that I can remember in my 30 plus years of watching. This could potentially be our 5th straight season without playoffs and our 4th straight without reaching .500.
I'm already losing interest in the NFL as whole... The rule changes, and emphasis on certain rules that are full of ambiguity are ruining the game overall, but now it's starting to get real hard to find reasons to alter my plans every week to watch the Giants as well. Sunday night was the first time in close to 20 years that I turned the game off with significant time left. I just found myself starting not to care, or perhaps care too much... Because I was disgusted.
I was particularly excited about Sunday night because it was the first time in awhile that I was having a couple of friends over to watch the game and do it up right, grilling beforehand, having a few beers, making it an event. Something that we used to do all the time, but now we're at the age where we all have toddlers and infants and just aren't able to find the time to make it happen. One of my close friends is a Green Bay fan. We talked alot about the game and he talked about that even though the Giants weren't doing to hot he knew they were dangerous, and his secondary was questionable and he thought Odell was going to go off. Plus, he talked about how well Eli played at Lambeau, etc... In my mind, I knew better, but part of me wanted to believe what he was saying, because I knew that it was a possibility. Maybe this would be the week. It was a great time... until the game started. While Aaron Rodgers was regularly getting what felt like 10 seconds to throw and a clean pocket on every play, our guy was under the gun in what felt like 2 seconds, and even when he was able to get a chance to scan the field, there were bodies flying all around him. It's amazingly frustrated to watch the other team constantly move forward and have 2nd and 6, 3rd and 5, or 3rd and 1 while our time seems to always feel like we're 2nd and 20, 2nd and 16, 3rd and 11... Constant three and outs while our defense is on the field for what feels like 10 minutes a clip. In fact, it felt predictable and boring. It honestly feels sometimes like we have more negative yardage on offense that positive yards. I know the statistics don't reflect it, but that's the way it feels when watching it.
Anyways, I was so negative by the end of the half, and it was such an noncompetitive game, friends left at halftime and I hung on for most of the third quarter that I just decided enough is enough and turned it off. Getting little sleep and nursing a hangover at work just not worth that level of performance. And it's not one off, it's every week.
I find myself manipulating plans all the time to watch the Giants. I've been with my wife for 16 years, dated for 7, married for 9. She knows the deal. I don't do birthday parties, relatives, any of that stuff on Sundays. She asks about the schedule before ever making plans. She's super supportive of the addiction and always has been. But now, I'm asking... "Why?" Why am I making these changes, and for what? The product is terrible. Nearly unwatchable... In fact, for me, it became unwatchable on Sunday night. And like I said, that was the first time in a LONG TIME that I just didn't care. I checked the score in the morning and didn't care to watch a highlight. I am not the same fan I was even a year ago.
I will always love the Giants and will always watch or at least follow, but for now, with this product, with no end in sight, I just don't think I'll be altering plans anymore. I'm not going to let them bring me down on Sundays or Mondays, or even bleed into Tuesday and Wednesday like they do. I know that it's the highest of the highs and the lowest of the lows that make sports interesting. And being this low will only make the next high sweeter.... But man, they are super hard to watch or even try to be interested in. I'm begging, BEGGING for them to give me a product to watch. To regain that ravenous fandom that I've had for most of my adult life.
I'm just venting, but yeah... I know. Find another team (actually at this point it's probably reached find another sport to follow status), don't let the door hit you, yada yada yada...
It's f-cking frustrating.
But Gdamn this has been AWFUL!
My frustration is that I can understand a dark period where we haven't alerted our QB, such as 94-99 (we even made playoffs in 97). But to have a guy we know we can with (no matter if you rate him good, very good, or elite) is frustrating. Just walking to work today I was thinking about Eli and how the quality of the offensive line directly impacts Eli's mechanics and how we let the OL get like this. We changed schemes to compensate for it, but at the end of the day Eli from 2005-2012 a gun slinger is who he is. I just think if we spent resources wisely on an offensive line this would have gotten better quicker. We can't run, we can't pass downfield anymore, and that is leading to this terrible, frustrating football to watch.
It's the hopelessness. The hopeless feeling that I have that we haven't seen the worst of it yet, and the hopeless feeling that we may not have the right people in charge to turn it around.
Meanwhile, the best player we've had in my adult life just wastes away. Eli was ready to blow up right after 2011, and the roster just went to sh-t and the wheels fell off. We've in the 5th season of that, and it doesn't seem much better than the 2012 roster. Maybe worse.
The past few years have been injury riddled messes, the aftermath of premature ending of careers, fireworks accidents, and poor cap management. The latter is a by-product of winning a championship, with teams trying to retain their core and overpaying in the process.
So while nobody wants to go 5 years without playoffs, I don't think we're exactly at the 'find the lifeboat' stage.
This is the first time I remember just turning off the game and not even checking back in to see what was going on. I knew we were going to lose and I had no faith in any type of comeback. I'm going to give this season one more week then I'm pretty much done giving up my Sunday on this pack of do nothings.
This is the first time I remember just turning off the game and not even checking back in to see what was going on. I knew we were going to lose and I had no faith in any type of comeback. I'm going to give this season one more week then I'm pretty much done giving up my Sunday on this pack of do nothings.
Glad I'm not the only one.
After the first 2 weeks, I wasn't deluded into thinking this team was great but I did think that there was potential for a competitive football season which, unfortunate to say, is how low the bar has gotten with this team in recent years. Then the Washington game happened and I thought.. well, that was an all too familiar loss in a game we really should have won but at least it was there for the taking. It'll work out.
I figured if we could clean up the mistakes, we could still see a pretty good team. Then the Vikings game happened and yeah, they probably have the best defense in football.. but it doesn't matter. This all too familiar stench of undisciplined, mistake-riddled losing football has risen again and now we're back at the point where you know from the very beginning of a game that it's going to be a long day/night.
I keep waiting for that game where it FINALLY clicks.. where we go up against a good football team and play a complete game on both sides of the ball. Where the offense looks like the excellent unit it was billed as... where the defense actually gets to the QB.. where we don't make 10 awful mistakes. but every week feels like we're getting further and further away from it. And it's starting to feel like this season is quickly going in that same dreaded direction that it went in last year and the year before around the same time.
It just feels like this team is constantly outcoached, outmanned and outplayed. The Giants don't scare anyone anymore. There was a time where I felt like this team was never out of a game or out of a season and now most weeks, it only takes 15 minutes for me to realize we have no chance. I get all pumped up before the games and then right away I realize what I'm in for as soon as it starts.
I know, I'm probably being dramatic but I'm just getting really tired of it. Whether it's the defense, the offense, the coaching.. something about this team just continues to feel broken and it's not getting better. I'm really starting to worry that this might be another 6-10 campaign. And then what? Who loses their job now? Is it Reese's turn?
Ugh.
The defense played good enough to win up there, but the offense simply did not.
we were never really "close" in this game - don't let the final score fool you.
and yes, this team has worn me down as well. I don't even get upset anymore... I am just disappointed and embarrassed by them.
That said, this recent stretch has been tough to stomach.
Up until this year's alternative jersey, if the stadium and past alternative uniforms are any indication of good looking aesthetics I'd beware of them selecting a cheerleading team.
I made a deal with the devil to beat Tom Brady twice in the superbowl. It came with a high price.
But with those guys, when changes were made things seemed to get better. Handley gets canned after 2 years and Reeves takes a 6-10 team to 11-5 with a revitalized Phil Simms. Fassel takes over for Reeves after 2 bad seasons, takes a 6-10 team from 10-5-1 and wins the division.
