for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Landon Collins vs. Ed Reed (2004 MVP season)

That’s Gold, Jerry : 11/23/2016 9:44 am
have to give credit to Ian Rapaport for this but take a look at these stats in which LC, through 10 games, has stats equal to or better than Reed when he won the MVP.

Reed Collins

Tackles - 76 80
Sacks - 2 3
Interceptions - 9 5
TD - 1 1

If he could grab a few more INTs, man, no question he is in MVP conversation.
Pages: 1 2 <<Prev | Show All |
RE: RE: Pretty sure the media  
pjcas18 : 11/23/2016 11:37 am : link
In comment 13230745 Hades07 said:
Quote:
In comment 13230703 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


has already selected Tom Brady MVP. He'd been back 4 games and already I'd began reading articles about how Tom Brady was MVP after just those 4 games.

I see almost no scenario anyone other than Brady wins.

I don't see how he can be MVP, the team was winning without him. Kinda puts a dent in the term most valuable. What would Dallas be w/o Elliot or for that matter NY without Eli ? Best player, sure Brady wins that, most valuable though, not close.


I'm not saying I agree with it, I'm saying it will happen, mark my words.

a big FU to Goodell.



Collins will have a shot  
Giantfootball025 : 11/23/2016 11:43 am : link
A stat line of maybe 120 tackles 5 sacks 7 picks and 2 tds might get it done this year. There is no clear cut MVP right now imo. And while normally I'd say no he won't be the MVP, this so far seems like the year a D player could win it.
RE: Greg  
map7711 : 11/23/2016 12:02 pm : link
In comment 13230737 Spike13 said:
Quote:
You forgot Ray Lewis being the 3rd.


Ray Lewis never won MVP. Only 2 defensive players have won with LT being the last.
Ed Reed? Collins is now the most overrated  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:28 pm : link
Player on the team.
RE: Ed Reed? Collins is now the most overrated  
BigBlueShock : 11/23/2016 12:34 pm : link
In comment 13230835 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Player on the team.

Aaaaaaaaaand, here comes the posts that try to bring down Collins. It was only a matter of time. Giants fans just can't stand prosperity. There's always those that feel the need to bring the room down.

Most overrated player on the team? Jeezus.
So if you don't think he's close to Reed'  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:40 pm : link
One of the top 2-3 S to ever play you're a downer? Not just Reed but comparing what Collins is doing to Reeds best year in the league,

What does overrated mean to you?

RE: So if you don't think he's close to Reed'  
giants#1 : 11/23/2016 12:42 pm : link
In comment 13230852 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
One of the top 2-3 S to ever play you're a downer? Not just Reed but comparing what Collins is doing to Reeds best year in the league,

What does overrated mean to you?


Who put Collins on Reed's level career-wise? This thread is about comparing Collins' 2016 season to Reed's 2004 DPOY season. And statistically they have been comparable, the one glaring omission in the OP (as pointed out by Osi Osi) is the ridiculous number of return yards that Reed had.

That's bigger joke  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:45 pm : link
He isn't close to Reeds best year. Projecting INTs is another joke.

Collins is a very good player. I thought he was good last year and liked the plan to get thinner and quicker. It seems to be helping. But he isn't a player of the year type even with the improved play.

And he sure as hell isnt close to having the impact Reed had that year.
RE: That's bigger joke  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:47 pm : link
In comment 13230859 KWALL2 said:
Quote:


And he sure as hell isnt close to having the impact Reed had that year.

Are we reading the same thing? Collins has more tackles and more sacks than Reed had all of that season, and there's still 6 games to play.
RE: So if you don't think he's close to Reed'  
BigBlueShock : 11/23/2016 12:48 pm : link
In comment 13230852 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
One of the top 2-3 S to ever play you're a downer? Not just Reed but comparing what Collins is doing to Reeds best year in the league,

What does overrated mean to you?

Well you completely whiffed on what this thread was about, first of all. No one ever said that Collins is a Hall of Famer like Reed certainly is, just that he's having a freaking great year, on par with one of Reed in some statistical areas. Second of all, you didn't just say he was overrated, but the most overrated player on the team. If by being the best player on the team so far this season equals being the most overrated to you, then I'm not not sure what to say, other than you are absolutely looking to bring everyone down a notch. Par for the course on this board.

KWALL  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:48 pm : link
Collins is having an all time season for a Giants safety...you realize this right? It's on par with Reed's season.
Oh he has more sacks and tackles?  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:49 pm : link
Ok
'Projecting INTs is another joke"  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:50 pm : link
what was the first joke? The facts?
RE: Oh he has more sacks and tackles?  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:51 pm : link
In comment 13230864 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Ok

Yes, he does. In 10 games mind you. Am I missing something? Did tackles and sacks suddenly not become important?
Are we  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:51 pm : link
in the twilight zone? Holy shit.
If you think it's on par  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:53 pm : link
With Reed that year than you don't know a thing about Reed.

INTs can get a guy overrated fast.

