Our biggest decision this offseason will be what to do about JPP and bringing him back. No slight on Hankins but I think we'd all agree that the JPP is a more valuable piece for this defense.
It got me thinking about JPP vs OV. Forgetting age and what the contracts will wind up being who do you think is a better player?
Personally, I think it's JPP. He has better measurable (even with the loss of a few fingers) and is a more natural pass rusher. Both are great against the run but I think JPP has more wiggle in the pass game and does a great job of knocking balls down at the LOS.
OV, had a good season for us but I'm not sure I see any upside with him. I think he's an 8-10 sack guy who will be a great edge run defender.
Interesting take. JPP is going to get paid more than Hankins by virtue of pass rushing being more valued than interior DL. I think we can get by with a rotation of Bromley/Thomas/FAVET(or draft pick) next to snacks.
Conversely if we lose JPP I don't see any possible way to replace his production next year.
Perhaps my choice of words was wrong. What I mean about OV is I don't see an extra gear or any untapped potential with him. He's a sound player from a technique standpoint and is has now played five full years. Athletically/physically I don't think he can do the things JPP can do.
JPP vs. Hank - I'd rather get Hankins back as well. I do want JPP back, but I think he's holding out for top dollar and I think cost/benefit wise Hankins will provide greater ROI. It will suck if we lose JPP though.
He has only played one full season in his 7 years with the Giants. It is more than likely that will not get better as he gets older.
JPP at a reasonable contract...otherwise, goodbye. OV played a complete full season, played through a broken hand, and was a big impact in terms of the pass rush, admittedly more pressures than sacks, and also in defending the run game.
I like JPP but, let's be realistic, his injury past does not inspire confidence going forward.
I don't see him ever being a 13-14 sack guy that I think JPP can accomplish.
Interesting to see a few of you value Hankins over JPP though. I think the contracts each will net is a strong indication of what's more important to the team.
Secondly, I'm not really sure why a comparison really needs to be made between the two in regards to whether or not to sign him. They both played very well.
The Giants will assign a value to both Hankins and JPp, and will likely make offers to both. I don't expect the conversation in the FO will start with "Is JPP better than Vernon?"
He has only played one full season in his 7 years with the Giants. It is more than likely that will not get better as he gets older.
JPP at a reasonable contract...otherwise, goodbye. OV played a complete full season, played through a broken hand, and was a big impact in terms of the pass rush, admittedly more pressures than sacks, and also in defending the run game.
I like JPP but, let's be realistic, his injury past does not inspire confidence going forward.
Some good points Jerry. However, 2 of OV 8.5 sacks came in that Cleveland game too. I don't think you can cherry pick when the sacks game and against whom.
In fact I can think of two game changing sacks from JPP and cant think of any from OV. One was against the skins at the end of the half and the other when Chicago was driving for the winning score.
Secondly, I'm not really sure why a comparison really needs to be made between the two in regards to whether or not to sign him. They both played very well.
The Giants will assign a value to both Hankins and JPp, and will likely make offers to both. I don't expect the conversation in the FO will start with "Is JPP better than Vernon?"
I don't think they will either. Vernon was 25 heading into free agency and was a better signing than a 28 yr old 7 fingered JPP. Just curious who people think is the better player putting contracts/age aside.
I cant predict the future so I wont try.
lol
Dallas is a bad example IMO. They're a team looking to run the ball all game. Against a team like GB where they're going to throw the majority of the game OV was nowhere near the QB. JPP on the other side would have been a big help.
I cant predict the future so I wont try.
That's the problem - handing a player money is doing exactly that, predicting the future.
I'm less concerned about JPP's fingers than I am his back and the rest of his body. At 28, there's a good chance he starts to break down.
Not that I don't want him back, or that I wouldn't pay him double digits millions, but I think I'd refrain from paying top DE dollar because I don't expect him to age well.
He's one of the few players I'd pay for despite the injured past. His injury this year was unrelated to his hand or back which is a really good thing.
