USC guy who will help the team. Very willing blocker who can block on the move as well as inline. Has fair speed and decent hands and will be a good special teams guy. Solid number two tight end and can play some fullback if needed. Solid signing.
What first year cap hit will be? Probally 3.25-3.5m cap hit first year, FA is crazy, im still wondering what there doing with OL, but so is everyone else.
well, they worked him extensively back in his draft year, must have kept tabs and really liked what they saw.
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
A little more than I thought he'd get, but a good signing nonetheless. I would've like to have both Ellison and Fasano with Ellison playing mostly at FB and Fasano as the #2 blocking TE. That would've helped out the line and running game immensely. But it looks like Reese wanted one or the other. Hopefully JPP signs an extension soon. That'll open up 6 to 7 mil so we can ho after a 2nd tier OL like Rief or Lang.
know much about him, but that seems like a lot. Could blossom, because he was stuck behind Rudolph. But tore his patellar tendon in 2015. Not sure who is gone. We have .32 in cap space left.
It's hard to imagine him posing much of a threat up the seam.
He ran a 4.88 40 at the combine in 2012, and suffered a Cruz-type injury in 2015.
If nothing else, this signing indicates that the team has acknowledged the hole that was created last year when both Johnson and Whitlock went down. It does raise the question of why so little was done to fill that hole at the time.
He's a perfect fit for our offense. Blocks well inline and as the lead blocker. Under utilized to this point in his career. I think he'll blossom here.
He's 6'2" 240 and plays FB/H-Back. Ellison plays end-of-the -line TE. What? We have so many versatile weapons we're giving them away. Hey, maybe his injury is bad but it that's so, why wasn't he already released.
not necessarily, the team had no fullback last year after Johnson was ir'd. Having both gives the team more flexibility between FB & TE. I think Tye and LaCross have more to worry about
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
Ellison is of Māori descent. He is the son of three-time Super bowl winner Riki Ellison, a former USC and NFL linebacker.[7] He is also of Ngāi Tahu descent and is the grandnephew of the first captain of the All Blacks, Thomas Ellison, who led New Zealand on their first tour to Australia in 1893. He is also related to current New Zealand rugby union players Jacob Ellison and Tamati Ellison.[8][9] Ellison completed a bachelor's degree in international relations from USC and a master's degree in communication management. He is married to fashion model Raina Hein, runner-up of Cycle 14 of America's Next Top Model.[10]
McAdoo was joking around with Johnson when he was discussing what role he has in the offense, and it led in part to this article
Quote:
"Sure," McAdoo said when asked if Johnson is a fullback, tight end, or both. Then, when pressed as to what the Giants liked about Johnson, McAdoo only said, "We like Will. We feel he has some versatility on offense and special teams and he's been a good addition so far."
So, let's ask Johnson: Are you a fullback? Tight end? Both?
"Yes, I'm both," said Johnson, who did divulge he is currently working out of the tight ends position room. "The more I can do to contribute to this offense and help out, I'm more than capable of doing. Whether that's fullback, tight end, short yardage runner, whatever. I did that all in Pittsburgh, so I'm familiar with it."
I don't know if Johnson is healthy or not, but it would appear that Ellison was signed to do what the Giants thought they were getting out of Johnson last year. And considering the cap situation and roster space, it doesn't make much sense to keep Johnson on the roster with this signing, even if they want a fullback.
Maybe they will try to use Ellison similar to what they did with former TE/HBack Dan Campbell, who they also played some at fullback years ago.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
I never get this philosophy:
Quote:
...they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder..
Does it work in reverse, when the Browns take someone at 33 is it in effect a first rounder, is the 34th pick in effect a first rounder? Is 31 in effect a second rounder?
There's 32 picks in the round (unless the Patriots lose one for cheating) they're all 1st round picks, not in effect anything.
Not picking on you, a lot of people say this, what am I missing?
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
They drafted Pugh and Flowers when they had DIRE Needs at the position. Pugh was like the 7th lineman taken in that rd.
Do the Giants take Collins if not for his name being around in a murder case? Give me a break. They fucking forced those picks.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
They drafted Pugh and Flowers when they had DIRE Needs at the position. Pugh was like the 7th lineman taken in that rd.
Do the Giants take Collins if not for his name being around in a murder case? Give me a break. They fucking forced those picks.
You're impossible to have a discussion with..Everything is a fucking fact with you..No need to engage with you moving forward
well, they worked him extensively back in his draft year, must have kept tabs and really liked what they saw.
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
his blocking ability, I wonder if this indicates the Giants might be more willing to take a TE who can stretch the seam, even if he isn't a good blocker. This is about improving the run game, and protecting Eli.
Looks like he's doing fine. Will Johnson Status Update - ( New Window )
Raanan :
FB/TE Rhett Ellison was a move that makes sense for Giants. They couldn't go into season with Will Johnson as... http://es.pn/2mMfxHh Link - ( New Window )
is nothing to be cavalier about. For that kind of ka-ching they have to be sure about the guy. It's not break the bank money, but it's not take a flier money, either. depends on how they structure it. With the tight cap, I'm guessing it's something like a signing bonus that can be spread over the length of the contract, or guaranteed salary for next year. any salary this year is almost de facto guaranteed regardless of whether it technically is or not.
an actual blocking TE? I like it. Be glad, but don't grab him for your FF team.
are you so confidently asserting that David Wilson was a "forced pick?"
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
are you so confidently asserting that David Wilson was a "forced pick?"
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
The fact he didnt argue the other two means I'm right. I'll take it. 2 out of 3 aint bad.
