Noah was brutally bad early on. He had no confidence and it almost seemed like he forgot how to play. Over the last few weeks, he's been excellent, but the Knicks are in a major funk. He's one of the only guys that has been good through that funk, but he's not a guy that wins games on his own.
Of course the stats aren't going to look good for him because of that, but reality is that we are a better team when Noah is playing well, like he has lately. If only the rest of the team didn't fall apart at the same time.
we've got to play him mostly at the 4. This has been obvious for years, but maybe it's finally getting thru (evidence is scant, but Horny talking KP at 4 suggests it). If that is the case, we have one center too many, with KP, Noah, KOQ, and Willy. Borderline 2 too many, b/c I think Plumlee is probably fine as a cheap #3 center, but with Noah's injury history, 4 centers is fine.
I think KOQ has to go if you can get decent value for him. A late #1 I'd take, even though I think it undervalues him.
Berman says Melo is the 4 once Porzingis returns. Assuming that's true either Noah or KOQ are going lose significant minutes. Don't see any way around that.
we've got to play him mostly at the 4. This has been obvious for years, but maybe it's finally getting thru (evidence is scant, but Horny talking KP at 4 suggests it). If that is the case, we have one center too many, with KP, Noah, KOQ, and Willy. Borderline 2 too many, b/c I think Plumlee is probably fine as a cheap #3 center, but with Noah's injury history, 4 centers is fine.
I think KOQ has to go if you can get decent value for him. A late #1 I'd take, even though I think it undervalues him.
This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
Noah was brutally bad early on. He had no confidence and it almost seemed like he forgot how to play. Over the last few weeks, he's been excellent, but the Knicks are in a major funk. He's one of the only guys that has been good through that funk, but he's not a guy that wins games on his own.
Of course the stats aren't going to look good for him because of that, but reality is that we are a better team when Noah is playing well, like he has lately. If only the rest of the team didn't fall apart at the same time.
Agree. I think this announcement is more about Melo than Noah.
key to success making 72 million usually move to the bench because they are playing so well...
So your conclusion from that move is that Noah is terrible and deserves benching, versus moving the two best players on the team to positions that suit them much better given how the rest of the league is playing? Yikes.
confirming, Noah headed to the bench when Porzingis returns.
BBR says KP has played 35% of his minutes at center this season. That cant possibly be correct, right?
Hornacek made it sound like they would need to see Porzingis comfort level at the 5 + the offensive changes they will have to make to accommodate such a move (presumably drawing up touches for KP that Noah doesn't get) but you would think if he truly was playing 35% of his minutes at the 5 this wouldn't be such a big "reworking".
This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
I actually think it's probably more important to have Melo at the 4 at the beginning of the game, when the other team has it's starting lineup (i.e. probably best 5) in the game. In that circumstance, you probably want to save Melo from being a SF defensively. Noah-KP-Melo would work better at times when the other team has a sub in at SF.
key to success making 72 million usually move to the bench because they are playing so well...
So your conclusion from that move is that Noah is terrible and deserves benching, versus moving the two best players on the team to positions that suit them much better given how the rest of the league is playing? Yikes.
My conclusion is Noah wouldn't be headed to the bench if he was playing up to his contract. He's an absolute zero offensively at this point and that makes it very hard to get the offense going. As it is teams know Rose isn't going to beat you from the outside, Noah doesn't even look at the rim. Clogs up the lanes even further.
should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists, that's tied for 8th among centers (with Monroe actually) and that's with 99% of his touches resulting in passes and not FGA.
"Simply put, Knicks president Phil Jackson has no choice. He has to re-sign Rose to a max contract this summer. The NBA salary cap will rise above $100 million this summer and, according to Spotrac, New York only has $77.2 million in active contracts for next season. Keeping Rose is a tough decision since he is already making $21.3 million in 2016-17, the final year of his contract, but he has earned that sum tremendously."
should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists,
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
"Simply put, Knicks president Phil Jackson has no choice. He has to re-sign Rose to a max contract this summer. The NBA salary cap will rise above $100 million this summer and, according to Spotrac, New York only has $77.2 million in active contracts for next season. Keeping Rose is a tough decision since he is already making $21.3 million in 2016-17, the final year of his contract, but he has earned that sum tremendously."
