I have been a Giants fan since 1956. I was a junior in high school for the 1-12-1 1966 season. I've seen Webster and Handley on the sidelines. I was a fan when Rocky Thompson went #1. I was actually driving through Philadelphia, listening to the game on the radio, for The Fumble.
So, I'm no stranger to adversity.
What we see, in my opinion, is an accentuation of bad traits/habits that have always been there, coupled with a cast of characters who can't make up for them, and probably some loss of skill that also helped make up for them, back in the day.
When Roger Staubach, Troy Aikman, Joe Montana, Terry Bradshaw, or yes, even Ben Roethlisberger wound up to throw a long one, their fans didn't have to cover their eyes. You've all done this with Eli, at least part of the time, since the beginning.
My Dad taught me early that, given enough time, any of the NFL QBs could make the completion. But the time that constitutes "enough time" has been shrinking as the LBs get faster and bigger.
With the current cast of characters, and at his age, I believe Eli may be hitting a wall. He apparently doesn't have the range of talents to redevelop himself as a different kind of player. He's not Brady. He's not his brother. He is, or was, above average, but he was never elite.
And we will need a new QB soon, if I'm right.
I disagree that his mechanics can't be corrected. I don't think it's all about his mechanics. He's been playing very, very skittish. Some have pointed out that this may be due to some hidden injury. That could be the case. Whatever the cause, I don't count Eli out. He has sucked lately. This is absolutely true, and I've even said it. Is he washed up though? No. I don't think so.
That doesn't mean he hasn't arced, however. The days of having Eli at the helm of our offense are shorter than they used to be. If he can't self correct or get healthy, this team is going to have some interesting discussions behind closed doors in the offseason.
It's also possible he bounces back completely and becomes the QB that carried this team on his back, materializing 4th quarter victories out of thin air.
Like the Magic 8 Ball says, "cannot predict now."
His best trait is he's a clutch player.
Great Giant. Not a great QB in the grand scheme of things.
Eli has already "redevelop(ed) himself as a different kind of player". This is the same system he's run the last two years and put up his best statistical seasons under. So how did he do that? Much has already been written on his success in changing the kind of player he is. New footwork, new routes, new reads. He already shown he can run this system. This isn't the problem.
Did he beat the Saints and Cowboys?
Man some of really need a break.
The running game would be dominant, and the QB would not have the entire load on his shoulders.
Right now, the way this offense is designed Eli needs to do this all on his own. He cannot do that. Ben.. maybe. Eli... no
I bet a lot of those back shoulder passes were not meant to be that.
I bet a lot of those back shoulder passes were not meant to be that.
never, huh?
Come on! Opens your eyes. The guy is not the same QB he was and is afraid to step up in the pocket. His pocket awareness is not what it was. He stands like a statue.
I bet a lot of those back shoulder passes were not meant to be that.
Dumb chitt troll.
Aaron Rodgers has spent most of his career running for his life. A bad offensive line didn't seem to bother him all that much. Of course, Rodgers could, you know, run.
however, unlike peyton and brady in the regular season, even in those super bowl years where he had the same supporting characters, he has been more clark kent than superman (with the exception of 2008 where he was on fire pre-plaxico's accident). his play was very up and down, even factoring in the complexity of the coaching staff, injuries, and surrounding talent.
the season is still young and I would love to see Eli put on the cape and channel his playoff magic. I think getting Jennings back will make a difference as I don't think he trusts the young guys back there in terms of assisting with blitz/pressure pickups.
however, unlike peyton and brady in the regular season, even in those super bowl years where he had the same supporting characters, he has been more clark kent than superman (with the exception of 2008 where he was on fire pre-plaxico's accident). his play was very up and down, even factoring in the complexity of the coaching staff, injuries, and surrounding talent.
the season is still young and I would love to see Eli put on the cape and channel his playoff magic. I think getting Jennings back will make a difference as I don't think he trusts the young guys back there in terms of assisting with blitz/pressure pickups.
Except 2011 was the epitome of a Superman year for a QB, with how flawed that team was in the regular season, and any Giant fan who can't realize and accept that all these years later doesn't deserve to have gotten an ounce of joy out of that entire run/season.
