As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone. Reese has to hit a home run this draft and pick 2 linemen between the 1st and 5th. He needs to get at least 1 starter and 1 legit backup.
between OL aquiring and holding onto Hankins, JPP has been the big pro Â
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone. Reese has to hit a home run this draft and pick 2 linemen between the 1st and 5th. He needs to get at least 1 starter and 1 legit backup.
They have plenty of options if they want to restructure contracts.
So why haven't we restructured those contracts yet? Answer:We are keeping that slug Thomas because Robinson is likely gone. We may restructure Harris which will save us a whopping 1.7 mil. You are a special kind of stupid.
So why haven't we restructured those contracts yet? Answer:We are keeping that slug Thomas because Robinson is likely gone. We may restructure Harris which will save us a whopping 1.7 mil. You are a special kind of stupid.
Vereen. Extending Pugh. Restructuring Jenkins. Or Vernon.
The giants probably lost their third best linemen today. Our lt sucks...the lg and c are good but neither are spectacular. The lt, rg and rt are bad ON PAPER. The biggest weakness is weaker on paper. We need to take an OL in rd 1 n 2 if we wanna win a sb
Another case of mass delusion sweeping BBI like in the Salem Â
witch hunt. A couple of people say that JPP is ruining free agency and everyone else starts repeating it, even though they know nothing about the real situation.
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone.
For someone who goes by the name Taxman, I would think you'd have a better handle on how the salary cap works in terms of the first year of multi-year contract. Even if Fluker is worth $7M/year, the Giants could give him a 4 year $28M deal with a $12M signing bonus and $750K salary in year one. The cap hit for such a deal would be $3.75M in 2017.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
RE: Another case of mass delusion sweeping BBI like in the Salem Â
witch hunt. A couple of people say that JPP is ruining free agency and everyone else starts repeating it, even though they know nothing about the real situation.
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
Exactly. It sucks the market is crazy, but we can address OL in the draft and don't need to give Riley Reiff 60 million dollars. And actually, the offensive tackles may be a value pick in the late first this year btw.
Restructuring is a two-way street, and it's not something you really Â
do lightly. A, the players have to want to do it, and B, It's kicking the can down the road. If they were going to do that, they probably would have done so to get a quality player they really want, not a clearance rack item.
do lightly. A, the players have to want to do it, and B, It's kicking the can down the road. If they were going to do that, they probably would have done so to get a quality player they really want, not a clearance rack item.
It's really not a two-way street. There is no reason for a player to reject the restructuring of his contract. It means salary is converted to bonus money, so he gets it sooner and in one lump sum rather than in 17 weekly payments from September to January. So he can begin earning interest on it immediately. On top of that, it gives him greater leverage in future years because his salary will be unchanged but his cap hit will be larger. The only reason to reject a restructured contract is if you want to force your way off the team.
It won't be because they didn't have the cap room for a deal. It will be because another team was willing to offer Fluker more money than the Giants thought he was worth.
Our OL is in worse shape than last year with no depth and a lousy class of OL coming out in the draft this year. It was the biggest problem the last few years and the Giants have not addressed the issue at all. Hopefully we can get Fluker.
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone.
For someone who goes by the name Taxman, I would think you'd have a better handle on how the salary cap works in terms of the first year of multi-year contract. Even if Fluker is worth $7M/year, the Giants could give him a 4 year $28M deal with a $12M signing bonus and $750K salary in year one. The cap hit for such a deal would be $3.75M in 2017.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
This. Tons of good points.
I think he MAY need to sign a prove it deal. Even if there are multi-year deals on the table they may not be very good. He's just 25-26, so I think 1 year could make a lot of sense from his perspective. Pryor and Jeffery are two of several I was surprised have had to settle for one year deals and not even for top dollar.
Like it or not he was one of our better linemen last season and versatile. More or less our Kevin Boothe last year and we would have been fucked without him.
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone.
For someone who goes by the name Taxman, I would think you'd have a better handle on how the salary cap works in terms of the first year of multi-year contract. Even if Fluker is worth $7M/year, the Giants could give him a 4 year $28M deal with a $12M signing bonus and $750K salary in year one. The cap hit for such a deal would be $3.75M in 2017.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
Excellent analysis. I don't really want Fluker, but that's what's available. He might benefit from the proverbial "change of scenery."