Counterpoint: He has a choice, and the better choice is not to bog the team down with a risky, massive Rose contract when signing Rose doesnt move them realistically any closer to title contention.
should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists,
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists,
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
It's harder for your passes to result in assists when there are less "easy buckets" with the lane/lanes crowded. Even if you "love" Noah you have to see that opposing defenders know he's not even going to fake an outside shot (like Tyson Chandler would), Noah catches the ball and looks to pass it again on literally 99% of his possessions. He's taken 5 or less FGA 24/38 games played. As bad as his FT shooting has been, he's scored 214 points, 70 of those points have come at the line. 38 games played, so he's scoring under 4 points per game on actual shots made. Why even bother Ding him up?
think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Noah is better than Plumlee. Noah has actually been playing pretty good ball of late, once you forget the contract. The advanced stats like him too -- suggest a guy who could easily be the 5th best starter on a very good team. I do think the advanced stats are missing out a bit on just how inept his offense is, to the point that he can be ignored.
I think there are smarter ways to use Noah offensively, but for whatever reason they're not being employed. For example, if you're going to give him the ball 20 feet from the basket, do it by design and give him cutters. And yeah, try some triangle-type plays -- back to the basket in the post, give him two options to pass to (I suspect this doesnt work because he's such a non-threat to pull a move and score).
This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
I actually think it's probably more important to have Melo at the 4 at the beginning of the game, when the other team has it's starting lineup (i.e. probably best 5) in the game. In that circumstance, you probably want to save Melo from being a SF defensively. Noah-KP-Melo would work better at times when the other team has a sub in at SF.
That's fair. I think the main takeaway is that KP should see more minutes at the 5 if that means that Melo gets more minutes at the 4. Melo just can't do anything on defense at the 3.
so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Noah is better than Plumlee. Noah has actually been playing pretty good ball of late, once you forget the contract. The advanced stats like him too -- suggest a guy who could easily be the 5th best starter on a very good team. I do think the advanced stats are missing out a bit on just how inept his offense is, to the point that he can be ignored.
I think there are smarter ways to use Noah offensively, but for whatever reason they're not being employed. For example, if you're going to give him the ball 20 feet from the basket, do it by design and give him cutters. And yeah, try some triangle-type plays -- back to the basket in the post, give him two options to pass to (I suspect this doesnt work because he's such a non-threat to pull a move and score).
Noah is better than Plumlee. I'm just talking about counting stats backing up Porzingis/KOQ, I don't think we'd see some huge downgrade Plumlee's #'s to Noah's. As you said, in theory his passing adds more than it does. I'm not exaggerating when I say he doesn't even look at the basket the majority of the time when he receives the ball. There are times when he catches the ball near (or even deeper) than the FT line and then the defender backs off and Noah kicks it back out to Melo etc. We aren't seeing some sort of Sabonis/Divac situation where he's hitting guys in stride/cutting to the basket. They are useless passes most of the time.
think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Cmon. The dude has more minutes on a bus than he does with the knicks. This is a ridiculous take, IMO.
so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Which would be "fine" if he either had some sort of offensive game to keep defenders honest or the Knicks ran more motion in their offense.
different ailment to affect Noah already this season. Good thing he changed the culture though!
Looks bad...when you're right you're right. You can stop reminding us every day!
For the record I went nuts to a friend I work with when he told me they signed Noah. HE was high on it. I said why and he's always banged. He talked me off the ledge and then I bought in came here and fought the good fight. I still like that he's here in the locker room with KP as a shitty insurance policy but early returns look pretty bleak. Oh well...Knicks would suck anyway even if they didn't sign him. Tank...draft a stud...that's all I got.
think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Cmon. The dude has more minutes on a bus than he does with the knicks. This is a ridiculous take, IMO.
