I am sorry this is so long, and sorry to be starting another OBJ discussion. But my thoughts were too long to include in the existing posts.
I’d be the first to say I am an unapologetic OBJ defender. That said. I think the criticism of some of his actions are warranted (the Panthers game from last year and some cheap shots observed this year. However due to the legitimate criticism he has received, the level of criticism of OBJ has reached an unreasonable level. I cite the following:
- The emotional meltdown during the Redskins game and hitting the net with his helmet. I understand that everyone wants to see the young man exercise complete composure at all times, but let’s be fair. Plenty of players, including hall of fame players, got emotional on the sidelines in similar fashion. It’s one thing to say he should stay composed, it’s another to label him as a distraction or a selfish player because of this particular behavior.
- His “taunting” penalty during the Vikings game. In addition to being a poor call by the official, OBJ had been hit late out of bounds, which was not called, and he was reacting to that hit. Also, I fail to see how that was taunting. OBJ was trying to get the official’s attention, not going after the defensive player. He did try to exact a little revenge on the next play, which in my opinion should have been flagged.
- And yesterday. I know people are tired of the thing with the net, and I could do without it. But I think we have to accept that this is OBJ’s way of getting back at the critics for what he sees as some unfair scrutiny when you consider that plenty of players do the same things he does and don’t receive the same treatment from the national sports media. I mean, he isn’t the first or the last player to have an outburst on the sideline and use his equipment to express that frustration. As far as removing the helmet penalty, I would argue he had stepped out of the endzone and therefore was no longer in the field of play, but the rules are the rules. Not going to make excuses for him there. As far as the post TD sideline antics go, he just scored the game winning TD on 4th and 1, and took his chest thumping strutting celebration to the sideline (where it belongs) and kept it out of the endzone.
National media is acting like OBJ is the first skill player to celebrate loudly after big plays. Anyone notice this kind of thing has been going on for 30 years? Why is OBJ proposing to the net on the sideline somehow worse than Antonio Brown’s twerking in the endzone? My basic point is there are things we can and should be critical of OBJ for, and then there are other instances where we (fans and media) are far too critical. As much as you don’t like the net stuff, doesn’t it seem like the sports media is more outraged about it than OBJ teammates are?
Last night Rodney Harrison said OBJ had “potential”, ok Mr. Harrison, I think we are beyond potential at this point. And Tony Dungy, a man I respect, said OBJ has to stop hurting his team with penalties like removing his helmet after the TD. While I concede the act was a penalty, let’s be fair. Did anyone catch Rob Gronkowski’s actions yesterday? Now, to be honest, I love me some Gronk. He is a monster, plays like a bull in a china shop, seems to never take a play off, and is near impossible to stop. I would love to see him in NYG Blue. But, Gronk is a bit off…mentally, and we all know this. We have accepted it. In fact, most of us love it, even when he is in the wrong.
Anyone remember his off the field antics and partying early in his career, when he explained to the New Patriot organization that his partying and blowing off steam helped him play better. And they said ok, just don’t do anything to hurt the team. Anyone read “It’s Good to be Gronk.” A book that details Gronk’s exploits in all facets of his life, some of which are not fit for young ears. Gronk’s antics are almost treated as humorous and loveable, his book was greated as fun and enjoyable. I have no problem with that. Gronk is a great player, he is who is, and is good for the game.
Yesterday during the Pats-Bengals game, Gronk repeatedly taunted the Bengals defense, including a player who got injured attempting to tackle the massive TE. For a while it looked like Gronk and Bengals LB Vontaze Burfict were going to fight. Gronk drew a 15 yard penalty, and later said he needed to avoid those types of penalties. I think we all understand things get heated and emotional on the football field, and players like Gronk and OBJ care about winning. Even when they are drawing attention to themselves they care about winning. What I don’t understand, is why OBJ’s actions yesterday are a bigger media story than Gronk’s actions? Is it because Gronk is a Patriot and has a ring? Is it because half the reason people love Gronk is because he has developed a caveman like persona and lives up to it? Is it because the Patriots win more than the Giants? Do we have more respect for the 6’6” 260lb TE who plays physical, than the 5’11” 195lb WR who plays a finesse game.