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I'd love to have him back (I want everyone!) but the 2nd Dallas game showed what they can do without him. However, there's no question the pass rush wasn't as effective without him.
Dallas is a bad example IMO. They're a team looking to run the ball all game. Against a team like GB where they're going to throw the majority of the game OV was nowhere near the QB. JPP on the other side would have been a big help.
We'd be saying the same thing if OV was out and JPP was in most likely. You need 2 pass rushers in this league, plain and simple.
He's one of the few players I'd pay for despite the injured past. His injury this year was unrelated to his hand or back which is a really good thing.
Agree. The giants need to bolster their pass rush WITH JPP. Losing JPP would be a big step back for this team IMO.
I like Hankins but he's replaceable.
Hankins vs JPP .... Build middle to the outside ... IMO
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
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JPP has had one year where he played pretty much the entire year. I don't think it's make or break in bringing him back. I think having a run stuffing interior is more critical.
Interesting take. JPP is going to get paid more than Hankins by virtue of pass rushing being more valued than interior DL. I think we can get by with a rotation of Bromley/Thomas/FAVET(or draft pick) next to snacks.
Conversely if we lose JPP I don't see any possible way to replace his production next year.
This kind of thinking led to Cofield and Joseph walking which led to wasted draft picks on replacements (Austin) and questionable FA contracts (Canty).
It's a tough call between JPP and Hankins. Hopefully it doesn't come to that, but Hankins deserves a little more credit in terms of his value to the defense. Snacks and Hankins were the main reason why the run defense was so good this year.
That said , having both of them with the secondary staying as good as they were with DRC in can be a dominant defense.
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
Some good points but DRC is not a free agent. He has two years left on his contract.
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While OV and JPP were strong in run support, the crucial components of the defense all season were the Snacks/Hankins combo in the middle and the excellent secondary.
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
Some good points but DRC is not a free agent. He has two years left on his contract.
He does? Then why all the discussion of him leaving?
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In comment 13322633 Go Terps said:
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While OV and JPP were strong in run support, the crucial components of the defense all season were the Snacks/Hankins combo in the middle and the excellent secondary.
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
Some good points but DRC is not a free agent. He has two years left on his contract.
He does? Then why all the discussion of him leaving?
Relatively high cap # and only played 60 percent or so of snaps.
Only a simpleton rates a DE by sacks. How many times does that have to be explained?
But I do agree that JPP is much more valuable than Hankins and wish someone who disagrees would explain why the think so? Hankins is a solid DT in this game and he is still young but he has not shown that he is a "special player" the way JPP is. IMHO BBI has Hankins overrated.
I think the Giants like Romeo but if they lost JPP I'd be surprised if they didn't shoot for a player like Calias Campbell or use a top two draft choice on a DE. If JPP is gone we cant rely solely on the current roster to replace him.
I'm with Terps on DRC. I think he means more to this defense right now than JPP does (and I'm a huge fan). Our exit from the playoffs happened as soon as DRC went down. Unless they have a plan for someone else just as good, I have no interest in watching us trot someone else out there to cover the slot.
Many on BBI refuse to eat the crow they so deserve.
I don't think it'd be a draft pick, either (although I do expect them to select a DE). If JPP bolts, I'd look for them to sign another FA DE.
Giants were 9th in the NFL as a team.
Both guys are excellent pass rushers.
The solution is to bring back JPP and find a 3rd player to help with the pass rush.
QB hurries in 2016 - ( New Window )
I'm with Terps on DRC. I think he means more to this defense right now than JPP does (and I'm a huge fan). Our exit from the playoffs happened as soon as DRC went down. Unless they have a plan for someone else just as good, I have no interest in watching us trot someone else out there to cover the slot.
Whether true or not there appeared to be some rumblings going into the season the Giants were unhappy with DRC taking himself off the field the last few years. I think they really tried to keep him healthy. Good points about Apple though.
I'd let Hankins walk and keep JPP and DRC.
Giants were 9th in the NFL as a team.
Both guys are excellent pass rushers.
