Get this done. Period. Fix this fucking atrocious OL. Period. Thus team is not improving offensively with the 5-7 OL they currently have. And if they don't improve offensively, they're not going to the playoffs.
Would stabilize our o-line. You should pray 1000 times over we pick a guy in the 2nd rd. near his level. We have the cap flexibility. Its a no brainer.
Put me in the no camp. Almost 34 (OTs can age fast) but, more importantly, the Giants have a pretty good batting avg in the 2nd round. Need those picks (eg TIGHT END).
That said, I'm not having conniption if it does happen.
But I think I'd seriously consider it for a 2nd. It could expedite the OL rebuild and we'd suddenly have a good deal of depth. I hate trading away picks in this sport but this is a scenario where I might be okay with it.
As does Eli. The Giants window is that amount of time to win another Super Bowl. And next year they will be looking to upgrade the line. I would make this move if I were the Giants. Offensive lineman tend to have a longer shelf life. Not to mention the mental aspect for Eli that he won't be looking over his shoulder as he does on every play that takes more than 2 seconds with Flowers at LT.
So was Randle, Austin, Sintim and Moss. Odds are you'll get a good player in the 2nd rd but it's not a guarantee.
Obviously no guarantees in the draft. But Reese, for all his faults, has been great in the 1st and good in the 2nd. Largely disastrous beyond that which is why there are so many holes on this team,
Look at those names I listed. They were 10 year organizational building blocks. Or potentially but for injuries (Smith) and $$ (Linval).
honestly everyone here saying we arent a LT away, i disagree. that defense is definitely good enough to make some noise. If a LT makes everyone better along oline, maybe the run game goes from dogshit to average but the pass pro goes from average to good. those are two upgrades(pass pro and run game) that could have our offense doing big things. if our offense scores 24+ we will win a lot of games. Just get in the playoffs. we dont needto be one piece away from a super bowl team just one piece away from a playoff team. once we are in we have seen eli can win it and has won it with less talent on offense. DO THE TRADE IF ITS THERE. elis window is closing fast and we dont have time for rookies to develop. get a VERY GOOD vet in here and immediately you improve the team WAY MORE than a second rounder could in the 2-3 years eli has left.
That Reese did not draft Strahan et al. But he's been good in his own right since taking over for Ernie. The 2nd round has been kind to NY going back a long time.
honestly everyone here saying we arent a LT away, i disagree. that defense is definitely good enough to make some noise. If a LT makes everyone better along oline, maybe the run game goes from dogshit to average but the pass pro goes from average to good. those are two upgrades(pass pro and run game) that could have our offense doing big things. if our offense scores 24+ we will win a lot of games. Just get in the playoffs. we dont needto be one piece away from a super bowl team just one piece away from a playoff team. once we are in we have seen eli can win it and has won it with less talent on offense. DO THE TRADE IF ITS THERE. elis window is closing fast and we dont have time for rookies to develop. get a VERY GOOD vet in here and immediately you improve the team WAY MORE than a second rounder could in the 2-3 years eli has left.
He's almost 32. I'd be stunned if the Giants did so, especially with Beatty probably set to return after the bye. Beatty and our second is better than Thomas at nearly 32.
He's almost 32. I'd be stunned if the Giants did so, especially with Beatty probably set to return after the bye. Beatty and our second is better than Thomas at nearly 32.
Unless you think Flowers is the answer at LT, and I do not, not making this move is the wrong move. I think Flowers will turn out to be a collosal bust at LT, but his career can be salvaged as a serviceable RT. The NYG have a 3-4 year window with Eli. No draft pick will supplant Flowers at LT because that would mean Reese admits a mistake. A future HOF'er is a different story.
The time to worry about Eli's window was years ago.
They aren't a good enough team where Thomas is going to instantly make them a real contender right now.
Trading a second round pick for an over 30 year old expensive player isn't part of the long term solution now -- and they committed to look at the long term by (unintentionally) punting so many season already.
And I'd do it now. Get him in during the bye week and on the field vs Philly.
Move Flowers to RT and the whole line is improved.
I'd try and get him for less but if it takes a 2nd, I'd still do it. If he helps them reach the playoffs that 2 is around the 50th pick. I can live with giving that up to have an all pro LT for the rest of Eli's career.
You may get 3-4 years out of Thomas would improve the O-line
in a nano second . Gives Flowers more time to develop .
If it jump starts the Run Game I agree no-brainier .
Only problem is that we should have made a move before
the season began . Right now were teetering on missing
the playoffs . If they did it now it would make sense .
No guarantees in the draft so to lose a 2nd rounder at
this juncture will not make or break the franchise ..
But knowing the way we go about things around here I highly
doubt it gets done ...
Front office is lost - 3rd and that's it to bail out
All we need to know about the Apple pick is what the secondary looks like when Wade is forced into duty. CB was a need. WR was also absolutely a need. Anyone who watched this pitiful defense last year would probably agree that a FS was a pretty big need as well. This LB corps has been subpar for a long time.. taking one with upside in the 4th didn't seem like a bad pick to me. Perkins might be the best RB on the team right now and the TE corps is garbage... Adams was worth taking a shot on.