Eli deserves criticism for his play the last couple games and some concern going forward, but this shit needs to stop. Some of you need to realize it's okay to not expose yourself as being a reactive, revisionist fool.
Listen, as a big Eli supporter, I will be the first to admit that he has not played his best ball this season. The offense has yet to click. Some of that is on Eli, some of that is on the OL (which in turn has totally messed up Eli's internal clock), some of it is on penalties, and some is on the lack of RB/TE threats. Throw in some VERY untimely turnovers and you have the mess that is this offense right now.
I still believe this offense has enough talent to turn this thing around. It has been an offense that has worked for the past 2 years, so its not a matter of it not being able to work. The pieces are there on offense.
Im sorry, but I would think that after all Eli has done for this franchise, that he has earned enough leeway and respect from the fan base to not give up on the guy after a bad stretch of games. If he doesn't turn it around this season (Id be pretty surprised if he doesnt), then be all means call for his head.
His best trait is he's a clutch player.
Great Giant. Not a great QB in the grand scheme of things.
Yes he is. He's going to finish his career top 10 all time in pass yards and pass TD's and a 2x SB MVP. Every other guy in the top 10 in each of these are HoF'ers or will be except for Testaverde and Rivers. By the time his career is over he'll be very close to top 5.. Marino is the last player he can't catch which means that when all is said and done, his brother, Favre, Brees, Brady and Marino will be the only guys in the history of this league with more TD passes than he has. Rivers and Roethlisberger could both pass him but either way, he's in elite company and belongs in Canton.
Love Eli, but the NFL has changed around him.
Love Eli, but the NFL has changed around him.
Nonsense. Tom Brady is not a mobile QB and neither was his brother. It helps to have mobility but it's certainly not essential.
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the maddening thing about eli is that in the playoffs in 2007 and 2011 he turned himself from clark kent into superman and was indeed better than brady and better than playoff peyton. eli was focused, accurate, prepared, made good decisions and avoided back breaking turnovers.
however, unlike peyton and brady in the regular season, even in those super bowl years where he had the same supporting characters, he has been more clark kent than superman (with the exception of 2008 where he was on fire pre-plaxico's accident). his play was very up and down, even factoring in the complexity of the coaching staff, injuries, and surrounding talent.
the season is still young and I would love to see Eli put on the cape and channel his playoff magic. I think getting Jennings back will make a difference as I don't think he trusts the young guys back there in terms of assisting with blitz/pressure pickups.
Except 2011 was the epitome of a Superman year for a QB, with how flawed that team was in the regular season, and any Giant fan who can't realize and accept that all these years later doesn't deserve to have gotten an ounce of joy out of that entire run/season.
Eli deserves criticism for his play the last couple games and some concern going forward, but this shit needs to stop. Some of you need to realize it's okay to not expose yourself as being a reactive, revisionist fool.
he had a number of good games and a number of stinkers in 2011, and some games where he had moments of excellence combined with moments of game-turning mistakes. for whatever reason, as soon as it became a do or die game, including the last game of the regular season at home against dallas, he put the big S on his chest and elevated his play.
This is why it's so hard for people to actually find a middle ground when it comes to Eli. Any even fair criticism and concern ultimately ends up feeling like piling on because of this nonsense.
This is why it's so hard for people to actually find a middle ground when it comes to Eli. Any even fair criticism and concern ultimately ends up feeling like piling on because of this nonsense.
This is why it's so hard for people to actually find a middle ground when it comes to Eli. Any even fair criticism and concern ultimately ends up feeling like piling on because of this nonsense.
Devon. Take my advice. Ignore his views on eli. He thinks his talks are rational but yet claims eli needs to be more like brian hoyer and Alex smith because they have higher winning percentages. He has gone on record saying peyton and brady overcame talent deficiencies. He tried this same stunt two years ago and only is bringing up now because Eli had a few bad games.
It's sad at this point where people question eli's career and claim to be objective. I don't care if I am the biggest eli supporter here. I am far more objective than the people who have come out of the woodwork and started with a lot of nonsense. Now we are to the point of questioning 2011? Just sad at this point.
