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How Giants' defensive line got the better of Cowboys' O-line

gidiefor : Mod : 9/14/2016 9:27 am
Jordan Raanan's Film Review Of Giants-Cowboys Game
Link - ( New Window )
love that pocket on the Cruz TD  
Victor in CT : 9/14/2016 9:41 am : link
loved the mauling on the final drive even more. Another JV defense this week should help them get more confidence before the tougher tests begin.
Surprising to me  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/14/2016 9:43 am : link
but Romeo Okwara is getting playing time already.

"Undrafted rookie defensive end Romeo Okwara impressed enough this summer that the Giants used him for 13 plays in his NFL debut. Most of those were on passing downs. Okwara even saw action in the fourth quarter and had a pressure late in the game and on the final drive."

New coach, new era, I suppose.


And thats what I thought would happen  
PatersonPlank : 9/14/2016 9:51 am : link
According to Raanan, in the 2nd half the Giants brought an extra guy into the box to completely stop the run. He said they did this because they realized Dak wasn't going to beat them. This is when the Cowboys offense stopped moving the ball at all (remember they had a number of long drives in the 1st half).

This is why Dak's stats are meaningless. So what he completed 25 passes with no picks. He only hit on 55%, threw no TD's, and was kept in check by the D. He was only hitting what the D wanted him to.
I caught Mike Golic too  
SwirlingEddie : 9/14/2016 9:51 am : link
singing the praises of the Giants' D-line and showing highlights of their run defense throughout the game.
making the offense thrown in front of you  
Randy in CT : 9/14/2016 9:53 am : link
while gearing up to stop the run, isn't a bad game plan.
I expected this from the DL  
chuckydee9 : 9/14/2016 9:58 am : link
this was money well spent.. For those of you that do nothing but bash advanced stats.. they predicted this exact thing.. Snacks is the single most disruptive run defender in the NFL right now and has been for the past couple of years.. He has a bigger impact on stopping the run than JJ Watt, Donald and Mack who are all very highly rated.. Vernon is also a solid above run defender and same with JPP and Hankins..
Great article by Raanan  
ZogZerg : 9/14/2016 10:31 am : link
Also, this was the first game that the Giants Defense played together. There are 8 new starters. One would think they would play better the more time they play together.
They didn't get the better of the Cowboys O-line  
Torrag : 9/14/2016 10:35 am : link
At best it was a wash and probably not that. They racked up insane time of possession moving the ball up and down the field. We didn't affect Prescott much all day. We did commit people to the LoS and handle their ground game. That was the only clear 'win' on the day.
Torrag  
collins25 : 9/14/2016 10:53 am : link
Only clear win? Clearly, shutting Dez down and limiting Witten to nothing after the catch was not a win! It was obvious they wanted to stop the run, take away dez, and make the rookie beat us. Mission accomplished.
RE: They didn't get the better of the Cowboys O-line  
chuckydee9 : 9/14/2016 10:59 am : link
In comment 13121742 Torrag said:
Quote:
At best it was a wash and probably not that. They racked up insane time of possession moving the ball up and down the field. We didn't affect Prescott much all day. We did commit people to the LoS and handle their ground game. That was the only clear 'win' on the day.


That was on the LB and safeties.. Anytime Dallas wanted they were able to get 7 yards with Witten and Beasley... that's what kept the drives alive.. Dak was pressured when he held the ball long enough.. but our LBs are so bad that Witten is open in the middle the second the ball is snapped.. I think it may be time again to start any TE that is playing the giants, because I doubt anyone can run on us effectively.. at least not inside..
RE: They didn't get the better of the Cowboys O-line  
BigBlueShock : 9/14/2016 11:03 am : link
In comment 13121742 Torrag said:
Quote:
At best it was a wash and probably not that. They racked up insane time of possession moving the ball up and down the field. We didn't affect Prescott much all day. We did commit people to the LoS and handle their ground game. That was the only clear 'win' on the day.

Time of possession? Wtf? This is important to you? The defensive game plan was to clearly stop the run, which they did and keep everything in front of them to prevent the big play. This type of game plan will give up some long drives but also prevent much scoring. Which they also did.

Time of possession is the most useless stay in football. Ranaan broke it down for you but you clearly either didn't read it or already have your mind mind up, so nothing nobody says will change your mind. Your outlook is so simple minded, it's comical. Up and down the field? Really?
Nice article, gidie  
Brown Recluse : 9/14/2016 11:03 am : link
.
Witten is a Fall of Fame TE  
gidiefor : Mod : 9/14/2016 11:04 am : link
and while he made a lot of catches -- he made pretty much zero YAC -- and he was brutally punished with each catch

He also missed a few key catches in the last quarter that he normally wouldn't miss - could be blamed on the sunlight -- could be because he was so banged up he couldn't stretch out anymore either : )

He certainly did not make any big plays
RE: They didn't get the better of the Cowboys O-line  
BillT : 9/14/2016 11:12 am : link
In comment 13121742 Torrag said:
Quote:
At best it was a wash and probably not that. They racked up insane time of possession moving the ball up and down the field. We didn't affect Prescott much all day. We did commit people to the LoS and handle their ground game. That was the only clear 'win' on the day.