You don't think Plumlee just based on his size could grab 8 rebounds tonight if given 25 minutes? I'm not suggesting he's a good player (he's not). I'm saying there isn't much lost with KP/KOQ/WIlly/Plumlee. Noah's passing/rebounding isn't irreplaceable.
whatever..with the Knicks I feel like I am better off buying into the suck. They deliver suck so consistently over the years. But I can't help but root for them. I enjoyed last night's win...but they are probably better off losing out unless they can really save the season and battle toward 500 record. Not even sure that's worth much but with the young players, losing can be toxic.
"Simply put, Knicks president Phil Jackson has no choice. He has to re-sign Rose to a max contract this summer. The NBA salary cap will rise above $100 million this summer and, according to Spotrac, New York only has $77.2 million in active contracts for next season. Keeping Rose is a tough decision since he is already making $21.3 million in 2016-17, the final year of his contract, but he has earned that sum tremendously."
"Simply put, Knicks president Phil Jackson has no choice. He has to re-sign Rose to a max contract this summer. The NBA salary cap will rise above $100 million this summer and, according to Spotrac, New York only has $77.2 million in active contracts for next season. Keeping Rose is a tough decision since he is already making $21.3 million in 2016-17, the final year of his contract, but he has earned that sum tremendously."
Counterpoint: He has a choice, and the better choice is not to bog the team down with a risky, massive Rose contract when signing Rose doesnt move them realistically any closer to title contention.
"they have no choice but to sign player X to max" --how many times have we heard THAT one before?!!
just noticed the Celtics stashed Yabusele in China. He's averaging 20.5 points 9 boards 2 assists, 39% from 3. Hard to judge Chinese stats when Jimmer is averaging 37 and 7 though...
Even in a limited role with Real Madrid - he had games where he got 10 minutes of action and gave you 6 points and 4 rebounds. His game is just so freaking smooth for a big man.
He produces when he gets that. *one day* I can actually see him as a staple starter next to KP.
He's basically the perfect example of why it's tough to develop young players as you try and win games. His defense clearly isn't ready but how does it "get good" without playing games?
just noticed the Celtics stashed Yabusele in China. He's averaging 20.5 points 9 boards 2 assists, 39% from 3. Hard to judge Chinese stats when Jimmer is averaging 37 and 7 though...
i think anyone here could average 10 points in the chinese league
was dead set on his ancient offense that "needs" to employ two traditional bigs. KP/Melo at the 5/4 surrounded by shooters isn't going to remind anyone of the Bad Boy Pistons on defense, but it would have likely represented their best chance at being competitive this season.
Regardless, here's what I would propose going forward:
Starters: KP/Melo/Kuz/Jennings/Lee
Bench: Rose/Noah/Holliday
Rose's ballhog act works better off the bench at this point of his career IMO, if at all. Lance can ride the bench. Willy gets the shaft but he can fill in for Noah who's always hurt and KP when he gets in foul trouble.
so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Yeah, I just dont understand what the plan is on offense. Noah seems really ill-suited to play in an offense where the #1 and #2 options, Rose and Melo, both stand around waiting for the ball to come to them. Neither move to take a pass. KP isnt a "cutter" and is often in wait for spot up mode (or at least move in a set area angling to open a passing lane for a jumper).
It's really just a bunch of pieces with no organizing concept other than hero ball. The offense ends up "working" (15th in PP possession) I think mostly because you have 3 supernaturally talented scorers in Melo, Rose, and KP.
so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Yeah, I just dont understand what the plan is on offense. Noah seems really ill-suited to play in an offense where the #1 and #2 options, Rose and Melo, both stand around waiting for the ball to come to them. Neither move to take a pass. KP isnt a "cutter" and is often in wait for spot up mode (or at least move in a set area angling to open a passing lane for a jumper).
It's really just a bunch of pieces with no organizing concept other than hero ball. The offense ends up "working" (15th in PP possession) I think mostly because you have 3 supernaturally talented scorers in Melo, Rose, and KP.
Agreed. I'm often watching and wondering what the plan is. They rely on Rose, Melo or KP to beat their man off the dribble almost the whole game. Their guard dribbles the ball up the court, hands it to the big at the top of the key and they give it back to the guard, set a pick and go from there.