The solution is to bring back JPP and find a 3rd player to help with the pass rush. QB hurries in 2016 - ( New Window )
This is my thoughts too Kwall.
OV: small, tough as nails, high effort, great against the run, constant pressure, versatile, a true football player
Based on natural ability, I would say JPP is the better of the 2, but I think Vernon has become the better overall football player in that he has to give a higher effort to get production.
Both are relentless which is why I think JPP is a priority to sign over Hankins.
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and sign Hankins.
I'd let Hankins walk and keep JPP and DRC.
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In comment 13322668 Victor in CT said:
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and sign Hankins.
I'd let Hankins walk and keep JPP and DRC.
Why keep JPP? He padded his stats against bad teams. Always has
Have you ever watched JPP play?? Jesus are we forgetting he is a relentless monster great against run and pass?? Jesus that's a dumb thing to say. Someone tried to discredit OV earlier because 2 of his sacks came against the Browns. Joe fucking Thomas? Are you kidding me? The "padding stats against bad teams" argument sucks find another one.
No slam dunk, imv. I wouldn't go multi years beyond 3-4. Wonder if the team feels he's worth more than they did before his injury when they offered him $12M per ... market has increased, but he's also two years older.
Might be best to draft a DE, franchise him, and punt the decision to next season when a longer term deal will likely be enough of a concern to push his overall value down.
Might be best to draft a DE, franchise him, and punt the decision to next season when a longer term deal will likely be enough of a concern to push his overall value down.
My only fear with the tag is the cap hit will be super high in an offseason where we need to also get atleast 1 starter on the OL and think about Hankins and others. I bet it could work, but it probably gets really dicey and I doubt they want to restructure Eli and jeopardize future cap.
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He's definitely worth the money right now. But he's 28, and been injured a lot. Will he be worth it in 3 years?
Might be best to draft a DE, franchise him, and punt the decision to next season when a longer term deal will likely be enough of a concern to push his overall value down.
My only fear with the tag is the cap hit will be super high in an offseason where we need to also get atleast 1 starter on the OL and think about Hankins and others. I bet it could work, but it probably gets really dicey and I doubt they want to restructure Eli and jeopardize future cap.
32 million in cap plus another 15-20 after some cuts. Closer to 15 if DRC stays with us which we all hope he does.
Tag number shouldn't be an issue.
I think this year was a large enough sample for the team to discern what JPP can do with his hand and not. As for injury concerns, I don't believe there is any added risk of serious injury to the hand. I'd be more worried about his back.
I don't think you can fairly critique JPP's early performance this season without indicting the entire defense, which we can say at that juncture was less than stellar. From a pure stats perspective, JPP's obviously improved as the defense over all did. His 7 and a half sacks may have been 10 0r 11 by years end. Nevertheless he has also demonstrated a strong ability to defend against the run.
I'd make it a priority to sign JPP. I hat the idea of being forced to spend a valuable draft pick on a DE instead of addressing other problem areas. To me that is standing in place.
I'd decide what my line in the sand was. I'd go in with a strong offer. If he takes it excellent. If not move on to plan B
Go watch Week 1 vs. Dallas. Vernon has an awesome game vs. one of the best OL in the league. JPP struggles against Doug Free who is above average at best, and was getting one on one almost all of it. He's really good just not as good as OV.
I would be okay with not giving big money to him if they can keep Hankins and pay lesser money to a DE in the draft, if not draft one high.
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In comment 13322765 jcn56 said:
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He's definitely worth the money right now. But he's 28, and been injured a lot. Will he be worth it in 3 years?
Might be best to draft a DE, franchise him, and punt the decision to next season when a longer term deal will likely be enough of a concern to push his overall value down.
My only fear with the tag is the cap hit will be super high in an offseason where we need to also get atleast 1 starter on the OL and think about Hankins and others. I bet it could work, but it probably gets really dicey and I doubt they want to restructure Eli and jeopardize future cap.
32 million in cap plus another 15-20 after some cuts. Closer to 15 if DRC stays with us which we all hope he does.
