"The Giants had one timeout and could have challenged the play. Had they been successful, the Packers would have faced 3rd-and-13 with roughly 2:30 remaining in the game with the Giants down a touchdown and still possessing a timeout. But what makes this such an egregious error is that McAdoo had nothing to lose: had he challenged and lost, the clock would have stopped. Instead, he simply used his time out.
After the game, McAdoo said he didn’t see anything to challenge, but on Wednesday his explanation was completely nonsensical.
“You'd lose the challenge,” McAdoo said. “I’d like to win them. I want to win everything we do. As a competitor. I saw him catch the ball, make a football move and I thought we had a chance to come out with a fumble.”
Intimidating number of Giant fires for Ben McAdoo to put out
That explanation doesn’t check out, because in this case there was virtually nothing to lose and, given how vague the catch rules are, it’s hard to know on a borderline play like that one how it would have turned out. Case in point: “football move” isn’t even part of the definition of a catch anymore, despite McAdoo referencing it. Also, at that point the Giants didn’t have a chance to come out with the fumble: the play was over, and the Packers had recovered it."
I know these guys try not to give up too much to the media but the more and more you get a chance to see other teams play via the redzone you realize these are just guys who lack common sense/intelligence.
Makes No Sense - (
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He blew it there. He's a first year head coach. Admit it and do better next time.
Having said that, I think McAdoo will end up being a good head coach, though he might have too much on his plate right now with play calling along with learning the ropes.
He's from a town of 1700 people so the KMART suit kind of makes sense.
And while I didn't want Coughlin fired, I admittedly had McAdoo as my first choice if he was.
A: You want me to tip my hand?
Does he really think the Ravens would get a competitive advantage by not answering this question?
Don't know if that's the actual rule or not, but if it is, it makes sense that there was no challenge.
Don't know if that's the actual rule or not, but if it is, it makes sense that there was no challenge.
I looked into it. If it were under 2 minutes the clock would continue but in this situation no. The clock would still have stopped.
My issue is that you have to lead by example. You see the team falling apart in front of our eyes. He doesn't squash the Beckham issues (which are non-issues imo to begin with) but he feeds into it with his answers. He then preaches to the media how Beckham needs to do better here and there. Yet, when our head coach is fucking up he just comes up with excuses. It is bullshit to me and he is going to have a hard time turning this team around because we have not played sound football yet.
Not to mention he sat on two timeout against dallas week 1 at the end of the first half. They scored so it got covered up but he put himself in a position if they didnt score on the Shepard td they would have been forced to kick a FG and squander an opportunity at 7.
Rooting like hell for the guy but I'm just totally unimpressed
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All that matters is that he does a better job on the sideline. This is terrible logic for not challenging. But he's a 1st year HC and he's a young guy relative to his peers. He's going to make mistakes and he's going to have to learn the hard way. It comes with the territory. It's a tough job.
My issue is that you have to lead by example. You see the team falling apart in front of our eyes. He doesn't squash the Beckham issues (which are non-issues imo to begin with) but he feeds into it with his answers. He then preaches to the media how Beckham needs to do better here and there. Yet, when our head coach is fucking up he just comes up with excuses. It is bullshit to me and he is going to have a hard time turning this team around because we have not played sound football yet.
That's fine, but all I said was I don't care what he wears or what kind of haircut he has.. it's irrelevant.
He did squash the Beckham stuff when he was on with Francesa last week and Beckham was not an issue at all in GB. He obviously got the situation under control.
I think this was a dumb mistake but he's going to make them. Our 2x SB HC was still making them in his final year here.
Seems like pretty important information.
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“You'd lose the challenge,” McAdoo said. “I’d like to win them. I want to win everything we do. As a competitor.”
It sounds like he is saying that winning at everything is so important to him that he wouldn't even want to risk the defeat of losing anything, even a challenge.
He had to not realize how dumb this would sound. That's just what we would need a coach that is so insure that he doesn't want to "suffer" losing at a challenge.
Now I don't believe for a moment this is true because he is intelligent enough to know that losing at a challenge isn't the end game to worry about but losing the game is.
Unfortunately though the reality is that he might just be insecure enough or stubborn enough not to just admit he blew it.
A: You'd lose the challenge. I'd like to win them. I want to win everything we do. He's a competitor. I saw him catch the ball, make a football move and I thought we had a chance to come out with a fumble.
His excuse for not challenging is just dumb.
To top it off his answer made no fucking sense whatsoever.
Just like when someone asked him if Flowers would start Sunday he replied "do you want me top my hand." Nonsensical answers.
Seems like pretty important information.
He made the importance irrelevant by instead calling the time out.
People love to complain about every freaking thing.
Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to be a smart alec, I wasn't.