No way to know if Johnson will be ready when it comes time to strap on the pads, but when you have suffered a stinger affecting the neck/shoulder 6 months later you are lifting 500lbs with the same neck/shoulder, I would guess he's feeling much better.
Looks like he's doing fine. Will Johnson Status Update - ( New Window )
Raanan :
FB/TE Rhett Ellison was a move that makes sense for Giants. They couldn't go into season with Will Johnson as... http://es.pn/2mMfxHh Link - ( New Window )
I'd say. He's an in-line blocker picked up to help the Tackles on this team, play in a big package on short yardage and goal line and catch the ball every now and then.
Name me one player on this team that could do that last year? I'll wait.
And if it's $8M gtd over 4 years, you're talking chump change for a guy who will improve your blocking schemes and run game.
This still leaves BPA open during the draft which is how Reese will approach it. That includes the TE's certainly and to some extent the OL available - though i'm a bit bearish on those guys at this point.
In comment 13386060 Milton said: It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
I have no idea what you're talking about. If he plays only one year with the team, his compensation for that year of play will be $8M. It will be spread over two years in terms of the salary cap, but the $8M he receives will be very real. And it will be for the one year he played.
On the other hand, if he plays the full four years of his contract, he will be compensated $18M. Of which $8M was guaranteed. Are you following me? - ( New Window )
had here before that were big contributors to this team.....Dan Campbell, Howard Cross, Bear Pascoe. Giants offenses have always excelled with two TE sets. I'm sure he's not being brought in to catch many passes. He's going to help with our running game however. He'll play a nice role in this offense.
The only money that matters is the guarantee dollars.
for a TE that is a very good blocker is going to help our tackles with blocking, which they desperately need? Basically, $2 million per year for an extra OL that can block and will help Flowers? Sign me up.
You can now put both these guys on the field and even get a few passes caught to move the chains. Add the TE from Miami and you now can do some serious damage to those 2 deep zones.
Wonder if this affects Giants drafting a TE with first pick
and it's not just on the offensive line. The 2 signings so far, with Marshall and Ellison, the Giants have players who can help in the running game by blocking. You know how many plays were blown up by having Donnell shoved into a running lane or missing a block. And even from the WR spot, having a WR that was good blocking out on screens.
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
RE: Wonder if this affects Giants drafting a TE with first pick
for a TE that is a very good blocker is going to help our tackles with blocking, which they desperately need? Basically, $2 million per year for an extra OL that can block and will help Flowers? Sign me up.
Basically they got Flowers help with this move. Watch Ellison spend most of his time next to Flowers. I think they are more interested in OG in the draft where there are good interior guys over OTs. I think John Jerry will be back to compete with a draft pick.
In comment 13386060 Milton said: It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
I have no idea what you're talking about. If he plays only one year with the team, his compensation for that year of play will be $8M. It will be spread over two years in terms of the salary cap, but the $8M he receives will be very real. And it will be for the one year he played.
On the other hand, if he plays the full four years of his contract, he will be compensated $18M. Of which $8M was guaranteed. Are you following me? - ( New Window )
I understand real money and cap money. Real money doesn't mean anything to fans. It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
are you so confidently asserting that David Wilson was a "forced pick?"
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
The fact he didnt argue the other two means I'm right. I'll take it. 2 out of 3 aint bad.
and it's not just on the offensive line. The 2 signings so far, with Marshall and Ellison, the Giants have players who can help in the running game by blocking. You know how many plays were blown up by having Donnell shoved into a running lane or missing a block. And even from the WR spot, having a WR that was good blocking out on screens.
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
I think everyone knows the Giants like the 2 big TEs in the draft. Reese loves UM products.
and it's not just on the offensive line. The 2 signings so far, with Marshall and Ellison, the Giants have players who can help in the running game by blocking. You know how many plays were blown up by having Donnell shoved into a running lane or missing a block. And even from the WR spot, having a WR that was good blocking out on screens.
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
Speculation of course, but even with last year's OL (no, I do not want to stand pat), there is little doubt in my mind that had we had Marshall on the other side of OBJ, we would have been in the NFCC with that D of ours, even without JPP..The Marshall signing was huge and the Ellison signing might prove to be as well..Two needs, filled nearly an hour and a half into FA
This money could have been used towards a linemen.
This money wouldn't by one quarter of a lineman signed so far lol. The Giants had zero FBs last year and no blocking at TE. Tye might actually be inactive on game days going forward.
It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
If he plays only one year, the $8M all hits the cap, it just gets divided between two years (or potentially three, I guess, if he has guaranteed salary in year three of the deal).
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
#Giants decided Rhett Ellison lining up next to their tackles for price paid to this point better investment to OL than big $ OL in market Link - ( New Window )
are 2 completely different players. Ellison will line up at the LOS and has prototype TE size.
Johnson is built like a FB.
We just need to go back to carrying a FB and we can (and should) keep both of these guys. Along with Marshall replacing Cruz we've upgraded our supplemental blocking dramatically
It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
If he plays only one year, the $8M all hits the cap, it just gets divided between two years (or potentially three, I guess, if he has guaranteed salary in year three of the deal).
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
We basically agree. My issue was when you said $8 million for 1 year. Apparently you were talking about real money where I was talking about the cap. I agree part of that $8 mil could include his base pay for year 1.
Wtf did you think he was going to get? A long term deal for one million per?? No one under the age of 32 signs a shit deal like that.
Sign him for one year prove it deal and people bitch. Sign him for four years at a typical deal that's gonna pay the guy enough but not a lot and people bitch. Wahh he makes too much. He's a young emerging player that will fill a need. Of course he's gonna make a few million! This isn't 1995.
