I'd get Hankins done with the anticipation JPP is one next yr ... just give him a low 1st year deal and balance it out in the 2nd yr and from there mutually beneficial and fair for both parties.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
and for this reason, the Giants have the leverage. The closer we get to the season, the more JPP has to think about passing on a long term deal, likely worth $60 million +. (Similar to what he did the summer that he blew up half of his hand) If he gets hurt week 1 and doesn't sign it...bye bye long term deal....forever.
...realistically this was never an option. You tag a player for two reasons. One is because he fills a major role on the team which you can't replace internally. The second is to maintain control of his rights so that if in the case of the non-exclusive tag he receives an offer you get assets in return to offset the loss.
The Giants were never going to let JPP just walk away scot free. Nor should they have. That approach would hurt our chances to win both short and long term.
Other than Hankins....who do you spend it on? What would be a shame is to lose Hankins this year and then JPP leaves after next season. But I am not sure Hankins would be an irreplaceable loss anyway.
My gut says the Giants and JPP are going to come to terms on a long term deal. JPP knows the risk of playing on a tag and I doubt he gives up a chance at 50-60 million guaranteed.
really? Since they would then know thatey have that $17 mill, the could lock up Hankins. It took 3 yrs to replace Linval Joseph, that would be done. THey would have money in reserve for helpful camp casualties, maybe find a good PK who they would then be able to pay.
According to Spotrac JPP's cap number in 2017 is $16.934. According to the same site, the following free agents have signed contracts with the following 2017 cap numbers:
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
Keep in mind - JPP has played 16 games once in the last four seasons
Any games he misses this season will be $16.9 million in cap space that isn't contributing on the field. That is over 10% of the cap.
People get tired of hearing me bitch about Vernon's contract, and franchising JPP. I get that I'm a broken record, but the stakes are enormous with these two players. They HAVE to be elite AND play a 16 game season in order to be worth the cost.
RE: The mistake was tagging him in the first place
According to Spotrac JPP's cap number in 2017 is $16.934. According to the same site, the following free agents have signed contracts with the following 2017 cap numbers:
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
right again. they beat 3 playoff teams without him. They lost when DRC got hurt.
they are never sitting back thinking everything is okay. They are aware that Eli could go down, or Odell could tear an ACL, or Snacks could get back problems from lifting too much weight. The idea that they are not concerned is laughable. They have 4 deep contingency plans - perhaps not in players, but on paper and the guys shuffling the money like a casino dealer are pros at massaging money and know what can and cannot be done. We're fans - those guys have asses on the line and professionals in every cubicle
'The mistake was tagging him in the first place '...
According to Spotrac JPP's cap number in 2017 is $16.934. According to the same site, the following free agents have signed contracts with the following 2017 cap numbers:
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
Calais Campbell has a hit of 10.5 mill with 30 mill guaranteed over 4 years (60 mill total btw, 15 mill average salary).
All Pro game-changing 4-3 DEs are worth more than mediocre talent. That much we knew already.
Not for nothing, if JPP plays on the tag, I imagine we're going to get the best game he's going to play at this point in his career. That well might be worth 17 mill guar.
The Giants can pull the tender, they can re-work a number of contracts, they can cut additional players etc. to get the money needed to acquire the players they desire.
The Giants are not in bad near, medium, or long-term cap shape. Adding up numbers on a cap hit for this year tells so little of the story it's virtually not worth discussing.
There just aren't players on the market this year the Giants think are worth the investment.
I agree it will suck if he plays on the tag, leaves next year, and we lose Hankins in the interim. That's one reason I'd pull the tag, and use the money to resign Hankins. His demands should be a lot more reasonable now that the market has spoken.
until he signs it. Once he signs it he is guaranteed that money as long as he comes to work, whether they play him or not or if he gets injured.