Eli is able to do it as well but there's a difference between stepping up into a pocket or moving with one and not having one at all. Peyton, especially in the last few years of his career would just go right to the ground any time the pass rush got near him.
Pocket presence or not, it's hard to overcome a shitty OL. Andrew Luck is a pretty mobile guy but he's running for his life on every pass play.. the IND OL is a disaster and his play has suffered as a result.
It's true that QB's with limited mobility are at a bit of a disadvantage but that doesn't mean there's no place for them in this league.. there are a lot of guys who aren't really mobile and do/have done just fine.
Eli isn't blameless in all of this.. he's missing a lot of throws he should be making. But I don't feel like his lack of mobility means he can no longer play at a high level in this league.
Eli is able to do it as well but there's a difference between stepping up into a pocket or moving with one and not having one at all. Peyton, especially in the last few years of his career would just go right to the ground any time the pass rush got near him.
Pocket presence or not, it's hard to overcome a shitty OL. Andrew Luck is a pretty mobile guy but he's running for his life on every pass play.. the IND OL is a disaster and his play has suffered as a result.
It's true that QB's with limited mobility are at a bit of a disadvantage but that doesn't mean there's no place for them in this league.. there are a lot of guys who aren't really mobile and do/have done just fine.
Eli isn't blameless in all of this.. he's missing a lot of throws he should be making. But I don't feel like his lack of mobility means he can no longer play at a high level in this league.
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“The scramble — they kind of covered everybody and hopefully I can make a few of those plays,” Brady said smiling. “At least I want to be a little bit of a threat out there. I know I’m never going to be like Russell Wilson, but if I can make one or two of those a game, I think that helps us out a bit.”
Good lord, this is unbelievable.
He has had two bad games, no doubt....
Still think it's too early to bury him.....there are some that think he is hiding an injury....there were the wobbled passes the week before....last game, it looked like he lost some of the steam on his passes.....Eli's main fault, is his decision making....too many int's on first down.....
It's not a 5 game season....it's a 16 game season.....next up Baltimore, which has a decent pass rush.....all eyes will be on that arm strength, and also how he reacts to the pass rush...
This is a player who never has missed a snap. He will finish his career in the top 5 or 6 all time in nearly all qB record categories. He has the hardware. Twice. Once beating 4 teams on the road with their QB's being Tony Romo, Brett Favre and TOm Brady. He beat the possible best QB ever twice in the title game. Once when they were undefeated.
He never missed a snap. If you don't get the serious nature of that feat in pro football then you don't get it at all. Period.
This is all coming right as he is set to throw his 300th TD. Tying John Elway for 7th all time. He is still goign to be our QB for 3-6 years. All of you fucks have to deal with that and I love it. Because your complaints reek like those of fans of rival teams.
Good way to move onto why Jordan Ranaan should be given zero info and not respected. Read his posts on game day. Then look at the headline here. The guy is a disgrace. This board unfortnately has probably hit that point. I a lot of people agree with me about Eli, but why have to deal with so many fans of other teams or worse, fans of the Giants who watch these games where the lines get beaten and yet its a Manning bitchfest.
Peole who agree with me...what makes these people want to spend their time on this? They have so many plays, so many wins, so many years to have to watch in the coming years.
You all don't like me I'm sure. And I dislike you very much. You make me sick actually. Nothing makes me happier than knowing you all will be forced to see his name on every leaderboard. And since so many of you root for ohter teams, its seems like such an obsession. THis guy is just better than any qB your teams have. And he has to deal with abslolute journalistic trash who are self serving. The opposite of himself. Jordan Ranaan is a piss poor reporter. Ideally the Giants and Pat Hanlon realize that he deserves no inside info. He dislikes the team and will seek out ways to be a problem.
Maybe I'm confusing you with someone else, but isn't' that talking out of both sides of your mouth? For the last two weeks, it was Eli sucks and now, your pumping him up just so you can beat him down again?