Good luck to Marshall. Wish him the best. He played hard, and was good at guard. Thanks for all your contributions to the Giants Marshall.
RE: Restructuring is a two-way street, and it's not something you really Â
do lightly. A, the players have to want to do it, and B, It's kicking the can down the road. If they were going to do that, they probably would have done so to get a quality player they really want, not a clearance rack item.
Restructuring means turning nonguaranteed money into guaranteed dollars. No players are turning that down, ever. You're turning money they might see into money they'll get right now.
A pay cut isn't a restructure, that's where you need both sides to be amenable.
I'm sure he has some upside and I think it's likely he joins for a reasonable contract, but I don't think he's a savior. Will he be better then Newhouse? Maybe.
Newhouse did a decent job, and better when he played guard.
& not nearly as bad as he was made out to be. Don't think he is a starter . However the Giants line just got weaker if you think that depth and versatility are important:
Through the draft, Guard Tackle or Tackel Guard in the first two rounds, Jake Butt in the third. However there's no escaping the fact that it all has to click for Flowers this year, without a vet signing he's your left tackle. He's a 23 year old with 2 years of NFL experience, coach him up.
offensive line solution they won't do.I defer to Sy on Fluker. Sign Fluker and Mangold. Put Mangold at LG. Have Pugh and Flowers battle it out for LT. The loser battles Fluker for RT, with the loser playing RG.
Let's all not forget the possible plans the Giants Â
witch hunt. A couple of people say that JPP is ruining free agency and everyone else starts repeating it, even though they know nothing about the real situation.
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
Exactly. It sucks the market is crazy, but we can address OL in the draft and don't need to give Riley Reiff 60 million dollars. And actually, the offensive tackles may be a value pick in the late first this year btw.
The Giants have shown ZERO ability to identify offensive line talent in the draft or FA. At least thy found a TE who can block. God knows why the fuck they refused to last year. Oh wait to to carry two guys at back up QB who will babe about as significant careers in the NFL as I do.
People arent upset Newhouse is gone. Tha t they didn't piss away 40-60 million on Rief or Okung. . They are upset Reese is a moron wnen it comes to the OL. We heard from all the people who generally reside up Reese's ass he had a plan last year. Yeah. That worked out. Forgive us for our skepticism
He's got a plan. But when it comes to OL there isn't a worse GMin the NFL.
It's almost like he just figures 3 step drops can cure the worst talent level in the NFL. I think he hates Eli.
Someone I know actually says he thinks Reese hates Eli as well. Obviously it's not true because Eli's a big reason why he's still employed, but you would think that at an advanced stage of his career, something Reese had acknowledged numerous times, he'd understand that Eli needs a solid OL now more than at any time in his career.
RE: Let's all not forget the possible plans the Giants Â
might have (even as versatile depth) for Brett Jones
Plan for Brett Jones?
Come on. The plan is to have him in pads every week and hope there are no in game injuries across the interior of the OL that would require him starting for a long stretch of time.
They have plenty of options if they want to restructure contracts.
Dumbass...
Oakland Raiders Sign Marshall Newhouse - ( New Window )
This shit just got interesting
That's shocking and humbling at the same time...
Pugh back to RT?
Vereen. Extending Pugh. Restructuring Jenkins. Or Vernon.
Who's the stupid one?
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
Exactly. It sucks the market is crazy, but we can address OL in the draft and don't need to give Riley Reiff 60 million dollars. And actually, the offensive tackles may be a value pick in the late first this year btw.
He is flying in on the Giants request....For a physical.
This is going to be a bigger and longer deal then one thinks....
The monies are out of control.....But if he checks out.....He will be a Giants
Quote:
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone.
For someone who goes by the name Taxman, I would think you'd have a better handle on how the salary cap works in terms of the first year of multi-year contract. Even if Fluker is worth $7M/year, the Giants could give him a 4 year $28M deal with a $12M signing bonus and $750K salary in year one. The cap hit for such a deal would be $3.75M in 2017.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
This. Tons of good points.
I think he MAY need to sign a prove it deal. Even if there are multi-year deals on the table they may not be very good. He's just 25-26, so I think 1 year could make a lot of sense from his perspective. Pryor and Jeffery are two of several I was surprised have had to settle for one year deals and not even for top dollar.