It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
If he plays only one year, the $8M all hits the cap, it just gets divided between two years (or potentially three, I guess, if he has guaranteed salary in year three of the deal).
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
We basically agree. My issue was when you said $8 million for 1 year. Apparently you were talking about real money where I was talking about the cap. I agree part of that $8 mil could include his base pay for year 1.
as someone said they will in a post above, but the Giants won't break their board for need alone.
If they really, really want an O-lineman in the first, they might have to trade up to get one. Or, if they don't like the cost of that, they may look to trade down to align their pick with the value of the player.
Just my uninformed speculation, but I think a trade up is more likely if they feel they don't need all their picks to fill out the bench and special teams for 2017. And that would mean making a lot of small-ish (un-sexy) signings, which would free them up to trade mid-late round draft picks if necessary.
But the whole point of doing all the scouting and arranging players in rows is that when they're on the clock, they're not going "SHIT RAMCZYK'S GONE WHAT DO WE DO NOW SHIT SHIT SHIT." They trust the work they've done.
Tye will have to work very hard to make next year's roster.
The TEs are:
Johnson
Ellison
Adams
... and everyone else
Lacosse
Tye
If the Giants draft another TE, barring injury, I would say that Tye is gone. He'll catch on somewhere, he can be a number 3 TE. But he is no longer the number 3 TE for the New York Giants.
Tye will have to work very hard to make next year's roster.
The TEs are:
Johnson
Ellison
Adams
... and everyone else
Lacosse
Tye
If the Giants draft another TE, barring injury, I would say that Tye is gone. He'll catch on somewhere, he can be a number 3 TE. But he is no longer the number 3 TE for the New York Giants.
Not so fast. Between the fullback and TE position, the Giants could easily use four roster spots. And there it's 50-50 at this point on Johnson.
Why do people continue to only focus on the guaranteed dollars? Players DO get the non-guaranteed portion as well if they're on the roster. I know it's been repeated ad nauseum that it's the guaranteed money that matters, but I feel like it's now to the point where that's the ONLY thing people look at and don't realize that the non-guaranteed dollars deplete cap space just as much, they just don't become dead money if the contract is terminated.
for a TE that is a very good blocker is going to help our tackles with blocking, which they desperately need? Basically, $2 million per year for an extra OL that can block and will help Flowers? Sign me up.
Holy shit. It's $4.5M per year. The guaranteed dollars are only relevant when you want to get out of the contract, not when you want to keep the player on the contract.
is going to be on the field a lot next year. You have to figure they Beckham, Shepard, and Marshall will be in the game as much as possible. Ellison will be moving (and motioning before the snap) to FB/TE/H-back as the play dictates.
We'll see how much help this guy is when his 2 million dollar a year salary is on the sidelines on 2nd and 3rd and long while flowers gets toasted and Eli killed
Giants need to improve running game. Having a FB and a TE/H-Back would go a real long way in doing just that.
I'd agree. But this team has a number of holes remaining on offense that makes carrying, in essence, 2 fullbacks a tough idea to sell. You might be right, but I don't see them carrying both of these guys. Last year it was set up to be Johnson vs. Whitlock...and both got hurt.
builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
backup behind a stud finally given a chance. he may not be flashy, but he will fill a huge need on offense - the ability to block. This is smarter than wasting 8-10+ million on mediocre tackles.
Marshall/Odell/Shep should be 1 of the best receiving corp in football, Ellison goes a long way in allowing Eli time to actually find them (or dare I say exactly seal the edge with an effective run block). Dominant blocker with sure hands when needed ... this is a good thing.
for a TE that is a very good blocker is going to help our tackles with blocking, which they desperately need? Basically, $2 million per year for an extra OL that can block and will help Flowers? Sign me up.
do you really think the deal is $8 million over 4 years?
builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
but I don't necessarily expect that he'll turn into a good blocker. If it happens, let it be a bonus. They needed an inline blocker they could count on.
2016. Beckum split wide with Sheppard in the slot on the right side, Cruz split out on left with Tye (or Donnell -your choice) in the backfield, he goes in motion and ends up behind Flowers at the snap. Eli pitches left to Perkins. Tye/Donnell get either blown up or pull a whiffer which leads to penetration in the backfield, Perkins has to bounce further outside (running parallel to the line at best) where he gets tackled by the corner as Cruz can't sustain his block. Loss of 2.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
wow, this is some blind homer bullshit.
And you're a blind whiner, pisser, moaner and complainer. Always bitching about something. What did I say that was wrong? Never mind, I wouldn't want to ruin your moment of depression.
And how in Gods name are people complaining about this signing?
We've needed a blocking tight end for how many years now? Our run game sucks and people must underestimate how much of that has to do with lack of blocking tight ends and receivers. That kills a running game.
Now we have Ellison that specializes in blocking and can catch a little bit, as well as Marshall who is a great run blocker for a receiver. They def still need help on o line but this offense improved a lot these last two days.
builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Try to think of it this way: had Reese drafted Ellison (presumably instead of Robinson) and wanted to keep him, this is still the same contract they'd be on the hook for. If you sign guys coming off of their first contract, it's no different going forward than if you had drafted them yourself. What you miss out on is the cheap years on the rookie deal, no question about that, but if you draft role players and want to keep them after that rookie deal, you still pay the same amount as if you sign other teams' role players. And if you don't keep your own draft picks after their rookie contracts, you just turn the draft into a revolving door, in which case you never really improve over time - you basically stay as good as your star players allow and keep reshuffling the deck around them.
