I'm in a bar argument with friend about this. I think he is, but my friend-a Bears fan-literally thinks Eli wearing a gold jacket is a joke.
When he retires, hopefully not soon, he'll be on the top ten for a ton of QB stats. Yes, including INTs. He's got a bit Brett Favre in him.
But I think he's a HOFer. I sadly think most non Giants fans don't think he is.
Roethlisberger and maybe even Rivers will go in 1st Ballot.
Why would Rivers be a 1st ballot guy if Eli isn't? Makes zero sense.
Roethlisberger and maybe even Rivers will go in 1st Ballot.
Rivers going first ballot would be laughable, absolutely laughable.
KW got in because of his story, Eli will be over scrutinized because of Peyton, his pick count,and his faces.
His good stats, yardage, TDs, etc keep growing and would draw him closer to YES, especially if they can make MC's O work.
That said, if its Stats oriented, TO should have gotten in, FWIW.
Anyway, I say Yes.
I don't know how anyone could justify Warner being in but keeping Eli out.
Probably end up top 4 all time yardage
Probably end up top 3 all time 4th quarter comebacks
2 super Bowl MVPs - beat "great team of all time" with greatest play in super bowl history (probably had second greatest with Manningham)
Iron Man streak
Unlike another QB did not choke in the 2007 NFC championship game (one of the greatest games ever played)
Charity work (unlike most of the guys in the HOF)
Ok so he threw a lot of INTs but 8 of 10 of QBs with most are in HOF.
This is a silly argument anyway. What does the kid have to do? He has more SuperBowl wins than Favre and Rogers Tarkenton, Moon etc. etc who have won one or none.
The real argument is should Namath be in with his 220 INTs and who really only had a five year career with any production but was a "personality" whose defense and Matt Snell won Super Bowl 3 for him.
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Is one of the biggest jokes I've ever seen. Will never understand it
Rags to riches story. Eli is better. He was the man when it mattered. And the morons who point to all this picks now want to ignore the last 3 years where his stats are now right up there.
Some of The fucking retards in the press were pushing for Ryan w a win by Atl this year. I was a bit on the fence before I started hearing all that idiotic shit. Good God what Eli could win if he had Jones hos whole career.
There is no stasticial measure that says eli is better than watner. Dont ise the 5 yr old "more rings" argument. Warner won two league mvps and manned an historic offense
There is no doubt in my mind, that Eli was on his way to that next level, after the 2011 season......but the talent on the Giants just went downhill after that season....where Eli could overcome bad OL play the year before, he couldn't do it by himself the next season....injuries to Nicks and the running game, took options away from Eli.....the line became worse over the next 4 seasons........and here we are in 2017, and the line is still in flux.....
Eli should have been the Number one priority of the front office, and they let him down.....
Lifetime stats aside, the number of Elite seasons are just not there.....however, when you see some of the stats of other qb's that have made the hall, he should be in...maybe not first ballot though....
I don't think Warner is a joke, but I thought his overall career and highs were short lived. Often that doesn't seem to get you in. He went from the best in the game to not even being able to become a starter in AZ. After the best show in Turf it was like he couldn't buy a starting job. He has also been surrounded by some great talent.
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Is one of the biggest jokes I've ever seen. Will never understand it
So now he's a HOFer after your comments on the other thread?
C'mon man make up your mind...
Dude your taking what i said out of context go back and read my posts Eli in my opinion is a good starting NFL QB he is not HOF. However, he will clearly get in but if I'm voting I would not. He's had 2 great runs and hasn't missed a game which has accounted for his TDs and Yardage numbers. He has not had many elite seasons by my account he has had 4. If 4 really good seasons means HOF then he is in and apparently it does i.e. kurt warner
24 18
23 20
21 10
27 14
31 25
29 16 good season
26 15 good season
18 27
30 14 good season-odell beckham arrives misses playoffs
35 14elite misses playoffs
26 16 good season
basically half his career was at average or below
I know i will be pegged as an Eli hater but the truth is I love the guy I love what he brings to the team, leadership, toughness, acountability but again, I don't put on my giants goggles when I judge my team i try and view it objectively
I don't think he should be in but I get it. I'd rather see elite guys get in even when they may not have done it over a long period over the compiler types who were never elite.
I don't think he should be in but I get it. I'd rather see elite guys get in even when they may not have done it over a long period over the compiler types who were never elite.
Are you talking about the concussion issues he had or something elae?
