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Barry Sanders vs. Odell Beckahm Jr.

dep026 : 1/11/2017 5:49 pm
More exciting with the ball in his hands?
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...  
christian : 1/11/2017 7:04 pm : link
It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.
RE: ...  
djm : 1/11/2017 7:16 pm : link
In comment 13322009 christian said:
Quote:
It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.


Never mind the facts!

Anyone saying it's not even close isn't paying attention to what Beckham has accomplished through his first 3 seasons.

I know I know Beckham is a jerkoff self entitled prima Donna. He's also the most amazing wr to come along ever. And that's a fact. No one has done what he's done through 3 seasons. No one.
Barry  
crick n NC : 1/11/2017 7:19 pm : link
Sanders made four yard runs amazing
Most amazing WR ever?  
Go Terps : 1/11/2017 7:24 pm : link
No hyperbole there.

Here are Barry Sanders's stats from his junior year at Oklahoma State. These seem like hyperbole, but they are not:

344 carries
2628 yards
7.6 yards/carry
37 TDs (all rushing)
1 PR TD
1 KR TD

That stat line occurred over 11 games.

Odell Beckham is an incredible talent. He is not Barry Sanders.
RE: ...  
Jim in Fairfax : 1/11/2017 7:26 pm : link
In comment 13322009 christian said:
Quote:
It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.

Sure, but Sanders had to break thru the 7 and 8 man fronts to have a chance to break one. When OBJ gets the ball, he's already in the open field.
Terps  
djm : 1/11/2017 7:40 pm : link
Name one wr that did more amazing shit through the first three years of his career. You can't. I'm 100% certain of it. I didn't say he was going to end up as the most amazing wr of all time I said through his first three seasons. And I stand by that. Not randy moss. Not Jerry rice. Not Sterling sharpe. Not anyone. No one has turned 10 yards into 60 like Beckham has. If you don't like the word amazing we can use uncanny. The dude has set a new standard for yac ability.
RE: Most amazing WR ever?  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/11/2017 7:42 pm : link
In comment 13322018 Go Terps said:
Quote:
No hyperbole there.

Here are Barry Sanders's stats from his junior year at Oklahoma State. These seem like hyperbole, but they are not:

344 carries
2628 yards
7.6 yards/carry
37 TDs (all rushing)
1 PR TD
1 KR TD

That stat line occurred over 11 games.

Odell Beckham is an incredible talent. He is not Barry Sanders.

We get it. You don't like him. Or, as you prefer to position it, you're indifferent. But your bias is clear. Maybe we can discuss a permanent rotation of rookie QBs instead.
And you can't compare rbs to WRs  
djm : 1/11/2017 7:43 pm : link
Apples and oranges. Sanders was a rare breed of rb much like Beckham is at wr but rbs touch the ball 25 times a game and don't need things to go right to get the ball in their hands.

With that said If I had to choose which guy to build around in this era I'm taking Beckham without a moment's hesitation.
RE: RE: ...  
Diver_Down : 1/11/2017 7:46 pm : link
In comment 13322019 Jim in Fairfax said:
Quote:
In comment 13322009 christian said:


Quote:


It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.


Sure, but Sanders had to break thru the 7 and 8 man fronts to have a chance to break one. When OBJ gets the ball, he's already in the open field.


And that is what made Sanders so special. He was their offense. Every defender knew he was going to get the ball, and he would routinely break defender's ankles making them look silly. OBJ is a tremendous talent. He has quite a few catches that doesn't seem possible, but overall it's his YAC that has padded his stat line. He can turn 10 into 60 in flash.
.  
Go Terps : 1/11/2017 7:48 pm : link
Gatorade - I'm not indifferent. I don't like him. There isn't much to like about him except that he's a very good football player. Lots of jerks have been good football players.

djm - The question wasn't who had the best first three years of his career. And I would hold off on comparing Beckham to Rice or Moss. Rice is still the best guy I've ever seen turning an 8 yard slant into a 70 yard TD, and he did it in an era where the middle of the field was a far more dangerous place than it is today. And I don't think the league has ever seen a pure deep threat like Randy Moss.

Just ease up a bit on the all time talk for Beckham. It's been three years. There are guys that have done it for far longer.
Sanders had Herman Moore in his offense  
djm : 1/11/2017 7:51 pm : link
He didn't have nothing. By the way he won jack squat in Detroit. He was amazing in every sense. He danced and juked and squirted for 1500 yards every season like no one can. He also took a lot of negative hits behind the line of scrimmage.

