Don't expect a long-term deal between Giants and JPP before free agency. Two sides not close. Giants will have to make do with available funds. Will be somewhat restrictive.
This essentially means no other (or not many) significant free agent additions without another move to free up space. If Marshall costs 5M this year and JPP ~17M, that doesn't leave much, $10M or so?
I get the impression we would be bargain hunting anyway.. But, JPP deal needs to get done or we need to move on. Can't pay him that much for one season.
Im just not comfortable with either Flowers or Hart. Even a guard would be good. Need to upgrade Jerry and Newhouse. Our line at this moment will not get us that SB.
That JPP wants a long term deal, but it was him that screwed up his situation, now he wants to act as if there is no problem with signing him to an enormous contract when he a good season, but not a dominant season. I am with the Giants on this and would try to get a DE in this draft. If you can add one in this draft then add another in next years draft, then if JPP does not live up to the expectations he has created, you let him walk.
I love JPP but he did not play his hand well when he did get injured, let's not forget, and he is at it again. It does hurt short term, but if the Giants can upgrade the guard position in free agency this season, then add the tackle in the draft, maybe we can get by again. They can also add a tight end to help out. Not ideal, but since when has JPP shown the least concern with the team when his money is concerned. I know he is not alone, but this does not make me feel warm and fuzzy about JPP. Maybe I'm wrong but that is how I feel. If the Giants changed their minds and cut ties with him I would actually understand now, and that is something I never thought I would say.
That JPP wants a long term deal, but it was him that screwed up his situation, now he wants to act as if there is no problem with signing him to an enormous contract when he a good season, but not a dominant season. I am with the Giants on this and would try to get a DE in this draft. If you can add one in this draft then add another in next years draft, then if JPP does not live up to the expectations he has created, you let him walk.
I love JPP but he did not play his hand well when he did get injured, let's not forget, and he is at it again. It does hurt short term, but if the Giants can upgrade the guard position in free agency this season, then add the tackle in the draft, maybe we can get by again. They can also add a tight end to help out. Not ideal, but since when has JPP shown the least concern with the team when his money is concerned. I know he is not alone, but this does not make me feel warm and fuzzy about JPP. Maybe I'm wrong but that is how I feel. If the Giants changed their minds and cut ties with him I would actually understand now, and that is something I never thought I would say.
I feel the same way. I didn't expect this at all. I guess I should have known better. Thought he bled blue on some level.
a couple of guys and boom, they're right back where they started in terms of available cap space.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
don't expect a new deal before free agency. Implies they aren't close.
Doesn't free agency start today? Is it really news that the deal isn't going to be done today?
All I get from this tweet is that we shouldn't be expecting a signing in the next few hours. Doesn't mean that we can't see something happen in the next couple of weeks.
I get that a lot here figured he might do a hometown discounts or a 12 million per year deal.
The Chandler Jones (who is 4 months younger than JPP) deal pretty much sets the tone. JPP IMO is "worth" somewhere less than Vernon and Jones but will absolutely demand what they got and expect more than what Calais Campbell was paid the last two year (14 and 15 million).
The market is pretty much set and it is fucking outrageously high.
RE: Leverage is still with the Giants, all they have to do is restructure
a couple of guys and boom, they're right back where they started in terms of available cap space.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
Being able to restructure is really not leverage, it's closer to desperation. Restructuring is not something an NFL teams wants to ever do, it's something they're forced to do to create cap space. Players don't care, just winds up benefiting them.
I looked at Eli's contract, I don't see him being a candidate, best options are the three big ticket FA's signed last year or extending Pugh IMO. But who wants to have to restructure those deals already.
As many predicted, JPP on the FT hamstrings what the Giants can do in FA.
don't expect a new deal before free agency. Implies they aren't close.
Doesn't free agency start today? Is it really news that the deal isn't going to be done today?
All I get from this tweet is that we shouldn't be expecting a signing in the next few hours. Doesn't mean that we can't see something happen in the next couple of weeks.
The significance would be impact to the 2017 tier 1 FA crop, who will likely be gone by the time they could work something out. It won't prevent the Giants from signing from the second tier (then again, they would have been able to do so through the restructures as well).
a couple of guys and boom, they're right back where they started in terms of available cap space.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
Being able to restructure is really not leverage, it's closer to desperation. Restructuring is not something an NFL teams wants to ever do, it's something they're forced to do to create cap space. Players don't care, just winds up benefiting them.
I looked at Eli's contract, I don't see him being a candidate, best options are the three big ticket FA's signed last year or extending Pugh IMO. But who wants to have to restructure those deals already.
