How do you feel about 2 TEs via the draft

I don't think they'll take one on either day 1 or 2. I think they like Adams and still have FA to fill in with a vet.

as a fullback, hback and TE.

but by all means draft two TEs, allowing for one of those types you guys want, it could be fun to watch

It didn't increase the odds of getting a quality player.

I don't like cluster drafting for a single position. Okay for linemen, LBs and DBs.

'falling down after a catch' :

IF it was not going to be caught -otherwise-, that shows an NFL type maturity of ones game.

Then, if it was catch most receivers were not making either way, same thing, it shows great body control.

both things are positives attributes, not negatives.

not commenting on hodges, 5 seconds of highlights doesn't do it, but if he is that player, it has value.

but as an every down in line TE? no, still need to upgrade that as well.

In comment 13356239 Ivan15 said:

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It didn't increase the odds of getting a quality player. I don't like cluster drafting for a single position. Okay for linemen, LBs and DBs.

I get your thought process, but we ran an offense where the TE wasn't nearly as important in the years where we never drafted 1. Our offense is in desperate need of a 2 way TE that can block on the edges efficiently and split the seams. If we had a better option at TE, we could have split the cover 2 shell and give OBJ some more 1 on 1 looks.

Other than Marty Bennett, are there going to be any decent free agents

#1 is game maturity: you have to want the reception more than the YACs, because without the first thing, team is not winning and you don't get yacs without the C part.

#2 is the ability to see the field and the body control to get the ball.

this year, we have a #1wr, so speed and etc can be #3 as opposed to #1.

.

maybe 3rd round as a 'wr'

you still have not upgraded the TE, but its a useful and possibly fun to watch piece of the overall O.

to do a Hodges draft:

by round:

1. OG
2. DT
3. Hodges 'te'
4. Shaheen TE
5. Fullback
6. WR
7. KR

until I read Sy's reports.

by round:

1. OT Moton to play left guard OG pugh to OLT
2. DT Qualls future and left DT 320lbs 6'1" pair w snacks
3. TE Hodges 'te/wr/hback
4. TE Shaneen TE classic style, poor mans whitten
5. FB Sam Rodgers Virginia Tech (wtf do I know, its from CBS draftscout)
or e holder or
d ball fullbacks also
6. WR Jamari Staples outside wr
or Ricky Seals Jones tall wr
7. C chase ruiller Wyoming, flyer on larger center or a dropped guard or short OT here for backup center

In comment 13356348 CT Charlie said:

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until I read Sy's reports.

Sy' or the Inside Football guy who writes the player draft reviews (Can't remember which guy did it, and having trouble finding the old thread) was drooling over Hodges. Wish I could find the TE review thread.

doesn't place that much value on the position for this to ever be a reality.

In comment 13356406 Beer Man said:

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doesn't place that much value on the position for this to ever be a reality.

That was under Coughlin where we had an offense that didn't require an athletic TE. It would have been nice, but wasn't required.

TE.

In comment 13356391 BigBlueDownTheShore said:

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In comment 13356348 CT Charlie said: Quote: until I read Sy's reports. Sy' or the Inside Football guy who writes the player draft reviews (Can't remember which guy did it, and having trouble finding the old thread) was drooling over Hodges. Wish I could find the TE review thread.

Sy56 loves Hodges as a WR, NOT as a TE. I agree with him.

and someone who can block. If you can get both in one player, awesome. If not draft two. Other than Adams, there is no TE currently on the roster that inspires any confidence or argues against drafting two TEs if the circumstances are favorable.

- Adams who they feel has a lot of potential
- Tye – whom they like, but is limited
- LaCosse – who they keep saying they expect a lot from, but so far he can’t stay healthy long enough for anyone to know what we have
- Will Johnson – who is a FB/TE/H-Back type

None of these guys are world beaters, but there is enough there that they probably won’t be spending two draft picks on the position.

Does that mean Adams is the Starter, now?

Not a good scenario....

Tye is fine as the #2 TE. Draft elsewhere.

where they are drafted

what is their specialty

who are we not drafting etc...

In comment 13356206 No Where Man said:

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and the only NFL worthy TE we have on the roster is Adams. I'd like Howard or Njoku in Round 1 and either Leggett or Sprinkle in Round 3. Last week Klattu said it would be a waste of resources to draft 2 TEs so he doesn't think its probable but we all say it is….Once we draft any 2 of these calibre players in this draft, and combine them with Adams, then the position would be solidified for the next 5-7 years.

Did I say drafting two TEs would be a waste of resources, or did I say drafting two TEs would be a ridiculous waste of resources? I think I said "ridiculous," because that's exactly what it would be.