It would have been nice to add another lineman but it's hard to argue that any of the picks we made didn't address needs. We had a good deal of holes and still have some.
Yeah anyone arguing at this point against picking Apple
This year, it might make him more open to making this move. It reminds me of a few years back when he didn't make the move for Tony Gonzalez. Too old, asking too much,salary too high etc.
I think everyone here who was against that trade, in hindsight wish the Giants had made it.
Give Eli an All Pro LT to finish out his career. He's earned that.
I think everyone here who was against that trade, in hindsight wish the Giants had made it.
At the time, certainly tempting. Gonzalez is a legend. But, in hindsight?
Atlanta gave up their 2010 2nd rounder.
In 2010, the Giants drafted in that round...Linval Joseph. A key part of the 2011 SB team and current monster in the NFL (who would still be a Giant but for $$).
Giving up premium picks, unless it's for absolute prime players in their mid-20s, is foolish.
RE: RE: Front office is lost - 3rd and that's it to bail out
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
I'm going to go out on s limb here and suggest that he is talking about the draft you were referring to; The most recent one. You know, the one in which the "morons" didn't select an OL.
Been playing this season? If he's been playing well, or well enough to give Eli more time than EF, it should be worth it.
Think of this from Elis perspective: if he has more time, the has more confidence. More confidence likely means truer passes, and maybe more important it gives a receiver time to get open, with a more confident QB.
If JT can run block well enough so they have a better ground game and not be 2nd or 3rd and forever the options increase.
Plus, just the idea of a probowler at LT has to jack up the play of the OL just to try to play up to that level.
I agree with Sy about not assuming a smooth transition or EF going to the bench(JRs pride/ego).
So EF stays at LT and we have what we have, Beatty comes in and EF goes into RT training, maybe OJ.T., or they pull the trigger.
I'm thinking about Eli and the confidence/ more receiver time thing, and if JT has been good, I'm for making the move ASAP with the extra week.
That said,I give it a 1% chance of happening.
I wouldn't do it. And with Hart's play at RT I'm not sure whether
we'd be better off with a dominant run-blocking OG than a Tackle. Hart's been much better than Newhouse, imo.
And, as Sy mentioned, there's no guarantee that Flowers could move seamlessly to RT...indeed, he's never played RT before as far as I can recall, both in college and the pros. And he doesn't seem like the quickest learner out there.
You can't really bitch about who the Giants took in this last draft
Most if not all of the picks have flashed and wtf is some 3rd or 4th round tackle gonna do for this team right now and even beyond? Odds are nothing. And again, the Giants did well last April.
But we still have a ton of issues: OL, MLB, TE, even WR. We need a guy on the outside opposite OBJ so Shep can play slot, and I don't think that Cruz is the difference maker he once was.
what did the Jets give up to get Brandon Marshall?
For a third and Beatty would be good or a fifth next year also which could become a fourth with performance factrs. There is NO way you trade a second since we have Flowers and Beatty plus Pugh should a rash of injuries hit the LT position. It's a need but also a very good player is available but not at that price plus his contract.
Then comes the question will Thomas make the offense that much better I'm not sure. When I look at this offense Eli is playing like crap, we don't have any speed in the backfield along with the fact Shepard and Cruz are both slot guys. Look around the NFL every OL is being challanged to protect the QB it's not just a Giants problem. I saw Tannehill running for his life yesterday without his legs he would have been sacked 6-8 times, how about Eli that becomes 8-12 and two or three fumbles. The first thing we need to ask ourselves is will Eli really be that much better if no matter the price Thomas is brought in?
But at 32 i wouldn't give away a farm for him. Only reason id consider is the state of this OL..no sugar coating it..theres problems with it if you show a putrid running game that it has shown
Yes he's almost 32 but he's still a top 5 LT IMHO. A future Hall of Famer. Yes he will start to go downhill in a year or two if it hasn't already started happening but a LT of his caliber going downhill is still better than most the league. It would kinda go against the grain of the Giants trying to get younger but then again I think they are seeing the results from a lack of veteran leadership. A 2nd rounder could be a great TE or OG towards the future. We don't know the status on Beatty. This isn't Madden so I don't think he'd step right in no matter how good he is. His contract isn't exactly cheap and he doesn't want to leave the Browns. Not sure how he would play in NY when he wants to stay in Cleveland.
Really tough call.
How many years does he have left on his contract? Cap/salary?
Other than his age, you dont want to give away a high draft pick for a guy who's going to hit FA after a year or 2.
On the positive side, if Giants think he still has the goods, they can
(1) avoid outbidding other teams in FA for a decent free agent, or investing a high draft pick on a guy who may or may not work out, and would probably need time to develop
(2) SB would be carried by the Browns, lessening the cap hit
(3) An "older" contract would likely be cheaper than a newer contract (salaries increase considerably every year), reducing the future cap number even further
(4) Improve the team immediately
(5) Reduce their needs, which I think they still have a few, that need to be addressed in FA/draft.
