accomplished?
Okay, he shit the bed with the S situation in '09. He has admitted as much. Probably slow to work on the OL, but has drafted rather well with Pugh, Richburg and Flowers despite some work in progress there. You hate Flowers? Fine..I'll wait for this aggressive, 21 year-old to have another season or two before weighing in and even then, would I really know what I'm seeing from TV? I'll trust in Solari's ongoing work with him before disparaging his play..Maybe ORT will be his landing place. The Giants know better than I do..
We had to re-build arguably the worse D in history and he has done a tremendous job in just one off season. Last year's "lousy" trade up for Collins, is suddenly not so lousy..
He tried to fortify the OL with FAs. He either was unable to quickly pull the trigger on some OL while putting together his D, or some FAs simply did not want to come here, or many were simply damaged goods..
With his recent drafting record, we can all pretty much assume he'll go Offense this offseason and possibly lure some young FA OL talent..
He drafted a TE in Adams. Were there any TEs available in the draft that could have helped us this year that we should have taken in the early rounds instead of who we took? How about FA? Who was available that would have made a huge difference? Maybe along with the OL, he'll draft one high next year? No idea..
So what GMs have done a better job of late? Dallas? Perhaps..The Pats? BB turns shit into gold, so who knows what that story is..Ozzie Newsome? Check his record the last bunch of years..I'm sure you can name some, but few of them could turn things around outside of possibly Dallas, imo..
Bottom line? After some lousy draft choices, bad injury luck and some omissions he has admitted to, he has been doing some fine work here, especially on D, imo
Perhaps other complaints should be pinned on possible choice of OC?PC(some borne out of necessity to mitigate some weaknesses at present)?Possible HC choice? Something else? Just asking.
The bashing gets old and is outdated imv..
Pics or GTFO?
Yes. For the love of god, please.
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but Coughlin is relevant to this discussion, because this is where the Reese disdain comes from. Again, you showed your ass during the Carolina game.
Pics or GTFO?
Shit this discussion was doing so well until my buddy Paul came on...😜
If this team wins 10 games and makes the playoffs- Will you still feel the same?
Are you familiar with Landon Collins?
Paul, just playin' with ya..😎
This sums it up for me. It's a team building philosophy. We got cute too many times with skill position players while letting the core of our team, the offensive and defensive lines, fall apart.
That is the whole argument for me, right there. That's it.
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Was his pick. That is the one guy that he got on that defense. He also added Nicks and Cruz who were very instrumental for our second ring. But I always believe that championships are won with the front lines and this is where he has failed miserably.
This sums it up for me. It's a team building philosophy. We got cute too many times with skill position players while letting the core of our team, the offensive and defensive lines, fall apart.
That is the whole argument for me, right there. That's it.
That's easier said than done. We have a top DL, the OL needs work- We knew this prior to the season.
And when did "we get cute"?
The OL has two #1s and a #2. It needs more help.
This idea that Reese has ignored the OL is simply false.
I'm talking about accountability from a fan perspective, not the organization. Where is it from your end?
That's an example of bad philosophy. Picking a 1st round RB thinking it will solve the rushing problem, when it's the guys that do the blocking that make the RB in most cases.
the Patriots invest very little in their lines. Some say Solder, their only 1st round pick on the OL is a liability. No one else higher than a 3rd round pick on their OL and no high priced FA's.
on their DL one 1st round pick. the rest JAG's that get coached up. More investment in the back 7 (slightly).
Think the Patriots are an anomaly?
Look at the Broncos OL from the SB.
no 1st round picks, in fact a couple 3rd's and late round picks, low $$ FA's. They had DL investment. But not more than the Giants. A lot of their investment is in the back 7.
Look at the Seahawks. OL, very little investment. DL some investment, but again mostly back 7 investment.
I looked at all 12 playoff teams from last year and the same theme is generally true, not much OL investment in terms of high draft picks and high $$ FA's - as a rule.
And definitely not on both lines.
The Cowboys this year will be an anomaly. And they haven't won anything yet.
I believe it's as much or more coaching based on results we're seeing on-field today.
Can't blame Coughlin anymore.
The personnel is better and people are supposed to blame... the GM? The D is certainly significantly better, if the O is better too, I would say that is a decent enough job.
That's an example of bad philosophy. Picking a 1st round RB thinking it will solve the rushing problem, when it's the guys that do the blocking that make the RB in most cases.
I wanted Cordy Glenn as well...No argument here. But we have 3 high picks on the OL.
