is because the Giants have the worst running game in the league AGAIN. What do we have to lose by starting a rookie? A guy like Perkins is not going to run for fewer yards than Jennings and Perkins has more upside for longer runs.
So, it seems that McAdoo (like Coughlin) are stubborn in this area when it comes to the RB. Yes, protecting Eli is the #1 job of the RB but Perkins has been doing that well.
I just feel that even if we drafted Zeke, we would be playing this game of spoon feed the rookie.
(8 rushes) over the last 5 games, yet you think McAdoo is stubborn? He's giving Perkins an opportunity to earn a larger role in the offense, it's up to Perkins to seize the chance.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
and think we would have had that same performance. I am wiping his success from my mind and just thinking about if we drafted a RB with our first pick, would we have the guy be the change of pace back still?
(8 rushes) over the last 5 games, yet you think McAdoo is stubborn? He's giving Perkins an opportunity to earn a larger role in the offense, it's up to Perkins to seize the chance.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
A RB needs to get more than 8-9 touches. He has to get into a groove. Also, the O-line has to get used to the back who is running behind them because they have different styles.
and think we would have had that same performance. I am wiping his success from my mind and just thinking about if we drafted a RB with our first pick, would we have the guy be the change of pace back still?
He'd get the chance, just like Perkins is, to earn more playing time.
You do realize our first round CB is starting, correct? And our 2nd round WR plays virtually every offensive snap. And our 3rd round FS was projected to start before injuries derailed his season. Not to mention the UDFAs that are major contributors:
Adams - starting FS
Okwara - was #3 DE, now possibly starter
Lewis - taking snaps from Cruz
So why do you think McAdoo would keep a talented player off the field?
(8 rushes) over the last 5 games, yet you think McAdoo is stubborn? He's giving Perkins an opportunity to earn a larger role in the offense, it's up to Perkins to seize the chance.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
A RB needs to get more than 8-9 touches. He has to get into a groove. Also, the O-line has to get used to the back who is running behind them because they have different styles.
That's bullshit. It's not like he's popping in for a play or two here scattered throughout the game. He comes in for a series or two at a time. He has plenty of chances to earn more snaps.
attributes a veteran back brings to a team, and why teams don't often start rookie RB's when they have OL issues:
Quote:
What do we have to lose by starting a rookie?
You often lose blocking assignments and pass protection. Dallas can get away with having Elliot be their back - they have a good OL. Teams that can't, often have the rookie struggle to pick up pass pro.
Even look at a guy like Gurley. Is he somehow a terrible back this year? No - his OL sucks, and he's struggling in pass pro too.
So when a David Wilson or an Ahmad Bradshaw weren't immediate starters, it isn't because Eric Dickerson has teh reins, it is because Eli does and you don't want the rookie getting him killed.
you have to add in coaching philosophy here a bit.
Remember a couple of years ago the Cows had DeMarco Murray leading a very successful ground attack for Dallas. Dallas had a terrific OL granted and wonderful complementary weapons e.g. Des, Witten, Beasley et al
Yet when Dallas was compelled by the Salary cap to choose between Dez and DeMarco they ended up losing DeMarco to Philly where Kelly misused him and DeMarco's stats suffered greatly.
Today DeMarco is with another team and he is right up there with the league leaders statistically.
So what changed in re DeMarco? Was Philly's OL really that bad?
I don't think so.
Dallas used DeMarco set back in the Power I and ran stretch plays wherein DeMarco could get a running start and use his vision to pick the appropriate cut back lanes to maximize his gains
Philly did not use this formation placing DeMarco much closer to the line and the qb.
DeMarco's stats suffered egregiously
Now Dallas is using Zeke just like they used DeMarco and Voila win win.
This is a long winded set up to suggest that the shot gun formation used 90% of the time by the Jints may not be all that beneficial to their run game
I would like to see more of the Power I formations and lets see what Jennings and Perkins can do in the run game. I am particularly enamored of Perkins ability to make opponents miss. Should he get more of an opportunity to use his vision and get a running start I wonder if he would be more productive even behind a Jint OL that is admittedly challenged in their run blocking
If you are trying to say Elliott is overrated... just say it.
Elliot would have the SAME results behind our line, only that he is a better back than Perkins/Jennings, and that he might eliminate that 2 safety defensive setup, that has plagued this offense....he runs over people, he runs away from people, and he has some wiggle....
But if we have him, we don't have Apple, and who would be the third corner?
is that Zeke would be serving a 4 game suspension for smacking his chick in July. Instead, the Boys are the saviors of the NFL ratings fall, and consequently, there will be no "rush to judgement" during the current season.