List the HOF players Eli has played with and the list the HOF players that played with Kurt Warner. Look at the numbers of guys like Larry Fitzgerald and Az Hakim or Tory Holt with and without Warner and then look at guys that Elis played with and, if you can find them, the numbers of those guys with other QBs.
Kurt Warner is a nice story but the guy has to one of the most overrated NFL players ever. Unbelievable but true, I think Giants fans are among the most often guilty of underrating Eli. Eli is a once in a lifetime player and still he gets kicked around like, "yeah, he won those two Super Bowls and he holds the record for consecutive starts among active players but he's not really worthy of the HOF..."
Marc Bulger led the Rams to a 12-4 season and a double OT loss in the NFC the year after Warner left. I think Bulger went 5-0 two season prior with the Rams and then got hurt. Could Warner play well for Martzs Rams? Hell yes he could and he did. But that team was stacked with talent and even a pretty pedestrian QB like Bulger could lead "the greatest show on turf". Anyone want to watch the Giants backup running our offense?
Can some Warner fan list all his 4th quarter comebacks? Please, regular season and playoffs. How about game winning drives? Here's one, number of 4th quarter game winning drives outdoors? Then list Elis. How about the number of times Warner was benched? How many different coaches benched Warner?
How Kurt Warners legend ever grew to the point that he wound up in the HOF is a mystery to me. You guys think Eli is inconsistent then take a look at Warners career. Did he win with the Rams? Yup. Can not take that away from him. Had a good run with the Cards too and that was without a doubt much more impressive. Guy could play. Sometimes. Congrats to him and his family. Really.
The only thing more mysterious than the love for Warner is the indifference and under-appreciation of Eli Manning. What more do people want from Eli? Two Super Bowls! Never misses a start. A gosh darn choirboy on the field and in the locker room and a freaking Walter Payton Man of the Year winner (and nominee) for the work he does in the community. He's one of a few pro athletes that you can point to and tell your kids, be like that guy and you'll be a great person and a winner. Seriously, what more do some of you people want from the guy?
I think it would be more ballsy for someone to provide some stats on how he is not a Hall of Famer. Someone should start a discussion like that.
I really liked Simms, and Y.A. was pretty darn good
I also know he was the quarterback that brought th team back to championship level after 18 years of losing football
List the HOF players Eli has played with and the list the HOF players that played with Kurt Warner. Look at the numbers of guys like Larry Fitzgerald and Az Hakim or Tory Holt with and without Warner and then look at guys that Elis played with and, if you can find them, the numbers of those guys with other QBs.
Kurt Warner is a nice story but the guy has to one of the most overrated NFL players ever. Unbelievable but true, I think Giants fans are among the most often guilty of underrating Eli. Eli is a once in a lifetime player and still he gets kicked around like, "yeah, he won those two Super Bowls and he holds the record for consecutive starts among active players but he's not really worthy of the HOF..."
Marc Bulger led the Rams to a 12-4 season and a double OT loss in the NFC the year after Warner left. I think Bulger went 5-0 two season prior with the Rams and then got hurt. Could Warner play well for Martzs Rams? Hell yes he could and he did. But that team was stacked with talent and even a pretty pedestrian QB like Bulger could lead "the greatest show on turf". Anyone want to watch the Giants backup running our offense?
Can some Warner fan list all his 4th quarter comebacks? Please, regular season and playoffs. How about game winning drives? Here's one, number of 4th quarter game winning drives outdoors? Then list Elis. How about the number of times Warner was benched? How many different coaches benched Warner?
How Kurt Warners legend ever grew to the point that he wound up in the HOF is a mystery to me. You guys think Eli is inconsistent then take a look at Warners career. Did he win with the Rams? Yup. Can not take that away from him. Had a good run with the Cards too and that was without a doubt much more impressive. Guy could play. Sometimes. Congrats to him and his family. Really.
The only thing more mysterious than the love for Warner is the indifference and under-appreciation of Eli Manning. What more do people want from Eli? Two Super Bowls! Never misses a start. A gosh darn choirboy on the field and in the locker room and a freaking Walter Payton Man of the Year winner (and nominee) for the work he does in the community. He's one of a few pro athletes that you can point to and tell your kids, be like that guy and you'll be a great person and a winner. Seriously, what more do some of you people want from the guy?
Let's not forget that Warner is a regular on the NFL Network. Does anyone have a better explanation of how Warren Sapp is a first round pick over Michael Strahan than his connection at the time to the NFL Network?
