Many of us realists called 2-3 as soon as Eli was picked to end the Redskin game and were mocked/ridiculed. Well, here we are. Season on the brink. And it's not yet Halloween. Again....
How many times has Trevin Wade fell in the last two games Â
It's another to look completely unprepared, playing scared at the QB position, missing wide open receivers, and commit shit tons of penalties and mental errors. This team wreaks of a team with a head coach who is attempting to also be the offensive coordinator and is in over his head.
You have to focus (where the focus should've been the entire past few weeks) on the shitshows of #10, #74, #31, any number worn by a LB, as well as the HC and the GM.
Was a huge mistake. You challenge you lose it's still a timeout.
McAdoo screwed up twice there. One, don't call timeout after 1st play. They still would've had to run a play before 2 minute warning. And then this, challenge that shit, nothing to lose but a timeout which you need to call anyways..
something is up. He fears the protection. Not saying it is an excuse, but something is amiss. Of course when it was desperation drive time they come right down and score.
We have all seen this before. On the game thread someone mentioned the hit, which was brutal, in the Skin game having some lasting affect. perhaps there is something too that since it was caused by a mental error.
Also, Flowers, fucking LVP. Horrid game
RE: What happens when you can't complain about #13 after the game anymore? Â
You have to focus (where the focus should've been the entire past few weeks) on the shitshows of #10, #74, #31, any number worn by a LB, as well as the HC and the GM.
The poor offensive line is having multiple negative impacts:
1. Teams don't have to stack the box so the receivers aren't getting open
2. Teams generate a pass rush without blitzing
3. Eli's lowering his eyes to look at the rush, and as a result he is playing like complete shit
But at least the money that wasn't spent on that side of the ball created an elite defensive line, right?
Fuck.
RE: Giants get the ball back, what has anyone seen that Â
Get this shit right because there are 6 very winnable games coming up now. This season doesn't have to go up in smoke but if the offense continues to play like this it sure will.
Are outweighed by emotions of concern for the big picture. The season is still young, and things can turn around, but barring said turnaround this team is staring a 5th straight non playoff year right in the face. That's a major red flag for where you are as an organization. Worse, we are old at qb with looming instability at the position on the horizon (Even if not immenent)
I am deeply concerned that this is a franchise who could drift into the wilderness for a prolonged period. Hope they get this turned around
Football is not fun with these guys. And, honestly, it hasn't been since 2011-2012. This won't be a playoff team (again) in 2016, even after all the $$ spent in the spring. When does Reese get held accountable?
The poor offensive line is having multiple negative impacts:
1. Teams don't have to stack the box so the receivers aren't getting open
2. Teams generate a pass rush without blitzing
3. Eli's lowering his eyes to look at the rush, and as a result he is playing like complete shit
But at least the money that wasn't spent on that side of the ball created an elite defensive line, right?
Fuck.
No one can say a word against you this week. 7-8 men in the secondary with 1 speed WR.
probably their best potential TE. Just can't figure out what is going on with some of these decisions. Also they finally let Perkins run with the ball. Very strange stuff.
Get this shit right because there are 6 very winnable games coming up now. This season doesn't have to go up in smoke but if the offense continues to play like this it sure will.
the offense has shown no reason to turn it around.
Football is not fun with these guys. And, honestly, it hasn't been since 2011-2012. This won't be a playoff team (again) in 2016, even after all the $$ spent in the spring. When does Reese get held accountable?
I'm not sure he does. You can't hold Reese accountable without also holding Chris Mara accountable.
and we voted to watch the debate. 3 in favor, 1 against (me), and 1 neutral. I guess it didn't matter what I watched, I was going to see a train wreck.
Seriously glad I didn't watch this except for the last 4 minutes. Which was enough to know McAdoo needs to get off his knees cause he's blowing the game. And our offensive line sucks.
Please bring in Beatty to LT and move Flowers to RT.
Same problems plague us year after year - shitty OL, no pass rush, shitty TEs and shitty LBs. Jonathan Casillas fucking sucks - how does a linebacker not know how to tackle? Oh yeah, shitty GM and shitty coaching staff, too. Spags and Sullivan were likely John Mara appointments, and McAdoo is lost.
I do think they have to find a way to make an improvement to the offensive line.
Even if they do turn things around, they are last in the division and have 3 conference losses. They would need to be near perfect the rest of the way to make the playoffs.
completely rattled behind this line. Hes played behind a bad line for 4 years now + its taken a toll. Our line has sucked since diehl subbed for locklear in 2012.
Get this shit right because there are 6 very winnable games coming up now. This season doesn't have to go up in smoke but if the offense continues to play like this it sure will.
the offense has shown no reason to turn it around.
First three weeks they were moving the ball very well but mental mistakes and turnovers were stalling drives. Nothing like what we've seen the last two weeks. I've got to believe Eli hasn't just suddenly gone through a complete physical breakdown over the course of a few months.
I do think they have to find a way to make an improvement to the offensive line.
Even if they do turn things around, they are last in the division and have 3 conference losses. They would need to be near perfect the rest of the way to make the playoffs.
No they don't. It's way too early to start looking at the divisional race. Just get the offensive line squared away and find a way to generate a pass rush.
need to show up some time soon, other than making a play or two early on against an edge run. They need to start disrupting offenses. If this is JPP, they better not re-sign him.
They need to consider using him next week! Is Flowers a RT or Guard? His technique is not good! Thought all along he was very physical and athletic?! Doesn't appear that way. How about Richburg? He looks weak and seems to be getting pushed back into Eli as well! We all thought this Oline was getting better. The amazing thing is Jerry and Pugh look to be the best two linemen on this team.
something is up. He fears the protection. Not saying it is an excuse, but something is amiss. Of course when it was desperation drive time they come right down and score.
We have all seen this before. On the game thread someone mentioned the hit, which was brutal, in the Skin game having some lasting affect. perhaps there is something too that since it was caused by a mental error.
Also, Flowers, fucking LVP. Horrid game
This is what happens when a GM leaves his QB behind an awful OL for going on 6 seasons now. Eli is either hurt or he's become totally skittish and gun shy. Taking a beating from his blindside almost weekly isn't helping matters either. Christ, Flowers sucks cock.
1.) Flowers was awful. Hart had a few tough plays on the very wide splits by the DE but was better than Flowers by a long shot.
2.) Eli was inaccurate through most of the game, but better in the 4th quarter. I have seen Eli be inaccurate on a couple throws per game, but never as many as tonight. Also, he seems to check down when he doesn't need to, and doesn't check down when he should.
3.) defense got better as the game went on, but Vernon is invisible on the rush.
