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NFT: Knicks Chat: Will they deal Rose?

DanMetroMan : 2/22/2017 8:59 am
- Multiple teams in on Deron Williams (who would seemingly be a similar group with interest in Rose), Utah is one such team in on Deron reportedly.

-Kobe/Harden's agent Rob Pelinka is the new GM of the Lakers

-Boston still talking to "everyone" including the Sixers regarding Okafor per Stein

-Knicks "aggressively" looking to deal Rose per Woj
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RE: RE: RE: Dep what dont you like about caldwell pope?  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 11:21 am : link
In comment 13367775 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
In comment 13367764 dep026 said:


Quote:


In comment 13367754 hitdog42 said:


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i haven't watched him much but from what i gather he is young and still developing (has upside)--- would think nets offer him in size on RFA front.
if you are a team way under the cap with no hope i would think he is a guy you target no?



Not that I dont like him, just not for the max which is rumors is what he wants. Good defender, improved shooter - not much to his game. Averaging 2 boards/2 assists per game and is 40% shooter from the floor.

Nice guy to have on your team but to may him max or near max money is silly.



so kind of perfect guy for a team like the nets to overpay- not ideal for a more cap constrained contender to invest in


KCP should probably be Nets priority #1. They can fuck a lot of teams over this year like they did with Crabbe last year.
RE: RE: RE: Dep what dont you like about caldwell pope?  
Deej : 2/22/2017 11:26 am : link
In comment 13367775 hitdog42 said:
Quote:

so kind of perfect guy for a team like the nets to overpay- not ideal for a more cap constrained contender to invest in


What is the Nets plan? I can think of 3 scenarios that make sense. 1) suck hard for 4-5 seasons so they get 2-3 high lotto picks, 2) clear a ton of cap space and hope to provide a home to a bunch of guys who want to play together (Summer of Lebron type model), or 3) try to sign guys to middle tier upside deals (preferably with declining salaries) + vet depth on <$10 million contracts, and trade them off for assets as needed.

Those are also in my order of attractiveness. Im not sure I see the upside of paying KCP real $$. I guess it just begs the question, "to what end?" Are the Nets honestly trying to win anytime soon? Pope could add what, 6 wins? Obviously, eventually you have to start adding talent somewhere. I just dont see how KCP for real $$ is the place you start. Maybe in the Summer of 2016, when things were even bleaker (and the $$ was a bit lower).
RE: RE: RE: RE: Dep what dont you like about caldwell pope?  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 11:33 am : link
In comment 13367786 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13367775 hitdog42 said:


Quote:



so kind of perfect guy for a team like the nets to overpay- not ideal for a more cap constrained contender to invest in



What is the Nets plan? I can think of 3 scenarios that make sense. 1) suck hard for 4-5 seasons so they get 2-3 high lotto picks, 2) clear a ton of cap space and hope to provide a home to a bunch of guys who want to play together (Summer of Lebron type model), or 3) try to sign guys to middle tier upside deals (preferably with declining salaries) + vet depth on <$10 million contracts, and trade them off for assets as needed.

Those are also in my order of attractiveness. Im not sure I see the upside of paying KCP real $$. I guess it just begs the question, "to what end?" Are the Nets honestly trying to win anytime soon? Pope could add what, 6 wins? Obviously, eventually you have to start adding talent somewhere. I just dont see how KCP for real $$ is the place you start. Maybe in the Summer of 2016, when things were even bleaker (and the $$ was a bit lower).


The Nets current cap # in 2 years is $17M with Lin expiring the following year. They can "afford" to get stuck with a few bad contracts just to hit the salary floor. KCP won't suddenly make the Nets win 30 games, but he could be a nice complimentary piece to whenever they get a top pick again. I still think Detroit would match.
probable means nothing  
nygiants16 : 2/22/2017 11:37 am : link
but ricky rubio just started following kp, maybe 10 minutes ago
The Nets are 6+ years from being relevant  
Deej : 2/22/2017 11:39 am : link
I dont see any upside in paying full freight for KCP. Basically, I think the goal of their FA signings for the next 2 offseasons should be to get players who could potentially turn into trade chips. KCP for 20-30 million wont be that. Better to spread that money for 2-3 hi risk/reward guys, and trade off the one who pans out (who will be on a cheap, tradeable deal).
RE: RE: RE: RE: Dep what dont you like about caldwell pope?  
giants#1 : 2/22/2017 11:40 am : link
In comment 13367786 Deej said:
Quote:
In comment 13367775 hitdog42 said:


Quote:



so kind of perfect guy for a team like the nets to overpay- not ideal for a more cap constrained contender to invest in



What is the Nets plan? I can think of 3 scenarios that make sense. 1) suck hard for 4-5 seasons so they get 2-3 high lotto picks, 2) clear a ton of cap space and hope to provide a home to a bunch of guys who want to play together (Summer of Lebron type model), or 3) try to sign guys to middle tier upside deals (preferably with declining salaries) + vet depth on <$10 million contracts, and trade them off for assets as needed.

Those are also in my order of attractiveness. Im not sure I see the upside of paying KCP real $$. I guess it just begs the question, "to what end?" Are the Nets honestly trying to win anytime soon? Pope could add what, 6 wins? Obviously, eventually you have to start adding talent somewhere. I just dont see how KCP for real $$ is the place you start. Maybe in the Summer of 2016, when things were even bleaker (and the $$ was a bit lower).


Adding 6 wins makes them twice as good as they are now!
who gives a shit about the Nets?  
Greg from LI : 2/22/2017 11:40 am : link
Other than the confused Sawx fan, anyway
RE: The Nets are 6+ years from being relevant  
yatqb : 2/22/2017 11:42 am : link
In comment 13367813 Deej said:
Quote:
I dont see any upside in paying full freight for KCP. Basically, I think the goal of their FA signings for the next 2 offseasons should be to get players who could potentially turn into trade chips. KCP for 20-30 million wont be that. Better to spread that money for 2-3 hi risk/reward guys, and trade off the one who pans out (who will be on a cheap, tradeable deal).


I sadly think it's the same for the Knicks, IF we're lucky.
That's absurd. The nets are 3 years behind  
Keith : 2/22/2017 11:48 am : link
the Knicks. How can you possibly compare?
RE: RE: The Nets are 6+ years from being relevant  
Deej : 2/22/2017 11:51 am : link
In comment 13367820 yatqb said:
Quote:
In comment 13367813 Deej said:


Quote:


I dont see any upside in paying full freight for KCP. Basically, I think the goal of their FA signings for the next 2 offseasons should be to get players who could potentially turn into trade chips. KCP for 20-30 million wont be that. Better to spread that money for 2-3 hi risk/reward guys, and trade off the one who pans out (who will be on a cheap, tradeable deal).



I sadly think it's the same for the Knicks, IF we're lucky.


I think KP alone makes us relevant in 2-3 seasons, assuming we dont really f'up the rest of the roster ala New Orleans. Relevant to me is like 6 seed competitive. 6 years from now I'd be hopeful that KP, Willy, and the 2017 #1 are more than just relevant.
RE: RE: The Nets are 6+ years from being relevant  
nygiants16 : 2/22/2017 11:52 am : link
In comment 13367820 yatqb said:
Quote:
In comment 13367813 Deej said:


Quote:


I dont see any upside in paying full freight for KCP. Basically, I think the goal of their FA signings for the next 2 offseasons should be to get players who could potentially turn into trade chips. KCP for 20-30 million wont be that. Better to spread that money for 2-3 hi risk/reward guys, and trade off the one who pans out (who will be on a cheap, tradeable deal).



I sadly think it's the same for the Knicks, IF we're lucky.


how do you figure? nets wont have their own pick for 2 more years and they do not have a building block on their team yet...

knicks at least have kp and have all their picks including 3 in this years draft
Rubio started following Porzingis on Instagram  
Anakim : 2/22/2017 11:53 am : link
And Porzingis is flirting with Abigail Ratchford.
Nets should be looking to fill their roster  
Deej : 2/22/2017 11:54 am : link
with Lou Williams and KOQ types. Most will disappoint, but 1 or 2 could net you a late #1 or some #1s. Turn THOSE picks into your depth foundation while you develop the high lotto picks you'll get circa 2019 and beyond.
RE: Rubio started following Porzingis on Instagram  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 11:58 am : link
In comment 13367838 Anakim said:
Quote:
And Porzingis is flirting with Abigail Ratchford.


Just looked her up. Good for him. He's giving Joel Embiid some competition.
RE: Nets should be looking to fill their roster  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 12:00 pm : link
In comment 13367843 Deej said:
Quote:
with Lou Williams and KOQ types. Most will disappoint, but 1 or 2 could net you a late #1 or some #1s. Turn THOSE picks into your depth foundation while you develop the high lotto picks you'll get circa 2019 and beyond.


