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NFT: Knicks Chat: Rose has multiple suitors

DanMetroMan : 2/21/2017 9:08 am
According to ESPN’s Ian Begley, the Timberwolves have talked to the Knicks about a possible trade involving Rose. Begley reports that “it is unclear” what the Timberwolves would offer the Knicks for the former MVP. The Timberwolves aren’t the only team inquiring about Rose as Begley reports that “several teams” have reached out to the Knicks about their starting point guard.

-Berman is implying Melo prefers LAC/LAL over Cleveland, Boston etc but like everyone else he's saying a deal would be shocking.

-Steve Kyler says Paul has a verbal agreement to remain with LAC and will be official once the new CBA begins.
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Here's a stat that absolutely boggled my mind  
dep026 : 2/21/2017 4:42 pm : link
the Knicks are 13th in the NBA in FG% allowed. I thought they would be near the bottom.
Said on another thread after watching Smith  
Carl in CT : 2/21/2017 4:43 pm : link
Against ND this weekend that I don't like the player at all.
I've seen Lonzo Ball the most  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 4:44 pm : link
so I'd probably lean towards him, but I haven't allowed myself to dream of such things. My magic number all along has been top 7 (PGs+Monk+Jackson), but Isaac and Tatum have made top 9 acceptable for me.
I think I'd go Fultz at #1  
Greg from LI : 2/21/2017 4:45 pm : link
.
RE: I've seen Lonzo Ball the most  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2017 4:46 pm : link
In comment 13366995 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
so I'd probably lean towards him, but I haven't allowed myself to dream of such things. My magic number all along has been top 7 (PGs+Monk+Jackson), but Isaac and Tatum have made top 9 acceptable for me.


Ball reminds me a lot of Jason Kid. Great passing and awesome quick outlets. Would be a dream to get him.
RE: Here's a stat that absolutely boggled my mind  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 4:46 pm : link
In comment 13366993 dep026 said:
Quote:
the Knicks are 13th in the NBA in FG% allowed. I thought they would be near the bottom.


They're 25th in defensive efficiency.
RE: I've seen Lonzo Ball the most  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 4:48 pm : link
In comment 13366995 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
so I'd probably lean towards him, but I haven't allowed myself to dream of such things. My magic number all along has been top 7 (PGs+Monk+Jackson), but Isaac and Tatum have made top 9 acceptable for me.


I'm pretty much right there with you. I probably take Isaac/Tatum over monk tho.
RE: RE: Here's a stat that absolutely boggled my mind  
dep026 : 2/21/2017 4:50 pm : link
In comment 13366999 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13366993 dep026 said:


Quote:


the Knicks are 13th in the NBA in FG% allowed. I thought they would be near the bottom.



They're 25th in defensive efficiency.


Oh I know they are bad.... I just thought teams shot a lot better against them.
Yeesh  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 4:55 pm : link
Denver is dead last in DEF efficiency. That's my one fear with Jokic, Denver needs to surround him with 4 guys that will play balls to the wall defense.
Knicks Schedule  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2017 4:57 pm : link
Knicks will be lucky to win 7 more games to get to 30 wins. Tough schedule and I'd bet them going under. Getting to the "4th seed" in the lottery gives them a 38% chance at top 3. Huge jump up from 8th currently and 8% at top 3.
RE: RE: RE: Here's a stat that absolutely boggled my mind  
Deej : 2/21/2017 5:02 pm : link
In comment 13367006 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 13366999 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


In comment 13366993 dep026 said:


Quote:


the Knicks are 13th in the NBA in FG% allowed. I thought they would be near the bottom.



They're 25th in defensive efficiency.



Oh I know they are bad.... I just thought teams shot a lot better against them.


eFG% allowed is 9th BEST because their 3 point D is actually decent (3P% against is also 9th). What does stick out in our stats allowed is ORB allowed (worst), FTA (7th worst, 2nd worst in foul rate), and TOs caused (4th worst). Stats are referenced per-possession.

Knicks are bad at pressuring the ball. They have bad non-shooting outcomes on D.
RE: Knicks Schedule  
Deej : 2/21/2017 5:03 pm : link
In comment 13367016 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
Knicks will be lucky to win 7 more games to get to 30 wins. Tough schedule and I'd bet them going under. Getting to the "4th seed" in the lottery gives them a 38% chance at top 3. Huge jump up from 8th currently and 8% at top 3.