4.) Giants wasted a TO on a complete pass and got jobbed on what was an incomplete pass that Sheppard should have picked off. Stark never had control of that ball.
5.) Despite awful play, they probably could have won if Eli was the least bit accurate in the 1st half and especially if Tye makes that catch before half
6.) Leon Hall is useless in coverage
7.) Jerrill Adams looked pretty good catching passes
8.) Green Bay has a very good defense
9.) many of the designs on the pass plays are terrible as I said at half time - seems they run two WRs into the same area making it easy to cover.
Move Flowers to RT. His feet are too slow for a LT. That has been proven.
After blindly hoping for improvement, I'm starting to wonder if moving him to the right side would even accomplish anything. Flowers has been atrocious and the coaching staff doesn't give him all that much help... the TE rarely chips or stays in when lined up on the left side.
need to show up some time soon, other than making a play or two early on against an edge run. They need to start disrupting offenses. If this is JPP, they better not re-sign him.
especially since Green Bay didn't play all that well and it was a winnable game.
The Giants are playing like one of the worst teams in the league. This is what one expects from the Browns.
- Just an anemic offense, wow. Even when they move the ball, nothing looks "smooth". It's all plays that barely happen, completions in traffic, etc.
- Flowers is a big problem. Bad LT play can as we all know almost single handedly tank a season
- Rodgers with an absurd amount of time. Their Oline was playing great. I would have started blitzing with L Collins (since they have no LBs) because the front 4 was getting bitch slapped.
- One of the worst games of Manning's career. The misses to wide Beckham near the sideline & Tye on seam were huge
- Jenkins played well
- Nice to see TE Adams make some plays
Thankfully Detroit did NY a favor or it would have been worst case scenario Sunday. Lookin like another 6-10, 7-9 season. 2011 seems like a looooong time ago.
Each of those 6 teams sees the Giants on their schedule and is salivating. The only teams they should be favored over going forward are the Bears and Browns.
There's time to right the ship, but only if serious adjustments are made.
Will they make a change or do they have to continue to play Flowers? I say no just because this is more egg in the face of Reese. A number 1 pick playing a critical position that is just outright terrible. Do you give him a short on the right side? Or just sit him??
But, I'm sorry, they are not the reason we lost. Eli still had time to make throws and this offense was put in place specifically to compensate for a bad OL. Eli made terrible throws all night to all his receivers and McAdoo's playcalling was terrible. The only drive he seemed to do anything to counter GB's pressure was the last drive. He gave Flowers no help, he called no misdirections or screens until the final drive, the slants, crossing routes, etc. were non-existent, etc.
But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Where are the people who laughed at the notion of bringing in LT Â
He just made bad throws. He wasn't skittish and he didn't have happy feet. I think he playcalling was terrible and Eli's execution was worse. He was behind his receivers in all spots on the field and missed badly on 2 open shots downfield.
RE: Where are the people who laughed at the notion of bringing in LT Â
But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
OL is meh, Flowers still looks like a RT
Secondary held up pretty well except third down
Tackling sucked
Pass rush sucked
Run defense sucked.
GB played like shit.
Jenkins and Harris showed up
But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
He's no more stationary now than he ever was. He still can buy time and avoid most pressure. He just isn't making the throws and the playcalling has left a ton to be desired. McAdoo has done nothing to combat the 2 deep looks or the pressure.
I think we are entering the pre- George Young era. Â
Paralyisis by analyisis.
.
PS: Kevin Shepard should never have made this team...the coaches who vouched for him should be dismissed, they have no expertise in LB talent evaluation.
Ereck Flowers got owned on multiple plays. Eli was under too much pressure most of the game.
Defensively, there was almost no pressure on Rogers. He had eternities to throw. I give the Giant's DBs some credit in this regard, they seemed to have covered well despite the the lack of QB pressure.
A couple of bright spots; Rainey is showing ability to run well after initial contact. Janoris Jenkins made plays.
Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
call out the play before they run it and I am Right ...
Problem is Its the Wrong fucking play to call .
Every god damn time we start a drive complete two passes
get a 1st down we would settle in and run the ball into
a wall . Its like they couldn't stop 2 passes in a row
its not a crime to throw 3 in a row .
So predictable for an armchair QB one would think an
NFL coach could see it as well .
Ben's Offense is a mess and it starts with the O-line
who cannot Run Block because we have the same damn
problem for 5 years ....
Fuck Reece this team sucks and he couldn't even buy his way
out of his piss poor drafts ..
But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
He's no more stationary now than he ever was. He still can buy time and avoid most pressure. He just isn't making the throws and the playcalling has left a ton to be desired. McAdoo has done nothing to combat the 2 deep looks or the pressure.
Disagree about this. Eli used to scramble. Hell the biggest play of his career came on a scramble where he was shaking off defenders.
Flowers may be a RT, next year, but maybe he can play guard on left next to Beatty, or Right w/ Pugh at RT, or with New house or Hart.
Or is that switch harder than putting him at RT, even this season?
The offense lost these 3 games. Against the Skins it was turnovers. The offense has no rhythm and is not carrying its weight. First, if they stayed on the field and increased TOP, the D would not wear out. Second, even 24 / 23 point games are winnable by a decent offense.
Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
My only defense of Spags is that there always seems to be some gaping chasm devoid of talent on this team. Last season it was cornerback AND safety. This season it's linebacker. Is it Spags' fault Jonathan Casillas and Khiry Robinson can't tackle fucking Randall Cobb? There was a play in the first half in which Starks ran the ball off the right end and NO ONE blocked Casillas on the play and he couldn't get to the ball.
Can't keep drives alive or sustained and the other team is executing. Tonight they got Green Bay off the field most of the game, but it still wasn't enough. We only had the ball like 23 minutes compared to 36+ for them. Big difference and gives us less opportunities to score, as well.
Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
My only defense of Spags is that there always seems to be some gaping chasm devoid of talent on this team. Last season it was cornerback AND safety. This season it's linebacker. Is it Spags' fault Jonathan Casillas and Khiry Robinson can't tackle fucking Randall Cobb? There was a play in the first half in which Starks ran the ball off the right end and NO ONE blocked Casillas on the play and he couldn't get to the ball.
lack of talent at certain positions is an issue with every team. No team is playing with 11 pro bowl players out there. Even in the 2007 SB year his defense gave up a lot of points early and a lot of points at home. 2008 has been his only great year to be honest throughout the time until Plax shot himself. Like it was suggested when he was hired back as DC. He had nowhere else to really go unless he stayed as a DB coach.
Flowers may be a RT, next year, but maybe he can play guard on left next to Beatty, or Right w/ Pugh at RT, or with New house or Hart.
Or is that switch harder than putting him at RT, even this season?
