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About Eli and restructuring

Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 12:26 pm
I saw an article the other day (not sure if a national one or from one of our beat writers) which effectively opined that if there is to be a re-structure of Eli, it should not be done this year, given the mediocrity out there. Rather, IF NECESSARYand with contracts coming up for our own, next year would be the time, especially if we can extend OBJ..

I agree with this..Curious what you guys think..
I'd have done it if Whitworth were willing to sign.  
yatqb : 3/11/2017 12:29 pm : link
Otherwise no.

It's like a line of credit - you don't want to use credit  
jcn56 : 3/11/2017 12:29 pm : link
when you don't need to, but it's nice to know it's there if you do.

Right now, the Giants haven't hit the need moment just yet. If/when they do, they have Eli and others that they can turn to and convert nonguaranteed money into bonus to give them some cap relief this year, and complicate things in the future.
Leary is the only guy I would have paid  
jcn56 : 3/11/2017 12:30 pm : link
Would have liked to have signed Whitworth, but he got paid a shit ton of money for a short term solution.
RE: It's like a line of credit - you don't want to use credit  
Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 12:30 pm : link
In comment 13389200 jcn56 said:
Quote:
when you don't need to, but it's nice to know it's there if you do.

Right now, the Giants haven't hit the need moment just yet. If/when they do, they have Eli and others that they can turn to and convert nonguaranteed money into bonus to give them some cap relief this year, and complicate things in the future.


I was talikng about possibly next year..I wouldn't this year
Eli's contract runs to 2020  
Steve in South Jersey : 3/11/2017 12:31 pm : link
He will be 39 or 40 then. A restructure would extend him past 2020.
RE: Leary is the only guy I would have paid  
Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 12:32 pm : link
In comment 13389202 jcn56 said:
Quote:
Would have liked to have signed Whitworth, but he got paid a shit ton of money for a short term solution.


What would you pay Fluker?
Trouble with that is retructuring guys with only 2 years left  
BillT : 3/11/2017 12:35 pm : link
Doesn't net you that great a cap savings. A $15m restructure only nets you $7.5m in cap savings. The same restructure this year nets you $10m and you can carry over what you don't use
RE: Trouble with that is retructuring guys with only 2 years left  
Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 12:37 pm : link
In comment 13389210 BillT said:
Quote:
Doesn't net you that great a cap savings. A $15m restructure only nets you $7.5m in cap savings. The same restructure this year nets you $10m and you can carry over what you don't use


Fair point. I think..😎
No to Eli restructure but yes to restucture of  
Rick in Dallas : 3/11/2017 12:52 pm : link
Vernon and Jenkins who are younger and have more years on their respective contracts.


Too late now. Honestly the money spent on the OL free agents this year was crazy. Market way overpriced.

JJP protracted contract negotiations have really hurt us in free agency this year.

Giants were never going to be big players in free agency this year.

I like the signings of Marshall and Ellison. Hope we can sign Fluker and Robinson.










RE: RE: Leary is the only guy I would have paid  
jcn56 : 3/11/2017 12:55 pm : link
In comment 13389206 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 13389202 jcn56 said:


Quote:


Would have liked to have signed Whitworth, but he got paid a shit ton of money for a short term solution.



What would you pay Fluker?


A lot less. I know it's not a popular opinion, but a player doesn't get better because he makes more money. There was a lot of dreck available in FA this year, and some people feel like they missed out purely because these guys made a lot of money. If we have dreck at the position currently, I'd rather save the money than acquire more expensive dreck.

That said, we do need warm bodies, with Jerry no longer under contract and Newhouse gone, but I'd really like to stay on the low end of whatever anyone else available is going to make if that's the case.
RE: No to Eli restructure but yes to restucture of  
Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 12:56 pm : link
In comment 13389241 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
Vernon and Jenkins who are younger and have more years on their respective contracts.


Too late now. Honestly the money spent on the OL free agents this year was crazy. Market way overpriced.

JJP protracted contract negotiations have really hurt us in free agency this year.

Giants were never going to be big players in free agency this year.

I like the signings of Marshall and Ellison. Hope we can sign Fluker and Robinson.











Rick, question..Other than possibly Hankins at this point, WHO did we miss out on had we been able to sign JPP which would have enabled us to have more cap room? I wouldn't have wanted us to sign any of those players out there for big money save for Zeitler and possibly Whitworth
BB'56  
Rick in Dallas : 3/11/2017 1:00 pm : link
I really liked Ron Leary and wanted to resign Hankins and Robinson. I would have called that a successful free agent period along with Marshall and Ellison additions.
Also, signing JPP to a 4 or 5 year contract.
RE: BB'56  
Big Blue '56 : 3/11/2017 1:04 pm : link
In comment 13389254 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
I really liked Ron Leary and wanted to resign Hankins and Robinson. I would have called that a successful free agent period along with Marshall and Ellison additions.
Also, signing JPP to a 4 or 5 year contract.


I hope we re-sign Robinson
RE: Eli's contract runs to 2020  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/12/2017 9:52 pm : link
In comment 13389205 Steve in South Jersey said:
Quote:
He will be 39 or 40 then. A restructure would extend him past 2020.

That's not necessarily true. It's possible to convert salary to bonus (amortized over the existing term) and essentially borrow against tomorrow's cap space in the present. With the way that the cap has increased in recent years, it's not as painful as it used to be.

Cap space is kind of like cash in your pocket - it's worth more in any current year than a subsequent year (unless/until the cap ever goes down YOY).
it's also like an advance on salary  
fkap : 3/12/2017 10:13 pm : link
you can borrow from next year's paycheck, but that means you have less in the check next year. sure your salary is due to increase, but so too is everything you need to pay for.
RE: it's also like an advance on salary  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/13/2017 8:05 am : link
In comment 13390801 fkap said:
Quote:
you can borrow from next year's paycheck, but that means you have less in the check next year. sure your salary is due to increase, but so too is everything you need to pay for.

That's absolutely true, and a good point. It's worth noting that you theoretically don't have to re-sign every player every year, so most of the inflationary effect is on new free agents. If you see a guy this year that you feel is a difference-maker, it can be worth it to lock him in now rather than wait a year for a comparable player who will make more by virtue of it being a year later and the cap having increased. Of course, that all goes out the window if it's a one-year deal and you end up borrowing against the future for a now solution AND having to pay the inflated cost again in a year.

TL;DR: only borrow against tomorrow's cap for a difference-maker, and try for a multi-year deal.
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