I was working at a summer camp that summer and had to miss the draft for parents night. My friends would keep me updated. We supposedly liked Lampe at #9, when we landed both he and Sweetney I thought we hit a home run....
Kaman, Josh Howard, Ridnour, TJ Ford, David West, Diaw, Barbosa, Korver, Mo Williams, Collison, Steve Blake, Hinrich, Perkins, Delfino, Zaza and yet the Knicks ended up with 2 absolute zeroes lol
Thoughts on Rose for Rubio/Muhammed(or a better piece)?
If melo isn't going anywhere, theres no point in breaking everything down, so accumulate assets where you can. Rubio is not very good, but his contract is reasonable and he can distribute. Muhammed or another piece, would be an asset.
for Lampe and Milos...and even Slavko who was like 7-6. But then Isiah got hired, immediately cut Slavko, and included Lampe and Milos in the Marbury deal and that was the end of that.
Kaman, Josh Howard, Ridnour, TJ Ford, David West, Diaw, Barbosa, Korver, Mo Williams, Collison, Steve Blake, Hinrich, Perkins, Delfino, Zaza and yet the Knicks ended up with 2 absolute zeroes lol
true, but Sweetney wasn't a bust due to a lack of talent.
Of course the stats aren't going to look good for him because of that, but reality is that we are a better team when Noah is playing well, like he has lately. If only the rest of the team didn't fall apart at the same time.
BBR says KP has played 35% of his minutes at center this season. That cant possibly be correct, right?
I think KOQ has to go if you can get decent value for him. A late #1 I'd take, even though I think it undervalues him.
Berman says Melo is the 4 once Porzingis returns. Assuming that's true either Noah or KOQ are going lose significant minutes. Don't see any way around that.
I think KOQ has to go if you can get decent value for him. A late #1 I'd take, even though I think it undervalues him.
This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
Of course the stats aren't going to look good for him because of that, but reality is that we are a better team when Noah is playing well, like he has lately. If only the rest of the team didn't fall apart at the same time.
Agree. I think this announcement is more about Melo than Noah.
So your conclusion from that move is that Noah is terrible and deserves benching, versus moving the two best players on the team to positions that suit them much better given how the rest of the league is playing? Yikes.
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confirming, Noah headed to the bench when Porzingis returns.
BBR says KP has played 35% of his minutes at center this season. That cant possibly be correct, right?
Hornacek made it sound like they would need to see Porzingis comfort level at the 5 + the offensive changes they will have to make to accommodate such a move (presumably drawing up touches for KP that Noah doesn't get) but you would think if he truly was playing 35% of his minutes at the 5 this wouldn't be such a big "reworking".
This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
I actually think it's probably more important to have Melo at the 4 at the beginning of the game, when the other team has it's starting lineup (i.e. probably best 5) in the game. In that circumstance, you probably want to save Melo from being a SF defensively. Noah-KP-Melo would work better at times when the other team has a sub in at SF.
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key to success making 72 million usually move to the bench because they are playing so well...
So your conclusion from that move is that Noah is terrible and deserves benching, versus moving the two best players on the team to positions that suit them much better given how the rest of the league is playing? Yikes.
My conclusion is Noah wouldn't be headed to the bench if he was playing up to his contract. He's an absolute zero offensively at this point and that makes it very hard to get the offense going. As it is teams know Rose isn't going to beat you from the outside, Noah doesn't even look at the rim. Clogs up the lanes even further.
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
Counterpoint: He has a choice, and the better choice is not to bog the team down with a risky, massive Rose contract when signing Rose doesnt move them realistically any closer to title contention.
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should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists,
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
Surprising opinion from this poster.
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should be noted that while Noah is a solid passer, the fact he doesn't even look for his own shot really negates that value. He's averaging a whopping 2.3 assists,
I like to call that the Melo-effect. Does anyone's assist numbers really go up playing with him? He is an iso player, so assists are tougher to get.