He got cute there. But, how long you gonna hold that over his head?
That's an example of bad philosophy. Picking a 1st round RB thinking it will solve the rushing problem, when it's the guys that do the blocking that make the RB in most cases.
Given the HC's penchant to go to bat for coordinators like Fewell and KG, you don't think he went to bat to squeeze out more years out of Diehl, Beatty, Boothe, Baas, and Snee? The team collectively thought the window was more wide open than it was. Basically, you want to shove the GM out the door who built the 2011 SB team, because he didn't make the pick you wanted the year after? Does he get credit for 2011, or nah? Who knows where we'd be with Wilson, the kid was a dynamic player who had shitty luck with injuries. DW actually would be dynamic with OBJ.
Am I happy with the way the O is playing? Of course not, but I find it really difficult to bitch and moan about an 8-4 team.
But that's just me.
Even if TC thought Diehl and Snee were ready to be Pro Bowlers again going into 2013, it's the GM's job to know his coaches blind spots and overrule him. I liked TC a ton and was sad to see him go, but he had blinders on when it came to certain players. Reese has to jettison those anchors. And maybe the organizational structure didn't allow for him to do so - I have no insight into the Giants decision making, so I find it hard to properly allocate blame with any certainty.
Even if TC thought Diehl and Snee were ready to be Pro Bowlers again going into 2013, it's the GM's job to know his coaches blind spots and overrule him. I liked TC a ton and was sad to see him go, but he had blinders on when it came to certain players. Reese has to jettison those anchors. And maybe the organizational structure didn't allow for him to do so - I have no insight into the Giants decision making, so I find it hard to properly allocate blame with any certainty.
Great post Brett.
the Patriots invest very little in their lines. Some say Solder, their only 1st round pick on the OL is a liability. No one else higher than a 3rd round pick on their OL and no high priced FA's.
on their DL one 1st round pick. the rest JAG's that get coached up. More investment in the back 7 (slightly).
Think the Patriots are an anomaly?
Look at the Broncos OL from the SB.
no 1st round picks, in fact a couple 3rd's and late round picks, low $$ FA's. They had DL investment. But not more than the Giants. A lot of their investment is in the back 7.
Look at the Seahawks. OL, very little investment. DL some investment, but again mostly back 7 investment.
I looked at all 12 playoff teams from last year and the same theme is generally true, not much OL investment in terms of high draft picks and high $$ FA's - as a rule.
And definitely not on both lines.
The Cowboys this year will be an anomaly. And they haven't won anything yet.
I believe it's as much or more coaching based on results we're seeing on-field today.
Or is it an ability to identify talent? The Broncos and Patriots may be that good to where they can identify solid talent in later rounds. Others are less fortunate and need to draft earlier where the likelihood of finding a keeper is higher.
For all his faults, Reese isn't bad at identifying CB and WR talent. OL not so much.
I mean come on
Ok, I see that aspect now and yeah there is to a degree. But you would also have to say that there is a contingent that denies Reese has any accountability with regards to our current situation also.
It's hard to say what could have been done to improve the line, I think Joe Thomas might have been the missed opportunity there but I don't know for sure. I do think though the ignoring of better TE's than what we have is a glaring omission on his part though that could have drastically helped
You are so full of shit, or just plain dense. I'm leaning towards both.
I said nothing of the sort. What I said was how do you know how good or job a bad of a job reigning in Beckham Coughlin had done, considering that he didn't have any issues for nearly two full seasons prior to the end of season meltdown last year, at which point he was coaching for his job.
I said that since it carried over into this season, and McAdoo also was having trouble reigning him in, perhaps it was just another in a long list of shit that posters like you heap at Coughlin's feet, which by the way didn't get any better after his ouster.
The dip in the offense should have been expected by every single Giants fan. It was clear as day that this would happen back in March.
Here's how you chose to lead off that thread.
Britt in VA : 12/20/2015 2:20 pm
Beckham drops a TD.
DRC Drops another Pick 6.
Jennings fumbles away a promising drive.
If they fire Coughlin, it's a BIG FUCKING MISTAKE.
I'll take showing my ass that way, I guess... Well, over literally showing my ass to my coworkers, or nah?
Granted, he has tried to address the oline and TE position but I think that is even a worse indictment of his performance. His attempts have not been good.
I didn't delete that other thread. Mods likely did it out of pity for you.
I didn't delete that other thread. Mods likely did it out of pity for you.
Absolutely hilarious.