Coughlin had a rougher start, but started red hot, then we all went through Eli's growing pains and understood... 2nd season we're 11-5 and won the division.
This league is built for teams to go from worst to first in one season. We see it every, single year. Only the sh-ttiest teams like the Browns can't seem to capitalize... But are we any better than them right now? The Eagles have done it twice, now. Firing a head coach and immediately competitive the next year. The Redskins have won the division TWICE since 2011. TWICE!
Why can't we get this sh-t turned around?
Not when you're starting a 2 time SB MVP.
It's just so wasteful.
watch . Both times leaving early I didn't see OBJ TD.
It reminded me of the Ray Handley era or as in the past
few years we are better at finding a way to lose .
I really was optimistic but even after the Cowboy game
was relieved but on the other hand I felt like we should
have beaten them soundly . Then comes the Saints and
we can't score its a trend a continuation of pre-season .
Followed by the debacle against the Skins .
Had no faith in the last two games . ere come the Ravens
another good defense .. I watched every play of the
72-41 Loss to the Skins they could be down by 30 I would still watch to the bitter end . Not anymore I lack the
passion I once had a lot has to do with the all the rule changes and various networks and the Sunday Monday and Thursday games the London games its all about the greed
at the top . Throw in the terrible one sided officiating .and terrible broadcasts . The Fantasy stats drivel .
The game is losing its appeal at least to me and its feeling like the old losing ways ..
And Fassel had the benefit of real training camp and a solid D.
They lose this week at home and, yes, the season is pretty much over. Another season over by Halloween. Then I start rooting for losses. This team still needs an infusion of elite blue chip talent. And the last few years, they've done just enough to get slotted right where the draftable talent goes from blue to red.
But it's not just that. Giants have a propensity to play real garbage football. Watching your team lose because of dumb shit is worse than watching them lose because they're the far worse team. And I agree with Britt that the rules/enforcement and other issues surrounding the league are just making for a less exciting product. Im also pissed that they scheduled a Giants night game for a Jewish high holiday for the 2nd straight year.
I think this is a bit dramatic. It's been bad but you sound like a spoiled brat.
That said, I'm tired of football season being essentially useless by Halloween.
They used to say all you can hope for every year is meaningful football in December.
We're not getting it.
Because of the Redskin debacle, 4-2 isn't good enough. That gets them to 6-5. After they lose in Pittsburgh, they're 6-6. If you subscribe to the notion that 10 wins the East, this team is going to run the table the rest of the way? With a likely healthy Dallas team and back to back games in Philly and Washington? Until I see it, there's likely zero chance of that happening. They're just not good enough, even $200 million later.
We should have been able to throw for 350 on that defense... Sterling Shepard caught 2 passes for 14 yards. Victor Cruz didn't even catch ONE pass. How does that happen?
This team has suffered from an inept front office for nearly seven years. If anyone thinks it is Eli who is failing you need to look at what he's dealt with since before we won Super Bowl 46. Jerry Reese has successfully broken this team from top to bottom. Even with the arguable improvements of drafting Odell and Sterling and Collins and Richburg we have four previous drafts of straight garbage that cannot be ignored and countless free agent disasters. John Beason? David Baas? And then letting our good players walk. How's Linval Joseph and Martellus Bennett doing? I'd go through the draft disasters but its been well documented that almost every player taken from 2009-2013 was equivalent to a sack of doorknobs at this point. The fact that Mara believed the failure of the team was related to "Grandpa Tom's" ineptidute to relate to players is further indictment that he's worse than Dan Snyder at owning at team. At least he finally figured it out and hired Scott Mcloughan who, in two seasons, made the Skins a team on the rise while we continue our fall into the roll of laughing stock of the NFC East and arguably the entire NFC (Thanks to the Browns and Chargers for holding on to top overall NFL spots). The sooner this franchise cleans house and stops the moronic band-aid approch it has followed the sooner we, as Giants fans, can start to root for a good product on the field. Consider this simple thought, if the Giants was your business and the product on the field is the culmination of your employees efforts would you fire them? If your answer is no then either your last name is Mara or you're an idiot. I pray this message reaches somone at the Giants' front office. Clearly they live in some weird bubble that has prevented them from seeing the problems right in front of them.
Thanks for the vent session BBI.
May take a few years to totally gut the the team and coaches to maybe change the losing culture. I time and patience is needed..but in meantime its rough and impatient at times
They had all the animals out and my kid was having an absolute ball. We left early to be able to catch the 1pm game.
Afterwards, I felt a little guilty pulling him away from that so I could watch the Giants blow it. It may be a more DVR and watch later type of season
I've begun the tune-out process also. There are just other things in my life that I find way more interesting.
I hope the NFL rots.
Guys there is still hope but the next five games will tell the true story 3-2 or less will seal our faith as another building season. At this point we need to be playing as if every game is the last hope for this season.
The 90s were pretty blahhh if you ask me.
This team is still interesting because of OBJ, and Eli...and the potential. But we might not realize it this year.
When we beat teams, they are usually team under .500, or they are not playoff teams.....we just haven't done it....there is an aberration here and there, but for the most part, this is what we have seen.....
We just don't play well against contenders, because of lack of consistency......the Giants are like a golfer....some days you can drive, some days you can't....some days you can chip, some days you can't....some days you can putt, some days you can't.....but when you can put them all together for one weekend you can win...
The Giants, right now, is a poor golfer.....one weekend, the defense plays great, the offense doesn't.....or the offense scores a lot of points(49), but the defense sucks(52).....or it's a close game, and a fumble, dropped pass, penalty or bad play call ends a game winning drive.....or the defense can't protect a fourth quarter lead......or the ST's screw up badly.....this is Giant football.....the offense, defense, ST's, or coaching screws up....it's very rare we see a Giant team play ok in all the phases in the same game, these last 5 seasons.....
A major problem is the front office......since 2011, they have created more problems than they have fixed by, their drafting and free agency signings......they never had a plan.....they approached each season with a bandaid fix...
This team had a franchise qb that could lead them to the SB.....they should have concentrated on protecting him, giving him an OL, and weapons.....we had a shitty defense last year.....yet if Eli had a line in front of him and weapons(not Parkers, Randles, Nickes, Williames, Donnells, etc.), this team could have won with even that defense.....
But no, it was more important to repeat.....it was more important to install a clock and go to the SB in our own stadium.....so after 5 seasons, what has the front office fixed? Are we a better team 5 years later?
Eli's window is about to close, unfortunately......I feel we have wasted the second half of his career....with a good line in front of him, these past 5 years, I don't think you would be seeing the Eli we see now....
I think the team was having a pissing contest between Coughlin and Reese....no one finds it strange that the plan for all this cap money happened after TC was gone?
The situation we are in, could have dark days ahead....Is Eli on the downside of his career? Is McAdoo a good HC? Can Spags only coach when he has all the pieces? These are all questions, that won't be answered until the end of the season.....
One thing is for sure.....this team is not playing like a team....yes there are injuries....we see other teams with injuries, not miss a beat when they have them.....this Giant team doesn't seem to have fire......it doesn't seem to have any leadership.....it's been a revolving door of players, that hasn't shown that quantum leap in improvement......
Anyone who was a Giant fan, like moi, who lived through the mid 60's to the early 80's, knows what pain and suffering is all about, when getting attached to this team.....after the second SB win, this team slumped again .....and we are doing it now.....can it come back? When you are in the muck of a slump, it doesn't seem so.....BBI is up/down like the stock market....just one win changes everything, until the next loss.....
We are Giant fans.....sometimes misery loves company....
No one does it better than you. Was my favorite part about going to Giants games
And Fassel had the benefit of real training camp and a solid D.
