With every JPP headline, the more likely it seems he's moving on from Big Blue. Given that and our other FA needs, it also seems likely we should have relatively high targets for a DE.
I know Taco Charlton is the best DE prospect likely to be around our pick at 23, but I'm not sure of picks in the 2nd or 3rd who may be a good value 4-3 DE. I've heard of Deatrich Wise, Tanoh Tkpassagnon, Jordan Willis, Daeshon Hall, and Da'Shawn Hand as possible 4-3 DE picks.
I'm not sure what the value is though. When are these guys a value; who can we expect to be first year starters; etc. Does anybody have a good handle on the 4-3 DEs in this year's draft?
DEs #14-#23
I have a strong feeling the value/talent this year at 23 will be at MLB. Supposedly there are 3 sideline to sideline, 3 down studs..They tend to fall in the draft...That would fit like a glove for the Giants.
For DE.they will need to find a hidden gem with upside, possibly even hurt last year but had a great year in 2015. The good news is Reese & Co. Are pretty good at finding the Tuck in the 3rd.
Jacksonville is the obvious spot that will overpay for JPP but yesterday was just agent banter.....No way he gets OV money. JPP is not clean with plenty of red flags so who knows.
I have a strong feeling the value/talent this year at 23 will be at MLB. Supposedly there are 3 sideline to sideline, 3 down studs..They tend to fall in the draft...That would fit like a glove for the Giants.
For DE.they will need to find a hidden gem with upside, possibly even hurt last year but had a great year in 2015. The good news is Reese & Co. Are pretty good at finding the Tuck in the 3rd.
Jacksonville is the obvious spot that will overpay for JPP but yesterday was just agent banter.....No way he gets OV money. JPP is not clean with plenty of red flags so who knows.
It is a new year though, with market inflation and an even sparser market than last year. Who knows what teams will do for a playmaker like JPP. There are huge cap spaces out there.
The LBs I've seen in that conversation are Reuben Foster, Jarrad Davis, and Zach Cunningham. I imagine one of those three is still there at 23, not likely to be Foster though. OJ Howard or Njoku might be there too. I suppose it really all depends on the Giants board rankings. You may be right. It finally could be the year of the first round LBer for Big Blue.
Regardless, this thread is about 4-3 DE prospects, not what JPP will or will not do. The assumption of this thread IS that JPP doesn't re-sign and DE becomes a much more urgent need. If you don't mind not changing the subject too far afield.
That doesn't have a bearing on the topic of the thread which are the prospects themselves, which you're saying we should be interested in. I don't get the need to focus on the extraneous details if the ultimate discussion benefits both of us, despite our different intuitions about how JPP's FA turns out.
Sorry to be bitchy, but I've had my last three threads spiral into player bashing or FO bashing lately while my question in the OP goes unanswered. I'd like to hear what people think of the college players coming out in the draft and where the value may be. There are JPP threads already.
There seems to be a lot of mid-round picks for the 3 tech. I could see another Reese 2-3rd round DT special coming up in this draft.
And Taco Charlton...
Quote:
Ryan plays football like a junk yard dog just looking to bite someone in the ass. He has an excellent burst off the ball and although he is a bit undersized when playing from a three point stance, he uses his quickness, techniques and football intelligence to gain advantage. He does an excellent job working against bigger players defending against the run and that is very impressive. Ryan is an instinctive football player with leadership skills through his play on the field. He has just enough athletic talent to drop off the line and defend those pesky screens and as far as running a sweep to his side you better bring more than one offensive player to block him or you won’t make the yardage you need to make on that down. Ryan’s ability to shed blocks is unique because of his long arms and quick feet. There might be more athletic players who play the same position as Ryan does in this draft but there are none that play his position better. Remember the name Ryan (Junk Yard) Anderson.
And Taco Charlton...
Quote:
When Taco uses the correct techniques and keeps players off his body with his long arms he is as good as any defensive lineman I have seen coming out in a draft. The key to his average play is the lack of passion he plays with and the lack of using consistent techniques. I’m not suggesting he takes downs off, but I am suggesting that he seems to play most games in a “depressed” state of mind. If I’m a coach I would love to get my hands on this kid to see if I can motivate him to become more of a complete player. As an owner there is no way I give him 1st round money to see if my coaches can prod him to the next level of play. So since I do the selecting, in this case I think the Taco is stale and needs to be put in the microwave to freshen it back up. But be careful because if it stays in the microwave for too long it will get all mushy and wilt.
