Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner
 

Archived Thread

NFT: Mets announce second round of cuts

DanMetroMan : 3/14/2017 9:35 am
Becerra, Flexen, Molina, Rosario, Bradford, Wilk



Marc Carig& #8207;Verified account
@MarcCarig

Following
More
Bruce starting at first.
Pages: 1 2 3 <<Prev | Show All |
Lol  
Shecky : 3/15/2017 2:47 pm : link
Nice, but awkward, catch by Tebow. So out of place.
Tebow just made a diving, lunging  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 2:47 pm : link
Play in the wind in RF. Lol.
Marlins announcers said the wind was pushing the ball  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 2:48 pm : link
And it was a tough play.
RE: Marlins announcers said the wind was pushing the ball  
Shecky : 3/15/2017 2:49 pm : link
In comment 13394154 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
And it was a tough play.


Homers....

Looked like he misjudged it, caught it and fell. Didn't have the best view to be honest.
Derek Norris released by Nats  
spike : 3/15/2017 2:52 pm : link
Time to bring him in?
RE: Derek Norris released by Nats  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 2:57 pm : link
In comment 13394161 spike said:
Quote:
Time to bring him in?


Nats apparently were doing him a solid and giving him a chance to look for a starting role. We aren't going to offer him that (maybe nobody will) but he will be looking for one.
Kernan  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 2:59 pm : link
says Montero not looking good this inning.
Montero still going  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:09 pm : link
Woodmansee at SS
Hit 94  
Shecky : 3/15/2017 3:09 pm : link
But no control
Tebow has a higher batting average than  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:18 pm : link
Mike Trout this spring now. lol
RE: RE: Derek Norris released by Nats  
spike : 3/15/2017 3:24 pm : link
In comment 13394165 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13394161 spike said:


Quote:


Time to bring him in?



Nats apparently were doing him a solid and giving him a chance to look for a starting role. We aren't going to offer him that (maybe nobody will) but he will be looking for one.


let him shop around for that, but if he can be an upgrade over Rivera, I'd totally give him an offer
Derek Norris was the worst every day  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:31 pm : link
hitter in baseball last year. There was nobody worse. His 2015 wasn't so hot either. I dont get the appeal.
In fact Derek Norris's "best year"  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:35 pm : link
in 2014 wasn't even as good as Rene Rivera's that year in terms of fWAR.
RE: Derek Norris was the worst every day  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 3:38 pm : link
In comment 13394223 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
hitter in baseball last year. There was nobody worse. His 2015 wasn't so hot either. I dont get the appeal.



Not totally fair. 2015 25 catchers had 350 or more PA's

Norris
11th in wRC+
12th in wOBA
10h in overall offense

TDA 2015+2016 (just for comparisons sake)
9th in wRC+
12th in wOBA
9th in overall offense

So essentially it would be like adding a second TDA (at least based on recent #'s)
RE: In fact Derek Norris's  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 3:39 pm : link
In comment 13394228 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
in 2014 wasn't even as good as Rene Rivera's that year in terms of fWAR.


TDA's best season ever is 2.3 fWAR yet I don't see you asking for Rene Rivera to start. Norris has 3 seasons 2.2 fWAR or greater. TDA has 1.
I am not comparing TDA to Norris at all  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:44 pm : link
Nor will I. We all know what TDA's issues have been and they've mostly had to do with staying healthy so its not apples to apples. And I wouldn't like to add "two TDAs" if we are talking in terms of risk which Norris has. Im comfortable with Rene Rivera as the backup, he knows the staff. If we are going to add a better vet I want somebody established. Not somebody who has been awful for two years and may not even be better than Rivera if Rivera somehow were asked to play all year.
I also dont see why you would average  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:46 pm : link
TDA's 2015 and 2016 together and not do that with Norris. Norris is coming off a historically bad year. Doesn't seem fair.
RE: I  
Eric on Li : 3/15/2017 3:46 pm : link
In comment 13394096 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
would not be stunned if Harvey is deemed not ready for opening day. A velocity drop from 1 inning to the next that step may suggest he needs more time than we think.


I hope he starts the year in extended ST and spends as much time as needs to getting right. He seemed to be excited about some of the progress he made today and he obviously always likes to push it, but there's no reason not to be as conservative as humanly possible.
RE: I am not comparing TDA to Norris at all  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 3:48 pm : link
In comment 13394244 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Nor will I. We all know what TDA's issues have been and they've mostly had to do with staying healthy so its not apples to apples. And I wouldn't like to add "two TDAs" if we are talking in terms of risk which Norris has. Im comfortable with Rene Rivera as the backup, he knows the staff. If we are going to add a better vet I want somebody established. Not somebody who has been awful for two years and may not even be better than Rivera if Rivera somehow were asked to play all year.