I don't think we are only one offensive tackle away from being a good team.
I think solidifying this line would be a huge step in the right direction. It improves both tackle positions with Flowers sliding over.
A solid OL makes this a playoff team.
Other than QB, its hard for any single player to change/improve the team single-handedly, but its a step in the right direction, and reduces other needs.
RE: RE: RE: Front office is lost - 3rd and that's it to bail out
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
It's a response to YOUR post. You're the one who posted "Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft". WTF were you talking about?
I've listed the lineman for years. Who would you give up doesn't make an sense nor does the hindsight comment as I've been posting lineman names for years.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
The Giants will exist after Eli and what's to say Eli doesn't leave in two years.
No to a 2nd rounder for Thomas. Anything less, ok. Then, do you move Flowers to RT? How is that helping Richburg, who seems to be having a rough year and seems to be the problem with the running game.
What I don't understand is when Hart took over for Newhouse, he and Jerry seemed to be doing a good job run blocking - opening holes and moving their assignments backwards. What has happened? It might be the lousy inside handoff or just piss poor design of plays.
In three or four years when those guys are done, so will Eli be done. If we don't protect him, we diminish Eli. Four years of this putrid football has been enough. If the current trend contI use, we will finish either in 3rd or 4th of the NFC East and another year of no playoffs.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
Seems like you've changed trajectory on your complaint
If you're saying the Giants don't draft enough on the OL it's one thing, implying they don't at all is another.
Not to mention most of the NFL builds their line the same way - draft picks for a few, FA for some others, reserves drafted in later rounds. The bigger problem is that we haven't *hit* on a reserve OL in some time.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
You really are a dope. You said they didn't draft any linemen. Clearly, you are wrong.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
You really are a dope. You said they didn't draft any linemen. Clearly, you are wrong.
Trolling around is your game, we get it. They drafted nobody this past year so I'm correct you dope. A few bodies since 2009 is your positon lol. Clearly you don't follow this team too closely and honestly can't figure out the OL has been a problem for years. You see bodies wearing the uniform so chalk it up as attention. Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
Another fella doesn't realize they didn't draft anybody. Who was the big free agent signing this past offseason.
When you add three guys over six years. That's not paying attention. Compare it to how many bodies have been drafted for WR and HB that never contribute or contributed. The lists is a mile long and good linemen were passed up. Hence, the mess of today.
Trolling around is your game, we get it. They drafted nobody this past year so I'm correct you dope. A few bodies since 2009 is your positon lol. Clearly you don't follow this team too closely and honestly can't figure out the OL has been a problem for years. You see bodies wearing the uniform so chalk it up as attention. Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
It took 3 posts for you to admit you were talking about this year. Now back to my original post. I'll type slowly for you.
Which lineman would you have drafted this year? What round would you have used to select him? Which player that was drafted would you give up for your choice? There have been 7 games played this year so you have the benefit of hindsight to make your selection.
They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
Another fella doesn't realize they didn't draft anybody. Who was the big free agent signing this past offseason.
When you add three guys over six years. That's not paying attention. Compare it to how many bodies have been drafted for WR and HB that never contribute or contributed. The lists is a mile long and good linemen were passed up. Hence, the mess of today.
Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
we got Weston Richburg, Landon Collins and Sterling Shepard as second round picks -- you really want to give up a second rounder for an expensive old lineman ? It really doesn't seem very prudent to me - that's the kind of move that kills the cap and creates a problem two or three years down the road.
Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
I watch ever Fla State game and he was brought in and out often. Think he dropped to Round 7 b/c he was a four year starter? I know more than you fella so stick shit comment in your foul mouth.
we got Weston Richburg, Landon Collins and Sterling Shepard as second round picks -- you really want to give up a second rounder for an expensive old lineman ? It really doesn't seem very prudent to me - that's the kind of move that kills the cap and creates a problem two or three years down the road.
Not at that age. Considering the hit rate of 3rd Rounders though. I might do it. No way for a 2nd or better.
Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
I watch ever Fla State game and he was brought in and out often. Think he dropped to Round 7 b/c he was a four year starter? I know more than you fella so stick shit comment in your foul mouth.
and get pissed the Giants, who were among many other interested teams, didn't sign him.
I'm curious what this teams looks like if we don't have Snacks or Jenkins and instead have a top paid Guard or RT. I'm guessing we still don't run the ball all that well and we either get run on, or passed on at much higher rates.
Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
Not going to dig for every post I've made regarding the OL appease your type skippy. The OL stinks so who knows what you have followed over the years or are aware of today. You sound like a fantasy kid. Bug off
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
Not going to dig for every post I've made regarding the OL appease your type skippy. The OL stinks so who knows what you have followed over the years or are aware of today. You sound like a fantasy kid. Bug off
Listen you pathetic child, I have seen over 1000 Giants games in my life. I have never played one second of FF, nor do I ever intend to..Suspend the nastiness, grow up and answer the facts put forth to you. READ the posts comprehensively instead of perusing them in passing and opting instead to trot out the usual standby cliches that say nothing..
and believe the Giants have paid special attention to the OL despite the history which is the direct result of what we have today. Bravo and you're wrong
But we still have a ton of issues: OL, MLB, TE, even WR. We need a guy on the outside opposite OBJ so Shep can play slot, and I don't think that Cruz is the difference maker he once was.