Good stuff. I keep hearing lukewarm stuff about Taco. Hadn't heard of Anderson. He looks like a lower ceiling Leonard Floyd. You see him as a second/third rounder?
I'm kind of assuming JPP will be reigned as well. I find the write up on Montravious Adams the DT more interesting in case we dont resign Hankins. I just don't know enough about whether he fits into our system or not or whether he is a 3-4 NT.
I'm also interested in mid round picks who might have starter potential. But I agree, it seems like there isn't a value pick for the Giants for a DE in 1. Taco Charlton's stock is falling fast.
Plus recent years clean 4-3 DEs are becoming very rare, I wouldnt want them to reach just because he fits the mold.
The guy who's going to end up getting first round consideration, especially at #23, Think is DeMarcus Walker. Really the perfect strong side defensive end. I believe if taco Charlton is gone, Walker will get a long look.
Mar. 9th? can talk with Agents Mar. 7th?
March 9th at 4:00 PM
Listing of All the Important Dates - ( New Window )
This is the salient point right here!!! It's also the reason why the Giants must and will resign JPP - they don't have a plethora of DEs that fit their Defensive scheme -- they need all they have and more
and it's why Vernon was signed in the first place
Kpassagnon may sneak into Round 2
Wise Jr. may go early on Day 3 and right now he's my fourth round selection in my mock.
Quote:
We still need another DE. JPP and Vernon played an insane amount of reps this year. Even when they played we got little push up the middle. Adding another DE is a no-brainer not only to give us more poss rushers but to give Vernon and JPP a break so they can be playing at 100% in terms of energy and health. Even with JPP signed DE is still a legit possibility in the first although I am intrigued by that Villanova kid if he lasts to our second round pick.
This is the salient point right here!!! It's also the reason why the Giants must and will resign JPP - they don't have a plethora of DEs that fit their Defensive scheme -- they need all they have and more
and it's why Vernon was signed in the first place
The title and point of the thread is to discuss draft/UDFA targets. Not looking for the JPP drama. There are JPP threads out the eyes with that.
I'll take the point of rarity of DE fits for us though. And that is part of what I've seen in looking for draft targets.
Kpassagnon may sneak into Round 2
Wise Jr. may go early on Day 3 and right now he's my fourth round selection in my mock.
Do you like Charlton? I've seen a lot more negative than positive. Is that more of a 'attack the top dog' thing? Like the way OJ Howard is getting a lot of hate now but still seems like the highest floor TE in the draft?
It seems so much easier to get that pass rusher if you can use a tweener guy and a 4-3 team can't.
On top of that, DE and DT are really hit/miss draft picks. Then they take a couple of years to pan out or get cut.
Bottom line, he will get handled at the next level.. and will be some clay that someone needs to mold. I'd want someone to come in and play. I like the kid from Villanova much better.
Bottom line, he will get handled at the next level.. and will be some clay that someone needs to mold. I'd want someone to come in and play. I like the kid from Villanova much better.
That could bode well for us, since the Villanova kid seems to project as a 2nd-3rd rounder (obviously, all is subject to change). We could get possibly get OJ Howard in the first and Kpassagnon in the second. Helping supplement the run and pass game in the first and keeping the Giants tradition of drafting elite defensive lineman with unpronounceable names in the second.
DeMarcus Walker is listed as a DE but I think he can really be a difference maker and wreak havoc as a 3 tech DT.
Jordan Willis is a player I'm excited to see. Not only a good pass rusher but plays the run as well as any DE in this class.
Derek Rivers from Youngstown St. is listed as a LB at the Senior Bowl but measured in at 6'4 1/8", 250 lbs after this morning's weigh in. It was against lesser comp but in his last 3 seasons he had 52 TFL's including 35 sacks. This is a huge week for him.
Then in rds 1-3 get the bpa at position of value.
Go need on day 3.
And there is also Smoot and Missouri has a pass rusher as well.
If a pass-rusher is available, you do it. DE/WR/S/TE @ #23
Sign Hankins long term
Add OL in FA (They need 2 additions here)