You fabricate something I said about Tom Coughlin not being responsible for reigning Beckham in, I correct you, then you dig up some old post to "prove" I said it, which has absolutely zero to do with what you accused me of saying. THEN, you have the audacity to say that I'm not capable of having a rational conversation about it!
Can't make it up.
Also, why in the world would the mods pity me? I wasn't even on the thread, which is even more lame, considering I wasn't even around and you were trying to bash me, at which point many other posters bashed you.
Got any more old threads to dig up? How about some Cutler threads where you followed me around for years with?
Like I said, hilarious.
I wear it as a badge of honor. The guy is a HOF coach, and took us to two championships. Both probably the greatest sports events I'll ever see in my lifetime, including the greatest upset of all time in all of sports.
Show some fucking respect, something you've lacked to for years. You've bashed the guy relentlessly for years, and continue to now that he's gone. That reflects way more poorly on you that anybody that defends the guy, IMO.
After awhile you are what your record says you are. its been enough years. Incomplete NFl average to below average records...NFL average to below average GM
I remind us he has a number of years and unlike most NFL GMS he inherited a NFL franchise QB who never got injured and still produced NFL average results ( and may again this year and next...hopefully not...but the likely pick is that the past is close to the future).
I dont buy he has had bad luck...his luck is average after a few years ( ie there is little good or bad luck by five years out...results resemble capability...NFL average to below considering he has the biggest piece to start which few other GMS had...a franchise QB who did not get injured.
just imho. Hopefully he is learning on the job
I wear it as a badge of honor. The guy is a HOF coach, and took us to two championships. Both probably the greatest sports events I'll ever see in my lifetime, including the greatest upset of all time in all of sports.
Show some fucking respect, something you've lacked to for years. You've bashed the guy relentlessly for years, and continue to now that he's gone. That reflects way more poorly on you that anybody that defends the guy, IMO.
You accuse me of bashing TC, when I suggest his best days were behind him, and things that he should be accountable for. Your most recent nickname was well earned.
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were won on the lines, but now I feel that's an old school concept.
the Patriots invest very little in their lines. Some say Solder, their only 1st round pick on the OL is a liability. No one else higher than a 3rd round pick on their OL and no high priced FA's.
on their DL one 1st round pick. the rest JAG's that get coached up. More investment in the back 7 (slightly).
Think the Patriots are an anomaly?
Look at the Broncos OL from the SB.
no 1st round picks, in fact a couple 3rd's and late round picks, low $$ FA's. They had DL investment. But not more than the Giants. A lot of their investment is in the back 7.
Look at the Seahawks. OL, very little investment. DL some investment, but again mostly back 7 investment.
I looked at all 12 playoff teams from last year and the same theme is generally true, not much OL investment in terms of high draft picks and high $$ FA's - as a rule.
And definitely not on both lines.
The Cowboys this year will be an anomaly. And they haven't won anything yet.
I believe it's as much or more coaching based on results we're seeing on-field today.
Or is it an ability to identify talent? The Broncos and Patriots may be that good to where they can identify solid talent in later rounds. Others are less fortunate and need to draft earlier where the likelihood of finding a keeper is higher.
For all his faults, Reese isn't bad at identifying CB and WR talent. OL not so much.
Probably a combination of both.
What I look at in New England is how bad their OL was the last two years (even winning a SB), so they lured Dante Scarnecchia out of retirement to take back OL coaching responsibilities and it has turned things around very quickly.
Someone like B in Alb or a former player would know, because I'm surprised coaching can have so much impact, but having never been an OL that's my opinion.
After awhile you are what your record says you are. its been enough years. Incomplete NFl average to below average records...NFL average to below average GM
I remind us he has a number of years and unlike most NFL GMS he inherited a NFL franchise QB who never got injured and still produced NFL average results ( and may again this year and next...hopefully not...but the likely pick is that the past is close to the future).
I dont buy he has had bad luck...his luck is average after a few years ( ie there is little good or bad luck by five years out...results resemble capability...NFL average to below considering he has the biggest piece to start which few other GMS had...a franchise QB who did not get injured.
just imho. Hopefully he is learning on the job
Bill, Reese has essentially been an extended period of Accorsi with some minor nuances. Same philosophy, particularly on the defensive side, and same areas of deficiency, particularly the offensive line. Ernie might have been better in free agency, Reese better in drafting and UDFA. If you think deeper about the parallels, there are a bunch.
I tried man, I tried.
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for good discussion. Not often that an entire thread can be mostly informative..
I tried man, I tried.
You always do, sir..😊