Had it rough last night dealing with a teen daughter whose emotions are all over the map. Hell, last night? Last year or so. Just occasional flare-ups, but man, when they happen. Damn.
Dropped her off at school. There was no talking in the car on the way. Then she just ... got out. Nothing. Trying to relax, stay calm, not let that bother me, but WOW, kids know how to hurt you. lol
Anyhow, I get to work and no fewer than 3 co-workers are talking about their nightmares at home. Coincidentally, they all have boys.
The one guy told his story: today is his youngest son's birthday (turns 14). His wife got up early to make a nice birthday breakfast. They eat, it's nice, and afterward the older son (almost 16) reaches across the table and snags his brother's phone, on which he'd been text away on (at 6:30 a.m.). No words spoken, the younger brother launched himself across the kitchen table and tackled the older brother back and out of the chair. They landed in a pile and THEN the mayhem was under way. The Dad said the worst part was that he wife was VERY upset by it all (he was laughing, but was also clearly still pissed off).
Next story up: Mom of 4 (yes 4) boys, the oldest being in 3rd grade. She's a country girl, and she and her husband are old-school. Basically, a policy of "you've got a problem with each other? deal with it and don't bother me or your father with your trivial crap" in their home. (Probably needed with 4 young boys.) She says last night she and her sons were visiting her mother's house, where a cousin (boy) was also visiting. Apparently a skirmish broke out and the 4-year-old cousin bit her eldest son on the back. That boy had been warned (over the weekend, by the grandmother) NOT to "deal with it" but instead to report the wrongdoing. So being a good kid, he went to his mother. Meanwhile, the gfrandmother is asking, and asking, and asking the young cousin why he bit the other kid. The grandmother couldn't get an answer so ... she made the young cousin kneel and "pray on why you were compelled to bite your cousin in the back." My co-worker said she asked her mother "what the hell you're doing," then took the young cousin (her nephew) into another room and "beat the hell out of him" (she said that meant spanking, for the biting) and told him the next time he bites his older cousin, she'll allow him to beat the hell out of him too.
Third co-worker is siting there, shaking his head, grinning. He's got three boys, ages 12, 9 and 6. He talked in general about the daily mayhem and how when they recently bought their new house, a requirement was a basement rec room sort of place where they could basically throw the boys and all their stuff and let them have at it. He then got his phone out and shared with us a brief video of his 3 sons basically beating the shit out of each other, with him laughing in the background while videotaping.
That guy, from a big family himself, laughed when he counted on 2 fingers the number of years I have "until she's at college," he said, referring to my daughter.
My son is a freshman in college and away at school for the first semester. I miss him. He was relatively easy, and being 18, while he and I have always been close, it's starting to feel a slight bit more like we're becoming friends, too. Of couirse, I still give him shit when I think he needs to hear it, but ... so much more smooth than with this girl of mine.
It's a struggle, man! You love your children, but there are moments in a day when you're just trying to get through, peace intact, and especially when you are suddenly outnumbered in the house (2 fenmales v. ME!).
Yes, this thread is a form of therapy. After work, my wife has a college class tonight, and after my daughter's swim practice, it's just me and her for nearly 4 hours. I'm thinking maybe a pizza ... possibly some scotch (lol) ... and almost certainly a retreat down into our basement with the big-screen, a nice recliner and a fluffy blanket. I'm fragile, dammit!
Pray for me.
:)
Yes - the world would be a better place if nobody had kids...
Why do we even need to define this? You want to hit/bite/kick, there's a chance you're getting your ass beat. I'm also in favor of the country couple - sort it out yourself until you see blood.
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Has to be better without kids. Travel. Work less. More money. Easier to retire. People work their entire lives just to spend their money on someone else.
Yes - the world would be a better place if nobody had kids...
Well, with certain people not reproducing it would probably be a better place.
She's a wonderful, loving, smart kid. But very dramatic and kind of hitting those Veruca Salt elements and I feel those parts are on us as parents. I dunno. I'm doing the best I can.
With our girl becoming more ... I'll say, emotional lately ... and with me being on the more "traditional" side of things for a Dad, the clashing, it has begun.
In the name of the father, the son, and the holy spirit, Amen.
My Dad drove for Green Bus lines and was a real bad ass in every sense of the word. Grew up in Queens as a street kid, quit school in 7th grade and went to work at age 13. Got us out of Queens and threw every penny he ever earned into buying a campground in 'nowhere' Massachusetts at the height of the gas crisis in 1974. Despite no education, he started a very successful business that he still runs today.