Sign a UFA like Dion Sims if you can, and then see how the draft shakes out. You still have Adams, whom the Giants are not going to give up on after one year, and you still have Tye and LaCosse. If you have the opportunity to draft a top-tier TE prospect somewhere in the first four rounds, then go for it, and let them compete with Sims, Adams, Tye and LaCosse. Three of those five will make the final 53.

You don't draft another TE prospect and pass up the chance to draft someone else to bolster your O-Line, D-Line, WR corps, RB corps, LB corps, or defensive backfield.

If you want to sign a UDFA or two and give them a shot in camp, fine.

In comment 13356187 Jim in Forest Hills said:

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He's really a WR also in that he hasn't blocked at all. I'm ok with him on day 3, but he's projected Day 1-2. Pass. I'm on the Howard train after the senior bowl. I hope he drops to 23 which is possible if he doesn't test well at the combine. I've seen enough of him that he's fast on the field. Hope he drops. If they go for a 2nd TE which is not a bad idea late in the draft assuming they pick up a Howard/Njoku early, I hope its a kid who can block. So tired of seeing the Giants running game destroyed.

I agree with you. I don't like Hodges as much as Leggett or even Butt. I think the Arkansas kid - Jeremy Sprinkle - would be the best 2nd TE if they did this - draft a TE other than Njoku or Howard (which I don't think they would).

And, if they did get Howard, they'd have no use for another TE. They'd be better off getting a Jordan Reed type or big X WR in the late rounds.

In comment 13356357 idiotsavant said:

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by round: 1. OT Moton to play left guard OG pugh to OLT 2. DT Qualls future and left DT 320lbs 6'1" pair w snacks 3. TE Hodges 'te/wr/hback 4. TE Shaneen TE classic style, poor mans whitten 5. FB Sam Rodgers Virginia Tech (wtf do I know, its from CBS draftscout) or e holder or d ball fullbacks also 6. WR Jamari Staples outside wr or Ricky Seals Jones tall wr 7. C chase ruiller Wyoming, flyer on larger center or a dropped guard or short OT here for backup center

Pretending Pugh is going to OLT isn't helpful imo. He's the OLG of now and the future. I don't think they move him, no matter what happens around him.

to keep the D intact, JPP, Hank and DRC, by all means, have at it.

Fans here have said there is no lock OLT at 23.

I would advise tearing apart a proven D in free agency to help pay for new pieces for a very unproven O coordinator and scheme is folly.

So, again, if you can find a proven great OLT and also keep the D intact, fine. Then you can have a really fun draft.

But someone work the numbers.

to rob peter (D) to pay paul (O), that screams of NY Knicks style shortsightedness.

I don't have the time to work the numbers, if you can do both...fine.

either as UDFA's, or 7th round picks, which are almost the same thing.

I think we need to guard against believing that the draft is going to fill most holes. History argues otherwise.

Jack Doyle from Indy. Guy is pretty good at everything but not sure what he will cost. Indy has some decent cap space this year

too much emphasis on narrow motivations and preclusions, not my motivations at all, to be clear, but ones which may exist:

1. "elis shrinking time at QB'.

Fine, but my worry is you loose track of rational long term team building if you consider this too much.

2. ''you Don't move Pugh to OLT and you don't draft guards early''

Here my worry would be another in a very long list of woulda coulda shouda beens at OLT next year, due to inclination #1, above, Mannings time window;, they won't be able to resist at least trying, maybe reaching, once and yet again.

3. do all of that AND loose our best Defense stars via free agency, you could have an exceedingly mediocre Giant team next year.

1. Keep D intact and trade up in the draft to gain a star OLT prospect.

(I personally would not do this and don't know the values for players enough to make that call, but it is not totally crazy either)

2. Keep the D intact and draft guards 1 and 2.

(close to my strategy)

3. Keep the D intact, do an all D draft and trade Manning for 2018 draft picks to spare him the abuse.

Draft all O in 2018.

(the 'mad-dog strategy', re-inforce your proven coordinator, Spagnulo, face the future and reality, wtf anyway, you might build a dynasty if you try this one)

4. let JPP and DRC and Hank go, invest in free agents all over the offense, especially the O line, 3rd wide out and try to replace DRC,HANK and JPP in the draft.