A few years ago, all Stevie Brown needed was 2 sacks and he would have been "on par with Reed" right?
Ryan  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 12:55 pm : link
The joke is comparing Collins play this year with Reeds play in his best year. That's a joke. To anybody outside of the NYG fan base.

Facts? That's another joke.
RE: If you think it's on par  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:55 pm : link
In comment 13230874 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
With Reed that year than you don't know a thing about Reed.

INTs can get a guy overrated fast.

A few years ago, all Stevie Brown needed was 2 sacks and he would have been "on par with Reed" right?

Dude, no offense but you are off your rocker right now. If that's the case, than it makes Collins' season even better compared to Reed's. If you say INTs are overrated, he had MORE of them than Collins...but Collins is going to destroy that tackles mark and probably get a few more sacks. Aren't you proving our point?
RE: If you think it's on par  
BigBlueShock : 11/23/2016 12:57 pm : link
In comment 13230874 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
With Reed that year than you don't know a thing about Reed.

INTs can get a guy overrated fast.

A few years ago, all Stevie Brown needed was 2 sacks and he would have been "on par with Reed" right?

Except for the fact that it's not the interceptions that are making him stand out, lol. Many on this thread alone have even mentioned that "if he can get some more interceptions"...You are completely lost, for someone that fancies himself as always being the smartest guy in the room.

What a strange thread to bring out your ridiculous radar impersonation.
RE: Ryan  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:57 pm : link
In comment 13230880 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
The joke is comparing Collins play this year with Reeds play in his best year. That's a joke. To anybody outside of the NYG fan base.

Facts? That's another joke.

Collins might get DPOY, just like Reed did that season. Is that a joke? What the fuck is going on.
Also..  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 12:59 pm : link
let's just say for shits and giggles that Collins wasn't out performing Reed in those categories already (which he is)...you're basically saying that it's impossible for Collins to be as good as Reed, which is so utterly ignorant in your football analysis. In that same vein, nobody would ever be as good as Randy Moss. Well, we have the guy on our team who is.
And that is not  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:00 pm : link
me saying that Collins will be as good as Reed one day. But to say it's a "joke" when literally, he's out performing him by a good margin in multiple categories...is absolutely ludicrous. I can't believe you're defending your stance.
Ryan  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 1:01 pm : link
Your welcome the guy struggling here. No offense but that last post was fulll of nonsense.

The only reason people are saying he's having an "all time season" and comparing it to Reeds best is his 5 INTs. While he is having an excellent season comparing him to Reeds best makes it clear he's severely overrated by some.

I thought the Player of the Year stuff was overrating his play. Hell, as far as Giant defenders go he's probably 5th most valuable. I'd take the play of both DEs and CBs over Collins.

All 4 are more valuable and better players.
We should probably calm down on this  
BlackLight : 11/23/2016 1:01 pm : link
Collins is having a great year, but I think the DPOY talk is premature.
You  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:01 pm : link
were right about Coleman vs Treadwell (so far at least...) but man, you're way off base here.
RE: Ryan  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:03 pm : link
In comment 13230895 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Hell, as far as Giant defenders go he's probably 5th most valuable. I'd take the play of both DEs and CBs over Collins.

All 4 are more valuable and better players.

5th most valuable????? Dude leads the team in sacks, tackles, and INTs!!!!
He's arguably  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:03 pm : link
the most valuable defender in the LEAGUE right now, let alone his own team. Jesus.
did you ever watch Ed Reed play?  
chris r : 11/23/2016 1:03 pm : link
I guess not because a comparison based on those stats is absurd. Ed Reed took away the deep ball. Collins has had some fortuitous INTs. Huge difference.
It is a joke  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 1:04 pm : link
Collins isn't close to Reed. Its that simple.

You can go on projecting INTs and sacks or overrating stats for defenders.
Collins  
Giantfootball025 : 11/23/2016 1:04 pm : link
picks are not just meaningless end of half or game hail mary picks. They are game sealing or game changing picks. No one is comparing him as a player to Reed, but right now what defensive player has meant more this year to their defense then Collins?
This almost makes  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:04 pm : link
me think you haven't watched a single Giants game this season.
Collins is having an excellent season  
David in LA : 11/23/2016 1:05 pm : link
but it's not in the same ballpark as Ed Reed's 2004. Reed simply has a better nose for the ball, and is better with the ball in his hands than Collins.
RE: did you ever watch Ed Reed play?  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:06 pm : link
In comment 13230903 chris r said:
Quote:
I guess not because a comparison based on those stats is absurd. Ed Reed took away the deep ball. Collins has had some fortuitous INTs. Huge difference.

OK, so now his picks are fortuitous. What's next? Half his tackles are just pure luck? He's just...there?
His value doesn't match those 4  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 1:08 pm : link
If all 5 are on the open market right now he's he last guy getting signed. The NFL would pay all 4 more $$$.

He isn't in consideration for league MVP outside of this thread. DPOY stuff is out of line too.