Melo and KP are shooters. Shooters can ALWAYS go off. Who had us beating SAS? I'd be surprised if the current roster closes that bad, especially if KP and Noah get healthy.
I think we end up with 32-33 wins  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 5:05 pm : link
Barring any trades. If we sell off rose and KOQ for picks/useless expirings I think 30 might be accurate.
Wouldnt it be so the knicks  
dep026 : 2/21/2017 5:05 pm : link
to have a diasterous season, finish with a top 4 pick, while trading for Rubio - and stuck with his contract when you could get a stud PG in the draft? haha
A 1 for Bojan would be great  
hitdog42 : 2/21/2017 5:07 pm : link
Stockpile some assets-
If could then trade brook for a 1 and 2 and then take on ezeli for comp- they will have something going for the offseason rfa attempts
Let's see what the roster looks like in 48 hours.  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 5:08 pm : link
If it stays as is, they'll at least be competitive (unfortunately). Maybe Rubio even gives them a spark on offense with his unselfishness. That's why I'd like to deal off some spare parts - Lance, O'Quinn, Jennings, etc. - to at least chip away at our depth. More minutes for Plumlee, Baker and N'Dour is good for development AND for tanking purposes.
RE: I think we end up with 32-33 wins  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2017 5:10 pm : link
In comment 13367024 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
Barring any trades. If we sell off rose and KOQ for picks/useless expirings I think 30 might be accurate.


If that deadline passes and there's no deal for Rose, why not just buy him out? What purpose does it serve keeping him for the last 25 games?
RE: Wouldnt it be so the knicks  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 5:10 pm : link
In comment 13367025 dep026 said:
Quote:
to have a diasterous season, finish with a top 4 pick, while trading for Rubio - and stuck with his contract when you could get a stud PG in the draft? haha


Why would that be a big deal? He only has 2 years left, so 1 before he becomes an expiring.
RE: Wouldnt it be so the knicks  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 5:10 pm : link
In comment 13367025 dep026 said:
Quote:
to have a diasterous season, finish with a top 4 pick, while trading for Rubio - and stuck with his contract when you could get a stud PG in the draft? haha


There isn't a chance in hell they'd pass up those top PGs because Rubio is on the roster. Minny took Dunn despite having Rubio.
RE: A 1 for Bojan would be great  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 5:12 pm : link
In comment 13367027 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
Stockpile some assets-
If could then trade brook for a 1 and 2 and then take on ezeli for comp- they will have something going for the offseason rfa attempts


Mirotic might be very gettable, could be a good reward if he can get his 3 point shot figured out.
RE: Wouldnt it be so the knicks  
Deej : 2/21/2017 5:15 pm : link
In comment 13367025 dep026 said:
Quote:
to have a diasterous season, finish with a top 4 pick, while trading for Rubio - and stuck with his contract when you could get a stud PG in the draft? haha


I struggle to see how we could be stuck with Rubio. Contract runs 2 more seasons. Even assuming it is untradeable, so what? 16-18 minutes as the backup 1, plus time in 2 PG guard sets. Fundamentally, I dont see Melo, Noah, KP, Lee, Fultz/Smith/Ball competing for a title in 2018-19. And then Rubio is done.

More realistic to me is that he has some value in 2018-19 to someone who could use some PG depth/defense. I'd also like to see what he brings as a bench guard, as his athleticism might shine thru better in the less structured game that comes when the starters sit.
Can we just wrap this up already?  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 5:56 pm : link
Quote:
David Aldridge
âś”
@daldridgetnt

Wolves’ pursuit of Derrick Rose still very strong—“Thibs wants to do this,” says league source w/knowledge—but MIN absolutely keeping Dunn.
RE: Can we just wrap this up already?  
Jon in NYC : 2/21/2017 5:58 pm : link
In comment 13367058 bceagle05 said:
Quote:


Quote:


David Aldridge
âś”
@daldridgetnt

Wolves’ pursuit of Derrick Rose still very strong—“Thibs wants to do this,” says league source w/knowledge—but MIN absolutely keeping Dunn.