If we somehow drafted Eli Apple in the first round
Well, ok I guess not secretly but anyway I'm sure he'd be a decent back for us but he landed in the perfect spot. I'm convinced people would be calling both he and Dak busts if they played behind this OL with this group of TEs... lol.
FM has it, that's why Jennings is not losing to many carries to quickly. That said hopefully we see more and more Perkins because he seems to be blocking well now.
Would have loved if we picked him but lets face it the
Cowboys knocked it out of the park if Zak doesn't become
a one year wonder but right now I don't see that and that
team will be set for years .
Apple will be a solid player who will only get better and
DRC won't be around forever . But we still have plenty to doto stay competitive . There is nothing remarkable about ourdrafting and we have little room to make mistakes especially in the first four rounds .
Fuck the attributes and projects
and potential . Give me football players that have produced
against big time programs . Sure once in a while you get
a Kalil Mack or an Osi and some other small schools but
not that many . Have we don't a bit better lately ?
So far yes but even our high round picks that are still
here have not played long enough to know for sure .
than the run of the mill first rounder. They are available every year. Factor in their ability to stay healthy and fluke injuries and come back to the importance of having a stellar Oline and a QB who keeps some pressure off the running game as the more important part of that equation.
He is a complete back. Even behind this OL Zeke would get yards because he is fast and strong. Good pass catcher and blocker. He is the total package. Having him with OBJ on offense would be tremendous.
I just don't see us beating Dallas. The offense is so inept and at this point in the season nothing is going to change.
Hey, I would have LOVED for the Giants to have drafted this guy, but the 2016 GIANTS would have been MUCH better with a stud OL than a RB -- even a real good one.
Not point of thread, but many on BBI were so critical (and happy)
That Dallas drafted Elliot. I thought the first round of this draft was a DISASTER for the Giants. Nothing against Apple, but considering Dallas got Elliott, Philly got Wentz, and the Giants did NOT get Conklin -- who would have helped tremendously, or Floyd -- who they wanted but would have been a 3-4 square peg for a round hole 4-3 defense, the first round was a disaster.
RE: Not point of thread, but many on BBI were so critical (and happy)
instead of Gurley, I would be in the playoffs in 2 of 3 of my fantasy leagues, and not just 1 of 3. I was going to pick him, but I was stupidly drafting on an I pad and got hosed. Fuck. What could have been!!!
Since they didn't take Buckner and especially since they didn't take Ramsey- the apparently best talent in the whole draft.
Looking at Anthony Brown's play/their secondary as a whole still and the fact they have a giant cap space allocated to RB for the foreseeable future, I say the jury is still out.
is that Zeke would be serving a 4 game suspension for smacking his chick in July. Instead, the Boys are the saviors of the NFL ratings fall, and consequently, there will be no "rush to judgement" during the current season.
But he definitely would not be leading the league (or close to it?) in rushing.
So, it seems that McAdoo (like Coughlin) are stubborn in this area when it comes to the RB. Yes, protecting Eli is the #1 job of the RB but Perkins has been doing that well.
I just feel that even if we drafted Zeke, we would be playing this game of spoon feed the rookie.
Despite popular belief, Jennings is not a guy that can be an every down back for 16 games at this point. They don't have a feature back.
If the Giants had Elliott, he would get the lion's share of carries, but Vereen would be worked in on passing downs.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
A RB needs to get more than 8-9 touches. He has to get into a groove. Also, the O-line has to get used to the back who is running behind them because they have different styles.
He'd get the chance, just like Perkins is, to earn more playing time.
You do realize our first round CB is starting, correct? And our 2nd round WR plays virtually every offensive snap. And our 3rd round FS was projected to start before injuries derailed his season. Not to mention the UDFAs that are major contributors:
Adams - starting FS
Okwara - was #3 DE, now possibly starter
Lewis - taking snaps from Cruz
So why do you think McAdoo would keep a talented player off the field?
Quote:
(8 rushes) over the last 5 games, yet you think McAdoo is stubborn? He's giving Perkins an opportunity to earn a larger role in the offense, it's up to Perkins to seize the chance.
This past Sunday was the only game during the 5 game stretch where Perkins averaged >4 yards/carry.
A RB needs to get more than 8-9 touches. He has to get into a groove. Also, the O-line has to get used to the back who is running behind them because they have different styles.