He may be done playing with fireworks, but he's playing with fire now by not signing. If something similar were to happen to him (heaven forbid), the Giants could pull the tag and he'd get nothing. Given his past you would think he'd know better and be satisfied with a nice offer from the Giants. Too bad his ego is getting in the way and he wants an offer like UFA are getting. Maybe he forgot that he's not an UFA, but a tagged UFA, and they never get what UFA get.
Sorry JPP - sign a nice contract with some guaranteed money and play out the rest of your career as a Giants with plenty in the bank for you and your family.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
If the FO forgoes a long-term contract and instead relies on the 1 year tender, then I hope JPP does what's best for him as such a move is a clear indication that JPP is not in their long-term plans. At which point, the only leverage he has is to withhold his services. He can sit in Florida and show up the day before the regular season and get his 17 mil. If the Giants feel they will play hardball and pull the tender in training camp, then he becomes a UFA. There are teams that will still give him the money and long-term security that comes with it.
...it takes two to tango. They aren't going to cut him late once the FA market doesn't afford them the ability to somehow alleviate his loss. IMO Mara stepped in for one reason, he sniffs a title shot. And he's right.
The last time we tagged JPP he skipped off-season activities and then blew up his hand.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
Right... I forgot you aren't to be taken seriously in JPP discussions. Talk about red herrings....
The first time around the franchise tag with JPP I was one of the few people here that deserved to be taken seriously. Most people were shooting the same homer garbage you are. How'd that work out?
Simple as that. It may be for the best, and I am also thinking they may end up going DE in the first round anyway, unless we want the same crap to happen to the DLine that has already happened to the OLine. When you don't stay ahead of it, or draft a bust with an 11th pick, this is what it looks like, we need a defensive end, we may not be able or may not want to keep JPP next season. There are a few players that look like good ones this draft, if that kid from Tennessee is there and we don't take him, then we are nuts.
Doesn't necessarily beat one very good DE. And some of those five are questionable at best AND we don't even know if the Giants wanted to or even could sign any additional players.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
And his eventual replacement will probably be on the roster via the upcoming draft.
There is some upside to playing on the tag. No long term commitment if he gets hurt/under performs and gives the Giants a season to see what they have behind him.
Doesn't necessarily beat one very good DE. And some of those five are questionable at best AND we don't even know if the Giants wanted to or even could sign any additional players.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
JPP ain't Eli. Not in the same universe when it comes to impacting wins and losses. But I have said repeatedly that once Eli retires I would want to see the team move away from the franchise quarterback model. Given the enormous attrition and reduced practice time in the NFL I'd favor a greater emphasis on improving depth and simplifying the way we play the game.
There's a surprising lot of sentiment out there that the Giants
should let Hankins go. It makes no sense, so they say, to have two run stuffing tackles playing next to each other, especially when your DEs are strong against the run.
I've also read that Hankins is less effective now playing farther away from the ball and that ideally he should be a nose tackle.
Also that this draft is so deep in DTs that the Giants can find a good pass rushing tackle with a middle round draft pick.
(Whenever I get the argument that it's fine to let a very good player walk because we'll replace him in the draft - and with a middle pick at that - it's just like, haven't they noticed yet how hard it is to hit on a draft choice, even with the 9th overall pick. Just because some lineman played really well in the Gator Bowl doesn't mean he's NFL Hall of Fame material.)
Those arguments for letting Hankins walk seem to make some sense.
The best argument for keep him, in my opinion, is "if it ain't broke don't fix it."
This defense we know was playing at a very high level with Hankins. How the defense plays without Hankins is just speculation.
Has it occurred to you that Hankins is not as good as you think hence why he is still available? 2015 he was lousy before injury. IN 2016 he played well but was he the benefit of Snacks, Jpp and Vernon?
Personally I would just let him walk but I am hearing some big numbers tossed around.
I hope they get it done. If it reduces his cap number enough that we can bring Hankins and Robinson back, maybe even get a RB like Blount, this off season will be very solid and the draft can set us up for a run.