His stats may wind up better than a guy like Polanski when he won awards but again his play right now doesn't come close.

He's been excellent but his play is getting overrated right. Ow. That's clear to me with the DPOY talk, MVP, and now the he's on par with Reeds best.
Maybe...just maybe...  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:09 pm : link
Collins is a really really good player with a potential to be great? Just maybe? Or are we not allowed to think that? You'd think a guy who was the best defender in the SEC most of his career and having a season like this already in his 2nd year would get a bit more respect.
Polamalu  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 1:10 pm : link
Sorry about typo
More respect?  
KWALL2 : 11/23/2016 1:11 pm : link
Everybody agrees he's having an excellent year.

Some don't honk it compares to all time greats. That isn't about a lack of respect.
RE: More respect?  
ryanmkeane : 11/23/2016 1:13 pm : link
In comment 13230922 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Everybody agrees he's having an excellent year.

Some don't honk it compares to all time greats. That isn't about a lack of respect.

That was about his "fortuitous INTs" and downplaying his tackles and sacks, which apparently seem to not matter when it's a Giant making them.
Collins is having a great year  
JonC : 11/23/2016 1:15 pm : link
but it's not on par with Reed 2004, he was otherwordly in a way not seen before for a S.
The fact  
JesseS : 11/23/2016 5:22 pm : link
That Collins is being mentioned in the same sentence as Reed is good enough for me. He's all over the field. Makes big plays. Hits hard. Sure tackler. Pumps up the defense. We haven't had a safety playing at this level since Sam Garnes!
kwall  
dep026 : 11/23/2016 5:36 pm : link
How can you say DRC has been more valuable when he doesn't even start and plays half the snaps apple and jenkins play?

I can see your point about the other 3 since they play premium positions. But no one in the nfl I'd taking DRC over collins right now.
RE: Collins is having a great year  
Patrick77 : 11/23/2016 7:41 pm : link
In comment 13230925 JonC said:
Quote:
but it's not on par with Reed 2004, he was otherwordly in a way not seen before for a S.


Agreed. Collins is an All Pro this year.

But...

Ed Reed routinely altered field position in a huge way while also
being the best safety in the game and providing coverage and the ability to cover ground that Collins can't.

It's not a knock on Collins to say he isn't anything close to Ed Reed, great season and all.
Reed Was a FS That Played Well Off The Line  
Jim in Tampa : 11/23/2016 9:59 pm : link
Collins is a SS who plays in the box. Of course Collins is going to have more tackles.

Also safeties are not like DEs who rush the QB on every passing play. Sacks for a safety are more a function of how many times the DC decides to blitz them.

Collins is a very good player who's having an outstanding year, but he's nowhere close to the player that Reed was.
Not close to Ed Reed  
trueblueinpw : 11/23/2016 10:02 pm : link
I like Collins, he's a solid young player getting better. But Ed Reed is one of the all time greats to play the game. Reed could, and often did, change a game on any play. If you make an all time NFL defensive backfield, Ed Reed is on the team. Collins is not.
Collins is still growing so we don't know his ceiling but  
xman : 11/23/2016 10:23 pm : link
Ed Reed the former captain at the U and a HOF er is unlikely to be trumped by our resident hero Mr Collins. But I am sure glad we got Collins playing today instead of a some of the busts that have been masquerading as S the past few years
RE: Collins won't be in contention for MVP.  
NINEster : 11/24/2016 6:45 am : link
In comment 13230569 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
.


If LT was the last NFL MVP and JJ Watt couldn't sniff it in recent years, don't see any DB getting it for a long, long time.
Collins is in the running for DPOY...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 11/24/2016 6:47 am : link
But I'd be shocked if he garnered an MVP vote.
Interceptions are a double edged stat  
NINEster : 11/24/2016 6:49 am : link
They prove you are taking away the ball but in order to get INTs the opposing QB has to have the confidence to throw it.

You see how Richard Sherman's INTs dropped once he became an established star and much the same for the other Seahawk DBs. Doesn't make them any less good.
RE: 'Projecting INTs is another joke  
Tuckrule : 11/26/2016 10:34 pm : link
In comment 13230867 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
what was the first joke? The facts?


lmao i laughed at that one
In 2012....  
Milton : 11/27/2016 5:26 am : link
Stevie Brown had 8 INT's (for 307 return yards) in just 11 games started with 76 total tackles and 2 forced fumbles. Those are great stats and yet nobody was comparing him to Ed Reed or suggesting him for DPOY.

p.s.-- Landon Collins isn't even the defensive MVP on the Giants, let alone the league. That's Janoris Jenkins. And the Giants could weather the loss of Collins better than they could weather the loss of JPP and Olivier Vernon, too. Collins has been playing some good ball, but it's not as if it's been mistake-free. Call me after the games against Pittsburgh and Dallas, not following a string of games versus Baltimore, LA, Philly, Cincy, and Chicago.
Pages: 1 2 <<Prev | Show All |
Back to the Corner