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The Future of Landon Collins

Tony-in-Wichita : 9/21/2016 10:17 pm
He may be the most exciting young player to watch in a Giants uniform. O'Dell is the obvious answer and Shepard is the new thing in town.. but Collins has the skills to be the best safety New York has had since I can remember. (I'm 26)

Landon is built like a brick shit house, has enough hip movement and speed to cover necessary ground, most of all he seems to understand what it takes to excel at the highest level. His training with Ryan Clark in the off season will have a large impact on his performance this year. If not physically, mentally.
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RE: Phillips  
j_rud : 9/22/2016 8:20 am : link
In comment 13135490 English Alaister said:
Quote:
and his ability to get from sideline to sideline in incredible time used to absolutely shrink the field on opponents. He was a massive loss. Especially when you replace him with CC Brown.


CC Brown...good Lord. Just when Will Demps turns in what you think is the worst possible performance one could see from a safety, in came CC Brown, who turned in more bad plays than a community theater group...
RE: Here's a good read about Collins offseason,  
short lease : 9/22/2016 8:28 am : link
In comment 13135487 j_rud said:
Quote:
Much of which was spent working with retired safety Ryan Clark at his "DB Precision" camp in Baton Rouge. By all accounts it sounds like he put in serious work, not only on the field but changing some habits away from it as well. Some selected quotes, including some basic comparisons that are sure to excite some and, knowing BBI, worry others...

On making changes away from the field and putting down the Oreos


Quote:


Clark said he believes Collins can be a special player.
“I do, I do,” Clark said. “I am very hard on him. There was many a day I called him ‘fat.’ And told him, that ‘Hey, if you want to continue to be seen as a box safety, then don’t eat right. If you want to continue to be seen as a guy that can only play one type of football, don’t take the training seriously.’ And I was on him about ‘What you did at Alabama, what you did at high school, that’s over. Every day you’re building your résumé.’



On remaining teachable and Collins desire to excel...


Quote:


“It was his desire to be great,” Clark said. “A lot of times you run across these young athletes, or athletes who have been highly touted for so long in their life, and you feel like part of the desire isn’t there, that they’ve achieved what they’ve always worked for, and now, ‘I’m gonna rest on my laurels.’ But to watch him each and every day ask questions, to constantly be seeking information and experience and wisdom, it was good for me to see this young, hungry man trying to be better, and so I enjoy working with him.”



And finally, who Collins' strength, explosiveness, and athleticism reminds Clark of, despite having a ways to go...


Quote:


“I think as a player, it’s just how strong he is,” Clark told The Post. “I played with Troy Polamalu, who’s extremely strong, and as far as in the weight room and the way he’s able to move, the way he’s able to explode, he reminds me of Troy, in that sense. Obviously, the on-the-field play has to progress and pick up to be that level, but he’s that type of explosive athlete.”

Ryan Clark Raves about Landon Collins - ( New Window )



Wow, great link (and quotes) J_rud. Thanks. Those 2 could be the best Safety tandem we have had back there in a while. Hoping they can both stay healthy and continually dedicated.
I'll post this again, just in case anyone missed it.  
Klaatu : 9/22/2016 8:29 am : link
Giants Life feature on Landon Collins. You can see Clark talk about him and watch some of his offseason workouts.
Giants Life - Landon Collins - ( New Window )
You can make Philips look better  
Doomster : 9/22/2016 8:32 am : link
by comparing him to what we have had out there.....but he was good, not great....he played like a deep centerfielder, the last line of defense, in a defense that was bend don't break...he was not a turnover machine by any means...a lot of his int's were hail mary, desperation passes at end of games.....he had one good, not great, season....those knees took their toll on him....at the end, he complained he played the position the way he was told to play it, and not the way he wanted to....

As for Collins, he has looked better this season....being thrown into the fire last season, many expected a miracle....he missed tackles, couldn't cover, and made many mistakes(remember when he forgot to down a player?)....

But it looks like he has learned from those mistakes......he came to play this year....he is all over the field .....he still needs work with coverage skills, but he seems to be playing with a confidence he didn't have last year....
Thanks for the Giants Life post  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 8:33 am : link
Honestly my inspiration for the post.