Tag number shouldn't be an issue.
Why? It will be over $16 million for DE's and the goal isn't just to use up all the cap possible. We had a ton roll over for 2016, every dollar counts when planning for the future.
$16 million tag for JPP + a modest $12-$14 million for Hankins and say a top FA Guard and there's that $30 million.
I'm guessing the Giants want to spend closer to $10 million per on JPP which leaves $6 million for another starter somewhere on this roster.
I keep saying you can get him for 4 years and 50M or so. You give him 33M guaranteed and he has the highest guaranteed money per year for a 4-3 DE while only a 4 year contract. 21M signing bonus gets him more than Vernon
I totally agree, when he wants to play he is one of the best however when he isn't motivated he is at best average. Went to see him a few years back in KC and he dogged on that field all day long. Finally went to the ground on a light hit and never returned. I will never forget it. Not sure he is worth the money at the end of the day. Hankins is worth the money and I don't want to see him leave. Snacks and Hankins in the middle for years to come and add BJ Goodson --we will stop the run!
I meant $12-14$ million total ($6 or $7mm each) for Hankins and a FA Guard.
I suspect they make him a very lucrative offer.
I also suspect the Giants will offer Hankins a bit less than he will make elsewhere.
Just a hunch. DE > DT
Go watch the 4th quarter and see who made the plays to force Dallas to punt. It was JPP with instant pressure on the QB.
He was excellent early and the year and it continued all year long.
The Giants defense was excellent early too. 2 of the best performances were Dallas and NO. Both in the first weeks of the season.
Seriously talent evaluation on this forum is horrible..
At age 29 going into next season, we need to be careful that we're paying the correct price for his performance going forward, not paying for what he's already done for us. I think DRC is the more valuable piece for this defense and Hankins is still an ascending player at age 24 (similar to OV). In order to make the money work, if it's a choice between an OV style deal for JPP, hanging onto DRC (if that's even a question), and signing Hankins to an extension, I think I'm picking DRC and Hankins first and thanking JPP for all he's done, but allowing him to get that money elsewhere that he's absolutely deserved.
Hopefully we can make all three work though...
At age 29 going into next season, we need to be careful that we're paying the correct price for his performance going forward, not paying for what he's already done for us. I think DRC is the more valuable piece for this defense and Hankins is still an ascending player at age 24 (similar to OV). In order to make the money work, if it's a choice between an OV style deal for JPP, hanging onto DRC (if that's even a question), and signing Hankins to an extension, I think I'm picking DRC and Hankins first and thanking JPP for all he's done, but allowing him to get that money elsewhere that he's absolutely deserved.
Hopefully we can make all three work though...
Definitely agree, but we can't get in a bidding war and overpay for JPP, gonna need to spend on a bona-fide LT and put Flowers somewhere he can function at least adequately.
Only a simpleton rates a DE by sacks. How many times does that have to be explained?
Unfortunately for you, this board is rife with simpletons.
At age 29 going into next season, we need to be careful that we're paying the correct price for his performance going forward, not paying for what he's already done for us. I think DRC is the more valuable piece for this defense and Hankins is still an ascending player at age 24 (similar to OV). In order to make the money work, if it's a choice between an OV style deal for JPP, hanging onto DRC (if that's even a question), and signing Hankins to an extension, I think I'm picking DRC and Hankins first and thanking JPP for all he's done, but allowing him to get that money elsewhere that he's absolutely deserved.
Hopefully we can make all three work though...
I agree, but you could argue JPP's presence would have made life easier for OV against GB. Okwara had one great game, but largely disappeared afterwards, but people here were set to name Okwara the next great DE for us.
gmenatlarge- I'm with you. Too many needs on offense, plus Hankins and fitting in DRC, to give JPP the same deal OV got. Just isn't feasible, as well as I thought he played this season.
That said I think JPP is going to get a lot of money for a team more in need of defensive help. I think the Giants will do what they did for Tuck and like Tuck JPP will go for the money AS HE SHOULD!
