playing some with the starters at the 1 and 2, but mostly being the offense with the 2nd unit. There are a limited # of guys who can create their own shot, and he is absolutely one of them. Each good team needs 2-3 of these players. It's why warts and all J.R. Smith is a good player.
but let's be clear that we're not interested in taking back onerous contracts on bad players. That is the Knick way so its always a concern when they have $ to spend and/or expiring contracts to deal. In short, they can't be trusted.
but let's be clear that we're not interested in taking back onerous contracts on bad players. That is the Knick way so its always a concern when they have $ to spend and/or expiring contracts to deal. In short, they can't be trusted.
No, we are interested in bad contracts if the asset is good enough. That's what rebuilding teams do -- use their cap as an asset to rent out to other teams (for a price).
The Knicks way is to trade their future assets for faded names.
I honestly am surprised that Rose really didn't make this team better Â
but let's be clear that we're not interested in taking back onerous contracts on bad players. That is the Knick way so its always a concern when they have $ to spend and/or expiring contracts to deal. In short, they can't be trusted.
Depends. As we've all discussed before, if we can move melo or if we decide to rebuild through the draft(an obvious direction considering), we can take back a bad contract if we get a pick to do it.
don't want any of our "assets" (ones we would actually move) back next year outside of KOQ (I'd deal him but I wouldn't give him away). I'd give away Jennings or Rose for 2nd's if need be. Obviously would prefer more.
he still can flash the offense, but it's inconsistent, he hasn't facilitated well, and his defense has been nonexistent.
I don't know how much of the defense part is on his effort/skills, and how much is on Hornacek, and how much is on this being an embarrassment of an organization, but the future isn't with Rose.
and they'd need to add an asset for me to take Rubio.
runio shabazz and a pick and i would do it..
rubio is still only 24 and he is really good friends with willy and other than melo the ball could be in his hands to run the offense, something he cant do in minnesota
a bad defender (combination of white guy and Euro syndrome). He's actually a very good defender. He's got two major weaknesses. 1) injury prone 2) subpar perimeter shooter
and prob fits better considering we have guys that can score. He's a terrible scorer, but good at getting others involved. Some thing he's a good defender, some thinks he sucks. Doesn't matter, anyone would suck being put on this team.
is his expiring contract, don't want to see the past mistakes of taking on bad contracts, let him go at end of season and leave cap room.
as a rebuilding team you take on a bad contract to get draft picks, this team will not be rebuilt theough free agency, cap room means very little right now..
so if a team is willing to package a 1st with a bad contract you do it..
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Howard Beck: Are the Nets going to get two (first-round picks) for Brook Lopez? No. This person I spoke to said he didn’t even think they could get one.
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
only has 1 year left. Gotta believe someone would pretty easily give up a 1st for him. Too bad Gortat is a bad fit at the 4. Washington with some interior scoring (Lopez) could be dangerous.
for bigs that cant rebound and aren't plus defenders.
Understood but Channing Frye brought back a 1st, plenty of players significantly worse than Lopez have brought back 1sts. It's not like he has a bad deal.
Howard Beck: Are the Nets going to get two (first-round picks) for Brook Lopez? No. This person I spoke to said he didn’t even think they could get one.
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
Anyone who talks in broad terms like a first or two firsts doesnt know what they're talking about. Philly's first doesnt equal Milw's first doesnt equal GSW's first.
Sports writers I think are very bad at valuing potential trade targets. Most sportswriters are actually bad at figuring out what is going on on the court, because you dont need to write about WHY a PnR killed a team one night. You just have to say "they couldnt stop X from getting to the lane". And quote players/coaches. So when it comes to stuff like trades and the draft, where there is active disinformation out there, they get made the fool.
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
and Jennings chose to sign here at a steep discount despite multiple teams offering him deals.
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
Howard Beck: Are the Nets going to get two (first-round picks) for Brook Lopez? No. This person I spoke to said he didn’t even think they could get one.
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
Anyone who talks in broad terms like a first or two firsts doesnt know what they're talking about. Philly's first doesnt equal Milw's first doesnt equal GSW's first.
Sports writers I think are very bad at valuing potential trade targets. Most sportswriters are actually bad at figuring out what is going on on the court, because you dont need to write about WHY a PnR killed a team one night. You just have to say "they couldnt stop X from getting to the lane". And quote players/coaches. So when it comes to stuff like trades and the draft, where there is active disinformation out there, they get made the fool.
It wasn't a sports writer, it was an executive telling howard beck this.
It wasn't a sports writer, it was an executive telling howard beck this.
Execs lie when it comes to the draft and trades. Even when they have no dog in the fight, they still have no dog in the fight.
Say you dont want Lopez, but you dont want a rival to get Lopez. What you do is publicly talk up or talk down his value. Then there is a disconnect between what is fair value and what the public thinks is fair value. Then to get a trade, one GM will have to overpay/under-receive in the public's eye.