The reason why Flowers was drafted to play RT was because of the 2014 season they got from Pugh at RT. Although some say Pugh was injured. When Flowers was drafted Reese and Coughlin said he was going to compete with Pugh for RT. No one brought that.
It would feel a lot better right now being 3-2 and 2-0 in the division. Season is still young, and they won't play a road game until after thanksgiving (London neutral site). I hope for the best, but any reason for trust or genuine optimism for this team is distantly in the rear view mirror.
I still can't believe the coaching staff liked Sheppard more Â
-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
A lot of teams aren't getting the HR this year. Most of the offense was a HR to Beckham. Now it's like diminishing returns with three wide receivers (three choices for Eli) plus, who knows who is the actual starting TE or HB.
-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
Because we didn't actually drop 3 TDs. That's one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL, playing on the road, we got zero offensive TD's, and you are talking about 3 plays. And being very generous in calling them drops. Odell's was a legit drop but it also wasn't a TD. Would've been inside the 5. I think one to Shep was thrown behind where it needed to be, defender was able to make a play on the ball. But you're excusing that shit offense that took the field because of three plays is the actual joke.
If it's more of the same this season, I don't see how Reese Â
escapes the axe. I had previously thought that he'd be OK as long as Eli is around, if only because they wouldn't make a change at HC with McAdoo in his first year, but so far this team has not looked good. Granted, for the most part that could be level of competition and growing pains, but when your franchise QB looks like Eli does, short of him being injured and us not knowing something is *very* wrong.
The lack of a functional OL and bad LBs just can't continue forever.
-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
Because we didn't actually drop 3 TDs. That's one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL, playing on the road, we got zero offensive TD's, and you are talking about 3 plays. And being very generous in calling them drops. Odell's was a legit drop but it also wasn't a TD. Would've been inside the 5. I think one to Shep was thrown behind where it needed to be, defender was able to make a play on the ball. But you're excusing that shit offense that took the field because of three plays is the actual joke.
False. Donnell dropped an easy back shoulder throw in the end zone. followed by beckham dropping one in the back of the end zone, finally beckhams drops at the end of the game.
How do you explain going 32-41, where 7 of the 9 incompletions hit the offensive players in the hands (as pointed out by beat writers, not me.)
Because check down Charlie doesn't make you a good QB.
And one of those drive ending fumbles was Eli's.
32-41 and 380 yards. Want to revist your statement. Cruz and Shephard over 100 yards and Beckham with 86. Maybe if Cruz and Beckham didnt drop deep balls, you wouldnt call him checkdown charlie.
Once again, you are embarrassing yourself. 39 out of 41 balls hit the WR in the hands. Awful. And his fumble didnt happen inside the 20. Cruz and vereen's did.
Unless there is a systemic failure. It's not just Eli playing poorly. It's everything. The team can't run the ball because the OL can't block. We can't pass the ball because the defense is keeping two Safeties deep and our OL isn't that good. Our franchise QB is rattled and our first year head coach appears overwhelmed. Every game the defense is the same. They let up multiple drives allowing the other team to score and eat up huge chunks of time. The defensive coordinator is clearly overrated. We have no pass rush and what appeared to be the strength of the defense, the secondary has been decimated with injuries.
And I'm not even going to go into what I think of the GM.
Keep defending the blameless one. Everyone can see he has been inaccurate on the deep ball, he's been feeling phantom pressure, throwing high and behing receivers or simply not seeing open receivers.
I didn't say Eli's fumble was in the redzone. Just that he had one that ended a drive. Or do lost fumbles only matter in the red zone?
Vereen's fumble occurred at the NO 38 yd line. Not the red zone.
And why don't you tell me how many completions were short of the line to gain on third down that resulted in a 4th down in that game?
Because completiom ratio is what wins games, right? Go back and look... A lot of short passes and relyimg on YAC to get the first. Problem is when the receiver isn't able to get there.
1. Get ball to Beckham
2. Try very hard to get the ball to Beckham
3.
4. Offense succeeds
I don't understand how all the ingenuity we saw the previous 2 seasons has gone out the window now. I recall a play (maybe Odell's rookie season) on 3rd & 4-6 in which the Giants had 4 guys to the right of the pattern in a diamond formation. Odell was the last man in the diamond. The first 3 players basically just cleared space for Odell to run a fake out, then a quick slant underneath for the 1st down. That's the kind of play we could use now as we struggle to convert 3rd & 5ish-type plays.
No leadership, committing to many penalties,getting fooled on screen plays, both wr and rb. A Lt that can't block speed rushers, average rb, wr not getting open against 2nd string cb.no passrush!! Still so many needs after 200 mill spent. Lbs,rb,oline,de. Sickening, hopefully can turn it around? Bad game all around.
No leadership, committing to many penalties,getting fooled on screen plays, both wr and rb. A Lt that can't block speed rushers, average rb, wr not getting open against 2nd string cb.no passrush!! Still so many needs after 200 mill spent. Lbs,rb,oline,de. Sickening, hopefully can turn it around? Bad game all around.
Plus antics by their top wr and OLT shoving reporters after game...a circus
Did the game plan seem to you that they were going to force it to Beckham no matter what? How could Cruz and Shephard never be open when GBs top two CBs were out?
Flowers had his worst game as a Giant. Still high on him though. Richburg gets tossed around by bigger DTs. He needs to get stronger. I thought Hart again acquitted himself well.
WTF were they thinking when they deferred on the coin toss? Really set the tone allowing an 8 ½ minute TD drive to start the game. This is the 2016 Giants Defense, not the 1986 or 1956.
Spags is incompetent. All they do is bull rush. He can’t scheme for anything. He rushed 4 as if they are still Strahan, Tuck, Canty and Osi.
I’m liking Landon Collins more and more. And Jenkins to me is the best of the FA bunch by a mile.
Another f’ing ST penalty!! UGH!
Overall, this is the team I thought they were. People like Paul Schwartz predicting 10-6 and playoffs were crazy. Good chance they are 2-5 at the bye week.
No question in my mind. Offensively, defensively.. just hard to defend at this point.
There are talent deficiencies and players not playing well but we're getting outcoached on a weekly basis right now and this is a completely undisciplined football team.
desultory performance. Every team is and will play us the same way, namely by keeping their safeties back in a cover 2 shell, and trying to control the LOS with four or five DL. That forces us to go on long drives to score, which is difficult, but even more so given our suspect OL and propensity for penalties. The end result is no big plays, and a field that seems two hundred yards long. My thoughts about individual players and position groups, as well as some suggestions, are as follows:
Eli: It’s possible we are witnessing the end of Eli. I say possible, because he clearly and understandably has no confidence in his OL, especially Flowers and Hart. But his arm strength seems to have declined. His passes are floating. They are often on the wrong side of the receiver, or too high or low. He also doesn’t seem to be throwing sideline outs as effectively. He may have an unknown injury, or it may just be an accumulation of injuries from repeated hits. He’s been an ironman, but is now 35. He won’t be benched for Nassib unless he is injured, or truly starts to play horrifically.