Totally disagree. Those Giants team under Handley were running on fumes. The SB 25 was really their last hurrah. A lot of veteran players.
Reeves re-energized it for one year - as I said in my previous post - so it wasn't built for the long haul.
and of course you want your time to win a SB every so often, but I also want my team to be competitive year in and year out, particularly when then have talent. We may not be stocked but we have a franchise QB, an incredibly talented trio of WR's, a supposedly stacked D Line and (when healthy) very good DB's.
And until this year we had a HOF coach.
i'd be much happier if we were winning 9 games, 10 games, 11 games - even if those seasons ended without SB's.
But instead, we have won SB's and then gone into abysmal losing seasons immediately thereafter.
we're like the FLA Marlins of the NFL!
But I guarantee you when the Giants get back to competing at a high level, you'll all jump on board with full enthusiam..........
I looked at the list of all Giant head coaches. Since 1930, Giants have had just 13 head coaches, and only 4 (Arnsparger, McVay, Perkins & Reeves) had not previously worked or played for the Giants.
Ray Walsh is listed as the team's first GM in 1947 and stayed until 1974, when ex-Giant Andy Robustelli took over. In 1998, Rozelle forced the Maras to hire their first outsider GM in George Young. In 1998, Ernie Accorsi moved up from assistant to GM, and Jerry Reese later made the same internal move up.
So over 86 years, only 4 times have the Giants looked outside their organization to fill the 2 primary player management positions. That has resulted in some great successes and several long periods of failure.
Clearly, the Maras are much more comfortable hiring people they know. They are loathe to make changes, I think much more so than owners who made their fortunes in financially competitive businesses where the bottom line demands innovation and finding the best management talent.
So here we are with what looks like another losing season with a GM in year 5 of losing and a head coach and several coordinators who were part of the coaching staff in those losing seasons. It's a pattern with which Giant fans should be familiar.
We're sixteen years plus five games into the millennium. In that span, the Giants have reached the playoffs seven times, with a post-season record of 10-5, three conference titles and two Super Bowl wins.
The team has pretty much stunk for four years. Extend that streak by another decade and a half, and you'll match the mess many of us were born into.
You're insane. =)
We're sixteen years plus five games into the millennium. In that span, the Giants have reached the playoffs seven times, with a post-season record of 10-5, three conference titles and two Super Bowl wins.
The team has pretty much stunk for four years. Extend that streak by another decade and a half, and you'll match the mess many of us were born into.
Great, great post.
Perspective.
It's that we're just stuck in the fucking mud. This team doesn't seem like it's really getting any better but it's also not getting worse to the point where we just blow it all up and rebuild it. It feels like we're just spinning our wheels around Eli and none of the changes we're making seem like they're making the team any better.
There's a lot of season left but I've fooled myself into thinking this team would just turn things around like they did late in 2011 far too many times since. I think I know better now.
I looked at the list of all Giant head coaches. Since 1930, Giants have had just 13 head coaches, and only 4 (Arnsparger, McVay, Perkins & Reeves) had not previously worked or played for the Giants.
Ray Walsh is listed as the team's first GM in 1947 and stayed until 1974, when ex-Giant Andy Robustelli took over. In 1998, Rozelle forced the Maras to hire their first outsider GM in George Young. In 1998, Ernie Accorsi moved up from assistant to GM, and Jerry Reese later made the same internal move up.
So over 86 years, only 4 times have the Giants looked outside their organization to fill the 2 primary player management positions. That has resulted in some great successes and several long periods of failure.
Clearly, the Maras are much more comfortable hiring people they know. They are loathe to make changes, I think much more so than owners who made their fortunes in financially competitive businesses where the bottom line demands innovation and finding the best management talent.
So here we are with what looks like another losing season with a GM in year 5 of losing and a head coach and several coordinators who were part of the coaching staff in those losing seasons. It's a pattern with which Giant fans should be familiar.
This team has won 12 games twice since Norwood's miss. Two 12 win seasons in 26 years. That's what frustrates me...I would like to see a team pay consistently well instead of count on catching lightning in a bottle like they did twice.
Considering the good fortune they had not only in acquiring Eli Manning, but in keeping him healthy, it feels like things have been left on the table.
So yeah my feeling is not one of despair but rather that an opportunity has been wasted.
Put it in a letter and mail it to him.
I too have lost interest in the NFL, and sadly, the Giants too. This team does not play Giants football as it used to be, as it needs to be. I watched very little of the game. I chose sleep over Giants football.
But with those guys, when changes were made things seemed to get better. Handley gets canned after 2 years and Reeves takes a 6-10 team to 11-5 with a revitalized Phil Simms. Fassel takes over for Reeves after 2 bad seasons, takes a 6-10 team from 10-5-1 and wins the division.
Coughlin had a rougher start, but started red hot, then we all went through Eli's growing pains and understood... 2nd season we're 11-5 and won the division.
This league is built for teams to go from worst to first in one season. We see it every, single year. Only the sh-ttiest teams like the Browns can't seem to capitalize... But are we any better than them right now? The Eagles have done it twice, now. Firing a head coach and immediately competitive the next year. The Redskins have won the division TWICE since 2011. TWICE!
Why can't we get this sh-t turned around?
Hey Britt,
I share most of your sentiment, in the past the loses would linger and take a toll through the week. In fact, it wouldn't be until the kick off of the following game when I allowed myself to move on from the previous loss. Nowadays, I let it go probably by the end of the game day. I have 3 beautiful little girls and a 4th otw in December, it isn't fair to them or my wife to have a grumpy daddy/husband. I will still root my ass off and have intense passion for the Giants but I don't live or die with them, can't do it.
Mmmmm...breakfast
We should have been able to throw for 350 on that defense... Sterling Shepard caught 2 passes for 14 yards. Victor Cruz didn't even catch ONE pass. How does that happen?
We're being out-coached..
~Tiki Barber
Yes, much of Eli Manning's tenure has been wasted. Yes, it doesn't look like we'll see him in the postseason again. But the Giants got 2 of what matters out of him, one almost fully unexpected.
If the Eagles continue to sweep NY every year and then themselves start having playoff success, then I'll be really bitter about football.
But, as my threadstart said, this has been the longest, continuous stretch of Giants football since I started watching in '84.
And I bet you'd have to go back to the 70's to find something comparable to the last 4 years.
So I get it, the 70's were bad. This is the worst stretch since then, IMO, which is my point.
Quote:
Is that it seems like opponents can regularly take advantages of our weaknesses.. they see a guy like Trevin Wade out there and go right after him and connect on plays but when we go against backup Vikings linemen, we still get zero pass rush.. when we go against Green Bay's decimated secondary, we still can't exploit it.
We should have been able to throw for 350 on that defense... Sterling Shepard caught 2 passes for 14 yards. Victor Cruz didn't even catch ONE pass. How does that happen?
We're being out-coached..
~Tiki Barber
Haha on Tiki quote! I do agree with Brett but still enjoy watching the Giants if not the rest of the NFL. In the past, I would have been interested in last night's game. Not any more. Part or most of the issue is the incessant marketing of indicidual players like we are chicks rather than marketing of the competition. It is distasteful and turns me off to the game. Market the fucking competition not indicidual ayers NFL!
Some aren't as masochist as others I suppose, I sit through every snap even in blow-outs. Not sure whether that's a virtue or vice lol.
Congrats on being a masochist. =)
Moreover, the Giants were still fully in the game well into the 4th quarter. If the LBs could fucking tackle or they could stop a 3rd & 10, Eli would have gotten the ball back with plenty of time.