Since we're dying to bring up beckham's negative qualities I figured I'd beat some to the punch.
That's fair to say about rice  
djm : 1/11/2017 7:55 pm : link
Rice did it in a tougher era for WRs. He also had the best offensive personnel surrounding him.

I'm not even dreaming of putting Beckham in any all time category. I never even hinted at that. I said three years. What Beckham has done here is ofher worldly. If they ever surround Beckham with half the talent that those niner teams trotted out there the guy will own the NFL record books. Could you imagine Beckham playing along side John Taylor, Brett jones and roger Craig or Ricky waters? And an oline? And the most accurate west coast qb ever??

We can't go there though.
It's not an insult to come up second best to Barry Sanders  
Go Terps : 1/11/2017 7:56 pm : link
Sanders is a Hall of Famer, one of the best RBs ever, and in the conversation for the most exciting player in the history of the game.

No one deserves to be mentioned in his class after playing three years. It's absurd.
Beckham  
markky : 1/11/2017 8:12 pm : link
i like how he can just run away from the defense. sanders had too many plays that resulted in a loss for my taste.
RE: .  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/11/2017 8:13 pm : link
In comment 13322039 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Gatorade - I'm not indifferent. I don't like him. There isn't much to like about him except that he's a very good football player. Lots of jerks have been good football players.

I'm sorry, I thought that was the whole point. If you want friends, take up a hobby.
Sanders is in a class of his own  
TD : 1/11/2017 8:29 pm : link
Love me some OBJ - and I have no problem calling him a great player with the potential to be an all-time great, but Barry was the most exciting player ever. Period. Next paragraph..
Sanders  
est1986 : 1/11/2017 8:30 pm : link
.
RE: RE: .  
Go Terps : 1/11/2017 8:30 pm : link
In comment 13322061 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 13322039 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Gatorade - I'm not indifferent. I don't like him. There isn't much to like about him except that he's a very good football player. Lots of jerks have been good football players.


I'm sorry, I thought that was the whole point. If you want friends, take up a hobby.


If I didn't think Beckham's bullshit adversely affected the team, I wouldn't care.
Trying to imagine  
Deej : 1/11/2017 8:35 pm : link
how the internet would chew up Sanders for all his team's 5 win seasons, given all the shit Odell personally takes for us losing a wildcard game on the road in freezing conditions. All you'd hear about are the negative runs.
RE: RE: RE: .  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/11/2017 8:54 pm : link
In comment 13322073 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 13322061 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 13322039 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Gatorade - I'm not indifferent. I don't like him. There isn't much to like about him except that he's a very good football player. Lots of jerks have been good football players.


I'm sorry, I thought that was the whole point. If you want friends, take up a hobby.



If I didn't think Beckham's bullshit adversely affected the team, I wouldn't care.

You're right - they'd win way more than 11 games without him. Try needlepoint.
...  
christian : 1/11/2017 9:11 pm : link
The mere mention of OBJ seems to sound the don't pay attention alarm.

The OP poses the question: who's more exciting with the ball in their hands. Not a success, talent, value proposition.

The question can be asked of many players without the value, productivity and reputation that Sanders thought.

OBJ right now, no further evidence needed is in the conversation of excitement as Barry Sanders, Dion Sanders, Hester, Sayers, Homer Jones, Swann etc.

For my money I'd put him on the top shelf with the Sanders.
The 6 most exciting players I've seen  
Big Blue '56 : 1/11/2017 9:11 pm : link
in no particular order, Sanders, LT, OBJ, Sayers, Jimmy Brown and Butkus
The Lions were my 2nd favorite team because of Barry Sanders  
SHO'NUFF : 1/11/2017 9:22 pm : link
and I may have switched teams if they didn't suck so bad.
For every argument that the league was tougher back then  
Ten Ton Hammer : 1/11/2017 9:23 pm : link
there's the counter argument that the league is much more physically gifted now.

We like to wax poetic about how great nostalgia is, but the NFL is made up of 260lb freaks that can run down the seam and catch like a wide receiver, and 215 pound safeties that can cover downfield and stuff the run like nickel linebackers. The game Rice played is very different than the game Beckham is playing. In some ways it's easier and in some ways much harder. And the talent pool is much more evenly dispersed than it used to be.
RE: And you can't compare rbs to WRs  
dep026 : 1/11/2017 9:45 pm : link
In comment 13322034 djm said:
Quote:
Apples and oranges. Sanders was a rare breed of rb much like Beckham is at wr but rbs touch the ball 25 times a game and don't need things to go right to get the ball in their hands.