My guess is Nassib is gone after this year. He understandably doesn’t want to remain as Eli’s backup forever. The Giants also may not want him back, as demonstrated by their signing of Johnson right at the end of the preseason, and the willingness to carry three QBs on the active roster.
OL: Flowers was beyond bad. That was one of the worst performances I have ever seen from a Giants LT. As I said last night, Flowers right now looks like a somewhat better version of James Brewer. Brewer was very effective when he locked onto someone, but had terrible feet. He couldn’t handle speed rushers, and was awful in space. The same was true for Petrus and Herman. Flowers is more effective when he locks on, and is better in space, but at least right now, his feet are as bad as Brewer’s.
As others have suggested, I would flip Flowers to RT, where his bad feet are less likely to be a problem, and his size would be more useful in the run game. Beatty would then play LT. Newhouse and Hart would be backups.
TE: I’d play Adams as much as possible. He’s a better blocker than Tye or Donnell, and that’s what we need most right now.
DL: No pass rush pressure, even when we blitz. Again. Rodgers had ridiculous amounts of time. I’m not sure how much we could expect in that regard from Hankins and Harrison, but although they have been stout against the run, they are not pushing the pocket backwards often enough. JPP, Vernon, Wynn, and OO are also not winning one on one battles. I think this is the last year for JPP. Right now, I’d play Okwara more.
LB: We still don’t have a real coverage LB, but the problem last night was just poor tackling.
CB: Teams are going to pick on Wade, a problem that is magnified because we have no pass rush. There were a few plays last night where Rodgers couldn’t find anyone to throw to even though he had six plus seconds. I’d give Wade and Hunter safety help as much as possible.
Coaching: I’d like to see more adjustments from McAdoo, including a willingness to move or bench some of the players I mentioned. I’m not sure what Spags can do. His DL is generating zero pass rush pressure. That is almost impossible for any coach to overcome.
Reese: He has to be concerned about Flowers, and that his defense hasn’t improved enough to warrant spending $200 million.
AcidTest, agree completely about Adams at TE. Play the kid. Â
and that can't be ignored. But this game once again came down to Eli Manning missing throws and playing poorly. That's 3 bad games in a row and 2 dreadful ones.
Eli cannot extend plays. What makes him great when he's on is his ability to throw good passes in the intermediate/deep range. He makes those tough in-the-pocket throws better than most NFL QBs, and when he's "on" he's as good as it gets in this area.
But he's been wayyyy off with his accuracy in the pocket following the Saints game. He did get hit hard late in that game and maybe that's why he's in a funk. But whatever it is, he's playing like crap out there.
The QB is the MVP of every football team and if he played above-average, we would've beat the Packers last night and would've beat the Redskins. Eli needs to play up to the standard that he's proven he can play at.
There are many things wrong with this team. Too many to list. Â
but right now one of our biggest issues is the QB position. Injury, age, general decline? who knows, but Eli is a bad/mediocre player right now.
He is killing this team with his rushed throws, fumbles, bad accuracy. He seems to have lost whatever small amount of athleticism he had, he is simply incapable of doing anything good when the play breaks down (save for 1 throw to OBJ last night that was more OBJ than Eli).
Again, I don't think too much of this team overall right now, but with even decent QB play we could be 4-1 (no one was helping us against the Vikes).
I'm not giving up on Eli yet. He was not the only one affected Â
PASSING COMP ATT PCT YDS TD INT QBR
Manning 18 35 51.4 199 1 0 78.2
PASSING COMP ATT PCT YDS TD INT QBR
A Rodgers 23 45 51.1 259 2 2 65.0
And Rogers had a bye. Something was in the air. Yes Eli was bad. But I don't think he's losing his skills. He just has to play better. IMHO He will. And you could say WTF on plenty of Rogers throws. Eli was just off enough consistently to cost us big time.
I said before the season started that Adams would be the starting TE Â
before mid season. He should start next week. So, too, should Perkins. Adams' blocking and Perkins running will improved the run game immensely. Then maybe the passing game will work. The defense is playing well enough to win games. It's offensive ineptitude that makes us want to see the defense play as if Osi, Strahan, and Tuck were still on the roster. That caliber of defense isn't needed if the team is able to run the ball.
desultory performance. Every team is and will play us the same way, namely by keeping their safeties back in a cover 2 shell, and trying to control the LOS with four or five DL. That forces us to go on long drives to score, which is difficult, but even more so given our suspect OL and propensity for penalties. The end result is no big plays, and a field that seems two hundred yards long. My thoughts about individual players and position groups, as well as some suggestions, are as follows:
Eli: It’s possible we are witnessing the end of Eli. I say possible, because he clearly and understandably has no confidence in his OL, especially Flowers and Hart. But his arm strength seems to have declined. His passes are floating. They are often on the wrong side of the receiver, or too high or low. He also doesn’t seem to be throwing sideline outs as effectively. He may have an unknown injury, or it may just be an accumulation of injuries from repeated hits. He’s been an ironman, but is now 35. He won’t be benched for Nassib unless he is injured, or truly starts to play horrifically.
My guess is Nassib is gone after this year. He understandably doesn’t want to remain as Eli’s backup forever. The Giants also may not want him back, as demonstrated by their signing of Johnson right at the end of the preseason, and the willingness to carry three QBs on the active roster.
OL: Flowers was beyond bad. That was one of the worst performances I have ever seen from a Giants LT. As I said last night, Flowers right now looks like a somewhat better version of James Brewer. Brewer was very effective when he locked onto someone, but had terrible feet. He couldn’t handle speed rushers, and was awful in space. The same was true for Petrus and Herman. Flowers is more effective when he locks on, and is better in space, but at least right now, his feet are as bad as Brewer’s.
As others have suggested, I would flip Flowers to RT, where his bad feet are less likely to be a problem, and his size would be more useful in the run game. Beatty would then play LT. Newhouse and Hart would be backups.
TE: I’d play Adams as much as possible. He’s a better blocker than Tye or Donnell, and that’s what we need most right now.
DL: No pass rush pressure, even when we blitz. Again. Rodgers had ridiculous amounts of time. I’m not sure how much we could expect in that regard from Hankins and Harrison, but although they have been stout against the run, they are not pushing the pocket backwards often enough. JPP, Vernon, Wynn, and OO are also not winning one on one battles. I think this is the last year for JPP. Right now, I’d play Okwara more.