If you're inclined to knock Reese regardless, you probably won't see it that way, but I think it's something to keep in mind. In fact, I'd make the argument that one of the reasons why the Giants had as much cap room last year as they did was because their previous drafts had been relatively weak and they didn't have a lot of players worth retaining as those rookie deals expired. In a way (albeit twisted), Reese's draft drought allowed us to get Vernon, Jenkins and Harrison. Hooray for that.
2016. Beckum split wide with Sheppard in the slot on the right side, Cruz split out on left with Tye (or Donnell -your choice) in the backfield, he goes in motion and ends up behind Flowers at the snap. Eli pitches left to Perkins. Tye/Donnell get either blown up or pull a whiffer which leads to penetration in the backfield, Perkins has to bounce further outside (running parallel to the line at best) where he gets tackled by the corner as Cruz can't sustain his block. Loss of 2.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
must be thinking he just hit on a scratch ticket.....
To look at his stats, and get that? Amazing...
Blocking doesn't show up on the stat sheet. The Giants needed a guy like this in a bad way. Between him and Marshall being a good run blocking ER we should be at least slightly better running the ball this year. Especially if we can draft a few lineman in the first four rounds of the draft.
1st and 10
SLIM_ : 8:13 pm : link : reply
2016. Beckum split wide with Sheppard in the slot on the right side, Cruz split out on left with Tye (or Donnell -your choice) in the backfield, he goes in motion and ends up behind Flowers at the snap. Eli pitches left to Perkins. Tye/Donnell get either blown up or pull a whiffer which leads to penetration in the backfield, Perkins has to bounce further outside (running parallel to the line at best) where he gets tackled by the corner as Cruz can't sustain his block. Loss of 2.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
Ellison was clearly a priority for the NYG. He's the starter and it seems he can bloclk.
Johnson I believe is a fullback. Last year we had a lot of RBs and WR. It's feasible we go 1 less RB and back to 2 QBD 4 of some mix of te/hb/fb is feasible.
Counting on Lacrosse is a mistake. He hasn't made it out of camp yet. I hope he does awesome.
Tye is more a steady receiver with limitations. He was the best of a weak unit last year.
guaranteed a lot of money? Ellison is a monster blocker, which is nice to have when your OL is struggling. He's not going to make anyone forget Mark Bavaro, but he can block, and he'll be a target in the red zone. I'm good with this.
is a plus blocker. He also played behind a very good TE in Kyle Rudolph. He's not going to set the world on fire catching the football, but he doesn't have to. Bottom line is we got better in our run and pass blocking with a TE. And we won't have to use an OT like Beatty that teams don't even need to acknowledge as a receiving threat anymore.
He is exactly what many have been begging for but now becuase he got 8M gauranteed it is a sucky FA signing? GTFO! Same people whinning will be the ones cheering their assess off when are run game resembles an NFL run game again. Do we still need Oline? Of course we do but our team just got better on offense at a point of weakness. Get over yourselves!
the money that TE Dion Sims got from the Bears, you have to like the Ellison signing even more.
Both TEs got $18 million, but Ellison signed for 4 years, while Sims signed for 3 years.
And the guaranteed money is $10 million for Sims and $8 million for Ellison.
Sims is younger and a better receiver as a legit tight end. Ellison is a fullback who is going to make his money blocking.
If he was a fullback, he wouldn't have a number in the eighties. He's a true TE that has played in an H-back role because he's been behind Kyle Rudolph. I'm not suggesting that he's the second coming of Gronk, but he's not a FB.
Ralph VacchianoVerified account @RVacchianoSNY
Rhett Elllison has been eyeing the Giants for a long time: "In college, all I watched was @BearPascoe film."
Ralph VacchianoVerified account @RVacchianoSNY
Rhett Elllison has been eyeing the Giants for a long time: "In college, all I watched was @BearPascoe film."
"Some missing info on Ellison. First of all, his father won 3 Superbowls with the 49ers in the 80s. Good football family. His father lives near me and I have had several conversations with him. 5 years ago they were 100% sure the Giants would draft him and when they didn't they were bitterly disappointed. The kid wants to be a Giant.
Second issue, he is a much better receiver than we've seen from him with the Vikings and their terrible QB situation. Not to mention, their O Coordinator Norv Turner (for most of Ellison's career) for some reason never liked him as a receiver and as many know, Turner was terrible in MN.
Anyway, I think we may be surprised at how good he is as a receiver!
Adam SchefterVerified account @AdamSchefter 52s53 seconds ago
Chris Baker 3-yr deal with Bucs...$6M+ per yr
Rhett Ellison 4-yr $18M deal with Giants with $8M fully guaranteed at signing
only 8 guaranteed
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
Blocking.
Blocking from both the TE and FB position.
That's why he is here.
What does this mean for Will Johnson?
I thinks it is more like he won't MAKE IT TO camp.
I'll take the blocking.
Maybe it will rub off on our LT.
Hi Von, I'm Rhett - ( New Window )
How do u figure? 8 mill guaranteed
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well, they worked him extensively back in his draft year, must have kept tabs and really liked what they saw.
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
He's not exactly done a ton in the NFL.
Not bad - ( New Window )
Is he better than Fasano? If so, he's younger..Also what is Fasano making with Dolphins? Asking because I don't know
Don't see this at all. I think they'd like to have the versatility both can bring.
he kind of reminds me of Kevin Boss...similar build similar running style.
He doesn't look like he is fast but he looks like he can get down the field vertically like Boss did.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Would you please shut the fuck up?
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well, they worked him extensively back in his draft year, must have kept tabs and really liked what they saw.
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
But you like this guy..Lawd knows we need a good blocking TE
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Would you please shut the fuck up?
This!
6'5", 250 officially.