As many predicted, JPP on the FT hamstrings what the Giants can do in FA.
I think you're just repeating fanspeak - restructuring is something just about all teams do (save for those so far under the cap they're looking at the floor). It's the frequent restructures of players who won't be viable towards the end of where you're kicking money that are a problem.
That's not an issue with the Giants, who won't be expecting to part with guys like Snacks or Vernon any time soon, or Eli.
The only thing this prevents is longer term cap management, since the Giants might not know for awhile how they're going to address the DE spot in '18.
Do you? He's tagged. Does he have to approve the tag before he can be dealt?
He's not under contract so we don't own his rights. The tag would need to be signed before he could be traded. He can sit out until the eve of the regular season. He would only incur fines for training camp ($30k/day). After July 14, we can no longer sign him to a multi-year contract. We could always rescind the tag at which point he becomes a free agent with no compensation for the Giants.
I would 100% try to trade him at this point. This team is too close to be this hamstrung financially by a guy not named Eli Manning.
This is why franchising him wasn't a no brainer.
Who are the Giants missing out on signing? They just got arguably 1 of the top WRs available. I don't think they were ever in the market to pay 9-13 million for FA OL but I guess who knows.
Move on and use the money to sign two or even three players that could help us.
Totally agree. We played pretty well defensively without him last year anyway. With 17 million extra dollars we could probably resign Hank, pick up Warford, and some second/third tier guys. Use the draft for a T, TE, another DE to rotate with Wynn and Okwara and depth based on bpa the rest of the way
restructuring does not mean pay cut, it means guaranteeing portions of or more of a contract than you as the team initially agreed to (aka you are now required to pay the player more or sooner than you thought they were worth.).
Eli isn't an option, because this is the year his cap hit dips. To create cap room with Eli need to increase the cap hit in future years and it's already 22.2 and 23.2 the final two years, that would hurt when they get there.
The others, maybe are candidates but again it's not in you as the teams best interest.
Fact: JPP is the superior player...he is better the Chandler Jones or Oliver Vernon...people know damn well that JPP will outplay both these 2 next year...just don't get why people expect him to play for less makes no sense...and just don't understand the malice and disrespect for the player...
The Giants should protect themselves with an out after 2-3 years if he can't stay healthy..,
This essentially means no other (or not many) significant free agent additions without another move to free up space. If Marshall costs 5M this year and JPP ~17M, that doesn't leave much, $10M or so?
Sucks balls!
JPP wants Chandler Jones money and the Giants must be saying no.
Who do you think this team is, the Patriots?
Did it it ever occur to that the Browns might not take that trade? Jesus Christ you make it seem like Cleveland offered Thomas for JPP.
Unbelievable the stupidity this time of year.
You'd have to sign him first, wouldn't you?
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You'd have to sign him first, wouldn't you?
Do you? He's tagged. Does he have to approve the tag before he can be dealt?
I love JPP but he did not play his hand well when he did get injured, let's not forget, and he is at it again. It does hurt short term, but if the Giants can upgrade the guard position in free agency this season, then add the tackle in the draft, maybe we can get by again. They can also add a tight end to help out. Not ideal, but since when has JPP shown the least concern with the team when his money is concerned. I know he is not alone, but this does not make me feel warm and fuzzy about JPP. Maybe I'm wrong but that is how I feel. If the Giants changed their minds and cut ties with him I would actually understand now, and that is something I never thought I would say.
They can technically spend what they want now.
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You'd have to sign him first, wouldn't you?
No, Patriots traded Cassel while on the FT. You can trade players on the FT from what I know.
I love JPP but he did not play his hand well when he did get injured, let's not forget, and he is at it again. It does hurt short term, but if the Giants can upgrade the guard position in free agency this season, then add the tackle in the draft, maybe we can get by again. They can also add a tight end to help out. Not ideal, but since when has JPP shown the least concern with the team when his money is concerned. I know he is not alone, but this does not make me feel warm and fuzzy about JPP. Maybe I'm wrong but that is how I feel. If the Giants changed their minds and cut ties with him I would actually understand now, and that is something I never thought I would say.
I feel the same way. I didn't expect this at all. I guess I should have known better. Thought he bled blue on some level.
They can technically spend what they want now.
Top 51 has to be under the cap right now.
They can technically spend what they want now.
Only before the start of the league year. Once 4PM today hits, all teams have to be under the cap and stay under or face penalties.
Yes, but he's probably not wrong about this, given the sentiment around everyone who covers the team.
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only need to be under the cap by a certain date?
They can technically spend what they want now.