So we held their running game to 3.4 ypc but we didn't get the better of their OL! And they did that many times, as the article said, with 7 in the box. They dinked and dunked to a good TOP but what did that get them? 12 points. It was a huge victory over the Cowboys OL. Huge. My bet is there won't be another team who does as well all year. Not, at least until we play them again.
This is a nice article.  
DonQuixote : 9/14/2016 11:18 am : link
There is a lot to talk about. The headline is the defensive line, which is appropriate, but here are my takeaways.

1) A good early showing from our rookie coach. The situation was clear and stated up front. Stop the run. The coach also said emphasis was on fundamentals (e.g. tackling). The team looked solid. The coach emphasized physicality. We were the tougher team at the end of the game. All positives.

2) The secondary. Dallas' longest play was 21 yards from a player we have never heard of. Jenkins shut down Bryant and the post-game interviews suggest this was planned and executed. Eli Apple was physical in his first game. DRC played the slot here and there and was a factor (he is really a great player for us btw). I am really looking forward to seeing how they do v. New Orleans ...

Just my two cents.
'Only clear win?'...  
Torrag : 9/14/2016 11:32 am : link
...the OP was addressing our DL v. their OL. That's the only aspect of the matchup my post addresses. We didn't get pass rush. They destroyed us on ToP. It was a close matchup overall but I don't see how that adds up to us 'getting the better of them' as Mr. Ranaan phrased it.
I think our DL got good pressure.  
PatersonPlank : 9/14/2016 11:37 am : link
I'm amazed we didn't get a sack, we could have easily gotten 3 or 4 and also a fumble.
So has O already passed OO?  
manh george : 9/14/2016 11:57 am : link
How many plays was Odighizuwa in for?
I don't know how many of you caught this  
BSIMatt : 9/14/2016 12:25 pm : link
But of Dak's 41 attempts, only 11 I believe went traveled further than 9 yards in the air. Dez had only 5 targets, and it was revealed that the Giants did not have a safety over the top much of the time with Dez. Dak was not going downfield with the ball, a lot of these completions were safe underneath passes to receivers crossing. Giants aren't gonna get a ton of pressure when he is checking it down like that AND he is a run threat. The Giants hammered the Dallas ground game, and once the game wore on the Giants pass rush emerged. Forget stats, there have been former scouts who have raved about the Giants DL performance against Dallas, saying they definitely won in the trenches on both sides of the ball.

Dallas was moving the ball checking it underneath with plays that were a threat to gain yards, but not a threat to produce touchdowns. Low risk, low reward plays that don't lose games but don't win them either.
RE: 'Only clear win?'...  
Dan in the Springs : 9/14/2016 12:34 pm : link
In comment 13121887 Torrag said:
Quote:
...the OP was addressing our DL v. their OL. That's the only aspect of the matchup my post addresses. We didn't get pass rush. They destroyed us on ToP. It was a close matchup overall but I don't see how that adds up to us 'getting the better of them' as Mr. Ranaan phrased it.


By your definition, I think you'd have to concede that containing DP was also a win. One of the reasons the Giants were a bit muted in bringing pressure was that they didn't want to give DP a chance to scramble for yards. He is a mobile guy who you can't turn your back on. Someone always had to have contain assignment against him.

Considering he wasn't able to run for many yards - that's another win for the DL, no?
RE: So has O already passed OO?  
giants#1 : 9/14/2016 12:35 pm : link
In comment 13121935 manh george said:
Quote:
How many plays was Odighizuwa in for?


OO played 17 snaps
Okwara 13
Wynn 5

And again, JPP/Vernon played all but 6 snaps so those 3 primarily got on the field in pass rushing situations for Snacks/Hankins.
More of this...  
KWALL2 : 9/14/2016 12:56 pm : link
Quote:
Safety Landon Collins played 23 snaps in a linebacker-type role


We need Collins and 4-5 DBs early in downs and all game next week vs Saints.
I don't see why people are objecting to the title  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/14/2016 1:03 pm : link
The cowboys wanted to run the ball.
They tried to run the ball a lot.
They got nothing done on the ground, and Prescott could not beat them deep.
RE: 'Only clear win?'...  
Mike in Philly : 9/14/2016 1:09 pm : link
In comment 13121887 Torrag said:
Quote:
...the OP was addressing our DL v. their OL. That's the only aspect of the matchup my post addresses. We didn't get pass rush. They destroyed us on ToP. It was a close matchup overall but I don't see how that adds up to us 'getting the better of them' as Mr. Ranaan phrased it.

20-19 is getting the better of them. And that's the only stat that really matters.
RE: More of this...  
Jay on the Island : 9/14/2016 2:45 pm : link
In comment 13122022 KWALL2 said:
Quote:


Quote:


Safety Landon Collins played 23 snaps in a linebacker-type role



We need Collins and 4-5 DBs early in downs and all game next week vs Saints.