Why is it nearly overlooked by national media when one taunts an injured player and almost gets in a fight, and we can’t get enough of what are at worst silly sideline antics with a net and a foolish (but not malicious) removal of the helmet penalty after a game winning TD.
I’m a Giants fan, so I am biased, but I really am curious why OBJ draws far more media attention than Cam Newton’s pouty press conference, Brown’s lewd dancing in the endzone, or Gronk taunting an injured player and almost starting a brawl. Do I think OBJ is under an unfair spotlight? Yes I do. Do I think he helped put it there? Yes I do. Do I think other players are getting away with even worse behavior? Absolutely I do.
Gronkowski, Blount Get Physical With Bengals And Burfict Late In Pats’ Win - (
New Window )
Quote:
In comment 13178817 therealmf said:
Quote:
and people bitch about the celebration penalty because that could have cost us the game.
You guys have an agenda. Either you don't like OBJ or you don't like the new NFL. All this talk of how OBJ could have cost us the game.
Two things.
1. He just had two plays for two tds. 75 yards and 65 yards. Who wouldn't celebrate? Some would say he won the game.
2. His fumble did more to hurt the Giants chances of winning then the penalty.
If the topic is he almost cost us the game, why hasn't that been mentioned?
Because the fumble is a physical mistake, and we can all live with a mistake. 15 yard penalties every week are a mental issue.
Let me toss this back at you:
When DaMontre Moore got 15 yard penalties in 3 straight games why was he public enemy #1 around here but now it's not ok to criticize Beckham and demand accountability for the same thing?
If DaMontre Moore was an all pro talent and the only thing separating this team team from 4-12 garbage, he would have gotten more rope too.
And thereun lies the problem that beckham has created for the Giants.
They can't discipline or reduce his playing time because of his insane level of talent.
This is why he is not and has never been a team guy. He could have easily put this all behind him after the mistake of the panthers game. To him it is not a problem.
That is why i am pissed. Grow up and act like the other 1500 adults in the league.
You think LT had this kind of act? Useless and uncalled for 15 yard penalties. Crying on he field. Complaining about being a victim. A fake tough guy act that included punching s guy in the back of the head and hen running away (Bills game)?
LT was nothing like this. He yelled at other players on occasion? That's about it. Enough of the LT talk in a Beckham thread: not close.
He's aggressive on some blocks. On occasion hits late. Hit high. Throws punches. In the Bills game he went after a few DBs and hit them late on running plays. Then on a pick they knock him on his ass with a clean block. His reaction? Punch the guy in the head after the whistle and run away.
He's not the victim of taunting. He brought it on. If you do that you should be able to handle the talk back.
I don't care if a guy talks after a play. But he can't handle it when teams go back at him verbally or physically.
This LT talk is hilarious here. LT didn't meltdown. He didn't care if somebody would talk back did he? He played his ass off without looking like a fool.
People not liking he Beckham act doesn't mean they didn't love LTs act because it wasn't the same.
You think LT had this kind of act? Useless and uncalled for 15 yard penalties. Crying on he field. Complaining about being a victim. A fake tough guy act that included punching s guy in the back of the head and hen running away (Bills game)?
LT was nothing like this. He yelled at other players on occasion? That's about it. Enough of the LT talk in a Beckham thread: not close.
You remember that 4 game stretch that LT missed that the Giants went 2-2 in? Guess what, that's worse than a 15 yard penalty.
You think LT had this kind of act? Useless and uncalled for 15 yard penalties. Crying on he field. Complaining about being a victim. A fake tough guy act that included punching s guy in the back of the head and hen running away (Bills game)?
LT was nothing like this. He yelled at other players on occasion? That's about it. Enough of the LT talk in a Beckham thread: not close.
+1
Those making the connection aren't smart enough to recognize failure staring them in the face
Ok.
Quote:
Seen it a few times.
You think LT had this kind of act? Useless and uncalled for 15 yard penalties. Crying on he field. Complaining about being a victim. A fake tough guy act that included punching s guy in the back of the head and hen running away (Bills game)?
LT was nothing like this. He yelled at other players on occasion? That's about it. Enough of the LT talk in a Beckham thread: not close.
You remember that 4 game stretch that LT missed that the Giants went 2-2 in? Guess what, that's worse than a 15 yard penalty.
Now the GOAT is being ridiculed by these dopes.
Ok.