He raised three boys that went to college, never got into trouble (I never got caught) and who respected others. I never appreciated his approach until I had my kids (3 Sons). They're grown up and I love them to death, but they are very much a part of the 'give it to me' slacker culture. It's my fault... I thought being a good parent was using intellect and reason. When problems popped-up, I shielded them and took them on myself. My mistake... young kids need to get a few scars to understand the consequences of bad decisions. Sorry Dad, you had it right. I wish I had gotten a couple of pairs of boxing gloves.
ok, just kidding, I have 14 year old twin daughters who think I'm an ATM machine and cell phone bill payer, they think my wife is a cab driver, and think school is an inconvenient medium for them to see their friends and make social plans.
they're really awesome, good-hearted, smart kids, but holy shit it's hard to connect with teenagers in a meaningful way that doesn't elicit an eye roll. It's rare to find a teenager who has big picture considerations in mind and makes sacrifices to achieve them beyond how they're going to get home from the JV football game Friday night.
I don't push, when I see their grades and if there is a problem with them I address it, I talk to them briefly and as adults about the risk they face with irresponsible behavior and make sure they know trust is earned but at the same time they have to be 100% confident I won't judge them for mistakes, there will be repercussions, but they have to feel like they can tell me the truth or it's going to be harder on all of us.
Lastly, I feel like every instinct I have as a parent is the wrong one and I'm fortunate to have my wife who is much less emotional than me and more level-headed.
Once you lose the threats of Santa and/or Jesus you're advantage is over as a parent. Shit gets real at that point.
I take back every bad thing I ever said about you.
:)
Not remotely true. My life got better with my daughter. You can still travel with kids, and I'd argue can work less since your priorities shift. I've also learned retiring with a boatload of money isn't something that's necessarily a good thing. You can die right after you retire, then what? I'd much rather spend my money on my family.
as much as behavior of my toddler can be frustrating, I put things in perspective - I have a 20 year old cousin who is autistic and goes around talking to strangers about his favourite playboy models and other inappropriate subjects....another who is a drug addicted schizophrenic who posts rambling nonsensical diatribes on facebook and is constantly trying to hit up family members for cash. another young cousin with severe depression and addiction issues killed herself by jumping in front of a train.
my kids are touch wood alive, healthy and meeting developmental milestones. so even if the toddler is an occasional a-hole, I am still blessed.
Getting up at 5am to make $5.15/hour (not a typo) at Dunkin Donuts one summer to save up for a snowboard I desperately wanted helped develop, I like to think, some character which served me then and later in life.
An alternative approach, if they're attractive enough, would be to spoil them absolutely as much as possible, and hope they turn into a reality TV star or socialite a la Paris Hilton/Kardashians. That's when you cash in!
As someone with 4 little kids, I'd have to say you are absolutely correct. The sacrifices you have to make are nearly unbearable at times. There are a bunch of recent studies showing that people raising kids (especially young kids) are less happy than people without kids.
But while having kids makes life much harder it also makes it also provides so much more meaning to life. For me that's really the trade-off - "qualify of life" (i.e. money, freedom, etc) vs. a more meaningful life.
I also have to believe as the kids grow older the "happiness" equation shifts heavily towards those who have kids. I very much look forward to having adult relationships with my kids, and spending time with grandkids when I'm older....and I can't image growing older without any kids for my wife and I to share our lives with and to pass something of us along after we're gone.
I completely endorse you never reproducing, too much douche in the world as it is.
Old Dirty Beckham : 10:20 am : link : reply
Has to be better without kids. Travel. Work less. More money. Easier to retire. People work their entire lives just to spend their money on someone else.
jlukes is 100% right that life is much better if everyone else didn't have kids because other people are awful.
However having kids personally, knocking up the wife and bringing a human to the world to raise and take care of is the only thing that keeps some of us from not being a complete dicklick and/or awful person like everyone else. I've improved myself ten fold in person no matter what it looks like on BBI. Not because I wanted to but because I had to for KidFilthy's sake.
Both are really good kids..."A" students but man it is alot of work.
I've always been very close with my daughter ... until (it seems) the hormones kicked in, full shot.
I have a bunch of emoptional support from friends (LOL) who have gone through this before and they keep reminding me that it's a phase and that it'll pass (if I don't kill her, of course).
I JUST WANT MY TOUGH, FIGHTER OF A LITTLE GIRL BACK!
Just without the nastiness/craziness/irrationality. Is that too much to ask for?
I've done some awesome stuff. Athletically, academically, professionally, just awesome. Stuff that if you told me when I was 14 I'd do I'd have never in a million years believed you. Stuff that I'll tell my grandkids about (probably over and over when I'm a senile old man).