6-4 250.
Can't go crazy without seeing the details of the contract, but this seems like big $ for a big recent injury.
He's older than JPP, he's not a young player with upside. He's a versatile JAG. Which the Giants need.
Not complaining about the signing, but he's not young at 28, turning 29 early in the season.
IDK whether the Giants envision Ellison as a major factor in the passing game, but at least he's a target the defense has to account for.
I would say this means Bye, Bye, Tye. Johnson stays.
If you are going to run an offense with inline TE, H-Back and Fullback, you need to have at least 2 guys to back up all the positions in a pinch.
51 catches, 3 TDs in 5 years. Yay. Problem solved.
18 over 4 years, a lot for this kind of player? Perhaps,but not a huge cap hit.
But by all means, let's keep whining.
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Would you please shut the fuck up?
For you?
Absolutely not.
51 catches, 3 TDs in 5 years. Yay. Problem solved.
Next time get a clue before you open your mouth.
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Instead we chose Adrien Robinson. Ellison was picked next, by the Vikings.
But you like this guy..Lawd knows we need a good blocking TE
I do like him. I just hope he stays healthy.
Doubt it. He'll be the blocking TE. Hopefully, they'll be able to get someone like a Njoku, Engram or Everett in the draft.
8 million Dollar Man - ( New Window )
Then again its Von.
If nothing else, this signing indicates that the team has acknowledged the hole that was created last year when both Johnson and Whitlock went down. It does raise the question of why so little was done to fill that hole at the time.
Ht
Wt
40-yd dash
10-yd split
20-yd split
20-ss
3-cone
Vert
Broad
BP
6 ft 5 in 251 lb 4.69 s 1.63 s 2.77 s 4.39 s 7.16 s 32.5 in 9 ft 3 in
All values from NFL Combine and Pro Day[6]
I'm not sure the Giants cut Will Johnson. They may see him more as a FB and Rhett Ellison more as a tight end/H-Back.
I'd be ok with Okung, but once Whitworth was signed, who was really worth the huge bucks given out, even if we were flush with cap money?
Zeitler was out of our financial grasp and probably Warford as well..
Chance Warmack might be worth signing..Depends on the Giants POV. I understand they liked him the year he came out
GREAT pick up @Giants Rhett is one of best blockers at TE I've ever gone against college or pros! We bout to have some battles in camp!
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OL in round 1.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
In comment 13386136 bceagle05 said:
A big +1 to both of these comments.
GREAT pick up @Giants Rhett is one of best blockers at TE I've ever gone against college or pros! We bout to have some battles in camp!
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In comment 13386044 Carl in CT said:
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OL in round 1.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
Looks like he's doing fine.
Will Johnson Status Update - ( New Window )
IT'S HAKA TIME IN EAST RUTHERFORD!
So, let's ask Johnson: Are you a fullback? Tight end? Both?
"Yes, I'm both," said Johnson, who did divulge he is currently working out of the tight ends position room. "The more I can do to contribute to this offense and help out, I'm more than capable of doing. Whether that's fullback, tight end, short yardage runner, whatever. I did that all in Pittsburgh, so I'm familiar with it."
I don't know if Johnson is healthy or not, but it would appear that Ellison was signed to do what the Giants thought they were getting out of Johnson last year. And considering the cap situation and roster space, it doesn't make much sense to keep Johnson on the roster with this signing, even if they want a fullback.
Maybe they will try to use Ellison similar to what they did with former TE/HBack Dan Campbell, who they also played some at fullback years ago.
With Jerell Adams projection as a blocker + Will Johnson, I have to think Tretter at G helps #Giants more than Rhett Ellison. Similar deals.
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In comment 13386050 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 13386044 Carl in CT said:
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OL in round 1.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
I never get this philosophy:
Does it work in reverse, when the Browns take someone at 33 is it in effect a first rounder, is the 34th pick in effect a first rounder? Is 31 in effect a second rounder?
There's 32 picks in the round (unless the Patriots lose one for cheating) they're all 1st round picks, not in effect anything.
Not picking on you, a lot of people say this, what am I missing?
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Would you please shut the fuck up?
Yes please
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In comment 13386050 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 13386044 Carl in CT said:
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OL in round 1.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
They drafted Pugh and Flowers when they had DIRE Needs at the position. Pugh was like the 7th lineman taken in that rd.
Do the Giants take Collins if not for his name being around in a murder case? Give me a break. They fucking forced those picks.
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I get they need a blocking TE, still with all the offensive linemen FA's who signed elsewhere today, hard to get excited about this.
I'd be ok with Okung, but once Whitworth was signed, who was really worth the huge bucks given out, even if we were flush with cap money?
Zeitler was out of our financial grasp and probably Warford as well..
Chance Warmack might be worth signing..Depends on the Giants POV. I understand they liked him the year he came out
I agree but I'm frustrated, what I say. I really thought they needed to get a veteran Guard or OT in FA and it ain't happening.
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In comment 13386024 The_Boss said:
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Would you please shut the fuck up?
For you?
Absolutely not.
8mil guaranteed , that's all that matters.
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I get they need a blocking TE, still with all the offensive linemen FA's who signed elsewhere today, hard to get excited about this.
I'd be ok with Okung, but once Whitworth was signed, who was really worth the huge bucks given out, even if we were flush with cap money?
Zeitler was out of our financial grasp and probably Warford as well..
Chance Warmack might be worth signing..Depends on the Giants POV. I understand they liked him the year he came out
Warmack to Eagles
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In comment 13386152 Old Dirty Beckham said:
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In comment 13386050 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 13386044 Carl in CT said:
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OL in round 1.