Stick the four game suspension you know where. OBJ's resume isn't even in the same sentence with what Taylor achieved.
Quote:
Was now if we have a problem with Beckhams BS we must have a problem with any plays who gets a 4 game suspension?
Ok.
Stick the four game suspension you know where. OBJ's resume isn't even in the same sentence with what Taylor achieved.
Sry, misread :)
Neg: had an unsportsmanlike penalty after a game tying TD after he won the game for us
The talk should be 80/20 positive. The talk is actually 80/20 negative
he WON US THE FUCKING GAME BY CARRYING US ON HIS BACK. That's a fact and reality, it happened.
Yet people are more concerned about him potentially costing us a better chance at winning the game.
A lot of fucking fools who care about bs than reality. He needs to grow up and get more mature, everyone here knows that. But the disproportionate amount of talk on the negative about yesterday's performance is simply pathetic. He had a legendary 2nd half.
So did most of the league and a legend named Mark Messier. Think steroids weren't used either? How about you annoint OBJ the GOAT and discredit everybody else. We'll pass out warm blankets for the OBJ needs a hug crew. So soft
Quote:
Was now if we have a problem with Beckhams BS we must have a problem with any plays who gets a 4 game suspension?
Ok.
Stick the four game suspension you know where. OBJ's resume isn't even in the same sentence with what Taylor achieved.
Quote:
In comment 13179191 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Was now if we have a problem with Beckhams BS we must have a problem with any plays who gets a 4 game suspension?
Ok.
Stick the four game suspension you know where. OBJ's resume isn't even in the same sentence with what Taylor achieved.
on one hand, you dismiss LT hurting the team because of his ability and performance. On the other you rush to ignore Beckham''s ability and performance to light the pyre over perceived transgressions. Same thing, different outcome.
Wrong - apparently you really can't figure out why it makes no sense, none, to compare the GOAT to a 3rd year player. Some believe he's not even the best receiver in the league and yet some want to bring up Taylor lol. Good lord, how ridiculous.
Never heard any NY player be spoken about like this. None
Not to mention, perhaps the quietest and more successful NY players not named Jeter, speaks out for one of the few times since 2004 and the 2nd time this year about OBJ.
Gee, maybe the world should remind Eli of LawrenceTaylor lol. Even Tiki Barber wouldn't say something so stupid
Nice dupe account and your first post. Lol - good lord
So when a young talented WR made "the catch" and overnight became the most talked about WR in the game and the catch was called by many the greatest catch in the history of the NFL many people became jealous and envious of the attention Odell received and as a result were quick to pounce on him when the opportunity presented itself hoping to take him down a notch or two.
Odell is amazing, he's already untouchable when he's on and he still has another level (the always level).
Norman got in his head, well guess what? Odell has absolutely dominated him. If that sick spin move play he had on Norman would've been a TD, that highlight would've been so much bigger than it was. It still led to a TD. Sherman fears Odell more than anyone else in the league. Odell burned him their first meeting and he's even better now. Rhodes somehow being A shutdown CB because he "stopped" Odell is cute. Butler is the only guy I've seen truly win a battle wit Odell (buffalo bills secondary as a whole stopped him) and Odell still dropped 100 and a TD on him.
33 games. 28 tds. 100+ yards per game. Just dropped 200 receiving yards in the second half and had the last minute game winner to keep our season alive. First instant monster NFL WR since Moss.
And we're focusing on the negatives. He's a diva and yes, if he concentrated his rage better he could be even more dominant than he already is. But he's already historic and everyone knows it, including him. He's been a diva and I hope he grows up, but he's just so damn good and I've enjoyed rooting for his unique madness.
Comparing him to Toomer isn't any less ridiculous, considering that Amani was never in the conversation for best WR in the sport a single day of his life.
Since week 5 of the 2014 season (the week of his debut), Beckham has at least 5 more offensive TDs than EVERY other non-QB in the sport. Trying to pretend Beckham isn't already one of the best players in the sport regardless of position doesn't help whatever point you're trying to make at all.
You don't like his behavior? Fine... say that, but there's no "BS hype". He's a generational talent.
Quote:
Or has the BS hype actually convinced some he's the LT of the offense lol? He's not even considered the best WR by some let alone the greatest offensive player of all time. Ridiculous, not hypocrisy.