They'll have enough cap space to do a lot of things. If they sign Mirotic to say a $15M a year deal it's not going to hurt flexibility.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/22/2017 12:08 pm : link
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account
‏@WojVerticalNBA

Following
More
Sources: Rockets motivated to make a deal for player in $10-12M salary range, offering expiring contracts/cash savings for trade partners.
Knicks don't have anyone in that range that they  
Keith : 2/22/2017 12:10 pm : link
need to dump, other than Lance Thomas!
Man, remember  
Deej : 2/22/2017 12:13 pm : link
the Mirotic hype? Guy was talked up like he would be a star.
Social media drama continues!  
bceagle05 : 2/22/2017 12:16 pm : link
Rubio removes Wolves from his Twitter bio, per Hahn and Humpty. Update social media first, pack second, call your mother third...
RE: Man, remember  
DanMetroMan : 2/22/2017 12:17 pm : link
In comment 13367877 Deej said:
Quote:
the Mirotic hype? Guy was talked up like he would be a star.


"No way they include him for Melo!"
RE: .  
Deej : 2/22/2017 12:18 pm : link
In comment 13367868 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account
‏@WojVerticalNBA

Following
More
Sources: Rockets motivated to make a deal for player in $10-12M salary range, offering expiring contracts/cash savings for trade partners.


Hmm. Their biggest expiring is Nene at 2.9 million. Enis is #2 at 1.7 million, and then no other expiring makes even 700k. Even if you extend out a season, it's Ariza at 7.8/7.4 -- but are they gonna do better than Ariza for just cap relief? And then KJ McDaniels. Not sure it is $$ relief to pay KJ 3.33 per next season. You could do worse, sure.

Weird rumor.
RE: Social media drama continues!  
Anakim : 2/22/2017 12:20 pm : link
In comment 13367880 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
Rubio removes Wolves from his Twitter bio, per Hahn and Humpty. Update social media first, pack second, call your mother third...


Follow Porzingis is first!
Looks  
DanMetroMan : 2/22/2017 12:20 pm : link
like our guess of Boston being reluctant to give up Crowder is accurate.

The Boston Celtics and Chicago Bulls continue to discuss a Jimmy Butler trade.

"I think the Jimmy Butler stuff is real," said Aldridge. "They have been trying to get Jimmy Butler. He doesn't want to give up Jae Crowder. That's the main sticking point there and he doesn't want to give up Jae Crowder in a deal and that's the guy the Bulls are insisting on right now in any package for Butler.

"The picks will work themselves out. Boston has about 600 first round picks in the next five years, so they'll make it work. That part I'm not worried about. I think it really comes down to Crowder. In terms of real tangible players, I think Danny would like to go into the playoffs with Smart, Bradley, Crowder defensively along with Butler, Horford, Thomas offensively. I think he feels like that's the only way they'll be able to complete with a team like Cleveland.
And I should note  
Deej : 2/22/2017 12:21 pm : link
that Nene is giving them amazing production in 17 minutes.
Won't include Crowder in a Jimmy Butler trade, eh?  
bceagle05 : 2/22/2017 12:22 pm : link
What a country.
Jae/Butler  
Deej : 2/22/2017 12:22 pm : link
which gets back to my point -- teams usually trade futures for stars. That's the real problem with the 2 pre-authorized Melo landing spots.
Butler is as good  
dep026 : 2/22/2017 12:23 pm : link
if not better defender than Crowder and obviously much better offensively too.
What's  
DanMetroMan : 2/22/2017 12:25 pm : link
wrong with the Celtics trying to hold onto as many good players as they can? It sure seems like Butler can be theirs if they want him so why not put the screws to the Bulls until the last minute?
Don't mind me, I'm just a disgruntled Knicks fan.  
bceagle05 : 2/22/2017 12:26 pm : link
.
Crowders contract  
Keith : 2/22/2017 12:30 pm : link
makes him one of the best bargains in the league.
...  
bceagle05 : 2/22/2017 12:44 pm : link
Quote:
Marc Berman @NYPost_Berman