This is a player who never has missed a snap. He will finish his career in the top 5 or 6 all time in nearly all qB record categories. He has the hardware. Twice. Once beating 4 teams on the road with their QB's being Tony Romo, Brett Favre and TOm Brady. He beat the possible best QB ever twice in the title game. Once when they were undefeated.
He never missed a snap. If you don't get the serious nature of that feat in pro football then you don't get it at all. Period.
This is all coming right as he is set to throw his 300th TD. Tying John Elway for 7th all time. He is still goign to be our QB for 3-6 years. All of you fucks have to deal with that and I love it. Because your complaints reek like those of fans of rival teams.
Good way to move onto why Jordan Ranaan should be given zero info and not respected. Read his posts on game day. Then look at the headline here. The guy is a disgrace. This board unfortnately has probably hit that point. I a lot of people agree with me about Eli, but why have to deal with so many fans of other teams or worse, fans of the Giants who watch these games where the lines get beaten and yet its a Manning bitchfest.
Peole who agree with me...what makes these people want to spend their time on this? They have so many plays, so many wins, so many years to have to watch in the coming years.
You all don't like me I'm sure. And I dislike you very much. You make me sick actually. Nothing makes me happier than knowing you all will be forced to see his name on every leaderboard. And since so many of you root for ohter teams, its seems like such an obsession. THis guy is just better than any qB your teams have. And he has to deal with abslolute journalistic trash who are self serving. The opposite of himself. Jordan Ranaan is a piss poor reporter. Ideally the Giants and Pat Hanlon realize that he deserves no inside info. He dislikes the team and will seek out ways to be a problem.
I don't like or dislike you, but this is some homer nonsense.
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I don't see why Eli can't be mentioned in the same breath as those guys... last I checked, Eli is a 2-time Super Bowl MVP without being a statistics whore.
Maybe I'm confusing you with someone else, but isn't' that talking out of both sides of your mouth? For the last two weeks, it was Eli sucks and now, your pumping him up just so you can beat him down again?
never said Eli sucks. I said his problem is being too smart and trusting guys he shouldn't trust.
- one of the more rational articles about Eli.
Eli Manning has earned my respect. A 2 time SB winner and MVP gets a pass from me. I don't have to think he's the greatest QB ever and I don't even have to know if he's even able to be a great QB in the future. I really don't give a fuck. The guy helped deliver two of the most magical sporting memories ever. To put it blunt - short of him doing something personally bad for me, the guy gets a pass from me for deriding him or calling him names or acting as if he's the scourge of the Earth. If you ever see me on a game thread or in general discussion saying Eli sucks balls and needs to be cut, disable my account.
Like every other fan, I can't control how the team does. I can't decide who is a good player, who isn't and which coaches and FO people have the best skills. If Eli isn't getting the job done, he'll be replaced. Not by the fans, but by the people who run the team.
Knowing that, you can take a couple of paths. You can take the good times and celebrate them and in down times have a general feeling of what's not working and hope it changes, or you can celebrate the good times and then come off as whiny, insufferable cunts when things aren't so well. You can take the very players you lauded before and hurl a ton of insults at them now - for what reason, I'll never know.
I get jumped on for lashing out at moronic posts, with the board's resident contrarian asking why I go after morons instead of the team. Well, the team's earned my respect infinitely more than a gaggle of posters who take a loss as if somebody stabbed them with an HIV infected sword.
There will always be a fan divide when some fans actually root for a team and have no interest in seeing them fail and are faced with fans who will hurl any amount of intelligible insults weekly when things go wrong. If somebody actually has the wherewithall to post "Eli can fucking die already" during a game thread - there will always be a divide.
And you know what? Nothing on the team will change or be impacted. It's just whining and bitching for the sake of it. If you've appreciated what Eli's done yet don't have enough respect for him not to lash out with insults, you have bigger problems than a poster on a website pointing this out.
- one of the more rational articles about Eli.
Actually it was quite awful. Most beat writers cant even tell you what a zone defense is. I love how writers use extreme examples.
"Well he isnt Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers - so dont expect him to turn into them."
Well no shit. Great analysis. You can say that about 30 other QBs in the league too.