(yeah, best of luck with that one Charlie)

In comment 13356668 idiotsavant said:

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too much emphasis on narrow motivations and preclusions, not my motivations at all, to be clear, but ones which may exist: 1. "elis shrinking time at QB'. Fine, but my worry is you loose track of rational long term team building if you consider this too much. 2. ''you Don't move Pugh to OLT and you don't draft guards early'' Here my worry would be another in a very long list of woulda coulda shouda beens at OLT next year, due to inclination #1, above, Mannings time window;, they won't be able to resist at least trying, maybe reaching, once and yet again. 3. do all of that AND loose our best Defense stars via free agency, you could have an exceedingly mediocre Giant team next year.

I have to ask do you have a job? You must have posted 20 times on here and like 5 posts back to back.

Lmao that's exactly the same thing I've noticed with Hodges in his highlights. Constantly catching the ball and leaving his feet And falling. Remind you of another tight end?

As a side note. Hodges to me is strictly a redzone target and not a tight end

This kid can fly and looks to be a good route runner with above average hands. Looks to be a competent blocker too. Not huge though, 6'3" 240 lbs. He might be a 2nd or 3rd rounder.

since Reese has shown what he thinks about the position, for some unknown reason we are unable to just plug in people like some other teams and be successful, why I don't know...

we don't have the luxury (as is the case for most teams). If you're lucky they'll take one TE.

whereas we all seem to agree that having one (njoku or hodges or whomever, the skinny one who is skilled on par with good wrs) and the 'blocking one' as two different players is agreeable, if not ideal:

We seem to have allowed ourselves to believe the larger 'blocking tight end' , who is probably slower, and ok, less body control, cannot be also 'a playmaker' as a receiver, or a legit check down move the chains role player.

Which is an obviously false narrative if you look around the league, the bigger 260, 270 + lb blocking TEs can certainly be playmakers in their own right, otherwise you would just line up an extra OT out there.

Fullbacks and RB can fill similar roles.

With regards to providing a 'threat that opens things up deep for Odell, up the seam' ok, the other type, but, again, Dorg and Joey pointed out that this opening up more broadly can be achieved with the tall right side wide out as well, up the right sideline.

IF its the case that all three or four or five of those things can be achived in rounds 3-7, whereas the OG/OT can only be found at 23, that puts into question njoku, but not hodges.

But again, I have no idea about where the great OLers can be found, am only looking at our own history and drawing those repeated lessons.

the OG as well as the pure non slot right wide out complimentary piece, the up the seam type small skinny te, the big te and possibly the large te sized wr as well.

not to mention a interior DT for good measure.

what happens many drafts is this:

that as we look for the home run skills player in round one, that typically creates a cascading effect that reduces the effectiveness of the rest of the draft.

luckily, we have the home run player already - ODB, which may allow for more specialist type O players to be found farther down.

for one example,

-wedged between Njoku and Hodges, yards wise, is a tall skinny (even skinnier, up to 220 from 208, 6'4" prolific TE from a smaller school, who is totally unlisted, not on anyone at alls' radar as a WR nor as a TE:

Deon Watson 6'4" 220

(espn stats)

124 David Njoku, TE MIAMI 43 698 16.2 76 8
125 Darreus Rogers, WR USC 56 696 12.4 46 4
126 Deon Watson, TE IDHO 41 695 17.0 74 3
127 Steven Dunbar, WR HOU 53 692 13.1 48 5
128 Bucky Hodges, TE VT 48 691 14.4 42 7

and possibly to be a wr again! ;-)

sleepers like

Mason Schreck Buffalo

6'4" 258lbs


all to make the point that if you don't draft one early, the both types are there throughout the draft

In comment 13356441 Victor in CT said:

Quote:

In comment 13356391 BigBlueDownTheShore said: Quote: In comment 13356348 CT Charlie said: Quote: until I read Sy's reports. Sy' or the Inside Football guy who writes the player draft reviews (Can't remember which guy did it, and having trouble finding the old thread) was drooling over Hodges. Wish I could find the TE review thread. Sy56 loves Hodges as a WR, NOT as a TE. I agree with him.

Truthfully I don't care if he primarily plays receiver. He reminds me of Mike Evans. Huge wingspan with an excellent catching radious. He can crack back on LBs if needed. I think the offense needs a true TE and I would love to have Hodges as a mismatch specialist.

while we are at it, also check out big WR Ricky Seals Jones at 6'4" 240

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LjGuMdKkww

Who go undrafted. Some are better projects than what we have.
Draft a TE and sign one or two in FA. Guys who will be better than Adam Tye and anything we have had before.

With Tye as a TE. The problem wasnt with him not catching the ball or getting open, Eli never threw him the ball. When he did, he caught it and then ran with it for a bunch. I also like Adams. I have no problem with getting an every down TE, someone like Wittenor hell even Heath Miller. But the only guy that seems like that seems to be Howard. If hes not available, I want a monster blocker who can catch the ball occasionally like Jake Ballard. That kinda guy we can get later.