LB: We still don’t have a real coverage LB, but the problem last night was just poor tackling.
CB: Teams are going to pick on Wade, a problem that is magnified because we have no pass rush. There were a few plays last night where Rodgers couldn’t find anyone to throw to even though he had six plus seconds. I’d give Wade and Hunter safety help as much as possible.
Coaching: I’d like to see more adjustments from McAdoo, including a willingness to move or bench some of the players I mentioned. I’m not sure what Spags can do. His DL is generating zero pass rush pressure. That is almost impossible for any coach to overcome.
Reese: He has to be concerned about Flowers, and that his defense hasn’t improved enough to warrant spending $200 million.
Actually, I think it was worse than this. Eli is pretty clearly done. Neither DE is succeeding as a pass rusher (though JPP has looked better to me than Vernon). The OL continues to be a disaster, with Flowers the most disappointing failure. This clouds assessment of the RBs, but none looks good enough to start on any other team. The tackling has gone downhill since the season began -- looks like a coaching problem.
McAdoo is a flop as a Head Coach. Reese, when all is said and done, has to bear the blame for assembling this mess -- and cannot possibly be the answer to how to fix it.
In short, the Giants continue to be a do-over team, with more weaknesses demanding solution, especially in the OL, and now in the QB and Head Coach situations, than were obvious last year. This still can't be done in a single year and probably not in two. But some heads must roll to begin with.
Papa said that Manning hadn't played well since he took Â
When, exactly?
Many of us realists called 2-3 as soon as Eli was picked to end the Redskin game and were mocked/ridiculed. Well, here we are. Season on the brink. And it's not yet Halloween. Again....
Defensive backfield played their tails off, got no help from the front 7
A couple bright spots...Perkins, Rainey and Adams all made the most of their limited chances
McAdoo screwed up twice there. One, don't call timeout after 1st play. They still would've had to run a play before 2 minute warning. And then this, challenge that shit, nothing to lose but a timeout which you need to call anyways..
Fuck this team.
We have all seen this before. On the game thread someone mentioned the hit, which was brutal, in the Skin game having some lasting affect. perhaps there is something too that since it was caused by a mental error.
Also, Flowers, fucking LVP. Horrid game
Agree with this 100%
Is Peppers coming out after this year? LOL
1. Teams don't have to stack the box so the receivers aren't getting open
2. Teams generate a pass rush without blitzing
3. Eli's lowering his eyes to look at the rush, and as a result he is playing like complete shit
But at least the money that wasn't spent on that side of the ball created an elite defensive line, right?
Fuck.
would have liked to have had the chance anyway
He really does look lost.
Erm... that's all I've got.
Trying to keep things positive here...
I am deeply concerned that this is a franchise who could drift into the wilderness for a prolonged period. Hope they get this turned around
Football is not fun with these guys. And, honestly, it hasn't been since 2011-2012. This won't be a playoff team (again) in 2016, even after all the $$ spent in the spring. When does Reese get held accountable?
1. Teams don't have to stack the box so the receivers aren't getting open
2. Teams generate a pass rush without blitzing
3. Eli's lowering his eyes to look at the rush, and as a result he is playing like complete shit
But at least the money that wasn't spent on that side of the ball created an elite defensive line, right?
Fuck.
No one can say a word against you this week. 7-8 men in the secondary with 1 speed WR.
I know it was not a perfect pass, but you gotta bring that one in.
These games are not even fun to watch.
the offense has shown no reason to turn it around.
Bench Bobby Hart; start William Beatty at LT and Flowers at RT
Play Jerell Adams a HELL of a lot more. In fact, I'd rather see him in over Tye and Donnell.
On Defense:
Bench Kelvin Sheppard; start BJ Goodson
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For me...
Football is not fun with these guys. And, honestly, it hasn't been since 2011-2012. This won't be a playoff team (again) in 2016, even after all the $$ spent in the spring. When does Reese get held accountable?
I'm not sure he does. You can't hold Reese accountable without also holding Chris Mara accountable.
Seriously glad I didn't watch this except for the last 4 minutes. Which was enough to know McAdoo needs to get off his knees cause he's blowing the game. And our offensive line sucks.
Please bring in Beatty to LT and move Flowers to RT.
FUCK!
Bench Bobby Hart; start William Beatty at LT and Flowers at RT
Play Jerell Adams a HELL of a lot more. In fact, I'd rather see him in over Tye and Donnell.
On Defense:
Bench Kelvin Sheppard; start BJ Goodson
Notice how Jerell Adams knew to get out of bounds, yet the vet Rainey didn't? Thats all I needed to see from Adams. Get him in there.
Career special don't become good players at the age of 30. He's the definition of mediocre.
Turned the corner my Irish ass....
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Get this shit right because there are 6 very winnable games coming up now. This season doesn't have to go up in smoke but if the offense continues to play like this it sure will.
the offense has shown no reason to turn it around.
First three weeks they were moving the ball very well but mental mistakes and turnovers were stalling drives. Nothing like what we've seen the last two weeks. I've got to believe Eli hasn't just suddenly gone through a complete physical breakdown over the course of a few months.
They all suck. Casillas can't make plays when no one is blocking him and he can't bring down slot receivers.
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I do think they have to find a way to make an improvement to the offensive line.
Even if they do turn things around, they are last in the division and have 3 conference losses. They would need to be near perfect the rest of the way to make the playoffs.
No they don't. It's way too early to start looking at the divisional race. Just get the offensive line squared away and find a way to generate a pass rush.
There's plenty of time.
And basically confirmin Eli's form is a mess due to the Oline.
We have all seen this before. On the game thread someone mentioned the hit, which was brutal, in the Skin game having some lasting affect. perhaps there is something too that since it was caused by a mental error.
Also, Flowers, fucking LVP. Horrid game
This is what happens when a GM leaves his QB behind an awful OL for going on 6 seasons now. Eli is either hurt or he's become totally skittish and gun shy. Taking a beating from his blindside almost weekly isn't helping matters either. Christ, Flowers sucks cock.
2.) Eli was inaccurate through most of the game, but better in the 4th quarter. I have seen Eli be inaccurate on a couple throws per game, but never as many as tonight. Also, he seems to check down when he doesn't need to, and doesn't check down when he should.
3.) defense got better as the game went on, but Vernon is invisible on the rush.
4.) Giants wasted a TO on a complete pass and got jobbed on what was an incomplete pass that Sheppard should have picked off. Stark never had control of that ball.
