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What kind of contract offers is JPP going to get...

Jerz44 : 12/3/2016 7:29 pm
...this off-season?

As of now, he has 50 tackles and 7 sacks. That projects to roughly 70 tackles and 10 sacks for the season. He also has 8 passes defensed, 3 forced fumbles and 22.5 hurries.

For comparisons, last year, Vernon had 61 and 7.5 and got that massive contract we all know about. He also had a bunch of hurries.

JPP is currently 27 so still very much in his prime. His numbers aren't JJ Watt eye-popping, but I think he's certainly playing at a high level and maybe just at or just below Pro-Bowl level (maybe I'm being a homer).

Does he stand to get a bonanza?


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RE: umm  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 11:05 am : link
In comment 13245942 mdthedream said:
Quote:
Jason was born in 89 Vernon 1990.


JPP will be 28 in several weeks
He was  
mdthedream : 12/4/2016 11:11 am : link
paid his value this year at 10 mill 5.5 sacks out of 7 against Chicago broken line and Cleveland is nice but lets not get crazy. The Giants will have to make a important decision and yes the can tag him its how it works.
Cruz  
mdthedream : 12/4/2016 11:13 am : link
we will see what Victor wants to do. Not a huge issue either way.
Cruz  
fkap : 12/4/2016 11:37 am : link
the only choice he has is whether to take a big paycut or see what the open market has to offer after we release him.

JPP, sans a total meltdown, is getting Vernon dollars. Whether it's from the Giants or someone else remains to be seen.

Hindsight being 20/20, the Giants would have been so much better off having given him that 10-12 mil a year contract he wanted 2 years ago. I still am a bit leery about his enthusiasm year in year out, but there's no denying that he is far better than anything else we've produced or acquired (jury being out on Vernon because of an alleged injury)
one has 6 sacks the other 7  
mdthedream : 12/4/2016 11:44 am : link
and both play the run well. Vernon puts more pressure on the Qb. The injury did slow him down.
Jason  
mdthedream : 12/4/2016 11:45 am : link
will get tagged if he doesn't want to make a deal.
5/90  
Vanzetti : 12/4/2016 11:47 am : link
with about 40 million guaranteed
He  
AcidTest : 12/4/2016 12:00 pm : link
deserves to be paid, but I think it will be by someone else. Somebody is going to offer him an insane amount of money. What Vernon got at a minimum.
RE: He  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:05 pm : link
In comment 13246008 AcidTest said:
Quote:
deserves to be paid, but I think it will be by someone else. Somebody is going to offer him an insane amount of money. What Vernon got at a minimum.


Agreed..Our team with OV on one side, OO and RO on the other with our anchors in the middle will survive..We'll draft well and sign FAs as needed..JPP will not cause this D to collapse.If we sign him and let Hankins go, I'll be super, super pissed..Keep both or let JPP go if he expects the moon.
Have to sign JPP  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2016 12:08 pm : link
need a "championship" D before ELi's window closes.

drafting someone or using OO or RO opposite Vernon has flashbacks for me of last year with Ayers on one side before JPP returned. Awful.
OO and RO on the other side...  
Jimmy Googs : 12/4/2016 12:12 pm : link
I would think we would have to go DE with first round pick as we cannot rely upon either of these two guys being the de facto starter opposite Vernon.

Tough to see their future as of yet, but possibility exists that they actually don't have one in the NFL...
RE: Have to sign JPP  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:15 pm : link
In comment 13246024 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
need a "championship" D before ELi's window closes.

drafting someone or using OO or RO opposite Vernon has flashbacks for me of last year with Ayers on one side before JPP returned. Awful.


I have a problem with HUGE guaranteed money for JPP. If it's doable and will allow us to re-sign Hankins and other OL FAs(if young and available), that's fine..Minority opinion or not, I don't believe he will perform well AFTER he gets the big bucks..I'm not a fan of JPP, that's no secret, but I certainly wouldn't cut off my nose to spite my face. If he can be signed for non-sky high dollars, then go for it..
RE: OO and RO on the other side...  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:16 pm : link
In comment 13246029 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
I would think we would have to go DE with first round pick as we cannot rely upon either of these two guys being the de facto starter opposite Vernon.