I think of this year as somewhere in between 2004 and 2005. We have some pieces in place but the team is an off-season away from fielding a well rounded team. That doesn't mean the Giants can't make noise this season and I don't think the D needs much work at all other than more DE talent.
for Thomas? I know I wouldn't. When you hit on a 2nd rounder like it appears we did, it's huge for the team. Of course you need to factor in that we don't always hit, but Reese seems to be a very good early rounds drafter.
Thomas is a pro, and might even improve after being placed on a team that actually belongs in the NFL. I think he'd elevate the Giants to a 10-6 type team.
Making the playoffs matters. This team doesn't figure to be a contender buy a playoff appearance after four years of futility is a good way to enter 2017.
for Thomas? I know I wouldn't. When you hit on a 2nd rounder like it appears we did, it's huge for the team.
...and when you miss on some high draft picks on the OL, it kills you. We need a solid running game more than we need Shepard. Please tell me.. what exactly is Shepard doing for us right now? A catch here and there? This is not a knock on Shepard because other than one game, OBJ is ordinary too. All due to our O-line.
Right now, I would trade Eli and OBJ for Derek Carr, Crabtree and a solid O-line that can run the ball. Before you jump through the computer, just think about it for a minute. This offense would be more efficient.
I will argue the opposite though, I believe fans undervalue the importance of picks. I feel(I could be wrong) that most of the teams with sustained success have 2 things...an elite QB and a team riddled with their own draft picks.
I also feel like this might be one of those situations where I'd trade a 2 for Thomas because of how bad we need it. I'm just pointing out how big it is for a team when they hit on a guy like Shepard or Collins.
This guy can play another 4 years at a high level in comparison of what we have. I would be more comfortable with trading a 3rd rounder and a 6th the following year than giving up a 2nd. If he helps to get us into the playoffs it becomes a late 3rd. Eli needs to feel safe out there as of now I do not see that happening. My only concern is the Browns are on their 5th QB. Where is the pressure coming from that has knocked out the 1st 4.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
Get this done. Period. Fix this fucking atrocious OL. Period. Thus team is not improving offensively with the 5-7 OL they currently have. And if they don't improve offensively, they're not going to the playoffs.
.
It is about a porous run blocking line as anybody in
this league.
I laugh when people say so and so is having a 'good year',
yeah unless you don't count run blocking.
Then their best 'running back' gets benched as soon as
Jennings comes back. Darkwa had 55 yards on 11 carries,
then 48 yards on 12 carries. His reward is the bench,
I just don't get it myself. I am not saying Darkwa is some star, just better than what they have running the ball.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
If people are saying that we have "ignored" the O-line then I would agree with you. That is false. The issue is whether we addressed it effectively. So, we used 2 first round picks...wonderful. If the O-line is playing at the bottom of the league, then we have a serious problem. We knew the O-line was a problem despite those picks going into camp this year. So, from that perspective it looks like (from the outside) that we ignored their performance last season and just rolled into this year with the same under performing group.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: So they didn't draft Flowers?
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
.
How about the right side of the line, really two backups there. I consider Jerry a backup myself, always been a pillow as a run blocker. Some people on here think he is better than he actually is.
There's also a decent chance that whoever we draft in the second round
The more I think about it, the more I'd be willing to give up a 2nd rounder for Joe Thomas.
It's not like we have Eli Manning for another decade. We have hopefully 4-5 more years of Eli.
That reason alone, makes it worth giving up a 2nd rounder for a T Joe Thomas. You're getting an All-Pro Tackle to protect our franchise QB. We may miss out on a good young player, but we could also miss on the #2 pick ala Marvin Austin.
For the next two years (that's what he's under contract for after this year) We would have Thomas, Pugh, Richburg, Jerry?, and Flowers.
We won't have to worry about our Tackle position in the offseason and can use a first round pick on a stud pass rusher or some place else.
I'd be surprised if this happens, but I'm glad the Giants are one of the teams listed as interested and I would definitely give up a #2 pick for Thomas.
I wouldn't eat his contract AND hand over a #2 pick
I would give up a 2
EddieNYG : 1:52 pm : link : reply
The more I think about it, the more I'd be willing to give up a 2nd rounder for Joe Thomas.
It's not like we have Eli Manning for another decade. We have hopefully 4-5 more years of Eli.
That reason alone, makes it worth giving up a 2nd rounder for a T Joe Thomas. You're getting an All-Pro Tackle to protect our franchise QB. We may miss out on a good young player, but we could also miss on the #2 pick ala Marvin Austin.