That's kinda silly Carl..We're not going to force the pick..
Right cause the giants have never forced a pick? Ereck Flowers, Justin Pugh, David Wilson to name a few.
They didn't force the pick at all..They liked Flowers, they liked Pugh and, after Martin was taken a pick before them, they chose Wilson at 32, which was in effect a second rounder
They drafted Pugh and Flowers when they had DIRE Needs at the position. Pugh was like the 7th lineman taken in that rd.
Do the Giants take Collins if not for his name being around in a murder case? Give me a break. They fucking forced those picks.
You're impossible to have a discussion with..Everything is a fucking fact with you..No need to engage with you moving forward
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In comment 13385970 JonC said:
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well, they worked him extensively back in his draft year, must have kept tabs and really liked what they saw.
Why ouch? Only 8 guaranteed over 4 years
It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
I don't know. What did Visanthe Shiancoe or Martellus Bennett do before they were traded?
or RB. Unless Lacy signs.
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Ellison is a good blocker but what else does he do out of the TE position
I don't know. What did Visanthe Shiancoe or Martellus Bennett do before they were traded?
Excuse me...not traded. Left in free agency for a better opportunity.
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must not be very healthy still
Looks like he's doing fine. Will Johnson Status Update - ( New Window )
Raanan :
FB/TE Rhett Ellison was a move that makes sense for Giants. They couldn't go into season with Will Johnson as... http://es.pn/2mMfxHh
Link - ( New Window )
an actual blocking TE? I like it. Be glad, but don't grab him for your FF team.
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
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are you so confidently asserting that David Wilson was a "forced pick?"
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
The fact he didnt argue the other two means I'm right. I'll take it. 2 out of 3 aint bad.
GREAT pick up @Giants Rhett is one of best blockers at TE I've ever gone against college or pros! We bout to have some battles in camp!
They were both Trojans...
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In comment 13386098 gidiefor said:
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must not be very healthy still
Looks like he's doing fine. Will Johnson Status Update - ( New Window )
Raanan :
FB/TE Rhett Ellison was a move that makes sense for Giants. They couldn't go into season with Will Johnson as... http://es.pn/2mMfxHh Link - ( New Window )
Wow Jordan reads BBI great scope there .
Name me one player on this team that could do that last year? I'll wait.
And if it's $8M gtd over 4 years, you're talking chump change for a guy who will improve your blocking schemes and run game.
This still leaves BPA open during the draft which is how Reese will approach it. That includes the TE's certainly and to some extent the OL available - though i'm a bit bearish on those guys at this point.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
On the other hand, if he plays the full four years of his contract, he will be compensated $18M. Of which $8M was guaranteed.
Are you following me? - ( New Window )
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Devon KennardVerified account @DevonKennard
GREAT pick up @Giants Rhett is one of best blockers at TE I've ever gone against college or pros! We bout to have some battles in camp!
They were both Trojans...
A Trojan? Well, we had a hole and...he filled it
Now at TE/FB/H-B the giants have:
Will Johnson
Rhett Ellison
Matt Lacosse
Will Tye
Jerell Adams
So at the very least 1 of those guys isn't on the team next season, likely 2 if the Giants draft another guy.
New York Giants Sign Rhett Ellison - ( New Window )
Bravo!
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
You mean that it might lower their chances? No. But I don't think they would do it anyway unless one of the top guys falls in their lap.
Basically they got Flowers help with this move. Watch Ellison spend most of his time next to Flowers. I think they are more interested in OG in the draft where there are good interior guys over OTs. I think John Jerry will be back to compete with a draft pick.
With Ellison and Johnson blocking will improve.
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In comment 13386060 Milton said: It's $8M guaranteed over four years if he plays four years and gets paid $18M total. Which is not cheap. If he plays only one year, it's $8M guaranteed over one year.
Not true. If he plays one year then it would be approximately $2 bonus and base salary for the first year. If he is released after that then we would have approximately $6 million in dead money for 2018.
I have no idea what you're talking about. If he plays only one year with the team, his compensation for that year of play will be $8M. It will be spread over two years in terms of the salary cap, but the $8M he receives will be very real. And it will be for the one year he played.
On the other hand, if he plays the full four years of his contract, he will be compensated $18M. Of which $8M was guaranteed. Are you following me? - ( New Window )
I understand real money and cap money. Real money doesn't mean anything to fans. It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
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In comment 13386206 santacruzom said:
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are you so confidently asserting that David Wilson was a "forced pick?"
Because he read it somewhere or it simply fits an argument.
The guy was the last pick in the first round and with the way the league was changing, his skill set would have been amazing to build around. Very few teams have every down backs, they matter less an less in the current NFL.
The fact he didnt argue the other two means I'm right. I'll take it. 2 out of 3 aint bad.
you're not right.
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
I think everyone knows the Giants like the 2 big TEs in the draft. Reese loves UM products.
I think it's fairly obvious the Giants will be going for a TE early in the draft, and they would expect that TE to provide some more explosion as an offensive weapon in the passing game. Right now you have a developing TE Adams who saw more of the field as the season went along, a JAG in Will Tye, and now a strong blocker in Ellison. Go and get a good pass catching TE in the draft, and the Giants can use him in the offense and Ellison can see the field as a hybrid TE/H-back/FB and stay on the field and shift around.
The signings so far from the Giants have been smart and fill needs. This offseason is about "fixing" the offense and turning this team into a Super Bowl contender. So far they have addressed 2 gaps on the 2016 team.
