Extremely pleased to come away with a win.....giving special teams the game ball! The 10 point swing on the blocked FG attempt was a thing of beauty!
I was waiting for the flood of offense during the entire game....that never materialized.
Our defense did a great job of making Breez uncomfortable. They also hit with very little yac. I have not seen/felt that kind of hitting for long time.....it is a most welcome. It also pumps the crowd up.
3rd downs have been a misery the past few years.... finally that bleeding has stopped/improved!
I am not going to be critical of the offensive play calling but it just seemed oddly conservative with too many low percentage passes. OBJ and Cruz had uncharacteristic drops. I hope they came away frustrated.....because they left a lot of points....it reminded me of our offense of the 80s....that it was assumed the defense would make the stops...."don't mind us, we are just tinkering"
I feel the Giant have not yet found their identity on offense. Personally, they are a passing team that needs to set up the run.....but are still trying to be a running team that sets up the pass.
I don't think this would ever have come out of my mouth....but I was not happy to see Newhouse limp off the field, especially at that critical junction. The OL is doing a decent job....I assume some will complain about the run blocking...but just look at our DL. A solid DL will dictate the run.....it's the pass protection.
Now, the play that won the game.....was such a whirlwind, as it looked initially like an INT......not sure how Cruz ended up with it.....but what a turmoil of emotions in that split second.....
Happy with the win....bu they do not make it easy.
Also, when you can turn the ball over three times and in addition shoot yourself in the foot with two consecutive holding penalties when it looked like you were on the way to maybe putting it in the endzone and still win, well, You are fortunate to win the game. Then again in reality I thought they dominated the game and as a result were able to absorb those mistakes because they really are a formidable team. No question about it. This is going to be a very interesting season.
No game-planning, play-calls can overcome lack of execution. The dropped passes by OBJ & Donnell in the EZ on the same drive (7 points), Cruz's fumble (in FG range, 3 points at least), the missed FG (another 3 points)... Thats 13 point at least.
The players didnt execute at key moments in the game, & I dont think you can fault that on coaching. Give the team credit (Coaches & players) for over coming that.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
Um, no. They had safeties deep and Eli took what they offered.
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We should have taken more chances going vertical because the Saints were daring us to try to go over the top.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
Um, no. They had safeties deep and Eli took what they offered.
Exactly - I was there too, the corners we giving an 8 yard cushion most of the game and they played 2 safeties deep. Eli was taking what was there (underneath throws). And it worked most of the day, 3 fumbles aside
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We should have taken more chances going vertical because the Saints were daring us to try to go over the top.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
Um, no. They had safeties deep and Eli took what they offered.
Moon, I recognize that- I'm saying that we should have challenged those safeties earlier in the game, rather than dinking and dunking and trying to get the ground game going for as long as we did.
Basically, the offense took what the Saints gave them.
Did the Saints stop the Giants or did the Giants stop the Giants
Did the Saints stop the Giants or did the Giants stop the Giants
The Giants stopped the Giants, although the Saints did a good job of stuffing our run game.
Honestly, I did not think the Giants could overcome all of their early adversity, but what a testament to the tenacity of their defense that they were able to do so.
Kudos to Jenkins on a superb game.
Eli put a couple of balls on the money that should have been TDs to Donnell and OBJ. Cannot believe penalty was not thrown when Cruz got mugged in endzone...was the ball already tipped? If those are all caught nobody would talking "whats wrong with the offense.
Watching Right-side of our O-line and Donnell block is painful though...
This is a big reason why a guy like Antonio Brown looks that much more dynamic than Odell right now.
I feel the Saints dictated our offensive plays calls.
The draw play from the shotgun is already a play, I hate.
I think you will see Eli taking short drops and unloading quickly in those cases especilally against better defesnes. They did it last year and there is no reason to think they won't this year. The other thing is now that they have a bonifide defense they go conservative at times and not chance a sack or a turnover and pick their spots when to opportunity presents itself.
That's kind of ironic to say since they turned it over three times yesterday. But I have to believe that was the exception rather then what we will see down the road.
I feel the Saints dictated our offensive plays calls.
The draw play from the shotgun is already a play, I hate.