Comparing him to Toomer isn't any less ridiculous, considering that Amani was never in the conversation for best WR in the sport a single day of his life.
Since week 5 of the 2014 season (the week of his debut), Beckham has at least 5 more offensive TDs than EVERY other non-QB in the sport. Trying to pretend Beckham isn't already one of the best players in the sport regardless of position doesn't help whatever point you're trying to make at all.
You don't like his behavior? Fine... say that, but there's no "BS hype". He's a generational talent.
Just be quiet. Some don't believe he's as good as Antonio Brown. Nobody thought anybody was better than Taylor and LT never pulled this nonsense in the field.
Antonio Brown mimics having sex in the endzone, wears cleats to "honor" people, participated in Dancing with the Stars. People would fucking kill on Odell for wearing Arnold Palmer cleats, claiming it was disrespectful and "look at me".
Have people never watched a baseball game and seen what players do to water coolers, sunflower seeds, bullpen phones, etc. when they strike out? I never hear those guys' commitments to their teams questioned.
Beckham is one of the most important and valuable players on the team. Any struggles the team has is not because of him. He does nothing but make our team and team culture better because of how hard he strives for greatness. Has there ever been a report of him not showing up for meetings, practice, training sessions? Have there been any reports or rumors of him dogging it or creating drama during training camps or practices?
When he lost his mind during the Skins game, Eli had to take ten minutes to calm him down. His lack of composure permeated thru the team in that game. The center got kicked out defending the honor of OBJ. The whole team lost their composure during that game and like it or not Odell is our team's identity. The 4th most penalty yards in the league and can't stay focused for 4 quarters. That's the Giant's MO at this point in the season.
What should we do?
Let's pound on him day and night about his behavior and how terrible he is. After all we are Giants fans, we expect better.
Or
Admit he was stupid and did stupid things and move on. Lets see how he handles himself through the season. Be a little supportive while acknowledging his faults. After all, we are Giants fans and should act like it.
I read some of the stuff on this board and can't help thinking that Eric and the moderators should give penalties for bad behavior. These should be tracked and available for all to see.
And OBJ isn't the only one getting stupid penalties - there are enough to go around. Now that everyone knows how the refs will call penalties, especially just about ANYTHING post-touchdown, all players need to make a concerted effort to get out of the end zone and celebrate on the sideline, plain and simple.
It was NEVER an issue on the field. He had off the field issues? Plenty do. On the field he wasn't a head case or problem.
Just be quiet. Some don't believe he's as good as Antonio Brown. Nobody thought anybody was better than Taylor and LT never pulled this nonsense in the field.
You're a clown.
Quote:
that he proposed to the kicking net? ?
Wrong - he's being ridiculed b/c of the flag which was the first act of his look at me show with no clue/care he was flagged which could have cost the team a win and maybe a playoff spot down the road.
Just wait until the Ram game this week.
So you're saying that there aren't people all over BBI making a fuss about him and the net? Which threads are you reading, because I'm seeing it in every Beckham thread.
Quote:
that he proposed to the kicking net? He was having some fun after getting torched in the media for hitting it a couple of weeks ago. If anything, the jokes with the kicking net indicates a bit of remorse on his part.
Have people never watched a baseball game and seen what players do to water coolers, sunflower seeds, bullpen phones, etc. when they strike out? I never hear those guys' commitments to their teams questioned.
Beckham is one of the most important and valuable players on the team. Any struggles the team has is not because of him. He does nothing but make our team and team culture better because of how hard he strives for greatness. Has there ever been a report of him not showing up for meetings, practice, training sessions? Have there been any reports or rumors of him dogging it or creating drama during training camps or practices?
When he lost his mind during the Skins game, Eli had to take ten minutes to calm him down. His lack of composure permeated thru the team in that game. The center got kicked out defending the honor of OBJ. The whole team lost their composure during that game and like it or not Odell is our team's identity. The 4th most penalty yards in the league and can't stay focused for 4 quarters. That's the Giant's MO at this point in the season.
Some serious confirmation bias showing up here. Eli had to calm down Beckham for ten minutes? Do you have a complaint from the coaching staff or Eli about that, or are you only basing it on the fact that they were talking on the sidelines? He should talk to Beckham-- it's the biggest weapon on the team and they needed to figure out what to do to get back to the superstar production they expect.
