "hysterics" but rather a great, big "yawn" when it comes to the signing of Will Beatty. He is not the answer in raising the overall quality of the O-line unit. He's the best the Giants can do at this late stage -- he adds a little back-up glue to a thin offense line that will need lots of serious attention in the 2017 off-season.
Quote:
In comment 13094452 YorkAveGiant said:
Quote:
Starting Tackle of the SuperBowl Champion Giants, Will Beatty.
if he did that as a Packer, Raven or Seahawk, everyone would be happy.
He didn't start for the Super Bowl Champion Giants, but Newhouse started for the Super Bowl Chamption Pakers. And it didn't make everyone happy. Irony can be so ironic.
This is also false. Newhouse wasn't in the league in 2010. His first year was 2011.. he was on the 15-1 Packer team we beat in the Divisional rd.
p.s.-- I think the addition of Beatty is as much about Flowers as it is about Newhouse. Whoever sucks the most will be the guy Beatty replaces and it won't involve a move to the right side by Flowers.
Quote:
Maybe it's not so much "hysterics" but rather a great, big "yawn" when it comes to the signing of Will Beatty. He is not the answer in raising the overall quality of the O-line unit. He's the best the Giants can do at this late stage -- he adds a little back-up glue to a thin offense line that will need lots of serious attention in the 2017 off-season.
I see that as an important upgrade.
It's a bit disappointing to go in the reverse direction of a good decision, imv.
you make it sound like TC signed these players you speak of lol
No plan.
No plan.
I don't assign fault here. Money was not an issue. Players worthy of that money were..
I've been a Reese guy but I do assign blame. There were offensive linemen on the market that cost a fraction of what we spent.
We can spend all the money on defense we want. This team is still only going where Eli takes it. To put him behind that right side is tough to justify.
Yeah, that wasn't directed at you.
I've been a Reese guy but I do assign blame. There were offensive linemen on the market that cost a fraction of what we spent.
We can spend all the money on defense we want. This team is still only going where Eli takes it. To put him behind that right side is tough to justify.
WHO? Osemele?
I wanted Conklin, but he went before us.
Who were the two noteworthy LTs out there? Russ Okung, a failed first-round pick his own team didn't really want (and who's name travels a lot more than his actual skill level) or Ryan Clady, a consistently injured big name player his team didn't really want.
The only other player of note is Mitchell Schwartz, who signed a deal that puts him in the highest paid players at his position.
OTs - ( New Window )
Osemele got 60/5 and Schwartz got 5/33. So yes, infinitely more.
Who gives a fuck about Jenkins? It's not like the dumped all resources on him- They didn't.
They clearly explored OTs.....
Quote:
I can't look now but did Osemele and Schwartz combined even cost as much as Jenkins?
Osemele got 60/5 and Schwartz got 5/33. So yes, infinitely more.
Guaranteed? And I believe that non-guaranteed money is still less than Vernon.
There wasn't an OT to be had. Okung is a major injury risk, let's see if he makes it through the year.
And have you explored the possibility that Osemele/Schwartz never wanted to play here?
Quote:
In comment 13096630 Go Terps said:
Quote:
I can't look now but did Osemele and Schwartz combined even cost as much as Jenkins?
Osemele got 60/5 and Schwartz got 5/33. So yes, infinitely more.
Guaranteed? And I believe that non-guaranteed money is still less than Vernon.
Guarantees:
Osemele: $25.4
Schwartz: $20.7
Vernon was $85m ($54m guaranteed). It wasn't less.