I wish the guy luck
Quote:
As mediocre as he is, he's going to want 7 mil at minimum. We have 9 mil. 4 of which has to go to draft picks. We aren't getting anyone.
For someone who goes by the name Taxman, I would think you'd have a better handle on how the salary cap works in terms of the first year of multi-year contract. Even if Fluker is worth $7M/year, the Giants could give him a 4 year $28M deal with a $12M signing bonus and $750K salary in year one. The cap hit for such a deal would be $3.75M in 2017.
But I doubt very much that Fluker is going to command a contract averaging $7M/year unless it includes very little guaranteed money, certainly not the numbers I gave in the above example. If he was worth $7M/year, chances are the Chargers would've exercised the 5th year option on his contract for $8.8M.
Truth is we have no idea how much money Fluker will command. I know I certainly don't, maybe I shouldn't speak for others. He was a disappointment with the Chargers, but Kalil and Okung were also disappointments and they both signed bigtime contracts with tons of guaranteed money.
One difference is that those two are left tackles, Fluker is strictly rightside of the OL only. The Chargers moved him to OG, but I think the Giants will look at him as a right tackle. It could be that Fluker is looked upon in a similar light as Chance Warmack and Warmack signed a one year deal with the Eagles for chump change.
So I have no idea what his real dollar value is, but whatever it is, I hope the Giants are the team to sign him for that amount.
Excellent analysis. I don't really want Fluker, but that's what's available. He might benefit from the proverbial "change of scenery."
Good luck to Marshall. Wish him the best. He played hard, and was good at guard. Thanks for all your contributions to the Giants Marshall.
Restructuring means turning nonguaranteed money into guaranteed dollars. No players are turning that down, ever. You're turning money they might see into money they'll get right now.
A pay cut isn't a restructure, that's where you need both sides to be amenable.
Newhouse did a decent job, and better when he played guard.
He's got a plan. But when it comes to OL there isn't a worse GMin the NFL.
It's almost like he just figures 3 step drops can cure the worst talent level in the NFL. I think he hates Eli.
Quote:
witch hunt. A couple of people say that JPP is ruining free agency and everyone else starts repeating it, even though they know nothing about the real situation.
If the Giants can restructure the three big free agents contracts from last year, they could have all the cap space they need and more.
What O-Linemen were really worth a big payday from the Giants?
If JPP is really being an reasonable bastard in negotiations and screwing everything up, let Jerry give him some medium concessions followed by a "take it or play out the one year tag."
If JPP and his agent have any brains, they would not give up this multi-year small fortune and take the risk of injury or poor production screwing up his value a year from now.
But Reese doesn't need any advice. He knows his options and they don't include ditching JPP to overpay some mediocre offensive linemen.
Exactly. It sucks the market is crazy, but we can address OL in the draft and don't need to give Riley Reiff 60 million dollars. And actually, the offensive tackles may be a value pick in the late first this year btw.
The Giants have shown ZERO ability to identify offensive line talent in the draft or FA. At least thy found a TE who can block. God knows why the fuck they refused to last year. Oh wait to to carry two guys at back up QB who will babe about as significant careers in the NFL as I do.
People arent upset Newhouse is gone. Tha t they didn't piss away 40-60 million on Rief or Okung. . They are upset Reese is a moron wnen it comes to the OL. We heard from all the people who generally reside up Reese's ass he had a plan last year. Yeah. That worked out. Forgive us for our skepticism
The FA's available -- certainly the remaining ones -- don't appear to be any better than Newhouse or Jerry.
Too funny. Nicely done
Quote:
I'm assuming he has a plan. Wishful thinking?
He's got a plan. But when it comes to OL there isn't a worse GMin the NFL.
It's almost like he just figures 3 step drops can cure the worst talent level in the NFL. I think he hates Eli.
Someone I know actually says he thinks Reese hates Eli as well. Obviously it's not true because Eli's a big reason why he's still employed, but you would think that at an advanced stage of his career, something Reese had acknowledged numerous times, he'd understand that Eli needs a solid OL now more than at any time in his career.
Plan for Brett Jones?
Come on. The plan is to have him in pads every week and hope there are no in game injuries across the interior of the OL that would require him starting for a long stretch of time.