Not like this was an across the board blowout like the Ravens or Falcons game a couple years back. Even in good seasons, some wins are ugly.
Can't explain it. Used to share that sentiment. On Sunday night, I had enough.
Quote:
Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Moreover, the Giants were still fully in the game well into the 4th quarter. If the LBs could fucking tackle or they could stop a 3rd & 10, Eli would have gotten the ball back with plenty of time.
Not like this was an across the board blowout like the Ravens or Falcons game a couple years back. Even in good seasons, some wins are ugly.
I never felt we were in the game. I know we got the score close (apparently), but it never felt competitive... To me at least.
It took 17 years between SB's, I know we made the playoffs and even a SB during that stretch but there were some pretty dark days circa 1990-2007.
Most fans of other teams in the league would kill for that.
Quote:
Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Moreover, the Giants were still fully in the game well into the 4th quarter. If the LBs could fucking tackle or they could stop a 3rd & 10, Eli would have gotten the ball back with plenty of time.
Not like this was an across the board blowout like the Ravens or Falcons game a couple years back. Even in good seasons, some wins are ugly.
Agreed. Have seen may football outcomes reverse themselves in fourth quarters.
If Robinson & Casillas could tackle a 190 pound WR, Eli would have had a legit opportunity to win the game.
I expect them to play well against a deeply flawed Baltimore team this week.
But the scary thing is that this kind of feels like perhaps the start of this stretch rather than the dark before the dawn. We have an old qb, and if he's not done now he will be soon. There is no replacement on the team. Barring Reese hitting big early on a qb like Dallas and philly have recently done (possible but not common) we are going to start facing some instability at that position very soon which is never a good place to be. Facing 5 straight years without the playoffs barring a turnaround, with an old qb, a total wildcard as head coach who may or may not be the guy. This just isn't a stable organization that i'd be buying stock in right now.
Still a young season, I hope they can turn it around, but it's getting tougher to see it
It just isn't happening with this team. When opportunities present themselves, we constantly whiff... when we finally make a play, it gets called back. We just can't seem to ever capitalize on chances to take hold of a football game and it has been happening far to often to believe it's simply going to revert to the mean.
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Definitely seems the longest dry spell since the the 70s.
It took 17 years between SB's, I know we made the playoffs and even a SB during that stretch but there were some pretty dark days circa 1990-2007.
Indeed, but there was hope every season. In the 17 years between Superbowls:
Playoffs in '93, '97, '00, '02, '05, '06....
Only 6 seasons under .500 (we're nearing 4 already, fourth year in a row)
And a Superbowl run in 2000.
We never sustained this long of a drought. We were always back in the mix in a year or two.
And even some of those seasons that we missed the playoffs, we were competitive and had chances late in the season. Or at least were competitive and secured a big win (Kent Graham vs. the Broncos).
What have we had to hang our hat on the past four years? Nothing.
Super Bowl wins are so rare for NFL teams that if my team is winning multiple championships the stretch can only be so bad, and far from the worst.
I much prefer that even with the losing seasons to long stretches without a championship regardless of how many winning season it entailed.
But you'd need to project this level of poor play consistently right up through 2028 - another twelve years of 6-10 seasons (or worse) - to get to where we were in 1981.
That's Cleveland Browns/Detroit Lions football we're talking about right there. We're no where near that level of incompetence yet.
i am not saying this to be an ass but maybe you should just take a step back and not watch for a couple of weeks...
in 2011 giants lost 5 in a row and looked absolutely terrible and then ended up winning a superbowl...
if you are saying giants were never competitive on sunday night sounds like you have it in your head the team sucks and they will lose before the game even starts..
i dont want to say your not a fan because that is not right, but someone who turns a game off after the first quarter and its 7-0 maybe should not really be watchjng...
like i said no disrespect just my opinion
I wouldn't go as far as to say unwatchable. As bad as it has been this team at least has some sparks to it that make sundays fun, beckham is the most electrifying Giant I've seen. The Giants of the 90s (after 1993, and save for 97 which was a fluke) were unwatchable. In addition to being bad they were just totally boring. QBs were horrible, no skill players, 3 yards and a cloud of dust running game
the last couple of years have been frustrating and this stretch of losing has been longer - there have been so many close games that were decided by a touchdown or less. but with more parity in the division and the fact that our coach/QB had produced two super bowl titles, there was at least hope the last few years that we would see another run like 07/11. unlike watching dave brown slinging ducks to arthur marshall.
I was not a TC fanboy, but you don't have to be a genius to see the problem goes deeper than him, deeper than the coach. There's something very rotten in this franchise that is keeping this team from getting better. It's a problem.
It is what it is. I doubt highly my interest in the sport ever returns to what it once was, even if the Giants one day are an exciting team again. I'll watch them though, of course. The other teams? Depends what else there is to do that day, I guess.
oh sorry must have been someone else who said that
You are either saying one of two things.
1) That you prefer longer stretches of better overall records without winning championships than one with multiple championships surrounded my some losing.
2) Wining a championship doesn't sustain you as a fan beyond four or five season without feeling disrepair.
No fan enjoys the losing but the reality is winning in the NFL is not easy and many fan bases have had it far worse than Giants fans and only a very few have had it better.
Believe me I hate the losing and I don't like the direction this team has been headed but this still feels far from being one of the worse stretches the team has gone through. A crappy few seasons for sure but lets keep it in the proper perspective.
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Definitely seems the longest dry spell since the the 70s.
It took 17 years between SB's, I know we made the playoffs and even a SB during that stretch but there were some pretty dark days circa 1990-2007.
Cannot argue with you at all. The Handley to Reeves' years feel dark to me. The Fassel years seemed to lack foundation / confidence.
It is what it is. I doubt highly my interest in the sport ever returns to what it once was, even if the Giants one day are an exciting team again. I'll watch them though, of course. The other teams? Depends what else there is to do that day, I guess.
I l Iove the NFL from 1-7 on a Sunday, and when the Giants are playing. All other times, all bets are off. The redzone channel has ruined prime time games for me. The pace is just too damn slow watching only one game at once. I can't deal with it unless it's a really important game
Not a very pretty picture considering most thought,me included, that this year would be different.
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Does saying that the Giants are unwatchable right now diminish what they've done in the past?
You are either saying one of two things.
1) That you prefer longer stretches of better overall records without winning championships than one with multiple championships surrounded my some losing.
2) Wining a championship doesn't sustain you as a fan beyond four or five season without feeling disrepair.
No fan enjoys the losing but the reality is winning in the NFL is not easy and many fan bases have had it far worse than Giants fans and only a very few have had it better.
Believe me I hate the losing and I don't like the direction this team has been headed but this still feels far from being one of the worse stretches the team has gone through. A crappy few seasons for sure but lets keep it in the proper perspective.
I didn't say either of those things, and on the second one, I said the opposite actually.
I pointed out that the 90's, while not great, did have glimmers of hope sprinkled throughout, with playoffs every couple of seasons and a Superbowl run to cap it. I didn't say I preferred any type of winning or losing periods over another. I simply responded to the notion that the 17 year stretch between championships wasn't great.
Secondly, I actually said earlier in this thread that it was the championships in the 80's as a new fan that helped me endure the 17 year championship drought, and specifically said how much loyalty a championship buys you.
I'm not renouncing my fandom, I'm stating my opinion on the state of the team and venting.
I wrote a letter to Mara after the 2006 season, telling him to stay the course and not fire Coughlin. He wrote me back a handwritten response.
Not a very pretty picture considering most thought,me included, that this year would be different.
Not going to argue with any of that but it is still very different from saying that "this is the worst, continuous stretch of Giants football in the past thirty years".