With that said If I had to choose which guy to build around in this era I'm taking Beckham without a moment's hesitation.


Since i have been watching football, these 2 with the ball have been the most exciting. I understand they are different position, but as far sa pure excitement, its tough to beat these two when they get the ball.
RE: Never really a comparison when a RB can touch the ball twice as much  
Giants2012 : 1/11/2017 10:08 pm : link
In comment 13321967 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
as a WR.


+1

B/c of the touches, Sanders.
Sanders  
PaulBlakeTSU : 1/11/2017 10:28 pm : link
I love Beckham's abilities, but in terms of the question asked, I've never seen anyone like Sanders.
RE: The Lions were my 2nd favorite team because of Barry Sanders  
Gatorade Dunk : 1/11/2017 10:35 pm : link
In comment 13322118 SHO'NUFF said:
Quote:
and I may have switched teams if they didn't suck so bad.

2nd favorite team? In the same conference? No. Just no.
The players are hard for me to compare.  
arcarsenal : 1/11/2017 10:38 pm : link
It goes without saying that they play different positions. But my most vivid memories of Sanders were between the ages of like.. 8 and 15.. so the scope through which I watched him was much different than my 30+ year old eyes that are watching Beckham.

I also didn't watch every Detroit Lions game as a young kid the way I watch every Giants game now. It was obviously a lot harder to have access to every NFL game the way we do now.

So, really.. my memories of Barry are a lot of Thanksgiving games and watching him whenever the Lions were on here in NY.. which was once in a while. He was one of my favorite players to watch as a kid. I had his jersey, his figurine, etc. I found him more exciting to watch than any other player in football during those years.

I think just from a volume standpoint, I'd say Sanders. Obviously in my older age I've watched more of him via highlights, replays of old games, etc. There's just a lot more tape of Sanders doing incredible things while Beckham has only been around 3 years now.

Crazy that Barry was just a year removed from a 2000 yard season where he averaged over 6 yards per carry when he hung it up. What an incredible talent. Much like Beckham is now, Sanders was a threat to take it to the house every single time he had the football.
Can't go wrong with either, really.  
Dave in Hoboken : 1/11/2017 11:43 pm : link
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Beckham's talent is exciting for the game  
NINEster : 1/12/2017 12:42 am : link
I remarked awhile ago that since the end of the Rice/Taylor era and then TO, that open field homerun threat off the WCO slant has gone missing for awhile, and Odell is the best thing since.

What I'm most curious about is why wasn't Beckham considered a more blue chip can't miss draft prospect?
mike  
zeroburrito : 1/12/2017 2:39 am : link
vick.
RE: ...  
giantgiantfan : 1/12/2017 4:34 am : link
In comment 13322009 christian said:
Quote:
It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.


Oh yeah? And how many guys did Odell have to beat on those? Generally two, but sometimes more. Barry Sanders had to beat damn near an entire team on all his runs. This is no contest. Barry is one of the great ones. Odell has played 3 years.
The jukes, the broken tackles,  
giantgiantfan : 1/12/2017 4:37 am : link
and all done with a franchise only slightly less shitty than the Cleveland Browns. And he's the only reason the Lions are slightly less shitty than Cleveland. Barry Sanders is the Detriot Lions SuperBowl.
jukes, broken tackles, the defense rests. - ( New Window )
Sanders was exciting BUT:  
Victor in CT : 1/12/2017 8:40 am : link
if you had to go a 3rd and short with the game on the line was he the guy you wanted or Emmitt Smith? Great as Sanders was, I always felt he was more worried about making the big show play than getting the important yard. You could stop him in a big spot because rather than get the 1 yard he start juking and back peddling
RE: Sanders was exciting BUT:  
rsjem1979 : 1/12/2017 9:10 am : link
In comment 13322364 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
if you had to go a 3rd and short with the game on the line was he the guy you wanted or Emmitt Smith?


Well, yeah, I'd pick the guy running behind one of the best offensive lines in NFL history.
JFC  
djm : 1/12/2017 9:47 am : link
we aren't talking about who was the more productive player or who had the better career....of course Barry had the better career he played 10 years or more.

Sanders by a million miles  
Brown Recluse : 1/12/2017 9:55 am : link
.
RE: RE: ...  
christian : 1/12/2017 10:00 am : link
In comment 13322306 giantgiantfan said:
Quote:
In comment 13322009 christian said:


Quote:


It's not so crazy to consider. Sanders for a career hit on 15 scores of 50 yards.