My prediction re: Eli---a fist ballot pick if he becomes a regular on the NFL Network. Otherwise, it will take a while, but he will get in eventually.
List the HOF players Eli has played with and the list the HOF players that played with Kurt Warner. Look at the numbers of guys like Larry Fitzgerald and Az Hakim or Tory Holt with and without Warner and then look at guys that Elis played with and, if you can find them, the numbers of those guys with other QBs.
Kurt Warner is a nice story but the guy has to one of the most overrated NFL players ever. Unbelievable but true, I think Giants fans are among the most often guilty of underrating Eli. Eli is a once in a lifetime player and still he gets kicked around like, "yeah, he won those two Super Bowls and he holds the record for consecutive starts among active players but he's not really worthy of the HOF..."
Marc Bulger led the Rams to a 12-4 season and a double OT loss in the NFC the year after Warner left. I think Bulger went 5-0 two season prior with the Rams and then got hurt. Could Warner play well for Martzs Rams? Hell yes he could and he did. But that team was stacked with talent and even a pretty pedestrian QB like Bulger could lead "the greatest show on turf". Anyone want to watch the Giants backup running our offense?
Can some Warner fan list all his 4th quarter comebacks? Please, regular season and playoffs. How about game winning drives? Here's one, number of 4th quarter game winning drives outdoors? Then list Elis. How about the number of times Warner was benched? How many different coaches benched Warner?
How Kurt Warners legend ever grew to the point that he wound up in the HOF is a mystery to me. You guys think Eli is inconsistent then take a look at Warners career. Did he win with the Rams? Yup. Can not take that away from him. Had a good run with the Cards too and that was without a doubt much more impressive. Guy could play. Sometimes. Congrats to him and his family. Really.
The only thing more mysterious than the love for Warner is the indifference and under-appreciation of Eli Manning. What more do people want from Eli? Two Super Bowls! Never misses a start. A gosh darn choirboy on the field and in the locker room and a freaking Walter Payton Man of the Year winner (and nominee) for the work he does in the community. He's one of a few pro athletes that you can point to and tell your kids, be like that guy and you'll be a great person and a winner. Seriously, what more do some of you people want from the guy?
Let's not forget that Warner is a regular on the NFL Network. Does anyone have a better explanation of how Warren Sapp is a first round pick over Michael Strahan than his connection at the time to the NFL Network?
My prediction re: Eli---a fist ballot pick if he becomes a regular on the NFL Network. Otherwise, it will take a while, but he will get in eventually.
Warner probably deserves to get in, but he benefited from being surrounded by amazing talent, in a QB friendly system. You saw how pedestrian he was when he played with the Giants.
This. He is a HOF lock. Maybe not first ballot yet. But he will get in.
It is all about Championships unless it is Eli then it gets downplayed as 2 great runs.
It is all about stats unless it is Eli then it is the era of when he played
It is all about being a gambler unless it is Eli and then it about int's
It is all about being tough and/or not missing games unless it is Eli and then it is downplayed
He forced a trade, he is not Peyton, and he does not care what the media thinks. It is easy to bash on Eli
Read BBI and you would think half the people here would rather not win the SB just so they could make the playoffs every year - and these are Giants fans
I'd say 50-50 he gets in
He has the championships
He has the Superbowl MVP's
He has the Iron Man Streak
He has the last name
I don;t think Eli has another 2011 season in him, but he doesn't have to. If he can throw 25-30 TD's over the next 3-4 seasons, and keep the TO's at a manageable level (like a 2:1 TD:TO ratio), than he's in. Another championship and it's a no-brainer.
Eli Manning is a franchise QB who has brought home two SBs.
Then everyone would be saying, "yeah, if he only could get a second. Ya know, to show the first wasn't luck. Then he'd be a lock."
The only thing in that list that is impressive is the MVPs. Pro Bowls? Seriously?
Having said that, Warner's career is completely disjointed. He arrived out of no where playing great, then disappeared for a time period, before reemerging with the Cardinals.
He's very tough to evaluate...........
So do we have a clue on how others -- experts, his peers, the general NFL fans -- think of Eli? He's been voted Super Bowl MVP twice. He's been voted to the Pro Bowl twice in 13 years. He's never been voted to the All-Pro, 1st or 2nd team. On several years he's been voted so low on the "NFL's top 100 players" list by his peers that led to outrage and ridicule on this forum.
So when it comes to HOF, the ultimate decision on how others think of a player, Eli will likely get in, but it likely will be a long wait, with some favorable circumstances needing to align in that particular year.