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Unfortunately for me,it still bothers the shit out of me when we lose. Losing sucks but when you seemingly always play like crap,makes it even more frustrating. I wish I could see the light at the end of the tunnel with this team but there doesn't appear to be any. Can't run the ball, can't pass protect,the quarterback plays afraid of getting hit and suddenly has accuracy issues, have the worst pass rush I have EVER seen,a defensive coordinator who has pioneered the worst defenses in the history of the NFL to go along with a VERY inexperienced head coach who appears to be in over his head.
Not a very pretty picture considering most thought,me included, that this year would be different.
Not going to argue with any of that but it is still very different from saying that "this is the worst, continuous stretch of Giants football in the past thirty years".
Name a worse one, then.
7-9
6-10
6-10
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In comment 13169187 Britt in VA said:
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Does saying that the Giants are unwatchable right now diminish what they've done in the past?
You are either saying one of two things.
1) That you prefer longer stretches of better overall records without winning championships than one with multiple championships surrounded my some losing.
2) Wining a championship doesn't sustain you as a fan beyond four or five season without feeling disrepair.
No fan enjoys the losing but the reality is winning in the NFL is not easy and many fan bases have had it far worse than Giants fans and only a very few have had it better.
Believe me I hate the losing and I don't like the direction this team has been headed but this still feels far from being one of the worse stretches the team has gone through. A crappy few seasons for sure but lets keep it in the proper perspective.
I didn't say either of those things, and on the second one, I said the opposite actually.
I pointed out that the 90's, while not great, did have glimmers of hope sprinkled throughout, with playoffs every couple of seasons and a Superbowl run to cap it. I didn't say I preferred any type of winning or losing periods over another. I simply responded to the notion that the 17 year stretch between championships wasn't great.
Secondly, I actually said earlier in this thread that it was the championships in the 80's as a new fan that helped me endure the 17 year championship drought, and specifically said how much loyalty a championship buys you.
I'm not renouncing my fandom, I'm stating my opinion on the state of the team and venting.
I guess I'm not understand you then. How come the previous two Super Bowls made the 17 drought more acceptable to you than those won just five and nine years ago have for this current four year drought?
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In comment 13169209 steve in ky said:
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In comment 13169187 Britt in VA said:
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Does saying that the Giants are unwatchable right now diminish what they've done in the past?
You are either saying one of two things.
1) That you prefer longer stretches of better overall records without winning championships than one with multiple championships surrounded my some losing.
2) Wining a championship doesn't sustain you as a fan beyond four or five season without feeling disrepair.
No fan enjoys the losing but the reality is winning in the NFL is not easy and many fan bases have had it far worse than Giants fans and only a very few have had it better.
Believe me I hate the losing and I don't like the direction this team has been headed but this still feels far from being one of the worse stretches the team has gone through. A crappy few seasons for sure but lets keep it in the proper perspective.
I didn't say either of those things, and on the second one, I said the opposite actually.
I pointed out that the 90's, while not great, did have glimmers of hope sprinkled throughout, with playoffs every couple of seasons and a Superbowl run to cap it. I didn't say I preferred any type of winning or losing periods over another. I simply responded to the notion that the 17 year stretch between championships wasn't great.
Secondly, I actually said earlier in this thread that it was the championships in the 80's as a new fan that helped me endure the 17 year championship drought, and specifically said how much loyalty a championship buys you.
I'm not renouncing my fandom, I'm stating my opinion on the state of the team and venting.
I guess I'm not understand you then. How come the previous two Super Bowls made the 17 drought more acceptable to you than those won just five and nine years ago have for this current four year drought?
Because we never experienced a prolonged, continuous being the operative word, streak as long as this one at all during that 17 year stretch. Which is the point of the thread.
Usually when a team is rebuilding, you can see the reasons you have to be excited about the future.. maybe it's a young, up and coming defense or a young QB, or building a dominant OL, etc.. so when you lose games, you have something to hang your hat on and feel like there's a direction and it's only a matter of time.
That doesn't really feel like it's the case with the Giants. It feels like a team that keeps frantically plugging away trying to keep the holes from sinking the boat but there's just too many holes and every time we plug one, another opens up.
It just feels like something is wrong with this football team and it has felt this way for 4 years now.
Usually when a team is rebuilding, you can see the reasons you have to be excited about the future.. maybe it's a young, up and coming defense or a young QB, or building a dominant OL, etc.. so when you lose games, you have something to hang your hat on and feel like there's a direction and it's only a matter of time.
That doesn't really feel like it's the case with the Giants. It feels like a team that keeps frantically plugging away trying to keep the holes from sinking the boat but there's just too many holes and every time we plug one, another opens up.
It just feels like something is wrong with this football team and it has felt this way for 4 years now.
Yeah, that's pretty much it. And add that there doesn't appear to be an end or solution in sight, hence the hopelessness.
Because they have better things to do?
The Giants rebuilt a defense in that span very well. And we had a successful era afterwards. There we even hope around brown with fassel.
Losing with premier player like Beckham and delaying a full rebuild around new personnel based in getting a last hurrah for manning who is losing steam seemingly (a lot still to be determined around this) .......Seems like this era may end with a full rebuild ahead....
Usually when a team is rebuilding, you can see the reasons you have to be excited about the future.. maybe it's a young, up and coming defense or a young QB, or building a dominant OL, etc.. so when you lose games, you have something to hang your hat on and feel like there's a direction and it's only a matter of time.
That doesn't really feel like it's the case with the Giants. It feels like a team that keeps frantically plugging away trying to keep the holes from sinking the boat but there's just too many holes and every time we plug one, another opens up.
It just feels like something is wrong with this football team and it has felt this way for 4 years now.
That's fine and I don't disagree but still very different than what he said in the OP. Maybe he misspoke because of the frustration of the losing football being played.
Certainly understandable.
This place never ceases to amaze me.
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Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Because they have better things to do?
Having to miss the game because of a commitment is very different than saying you turned it off for no other reason than how the team was playing.
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In comment 13169147 steve in ky said:
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Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Because they have better things to do?
Having to miss the game because of a commitment is very different than saying you turned it off for no other reason than how the team was playing.
The better thing to do was get some sleep and avoid a hangover the next morning at work.
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In comment 13169147 steve in ky said:
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Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Because they have better things to do?
Having to miss the game because of a commitment is very different than saying you turned it off for no other reason than how the team was playing.
If a movie stinks, is it wrong to shut if off before it's over?
Sports is just entertainment, and fans are just customers. We don't owe these sports franchises anything.
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That team was stacked but Handley was so incompetent that they wasted 2 prime years. All Reeves did was restore order, settled on 1 QB and gave that core 1 final ride to the playoffs.
And Fassel had the benefit of real training camp and a solid D.
Totally disagree. Those Giants team under Handley were running on fumes. The SB 25 was really their last hurrah. A lot of veteran players.
Reeves re-energized it for one year - as I said in my previous post - so it wasn't built for the long haul.
Disagree Bill. That team had a great OL in its prime, 2 QBs, and a solid D. They weern't on fumes until 1993. Reeves got 1 last run out of them. 2 full years were wasted because George Young wanted Handley as coach, not Belichick, Coughlin, Earhardt or Groh.
This place never ceases to amaze me.
It amazes me that fans having a different perspective amazes you.
This is a forum, people post opinions others respond. Nobody is making it personal or calling anyone names. And everyone is going to feel how they feel so it goes without saying that there is no right or wrong feelings. We are just discussing them. What's the point of posting them if not for discussing them?
I guess for some fans seasonal losses are more frustrating than lack of championships and that seems to be where some differ.
