Pardon me if this has been discussed before. But Rodgers dropped a lot more than expected. I'm sure part of it is the nature of the position and that teams usually don't draft QBs unless they have a need. But still, I think he's easily the most talented QB in the game right now. I also remember not thinking much of him at the time. But that's not coming from someone that follows college football. It just seemed like there wasn't that much excitement about him like there is about other QBs. Maybe I'm remembering wrong.
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So it wasnt like he was not considered good. A lot of talk about him going number one. But it just broke the way it did. It was ballsy of Pack to take him when they already had Favre. Think about if the Giants had the chance to draft OJ Howard next year but took Watson instead. There would be riots.
It's the draft.
Evaluating other humans performance potential is an inexact science...at best.
We've come to expect it, so I am not sure football fans appreciate it as much as they should.
They didn't anticipate him playing at a high level for 3 more seasons.
So it really came down to Smith over Rodgers, and shit like that happens sometimes.
This. I'm not a CFB guy, but I remember clearly that Rodgers was getting knocked repeatedly for buying a system QB, produced by a system that had churned out a number of dud QBs that put up gaudy college performances.
Ugh, b/c the 49ers didn't have a pick and we wouldn't give up Simms. I know it worked out but we really should have had L.T. and Reggie White while Montana was there for the taking had the Giants traded with the 49er who wanted Simms.
Taylor, White and Montana - geez
It was a pretty good draft though for first rounders if you go back and look...
That's enough to drop you in the NFL Draft. Not always, but it can.
But he fell because of a couple of other reasons... #1, Alex Smith was more mobile AND more intelligent... #2, Smith's Pro Day received borderline LEGENDARY hype... #3, Rodgers being a huge 49ers fan with a Cali background actually made the 49ers more hesitant to pick him because of the perceived added pressure... #4, shitty NFL teams just weren't looking for QBs that year as much as usual.
Also, the Packers made major changes to Rodgers' mechanics. He DID NOT throw or look like this in college. Those years he got to wait under Favre's wings gave him and the Packers time to mold him into the player he has become. He's basically the equivalent of a pitching prospect who was expected to throw 93-95 in the bigs, but a couple of little tweaks allowed him to throw 98-100 AND have more control.
Must have been a scout for the Browns(tains)...
Marino dropped b/c of his knee. Then again, he went in to the top 20 so not sure that qualifies as dropping.
One of the reasons, I would be ok if Reese and company picked a high round draft pick QB if there was someone worthy of it.
I think the Tedford influence played a part, but I also wonder if there was something in his interview process, or rumors flying around league circles. If you look at drafts prior to that one, and that followed, you see plenty of occasions where teams reached for QB's. There had to be something that scared teams away.
Also - those commenting on how he had a great chance to develop under Favre are right as well. It's not like he hasn't improved his game significantly in the past 11 years.
Here's the article referring to Rodgers as a "reach" pick. - ( New Window )
We've come to expect it, so I am not sure football fans appreciate it as much as they should.
Slow down....hyperbole much?
We've come to expect it, so I am not sure football fans appreciate it as much as they should.
It's not like the 1st Round is a dud while the 3rd Round has so many steals.
Com'on, it's not pick a player out of a hat.
Ugh, b/c the 49ers didn't have a pick and we wouldn't give up Simms. I know it worked out but we really should have had L.T. and Reggie White while Montana was there for the taking had the Giants traded with the 49er who wanted Simms.
Taylor, White and Montana - geez
Montana would have never survived behind that awful offensive line the Giants had in the early 80s. Simms barely did. With his slight build Montana would have been ground to bits. He probably would have been out of football before Parcells took over.
Monatana didn't "drop" He wasn't considered 1st round talent coming out of college due to his slight build and non-elite arm strength. Bill Walsh wanted Phil Simms but had no 1st Round pick that year. He planned on taking him with their 2nd Rounder but the Giants pounced in the 1st Round with the 7th overall pick.
Do you have a source for this? I hate to be that guy, but I've read it was almost entirely Mike Nolan's call.
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the best that a QB has ever played at any point in time, EVER. His throws are exactly what they need to be for the play at the time the ball is thrown. He puts the exact touch that each throw needs to give his receivers the best chance to make a play on the ball. You couple that with his ability to scramble and he's a man amongst boys...It's a pretty thing to watch.