Now its well known that you want as many people who can rush the passer as possible and I feel like JR is going to 'reach' this year if he thinks one is available in the first round(SY, Anakim can speak to that far better). I won't be against it considering its out there that OL is seen as a weak position in this years draft AND that Jerry has had better results reaching for 1st round DE's than 1st round OL.....
That said I think JPP is going to get a lot of money for a team more in need of defensive help. I think the Giants will do what they did for Tuck and like Tuck JPP will go for the money AS HE SHOULD!
Now its well known that you want as many people who can rush the passer as possible and I feel like JR is going to 'reach' this year if he thinks one is available in the first round(SY, Anakim can speak to that far better). I won't be against it considering its out there that OL is seen as a weak position in this years draft AND that Jerry has had better results reaching for 1st round DE's than 1st round OL.....
Don't think the TUck and JPP situations are comparable. Tuck got a 2 yr 5 millionish deal. The giants simply no longer wanted Justin.
I'm still at $10 million. At that price he's worth more thank Hankins, IMO. But when we get into that $12 million + range I think it becomes pretty equal or even advantage Hankins (due to what we can do with the other $6 million or so).
Seriously talent evaluation on this forum is horrible..
Yes, Hankins will be easier to replace than JPP. Great 2 way 4-3 DEs don't grow on trees.
Tuck is so different because he was playing as a beat up 30 year old with the Giants. JPP just turned 28
What is this 'over pay number" that many seem to be thinking he is getting. What is the so called 'non-overpay number. Has this board been happy with any player who has signed a contract here?
Who is this LT they are supposed to be paying in FA commanding all this money?
JPP on the other hand could command $15M or more. If that's the case, and you're committing to say, guaranteeing that over the next 4 years (at which point he'd be nearing 32 years old), would you feel comfortable making that call?
I think $12M is where I'd go for JPP, unless we're talking really short term or team friendly in terms of structure.
I'd pay JPP up to 13-14 per year.
I'd pay JPP up to 13-14 per year.
I don't. We tend to overrate our players and this could be an example of that since Snacks is such a monster. $8 million would be almost 30% more than what Linval Joseph got who, at that time, was our best DT. This is several years later, but 1, Does the market view Hankins like they did Linval and 2, will teams be scared to pay a guy that much who isn't the best DT on the team?
I don't know the answer to either question but my best guess tells me no to both.
And i'm not shitting on Hankins, I love him. But when it comes to contract talks playing next to Snacks will be one of the first things GM's will look at to determine worth.
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In comment 13322782 UConn4523 said:
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In comment 13322765 jcn56 said:
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He's definitely worth the money right now. But he's 28, and been injured a lot. Will he be worth it in 3 years?
Might be best to draft a DE, franchise him, and punt the decision to next season when a longer term deal will likely be enough of a concern to push his overall value down.
My only fear with the tag is the cap hit will be super high in an offseason where we need to also get atleast 1 starter on the OL and think about Hankins and others. I bet it could work, but it probably gets really dicey and I doubt they want to restructure Eli and jeopardize future cap.
32 million in cap plus another 15-20 after some cuts. Closer to 15 if DRC stays with us which we all hope he does.
Tag number shouldn't be an issue.
Why? It will be over $16 million for DE's and the goal isn't just to use up all the cap possible. We had a ton roll over for 2016, every dollar counts when planning for the future.
$16 million tag for JPP + a modest $12-$14 million for Hankins and say a top FA Guard and there's that $30 million.
I'm guessing the Giants want to spend closer to $10 million per on JPP which leaves $6 million for another starter somewhere on this roster.
12-14 million for Hankins that is nuts IMO, Harrison makes less than 9mil I think. And you franchise JPP totally thinking about the future. If you have the cap why not use it on a one year deal! key word, one year!
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I'd be shocked if Hankins got less than an avg of 8 per year.
I'd pay JPP up to 13-14 per year.