He can tackle your biggest running back behind the line of scrimmage and cover Dez down field. Impressive
RE: No one under the age of 35  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 8:35 am : link
In comment 13135468 WillieYoung said:
Quote:
is permitted to use the phrase "best I ever remember" unless discussing candy or onesies.


Ha! Which is why I allowed you guys to know my age. I have a limited perspective for sure. Rolle and Phillips are his only competition in his second year.

And C.c. brown
Much better  
SomeFan : 9/22/2016 8:41 am : link
Pleasantly surprised. If he continues playing as is, he's a core player.
Collins  
ryanmkeane : 9/22/2016 8:50 am : link
is the new NFL's safety/linebacker and he's damn good at it. Love what I'm seeing so far. Best tackling safety we've had in some time.
People  
ryanmkeane : 9/22/2016 8:51 am : link
knocked/thought it was absurd to say Collins had a good rookie season leading all rookies in tackles because "the defense was on the field the whole game." Well - what it showed was he's an excellent tackler and very good near the LOS.
RE: Landon Collins was a guy  
Big Blue '56 : 9/22/2016 9:03 am : link
In comment 13135435 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
I was thrilled we stole last year. He was overlooked in the draft I thought and while I thought he'd have been better in covering backs and TEs, he was a helluva tackler. He also diagnosed plays and was a missile out there. Reminded me a lot of Gibril Wilson's rookie year. But unlike Wilson, Collins is BIG. He can learn how to cover because he is also QUICK. He can blow up plays because he is also faster than most LBs and is a player most lineman will miss on blocks. He plays like an Alabama defender, and is fundamentally sound.

While he might not be fit for the sexier of the safety positions, I look at him as a guy who can augment the LBs and cover a bit. He is a rare asset. He is our Kam Chancellor and I think he will progress more in pass coverage than many of you think.


Thanks Seth, you saved me from wasting words..Not surprisingly, this is an excellent post..
Oh and as I've said on several occasions of late,  
Big Blue '56 : 9/22/2016 9:05 am : link
I believe Collins' apparent increase in speed has much to do with his 10-15 pound weight loss in the offseason, along with better anticipation/recognition skills, imv
RE: RE: Better than rolle?  
djstat : 9/22/2016 9:06 am : link
In comment 13135319 EricJ said:
Quote:
In comment 13135304 Moondawg said:


Quote:


.



Not yet. Plus Rolle was a solid leader. I am also happy about Collins' development
Collins is better in year 2 than Rolle was in year 2
Chancellor is the comparison for me  
area junc : 9/22/2016 9:06 am : link
if u put a guy like that behind a great front 4 you've got big problems because you can't block him. he just smashes anybody that pops thru

now, sure, every S in the league is better behind a good front 4 but LC is a destructive force behind it

perfect fit behind this DLine
Seeing Collins sitting on the bench next to Thompson and Apple...  
Klaatu : 9/22/2016 9:08 am : link
Tells me that his future, as bright as it may be, is also linked to the rest of the young guns in the secondary. May they all stay healthy and productive. Along with veterans like DRC and JJ, this could be the best defensive backfield the Giants have showcased in quite a while.
RE: Much better  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 9:08 am : link
In comment 13135519 SomeFan said:
Quote:
Pleasantly surprised. If he continues playing as is, he's a core player.


To me, he's already a core player. The question is just how good can he be? Imagine this defense without collins. He has already made huge plays in both the run and pass game. Not to mention what we can't see as fans such as scheme alignment pre snap.

His play in both run and pass defense is a HUGE reason why the Giants are 2-0. I fear his loss would be extremely difficult to overcome.
Collins problem last year was 1) that Spags misused him  
Victor in CT : 9/22/2016 9:17 am : link
(yes, i Know, they had nobody else) and 2) he was too big/heavy. Kids showing that he's a player now that he lightened up a little and is being used properly.
RE: RE: Much better  
SomeFan : 9/22/2016 9:18 am : link
In comment 13135568 Tony-in-Wichita said:
Quote:
In comment 13135519 SomeFan said:


Quote:


Pleasantly surprised. If he continues playing as is, he's a core player.



To me, he's already a core player. The question is just how good can he be? Imagine this defense without collins. He has already made huge plays in both the run and pass game. Not to mention what we can't see as fans such as scheme alignment pre snap.