My 4 year old is in preschool soccer. He stinks. He's the worst player on the team. And as hypercompetitive as I was growing up, I dont care one bit if he's the worst player on any team he's ever on. I just love him.
But when he kicked that ball and it went into the net...
That was my proudest moment.
Ages 6 to 10 are generally good. With boys, there is a time from maybe 10 to 12 when you are a god to him. Wants to do everything you do. Enjoy it. It will soon pass.
Supposedly, the early teen years are the worst with daughters and the later teen year worst with boys; that was my experience.
Your IQ, in their eyes, starts to drop from ages 12 - 14 until they are in their 20s. Then you start to get smarter again. It took longer than I thought, but I have a great relationship with my kids now. My daughter came around first, asking for advice, while still being independent.
My son was the typical "I know it all / want to be independent" late teen / early 20s guy. Drove my wife nuts, but he's really matured in the last couple of years.
My observation / experience: Each phase of life has its own positives and negatives; they all pass. Enjoy the positives of each phase and endure the negatives. Some of the positives (carrying a sleeping child in from the car) never return. Others (having your advice being heard and accepted) come back.
Good luck to all struggling parents; hang in there!
What I remember from the book was that it's really important that you keep spending time with your daughter whenever you can - even if you have to force her to spend time with you and even if the time is spent in silence together. It will pay off in the long run even if it doesn't seem like it now.
Best of luck....and I loved the thread title because we really are all in this together.
Holy tone deaf, Batman...
I'll bet you're glad your parents didn't think that way!
Now the GFs kids....they are awful with each other. They are 17 (boy), 14 (girl) and 12 (boy). They seem to legit hate each other. They hit, punch, throw things at each other and call each other names like crazy. I have to bite my tongue every time I am there to not discipline them myself. It's sad to watch actually.
Moreover, it's true/not true for period A of a person's life (e.g. I'd never want kids in my 20s), but different for period B (40s/50s, then great to have grandchildren while you're slumped in your 10 years overworn La-z-boy watching golf & drinking Miller High Life on your birthday, praying that the Viagra will kick in before your once per annum blowjob).
People are different and have different priorities (if you excuse the banality). I can absolutely unerstand an individual whose highest priority is, for instance, to see every inch of the globe. Something which is unlikely to happen if you have kids. Which is why so many people have to wait until they're old to really see the world.
In short: for some it is better w/o kids.
Hang in there. I thought my wife would kill both my girls but now they are her best friends and they both call me 2-3 times a week for advice.
Amazing how much smarter I've become since they were teens!
I know that this can all go to shit any minute, but I'm riding high while I can.
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Has to be better without kids. Travel. Work less. More money. Easier to retire. People work their entire lives just to spend their money on someone else.
Holy tone deaf, Batman...
I'll bet you're glad your parents didn't think that way!
And the rest of us are sadly disappointed that they didn't.
Serious arguments are rare - and are almost ALWAYS fueled by a lack of sleep.
When they were in their Elementary School years, fighting was more common, but they grew out of it as they matured.
Lucky me, I guess!
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Has to be better without kids. Travel. Work less. More money. Easier to retire. People work their entire lives just to spend their money on someone else.
Yes - the world would be a better place if nobody had kids...
To a certain extent, you're quite correct.
Older daughter is a freshman in college. Complete emotional mess the last couple years. Seems like she enjoys hurting people emotionally, but then is apologetic shortly thereafter, once she thinks about it. Hoping we get a similar turnaround like we did with our son. Her and I did facetime during the Walking Dead premier Sunday night and it was nice to hang out. She's always been my movie and TV buddy. I think she's getting there.
Younger daughter, a junior in HS, is now the only child at home and loving it. My wife and I call her the gift God gave us because of the other two. Pretty much a perfect kid. Well behaved, good student, has no interest in partying or boys, athlete, dancer and is about to publish her first book. Plus I've turned her into a fellow Star Wars fanatic. She's also become a much bigger Giants fan this year since she's watched all the games with me. That's not easy for her considering my wife is a Patriots fan. Part of me hopes she doesn't go away for college, but I know that's what's best for her.
They are 18, 16, and 14 now and it is rewarding and fulfilling to watch each of them explore their different interests and accomplishments.
But as they get older, and my wife and I see our role slowly changing---and yes, shrinking---it is more than a bit melancholic to look back that the last 18 years and recognize a few regrets, a few opportunities lost, a few adventures never taken.
Moreover, in retrospect, I think the best I have ever felt as a man still goes back to the days when my kids were younger. It's then that all the possibilities are out there, when your parenting and love can have the most impact, and when the simple pleasures of watching your son play with his Lego's, taking your daughter to art camp, or going on a weekend getaway with your family are a daily occurrence.