Moreover, these assessments often confuse what that GM would do for what other GMs should do. And an executive could be any of 500+ people around the league.
the mechanics of an NBA trade can get so complicated... Â
so making a definitive statement about a guy's worth can be difficult. It's not like MLB where if you're trading an ace pitcher, you can expect to receive 4-5 prospects of various abilities or whatever and you don't have to worry about cap rules. In the the case of Lopez, it's not like he has the type of game where you can just plug and play him into any lineup. But in the right scenario (maybe anchoring a contender's second unit), he would have a ton of value. But said contender would need to have the pieces on hand to deal for him without disrupting their existing core.
No, we are interested in bad contracts if the asset is good enough. That's what rebuilding teams do -- use their cap as an asset to rent out to other teams (for a price).
The Knicks way is to trade their future assets for faded names.
I figured he would IF he was healthy, and for the most part he has been, but he's even less of a passer than I thought he was.
Depends. As we've all discussed before, if we can move melo or if we decide to rebuild through the draft(an obvious direction considering), we can take back a bad contract if we get a pick to do it.
100%. Don't want him back next year so gimme some sort of asset and I'm good.
Trade them both and we'll struggle to win more than a handful of games. Which is fine.
I don't know how much of the defense part is on his effort/skills, and how much is on Hornacek, and how much is on this being an embarrassment of an organization, but the future isn't with Rose.
Might as well collect assets.
Heat - for a package centered on Dragic (if Miami wants to get out of that committment)
Wolves - for Rubio plus cap filler
Suns - for Knight + Warren + 2017 # 2
runio shabazz and a pick and i would do it..
rubio is still only 24 and he is really good friends with willy and other than melo the ball could be in his hands to run the offense, something he cant do in minnesota
Since Rose makes $8mm more than Rubio, you need another 8mm on salary from Minny.
Minnesota is under cap
Disagree there (and I say that as someone 100% against bringing back Rose). But on the right team as a scorer off the bench he absolutely has value.
as a rebuilding team you take on a bad contract to get draft picks, this team will not be rebuilt theough free agency, cap room means very little right now..
so if a team is willing to package a 1st with a bad contract you do it..
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
Understood but Channing Frye brought back a 1st, plenty of players significantly worse than Lopez have brought back 1sts. It's not like he has a bad deal.
And yet the Knicks traded a first round pick for Bargnani
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
Anyone who talks in broad terms like a first or two firsts doesnt know what they're talking about. Philly's first doesnt equal Milw's first doesnt equal GSW's first.
Sports writers I think are very bad at valuing potential trade targets. Most sportswriters are actually bad at figuring out what is going on on the court, because you dont need to write about WHY a PnR killed a team one night. You just have to say "they couldnt stop X from getting to the lane". And quote players/coaches. So when it comes to stuff like trades and the draft, where there is active disinformation out there, they get made the fool.
Quote:
for bigs that cant rebound and aren't plus defenders.
And yet the Knicks traded a first round pick for Bargnani
A 1 and two 2s. Get it right.
Quote:
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
Quote:
In comment 13364002 JOMO25 said:
Quote:
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
Quote:
In comment 13364004 Keith said:
Quote:
In comment 13364002 JOMO25 said:
Quote:
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
and Jennings chose to sign here at a steep discount despite multiple teams offering him deals.
Quote:
In comment 13364004 Keith said:
Quote:
In comment 13364002 JOMO25 said:
Quote:
room is that a) with the increased "madness" surrounding the NYK, you wonder about FAs coming here b) Phil doesn't show any ability to score FAs that are "in demand"
So they may be resigned to filling next years PG position via trade (be it Rubio or others mentioned in this thread) and hopefully backed up but a top 5 draft pick with the top of the lottery being so loaded with PGs
Explain that first statement? What FA did we target that Phil missed out on?
Off the top of my head, Aldridge, Jordan, and Monroe were actively, publicly targeted the summer we signed Rolo.
We never pursued Aldridge. We never gave Monroe a max offer. Michael Jordan has been retired for a while now.
kidding, I hope
Quote:
Howard Beck: Are the Nets going to get two (first-round picks) for Brook Lopez? No. This person I spoke to said he didn’t even think they could get one.
They could def get a first, probably not a good first.
Anyone who talks in broad terms like a first or two firsts doesnt know what they're talking about. Philly's first doesnt equal Milw's first doesnt equal GSW's first.
Sports writers I think are very bad at valuing potential trade targets. Most sportswriters are actually bad at figuring out what is going on on the court, because you dont need to write about WHY a PnR killed a team one night. You just have to say "they couldnt stop X from getting to the lane". And quote players/coaches. So when it comes to stuff like trades and the draft, where there is active disinformation out there, they get made the fool.
It wasn't a sports writer, it was an executive telling howard beck this.
It wasn't a sports writer, it was an executive telling howard beck this.
Execs lie when it comes to the draft and trades. Even when they have no dog in the fight, they still have no dog in the fight.
Say you dont want Lopez, but you dont want a rival to get Lopez. What you do is publicly talk up or talk down his value. Then there is a disconnect between what is fair value and what the public thinks is fair value. Then to get a trade, one GM will have to overpay/under-receive in the public's eye.
Moreover, these assessments often confuse what that GM would do for what other GMs should do. And an executive could be any of 500+ people around the league.