? What "risk" does Norris have? We don't even know what he would cost. What's the risk? He sucks? You make it sound like he's getting years and money. He's not going to get either. It's as "no risk" as they come.
RE: Tebow has a higher batting average than  
NewFakeDannyHeep : 3/15/2017 3:49 pm : link
In comment 13394199 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Mike Trout this spring now. lol


Trade him while his value is highest!

Also, if Tim Tebow could be traded for Mike Trout, I'll believe anything Tebow tells me to believe.
RE: I also dont see why you would average  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 3:50 pm : link
In comment 13394251 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
TDA's 2015 and 2016 together and not do that with Norris. Norris is coming off a historically bad year. Doesn't seem fair.


Huh? You said Norris had a bad 2015 yet his 2015 puts his production on par with what TDA has given us the last 2 seasons. You aren't giving up on TDA yet right? So why would Norris be "done" by one really bad season? He was an above average starting catcher in 2015 despite your claims otherwise. 2.4 fWAR which again is higher fWAR than ANY season TDA has put up. Really strange to say his 2015 wasn't good enough to have some interest.
Yeah the risk is that he doesn't know the staff  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:50 pm : link
and has been horrid recently. Aren't you signing him hoping for a bounceback? There's certainly risk in that ever happening and you could be stuck with the worst everyday hitter in baseball from 2016 on your team. Its not like we can keep Rivera while this experiment is going on.



I count catcher as a gravy  
pjcas18 : 3/15/2017 3:53 pm : link
position (like Wright). Catching is subpar all over baseball.

9 catchers in all of baseball qualified for FG leaderboard (based on PA). Only 16 in the game had over 400 plate appearances as a catcher (~100 - 110 games).

and only 8 even rated as solid role player or better on the fWAR scale and most of the 8 has solid DEF ratings.

In the National League where there's no DH my "other" catcher has to be a good defensive catcher who can throw runners out. I'd put that higher than marginal offensive skill.
RE: RE: I also dont see why you would average  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 3:53 pm : link
In comment 13394264 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 13394251 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


TDA's 2015 and 2016 together and not do that with Norris. Norris is coming off a historically bad year. Doesn't seem fair.



Huh? You said Norris had a bad 2015 yet his 2015 puts his production on par with what TDA has given us the last 2 seasons. You aren't giving up on TDA yet right? So why would Norris be "done" by one really bad season? He was an above average starting catcher in 2015 despite your claims otherwise. 2.4 fWAR which again is higher fWAR than ANY season TDA has put up. Really strange to say his 2015 wasn't good enough to have some interest.


I said his 2015 "wasn't so hot". I did not say it was bad. He hit below league average which I get is still fine for catchers but doesn't blow my skirt up thus the "not so hot". His 2016 was historically bad however and his last two seasons he has played a heck of a lot more than TDA so the samples are off.
.  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 3:58 pm : link
2016 included Norris 2013-2016 12th in fWAR (32 qualified catchers) 32 qualified


As for not knowing the staff, we signed Rivera on April 5th, went down to the minors with the understanding he would likely be up quickly and was. Can't say it's early in ST for guys like Harvey and then act like Norris couldn't come in on March 15th and "learn the staff". By that rationale even if a stud catcher were available it would make sense to pass. He'd have roughly 3 weeks to work with the pitchers.
No because a stud catcher offers more of a guarantee  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:01 pm : link
on his bat IMO. Im not convinced Norris is better than R Rivera which is the only reason R Rivera would get the tie breaker from knowing the staff.
Guillorme  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:13 pm : link
impressive spring so far
Guillorme is another guy  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:16 pm : link
that has to go to Bing, right? Can't possibly be atbats for him in Vegas?
RE: Guillorme is another guy  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:19 pm : link
In comment 13394307 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
that has to go to Bing, right? Can't possibly be atbats for him in Vegas?


He put up a .647 OPS in St. Lucie. He's certainly going to be in Bing.
Yeah true...  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:20 pm : link
Just thinking he looks like a different player this spring. Stronger. Hitting with authority. Even later on he's going to have a hard time cracking Vegas IMO.
.  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:36 pm : link
Michael Mayer @themainemets
Paul Sewald has allowed only four base runners this spring in eight innings. Really pushing for that final bullpen spot.
.  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:39 pm : link
Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
May; that's how long Warthen told me it might take for Harvey to get back his old fastball. Until then, gotta command and pitch.

1m

Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
Marlins got their hits on Harvey against low 90s fastballs. Per Warthen, Harvey lost velo when he was trying to amp it up.

3m

Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
No. He's a guy coming off a major surgery who may not be able to throw harder than this.

4m

Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
So, Harvey could be facing the challenge that deGrom dealt with last year. Can Harvey pitch when diminishef velo is the new normal?

5m

Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
So, Dan Warthen and Matt Harvey think this could be the new normal, low 90s fastball, heavy on secondary stuff. At least for awhile.
"at least for a while"  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:42 pm : link
Does that mean they expect him to build up arm strength eventually? What a mess.
.  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:45 pm : link
Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
Thing I was struck by earlier with Harvey is what seemed to be an acceptance of his situation, and the challenge it now presents.