It's harder for your passes to result in assists when there are less "easy buckets" with the lane/lanes crowded. Even if you "love" Noah you have to see that opposing defenders know he's not even going to fake an outside shot (like Tyson Chandler would), Noah catches the ball and looks to pass it again on literally 99% of his possessions. He's taken 5 or less FGA 24/38 games played. As bad as his FT shooting has been, he's scored 214 points, 70 of those points have come at the line. 38 games played, so he's scoring under 4 points per game on actual shots made. Why even bother Ding him up?
Noah is better than Plumlee. Noah has actually been playing pretty good ball of late, once you forget the contract. The advanced stats like him too -- suggest a guy who could easily be the 5th best starter on a very good team. I do think the advanced stats are missing out a bit on just how inept his offense is, to the point that he can be ignored.
I think there are smarter ways to use Noah offensively, but for whatever reason they're not being employed. For example, if you're going to give him the ball 20 feet from the basket, do it by design and give him cutters. And yeah, try some triangle-type plays -- back to the basket in the post, give him two options to pass to (I suspect this doesnt work because he's such a non-threat to pull a move and score).
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This was my thinking, but I think you can still start Noah. Just give KP the bulk of the minutes at the 5 if that's the case. At the very least, Noah gives you the experienced body to bang with the bigger centers of the league, something you don't want KP doing at this point.
My hope is that at the end of the year they can package their 1st rounder and O'Quinn to move up in the draft if there's someone that they really want.
I actually think it's probably more important to have Melo at the 4 at the beginning of the game, when the other team has it's starting lineup (i.e. probably best 5) in the game. In that circumstance, you probably want to save Melo from being a SF defensively. Noah-KP-Melo would work better at times when the other team has a sub in at SF.
That's fair. I think the main takeaway is that KP should see more minutes at the 5 if that means that Melo gets more minutes at the 4. Melo just can't do anything on defense at the 3.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
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think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Noah is better than Plumlee. Noah has actually been playing pretty good ball of late, once you forget the contract. The advanced stats like him too -- suggest a guy who could easily be the 5th best starter on a very good team. I do think the advanced stats are missing out a bit on just how inept his offense is, to the point that he can be ignored.
I think there are smarter ways to use Noah offensively, but for whatever reason they're not being employed. For example, if you're going to give him the ball 20 feet from the basket, do it by design and give him cutters. And yeah, try some triangle-type plays -- back to the basket in the post, give him two options to pass to (I suspect this doesnt work because he's such a non-threat to pull a move and score).
Noah is better than Plumlee. I'm just talking about counting stats backing up Porzingis/KOQ, I don't think we'd see some huge downgrade Plumlee's #'s to Noah's. As you said, in theory his passing adds more than it does. I'm not exaggerating when I say he doesn't even look at the basket the majority of the time when he receives the ball. There are times when he catches the ball near (or even deeper) than the FT line and then the defender backs off and Noah kicks it back out to Melo etc. We aren't seeing some sort of Sabonis/Divac situation where he's hitting guys in stride/cutting to the basket. They are useless passes most of the time.
Cmon. The dude has more minutes on a bus than he does with the knicks. This is a ridiculous take, IMO.
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so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Which would be "fine" if he either had some sort of offensive game to keep defenders honest or the Knicks ran more motion in their offense.
Looks bad...when you're right you're right. You can stop reminding us every day!
For the record I went nuts to a friend I work with when he told me they signed Noah. HE was high on it. I said why and he's always banged. He talked me off the ledge and then I bought in came here and fought the good fight. I still like that he's here in the locker room with KP as a shitty insurance policy but early returns look pretty bleak. Oh well...Knicks would suck anyway even if they didn't sign him. Tank...draft a stud...that's all I got.
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think the Knicks would be just as good (if not better) with Porzingis backed up by KOQ, Willy and Plumlee vs. what they have done to this point. I'm not even sure Plumlee is a significant downgrade from Noah. He couldn't possibly chip in 5 and 9 or close to it?
Cmon. The dude has more minutes on a bus than he does with the knicks. This is a ridiculous take, IMO.