No matter what the defense does? Really? It's not a video game. Throwing at a safety who is ready for it will likely result in a dead receiver or an interception.
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We should have taken more chances going vertical because the Saints were daring us to try to go over the top.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
Um, no. They had safeties deep and Eli took what they offered.
14 plays - 80 yards - nothing
6 plays - 30 yards - fumble on NO 36
5 plays - 67 yards - fumble on NO 20
8 Plays - 40 yards - missed FG
they had 3 Drives in the second half that were 11 plays and scored 3 FG
They moved the ball all game
But because we didn't score 30 points or have flashy plays, people come away unimpressed. McAdoo knows that if we took care of "The Duke" that yesterday looks a lot better, even to the ignorant fans. What is a TD-less day is probably a 14-21 point win with 2-3 TD's.
If people consider that ineffective, they are doing it based solely on the scoreboard.
But because we didn't score 30 points or have flashy plays, people come away unimpressed. McAdoo knows that if we took care of "The Duke" that yesterday looks a lot better, even to the ignorant fans. What is a TD-less day is probably a 14-21 point win with 2-3 TD's.
This game has been a bit of a flame to draw out the moths of uninformed fans. And I think a lot of people just learned what "conservative" means in regards to football gameplanning, so they keep saying it.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
But because we didn't score 30 points or have flashy plays, people come away unimpressed. McAdoo knows that if we took care of "The Duke" that yesterday looks a lot better, even to the ignorant fans. What is a TD-less day is probably a 14-21 point win with 2-3 TD's.
I mean midway through the game yesterday, you had people bitching about the following:
- Eli is inaccurate. Even though he was something like 14-18 at the time!
- Vernon isn't getting sacks and we aren't paying for his run stopping
- Cruz sucks and is costing us the game
- Why the hell did we bring Josh Brown back (Oh fucking no - he missed a 50+ yearder!!)
- McAdoo's playcalling sucks. Really sucks.
- We refuse to go deep and McAdoo is getting outcoached
- Newhouse sucks! Well, until he was hurt and then people got worried.
There is minimal understanding of what people see in front of them. They bitch and moan anytime there's a handoff, but then fail to realize that those inside handoffs are directly responsible for keeping the LB's looking for the run when Eli found Cruz for the winning TD last week. so they are late dropping into coverage.
We dink and dunk this week, but if we forced the deep throws and Eli had a few INT's people would be bitching about that too.
We just won two games that last year we lost. And we have a D that hits a ton better than last year. Just look at the difference in Collins now that he can play his regular position.
We are 2-0, while teams that people like to fawn over here like the Seahawks (lost to the Rams), the Packers (lost to the Vikes), the Redskins (haven't won shit), or the Panthers (lost to NE) all have a loss. Even though it is early, if we can go 3-0 next week, we will be in early command of the division and will look good in conference tiebreakers.
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We should have taken more chances going vertical because the Saints were daring us to try to go over the top.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
The Saints were playing a cover 2 with two deep safeties to help limit the big play. Hence why the underneath stuff was all there. Sorry this offense was boring for your liking but it made sense. Taking chances deep just to do so is dumb. Eli Carved up the Saints for 368 yards. It just so happens OBJ dropped two TD passes as did Donnell and than Cruz fumbled, Vareen Fumbled and Eli Fumbled.
I never said it was boring.
Look, I understand the approach we took and mentioned in my post that I have no problem with taking what the defense gives you.
That said, there are other ways to attack Cover 2 and by completely avoiding the deep ball (especially deep down the middle of the field), the Saints became more comfortable in stopping the run and preventing dink and dunk passes from becoming big plays as the game went on.
Short passes are equivalent to runs....now, I get no need to pull out all our tricks....
Also, no need to act superior.
When did the Saints prevent the dink and dunk passes? Eli was 32-41 for 368 yards. When exactly were they stopping those 9 incompletions?
There is a really good way to attack the Cover 2 - it is to throw underneath routes and establish the running game. we never got the running game going, but we never were stopped on the underneath stuff. The other that beats a cover 2 is not having turnovers. That's what killed things yesterday.
Short passes are equivalent to runs....now, I get no need to pull out all our tricks....
Also, no need to act superior.