I think it needs to be OL with two of the first 3 picks if we dont sign a Whitworth or a Zeitler. Solidifying this OL and running the ball consistently again instantly makes a Super Bowl contender with this defense. Everybody is down on Jennings...Jennings is a nice back up to have when he has giant holes to bust through late in games.

But, this is not a position I would even consider taking in multiple rounds.

Doubtful IMO. Too many unproven TEs then and too many other needs. Do absolutely believe they will draft one and possibly sign one in free agency. As it relates to drafting one, what it will come down to is what do the Giants view as their primary concern. Are they more concerned with getting the running game going or are they more concerned with stretching the middle of the field and taking some pressure off Beckham because there aren't too many good 2-way TEs in this draft. If it's the former, could see Shaheen in the 4th or Roberts in the 6th. If it's the latter, could see Hodges in the 2nd or Leggett in the 3rd. If they want both, maybe Sprinkle in the 4th or 5th assuming they are okay with him personally. Best bet though would be to sign a plug and play vet TE (Bennett, Fasano, Sims or Doyle) to take the pressure off needing to draft one,
They need to get the offense to where the defense is NOW. Can't wait for young guys to develop at key positions given Manning's age. If they can sign a vet TE, a vet LT and a vet #2 WR in free agency, the offense will be much better immediately and they will then have the luxury of drafting a young TE if he's BPA.

I would have an issue with 2 TE's in the draft

RANK PLAYER POS. POS. RANK SCHOOL CLASS HT. WT. PROJ. ROUND
11 O.J. Howard TE 1 Alabama Sr 6-6 249 1
30 David Njoku TE 2 Miami (Fla.) rSo 6-4 240 1-2
45 Evan Engram TE 3 Ole Miss Sr 6-3 236 2
72 Bucky Hodges TE 4 Virginia Tech rJr 6-6 245 2-3
75 Gerald Everett TE 5 South Alabama rSr 6-3 227 2-3
90 Jake ButtInjured TE 6 Michigan Sr 6-5 250 3
103 Jordan Leggett TE 7 Clemson Sr 6-5 258 3-4
147 Adam Shaheen TE 8 Ashland rJr 6-5 277 4-5
164 Jonnu Smith TE 9 Florida International Sr 6-3 245 5
172 Jeremy Sprinkle TE 10 Arkansas rSr 6-5 256 5
179 Billy Brown TE 11 Shepherd rSr 6-3 254 5-6
205 Michael Roberts TE 12 Toledo Sr 6-4 261 6
211 Eric Saubert TE 13 Drake rSr 6-5 247 6
235 Cole Hikutini TE 14 Louisville Sr 6-4 248 6-7
250 Blake Jarwin TE 15 Oklahoma State rSr 6-5 244 7
280 Darrell Daniels TE 16 Washington Sr 6-3 254 7-FA
298 Hayden Plinke TE 17 Texas-El Paso rSr 6-4 258 7-FA
312 Cethan Carter TE 18 Nebraska Sr 6-3 234 7-FA
324 George Kittle TE 19 Iowa rSr 6-4 250 7-FA
342 Scott Orndoff TE 20 Pittsburgh Sr 6-5 254 7-FA
369 Antony Auclair TE 21 Laval Sr 6-6 256 ––
391 Pharaoh Brown TE 22 Oregon rSr 6-5 250 ––
403 Josiah Price TE 23 Michigan State rSr 6-3 248 ––
420 Keith Towbridge TE 24 Louisville Sr 6-4 262 ––
437 Robert Tonyan Jr.

Lots of teams are going to be finding their TE for the next 5 years

In comment 13357839 chopperhatch said:

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With Tye as a TE. The problem wasnt with him not catching the ball or getting open, Eli never threw him the ball. When he did, he caught it and then ran with it for a bunch. I also like Adams. I have no problem with getting an every down TE, someone like Wittenor hell even Heath Miller. But the only guy that seems like that seems to be Howard. If hes not available, I want a monster blocker who can catch the ball occasionally like Jake Ballard. That kinda guy we can get later. I think it needs to be OL with two of the first 3 picks if we dont sign a Whitworth or a Zeitler. Solidifying this OL and running the ball consistently again instantly makes a Super Bowl contender with this defense. Everybody is down on Jennings...Jennings is a nice back up to have when he has giant holes to bust through late in games.

You lost me at Jennings. He is getting cut not only because he has decreased in production, but because he is going to cost to much to even keeps. I'd also like fresher legs to run through those wide open holes!