You don't think Plumlee just based on his size could grab 8 rebounds tonight if given 25 minutes? I'm not suggesting he's a good player (he's not). I'm saying there isn't much lost with KP/KOQ/WIlly/Plumlee. Noah's passing/rebounding isn't irreplaceable.
my eyes!
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"Simply put, Knicks president Phil Jackson has no choice. He has to re-sign Rose to a max contract this summer. The NBA salary cap will rise above $100 million this summer and, according to Spotrac, New York only has $77.2 million in active contracts for next season. Keeping Rose is a tough decision since he is already making $21.3 million in 2016-17, the final year of his contract, but he has earned that sum tremendously."
Counterpoint: He has a choice, and the better choice is not to bog the team down with a risky, massive Rose contract when signing Rose doesnt move them realistically any closer to title contention.
"they have no choice but to sign player X to max" --how many times have we heard THAT one before?!!
No. Just no.
He's basically the perfect example of why it's tough to develop young players as you try and win games. His defense clearly isn't ready but how does it "get good" without playing games?
i think anyone here could average 10 points in the chinese league
Regardless, here's what I would propose going forward:
Starters: KP/Melo/Kuz/Jennings/Lee
Bench: Rose/Noah/Holliday
Rose's ballhog act works better off the bench at this point of his career IMO, if at all. Lance can ride the bench. Willy gets the shaft but he can fill in for Noah who's always hurt and KP when he gets in foul trouble.
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so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Yeah, I just dont understand what the plan is on offense. Noah seems really ill-suited to play in an offense where the #1 and #2 options, Rose and Melo, both stand around waiting for the ball to come to them. Neither move to take a pass. KP isnt a "cutter" and is often in wait for spot up mode (or at least move in a set area angling to open a passing lane for a jumper).
It's really just a bunch of pieces with no organizing concept other than hero ball. The offense ends up "working" (15th in PP possession) I think mostly because you have 3 supernaturally talented scorers in Melo, Rose, and KP.
It's like a Knicks graveyard over there
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In comment 13332892 Deej said:
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so often he flares out to accept a pass beyond the 3 point line. What the fuck is the point of this. What happens is they leave him open by 10 feet, you have 5 defenders guarding 4 guys, and there isnt space to do much.
Notably, they are NOT using him as a triangle big, taking passes in the post with his back to the basket.
I feel like this is the offense they are running, not what Noah wants to do. Almost every half court set starts with a big at the top of the key and they just hand him the ball to get the offense started.
Yeah, I just dont understand what the plan is on offense. Noah seems really ill-suited to play in an offense where the #1 and #2 options, Rose and Melo, both stand around waiting for the ball to come to them. Neither move to take a pass. KP isnt a "cutter" and is often in wait for spot up mode (or at least move in a set area angling to open a passing lane for a jumper).
It's really just a bunch of pieces with no organizing concept other than hero ball. The offense ends up "working" (15th in PP possession) I think mostly because you have 3 supernaturally talented scorers in Melo, Rose, and KP.
Agreed. I'm often watching and wondering what the plan is. They rely on Rose, Melo or KP to beat their man off the dribble almost the whole game. Their guard dribbles the ball up the court, hands it to the big at the top of the key and they give it back to the guard, set a pick and go from there.
I was working at a summer camp that summer and had to miss the draft for parents night. My friends would keep me updated. We supposedly liked Lampe at #9, when we landed both he and Sweetney I thought we hit a home run....
Kaman, Josh Howard, Ridnour, TJ Ford, David West, Diaw, Barbosa, Korver, Mo Williams, Collison, Steve Blake, Hinrich, Perkins, Delfino, Zaza and yet the Knicks ended up with 2 absolute zeroes lol
Thoughts?
Felt like an 8 player draft and we had pick 9. I think I was hoping on Kaman, because I liked that he could shoot with both hands.
Kaman, Josh Howard, Ridnour, TJ Ford, David West, Diaw, Barbosa, Korver, Mo Williams, Collison, Steve Blake, Hinrich, Perkins, Delfino, Zaza and yet the Knicks ended up with 2 absolute zeroes lol
true, but Sweetney wasn't a bust due to a lack of talent.