Sorry if my general annoyance was unfairly focused at you, George. I read what you were saying as the opposite of what you just said here, which is talking what they give you (and not just going deep to go deep, irrespective of the defensive scheme, as many people seem to be advocating).
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That said, there are other ways to attack Cover 2 and by completely avoiding the deep ball (especially deep down the middle of the field), the Saints became more comfortable in stopping the run and preventing dink and dunk passes from becoming big plays as the game went on.
When did the Saints prevent the dink and dunk passes? Eli was 32-41 for 368 yards. When exactly were they stopping those 9 incompletions?
There is a really good way to attack the Cover 2 - it is to throw underneath routes and establish the running game. we never got the running game going, but we never were stopped on the underneath stuff. The other that beats a cover 2 is not having turnovers. That's what killed things yesterday.
Fats, I didn't say the Saints prevented dink and dunk passes. I said they prevented dink and dunk passes from becoming big plays.
They took plenty of shot down field....green zone was pretty "conservative"......I really do not like that draw from the shotgun.....they could retire that play imo.
My opinion is that the Giants are good enough to dictate their play call especially in the passing game.....we went to runs because the numbers favored us which seemed predictable and outcome were not great
Where am I doing that? I'm saying that a lot of people here have a hard time understanding what is happening from a strategic aspect. If people are advocating taking deep shots for what I can only believe is:
a) The hell of it
b) Because the game seems too boring to them
Then I don't know how else to discuss it. People still think the inside draw is simply a give-up play, but it forces the LB's to freeze. And when they freeze and we pass, it opens up the middle of the field, which is the reason Cruz gets the winning TD last week or why Donnell gets looks in the end zone.
But it is infinitely easier to just scream THAT PLAY SUCKS when it fails. I'm not sure why. I guess I'll have to trade places with somebody who looks at things that way to figure it out.
They have played 2 games and are 2-0. They have played the clock perfectly in each of those.
Yesterday they took what NO gave to them - really forced nothing. NO never stopped them, the Giants stopped themselves.
Next week they have not only a chance to get to 3-0, but really bury one of the division opponents
Is there room for improvement - absolutely, but so far so good.
Yesterday was the first game playing a very good QB where as the game wore on I was not expecting the D to give up huge plays or a late TD. I expected them to hold NO to the FG. That has not happened in 3-4 years
Our defense dictated the action.....very impressed.
Our offense dictated much of the action...but we made too many errors (fumbles and drops) in key spots.
The green zone play calls failed badly.... settling for FGs....which I suspect worried everyone based on the potential of the Saints offense.
Cut out the turnovers and people would say it is absolutely crazy talk that the saints D played well.
I'm not really sure how people watch that game and gripe that the O was ineffective at attacking the Saints. They were ineffective at securing the ball, for sure, but the gameplan was damn solid.
-two end zone drops leading to a turnover on downs at the 5
-Cruz fumbling inside the 20
-Vereen fumbling inside the 30 (I think?)
Three possessions that should have been scores.
A) Giants 16 Saints 13
or
B) Giants 30 Saints 13
You have all day to think about (as some will need it).
.
I didn't mind the conservative game plan. Keep the ball out of Brees' hands! Look at time of possession. That had to be the plan.
nothing . We have no game breaking back .
We knew from the get go that two of our starters are
journey men that were brought in as back ups .
Now albeit the weakest link is injured his back up a 7th round
project will most likely start .
Also the status of Jennings is unknown . Vereen is not a
bell cow sort of runner , so not time to panic but a
definate concern . I would like to see Rainey activated he
brings a good burst good hands and the ability to get to
the corner .
Were still uncertain about Beatty is it time to make a move
and send a draft pick somewhere to help the run game ?
A) Giants 16 Saints 13
or
B) Giants 30 Saints 13
You have all day to think about (as some will need it).
Both count the same in the win column however one has positive intangibles that come into play moving forward the other does not. 30 to 16 says we are a well oiled machine that can methodically beat up or bomb you to death. 16 to 13 says we got lucky and survived shooting ourselves in the foot, arm and leg (3 TOs) .... winning with -3 TO ratio is rare we got lucky. It says to teams the Saints game plan is a very good tactic the NYG just got lucky.