His play in both run and pass defense is a HUGE reason why the Giants bare 2-0. I fear his loss would be extremely difficult to overcome.


I wouldn't argue against that.
I would like to see a devastating blow to Jordan Reed in the ...  
Boy Cord : 9/22/2016 10:09 am : link
... very near future. Again, nothing illegal or dirty. Just good, clean football fun.
should be (pretty much already is)  
djm : 9/22/2016 10:29 am : link
a great in the box safety. Won't kill you in coverage but won't be remembered for his coverage skills. Overall we should be very happy with Collins over the long haul. He's a great tackler.
and most definitely a core player  
djm : 9/22/2016 10:32 am : link
..
RE: should be (pretty much already is)  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 10:34 am : link
In comment 13135700 djm said:
Quote:
a great in the box safety. Won't kill you in coverage but won't be remembered for his coverage skills. Overall we should be very happy with Collins over the long haul. He's a great tackler.


His pass coverage against Dez was memorable, to me. His play against tight ends in his young career have certain highlights, one this year that I can recall. I found myself dogging his cover skills as well. The guy was thrown into a terrible defense last year as a rookie.
I think Berhe might be a better-than-average backup...  
Big Blue Blogger : 9/22/2016 10:52 am : link
...but there's no doubt Collins would be badly missed. On top of which, there would then be absolutely nothing behind Berhe.
RE: I would like to see a devastating blow to Jordan Reed in the ...  
markky : 9/22/2016 11:06 am : link
In comment 13135667 Boy Cord said:
Quote:
... very near future. Again, nothing illegal or dirty. Just good, clean football fun.


I was just thinking the exact same thing while reading down this thread.
Slow  
est1986 : 9/22/2016 11:07 am : link
Down.
RE: Slow  
Klaatu : 9/22/2016 11:17 am : link
In comment 13135777 est1986 said:
Quote:
Down.


Whaaat...dooo...youuu...dooo...aaat...aaa...yellowwww...liiight...
RE: KP was the best Giant safety  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/22/2016 11:34 am : link
In comment 13135429 Modus Operandi said:
Quote:
During the modern Eli era. Yes, better than Rolle. His career ending injury has probably done more to set this defense back than any other singular event.


He just never played enough to be able to say this. We got like two years out of him. Part of me wants to say Hill was better than Phillips. Or at least it can be argued.
in terms of build  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 9/22/2016 11:35 am : link
I've seen very few safeties who look more intimidating. He looks like Tarzan and hits like him too. He's a beast going forward.

His skills in coverage remain a question mark, but his strengths certainly seem valuable enough to more than make up for his shortcomings in coverage. And obviously he can get better in pass coverage.
JPP's hand  
Carl in CT : 9/22/2016 11:36 am : link
Was a worse event. He was one of the most dominant DE's in football. Now he is average at best.
KP  
Carl in CT : 9/22/2016 11:38 am : link
Was the best safety.
RE: RE: should be (pretty much already is)  
djm : 9/22/2016 11:46 am : link
In comment 13135709 Tony-in-Wichita said:
Quote:
In comment 13135700 djm said:


Quote:


a great in the box safety. Won't kill you in coverage but won't be remembered for his coverage skills. Overall we should be very happy with Collins over the long haul. He's a great tackler.



His pass coverage against Dez was memorable, to me. His play against tight ends in his young career have certain highlights, one this year that I can recall. I found myself dogging his cover skills as well. The guy was thrown into a terrible defense last year as a rookie.


I didn't mean that in a bad way I just don't think his greatest strength will be in coverage or attacking the ball, so to speak. HE will be fine back there but his greatest strength will be flowing downhill on D and cleaning up. He's gonna own the middle and make a lot of big plays while preventing big plays from occurring.
True  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 11:51 am : link
His weakness is pass covetave. But I still put his coverage skills at above average for the position.

Jerry Reese is trying to keep that job
Whoa  
Bill in UT : 9/22/2016 11:54 am : link
Nellie. Getting a little ahead of ourselves?
I think Antrel at his best was better than KP at his  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 9/22/2016 12:29 pm : link
KP was a solid B/B+ centerfielder who rarely gave up the big play. Good in deep coverage and sound tackler. But he wasn't a playmaker. INTs aren't everything as Stevie Brown showed us, but KP's lack of playmaking limited how impactful he was imo.