Doesn't necessarily beat one very good DE. And some of those five are questionable at best AND we don't even know if the Giants wanted to or even could sign any additional players.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
The Giants could of gone after Jabaal Sheard 3 years/ $21 Mill) and re-signed Hankins, Robinson and possibly a better OT, and even s Vet RB.
As good as JPP is, you need talent all over your roster. Free agency is for filling holes and the draft is for a starter or 2, depth and the future. A DE could be selected in the first 3 rounds.
So why don't GM's copy New England.
Can you imagine Little Bill being held hostage like this.?
He should have been gone and a comp pick awarded. No player - other than a QB - is worth 10% of your cap.
3 x 6 is much bigger than 1 x 18.
That's the real "new math".
Said it on another thread, but Vernon/Snacks already give the Giants a defensive line better than most. I still think a long term deal gets done, and if it doesn't, oh well - guess we're stuck with the best run stopping defensive player in the league and 1 of the best 2 way DEs in the NFL. Bummer.
We are capable of having the NFL's most dominant DL
That is what you WANT if you DESIRE a true SB run. Assuming we sign DT Hankins long-term; assuming health for all four starters; assuming development of the youth; and, assuming we get a LB who can rush and play the run better than Casillas, this front seven could be devastating to ANY Offense in the league.
Eli can than manage games and hit the big play as available.
We have the potential to again have a top 3 overall defense and special teams. All we need is for the offense to be productive. We added blocking so lets see how this works out.
The last time we tagged JPP he skipped off-season activities and then blew up his hand.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
Right... I forgot you aren't to be taken seriously in JPP discussions. Talk about red herrings....
The first time around the franchise tag with JPP I was one of the few people here that deserved to be taken seriously. Most people were shooting the same homer garbage you are. How'd that work out?
Another post and the same tired point is made, an irrelevant one at that. Continue to repeat yourself though.
In regard to what? Your sour grape reiteration that you didn't want JPP before he blew his hand up and now every mention of him in a thread requires you to flaunt your Nostradamus level of insight? No point can be made to you.
I already said the market for a player of JPP's quality is well over a $10 mill cap hit. So, your argument that we could have 3 jags on D for that hit is a facile and silly thing. Others mentioned the same latter point. Do you have an actual point? Or are you just going to mention JPP's fireworks for the third time in a row and keep crowing?
He played much better than I expected last year but this is an enormous hit. Question: can you sign a tendered player and then trade him immediately as they do in the NBA?
He is a one trick pony as far as his moves on rushing the passer....
I don't trust him, to play 16 game seasons....
Reese had to know he was opening a can of worms, by signing Snacks and Vernon, to huge contracts.....he knew that Hankins and JPP would be in line at his door with their hand out too....
Doesn't every one remember the lack of pressure/sacks this defensive line had last season when it rushed only four? Yes, it shut down the running game, but QB's had time to pass..... Enough credit has not been given to the back 7, who played much better than the previous year, with Apple, Jenkins, and DRC back there....that and the stupid OC's that didn't take advantage of what we were trotting out there at FS....
missed 17 games in his career. JPP has missed 18 already in half the time.
Osi missed 12 games in 9 years here. Tuck missed 14 games in 9 years.
Way less injured??
FIC, Wouldn't it be nice if the poster you corrected would actually come back to the thread to thank you for correcting them? That way they don't walk around spreading false information. Instead it's almost always crickets
He is a one trick pony as far as his moves on rushing the passer....
I don't trust him, to play 16 game seasons....
Reese had to know he was opening a can of worms, by signing Snacks and Vernon, to huge contracts.....he knew that Hankins and JPP would be in line at his door with their hand out too....
Doesn't every one remember the lack of pressure/sacks this defensive line had last season when it rushed only four? Yes, it shut down the running game, but QB's had time to pass..... Enough credit has not been given to the back 7, who played much better than the previous year, with Apple, Jenkins, and DRC back there....that and the stupid OC's that didn't take advantage of what we were trotting out there at FS....