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has had in 30 years. We're going on 5 years now. How people can have hard time deciphering that very simple message..
This place never ceases to amaze me.
It amazes me that fans having a different perspective amazes you.
This is a forum, people post opinions others respond. Nobody is making it personal or calling anyone names. And everyone is going to feel how they feel so it goes without saying that there is no right or wrong feelings. We are just discussing them. What's the point of posting them if not for discussing them?
I guess for some fans seasonal losses are more frustrating than lack of championships and that seems to be where some differ.
No offense steve, but you're one of the only people on this thread that don't seem to understand what I'm saying, and actually are misinterpreting what I'm saying into something else, additionally.
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In comment 13169243 Mr. Bungle said:
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In comment 13169147 steve in ky said:
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Regardless of how bad they are playing or how far they are behind I can't relate to how a die hard fan just can simply turn it off.
Because they have better things to do?
Having to miss the game because of a commitment is very different than saying you turned it off for no other reason than how the team was playing.
If a movie stinks, is it wrong to shut if off before it's over?
Sports is just entertainment, and fans are just customers. We don't owe these sports franchises anything.
Of course we don't and I expect the casual fan to tune things in and out. I don't understand the life long die hards doing so is my point.
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has had in 30 years. We're going on 5 years now. How people can have hard time deciphering that very simple message..
This place never ceases to amaze me.
It amazes me that fans having a different perspective amazes you.
This is a forum, people post opinions others respond. Nobody is making it personal or calling anyone names. And everyone is going to feel how they feel so it goes without saying that there is no right or wrong feelings. We are just discussing them. What's the point of posting them if not for discussing them?
I guess for some fans seasonal losses are more frustrating than lack of championships and that seems to be where some differ.
This isn't about opinion, though. It is factually correct to state that this has been the worst continuous streak this team has had in 30 years. Go back to 1986 and find me a 4 year streak of this team not making the postseason.
Outside of 2012-2015, you won't find one.
It's a fact.
I feel the same, but another cause for real football fans like us is the disadvantage the new penalty scheme has imposed on the defense.
I found the Packers/Giants game this weekend very poor entertainment. It was frankly boring. But you know what was one of the other memorably boring - I mean dull - games in recent seasons? That Saints/Giants 52-49 or whatever the score was game. Tedious. I didn't care who won by the end of that fiasco. I couldn't remember the TDs scored in the first half.
More (offense) is less (interest).
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In comment 13169247 Dave in Hoboken said:
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has had in 30 years. We're going on 5 years now. How people can have hard time deciphering that very simple message..
This place never ceases to amaze me.
It amazes me that fans having a different perspective amazes you.
This is a forum, people post opinions others respond. Nobody is making it personal or calling anyone names. And everyone is going to feel how they feel so it goes without saying that there is no right or wrong feelings. We are just discussing them. What's the point of posting them if not for discussing them?
I guess for some fans seasonal losses are more frustrating than lack of championships and that seems to be where some differ.
No offense steve, but you're one of the only people on this thread that don't seem to understand what I'm saying, and actually are misinterpreting what I'm saying into something else, additionally.
I apologize then because I guess I am.
We must just see it much differently.
Hakeem Nicks was one of the best draft selections in Giants history. A healthy Nicks is almost as good as Beckham, and certainly stronger. David Wilson would likely have put it together. Pre-M80 moron JPP was a game-changing pass rusher. Now he's a run stopping DE.
It can change quickly, the Giants are drafting better these days. Whatever year Cedric Jones was drafted, the Ravens drafted two Hall of Famers in the first round: Ogden & Lewis. Building blocks for a 2 SB teams (Ogden 1) and overall competitiveness for years.
Again, there's no shame in transitioning to a non-hardcore fan. I'll never do it for football unless real life shit makes it necessary - even just watching Adams play well on Sunday pleased me - but have done it for other sports and if anything it's a relief to not have to be relentlessly tuned into everything that transpires.
I'm 48, went to my first Giants game at 6 and aside from the 70's, haven't ever been this disappointed with the product on the field. This is a sloppy, ill-prepared team.
Very disappointing.
And there is nothing wrong with that. You may have been a die hard and no longer one. Actually given your life commitments and your interests you may even stop being a fan for a while and come back to it later.
Don't think there is anything wrong in taking a break......
But as a fan since 56 I watch every game. Maybe because I feel so lucky to see every game as opposed to the old days where my dad and I went to some great extremes to watch the games. This would include buying a battey operated t.v. and going to the top of a local mountain to pick up directly the signal from CBS Bingington NY..
Many it's a generational thing, I don't know. But there have been so many posts like this one lately.
It's not as much fun because they are not playing well. So you lose interest, got it.
But to stop watching, well I can't relate to that. Again not judging, there is no right or wrong here, just an observation
I turned if off on Sunday because it was boring and non competitive, and I made a business decision that I'd rather have sleep and no hangover at work the next morning.
I'm not quitting being a fan. I was raised a Giants fan and I'm raising my children as Giants fans.
nygiants16 : 11:41 am : link : reply
In comment 13169187 Britt in VA said:
i am not saying this to be an ass but maybe you should just take a step back and not watch for a couple of weeks...
in 2011 giants lost 5 in a row and looked absolutely terrible and then ended up winning a superbowl...
They never lost 5 in a row, it was 4, and three were by 7 points or less......any game with 2011 Eli was worth watching, can't say the same for 2016 Eli....
Like I said before, there's just something about the Giants right now that is really difficult to stomach. They're a really frustrating team. I'd almost rather just see the team get their asses kicked than have 15 possessions where they can actually tie a game, take a lead or just get back into it and fail to capitalize over and over and over again.. and nearly every time the defense needs a stop, it feels like they can't get it. Then every time we do make a play you see the "FLAG" graphic pop right up.
I'll watch every week but it's extremely aggravating.
Ugly wins, even as part of an overall successful season, are part of the salary cap era. Whats problematic for the Giants presently is that they can't even sufficiently get them.
You seem to want to overstate how bad things are in order to maybe feel less bad about averting your eyes. (#1semesterofpsychology). Sunday was not a non-competitive game, this is a fact.
I expect them to play well against a deeply flawed Baltimore team this week.
Don't we hear this every week? Its just ends in disappointment. I'm not as optimistic about this week either. Baltimore also has a very good Defense. Suggs and Dumervil will kill this oline and Eli will be skittish again!
Blame the past 4 years on the last coach but remember he gave you two titles.
Some of you guys need to take a breath. All the preseason hype and the FA spending spree. This is a team that turned over 30+% of the roster.
New coaches get 3 years that's the Giants plan. So get over it!
1964-1980 is the worst stretch of Giants football. BTW.
I have almost 0 faith in us having any chance in games when we are down. Eli is horrible and we no longer have the puncher's chance we used to have with him.
Hard to believe how bad he has gotten in such a short period of time.
And I really like Mcadoo, but I am starting to think (given the play of the O, Eli, penalties, lack of development of a pass rush, lack of the OL even looking marginally better or even as good at times as it did last year), that he does not have a strong enough personality to be a factor as a head coach. There may be a reason he has never been one before. Or maybe he just needs some more time.
Either way, I am completely disgusted at how they are playing, as well as the vast improvements of all the other NFC East teams. And I am seriously considering canceling my NFL package on DTV. I've got better things to do than waste time tying my happiness to this team.
They have been so mediocre for so long now, regardless of the supposed improvements that get my hopes up every year. And as I said above, we no longer even have a chance with Eli in games, and it has been the one thing to hang onto for over 10 years.
Time to draft and develop a new franchise QB, and I don't see Reese being around much longer either (obviously).