Tough to see their future as of yet, but possibility exists that they actually don't have one in the NFL...


I just said I could live with it, if I, as a fan, had to..I also said that this D, with other parts remaining in place and continual upgrades, will not die/collapse if JPP walks.
RE: RE: Have to sign JPP  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2016 12:20 pm : link
In comment 13246030 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13246024 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


need a "championship" D before ELi's window closes.

drafting someone or using OO or RO opposite Vernon has flashbacks for me of last year with Ayers on one side before JPP returned. Awful.



I have a problem with HUGE guaranteed money for JPP. If it's doable and will allow us to re-sign Hankins and other OL FAs(if young and available), that's fine..Minority opinion or not, I don't believe he will perform well AFTER he gets the big bucks..I'm not a fan of JPP, that's no secret, but I certainly wouldn't cut off my nose to spite my face. If he can be signed for non-sky high dollars, then go for it..


Nothing is guaranteed (no pun intended), but I believe the fireworks incident humbled him if you believe him and have listened to any interviews he's given.

I have no problem with 40-50M guaranteed to him though I'd front load it to the extent possible.

The defense is really just a player or two away from being legit elite IMO and I hate going into the draft saying "we'll draft position X in the first round or rely on the drafted player to start" even if that's the case, it's a crapshoot.
Why would the Giants  
mdthedream : 12/4/2016 12:30 pm : link
let him walk when they can tag him? Sorry but its a business and they owe him nothing more than a contract at his value and a tag would be at that value. Its part of the roles and I don't blame them if they use it.
If he's signed to a 5 year  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:31 pm : link
deal, that's a $10 million amortized cap hit PLUS his salary..You really want to guarantee that kind of money to him? I wouldn't..$25 million guaranteed? Sure. I wouldn't take the chance on much more..You guys can believe the incident changed his life around (of vourse to some extent he probably has) Forgive me If I'm not buying..
tagging is not desirable  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2016 12:32 pm : link
by the player or the team in most cases.

The Giants should use the tag if they have to, but it's not the first choice IMO.
BB56  
hassan : 12/4/2016 12:34 pm : link
He will clear 14 million annually book it. Whether as a Giant or elsewhere.

Giants will need to tag him or get real about a contract and that may be hard. Having Odell at a bargain price for two more years may need to stay the case as qb and ends and Jenkins add up to a big cap number.
RE: If he's signed to a 5 year  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2016 12:35 pm : link
In comment 13246048 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
deal, that's a $10 million amortized cap hit PLUS his salary..You really want to guarantee that kind of money to him? I wouldn't..$25 million guaranteed? Sure. I wouldn't take the chance on much more..You guys can believe the incident changed his life around (of vourse to some extent he probably has) Forgive me If I'm not buying..


Hard to gauge sincerity, but listen to him talk about his appreciation for his blind father sine his incident. words are words, but since his return he's seemed like a completely changed player and his words indicate a humility most pro athletes don't have.

He'd be a core player on my team and one I'd build around.

Of course you'd have to make it work financially and there is a point where I'd say not worth it, but the numbers I've been mentioning are a no-brainer IMO.
RE: BB56  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:39 pm : link
In comment 13246053 hassan said:
Quote:
He will clear 14 million annually book it. Whether as a Giant or elsewhere.

Giants will need to tag him or get real about a contract and that may be hard. Having Odell at a bargain price for two more years may need to stay the case as qb and ends and Jenkins add up to a big cap number.


Yeah, I see a tag on the horizon as a possibility or even a probability. It gives them another year to see if this year was a huge contract drive on his part or legit. Can't they always tag him after next year as well? I know it doesn't help the cap with a FT hit, but at least we don't have to guarantee huge bucks, even as a front load
RE: RE: BB56  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2016 12:42 pm : link
In comment 13246058 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13246053 hassan said:


Quote:


He will clear 14 million annually book it. Whether as a Giant or elsewhere.

Giants will need to tag him or get real about a contract and that may be hard. Having Odell at a bargain price for two more years may need to stay the case as qb and ends and Jenkins add up to a big cap number.