5.) Despite awful play, they probably could have won if Eli was the least bit accurate in the 1st half and especially if Tye makes that catch before half
6.) Leon Hall is useless in coverage
7.) Jerrill Adams looked pretty good catching passes
8.) Green Bay has a very good defense
9.) many of the designs on the pass plays are terrible as I said at half time - seems they run two WRs into the same area making it easy to cover.
They don't need an LT type linebacker.
They just need a linebacker who isn't a special teams player. Every guy they have at linebacker is mediocre, every single one of them.
heard this mantra every year since 2012.
Changes are needed here. Next week is must win. Cause I don't believe a 2-4 team has a shot at the playoffs.
After blindly hoping for improvement, I'm starting to wonder if moving him to the right side would even accomplish anything. Flowers has been atrocious and the coaching staff doesn't give him all that much help... the TE rarely chips or stays in when lined up on the left side.
They are showing up. This is what they are.
What was he fucking thinking? Flowers is awful. That dude was the 9th overall pick and he looks like shit.
The Giants are playing like one of the worst teams in the league. This is what one expects from the Browns.
- Just an anemic offense, wow. Even when they move the ball, nothing looks "smooth". It's all plays that barely happen, completions in traffic, etc.
- Flowers is a big problem. Bad LT play can as we all know almost single handedly tank a season
- Rodgers with an absurd amount of time. Their Oline was playing great. I would have started blitzing with L Collins (since they have no LBs) because the front 4 was getting bitch slapped.
- One of the worst games of Manning's career. The misses to wide Beckham near the sideline & Tye on seam were huge
- Jenkins played well
- Nice to see TE Adams make some plays
Thankfully Detroit did NY a favor or it would have been worst case scenario Sunday. Lookin like another 6-10, 7-9 season. 2011 seems like a looooong time ago.
There's time to right the ship, but only if serious adjustments are made.
You can make an argument each of our losses is the offenses fault. Kicking field goals loses games.
Osi Umenyiora.
lol at this too..even post game is a fuck up. holy
And 3 of those points came courtesy of Eli's horrendous fumble before the half.
TE or RB needs to be kept in to help Flowers on third downs.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Coughlin may be gone, but the two coordinators are still here, and things still look very much the same, should we be surprised by that?
Coughlin may be gone, but the two coordinators are still here, and things still look very much the same, should we be surprised by that?
Only if your last name is Mara or Tisch.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
Secondary held up pretty well except third down
Tackling sucked
Pass rush sucked
Run defense sucked.
GB played like shit.
Jenkins and Harris showed up
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But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
.
PS: Kevin Shepard should never have made this team...the coaches who vouched for him should be dismissed, they have no expertise in LB talent evaluation.
Defensively, there was almost no pressure on Rogers. He had eternities to throw. I give the Giant's DBs some credit in this regard, they seemed to have covered well despite the the lack of QB pressure.
A couple of bright spots; Rainey is showing ability to run well after initial contact. Janoris Jenkins made plays.
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
Problem is Its the Wrong fucking play to call .
Every god damn time we start a drive complete two passes
get a 1st down we would settle in and run the ball into
a wall . Its like they couldn't stop 2 passes in a row
its not a crime to throw 3 in a row .
So predictable for an armchair QB one would think an
NFL coach could see it as well .
Ben's Offense is a mess and it starts with the O-line
who cannot Run Block because we have the same damn
problem for 5 years ....
Fuck Reece this team sucks and he couldn't even buy his way
out of his piss poor drafts ..
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In comment 13166779 old man said:
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But he IS playing scared, even the few times he is protected.
I thought Mc dropped rollouts too soon; could have brought TE across with him to take some of the rush pressure off.
But Eli needs to make the few plays the OL let's him.
Eli has been playing like this the entire season. The guy looks awful trying to move in the pocket. Rodgers and Eli are nearly the same age. Eli has become a pure stationary QB and when hit he can't even hold onto the ball anymore. There are issues there. Not great line play and Flowers should be moved but there are some serious issues at QB play going forward.
He's no more stationary now than he ever was. He still can buy time and avoid most pressure. He just isn't making the throws and the playcalling has left a ton to be desired. McAdoo has done nothing to combat the 2 deep looks or the pressure.
Disagree about this. Eli used to scramble. Hell the biggest play of his career came on a scramble where he was shaking off defenders.
Or is that switch harder than putting him at RT, even this season?
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Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
My only defense of Spags is that there always seems to be some gaping chasm devoid of talent on this team. Last season it was cornerback AND safety. This season it's linebacker. Is it Spags' fault Jonathan Casillas and Khiry Robinson can't tackle fucking Randall Cobb? There was a play in the first half in which Starks ran the ball off the right end and NO ONE blocked Casillas on the play and he couldn't get to the ball.
London game is on national TV at 9:30 AM
yep typical press conference answers....same shit every week
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In comment 13166799 Matt M. said:
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Nothing he does is disguised, makes the QB/OC guess, or makes them uncomfortable. His blitzes are always telegraphed, his coverages are easy to read, etc. Every week, DC's force our offense to play chess, make our OL/QB uncomfortable, disguise coverages, etc. When does a QB ever seem to be guessing against us?
He has been so overrated on BBI. I been saying it for many years. If you actually followed the Rams during his tenure you wouldn't be shocked. I wanted a fresh name but he is part of some fans folklore.
My only defense of Spags is that there always seems to be some gaping chasm devoid of talent on this team. Last season it was cornerback AND safety. This season it's linebacker. Is it Spags' fault Jonathan Casillas and Khiry Robinson can't tackle fucking Randall Cobb? There was a play in the first half in which Starks ran the ball off the right end and NO ONE blocked Casillas on the play and he couldn't get to the ball.
lack of talent at certain positions is an issue with every team. No team is playing with 11 pro bowl players out there. Even in the 2007 SB year his defense gave up a lot of points early and a lot of points at home. 2008 has been his only great year to be honest throughout the time until Plax shot himself. Like it was suggested when he was hired back as DC. He had nowhere else to really go unless he stayed as a DB coach.
Career special don't become good players at the age of 30. He's the definition of mediocre.
Turned the corner my Irish ass....
This is BBi. Nuts and ass in the same post.
If McAdoo can't figure out how to move the ball (and score) vs this defensive strategy, and he's had 5 weeks now, then this season truly is shot.
Or is that switch harder than putting him at RT, even this season?
The reason why Flowers was drafted to play RT was because of the 2014 season they got from Pugh at RT. Although some say Pugh was injured. When Flowers was drafted Reese and Coughlin said he was going to compete with Pugh for RT. No one brought that.
Agreed. Has to be one of the worst in the NFL.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
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They can't get a decent production together.
Agreed. Has to be one of the worst in the NFL.
Are you guys talking about the one on MSG or WFAN?