But my point is if he instead called the timeout it would have been the same result had he lost the challenge. Why not take a chance that the play just might be overturned if he is simply intending to call the time out anyway?
People love to complain about every freaking thing.
It's a combination of things. Appearances dont matter but showing up to your introductory press conference in a $4 suit looking like Mick Foley isnt a good decision, right? With his poor clock management, poor use of timeouts/challenges and some pretty stupid answers to the media the evidence is starting to piling up that this guy may not be too sharp.
Could be wrong. We'll see. I hope so.
Mac called a timeout and didn't challenge the call which could have stopped the clock and forced a 3rd and 14 instead of 3rd and 10 i believe.
They converted the 3rd down and the game was over.
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Steve. So thanks for not answering the question.
Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to be a smart alec, I wasn't.
But my point is if he instead called the timeout it would have been the same result had he lost the challenge. Why not take a chance that the play just might be overturned if he is simply intending to call the time out anyway?
No worries bud. And I'm not arguing about whether or not it was foolish considering he used the TO anyways. Clearly he made a mistake and is using a lame excuse.
But again, would the call have been overturned?
Mac called a timeout and didn't challenge the call which could have stopped the clock and forced a 3rd and 14 instead of 3rd and 10 i believe.
They converted the 3rd down and the game was over.
Yeah and since it was their final TO he lost his final challenge anyway by calling the TO.
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In comment 13171126 B in ALB said:
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Steve. So thanks for not answering the question.
Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to be a smart alec, I wasn't.
But my point is if he instead called the timeout it would have been the same result had he lost the challenge. Why not take a chance that the play just might be overturned if he is simply intending to call the time out anyway?
No worries bud. And I'm not arguing about whether or not it was foolish considering he used the TO anyways. Clearly he made a mistake and is using a lame excuse.
But again, would the call have been overturned?
Prob not. But it's the lack of using logic in the situation that is worrisome. I watched the game with 6 people and we all knew he should give the challenge a shot while conceding he would lose.
Not admitting the mistake was weird. His response was just bizarre. "As a competitor i dont like to lose." WTF?!?!?!?!?
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In comment 13171126 B in ALB said:
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Steve. So thanks for not answering the question.
Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to be a smart alec, I wasn't.
But my point is if he instead called the timeout it would have been the same result had he lost the challenge. Why not take a chance that the play just might be overturned if he is simply intending to call the time out anyway?
No worries bud. And I'm not arguing about whether or not it was foolish considering he used the TO anyways. Clearly he made a mistake and is using a lame excuse.
But again, would the call have been overturned?
He should just say he blew it and move on, instead of this "I hate to lose at anything nonsense"
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He has nothing to gain by answering the question about Flowers. It's probably overkill but why does it matter that he didn't answer it? Let the Ravens at least consider that they might have to prepare for someone else. His answer does zero harm to our team and at worst, the Ravens don't treat their prep work any differently and it's completely inconsequential.
People love to complain about every freaking thing.
It's a combination of things. Appearances dont matter but showing up to your introductory press conference in a $4 suit looking like Mick Foley isnt a good decision, right? With his poor clock management, poor use of timeouts/challenges and some pretty stupid answers to the media the evidence is starting to piling up that this guy may not be too sharp.
Could be wrong. We'll see. I hope so.
Have you seen the ratty things Bill Belichick has worn over the years? It's meaningless.
I think it's unfair to assume he's not going to make some mistakes while he learns the ropes. We have to give the guy a little time.
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In comment 13171127 arcarsenal said:
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He has nothing to gain by answering the question about Flowers. It's probably overkill but why does it matter that he didn't answer it? Let the Ravens at least consider that they might have to prepare for someone else. His answer does zero harm to our team and at worst, the Ravens don't treat their prep work any differently and it's completely inconsequential.
People love to complain about every freaking thing.
It's a combination of things. Appearances dont matter but showing up to your introductory press conference in a $4 suit looking like Mick Foley isnt a good decision, right? With his poor clock management, poor use of timeouts/challenges and some pretty stupid answers to the media the evidence is starting to piling up that this guy may not be too sharp.
Could be wrong. We'll see. I hope so.
Have you seen the ratty things Bill Belichick has worn over the years? It's meaningless.
I think it's unfair to assume he's not going to make some mistakes while he learns the ropes. We have to give the guy a little time.
Agreed. But so far as HC he's proven to be closer to stupid than smart in more facets than just on the field. Things can and hopefully will change.
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In comment 13171127 arcarsenal said:
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He has nothing to gain by answering the question about Flowers. It's probably overkill but why does it matter that he didn't answer it? Let the Ravens at least consider that they might have to prepare for someone else. His answer does zero harm to our team and at worst, the Ravens don't treat their prep work any differently and it's completely inconsequential.