3m
.  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:46 pm : link
Matt Ehalt @MattEhalt
Warthen added: ďHistory says with that surgery itís 10 months out. Thatís when you start to really feel strong."
Harv  
spike : 3/15/2017 4:50 pm : link
should do extended ST to get that velocity back, in due time.

We still have Lugo as the extra starter
It  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:50 pm : link
does sound like the idea he was throwing really hard in side sessions was BS. Warthen isn't even making that claim. He's acknowledging it's down but is hopeful it will creep up.
.  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:50 pm : link
Marc Carig ✔@MarcCarig
May; that's how long Warthen told me it might take for Harvey to get back his old fastball. Until then, gotta command and pitch.
TC claims (once again) that Tebow  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:52 pm : link
is done in MLB camp.

Matt Ehalt‏ @MattEhalt 10m10 minutes ago
More
Terry and Warthen both talked about Harvey being bale to pitch despite diminished velocity. This could be a real thing.
RE: It  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 4:52 pm : link
In comment 13394352 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
does sound like the idea he was throwing really hard in side sessions was BS. Warthen isn't even making that claim. He's acknowledging it's down but is hopeful it will creep up.


Warthen himself said he had thrown harder in side sessions but that was weeks ago and it might only been a few times. Seems like now that Harvey is settling in he might have to pitch a lower velocity for a while.
.  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 4:52 pm : link
Marc Carig‏Verified account
@MarcCarig

Following
More
Warthen thinks there's a chance that Harvey has to pitch at this velo this year. At least the first few months.
Positive outlook-  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 5:02 pm : link
Marc Carig ✔ @MarcCarig
FWIW, scouts who have watched Harvey generally think heís on track. Seen nothing to believe that velo is gone forever, just needs time.
Please no  
Shecky : 3/15/2017 5:04 pm : link
On Norris. Not worth it, and that's fo free.
RE: Please no  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 5:05 pm : link
In comment 13394369 Shecky said:
Quote:
On Norris. Not worth it, and that's fo free.


I wanted Chooch. We flubbed that one considering the price.
Man if Harvey's velocity  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 5:08 pm : link
isn't really expected back fully until May its going to be a rough month or so in Metsfan land. Not sure Im ready for that yet. Hope Harvey is.
mid-season Stephen Vogt (or maybe Lucroy) acquisition still possible  
Eric on Li : 3/15/2017 5:11 pm : link
Hopefully TDA finally shows some consistency and stays healthy, though it's a lot to ask for.

They really should just leave Harvey in ST for a while. There's no downside. Why waste innings while he's building up velocity?
If  
DanMetroMan : 3/15/2017 5:11 pm : link
they truly believe velocity will return into May then he should be left behind until then. I don't know the answer either way but I don't see why suggesting Harvey may be better off with 2-4 weeks in extended if the prevailing thought/claim is he won't be fully back until May. What's the purpose of putting diminished Harvey out there IF they really believe there is more velocity there? This ONLY makes sense if he's clearly one of your best 5. If it's determined he's better than Lugo and Gsellman than so be it but otherwise what exactly is "owed" to Harvey and the opening day roster? That may read as cruel but every single game matters. If "this" Harvey is better than Gsellman or Lugo, then you go with Harvey. If you feel Harvey is now "this" Harvey and want to see if he can help you or not, then go with Harvey. BUT if you are suggesting it's going to be longer because he's still working his way back. No way do you go with Harvey. It's silly.
Yeah makes the most sense  
ZGiants98 : 3/15/2017 5:18 pm : link
unless we are only talking about a tick or two. If Harvey is sitting 94-ish by the time the season starts and they think he can sit 96ish mid-season that's not huge but if he's throwing 90-92 heading into the season you gotta hold him back IMO.
harvey is a proud guy  
spike : 3/15/2017 5:21 pm : link
and I don't want to see him embarrassed out there in Queens.

Let him pitch through it in Florida until May
RE: If  
Rob in Rockaway : 3/15/2017 8:02 pm : link
In comment 13394383 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
they truly believe velocity will return into May then he should be left behind until then. I don't know the answer either way but I don't see why suggesting Harvey may be better off with 2-4 weeks in extended if the prevailing thought/claim is he won't be fully back until May. What's the purpose of putting diminished Harvey out there IF they really believe there is more velocity there? This ONLY makes sense if he's clearly one of your best 5. If it's determined he's better than Lugo and Gsellman than so be it but otherwise what exactly is "owed" to Harvey and the opening day roster? That may read as cruel but every single game matters. If "this" Harvey is better than Gsellman or Lugo, then you go with Harvey. If you feel Harvey is now "this" Harvey and want to see if he can help you or not, then go with Harvey. BUT if you are suggesting it's going to be longer because he's still working his way back. No way do you go with Harvey. It's silly.


This makes a ton of sense.
Pages: 1 2 3 <<Prev | Show All |
Back to the Corner