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They are going to give him the Strahan NY Bias treatment and put him in 2nd Ballot almost unanimously.
Roethlisberger and maybe even Rivers will go in 1st Ballot.
Rivers going first ballot would be laughable, absolutely laughable.
Unless Rivers gets a ring, I personally don't think he's going to get in at all. If he gets a ring, I think he makes it.
Even his 2011 campaign where he carried the Giants, he never got the recognition he deserved because of how unspectacular the team was in the regular season.
For their entire careers, they have very similar completion ratio percentage, TD%, INT%. So similar to essentially be equal.
Of course Jay doesn't have the trophies nor the physical toughness....or the leadership. 2010 NFC Championship game is a bit hard to shake along with other shenanigans in the seasons that followed.
But there are enough casual fans out there who believe he is as good as Eli, or maybe more accurately that Eli isn't any better than Jay.
I'd say he's a Hall of Famer.
BUT...
He's very reliant on those two trophies. Unlike a Marino who gets in with 0 or Young/Favre who get in with 1.
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is not a way of proving Eli belongs in the HOF. Warner was an first team All-Pro 2 times, 4 times overall (Eli 0). Warner was a 2 time NFL MVP (Eli 0). He was voted to the Pro Bowl 4 times (Eli 2, he was an alternate in to others). So, by saying if Kurt Warner made the HOF so should Eli, I don't know if one has much of an argument
The only thing in that list that is impressive is the MVPs. Pro Bowls? Seriously?
Having said that, Warner's career is completely disjointed. He arrived out of no where playing great, then disappeared for a time period, before reemerging with the Cardinals.
He's very tough to evaluate...........
Warner when he was great you could say had higher peaks than Eli Manning.
It's that simple. The Terrell Davis formula.
If he won it all with the Cardinals, then nobody is even bringing this topic up with him. It was close but no cigar. I guess that pick 6 is on him.
But Brady threw one last week and it was ok, haha.
Speaking of the Patriots, how about SB 36? Marshall Faulk is still pissed at what he perceived was cheating.
Normally you'd say he has to go based on that.
But the thing to remember is how voting took place back in the day versus now. You have Joe Namath in the HoF for crying out loud.
I think being the starting QB of a winning SB team was enough back then. Now not as much....even when the QB position is more important than it used to be.
2. Eli is 7th all time in completions currently. Everyone in front of him is a hall of famer
3.Eli is 8th in passing yards. Everyone in front of him is a hall of famer
4. Eli is 7th in touchdowns. everyone in front of him is a hall of famer.
If he just had the rings or just had the numbers i can see making him wait but the guy has both. He also got both of his championships while beating arguable the best team of his era and winning MVP honors both times. I just dont see how you cant put him in
I'm not sure how that helps Eli make the HOF, but I like the nonlinear thinking!
and it doesn't help that he coincided with another HOF question mark - Tom Coughlin. you have a HOF QB with a HOF HC, there should be more playoff seasons/playoff wins in more seasons.
Is all that his fault? of course not. but it has to be taken into account.
Methinks he's a borderline HOF QB. IMO, he needs a rebound year where he and his offense look good in order to make this a done deal. He doesn't need another ring. but he does need to show that he's leading the team to victories.
24 18
23 20
21 10
27 14
31 25
29 16 good season
26 15 good season
18 27
30 14 good season-odell beckham arrives misses playoffs
35 14 elite misses playoffs
26 16 good season
So 26-15 and 26-16 are good seasons, but 27-14 isn't? And the 29-16 wasn't a good season, it was a great one. His best. Nearly 5,000 yards, with the lowest rated rushing attack in the league, and the 30th ranked defense, Eli put that team on his back and willed it into the playoffs.
That was also the beginning of the end of the "big five" on the offensive line.
Everything had to be perfect for Eli to be elite? Name one HOF player on either Super Bowl teams aside from Michael Strahan on defense and I'll concede the point. Prior to Beckham, he had played with only four skilled position pro bowlers, two of which were non contributors to the 2007 team team (Tike and Shockey). The only other pro bowlers who were receivers, I believe made it as alternates (Steve Smith and Victor Cruz). Beckham is the first true weapon he has played with, and guys like Plax, Nicks, Cruz, Smith, Toomer were good contributors but not multi-year, elite superstars.
However,looking at his lifetime QB rating of 83.7 which is
above HOFers,Aikman,Moon,Tarkenton & even Johnny Unitas,I conclude that he has an excellent chance of getting in,but not
on the first ballot.