OBJ has I think 10 60 plus scores in 3 years.

I'll try and trudge up the articles - OBJ has an insane % of yards on YAC, so he's doing a lot of his big strikes with his feet.



Oh yeah? And how many guys did Odell have to beat on those? Generally two, but sometimes more. Barry Sanders had to beat damn near an entire team on all his runs. This is no contest. Barry is one of the great ones. Odell has played 3 years.


And again the question wasn't who's more talented, who has/had a harder job. The question was who's more exciting with the ball in his hands.
RE: Sanders by a million miles  
djm : 1/12/2017 10:24 am : link
In comment 13322436 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
.


Says the poster who insists that the 90s Dallas teams wouldn't win in this era because of the media coverage? Right.
If you're too young to have watched Barry Sanders play  
ATL_Giants : 1/12/2017 11:08 am : link
..it was amazing. Watching highlight reels doesn't do justice to the magic of watching him perform real time. His balance and escapability were awesome to watch.

Also, WR to RB isn't an equitable comparison.
Sanders by a longshot  
PatersonPlank : 1/12/2017 11:11 am : link
Current guys like Antonio Brown are just as good as Beckham with the ball.
Sanders  
Bubba : 1/12/2017 11:16 am : link
was one of the most amazing running backs I ever saw. The OL loved him. Their assignment was to simply block the guy across from them and let Barry pick the hole.
RE: If you're too young to have watched Barry Sanders play  
gidiefor : Mod : 1/12/2017 11:30 am : link
In comment 13322558 ATL_Giants said:
Quote:
..it was amazing. Watching highlight reels doesn't do justice to the magic of watching him perform real time. His balance and escapability were awesome to watch.

Also, WR to RB isn't an equitable comparison.


this is true -- I went back and looked through his highlight reels and it really didn;t capture how amazing Sanders was through the course of a game -- Detroit was basically a non-team during the Sanders years and he made them fun to watch the ebb and flow of an entire game. It worth watching a Detroit game on thanksgiving just to watch him play - the moves this guy made were unreal -- and I guess you could compare his game seed to Odell but Sanders did it as someone else indicated above from the backfield through the line and then broke free and he did it artfully and beautifully time and time again and very consistently
Sanders.  
Britt in VA : 1/12/2017 11:32 am : link
.
As great as he was, Sanders didn't have the explosiveness  
Section331 : 1/12/2017 11:33 am : link
Odell has. His brilliance was in his vision, and unbelievable quickness in tight space. I've never seen anyone like him. There is, however, a certain kind of beauty in seeing Odell explode into an open field.
I'm not taking anything away from OBJ  
gidiefor : Mod : 1/12/2017 11:37 am : link
but I loved watching Sanders play
Sanders  
Simms : 1/13/2017 7:29 am : link
His college stats would have been higher, but even back in HS when records were to be set, he was willing to sit if the game was in hand and let others play. Did so in college too.

If he wanted to keep playing, he could have broken the all time record and placed it far out of Emmitt Smith's reach EASY.

But he walked away from the game, polite but weary in some ways.

A great man, who you never had to worry about antics on or off the field. It was never considered in your thoughts.

Its nice to compare OBJ, but in Barry's era OBJ playing within the LT era of the NFC east. Think he would have been put in place in ways never has experienced yet. And the league would not have fined anyone back then like they do now.

Its not a close comparison. Barry by many, many miles.
In terms  
PaulBlakeTSU : 1/13/2017 9:11 am : link
of pure excitement with the ball in their hands (not in terms of value to the team, or production as a football players, I think I would add Devin Hester when the ball was in his hands after receiving a punt.

But since I've been watching football, no one comes close to Barry in terms of that kind of excitement.
RE: It's not an insult to come up second best to Barry Sanders  
Section331 : 1/13/2017 10:03 am : link
In comment 13322047 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Sanders is a Hall of Famer, one of the best RBs ever, and in the conversation for the most exciting player in the history of the game.

No one deserves to be mentioned in his class after playing three years. It's absurd.


I didn't read the question as who is better. If it were, I would 100% agree with you. Odell has a ways to go approach Barry Sanders' careers; he's an all time great.

The question, however, was which one do you think was more exciting with the ball in his hands. While Sanders' uncanny ability to make guys miss in tight spaces was otherworldly, watching Odell break into the open field is amazing to watch. I'm willing to admit that my Giant bias may influence that, but it is, after all, a subjective exercise.
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