Was Dunn even up for grabs?
Yeah that was a weird thing to add.  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 6:02 pm : link
I think we all figure it's for Rubio by now.
RE: RE: Can we just wrap this up already?  
Deej : 2/21/2017 6:05 pm : link
In comment 13367060 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 13367058 bceagle05 said:


Quote:




Quote:


David Aldridge
âś”
@daldridgetnt

Wolves’ pursuit of Derrick Rose still very strong—“Thibs wants to do this,” says league source w/knowledge—but MIN absolutely keeping Dunn.





Was Dunn even up for grabs?


For Rose? I wouldnt think so. I think it is just a statement that just because they want to trade for Rose, a PG, does not mean that they are looking to move on from Dunn, another PG.
Read that Celts are more interested in  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 2/21/2017 6:18 pm : link
George than Butler.
Why  
Jon in NYC : 2/21/2017 7:15 pm : link
aren't the Wolves better?

Rubio, Lavine, Wiggins, KAT, Dunn, Dieng. They have the third worst record in the West.
RE: Why  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 7:22 pm : link
In comment 13367128 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
aren't the Wolves better?

Rubio, Lavine, Wiggins, KAT, Dunn, Dieng. They have the third worst record in the West.


The offensive reputation for all of those guys are levels ahead of where their defense stands. Defense comes much, much later in any player's career.
And Dunn  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 7:22 pm : link
has arguably been the worst player in the league at the amount of minutes he's gotten.
A quiet day for a lot of talk  
Carl in CT : 2/21/2017 7:31 pm : link
Wonder what tomorrow brings.
.  
Anakim : 2/21/2017 7:41 pm : link
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account‏@WojVerticalNBA
The Rockets are sending Corey Brewer and a first-round pick to the Lakers for Lou Williams, league source tells @TheVertical.
RE: A quiet day for a lot of talk  
nygiants16 : 2/21/2017 7:42 pm : link
In comment 13367155 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Wonder what tomorrow brings.


everything seems to happen at night
Who  
Jon in NYC : 2/21/2017 7:43 pm : link
would you rather have, Lou Williams or Courtney Lee?
RE: Who  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 7:50 pm : link
In comment 13367164 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
would you rather have, Lou Williams or Courtney Lee?


In a vacuum I take Williams. If I need a starting SG, I take Lee.
Noah "tweaked" his hamstring again  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/21/2017 8:11 pm : link
Willy starting Thursday night per bleacher report.
Why do I get the feeling that we'll all be disappointed Thursday?  
yatqb : 2/21/2017 8:11 pm : link
.
RE: Why do I get the feeling that we'll all be disappointed Thursday?  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 8:18 pm : link
In comment 13367202 yatqb said:
Quote:
.


In what way?
RE: RE: Why do I get the feeling that we'll all be disappointed Thursday?  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 8:19 pm : link
In comment 13367216 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
In comment 13367202 yatqb said:


Quote:


.



In what way?


Nvm, thought you were suggesting we were going to beat the Cavs lol.
Picks  
TyreeHelmet : 2/21/2017 8:25 pm : link
But I thought no teams would trade a 1st round pick because no one can beat the Cavs/ Warriors......

I'd much rather have Courtney Lee. Lou Williams might be the worst defender in the league.

Courtney Lee and KOQ to the Wizards for picks. They need bench help....
RE: Why do I get the feeling that we'll all be disappointed Thursday?  
Jon in NYC : 2/21/2017 8:26 pm : link
In comment 13367202 yatqb said:
Quote:
.


I guess it depends on your expectation. I'd expect the Rose for Rubio trade to go down, and I think it's a safe bet that Jennings and/or KOQ goes for a pick. Melo's almost certainly staying.
RE: Picks  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 8:35 pm : link
In comment 13367228 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
But I thought no teams would trade a 1st round pick because no one can beat the Cavs/ Warriors......

I'd much rather have Courtney Lee. Lou Williams might be the worst defender in the league.

Courtney Lee and KOQ to the Wizards for picks. They need bench help....