I miss my kids being young, and I am having a lot of fun with them as teenagers. There is nothing better for me than having been able to take on the role of parent.
I love her for how strong-willed and independent she is, but there's a flip side to that. She's stubborn as a mule and she has a definite mean streak to her. The weird thing is that she's practically a saint at school. We happened to run into her kindergarten teacher at a burger joint one weekend. She had one of her meltdowns in there, and her teacher's eyes were bugging out of her head. She'd never seen my daughter act that way, and it was not in any way an unusual incident.
I do feel hopeful that her attitude will help keep her from getting in trouble by going along with the crowd, which is totally what I fear with my son. He's sensitive, and wants everyone to like him, so I can totally see him being taken advantage of by other kids. There isn't anyone who can talk Faith into doing something she doesn't want to do, though.
The funny thing is, he still enjoys hanging out with the old man sometimes. He just told me he hopes we can go see Roger Waters in September. His first concert was Roger Waters doing The Wall at Yankee Stadium 4 years or so ago. And still at least once a month on a Friday or Saturday night he will look at me and say, Father/Son night tonight? Which means dinner and a movie. I feel really grateful for this and also about something he said to us about 3 months ago, we were eating dinner and he said, "I want you guys to know that I never realized how lucky I am to have parents that I can talk to about anything" so my wife said, don't most of your friends have that kind of relationship with their parents? He looked at us like we had two heads each, and informed us that most of his friends rarely eat dinner as a family let alone feel comfortable talking about their lives with their parents. And told us he knows that whatever problem he has, even if he did something wrong or was in some kind of trouble that he knows he can come to us and we would be there for him. I have never felt so accomplished as a parent as I did at that moment. I know there is still some time to go before we declare victory, but I think we are on the right path.
It means so much to me because I didn't have a relationship like that with my dad. He was just way more concerned with himself and his own happiness than he was with me or my mom. They split up when I was a kid because he had fidelity problems and had a kid with anther woman. So, I just spend as much time with Nick (my son) as I can and hope he stays on the right path. The one annoying thing is, I was a slob at his age, he is 10x worse than I ever was. It drives my wife crazy.
I really enjoyed this thread talking about our kids and the realtionships we have with them.
Older daughter is a freshman in college. Complete emotional mess the last couple years. Seems like she enjoys hurting people emotionally, but then is apologetic shortly thereafter, once she thinks about it. Hoping we get a similar turnaround like we did with our son. Her and I did facetime during the Walking Dead premier Sunday night and it was nice to hang out. She's always been my movie and TV buddy. I think she's getting there.
Younger daughter, a junior in HS, is now the only child at home and loving it. My wife and I call her the gift God gave us because of the other two. Pretty much a perfect kid. Well behaved, good student, has no interest in partying or boys, athlete, dancer and is about to publish her first book. Plus I've turned her into a fellow Star Wars fanatic. She's also become a much bigger Giants fan this year since she's watched all the games with me. That's not easy for her considering my wife is a Patriots fan. Part of me hopes she doesn't go away for college, but I know that's what's best for her.
That is so true, I always say that the thing I am best at, is being a dad. And the most rewarding too.
I definitely was not close with my sister growing up, but now we are really close. We were both very much independent which grew us up a lot quicker than some of our friends. No idea if that's good or bad, but something I've been thinking about.
I think we will probably meet in the middle and do a 3-ish year gap. I can't imagine trying to have another kid right now and that's purely for financial reasons. We don't make enough for 2 kids a daycare in our area but we make enough where 1 of us staying home and dropping the career isn't an option.
The hardest thing for me though was the 6 yr period we went through w/ my20 yr old son. Tough thing for a dad to have his son who always shared things and talked, go 180 and become this "I can't show any emotion or open up because its not cool" kid. He is a real good athlete and that led to him being around older kids when I think he was not emotionally ready for it. Nice thing is though he is in his second year at college, and has fully come back around.
Wait until they have grandchildens -- that's the bomb!!!!
Pretty much all you need to say to Beezer...
And we're not in this together in any form...I wouldn't let any of you motherf'ers or your spawns get within 10 miles of influencing my kids.
And my sister is 7 years younger than me and I'm definitely closer to my wife's sister's who are 2 and 4 years younger. While the 7 year gap gave me a sibling I've never really fought with, it also gave me a sister who is somewhat of a stranger in that a close sibling relationship has never happened. We are good friends, but I wouldn't say we are close. We text a few times a month, but she's in Manhattan and I'm in the sticks.