Will Hill in those 10 or so games played at a level easily higher than KP ever played at imo. Easy to shit on him for being a complete moron but he was a beast for us that year.
RE: IMO The biggest difference from last season to this season  
ColHowPepper : 9/22/2016 12:55 pm : link
I think j_rud's post distills all a fan needs to know about the marked improvement in LC's play, that along with his offseason camp.
He had an ill-defined role in 2015 because the Ss he was paired with were short on talent as well as experience, and he was asked to play a role he is, still, relatively ill-suited for as a coverage or free S. Now that the position is sewed up by DT (we hope he stays healthy), it frees him to concentrate on his more limited coverage duties and playing the run, which he does very, very well. That and being his 2nd year, it's coming together nicely.
In comment 13135426 j_rud said:
Quote:
Is that he is thinking less and is reacting to what he sees much quicker. He stated several times in the off-season that his number one priority was learning to trust and building rapport with whoever it was who earned the FS job. It's clear he is made that happen with Thompson. I'd say his biggest problem last season was indecisiveness. It's easy to say "he struggled in coverage. He did. But You can't tell me much of that was hesitancy and reluctance to trust that the other guysn1)knew their job and 2) were able to do it.

This year there is none that. He knows that Darian knows his assignments and responsibilities and he isn't worried about whether or not his backfield mats are going to be in the right position while simultaneously reading the play is it develops and locking down his own responsibilities. A year in the system, being surrounded by guys he trusts, and being able to just focus on his own responsibilities without those added concerns is making all the difference in the world.
It isn't just about INTs, as you pointed out  
Modus Operandi : 9/22/2016 1:04 pm : link
In his two years where he was healthy, KP was emerging as one of the best FS in the game.

He had range, recognition skills and decisiveness to make a play on on the ball anywhere on the field. He rarely took a false step and you'd be hard pressed to find many plays where we were beat deep and the CBs were shrugging their shoulders or throwing their hands up in the air because they thought they had help over the top - which happened with regularity after KP went down. And while not big, he had enough size and athleticism (prior to getting hurt) to play the better TEs.

This is why he was trusted to be the deep man. He could erase mistakes. He could also lay some wood and dislodge the ball at times and was always a sure tackler. This allowed us to play more men in the box without fear of the opposing WR or TE beating us down the seam.

Losing KP was a huge loss. He was truly unheralded by fans who didn't quite understand his role.
RE: Whoa  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 1:07 pm : link
In comment 13135884 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
Nellie. Getting a little ahead of ourselves?


In what way? It's not like the Giants have a plethora of great safeties to compare him to. Linebacker and DE is another story.

Landon is already a terrific player with potential upside to be a perennial pro bowler. His statics through the first 2 weeks predict that and he will only get better in this much improved defense.
Re: Rolle  
Modus Operandi : 9/22/2016 1:09 pm : link
It's easier to appreciate what he did. As someone pointed out, he was a weird player. A CB in college, with cover skills who developed into more of an inbox safety.

He made a lot of stops and put a lot of hits on RBs. Those plays are easier for a casual fan to appreciate than KP's non-plays. If you follow.

Im missing a coma or 2  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 1:10 pm : link
Busy at work
RE: Im missing a coma or 2  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 1:12 pm : link
In comment 13136012 Tony-in-Wichita said:
Quote:
Busy at work


, <<< one of these.

Not a coma.

RE: Im missing a coma or 2  
Modus Operandi : 9/22/2016 1:12 pm : link
In comment 13136012 Tony-in-Wichita said:
Quote:
Busy at work


My fingers are crossed that you continue to miss the comas.
RE: Re: Rolle  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 1:13 pm : link
In comment 13136011 Modus Operandi said:
Quote:
It's easier to appreciate what he did. As someone pointed out, he was a weird player. A CB in college, with cover skills who developed into more of an inbox safety.

He made a lot of stops and put a lot of hits on RBs. Those plays are easier for a casual fan to appreciate than KP's non-plays. If you follow.


Non-plays for dbs is a great point. Hard to tell unless a coach gives praise
RE: Re: Rolle  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 1:14 pm : link
In comment 13136011 Modus Operandi said:
Quote:
It's easier to appreciate what he did. As someone pointed out, he was a weird player. A CB in college, with cover skills who developed into more of an inbox safety.