Speculation of course, but even with last year's OL (no, I do not want to stand pat), there is little doubt in my mind that had we had Marshall on the other side of OBJ, we would have been in the NFCC with that D of ours, even without JPP..The Marshall signing was huge and the Ellison signing might prove to be as well..Two needs, filled nearly an hour and a half into FA
post of the day
This money could have been used towards a linemen.
This money could have been used towards a linemen.
This money wouldn't by one quarter of a lineman signed so far lol. The Giants had zero FBs last year and no blocking at TE. Tye might actually be inactive on game days going forward.
What part of 8 mill. GTD don't some understand on Ellison?
Perusing the comments, geez.
This money could have been used towards a linemen.
Park him next to Flowers....that's how he helps
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
This money could have been used towards a linemen.
Maybe if he helps us run better on 1st and 2nd downs, we can avoid a lot of 3rd and 7's.
Link - ( New Window )
Johnson is built like a FB.
We just need to go back to carrying a FB and we can (and should) keep both of these guys. Along with Marshall replacing Cruz we've upgraded our supplemental blocking dramatically
Little Mary Sunshine leaks another fart.
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It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
If he plays only one year, the $8M all hits the cap, it just gets divided between two years (or potentially three, I guess, if he has guaranteed salary in year three of the deal).
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
We basically agree. My issue was when you said $8 million for 1 year. Apparently you were talking about real money where I was talking about the cap. I agree part of that $8 mil could include his base pay for year 1.
Sign him for one year prove it deal and people bitch. Sign him for four years at a typical deal that's gonna pay the guy enough but not a lot and people bitch. Wahh he makes too much. He's a young emerging player that will fill a need. Of course he's gonna make a few million! This isn't 1995.
That's the NFL.
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In comment 13386300 robbieballs2003 said:
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It is all about the cap. Plus, if you are talking about real money it would be $8 million PLUS his base salary.
If he plays only one year, the $8M all hits the cap, it just gets divided between two years (or potentially three, I guess, if he has guaranteed salary in year three of the deal).
And I think it's safe to assume that his base salary in 2017 is part of the $8M that is guaranteed, so no it won't be "$8 million PLUS his base salary" that he would receive if he only played one year.
We basically agree. My issue was when you said $8 million for 1 year. Apparently you were talking about real money where I was talking about the cap. I agree part of that $8 mil could include his base pay for year 1.
That's the NFL.
This is true!
Love what you did there, Marty.
If they really, really want an O-lineman in the first, they might have to trade up to get one. Or, if they don't like the cost of that, they may look to trade down to align their pick with the value of the player.
Just my uninformed speculation, but I think a trade up is more likely if they feel they don't need all their picks to fill out the bench and special teams for 2017. And that would mean making a lot of small-ish (un-sexy) signings, which would free them up to trade mid-late round draft picks if necessary.
But the whole point of doing all the scouting and arranging players in rows is that when they're on the clock, they're not going "SHIT RAMCZYK'S GONE WHAT DO WE DO NOW SHIT SHIT SHIT." They trust the work they've done.
The TEs are:
Johnson
Ellison
Adams
... and everyone else
Lacosse
Tye
If the Giants draft another TE, barring injury, I would say that Tye is gone. He'll catch on somewhere, he can be a number 3 TE. But he is no longer the number 3 TE for the New York Giants.
The TEs are:
Johnson
Ellison
Adams
... and everyone else
Lacosse
Tye
If the Giants draft another TE, barring injury, I would say that Tye is gone. He'll catch on somewhere, he can be a number 3 TE. But he is no longer the number 3 TE for the New York Giants.
Simple.
I'd use Ellison as Hback
Adams vs Lacosse for tight end but use a high pick for our starter.
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thats ALOT
How do u figure? 8 mill guaranteed
Why do people continue to only focus on the guaranteed dollars? Players DO get the non-guaranteed portion as well if they're on the roster. I know it's been repeated ad nauseum that it's the guaranteed money that matters, but I feel like it's now to the point where that's the ONLY thing people look at and don't realize that the non-guaranteed dollars deplete cap space just as much, they just don't become dead money if the contract is terminated.
Holy shit. It's $4.5M per year. The guaranteed dollars are only relevant when you want to get out of the contract, not when you want to keep the player on the contract.
some of you just take your likes and dislikes and project them onto the Giants
We'll see how much help this guy is when his 2 million dollar a year salary is on the sidelines on 2nd and 3rd and long while flowers gets toasted and Eli killed
Waste
Continue sky falling.
let Marshall/Shep/Odell do the rest.
Well then, I guess lots of GMs missed given the overpayments around the league today..
I'd agree. But this team has a number of holes remaining on offense that makes carrying, in essence, 2 fullbacks a tough idea to sell. You might be right, but I don't see them carrying both of these guys. Last year it was set up to be Johnson vs. Whitlock...and both got hurt.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
Marshall/Odell/Shep should be 1 of the best receiving corp in football, Ellison goes a long way in allowing Eli time to actually find them (or dare I say exactly seal the edge with an effective run block). Dominant blocker with sure hands when needed ... this is a good thing.
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builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Well then, I guess lots of GMs missed given the overpayments around the league today..
not all overpays are the same.
do you really think the deal is $8 million over 4 years?
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builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
wow, this is some blind homer bullshit.
Well, a lot. For as much as Donnell and Tye played, neither one could block a wet towel. It was absolutely a need.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
maybe he will always be an hback, time will tell.
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In comment 13386485 Enzo said:
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builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
wow, this is some blind homer bullshit.
And you're a blind whiner, pisser, moaner and complainer. Always bitching about something. What did I say that was wrong? Never mind, I wouldn't want to ruin your moment of depression.