Only before the start of the league year. Once 4PM today hits, all teams have to be under the cap and stay under or face penalties.
Gotcha
They can technically spend what they want now.
Yes they can until the new league year starts today at 4pm.
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In comment 13385449 Jints in Carolina said:
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You'd have to sign him first, wouldn't you?
No, Patriots traded Cassel while on the FT. You can trade players on the FT from what I know.
Yeah, but Cassel signed his tender and was then traded. I don't think you can trade a guy without him signing his tender first.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
Doesn't free agency start today? Is it really news that the deal isn't going to be done today?
All I get from this tweet is that we shouldn't be expecting a signing in the next few hours. Doesn't mean that we can't see something happen in the next couple of weeks.
The Chandler Jones (who is 4 months younger than JPP) deal pretty much sets the tone. JPP IMO is "worth" somewhere less than Vernon and Jones but will absolutely demand what they got and expect more than what Calais Campbell was paid the last two year (14 and 15 million).
The market is pretty much set and it is fucking outrageously high.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
Being able to restructure is really not leverage, it's closer to desperation. Restructuring is not something an NFL teams wants to ever do, it's something they're forced to do to create cap space. Players don't care, just winds up benefiting them.
I looked at Eli's contract, I don't see him being a candidate, best options are the three big ticket FA's signed last year or extending Pugh IMO. But who wants to have to restructure those deals already.
As many predicted, JPP on the FT hamstrings what the Giants can do in FA.
Doesn't free agency start today? Is it really news that the deal isn't going to be done today?
All I get from this tweet is that we shouldn't be expecting a signing in the next few hours. Doesn't mean that we can't see something happen in the next couple of weeks.
The significance would be impact to the 2017 tier 1 FA crop, who will likely be gone by the time they could work something out. It won't prevent the Giants from signing from the second tier (then again, they would have been able to do so through the restructures as well).
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a couple of guys and boom, they're right back where they started in terms of available cap space.
This isn't a good thing, mind you - it'd be better if they were close on contract terms so we'd know JPP is here to stay and they'd have a more manageable cap situation, but it's not dire either.
Being able to restructure is really not leverage, it's closer to desperation. Restructuring is not something an NFL teams wants to ever do, it's something they're forced to do to create cap space. Players don't care, just winds up benefiting them.
I looked at Eli's contract, I don't see him being a candidate, best options are the three big ticket FA's signed last year or extending Pugh IMO. But who wants to have to restructure those deals already.
As many predicted, JPP on the FT hamstrings what the Giants can do in FA.
I think you're just repeating fanspeak - restructuring is something just about all teams do (save for those so far under the cap they're looking at the floor). It's the frequent restructures of players who won't be viable towards the end of where you're kicking money that are a problem.
That's not an issue with the Giants, who won't be expecting to part with guys like Snacks or Vernon any time soon, or Eli.
The only thing this prevents is longer term cap management, since the Giants might not know for awhile how they're going to address the DE spot in '18.
This is why franchising him wasn't a no brainer.
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In comment 13385449 Jints in Carolina said:
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You'd have to sign him first, wouldn't you?
Do you? He's tagged. Does he have to approve the tag before he can be dealt?
He's not under contract so we don't own his rights. The tag would need to be signed before he could be traded. He can sit out until the eve of the regular season. He would only incur fines for training camp ($30k/day). After July 14, we can no longer sign him to a multi-year contract. We could always rescind the tag at which point he becomes a free agent with no compensation for the Giants.
Can we?
Agree and draft a DE. JPP is good but not that good imo
This is why franchising him wasn't a no brainer.
Who are the Giants missing out on signing? They just got arguably 1 of the top WRs available. I don't think they were ever in the market to pay 9-13 million for FA OL but I guess who knows.
Totally agree. We played pretty well defensively without him last year anyway. With 17 million extra dollars we could probably resign Hank, pick up Warford, and some second/third tier guys. Use the draft for a T, TE, another DE to rotate with Wynn and Okwara and depth based on bpa the rest of the way
Eli isn't an option, because this is the year his cap hit dips. To create cap room with Eli need to increase the cap hit in future years and it's already 22.2 and 23.2 the final two years, that would hurt when they get there.
The others, maybe are candidates but again it's not in you as the teams best interest.
Fact: JPP is the superior player...he is better the Chandler Jones or Oliver Vernon...people know damn well that JPP will outplay both these 2 next year...just don't get why people expect him to play for less makes no sense...and just don't understand the malice and disrespect for the player...
The Giants should protect themselves with an out after 2-3 years if he can't stay healthy..,