I don't think anyone was saying NO 1st rounders would be traded. Like Deej said, not all 1st rounders are equal. The Rockets pick could very easily be the 28th pick in the draft and half of Lou Will's value is his contract. Lee's certainly not un-tradeable but his contract isn't amazing, either. He's getting twice what Williams is getting.
Kmart  
DanMetroMan : 2/21/2017 8:52 pm : link
shits on Phil and Noah wow lol
Link - ( New Window )
Somebody give us a crumb or something.  
bceagle05 : 2/21/2017 10:01 pm : link
Has Isaiah Thomas posted any more eyeball emojis?
RE: Somebody give us a crumb or something.  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 10:12 pm : link
In comment 13367343 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
Has Isaiah Thomas posted any more eyeball emojis?


Umm...Emmanuel Mudiay is expected to play on Thursday?
I get why we are trading Rose.  
Keith : 2/21/2017 10:20 pm : link
I understand he has no future in NY and he's not really a good fit with this group. I also get that Rubio is a better fit with this cast, but Rose for Rubio makes no fucking sense to me. The whole idea of trading for rose was to give him a tryout and then decide if we want to build with him. It didn't work, so we get to move on pretty easily. What exactly does Rubio do for us? Make us slightly better in the short term which is the opposite of what we need to be doing. Nobody is taking him now and I doubt he will be movable next year too. If we are taking Rubio to get another asset, that works for me. A young player with potential or a pick makes it worth it. Rose for Rubio would be the Knicks of old. Hell, we might as well throw in a 2nd or Jennings or O'Quinn to get it done too!

Reggie Jackson? That would be way worse than Rubio....way worse.

I have to believe that these rumors are teams and agents using the media to strengthen their position. Hopefully Phil is smarter than that. We will see.

RE: I get why we are trading Rose.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/21/2017 10:24 pm : link
In comment 13367363 Keith said:
Quote:
I understand he has no future in NY and he's not really a good fit with this group. I also get that Rubio is a better fit with this cast, but Rose for Rubio makes no fucking sense to me. The whole idea of trading for rose was to give him a tryout and then decide if we want to build with him. It didn't work, so we get to move on pretty easily. What exactly does Rubio do for us? Make us slightly better in the short term which is the opposite of what we need to be doing. Nobody is taking him now and I doubt he will be movable next year too. If we are taking Rubio to get another asset, that works for me. A young player with potential or a pick makes it worth it. Rose for Rubio would be the Knicks of old. Hell, we might as well throw in a 2nd or Jennings or O'Quinn to get it done too!

Reggie Jackson? That would be way worse than Rubio....way worse.

I have to believe that these rumors are teams and agents using the media to strengthen their position. Hopefully Phil is smarter than that. We will see.


Part of what the Knicks need to be doing is developing Porzingis. He's not going to get better surrounded by ball hogs, but he's also not going to get better surrounded by garbage playing for 15 win teams.

You have to field a team, and Rubio isn't a long term commitment.
Rubio is about 2 years longer than he should be.  
Keith : 2/21/2017 10:29 pm : link
Why are we trading for a 3 year contract(that nobody else is interested in right now) that maybe makes us a little better which is the worst thing we can do right now. Because it might make KP better and we need bodies? That's ludicrous.

We need to stop making excuses for KP. Stop blaming Rose for KP's stagnation. KP has not played well this year and that isn't Rose's fault. Rose isn't a facilitator, but he also doesn't hog the ball until he has to. He's had to a lot this year. I understand that his style isn't really going to help KP a ton, but it's not his fault KP hasn't progressed.
Sure it's his fault. There's plenty of fault to go around.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/21/2017 10:35 pm : link
From coaching to roster to the player himself. He's still not going to get better playing with teammates that don't pass the ball or do a good job of running the offense the coach is trying to run. It's been half a season and KP himself is on the record as saying he still can't figure out how to play with Rose.

Nobody has benefitted from Rose's play this season except Rose demonstrating that he can still score when he wants to.
I'm rooting for a Rubio trade  
giantsfan44ab : 2/21/2017 10:37 pm : link
Because I don't expect this team to spend that money on anything wiser come this offseason.
What about a Rose and KOQ for  
NoGainDayne : 2/21/2017 10:38 pm : link
Rubio and their 1st rounder, who says no? KOQ is an asset on a good contract Rubio is a bad contract. They get to make a push this year and have more cap room this summer
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