Shhhhhhh. You'll upset Enzo. The Giants wouldn't need to sign FAs if Reese wasn't such an imbecile.
We've needed a blocking tight end for how many years now? Our run game sucks and people must underestimate how much of that has to do with lack of blocking tight ends and receivers. That kills a running game.
Now we have Ellison that specializes in blocking and can catch a little bit, as well as Marshall who is a great run blocker for a receiver. They def still need help on o line but this offense improved a lot these last two days.
Try to think of it this way: had Reese drafted Ellison (presumably instead of Robinson) and wanted to keep him, this is still the same contract they'd be on the hook for. If you sign guys coming off of their first contract, it's no different going forward than if you had drafted them yourself. What you miss out on is the cheap years on the rookie deal, no question about that, but if you draft role players and want to keep them after that rookie deal, you still pay the same amount as if you sign other teams' role players. And if you don't keep your own draft picks after their rookie contracts, you just turn the draft into a revolving door, in which case you never really improve over time - you basically stay as good as your star players allow and keep reshuffling the deck around them.
If you're inclined to knock Reese regardless, you probably won't see it that way, but I think it's something to keep in mind. In fact, I'd make the argument that one of the reasons why the Giants had as much cap room last year as they did was because their previous drafts had been relatively weak and they didn't have a lot of players worth retaining as those rookie deals expired. In a way (albeit twisted), Reese's draft drought allowed us to get Vernon, Jenkins and Harrison. Hooray for that.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
Great post.
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builds a roster full of holes and consistently misses in the middle to late rounds, I guess you end up overpaying for other team's role players.
Clown show. The Giants are a few pieces away from legitimately competing for the Super Bowl, yet we continue to kill the GM. There is such a thing as balancing the draft and FA, ya know? But sure, let's just continue to bitch and bitch and bitch and bitch about Reese. About 25 teams would kill to have such poor team management.
+1 [esp the Redskins ;)]
To look at his stats, and get that? Amazing...
Rhett Elison Secret Superstar - ( New Window )
Both TEs got $18 million, but Ellison signed for 4 years, while Sims signed for 3 years.
And the guaranteed money is $10 million for Sims and $8 million for Ellison.
To look at his stats, and get that? Amazing...
Blocking doesn't show up on the stat sheet. The Giants needed a guy like this in a bad way. Between him and Marshall being a good run blocking ER we should be at least slightly better running the ball this year. Especially if we can draft a few lineman in the first four rounds of the draft.
SLIM_ : 8:13 pm : link : reply
2016. Beckum split wide with Sheppard in the slot on the right side, Cruz split out on left with Tye (or Donnell -your choice) in the backfield, he goes in motion and ends up behind Flowers at the snap. Eli pitches left to Perkins. Tye/Donnell get either blown up or pull a whiffer which leads to penetration in the backfield, Perkins has to bounce further outside (running parallel to the line at best) where he gets tackled by the corner as Cruz can't sustain his block. Loss of 2.
2017. Same formation with Ellison/Marshall. Ellison is aggressive and attacks the linebacker creating a seal a little wide of the left tackle. Marshall effectively walls off his man and Perkins cuts upfield quickly for a gain of 6.
Same line / tougher 'skill' position players / Much different result.
Thanks.
Johnson I believe is a fullback. Last year we had a lot of RBs and WR. It's feasible we go 1 less RB and back to 2 QBD 4 of some mix of te/hb/fb is feasible.
Counting on Lacrosse is a mistake. He hasn't made it out of camp yet. I hope he does awesome.
Tye is more a steady receiver with limitations. He was the best of a weak unit last year.
Should be fun to watch in camp.
Both TEs got $18 million, but Ellison signed for 4 years, while Sims signed for 3 years.
And the guaranteed money is $10 million for Sims and $8 million for Ellison.
Plus they added an excellent downfield blocker in Marshall
Yeah, who needs an above average blocker.. certainly not the Giants.
Oy fucking vey.
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the money that TE Dion Sims got from the Bears, you have to like the Ellison signing even more.
Both TEs got $18 million, but Ellison signed for 4 years, while Sims signed for 3 years.
And the guaranteed money is $10 million for Sims and $8 million for Ellison.
Sims is younger and a better receiver as a legit tight end. Ellison is a fullback who is going to make his money blocking.
Sims also averaging less than 10 YPC on 74 career grabs. His catch totals look better because Miami was atrocious at times on offense
Quote:
the money that TE Dion Sims got from the Bears, you have to like the Ellison signing even more.
Both TEs got $18 million, but Ellison signed for 4 years, while Sims signed for 3 years.
And the guaranteed money is $10 million for Sims and $8 million for Ellison.
Sims is younger and a better receiver as a legit tight end. Ellison is a fullback who is going to make his money blocking.
If he was a fullback, he wouldn't have a number in the eighties. He's a true TE that has played in an H-back role because he's been behind Kyle Rudolph. I'm not suggesting that he's the second coming of Gronk, but he's not a FB.
Rhett Elli - ( New Window )
I don't know much about this guy but he sounds versatile and he sounds like he has played FB well in addition to TE.
Rhett Elllison has been eyeing the Giants for a long time: "In college, all I watched was @BearPascoe film."
Rhett Elllison has been eyeing the Giants for a long time: "In college, all I watched was @BearPascoe film."
lol--what's not to love.
Second issue, he is a much better receiver than we've seen from him with the Vikings and their terrible QB situation. Not to mention, their O Coordinator Norv Turner (for most of Ellison's career) for some reason never liked him as a receiver and as many know, Turner was terrible in MN.
Anyway, I think we may be surprised at how good he is as a receiver!
And yes, he is a GREAT blocker!"