For the next two years (that's what he's under contract for after this year) We would have Thomas, Pugh, Richburg, Jerry?, and Flowers.
We won't have to worry about our Tackle position in the offseason and can use a first round pick on a stud pass rusher or some place else.
I'd be surprised if this happens, but I'm glad the Giants are one of the teams listed as interested and I would definitely give up a #2 pick for Thomas.
The Goal is a Lombardi we have the QB and the Defense .
We will have 3-4 more chances before we are looking for the next Eli . a 2nd round pick is steep but not if it puts us
in contention for the next 3-4 years
Browns coach Hue Jackson insists the team isn't going to trade LT Joe Thomas.
"We. Are. Not. Going. To. Trade. Joe. Thomas," were how Jackson's words were stylized by the team's Twitter account. It's unequivocal, but we'd guess everything remains negotiable for the tanking Browns. Jackson undoubtedly values Thomas' leadership on a young team, but not even an All-Pro left tackle has been able to prevent every Browns quarterback from getting hurt. Trading Thomas makes sense if the opportunity presents itself.
We have maybe 2 more good years from Eli after this. Now or never.
You say "but a 2nd is too much to give"? Take your 1rst rounder trade back get a later first rounder and a second.
Id be all over him for a 2nd. Move Flowers to RT, See if Hart is an upgrade at RG.
Shit its early enough he comes in you get 10 wins and make a push THIS YEAR. Plus you have the pieces to content until Eli's arm falls off.
Defense looks good, we have cap room, young guys look great.
Do it JR...
That said, I'm not having conniption if it does happen.
NO!
They're a lot closer than you think but OT is a primary need.
DE and TE are the others. Secondary needs are outside WR, LB, RG, and RB.
I think solidifying this line would be a huge step in the right direction. It improves both tackle positions with Flowers sliding over.
A solid OL makes this a playoff team.
NO!
Would you spend a 2nd rounder if it meant a net positive effect on the other 4 OL? With Eli's window, I think I would be ok giving up a 2nd.
It just wouldn't be smart.
NO!
The price is neither here nor there. Nobody is giving them a 2nd.
It just wouldn't be smart.
So was Randle, Austin, Sintim and Moss. Odds are you'll get a good player in the 2nd rd but it's not a guarantee.
But also not a GM so my opinion is weak and suspect at best too.
Obviously no guarantees in the draft. But Reese, for all his faults, has been great in the 1st and good in the 2nd. Largely disastrous beyond that which is why there are so many holes on this team,
Look at those names I listed. They were 10 year organizational building blocks. Or potentially but for injuries (Smith) and $$ (Linval).
Great post, absolutely agree.
LTs, even the greats, are typically done at 33 or 34 if you're lucky.
We've been pretty good in the 2nd round.
Unless you think Flowers is the answer at LT, and I do not, not making this move is the wrong move. I think Flowers will turn out to be a collosal bust at LT, but his career can be salvaged as a serviceable RT. The NYG have a 3-4 year window with Eli. No draft pick will supplant Flowers at LT because that would mean Reese admits a mistake. A future HOF'er is a different story.
Trading a second round pick for an over 30 year old expensive player isn't part of the long term solution now -- and they committed to look at the long term by (unintentionally) punting so many season already.
Move Flowers to RT and the whole line is improved.
I'd try and get him for less but if it takes a 2nd, I'd still do it. If he helps them reach the playoffs that 2 is around the 50th pick. I can live with giving that up to have an all pro LT for the rest of Eli's career.
in a nano second . Gives Flowers more time to develop .
If it jump starts the Run Game I agree no-brainier .
Only problem is that we should have made a move before
the season began . Right now were teetering on missing
the playoffs . If they did it now it would make sense .
No guarantees in the draft so to lose a 2nd rounder at
this juncture will not make or break the franchise ..
But knowing the way we go about things around here I highly
doubt it gets done ...
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
It would have been nice to add another lineman but it's hard to argue that any of the picks we made didn't address needs. We had a good deal of holes and still have some.
It does suck, however, that Conklin looks not good but great. He might make the pro-bowl. Really wish Tenn didn't leapfrog NY on draft day.
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Unfortunately NYG will go forward with this very unstable group of OL.
They already gave up their #1 for Bradford.
I think everyone here who was against that trade, in hindsight wish the Giants had made it.
Give Eli an All Pro LT to finish out his career. He's earned that.
At the time, certainly tempting. Gonzalez is a legend. But, in hindsight?
Atlanta gave up their 2010 2nd rounder.
In 2010, the Giants drafted in that round...Linval Joseph. A key part of the 2011 SB team and current monster in the NFL (who would still be a Giant but for $$).
Giving up premium picks, unless it's for absolute prime players in their mid-20s, is foolish.
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the entire front office.
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
Unfortunately NYG will go forward with this very unstable group of OL.
Seamless? Not likely, but I still see Thomas at LT and Flowers at RT as a net gain even if Flowers continues to struggle.
I'd pull the trigger at a more reasonable cost.
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In comment 13188163 Giants2012 said:
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the entire front office.