A lot of teams aren't getting the HR this year. Most of the offense was a HR to Beckham. Now it's like diminishing returns with three wide receivers (three choices for Eli) plus, who knows who is the actual starting TE or HB.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
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-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
2. Try very hard to get the ball to Beckham
3.
4. Offense succeeds
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In comment 13166903 JohnVB said:
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-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
Because we didn't actually drop 3 TDs. That's one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL, playing on the road, we got zero offensive TD's, and you are talking about 3 plays. And being very generous in calling them drops. Odell's was a legit drop but it also wasn't a TD. Would've been inside the 5. I think one to Shep was thrown behind where it needed to be, defender was able to make a play on the ball. But you're excusing that shit offense that took the field because of three plays is the actual joke.
The lack of a functional OL and bad LBs just can't continue forever.
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In comment 13166956 allstarjim said:
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In comment 13166903 JohnVB said:
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-Eli has looked like shit since the 2nd half of the skins game. He's had a bad game here and there throughout his career but this is 10 quarters of shitty football. If someone told you we would hold the Packers to 23 points and win the TO battle before the game, everyone would take that. Eli and the offense are a liability.
-The DL needs to generate pressure and make plays. If Strahan/Tuck/Osi/5 Fingered JPP had this kind of coverage on the back end when they were playing they would've went down as a historically great defense. Vernon and JPP aren't earning their checks.
-The LBs are atrocious. As a unit they can't tackle for shit.
-The OL is uneven at best. Flowers is a liability.
-McAdoo looks lost at times on the sideline. The team, and the offense in particular, looks sloppy and undisciplined way too often. For as much shit Spags gets around here, the defense has actually kept us in games this year despite shit shows on offense and specials -- even with zero pass rush and shitty LBs.
This team should be 3-2 at worst and 5-0 at best based on talent at this point. Very frustrating season so far. The offense has been a huge letdown.
Eli has looked like shit since he staryed in the 2nd preseason game. He has been terrible. You score zero TD's against the Saints. The Saints... In your building. 20 points against the Cowboys, with zero pass rush. And that was his best game. The Redskins loss 100% on him. Completely outclassed by Minnesota. And shit the bed against the what, 28th ranked pass defense without their top 2 corners? You kidding me?
You're a joke. Explain how he was terrible against the Saints. 4th time I have asked you. Is it his fault we dropped 3 TDs and we had two fumbles inside the 20? Dont post stupid shit if you dont know what you are talking about.
Because we didn't actually drop 3 TDs. That's one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL, playing on the road, we got zero offensive TD's, and you are talking about 3 plays. And being very generous in calling them drops. Odell's was a legit drop but it also wasn't a TD. Would've been inside the 5. I think one to Shep was thrown behind where it needed to be, defender was able to make a play on the ball. But you're excusing that shit offense that took the field because of three plays is the actual joke.
False. Donnell dropped an easy back shoulder throw in the end zone. followed by beckham dropping one in the back of the end zone, finally beckhams drops at the end of the game.
How do you explain going 32-41, where 7 of the 9 incompletions hit the offensive players in the hands (as pointed out by beat writers, not me.)
Get a clue buddy.
And one of those drive ending fumbles was Eli's.
And one of those drive ending fumbles was Eli's.
32-41 and 380 yards. Want to revist your statement. Cruz and Shephard over 100 yards and Beckham with 86. Maybe if Cruz and Beckham didnt drop deep balls, you wouldnt call him checkdown charlie.
Once again, you are embarrassing yourself. 39 out of 41 balls hit the WR in the hands. Awful. And his fumble didnt happen inside the 20. Cruz and vereen's did.
And I'm not even going to go into what I think of the GM.
Keep defending the blameless one. Everyone can see he has been inaccurate on the deep ball, he's been feeling phantom pressure, throwing high and behing receivers or simply not seeing open receivers.
I didn't say Eli's fumble was in the redzone. Just that he had one that ended a drive. Or do lost fumbles only matter in the red zone?
Vereen's fumble occurred at the NO 38 yd line. Not the red zone.
And why don't you tell me how many completions were short of the line to gain on third down that resulted in a 4th down in that game?
Because completiom ratio is what wins games, right? Go back and look... A lot of short passes and relyimg on YAC to get the first. Problem is when the receiver isn't able to get there.
2. Try very hard to get the ball to Beckham
3.
4. Offense succeeds
I don't understand how all the ingenuity we saw the previous 2 seasons has gone out the window now. I recall a play (maybe Odell's rookie season) on 3rd & 4-6 in which the Giants had 4 guys to the right of the pattern in a diamond formation. Odell was the last man in the diamond. The first 3 players basically just cleared space for Odell to run a fake out, then a quick slant underneath for the 1st down. That's the kind of play we could use now as we struggle to convert 3rd & 5ish-type plays.
Plus antics by their top wr and OLT shoving reporters after game...a circus
Did the game plan seem to you that they were going to force it to Beckham no matter what? How could Cruz and Shephard never be open when GBs top two CBs were out?
Flowers had his worst game as a Giant. Still high on him though. Richburg gets tossed around by bigger DTs. He needs to get stronger. I thought Hart again acquitted himself well.
WTF were they thinking when they deferred on the coin toss? Really set the tone allowing an 8 ½ minute TD drive to start the game. This is the 2016 Giants Defense, not the 1986 or 1956.
Spags is incompetent. All they do is bull rush. He can’t scheme for anything. He rushed 4 as if they are still Strahan, Tuck, Canty and Osi.
I’m liking Landon Collins more and more. And Jenkins to me is the best of the FA bunch by a mile.
Another f’ing ST penalty!! UGH!
Overall, this is the team I thought they were. People like Paul Schwartz predicting 10-6 and playoffs were crazy. Good chance they are 2-5 at the bye week.
There are talent deficiencies and players not playing well but we're getting outcoached on a weekly basis right now and this is a completely undisciplined football team.
Eli: It’s possible we are witnessing the end of Eli. I say possible, because he clearly and understandably has no confidence in his OL, especially Flowers and Hart. But his arm strength seems to have declined. His passes are floating. They are often on the wrong side of the receiver, or too high or low. He also doesn’t seem to be throwing sideline outs as effectively. He may have an unknown injury, or it may just be an accumulation of injuries from repeated hits. He’s been an ironman, but is now 35. He won’t be benched for Nassib unless he is injured, or truly starts to play horrifically.
My guess is Nassib is gone after this year. He understandably doesn’t want to remain as Eli’s backup forever. The Giants also may not want him back, as demonstrated by their signing of Johnson right at the end of the preseason, and the willingness to carry three QBs on the active roster.