I don't. We tend to overrate our players and this could be an example of that since Snacks is such a monster. $8 million would be almost 30% more than what Linval Joseph got who, at that time, was our best DT. This is several years later, but 1, Does the market view Hankins like they did Linval and 2, will teams be scared to pay a guy that much who isn't the best DT on the team?
I don't know the answer to either question but my best guess tells me no to both.
And i'm not shitting on Hankins, I love him. But when it comes to contract talks playing next to Snacks will be one of the first things GM's will look at to determine worth.
If I were a GM of another team, I wouldn't back up the Brinks truck for Hankins. He did very little last season when he was "the man". When he's playing off of Snacks and OV, he looks better. Very unproven commodity when he gets all the attention IMO.
For that reason I think Hankings will get a middle of the road contract for a DT, maybe a bit more depending on how quickly he signs a deal.
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JPP has had one year where he played pretty much the entire year. I don't think it's make or break in bringing him back. I think having a run stuffing interior is more critical.
Interesting take. JPP is going to get paid more than Hankins by virtue of pass rushing being more valued than interior DL. I think we can get by with a rotation of Bromley/Thomas/FAVET(or draft pick) next to snacks.
Conversely if we lose JPP I don't see any possible way to replace his production next year.
And we could probably get by without you, but who's counting? Hankins is the more important target given the context of price.
I forgot the Terps bias against good players (is there anyone else here who actively dislikes both JPP and Beckham?). I change my mind - give JPP whatever he wants just because.
Well you don't love Vernon so you must loath JPP. Actually we already knew that.
What does JPP's finger issue have to do with anything? I think it's clear the guy can play with his hand issue. Just a worthless post.
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Vernon has all 10 fingers. Start there.
Well you don't love Vernon so you must loath JPP. Actually we already knew that.
What does JPP's finger issue have to do with anything? I think it's clear the guy can play with his hand issue. Just a worthless post.
I don't remember saying I don't like Vernon. I like Vernon. He plays hard and is obviously willing to play hurt. I just don't think he's worth the contract. Sorry you can't make the distinction.
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
This I tend to agree with. Kind of... I think gun to my head I'm keeping Hankins over jpp. DRC better not be going anywhere.
If I'm prioritizing our defensive FAs, it's Hankins and DRC well before JPP. Consider also that we have a viable replacement for JPP already in house with Okwara. We don't have such options already in place should Hankins and/or DRC leave.
I know the first instinct is to spend money on the offense, but I think the defense has to be the priority and it starts with Hankins and DRC (or replacements of similar quality).
Is DRC a free agent? Did I miss something?
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In comment 13322602 Go Terps said:
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Vernon has all 10 fingers. Start there.
Well you don't love Vernon so you must loath JPP. Actually we already knew that.
What does JPP's finger issue have to do with anything? I think it's clear the guy can play with his hand issue. Just a worthless post.
I don't remember saying I don't like Vernon. I like Vernon. He plays hard and is obviously willing to play hurt. I just don't think he's worth the contract. Sorry you can't make the distinction.
Exactly what type of team would you build? Clearly no one is worth their contract to you and you want a revolving door of rookie QBs. Do you actually want to root for a winning team, or just have a Scrooge McDuck amount of cap room that you can exercise your fetish to?
This is directed at the few on here that make shit up. What's with this "when healthy and motivated" crap about jpp? Seriously? What the fuck? JPP had one off year, 2013, when he was playing through an injury that sidelines everyone, including JJ Watt.
When has jpp not played hard? When? Stop making shit up! Stop copying what idiots parrot and go by what your eyes tell you. Jpp is one of the best DE's in the NFL and his whole game is predicated on effort and hustle.
Stop being ignorant.
The defense continued to play very well with Okwara after JPP went down. Actually, the defense played its best football of the season with Okwara, not JPP, at that position. That's not to say that Okwara is the better player, but the defense functioned at its highest level with him starting. That has to be taken into account when you are looking at JPP for huge cap space vs. Okwara for peanuts.
Okwara doesn't have to be better than JPP to be the better option. The defense functioned at its best with him starting. That is known.