We've come to expect it, so I am not sure football fans appreciate it as much as they should.
Clams, and it doesn't hurt that the Packers' receivers are really, sticky-fingered, hands catching WRS, TEs, RBs. They seem to have a deep crowd of guys who flat out catch, regardless of when/if drafted, even after Nelson went down. That's taking nothing away from AR because he usually puts the pass right on the money, in stride, leading them. As CC said during 4th Quarter (I think) when Heath intercepted a very poorly thrown ball, "That's one of AR's rare mistakes...."
I think the catches are more a product of his throws and the touch he puts on the ball. You can almost "NOT" not catch the ball. Look at the catches...he puts it exactly where it needs to be.....not every single throw, but a lot of them.
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Ugh, b/c the 49ers didn't have a pick and we wouldn't give up Simms. I know it worked out but we really should have had L.T. and Reggie White while Montana was there for the taking had the Giants traded with the 49er who wanted Simms.
Taylor, White and Montana - geez
Montana would have never survived behind that awful offensive line the Giants had in the early 80s. Simms barely did. With his slight build Montana would have been ground to bits. He probably would have been out of football before Parcells took over.
Montana survives the beatings he took from the Skins, Bears and Giants prior to 1986 so not buying your guess.
But he fell because of a couple of other reasons... #1, Alex Smith was more mobile AND more intelligent... #2, Smith's Pro Day received borderline LEGENDARY hype... #3, Rodgers being a huge 49ers fan with a Cali background actually made the 49ers more hesitant to pick him because of the perceived added pressure... #4, shitty NFL teams just weren't looking for QBs that year as much as usual.
Also, the Packers made major changes to Rodgers' mechanics. He DID NOT throw or look like this in college. Those years he got to wait under Favre's wings gave him and the Packers time to mold him into the player he has become. He's basically the equivalent of a pitching prospect who was expected to throw 93-95 in the bigs, but a couple of little tweaks allowed him to throw 98-100 AND have more control.
I wonder if he would have became the player he did if he went elsewhere.
I think QBs have a wide range of outcomes depending on where they land. We may have even saw that here with the transition from Huffnagle to Gilbride.
But he fell because of a couple of other reasons... #1, Alex Smith was more mobile AND more intelligent... #2, Smith's Pro Day received borderline LEGENDARY hype... #3, Rodgers being a huge 49ers fan with a Cali background actually made the 49ers more hesitant to pick him because of the perceived added pressure... #4, shitty NFL teams just weren't looking for QBs that year as much as usual.
Also, the Packers made major changes to Rodgers' mechanics. He DID NOT throw or look like this in college. Those years he got to wait under Favre's wings gave him and the Packers time to mold him into the player he has become. He's basically the equivalent of a pitching prospect who was expected to throw 93-95 in the bigs, but a couple of little tweaks allowed him to throw 98-100 AND have more control.
There was also the rumor of Mike Nolan not wanting Rodgers because he seemed like a dick who wouldn't obey orders like Smith would.
He would definitely be right in that....Rodgers the cocky guy, Smith the nice guy. Whether that really mattered, nobody knows. Nolan naturally denied that recently.
“So I don’t know where that ever started, or where it was generated from. But it’s got legs. And sometimes it’s even sprinting. But if there’s anything further from the truth, that was the thing that had me continue to ask the question: Guys, are we on this? Are we right? And the thing that kind of swayed me, because I was the decision-maker at the time, was well, Alex is going to better in the long run. I was thinking, well, we’re in the first year, I’ve got a five year deal, I think we’re going to have some time to get it done. And so I went that way. And that was my mistake for trusting in that part of the assessment.”
“At the time, we thought in the long term, that Alex was going to be the better quarterback. Obviously, we were wrong,” Nolan said. “One of them, Aaron Rodgers is going to the Hall of Fame, and Alex Smith is a very solid, capable, good quarterback. So we didn’t have a bad choice, but there’s always one better than the other. We missed the mark. We should’ve taken Aaron, no question.