People love to complain about every freaking thing.
It's a combination of things. Appearances dont matter but showing up to your introductory press conference in a $4 suit looking like Mick Foley isnt a good decision, right? With his poor clock management, poor use of timeouts/challenges and some pretty stupid answers to the media the evidence is starting to piling up that this guy may not be too sharp.
Could be wrong. We'll see. I hope so.
Have you seen the ratty things Bill Belichick has worn over the years? It's meaningless.
I think it's unfair to assume he's not going to make some mistakes while he learns the ropes. We have to give the guy a little time.
Absolutely, but I like a man who can admit it when he does. This I don't want to lose at anything so I didn't challenge BS is embarrassing. Sounds like a twelve year old's logic.
IMO seems like the team would respect him more if he manned up as well.
But for things like the end of the half vs Dallas, end of the half vs Minnesota, the non challenge and lame excuse vs Green Bay... I'm sorry, but if you are a 39 year old man who has presumably been watching football his whole life and has spent 10 years on NFL staffs ,you shouldn't look like such an amateur in those situations.... just having spent a minute or two watching football should provide you with the tools to not look like a dope in those situations. Average fans have their jaws drop in real time at the amateur nature of it all in those instances
But for things like the end of the half vs Dallas, end of the half vs Minnesota, the non challenge and lame excuse vs Green Bay... I'm sorry, but if you are a 39 year old man who has presumably been watching football his whole life and has spent 10 years on NFL staffs ,you shouldn't look like such an amateur in those situations.... just having spent a minute or two watching football should provide you with the tools to not look like a dope in those situations. Average fans have their jaws drop in real time at the amateur nature of it all in those instances
I think you're completely underestimating how many things an NFL head coach has to be aware of at once throughout the course of a football game. It's easy to sit home and not have to worry about anything else and feel like all of these decisions should be easy on the field... I'm sure that's not quite the case.
Andy Reid has been in this league forever now and the guy made so many clock management errors over the years that I lost count. It's not an excuse but people need to realize this stuff is going to happen sometimes. Especially with an inexperienced coach.
Mac just looks clueless in these situations. And I agree that there is a lot more that goes into being a head coach, but the really good ones generally have their shot together with situational awareness
No. He would have won he challenge.
I disagree with the conclusion, but understand why he did not challenge.
But alas, our linebackers don't make plays like that...
That said, talking about his clothes and calling him white trash like that's some kind of meaningful comment on his coaching ability is out of line and pathetic.
However, is this possibly the logic. BM knew he wasn't going to win the challenge and wanted to potentially save a final challenge in case something happened on a play before the two minute warning on the next play?
OF course, if it was his last time out, then it doesn't make any sense.....nothing to lose I suppose.
I could care less what he wears or how he looks.
Once the Giants decided to move on from TC due to multiple losing seasons. I would have preferred they clean house with a new GM that could have selected a coach that fit their football philosophy and vision. But, that ship has sailed and this guy is the top man now. It would be very silly to draw any conclusions after five games.
However, is this possibly the logic. BM knew he wasn't going to win the challenge and wanted to potentially save a final challenge in case something happened on a play before the two minute warning on the next play?
OF course, if it was his last time out, then it doesn't make any sense.....nothing to lose I suppose.
I don't think so. If he knew the catch was in question, there was no reason not to challenge. I just don't think it even occurred to them that the catch was in question.
But the reason he needed to study that so much is because he lacked that skill. This is evidence of that, and worse its evidence that he can't admit it.
I watched the game and I'd bet every dollar in my bank account that he'd win the challenge. The guy never had control of the ball it's a clear as day. The second the ball hits his hands it's bobbling and then he drops it.
McAdoo has had a dreadful opening month on the field and his press dealings are concerning as well. I'm terrified. And who the hell is helping with the challenges and clock mgmt? Anyone? Mcadoo appears to be in over his head.
Any time someone loses possession bang-bang, you have to have eyes on the replay. Two things can always go in your favor- a fumble or incompletion.
There was a scrum, there was time to think and act. If he said oh well, air thought it wasn't a fumble and that was it, we need to get a guy in the booth focused on this.
I agree.I thought the review would have been to see if it was a good completion. It looked like the ball shifted a few times and then popped out. (Probably a slight chance to be overturned, but who knows with todays decisions) Now something that subtle might not be easy to see on the sidelines. Whoever is in the Giants booth watching the replay probably should have buzzed down, they should know the situation as well. Far from the reason why we lost the game, but a mistake.
Also, thanks to whoever looked up the rule in regards to the clock running only after the 2 minute warning if the challenge is lost.
Ideally you'd love a young guy who could be the guy for a long time and mimic that steelers stability. But at the end of the day, it's about getting the best coach. Retread or not