And while DRC is not a free agent it appears he is a prime candidate to be a cap casualty. If he is, that position MUST be filled by an equal player...we learned that lesson in Green Bay.
As for Hankins, I think his quality is elevated by Snacks and vice versa. He also figures to cost much less than JPP.
I think there is a lot more to this than simply "DEs are harder to get than DTs".
Don't over think this. Maybe they are better off signing hank and spending jpp money elsewhere but make no mistake the defense is better with jpp in the lineup over Romeo fucking okwara. Cmon dude... you're killing me.
This is directed at the few on here that make shit up. What's with this "when healthy and motivated" crap about jpp? Seriously? What the fuck? JPP had one off year, 2013, when he was playing through an injury that sidelines everyone, including JJ Watt.
When has jpp not played hard? When? Stop making shit up! Stop copying what idiots parrot and go by what your eyes tell you. Jpp is one of the best DE's in the NFL and his whole game is predicated on effort and hustle.
Stop being ignorant.
Interesting that JJ Watt gets lauded for being a tirelessly hard worker, but JPP doesn't when they had down years with the same injury. Don't get where the effort talk comes into play, when a lot of JPP's tackles comes from backside pursuit.
It's a fair point, but we know that he and Snacks together were the backbone of the entire team this year.
If Hankins walks and he is not replaced by someone as good or better (is such a player available?) the defense will be significantly worse next year all over the field.
The DT spot next to Snacks is absolutely crucial if we want the defense to approach the same level next year.
Hankins and Snacks were great and JPP was coming on. In Miami he played w Suh and Cameron Wake. He was fucking held a lot so I'm inbit torn as I think knhe got screwed some but he needs to step it up. He's paid like a Von Miller. With all the talent around him I expected more.
Again no one knows how bad his wrist was but JPP looked damn good for a dude w his hand. I imagine he will be better next year
Hankins and Snacks were great and JPP was coming on. In Miami he played w Suh and Cameron Wake. He was fucking held a lot so I'm inbit torn as I think knhe got screwed some but he needs to step it up. He's paid like a Von Miller. With all the talent around him I expected more.
Again no one knows how bad his wrist was but JPP looked damn good for a dude w his hand. I imagine he will be better next year
Yes, free agents who earn all-pro honors their first year with a new team are a dime a dozen. You guys are unbelievable.
Maybe your expectations were more flawed than his performance.
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OV's production slipped when he went down. Vernon healthy will be interesting but the jury is out on whether his contract was a wise investment. By all accounts a great teammate and tireless worker but not sure about him
Hankins and Snacks were great and JPP was coming on. In Miami he played w Suh and Cameron Wake. He was fucking held a lot so I'm inbit torn as I think knhe got screwed some but he needs to step it up. He's paid like a Von Miller. With all the talent around him I expected more.
Again no one knows how bad his wrist was but JPP looked damn good for a dude w his hand. I imagine he will be better next year
Yes, free agents who earn all-pro honors their first year with a new team are a dime a dozen. You guys are unbelievable.
Maybe your expectations were more flawed than his performance.
He played in Miami next to great players. Now he was on a line where his play was again aided by the players around him IMO. i expected more sacks. He seemed to play very well. I don't know how bad he was hurt which I posited may have affected him in all fairness.
I guess paying more than JJ Watt tinged my expectations. For that cap value you need more. Why can't have that opinion? because it bothers some dope here on BBI? Sorry my opinion got your estrogen level up.
With JPP, Vernon and Snacks on the same line, and with talented blitzers DRC and Collins, this defense could be memorable.
If we have to overpay someone, overpaying for the pass rush is the most justified. The Giants have to face Dak twice a year, and Rodgers still stands in the way of going to the Super Bowl.
There might be consequences several years down the road for overspending now, but the clock is ticking on Eli. We don't know how long it will take to find his replacement, but I don't think we'll be as lucky as Dallas. Forced to draft Dak when the guy they really wanted was snatched right ahead of him, and then forced to play the guy when their vet QB went down.
All good.