“But like I said, they both turned out to be capable quarterbacks, one much more than the other. I just think that’s the facts of it. Obviously, right now, Alex is still playing. He’s in the playoffs, he’s been to the playoffs many times. Now to credit — I will say this. One of the things that would’ve really helped us immensely, is had we used Alex’s entire skill set — meaning if we would’ve had some zone-read and things like that in our offense to utilize his legs which is what he has done since (Jim) Harbaugh has coached him and also on to Kansas City — we would’ve used the entire package that Alex has. And I think early on, Alex would’ve been thought as a much better quarterback because that’s what he would’ve been doing. Plus, we would’ve been innovative in the fact that we’ve done it…Who knows who would be the head coach at this time if we would have done a better job with that situation.”
Also interesting to note is that Mike McCarthy was the 49ers OC that year and he too co-signed on Smith a year prior to joining the Packers...
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better than Rodgers. That Off Co was Mike McCarthy.
Do you have a source for this? I hate to be that guy, but I've read it was almost entirely Mike Nolan's call.
McCarthy himself said it in an interview. "As fate would have it, McCarthy spent only one season as the offensive coordinator in San Francisco, in '05. He was also Favre's quarterback coach in 1999, and went back to Green Bay in '06 to become the head coach. Had he supported Rodgers as the pick in '05, McCarthy could have changed everything, including his own future with the Packers, but even he was more keen on Smith and thought Rodgers dumped it off too much at Cal.
"Everybody starts at zero," is what McCarthy said ten years ago with regard to the rookie Smith battling against veteran Tim Rattay to be the starter in San Francisco."
And you LOVE to be that guy. :-)
REVISITING AARON RODGERS' DRAFT FALL - ( New Window )
Simth was just fantastic in college. He finished off a great career by beating the snot out of Alabama in the Sugar Bowl. That's why he went first.
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In comment 13329402 Victor in CT said:
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better than Rodgers. That Off Co was Mike McCarthy.
Do you have a source for this? I hate to be that guy, but I've read it was almost entirely Mike Nolan's call.
McCarthy himself said it in an interview. "As fate would have it, McCarthy spent only one season as the offensive coordinator in San Francisco, in '05. He was also Favre's quarterback coach in 1999, and went back to Green Bay in '06 to become the head coach. Had he supported Rodgers as the pick in '05, McCarthy could have changed everything, including his own future with the Packers, but even he was more keen on Smith and thought Rodgers dumped it off too much at Cal.
"Everybody starts at zero," is what McCarthy said ten years ago with regard to the rookie Smith battling against veteran Tim Rattay to be the starter in San Francisco."
And you LOVE to be that guy. :-) REVISITING AARON RODGERS' DRAFT FALL - ( New Window )
Do I really have a reputation for being that guy? Anyway, that article says nothing about how SF took Smith because McCarthy liked him better. Nolan still gets most of the blame for it, and although Nolan denies the attitude thing I've never heard him foist blame for the pick on anyone other than himself. In fact he says if Aaron Rodgers wasn't "the other guy" the Alex Smith pick wouldn't get as much scrutiny and that's probably true.
I even read one story that said the 49ers took Smith and his mother out to dinner during his pre-draft meeting and when Smith went around and opened the door for his mother Nolan made up his mind then and there that they were drafting Smith.
When asked about this Rodgers said he didn't know if it was true or not, but he took his dad with him and wasn't opening the door for him, LOL.
But wasn't a lot due to the change in mechanics?
The issue was holding the ball up high on the drop. Tedford wanted him to do it. He was still snapping the ball out fast and accurately. It wouldn't take years to change it. Just keep the ball lower on the drop? That can be fixed in 1 day.
The knocks on him were mostly size, the mechanical drop back with the ball pinned to his ear, and Tedford and his QB struggling in the NFL.
I didn't see the Tedford thing as a legit knock. Do the struggles of a guy like Biller or Harrington have anything to do with a prospect? I don't think so.
The one thing you could see in college was his ability to throw on the run especially left. Back then I knew he played shortstop and you could see it in his throwing motion in college and balance as he moves left and throws. Perfect example this weekend with the Cook throw. Take a look at it and tthink of a shortstop making those throws. Most QBs have to flip the hips around but he's able to plant the right foot and still move left and make an accurate throw.
There is an article on Philly.com about Rodgers and Wentz being able to make thiose throws that they learned playing baseball.