His lack of composure permeated through the team? How so? This team has been committing penalties all season-- Richburg was ejected because Richburg lost his cool. Blaming that on Beckham is absurd.
Overall, fans have a bad tendency of trying to fit their own narratives. A team has a fiery player and wins? They won because of the fire and passion of that player. The team loses? That player lost his cool and made it all about himself and was a distraction.
Same thing with Eli. When the team wins, it's his unshakable demeanor and calmness that kept the team cool under pressure. When the team loses, he's not a "leader," and shows no passion or sense of urgency.
If Odell Beckham's energy and sideline antics are the reasons why Trevin Wade can't cover, or why our defensive line can't get to the quarterback, or why we can't run the ball, or why Larry Donnell thinks he's doing parkour, then the team has far, FAR bigger problems to worry about.
Yes, Richburg has to be responsible for his own actions, but he was ejected for hitting Norman late and taunting him. In Beckham/Norman round two.
We need OBJ to be a leader, that's all. We are only going to go as far as he takes us. The team feeds off his emotion whether positive or negative. He needs to be cognizant of that.
Link - ( New Window )
Quote:
Just be quiet. Some don't believe he's as good as Antonio Brown. Nobody thought anybody was better than Taylor and LT never pulled this nonsense in the field.
You're a clown.
Lol - having a Beckham i see. Need a hug before a kicking net crashing into your fragile psyche?
Kid had to keep on his helmet which is a penalty. Apparently you're too dumb to figure it out just as you're to lost realize Taylor never pulled this baby nonsense on the football field
Quote:
In comment 13178995 PaulBlakeTSU said:
Quote:
that he proposed to the kicking net? ?
Wrong - he's being ridiculed b/c of the flag which was the first act of his look at me show with no clue/care he was flagged which could have cost the team a win and maybe a playoff spot down the road.
Just wait until the Ram game this week.
So you're saying that there aren't people all over BBI making a fuss about him and the net? Which threads are you reading, because I'm seeing it in every Beckham thread.
Apparently you still miss the ones about the flag b/c you're still posting about the net.
Odell is amazing, he's already untouchable when he's on and he still has another level (the always level).
Norman got in his head, well guess what? Odell has absolutely dominated him. If that sick spin move play he had on Norman would've been a TD, that highlight would've been so much bigger than it was. It still led to a TD. Sherman fears Odell more than anyone else in the league. Odell burned him their first meeting and he's even better now. Rhodes somehow being A shutdown CB because he "stopped" Odell is cute. Butler is the only guy I've seen truly win a battle wit Odell (buffalo bills secondary as a whole stopped him) and Odell still dropped 100 and a TD on him.
33 games. 28 tds. 100+ yards per game. Just dropped 200 receiving yards in the second half and had the last minute game winner to keep our season alive. First instant monster NFL WR since Moss.
And we're focusing on the negatives. He's a diva and yes, if he concentrated his rage better he could be even more dominant than he already is. But he's already historic and everyone knows it, including him. He's been a diva and I hope he grows up, but he's just so damn good and I've enjoyed rooting for his unique madness.
Yes, Richburg has to be responsible for his own actions, but he was ejected for hitting Norman late and taunting him. In Beckham/Norman round two.
We need OBJ to be a leader, that's all. We are only going to go as far as he takes us. The team feeds off his emotion whether positive or negative. He needs to be cognizant of that.
Link - ( New Window )
I would suggest that Richmond was protecting, or retaliating for Shepard more than Beckham. Even the link shows the hit JN laid on him. Should have been a flag but he was fined. So you may not be making it up, but you may be drawing the wrong conclusion. The only negative thing that article said about Beckham is
If you think that is a negative.
Quote:
In comment 13179746 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
Just be quiet. Some don't believe he's as good as Antonio Brown. Nobody thought anybody was better than Taylor and LT never pulled this nonsense in the field.
You're a clown.
Lol - having a Beckham i see. Need a hug before a kicking net crashing into your fragile psyche?
Kid had to keep on his helmet which is a penalty. Apparently you're too dumb to figure it out just as you're to lost realize Taylor never pulled this baby nonsense on the football field
Your getting boring. All you do is answer a post with insults.
Great player, troubled man.