He made a lot of stops and put a lot of hits on RBs. Those plays are easier for a casual fan to appreciate than KP's non-plays. If you follow.


Non-plays for dbs is a great point. Hard to tell unless a coach gives praise
I sure do miss KP!  
Jerry "Championship" Reese : 9/22/2016 4:10 pm : link
Imagine KP and Landon Collins side by side as safeties. Injuries sure can be devastating, seems like the NYG have a tough history with injury issues.
If Collins had ball skills he'd be special  
Torrag : 9/22/2016 4:13 pm : link
He doesn't. As it is he's a great tackler that brings the pain and covers ground at a fair pace.
RE: If Collins had ball skills he'd be special  
Klaatu : 9/22/2016 4:35 pm : link
In comment 13136373 Torrag said:
Quote:
He doesn't. As it is he's a great tackler that brings the pain and covers ground at a fair pace.


He doesn't have any ball skills? None at all?

He may not be your classic ballhawk, and pass coverage may not be his strongest suit, but to say he has no ball skills is patently ridiculous.

Linked below is an article written by Chase Goodbread at NFL.com prior to the 2015 draft, accompanied by a video featuring Bucky Brooks giving his assessment of Collins.

2015 NFL Draft: Top five ball-hawking DB prospects. - ( New Window )
You're splitting hairs  
Torrag : 9/22/2016 7:52 pm : link
I could have said mediocre ball skills instead of none. Doesn't change my opinion he's going to be a good player for us but not 'special'. In today's NFL DB's that are average in the passing game have limited upside.
Very solid player  
mrvax : 9/22/2016 8:27 pm : link
if his coverage improves, he could be All-Pro.
RE: RE: If Collins had ball skills he'd be special  
madgiantscow009 : 9/22/2016 8:30 pm : link
In comment 13136406 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 13136373 Torrag said:


Quote:


He doesn't. As it is he's a great tackler that brings the pain and covers ground at a fair pace.



He doesn't have any ball skills? None at all?

He may not be your classic ballhawk, and pass coverage may not be his strongest suit, but to say he has no ball skills is patently ridiculous.

Linked below is an article written by Chase Goodbread at NFL.com prior to the 2015 draft, accompanied by a video featuring Bucky Brooks giving his assessment of Collins. 2015 NFL Draft: Top five ball-hawking DB prospects. - ( New Window )


He made that interception crucial drop last year, I forget against who, but it was a game that the giants let a lot of chances slip through their fingers.

I don't think one play is proof of anything, but I think that is fresh in the minds of people who don't think he has good ball skills.


RE: RE: RE: If Collins had ball skills he'd be special  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 8:52 pm : link
In comment 13136616 madgiantscow009 said:
Quote:
In comment 13136406 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 13136373 Torrag said:


Quote:


He doesn't. As it is he's a great tackler that brings the pain and covers ground at a fair pace.



He doesn't have any ball skills? None at all?

He may not be your classic ballhawk, and pass coverage may not be his strongest suit, but to say he has no ball skills is patently ridiculous.

Linked below is an article written by Chase Goodbread at NFL.com prior to the 2015 draft, accompanied by a video featuring Bucky Brooks giving his assessment of Collins. 2015 NFL Draft: Top five ball-hawking DB prospects. - ( New Window )



He made that interception crucial drop last year, I forget against who, but it was a game that the giants let a lot of chances slip through their fingers.

I don't think one play is proof of anything, but I think that is fresh in the minds of people who don't think he has good ball skills.



Against the Patriots. It could have changed the entire season if they get that win against them.

He being in position to make an interception nullifies his coverage skills complaint. Ball skills is a small sacrifice given his tangibles. He will improve overtime
RE: in terms of build  
Tony-in-Wichita : 9/22/2016 9:41 pm : link
In comment 13135828 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:
Quote:
I've seen very few safeties who look more intimidating. He looks like Tarzan and hits like him too. He's a beast going forward.

His skills in coverage remain a question mark, but his strengths certainly seem valuable enough to more than make up for his shortcomings in coverage. And obviously he can get better in pass coverage.


Nail-on-the-head
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