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Which game counts more?
A) Giants 16 Saints 13
or
B) Giants 30 Saints 13
You have all day to think about (as some will need it).
Both count the same in the win column however one has positive intangibles that come into play moving forward the other does not. 30 to 16 says we are a well oiled machine that can methodically beat up or bomb you to death. 16 to 13 says we got lucky and survived shooting ourselves in the foot
The only difference between the two is that one is more pleasing to the fans on that particular day.
It's the NFL. They could have won 30-13 and looked great, and then next week lose to Washington.
It means nothing. Just win the game and move on to next week. You don't get extra credit for the next game by winning stylishly.
PaulN : 10:54 am : link : reply
During the game and complained once, calling out the Mara's for going out of their way to hiring an ignorant coach, then a surprise happened, we won. When you win its a good thing and all is forgiven. Until next Sunday. We all take this too serious, but that is what we do and who we ALL are, even the ones acting like they aren't.
I don't think I've once watched a game and blasted the fucking owner during it. It isn't who we ALL are - it is people trying to justify their own shortfall - whether it is a lack of control or a more protracted display of utter ignorance.
I was with a bunch of fans watching a game last year and one guy yells out "Eli, eat a bag of dicks" after an interception. The rest of the table jumped on him for being a fucking moron immediately. His response was "Well, you all were thinking it". Umm no. We weren't.
Quote:
Which game counts more?
A) Giants 16 Saints 13
or
B) Giants 30 Saints 13
You have all day to think about (as some will need it).
Both count the same in the win column however one has positive intangibles that come into play moving forward the other does not. 30 to 16 says we are a well oiled machine that can methodically beat up or bomb you to death. 16 to 13 says we got lucky and survived shooting ourselves in the foot, arm and leg (3 TOs) .... winning with -3 TO ratio is rare we got lucky. It says to teams the Saints game plan is a very good tactic the NYG just got lucky.
Your grade is a C-. The Giants did not get lucky in winning that game whatsoever. But your point that -3 TO ratio wins are not very common is very true.
And I would tell you that after last year's debacles in close games, the intangibles of winning tight contests bodes well for confidence going forward.
Further, NFL seasons are full of well-oiled Superbowl-looking teams in September. Its the ones that look the part in Dec/Jan that hold the trophy.
Shepard and Cruz were being given anything short of a 10 yard completion whenever we wanted it. We should've unmercifully dissected them like Brady and Belichick would've done until they had no choice but to come out of their shell.
area junc : 11:37 am : link : reply
thing about the offense are guys running wide open and Eli either not seeing them, or ignoring them.
Shepard and Cruz were being given anything short of a 10 yard completion whenever we wanted it. We should've unmercifully dissected them like Brady and Belichick would've done until they had no choice but to come out of their shell.
Eli was 32-41. I guess I need to highlight it again. Eli was 32-41
We did take the short completion. Often. We also had a shitload of turnovers.
Did you fuckers watch the same game? I mean, I know this is another point from Area Junk, but still.
Really sounded so on TV.
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In comment 13129453 Giantology said:
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We should have taken more chances going vertical because the Saints were daring us to try to go over the top.
I have no problem taking what the defense gives us the majority of the game, but an early shot deep to Beckham keeps them honest and maybe gives you that much more cushion off a curl or slant.
The other thing the offense lacked at times was tempo, but that was an obvious part of our conservative approach.
Um, no. They had safeties deep and Eli took what they offered.
Moon, I recognize that- I'm saying that we should have challenged those safeties earlier in the game, rather than dinking and dunking and trying to get the ground game going for as long as we did.
If Giants don't turn the ball over, drop passes and build a reasonable lead, as they could/should have, Saints would have had to adjust, and then you take your deep shots. They'd would not have been able to sit back and let the Giants dink & dunk them to time consuming scoring drives with Bree's on the sidelines. Unfortunately the TOs played right into their hands, and made them stick their approach.
Under the circumstances, Giants did the right thing, and Eli did a great job staying patient.
Shepard and Cruz were being given anything short of a 10 yard completion whenever we wanted it. We should've unmercifully dissected them like Brady and Belichick would've done until they had no choice but to come out of their shell.