Offense - show me something shiny to distract me (Shepard) from the fact that the foundation (O-line) of the offense is fractured and cannot support the team. This does not mean the O-line was ignored, it means we repaired it with poor quality materials. It is STILL broken. We went backwards since last year in this area.
Defense - The worst defense since the dinosaurs roamed the earth got an upgrade. We added run stoppers which is absolutely paying off. However, we are not getting anywhere close to the QB which means the guys we added in the back are still vulnerable. Finally, Spags IMO sucks and has always been part of the problem. The fact that he was retained to me meant that this defense was still going to struggle. Quite simply, we cannot get off of the field on 3rd down.
Injuries - so far, there seems to be an improvement in this area.
Based upon what I outlined above, our record probably is what it should be. We lost the the teams that are better than we are right now.
If that is true, then the Giants deserve the results they are realizing right now. Eli has looked almost as bad as he did when he lead the universe in interceptions a few years ago.
Blame the past 4 years on the last coach but remember he gave you two titles.
Some of you guys need to take a breath. All the preseason hype and the FA spending spree. This is a team that turned over 30+% of the roster.
New coaches get 3 years that's the Giants plan. So get over it!
1964-1980 is the worst stretch of Giants football. BTW.
The OP never said this was the worst Giants stretch ever. He said the worst stretch in the last 30 years which is a fact.
He is in Cancun. Sorry, I should have replied to this instead of posting it separately.
If Eli goes deep and one of the backup CBs gets an INT so be it. They made a play and deserve the ball. But to not even try to exploit such a huge weakness was unbelievable to me.
McAdoo has shown a real lack of creativity against two deep. You can go on any Football 101 site and see running the ball and throwing seam passes to the TE are the traditional way of combating two deep. But Giants can't run up the gut because Jerry can't run block and Pugh and Richburg are undersized. They can't throw seam passes to a guy as short as Tye because to get the ball over the LBs requires you throw high. We saw what happened with Tye when the seam pass was thrown high to him last game.
Also the fact that Tye was wide open shows that their deep coverage was confused, just as you would expect with backups playing at CB.
So, you have to be innovative and flood the deep zone in other ways.
.
I wouldn't want to go thru a 10 drought like that again.
How about the week before when Minnesota was without both starting OT's, their starting QB, and Adrian Pederson? And they still out-passed us, out-rushed us, and we didn't get a whiff of Sam Bradford?
If Eli goes deep and one of the backup CBs gets an INT so be it. They made a play and deserve the ball. But to not even try to exploit such a huge weakness was unbelievable to me.
Dude, they cannot get the ball downfield because the O-line is so bad that Eli had to get rid of it before the WRs can take 5 steps.
This is why I argue with people about the O-line and that it is more important than any other position on the offense other than the QB.
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Our opponents are 16-7. We have a new head coach who is a rookie. I new core of players. What we all believed to be a suspect OL. We are 2-3 going in to a stretch of some very winnable games. 4-2 is not unreasonable over the next six games. At 6-5 with five games left, three of which are against the division, I still like our chances. Call me an optimist but I believe this team will gel at the right time.
Because of the Redskin debacle, 4-2 isn't good enough. That gets them to 6-5. After they lose in Pittsburgh, they're 6-6. If you subscribe to the notion that 10 wins the East, this team is going to run the table the rest of the way? With a likely healthy Dallas team and back to back games in Philly and Washington? Until I see it, there's likely zero chance of that happening. They're just not good enough, even $200 million later.
Im with you. I still believe they are a work in progress. If we gel over the next few weeks we will be competitive. Whether this team wins out or loses every game I will still be a die hard fan.
That was the point
Rut didn't get
Also McAdoo era is
2-3
That was the point
Rut didn't get
Also McAdoo era is
2-3
Did they fire the person responsible for that?
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and McAdoo did not even test them and that the offense was totally putrid was a real turnoff for me as a fan.
How about the week before when Minnesota was without both starting OT's, their starting QB, and Adrian Pederson? And they still out-passed us, out-rushed us, and we didn't get a whiff of Sam Bradford?
That puts us in the same category as every other team they've played.
Peterson is an incredible player, but they may be better off without him. He limits what they do offensively when he is on the field because he isn't a receiving threat. They are much more diverse without him.
And their defense is superb. This is what I've been talking about for a long time with the Giants: the focusing of resources in a specific area to create a top tier unit. If Manning and Beckham are our two best players all efforts should have been taken to support them. Improve the offensive line, improve the running back and tight end positions, etc.
There are 5 new starters, 6 if you include Apple in nickle. Then you lose/hobble basically the entire secondary.
Any reasonable expectation would be for the defense to improve, not transform.
You can cherry pick bad play calls and individual performances, and that's valid, but realistically this is good improvement shown on defense.
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You know they fired the coach responsible for that...right.
That was the point
Rut didn't get
Also McAdoo era is
2-3
Did they fire the person responsible for that?
Well hard to fire Family Members.
They gave us a New Coach.
Same QB who has had 2 bad games in 5
Not a bad start for a first year team.
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In comment 13169396 shelovesnycsports said:
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You know they fired the coach responsible for that...right.
That was the point
Rut didn't get
Also McAdoo era is
2-3
Did they fire the person responsible for that?
Well hard to fire Family Members.
They gave us a New Coach.
Same QB who has had 2 bad games in 5
Not a bad start for a first year team.
How about the guy buying the groceries?
There are 5 new starters, 6 if you include Apple in nickle. Then you lose/hobble basically the entire secondary.
Any reasonable expectation would be for the defense to improve, not transform.
You can cherry pick bad play calls and individual performances, and that's valid, but realistically this is good improvement shown on defense.
I said I'd be happy with "average" defense this year given the disaster we dealt with last year and the fact that you reasonably aren't going from worst to top 5 in one year regardless of who you sign.... but that being said.. the complete lack of pressure has been baffling. You have to be able to get to the QB... both of these DE's are being paid a lot of money and if they can't get there, the DC has to figure out schematic ways to do it.
The amount of time QB's have in the pocket against us is actually embarrassing. There were times where Rodgers had well over 5 seconds back there which is absurd.
Regardless, the last three drafts have been decent. Looks like they have plugged that hole some.
But this is a new team with a new coach. Would we be bitching about Hue Jackson? With Mac still at OC?
Jackson has been horrible. This is year one as soon as the fans accept that the easier the season will be. We are 2-3 all the hype by the media rose up the expectations but fact is this team won 6 games last year. We need to do better than that.
They absolutely should have fired Coughlin. They also should have fired the DC. And the GM. It's way too early to have a definitive opinion about McAdoo. If you put a gun to my head, I'd say he will eventually be a good head coach in this league. Hopefully it's with us, much sooner than later.
G I A N T S
G A!!!
A I N T S
P I N T S
I N E P T S
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The goofiest thing is fans thinking the defense would go from historically bad to good in the matter of 1/4 of a season.
There are 5 new starters, 6 if you include Apple in nickle. Then you lose/hobble basically the entire secondary.
Any reasonable expectation would be for the defense to improve, not transform.
You can cherry pick bad play calls and individual performances, and that's valid, but realistically this is good improvement shown on defense.
I said I'd be happy with "average" defense this year given the disaster we dealt with last year and the fact that you reasonably aren't going from worst to top 5 in one year regardless of who you sign.... but that being said.. the complete lack of pressure has been baffling. You have to be able to get to the QB... both of these DE's are being paid a lot of money and if they can't get there, the DC has to figure out schematic ways to do it.
The amount of time QB's have in the pocket against us is actually embarrassing. There were times where Rodgers had well over 5 seconds back there which is absurd.