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
I'm going to go out on s limb here and suggest that he is talking about the draft you were referring to; The most recent one. You know, the one in which the "morons" didn't select an OL.
Think of this from Elis perspective: if he has more time, the has more confidence. More confidence likely means truer passes, and maybe more important it gives a receiver time to get open, with a more confident QB.
If JT can run block well enough so they have a better ground game and not be 2nd or 3rd and forever the options increase.
Plus, just the idea of a probowler at LT has to jack up the play of the OL just to try to play up to that level.
I agree with Sy about not assuming a smooth transition or EF going to the bench(JRs pride/ego).
So EF stays at LT and we have what we have, Beatty comes in and EF goes into RT training, maybe OJ.T., or they pull the trigger.
I'm thinking about Eli and the confidence/ more receiver time thing, and if JT has been good, I'm for making the move ASAP with the extra week.
That said,I give it a 1% chance of happening.
And, as Sy mentioned, there's no guarantee that Flowers could move seamlessly to RT...indeed, he's never played RT before as far as I can recall, both in college and the pros. And he doesn't seem like the quickest learner out there.
Then comes the question will Thomas make the offense that much better I'm not sure. When I look at this offense Eli is playing like crap, we don't have any speed in the backfield along with the fact Shepard and Cruz are both slot guys. Look around the NFL every OL is being challanged to protect the QB it's not just a Giants problem. I saw Tannehill running for his life yesterday without his legs he would have been sacked 6-8 times, how about Eli that becomes 8-12 and two or three fumbles. The first thing we need to ask ourselves is will Eli really be that much better if no matter the price Thomas is brought in?
NO!
How long will Eli play?
On the other hand, a 3rd and a 4th would be a better risk-reward. Sometimes teams are tempted by more picks even if they're worth less.
Really tough call.
On the positive side, if Giants think he still has the goods, they can
(1) avoid outbidding other teams in FA for a decent free agent, or investing a high draft pick on a guy who may or may not work out, and would probably need time to develop
(2) SB would be carried by the Browns, lessening the cap hit
(3) An "older" contract would likely be cheaper than a newer contract (salaries increase considerably every year), reducing the future cap number even further
(4) Improve the team immediately
(5) Reduce their needs, which I think they still have a few, that need to be addressed in FA/draft.
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I don't think we are only one offensive tackle away from being a good team.
I think solidifying this line would be a huge step in the right direction. It improves both tackle positions with Flowers sliding over.
A solid OL makes this a playoff team.
Other than QB, its hard for any single player to change/improve the team single-handedly, but its a step in the right direction, and reduces other needs.
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In comment 13188163 Giants2012 said:
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the entire front office.
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
It's a response to YOUR post. You're the one who posted "Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft". WTF were you talking about?
Now, for a third, maybe. For a fourth, absolutely. I still don't think they're moving him though.
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In comment 13188211 PeterinAtlanta said:
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In comment 13188163 Giants2012 said:
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the entire front office.
Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft
Name the lineman you'd take in what round and who do you give up. You have 7 games of hindsight.
Wtf does that mean? What lineman when? Last draft, two years ago? Next year?
It's a response to YOUR post. You're the one who posted "Morons didn't even select one lineman in the draft". WTF were you talking about?
I've listed the lineman for years. Who would you give up doesn't make an sense nor does the hindsight comment as I've been posting lineman names for years.
No to a 2nd rounder for Thomas. Anything less, ok. Then, do you move Flowers to RT? How is that helping Richburg, who seems to be having a rough year and seems to be the problem with the running game.
What I don't understand is when Hart took over for Newhouse, he and Jerry seemed to be doing a good job run blocking - opening holes and moving their assignments backwards. What has happened? It might be the lousy inside handoff or just piss poor design of plays.
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
Not to mention most of the NFL builds their line the same way - draft picks for a few, FA for some others, reserves drafted in later rounds. The bigger problem is that we haven't *hit* on a reserve OL in some time.
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They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
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In comment 13188478 PeterinAtlanta said:
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They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
You are so funny. Haha. Are you kidding me? Obviosuly you're not. Look at the draft history. I've listed it endless times. Since 2009 they've drafted only three offensive linemen in the first three rounds which equates to three linemen, no right side and no depth. Hindsight my tail. Several have been begging for linemen since 2011 and the product shows.
Name the right side and depth. Can you even name the backups drafted? There are none
You really are a dope. You said they didn't draft any linemen. Clearly, you are wrong.
Trolling around is your game, we get it. They drafted nobody this past year so I'm correct you dope. A few bodies since 2009 is your positon lol. Clearly you don't follow this team too closely and honestly can't figure out the OL has been a problem for years. You see bodies wearing the uniform so chalk it up as attention. Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
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They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
Another fella doesn't realize they didn't draft anybody. Who was the big free agent signing this past offseason.
When you add three guys over six years. That's not paying attention. Compare it to how many bodies have been drafted for WR and HB that never contribute or contributed. The lists is a mile long and good linemen were passed up. Hence, the mess of today.