OL: Flowers was beyond bad. That was one of the worst performances I have ever seen from a Giants LT. As I said last night, Flowers right now looks like a somewhat better version of James Brewer. Brewer was very effective when he locked onto someone, but had terrible feet. He couldn’t handle speed rushers, and was awful in space. The same was true for Petrus and Herman. Flowers is more effective when he locks on, and is better in space, but at least right now, his feet are as bad as Brewer’s.
As others have suggested, I would flip Flowers to RT, where his bad feet are less likely to be a problem, and his size would be more useful in the run game. Beatty would then play LT. Newhouse and Hart would be backups.
TE: I’d play Adams as much as possible. He’s a better blocker than Tye or Donnell, and that’s what we need most right now.
DL: No pass rush pressure, even when we blitz. Again. Rodgers had ridiculous amounts of time. I’m not sure how much we could expect in that regard from Hankins and Harrison, but although they have been stout against the run, they are not pushing the pocket backwards often enough. JPP, Vernon, Wynn, and OO are also not winning one on one battles. I think this is the last year for JPP. Right now, I’d play Okwara more.
LB: We still don’t have a real coverage LB, but the problem last night was just poor tackling.
CB: Teams are going to pick on Wade, a problem that is magnified because we have no pass rush. There were a few plays last night where Rodgers couldn’t find anyone to throw to even though he had six plus seconds. I’d give Wade and Hunter safety help as much as possible.
Coaching: I’d like to see more adjustments from McAdoo, including a willingness to move or bench some of the players I mentioned. I’m not sure what Spags can do. His DL is generating zero pass rush pressure. That is almost impossible for any coach to overcome.
Reese: He has to be concerned about Flowers, and that his defense hasn’t improved enough to warrant spending $200 million.
Same goes for Goodson at MLB. They suck anyway. May as well let the kid get experience.
Eli cannot extend plays. What makes him great when he's on is his ability to throw good passes in the intermediate/deep range. He makes those tough in-the-pocket throws better than most NFL QBs, and when he's "on" he's as good as it gets in this area.
But he's been wayyyy off with his accuracy in the pocket following the Saints game. He did get hit hard late in that game and maybe that's why he's in a funk. But whatever it is, he's playing like crap out there.
The QB is the MVP of every football team and if he played above-average, we would've beat the Packers last night and would've beat the Redskins. Eli needs to play up to the standard that he's proven he can play at.
He is killing this team with his rushed throws, fumbles, bad accuracy. He seems to have lost whatever small amount of athleticism he had, he is simply incapable of doing anything good when the play breaks down (save for 1 throw to OBJ last night that was more OBJ than Eli).
Again, I don't think too much of this team overall right now, but with even decent QB play we could be 4-1 (no one was helping us against the Vikes).
PASSING COMP ATT PCT YDS TD INT QBR
Manning 18 35 51.4 199 1 0 78.2
PASSING COMP ATT PCT YDS TD INT QBR
A Rodgers 23 45 51.1 259 2 2 65.0
And Rogers had a bye. Something was in the air. Yes Eli was bad. But I don't think he's losing his skills. He just has to play better. IMHO He will. And you could say WTF on plenty of Rogers throws. Eli was just off enough consistently to cost us big time.
Eli: It’s possible we are witnessing the end of Eli. I say possible, because he clearly and understandably has no confidence in his OL, especially Flowers and Hart. But his arm strength seems to have declined. His passes are floating. They are often on the wrong side of the receiver, or too high or low. He also doesn’t seem to be throwing sideline outs as effectively. He may have an unknown injury, or it may just be an accumulation of injuries from repeated hits. He’s been an ironman, but is now 35. He won’t be benched for Nassib unless he is injured, or truly starts to play horrifically.
My guess is Nassib is gone after this year. He understandably doesn’t want to remain as Eli’s backup forever. The Giants also may not want him back, as demonstrated by their signing of Johnson right at the end of the preseason, and the willingness to carry three QBs on the active roster.
OL: Flowers was beyond bad. That was one of the worst performances I have ever seen from a Giants LT. As I said last night, Flowers right now looks like a somewhat better version of James Brewer. Brewer was very effective when he locked onto someone, but had terrible feet. He couldn’t handle speed rushers, and was awful in space. The same was true for Petrus and Herman. Flowers is more effective when he locks on, and is better in space, but at least right now, his feet are as bad as Brewer’s.
As others have suggested, I would flip Flowers to RT, where his bad feet are less likely to be a problem, and his size would be more useful in the run game. Beatty would then play LT. Newhouse and Hart would be backups.
TE: I’d play Adams as much as possible. He’s a better blocker than Tye or Donnell, and that’s what we need most right now.
DL: No pass rush pressure, even when we blitz. Again. Rodgers had ridiculous amounts of time. I’m not sure how much we could expect in that regard from Hankins and Harrison, but although they have been stout against the run, they are not pushing the pocket backwards often enough. JPP, Vernon, Wynn, and OO are also not winning one on one battles. I think this is the last year for JPP. Right now, I’d play Okwara more.
LB: We still don’t have a real coverage LB, but the problem last night was just poor tackling.
CB: Teams are going to pick on Wade, a problem that is magnified because we have no pass rush. There were a few plays last night where Rodgers couldn’t find anyone to throw to even though he had six plus seconds. I’d give Wade and Hunter safety help as much as possible.
Coaching: I’d like to see more adjustments from McAdoo, including a willingness to move or bench some of the players I mentioned. I’m not sure what Spags can do. His DL is generating zero pass rush pressure. That is almost impossible for any coach to overcome.
Reese: He has to be concerned about Flowers, and that his defense hasn’t improved enough to warrant spending $200 million.
Actually, I think it was worse than this. Eli is pretty clearly done. Neither DE is succeeding as a pass rusher (though JPP has looked better to me than Vernon). The OL continues to be a disaster, with Flowers the most disappointing failure. This clouds assessment of the RBs, but none looks good enough to start on any other team. The tackling has gone downhill since the season began -- looks like a coaching problem.
McAdoo is a flop as a Head Coach. Reese, when all is said and done, has to bear the blame for assembling this mess -- and cannot possibly be the answer to how to fix it.
In short, the Giants continue to be a do-over team, with more weaknesses demanding solution, especially in the OL, and now in the QB and Head Coach situations, than were obvious last year. This still can't be done in a single year and probably not in two. But some heads must roll to begin with.
Wishful thinking?
Manning could get over one big hit and Vernon's wrist would heal, hopefully.
I suppose it's not shocking that now we're judging heading head coach hires to be a "flop" after 5 games.
also, if manning is a nicotene user off schedule, then he could try wearing the patch during games.
it has a strong effect on focus
more a fan of freeing up DTs as opposed to bitzing back 7 players, however, we failed to add the true rush DT.