I don't think that would work. Granted it was Perry Fewell but the Giants tried that against Peyton a few years ago and Peyton just audibled into a running play and they ran all over the Giants. I would like to see a lot of Robinson and Casillas at LB and leave Sheppard on the bench. I agree that Collins would be a good fit playing the LB/S role against the Saints.
Against the Saints, the Giant defense should just  
Jimmy Googs : 9/14/2016 3:00 pm : link
come out like a bunch of crazed dogs and have some fun...
Time of possession  
stretch234 : 9/14/2016 4:08 pm : link
There are 2 ways to look at TOP. 1 is where your defense cant stop the other team. The 2nd is when an opposing offense slows down the game.

Dallas used almost every second of every play to minimize what Prescott had to do. Their TOP did not have to do with them dominating the defense. The Giants defense was fresh in the 4th qtr because of this. That is getting the better of the OL
The NY defense did limit Dallas  
fanatic II : 9/14/2016 7:59 pm : link
But Dallas was able to move the ball, even with a scaled down game plan for Prescott.

Dallas had 10 possessions, they scored on 5, punted on 3, and had the end of the 1st half and the end of the game where they couldn't get a FG attempt. NY basically stopped Dallas on 3 possessions.

The NY defense is improved, but they played a rookie QB making his first NFL start.

The true test for the NY defense would have been facing Romo and getting the same result.

Would Dallas have passed for 227 yards on 45 attempts if Romo was the QB passing 45 times? Would Dallas have settled for 4 FGs? Probably not.

The NY defense is improved, but has yet to be truly tested.
RE: The NY defense did limit Dallas  
Dan in the Springs : 9/14/2016 8:17 pm : link
In comment 13122787 fanatic II said:
Quote:
But Dallas was able to move the ball, even with a scaled down game plan for Prescott.

Dallas had 10 possessions, they scored on 5, punted on 3, and had the end of the 1st half and the end of the game where they couldn't get a FG attempt. NY basically stopped Dallas on 3 possessions.

The NY defense is improved, but they played a rookie QB making his first NFL start.

The true test for the NY defense would have been facing Romo and getting the same result.

Would Dallas have passed for 227 yards on 45 attempts if Romo was the QB passing 45 times? Would Dallas have settled for 4 FGs? Probably not.

The NY defense is improved, but has yet to be truly tested.


I guess you can see it that way. The Giants had a game plan to keep Dallas out of the end zone. They held Dallas to 19 points - just two more than their goal of 17. 7 of those points came on a short field due to turnover. Other Giants defensive goals were to stop the run (which they did fairly effectively, particularly against the starter), contain the mobile QB (which they effectively did), take away explosive plays (which they did - longest play of the night was 21 yards).

NYG were effective at doing what they wanted to do. If you like field goals, then Dallas was effective on four of its drives. If that's the game you're going to play you better be really good on defense, particularly red-zone defense, because you can't be giving up 3 red-zone touchdowns when you only get 1 TD on 10 possessions.

Another issue for Dallas was the timing. Dallas didn't face a NYG passing attack the final five minutes like they might have had the Giants been playing from behind. The Giants intended to run out the clock, and were effective at doing so. Keep that in mind as you analyze the outcome of the last Dallas drive.

Finally, Dallas didn't seem to improve as the game went on. The opposite was true. The Dallas run game could have (and should have) dominated as they played most of the second half with the lead. They should have been able to run the ball and take time off the clock themselves, particularly with as much time as the NYG defense had to be on the field. Didn't really matter late, as these were Dallas' drives once they took the lead in the third quarter:

3 plays - 1 yd punt
10 plays - 39 yds (FG)
3 plays - 5 yds punt
6 plays - 8 yds punt

I obviously left the final drive off - the Giants did exactly what they wanted to do there in keeping the ball in bounds after Dallas moved the ball 40 yds on 6 plays.

I don't know what happened to the might Dallas OL if they didn't get beat by the Giants DL through most of the second half. Strange, considering the TOP advantage.
First off thank god we won so the week is sunny  
xman : 9/14/2016 8:48 pm : link
thank God the idiot Cowboy receiver had a brain fart at the end so we didn't have to see a 62 yard FG attempt

Now the fact that we won by 1 against a piece of shit team with no DL and an offense that features a rookie QB is scarry. Chalk it up to division rivalry problems

Our DL won the battle. Don't need sacks against a scrambler. Keep containment and stay disiplined. We did that and took away their best weapon, his legs
I don't disagree...  
Dan in the Springs : 9/14/2016 8:48 pm : link
That the Dallas offense sans Tomorrow isn't the same test as with him, but that's not what this thread is about. Since you brought it up, I'll speculate. I'm pretty sure the Pass rush would have been improved, as the threat of a mobile QB wouldn't have been there. The DL would've had their ears pinned back on passing downs, imo.

I hope we get to find out the next time we meet up.
RE: The NY defense did limit Dallas  
Semipro Lineman : 9/14/2016 10:35 pm : link
In comment 13122787 fanatic II said:
Quote:
But Dallas was able to move the ball, even with a scaled down game plan for Prescott.



Dallas got 328 yards of offense Sunday afternoon. Only 11 teams in the league had less yards from scrimmage week one. Being bottom third in yards isn't exactly moving the ball. As another poster said, they won the time of possession battle more through playing 4-corners on offense than having an effective offense.
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