Trolling around is your game, we get it. They drafted nobody this past year so I'm correct you dope. A few bodies since 2009 is your positon lol. Clearly you don't follow this team too closely and honestly can't figure out the OL has been a problem for years. You see bodies wearing the uniform so chalk it up as attention. Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
It took 3 posts for you to admit you were talking about this year. Now back to my original post. I'll type slowly for you.
Which lineman would you have drafted this year? What round would you have used to select him? Which player that was drafted would you give up for your choice? There have been 7 games played this year so you have the benefit of hindsight to make your selection.
Do you understand now?
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In comment 13188478 PeterinAtlanta said:
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They didn't draft Richburg? They didn't draft Pugh? They didn't draft Hart? 4 of the 5 starting OL were drafted. But you call them "Morons" for not drafting OL?
Good lawd. I just don't understand why people just don't get it..Does it matter if Reese did indeed fuck up years ago as it pertains to the OL? It's over with. Done. Finito. The last bunch of years he's addressing it..Enough already with this crap. It really is getting old..
Another fella doesn't realize they didn't draft anybody. Who was the big free agent signing this past offseason.
When you add three guys over six years. That's not paying attention. Compare it to how many bodies have been drafted for WR and HB that never contribute or contributed. The lists is a mile long and good linemen were passed up. Hence, the mess of today.
Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
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Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
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In comment 13188507 PeterinAtlanta said:
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Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
I watch ever Fla State game and he was brought in and out often. Think he dropped to Round 7 b/c he was a four year starter? I know more than you fella so stick shit comment in your foul mouth.
Not at that age. Considering the hit rate of 3rd Rounders though. I might do it. No way for a 2nd or better.
Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
Osemele, thanks
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In comment 13188556 Giants2012 said:
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In comment 13188507 PeterinAtlanta said:
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Heck, Bobby Hart wasn't even a starter in college yet he's already a starter hereb/c there is no depth. Oh yeah, great job.
Ah, hate to break it to you, but Hart started playing (starting) midway through his freshman year at FSU as a 17 year old. He started a LT and moved to RT and was basically a 4 year starter on one of the best programs in Div 1. So obviously you know jack shit.
I watch ever Fla State game and he was brought in and out often. Think he dropped to Round 7 b/c he was a four year starter? I know more than you fella so stick shit comment in your foul mouth.
Hart Bio - ( New Window )
I'm curious what this teams looks like if we don't have Snacks or Jenkins and instead have a top paid Guard or RT. I'm guessing we still don't run the ball all that well and we either get run on, or passed on at much higher rates.
This wasn't a 1 offseason fix.
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Who the fuck was abailable to sign? Okung? Penn wanted back in Oakland. Jake Long is a cripple..WHO was available that wasn't snapped up immediately after FA started while we were fixing our historically bad D? WHO???
Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
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Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
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In comment 13188677 Big Blue '56 said:
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Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
Not going to dig for every post I've made regarding the OL appease your type skippy. The OL stinks so who knows what you have followed over the years or are aware of today. You sound like a fantasy kid. Bug off
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In comment 13188695 Giants2012 said:
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In comment 13188677 Big Blue '56 said:
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Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Since you had no answer to my fact-based responses, You gave an answer that is typical of a person who has none. A vacuous response that says absolutely nothing..Throw out the "obviously you're part of the group...." line that somehow and mysteriously is dupposed to make some point..I gave you facts, now refute them..You said, "Osemele, thanks." I provided you with info that showed you were wrong. Refute that instead of trying to escape tge conversation with the handy copout ("obviously you're part if the group") indigenous to those who have nothing to refute..We're done here..
Not going to dig for every post I've made regarding the OL appease your type skippy. The OL stinks so who knows what you have followed over the years or are aware of today. You sound like a fantasy kid. Bug off
Listen you pathetic child, I have seen over 1000 Giants games in my life. I have never played one second of FF, nor do I ever intend to..Suspend the nastiness, grow up and answer the facts put forth to you. READ the posts comprehensively instead of perusing them in passing and opting instead to trot out the usual standby cliches that say nothing..
I think of this year as somewhere in between 2004 and 2005. We have some pieces in place but the team is an off-season away from fielding a well rounded team. That doesn't mean the Giants can't make noise this season and I don't think the D needs much work at all other than more DE talent.
Has it been 9 years since Staley was drafted. Iirc, didn't a bunch on here feel he was taken too high or, am I misremembering?
Making the playoffs matters. This team doesn't figure to be a contender buy a playoff appearance after four years of futility is a good way to enter 2017.
Better blocking means defenses have to respect our ability to run, something that currently is not the case.
...and when you miss on some high draft picks on the OL, it kills you. We need a solid running game more than we need Shepard. Please tell me.. what exactly is Shepard doing for us right now? A catch here and there? This is not a knock on Shepard because other than one game, OBJ is ordinary too. All due to our O-line.
Right now, I would trade Eli and OBJ for Derek Carr, Crabtree and a solid O-line that can run the ball. Before you jump through the computer, just think about it for a minute. This offense would be more efficient.