That's bullshit. It's not like he's popping in for a play or two here scattered throughout the game. He comes in for a series or two at a time. He has plenty of chances to earn more snaps.
You often lose blocking assignments and pass protection. Dallas can get away with having Elliot be their back - they have a good OL. Teams that can't, often have the rookie struggle to pick up pass pro.
Even look at a guy like Gurley. Is he somehow a terrible back this year? No - his OL sucks, and he's struggling in pass pro too.
So when a David Wilson or an Ahmad Bradshaw weren't immediate starters, it isn't because Eric Dickerson has teh reins, it is because Eli does and you don't want the rookie getting him killed.
Remember a couple of years ago the Cows had DeMarco Murray leading a very successful ground attack for Dallas. Dallas had a terrific OL granted and wonderful complementary weapons e.g. Des, Witten, Beasley et al
Yet when Dallas was compelled by the Salary cap to choose between Dez and DeMarco they ended up losing DeMarco to Philly where Kelly misused him and DeMarco's stats suffered greatly.
Today DeMarco is with another team and he is right up there with the league leaders statistically.
So what changed in re DeMarco? Was Philly's OL really that bad?
I don't think so.
Dallas used DeMarco set back in the Power I and ran stretch plays wherein DeMarco could get a running start and use his vision to pick the appropriate cut back lanes to maximize his gains
Philly did not use this formation placing DeMarco much closer to the line and the qb.
DeMarco's stats suffered egregiously
Now Dallas is using Zeke just like they used DeMarco and Voila win win.
This is a long winded set up to suggest that the shot gun formation used 90% of the time by the Jints may not be all that beneficial to their run game
I would like to see more of the Power I formations and lets see what Jennings and Perkins can do in the run game. I am particularly enamored of Perkins ability to make opponents miss. Should he get more of an opportunity to use his vision and get a running start I wonder if he would be more productive even behind a Jint OL that is admittedly challenged in their run blocking
I would have to think that this rating included their own projection as to how Perkins would fit with their offensive philosophy as noted above
Another fun stat: Elliot has more yards before contact than the Jaguars have total rushing yards.
The Cowboys run blocking is just dominant.
But if we have him, we don't have Apple, and who would be the third corner?
Oh wait, we did draft Apple and he is starting over DRC.
FM has it, that's why Jennings is not losing to many carries to quickly. That said hopefully we see more and more Perkins because he seems to be blocking well now.
Cowboys knocked it out of the park if Zak doesn't become
a one year wonder but right now I don't see that and that
team will be set for years .
Apple will be a solid player who will only get better and
DRC won't be around forever . But we still have plenty to doto stay competitive . There is nothing remarkable about ourdrafting and we have little room to make mistakes especially in the first four rounds .
Fuck the attributes and projects
and potential . Give me football players that have produced
against big time programs . Sure once in a while you get
a Kalil Mack or an Osi and some other small schools but
not that many . Have we don't a bit better lately ?
So far yes but even our high round picks that are still
here have not played long enough to know for sure .
If so he gets about 20 ypg more and the Giants score about 24 PPG more.
ZogZerg : 12:34 pm : link : reply
Would the Giants play him since they have DRC and Jenkins?
Oh wait, we did draft Apple and he is starting over DRC.
DRC can play slot corner, better than Apple, so that is why he is there, instead of corner.....it's not because he is better than DRC at corner.....
ZogZerg : 12:34 pm : link : reply
Would the Giants play him since they have DRC and Jenkins?
Oh wait, we did draft Apple and he is starting over DRC.
DRC can play slot corner, better than Apple, so that is why he is there, instead of corner.....it's not because he is better than DRC at corner.....
That ignores the fact that Apple plays in the base D over DRC.
He would be a failed draft pick. And it would be everybody's else fault but Eli's.
Not quite that bad. Even Jennings (and Perkins) have a higher ypc than Gurley. Eli/Beckham at least keep the D a little honest.
Yep. The Dallas OL in very very good. Giants? UGH
can we get someone else to evaluate the talent before we draft them?
I just don't see us beating Dallas. The offense is so inept and at this point in the season nothing is going to change.
Hey, I would have LOVED for the Giants to have drafted this guy, but the 2016 GIANTS would have been MUCH better with a stud OL than a RB -- even a real good one.
And now?
And now?
Not me, I was not happy at all they drafted him. I was hoping they stuck with the two journeyman they had last year... lol
Looking at Anthony Brown's play/their secondary as a whole still and the fact they have a giant cap space allocated to RB for the foreseeable future, I say the jury is still out.
Bingo!