That's a totally reasonable critique - the Giants are definitely struggling getting pressure on the QB.
I'm sure the staff would admit that. There's also underlying causes other than Spags sucks.
Vernon is very obviously playing with an injury effecting his ability to punch and re-route his opponent. JPP seems to be playing very wide, which would indicate to me he's tasked with containment and not an inside rush.
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They should have let go of the OC & DC! This is where they failed. But thats my opinion.
They absolutely should have fired Coughlin. They also should have fired the DC. And the GM. It's way too early to have a definitive opinion about McAdoo. If you put a gun to my head, I'd say he will eventually be a good head coach in this league. Hopefully it's with us, much sooner than later.
It's becoming increasingly clear that the front office and coaching staff should have been swept clean after 2012. I've said that before and the response is always, "How could you do that a year after winning the Super Bowl?"
I always come back to Bill Walsh: "Better a year too early than a year too late."
Getting back to you though Britt, I am a few years ahead when it comes to my kids. My son is 9 and REALLY getting into sports. He follows the Yankees religiously and is becoming a 'worse' Giants fan than me. At the slightest bit of adversity he storms off and says hes going to watch the MLB playoffs. I feel bad that this is the example I set but it strikes me that I should re order priorities. Family first, friends second, everything else...especially a billion dollar entertainment 'entity' that rooked its fan base into PSL's and overhyped loyalty.
Dont get me wrong, I'll still follow them as well. But from a further distance. DVR and the internet will help. Call me a fairweather fan, but this team hasn't entertained in a while.
I always come back to Bill Walsh: "Better a year too early than a year too late."
20/20 hindsight though. It wasn't yet clear that the 2011 & 2012 drafts were to be useless. So it was difficult to recognize that it was "a year early". They probably genuinely thought they still had something.
Obviously dead wrong given that the 2013 team was by far the worst one of the Manning era.
But hopefully the experience equipped us to be able to see problems in the present and future. And I see the same issue now as then: the lack of a comprehensive plan for achieving and sustaining success. A big issue may be that they are trying to sell out to win in Eli's remaining years. That approach isn't going to get them anywhere.
I would have been okay with retaining Reese, but canning Mark Ross.
Keeping the assistants on the coaching staff was stupid and makes it more difficult for a new, young coach to put his stamp on the organization
With what was out there the Giants did fine. Spags will either have to learn to do more with what he has or DC needs an upgrade.
I have no idea why we have the same ST Coach other than hes liked by John and CO.
I said this on the McAdoo Offense thread. He just starting to assemble his team. It will take more than 1 draft. I see what he is trying to do but needs upgrades and one off season is not enough.
We are 2-3 going into a very favorable part of the schedule. This for a first year coach is not bad. Give it time but down the line I see where the team wants to go.
Indeed, they look to be pushing in all their chips. The Vernon contract reeked of being desperate, which I suppose is what they were. He simply is not a monster, $85M dollar player and never was (although he is better than how he's played so I have hope). And although improved from 11 & 12, they're just getting almost nothing after rounds 1 & 2 in the draft. No one expects to hit a lot in the later rounds, but maybe bat 20-30% there. You should be able to find a guard once in a while, for instance.
By the way...you know who the Giants could have had as coach after 2012. Some will scoff and his weaknesses (in game management) are well known) but his teams are far more often than not extremely well prepared, something the Giants simply have not been.
Andy Reid.
Now, I have to make decisions as to whether I want to go and a lot of it has to do with this shit product. One home game with parking tolls and gas costs me about $425 for two tix. Plus it takes up the WHOLE day. The drive home after another shit show on turf is agonizing and I am not even thinking about the money.
I can sell the tickets, go fishing in the morning, get home late morning, setup my Fan Duel contests, watch the Giants and any other games on TV, have a home cooked meal, etc.
Going to the Ravens game this Sunday with the wife, friends, cousins, etc. Will be a fun time. Bringing ribs and all kinds of other food. Will get hammered in the parking lot to the point where I won't care what is happening on the field.
At some point, I will begin splitting the year between NJ and FL. Well, some of those FL months will be during football season and I am definitely not boarding a plane to go to a Giants game
I wish you both well on rooting for other teams.
Now, I have to make decisions as to whether I want to go and a lot of it has to do with this shit product. One home game with parking tolls and gas costs me about $425 for two tix. Plus it takes up the WHOLE day. The drive home after another shit show on turf is agonizing and I am not even thinking about the money.
I can sell the tickets, go fishing in the morning, get home late morning, setup my Fan Duel contests, watch the Giants and any other games on TV, have a home cooked meal, etc.
Going to the Ravens game this Sunday with the wife, friends, cousins, etc. Will be a fun time. Bringing ribs and all kinds of other food. Will get hammered in the parking lot to the point where I won't care what is happening on the field.
At some point, I will begin splitting the year between NJ and FL. Well, some of those FL months will be during football season and I am definitely not boarding a plane to go to a Giants game
IMO life choices is much different than when having set the time aside to watch the game turning it off because they are playing poorly.
I agree with you about other things in life, family and priorities. With DVR's there is no reason someone should miss something important for their family when one can easily watch the game when he/she comes home.
The past three games have been a microcosm of the organization since the 2011 Super Bowl. Hell, 2009 and 2010 were no great shakes either, and I'm not even going to talk about 2008.
I have been hopeful because of the team's relatively recent Super Bowl success, Eli, Beckham, and all of the resources spent on the defense. The honeymoon is over. The Giants are not an elite team. The crappy play we have seen the past three weeks is the Giants reality. It's been like since 2012.
I have no expectations for 2016 and I won't have any going forward until proven otherwise. I watch to see improvement.
Things are not that bad. The Giants will be 6-5 in 7 weeks.
Yup. And Packers had a lot of injuries that night anyway. Giants haven't been the same since. The curse of Hurricane Sandy!
I remember when all I got about the games for a couple of years was clippings from the newspaper snail-mailed to me out of the country.
I remember the countless hours spent trying to get my aerial antenna right so I could catch a local game that wasn't being broadcast by satellite.
I cancelled the Sunday Ticket a couple of years back and just went with GamePass. It seemed I was so busy back then that I wasn't watching the games live anyway. I realized how much it bothered me to sit around and wait a few more hours to watch the game that I decided to hell with it, I'm paying the extra money for DirecTV just so I can watch the Giants live every single week in High Def.
There's no way I'm missing even a single play, let alone a game, regardless of record or opponent. I'm just too committed to it.
We're all fools. The Giants have ended the season on a high four times over the last 30 years which is about as good as it gets and we're still miserable. Even pats fans are angry in February more often than not and they are the best franchise going.
LT and playoffs in '81, disappointment with the strike in '82 (with the famous "squib" against the Redskins) and then the mess of '83, then ascendancy and dominance from '84-'90, 2 wasted years with George Young hand picking Ray Handley to fuck up a talented team, then finishing with Reeves restoring order in 1993 for one last fling before turning the Giants into an Elway-less version of the Broncos.
'56-'63 has to be considered great as well, perhaps greater, with 6 Title Game appearances and 1 Championship.
more recently. I think 2005-2011 was pretty damn good. 11-5 in 2005, 8-8 in a disappointing 2006, 10-6 and SB in '07, 12-4 in 2008 (best team of the Coughlin era til Plax shooting), 8-8, 10-6 no playoff in '09 and '10, 9-7 and SB in 2011. 9-7 in 2012 looks okay, but you could see the wheels coming off.
The 2013 SB Clock fiasco set them on the path to the recent mess.
man am I having a bad day. UGH!