The draft is crucial to team building, but fans tend to over value individual picks. Thomas is a known quantity in an area of tremendous weakness.
This team is in need of a change to a culture of winning. So is this player. It could be a great match.
I also feel like this might be one of those situations where I'd trade a 2 for Thomas because of how bad we need it. I'm just pointing out how big it is for a team when they hit on a guy like Shepard or Collins.
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Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
It is about a porous run blocking line as anybody in
this league.
I laugh when people say so and so is having a 'good year',
yeah unless you don't count run blocking.
Then their best 'running back' gets benched as soon as
Jennings comes back. Darkwa had 55 yards on 11 carries,
then 48 yards on 12 carries. His reward is the bench,
I just don't get it myself. I am not saying Darkwa is some star, just better than what they have running the ball.
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
If people are saying that we have "ignored" the O-line then I would agree with you. That is false. The issue is whether we addressed it effectively. So, we used 2 first round picks...wonderful. If the O-line is playing at the bottom of the league, then we have a serious problem. We knew the O-line was a problem despite those picks going into camp this year. So, from that perspective it looks like (from the outside) that we ignored their performance last season and just rolled into this year with the same under performing group.
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In comment 13188677 Big Blue '56 said:
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Osemele, thanks
Again, re-read my post. FA started March 9th..Osemele was assigned less than a day later while we were fixing our pathetic D..You're quite welcome..
Obviously you're part of that group that believe attention was really given to the OL over the years. The line's play speaks for itself without even digging into the history. You think otherwise, good for you. The line stinks for reasons which escape you.
Well currently we have two first round picks and one second round pick starting on the OL.
It doesn't really fit the narrative that the OL has been forsaken.
How about the right side of the line, really two backups there. I consider Jerry a backup myself, always been a pillow as a run blocker. Some people on here think he is better than he actually is.
It also doesn't matter much to hit on Shepard if the line is too poor to take advantage of his talents. Thomas makes Shepard better. Collins too.
If he was 28 or 29, I would give up a 2nd.
If he was 28 or 29, I would give up a 2nd.
If Thomas was 28, I'd part with a 1st
It also doesn't matter much to hit on Shepard if the line is too poor to take advantage of his talents. Thomas makes Shepard better. Collins too.
Why does anyone believe that Thomas will play until he's 35?
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is only here for four years, like Thomas would figure to be.
It also doesn't matter much to hit on Shepard if the line is too poor to take advantage of his talents. Thomas makes Shepard better. Collins too.
Why does anyone believe that Thomas will play until he's 35?
Even if he only plays here at a high level for two years, he's worth it.
The offensive line is an albatross. The only reason the team isn't 2-5 is Eli and McAdoo realizing this and tailoring the offense accordingly.
It's not like we have Eli Manning for another decade. We have hopefully 4-5 more years of Eli.
That reason alone, makes it worth giving up a 2nd rounder for a T Joe Thomas. You're getting an All-Pro Tackle to protect our franchise QB. We may miss out on a good young player, but we could also miss on the #2 pick ala Marvin Austin.
For the next two years (that's what he's under contract for after this year) We would have Thomas, Pugh, Richburg, Jerry?, and Flowers.
We won't have to worry about our Tackle position in the offseason and can use a first round pick on a stud pass rusher or some place else.
I'd be surprised if this happens, but I'm glad the Giants are one of the teams listed as interested and I would definitely give up a #2 pick for Thomas.
EddieNYG : 1:52 pm : link : reply
The more I think about it, the more I'd be willing to give up a 2nd rounder for Joe Thomas.
It's not like we have Eli Manning for another decade. We have hopefully 4-5 more years of Eli.
That reason alone, makes it worth giving up a 2nd rounder for a T Joe Thomas. You're getting an All-Pro Tackle to protect our franchise QB. We may miss out on a good young player, but we could also miss on the #2 pick ala Marvin Austin.
For the next two years (that's what he's under contract for after this year) We would have Thomas, Pugh, Richburg, Jerry?, and Flowers.
We won't have to worry about our Tackle position in the offseason and can use a first round pick on a stud pass rusher or some place else.
I'd be surprised if this happens, but I'm glad the Giants are one of the teams listed as interested and I would definitely give up a #2 pick for Thomas.
The Goal is a Lombardi we have the QB and the Defense .
We will have 3-4 more chances before we are looking for the next Eli . a 2nd round pick is steep but not if it puts us
in contention for the next 3-4 years
Browns coach Hue Jackson insists the team isn't going to trade LT Joe Thomas.
"We. Are. Not. Going. To. Trade. Joe. Thomas," were how Jackson's words were stylized by the team's Twitter account. It's unequivocal, but we'd guess everything remains negotiable for the tanking Browns. Jackson undoubtedly values Thomas' leadership on a young team, but not even an All-Pro left tackle has been able to prevent every Browns quarterback from getting hurt. Trading Thomas makes sense if the opportunity presents itself.