Yeah, I see a tag on the horizon as a possibility or even a probability. It gives them another year to see if this year was a huge contract drive on his part or legit. Can't they always tag him after next year as well? I know it doesn't help the cap with a FT hit, but at least we don't have to guarantee huge bucks, even as a front load


If they tag him two years in a row it's the equivalent of like 35M guaranteed.

Why not just give him 45 - 50M guaranteed, front load it to an extent, and potentially have him for 5 years instead of the two.
I personally wouldn't tag him that second year(does last year's  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:45 pm : link
count or was it rescinded and pro-rated?)..1 year would be fine with me if necessary
we need two decent DE  
fkap : 12/4/2016 12:47 pm : link
we currently have two decent DE.

let JPP go, and we have one decent DE and then absolutely nothing. JPP and Vernon aren't playing 90 + percent of snaps because we're saving the backups for the playoffs.

I'm not advocating paying JPP whatever he wants, because like BB'56, I'm not convinced he's worth it or that he'll have the same enthusiasm once signed. But, without him there's a huge, huge hole on a very critical part of our defense. IF you can get him at Vernon dollars, you've got to think about it.

Hopefully, with the readjustment of the draft committee, we'll be able to draft a cheaper alternative, but a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
RE: RE: OO and RO on the other side...  
Jimmy Googs : 12/4/2016 12:49 pm : link
In comment 13246032 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13246029 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


I would think we would have to go DE with first round pick as we cannot rely upon either of these two guys being the de facto starter opposite Vernon.

Tough to see their future as of yet, but possibility exists that they actually don't have one in the NFL...



I just said I could live with it, if I, as a fan, had to..I also said that this D, with other parts remaining in place and continual upgrades, will not die/collapse if JPP walks.


My point is I don't think we can live with it BB56. We don't have effective pass rushers from DTs or LBs, so will need somebody reliable opposite Vernon. OO/RO could be a fatal flaw.
Look, regardless of how I feel as a fan,  
Big Blue '56 : 12/4/2016 12:50 pm : link
If they want him here, then whatever they work out I'll obviously have to accept. However, if it results in us letting Hankins ago, I will be really pissed at Reese..
I would consider using the franchise tag on him as a last resort  
Milton : 12/4/2016 12:57 pm : link
But I think they should work really hard at re-signing him before it comes to that. I don't think they need to give him what they gave Vernon. But a contract in the $15M/year range with $40-45M guaranteed should do the trick. I think he wants to stay and will give a home team discount to accomplish that. This is very, very different than two years ago.
RE: Look, regardless of how I feel as a fan,  
David in LA : 12/4/2016 3:21 pm : link
In comment 13246075 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
If they want him here, then whatever they work out I'll obviously have to accept. However, if it results in us letting Hankins ago, I will be really pissed at Reese..


They already invested heavily in Snacks. You can't keep everybody, and JPP is clearly the better player. This is a pretty dumb reason to get on Reese's ass about.
I don't think they can give him Vernon money.  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/4/2016 3:31 pm : link
Too much money invested in the same position. But anything not as big as that, I'd be okay with.
We had no problem paying Strahan and Osi.  
David in LA : 12/4/2016 3:35 pm : link
If you have two premium bookend DE's, you pay them.
We also have alot of other players to pay very soon,  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/4/2016 3:37 pm : link
Bekcham being one of them, who is going to (rightfully) get a massive contract, next year, I believe. Hankins and Pugh are FA's, too.

I'm not making any predictions or anything. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. Maybe Cruz or Eli can take a paycut (doubtful). Hopefully, the cap increases again. That would help, too.
You have to prioritize  
David in LA : 12/4/2016 3:44 pm : link
I can't fathom the logic in going with Hankins over JPP. Hankins is young and talented, but really has one very good season to his name. JPP should be priority #1 this offseason.
I guess it depends on what other teams  
Dave in Hoboken : 12/4/2016 3:45 pm : link
are going to offer JPP, too. If a team out there offers him something crazy like Vernon money; I think it's a 50/50 proposition that JPP stays. I hope there is no team out there willing to do that.
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