Derrick Rose sitting out scrimmage, next to injured Joakim Noah.
As I said,  
Jon in NYC : 2/22/2017 12:47 pm : link
this Rose for Rubio thing makes too much sense not to happen.
I guess the Knicks are just stalling  
bceagle05 : 2/22/2017 12:51 pm : link
to see if a better offer comes in? This one seems like it could've been wrapped up in a five-minute phone call.
Think you can get away with  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 12:53 pm : link
Butler or Crowder at the 4 in stretches. Might hurt rebounding but statistically Love has been the most inefficient player on post ups in the NBA. I'd dare Love to post up Crowder as much as possible.
Sitting out scrimmage after a week off?  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/22/2017 1:13 pm : link
He's gone. Must just need to be finalized.
is it at all feasible to include Noah and Pekovic in that deal?  
Dmc1188 : 2/22/2017 1:19 pm : link
the only way I'd be okay with this is if we could shed Noah. Pekovic at least only has 2 years left, not 4. My inclination is that there's no way Min would do that
RE: is it at all feasible to include Noah and Pekovic in that deal?  
Jon in NYC : 2/22/2017 1:20 pm : link
In comment 13367965 Dmc1188 said:
Quote:
the only way I'd be okay with this is if we could shed Noah. Pekovic at least only has 2 years left, not 4. My inclination is that there's no way Min would do that


Actually not sure about that. Some reports think Minn is the aggressor here.
Rose for Rubio makes little sense.  
Keith : 2/22/2017 1:23 pm : link
I'd hope minny sweetens the pot a bit.
that would be worth it IMO  
Dmc1188 : 2/22/2017 1:25 pm : link
Not a huge Rubio fan and I'm sick of tying up $ in guys that won't put us over the hump. Would prefer an all out rebuild.

But shedding Noah's contract changes everything. Pekovic would actually be an asset at this time next year with $12M expiring
No way Rose and Noah  
Carl in CT : 2/22/2017 1:25 pm : link
Could happen. Minn doesn't have anyone (salary wise) that can make that trade happen. At least in my eyes.
Rubio dropped  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 1:25 pm : link
the Timberwolves affiliation from his bio.

Any minute now...
If we somehow packaged Noah in a deal before the deadline  
Canton : 2/22/2017 1:25 pm : link
I'll be ecstatic asf.
RE: No way Rose and Noah  
Jon in NYC : 2/22/2017 1:26 pm : link
In comment 13367979 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Could happen. Minn doesn't have anyone (salary wise) that can make that trade happen. At least in my eyes.


Pekovic alone works.
RE: Rubio dropped  
Canton : 2/22/2017 1:26 pm : link
In comment 13367980 giantsfan44ab said:
Quote:
the Timberwolves affiliation from his bio.

Any minute now...


What bio? Where?
RE: Rose for Rubio makes little sense.  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 1:27 pm : link
In comment 13367975 Keith said:
Quote:
I'd hope minny sweetens the pot a bit.


It makes perfect sense if you do not trust the Knicks enough to not give Jeff Teague or Jrue Holiday a 4 year max contract.
RE: RE: Rubio dropped  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 1:27 pm : link
In comment 13367985 Canton said:
Quote:
In comment 13367980 giantsfan44ab said:


Quote:


the Timberwolves affiliation from his bio.

Any minute now...



What bio? Where?


*Twitter
RE: No way Rose and Noah  
nygiants16 : 2/22/2017 1:28 pm : link
In comment 13367979 Carl in CT said:
Quote:
Could happen. Minn doesn't have anyone (salary wise) that can make that trade happen. At least in my eyes.


minnesota under cap..

knicks will probably get a big trade exception
Rose's $20+m and Noah salary?  
Carl in CT : 2/22/2017 1:29 pm : link
And it works?
RE: RE: No way Rose and Noah  
giantsfan44ab : 2/22/2017 1:29 pm : link
In comment 13367984 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 13367979 Carl in CT said:


Quote:


Could happen. Minn doesn't have anyone (salary wise) that can make that trade happen. At least in my eyes.



Pekovic alone works.


*works for the Knicks

It makes little sense for Minnesotta who would then have $120M committed over the next 3 years to 3 backup centers. Towns is probably the center at this point and they probably will end up with someone like Bridges, Markannen, or Williams in the draft who would play the 4. Towns at the 5.
Thanks 16  
Carl in CT : 2/22/2017 1:30 pm : link
Didn't know they were under. We would have to add a pick (once again) for them to take on that kind of salary.
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