According to Spotrac JPP's cap number in 2017 is $16.934. According to the same site, the following free agents have signed contracts with the following 2017 cap numbers:
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
I think JPPs cap number has made him far too expansive for us and I think Reese should have known this. There had to be decent pass rushers out there in FA who he could have signed and saved a ton of money to spend elsewhere
"Not for nothing, if JPP plays on the tag, I imagine we're going to get the best game he's going to play at this point in his career. That well might be worth 17 mill guar."
That is based on what? My point, since you asked, is that the other time he was franchised he did NOT give the Giants great football. And even if he hadn't blown up his hand he was skipping all offseason activity. How was that going to result in him playing great football?
Homer bullshit is still bullshit. The Giants fucked up tagging him. Twice.
Doesn't necessarily beat one very good DE. And some of those five are questionable at best AND we don't even know if the Giants wanted to or even could sign any additional players.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
JPP ain't Eli. Not in the same universe when it comes to impacting wins and losses. But I have said repeatedly that once Eli retires I would want to see the team move away from the franchise quarterback model. Given the enormous attrition and reduced practice time in the NFL I'd favor a greater emphasis on improving depth and simplifying the way we play the game.
people need to remember that the Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer so that proves your theory..
How about now? They have painted themselves into a corner with JPP. They can't seem to sign him, because of him they can't sign anyone else (including their own) and if nothing changes he will cost them $17M which he will never come close to playing to. This guy is a myth.
Sign him then trade him to the Browns (where the ingrate will never see another playoff game) for Joe Thomas. Resign Hankins and Robinson. Platoon Wynn (1st and 2nd downs) with Okwara and Odiggy (2nd and 3rd downs) and draft a DE in the first three rounds. Overall, the D will end up better off and you have a real LT.
get a compensatory pick if they rescind and he signs elsehwere?
From what I know re: comp pick calculation, only players on their initial rookie contract who leave are factored into the comp pick equation. JPP will be on his 3rd contract so no comp pick.
When should the Giants be getting concerned.....
johnboyw : 7:32 pm : link : reply
How about now? They have painted themselves into a corner with JPP. They can't seem to sign him, because of him they can't sign anyone else (including their own) and if nothing changes he will cost them $17M which he will never come close to playing to. This guy is a myth.
Sign him then trade him to the Browns (where the ingrate will never see another playoff game) for Joe Thomas. Resign Hankins and Robinson. Platoon Wynn (1st and 2nd downs) with Okwara and Odiggy (2nd and 3rd downs) and draft a DE in the first three rounds. Overall, the D will end up better off and you have a real LT.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
and for this reason, the Giants have the leverage. The closer we get to the season, the more JPP has to think about passing on a long term deal, likely worth $60 million +. (Similar to what he did the summer that he blew up half of his hand) If he gets hurt week 1 and doesn't sign it...bye bye long term deal....forever.
The Giants were never going to let JPP just walk away scot free. Nor should they have. That approach would hurt our chances to win both short and long term.
My gut says the Giants and JPP are going to come to terms on a long term deal. JPP knows the risk of playing on a tag and I doubt he gives up a chance at 50-60 million guaranteed.
really? Since they would then know thatey have that $17 mill, the could lock up Hankins. It took 3 yrs to replace Linval Joseph, that would be done. THey would have money in reserve for helpful camp casualties, maybe find a good PK who they would then be able to pay.
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
People get tired of hearing me bitch about Vernon's contract, and franchising JPP. I get that I'm a broken record, but the stakes are enormous with these two players. They HAVE to be elite AND play a 16 game season in order to be worth the cost.
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
right again. they beat 3 playoff teams without him. They lost when DRC got hurt.
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
Calais Campbell has a hit of 10.5 mill with 30 mill guaranteed over 4 years (60 mill total btw, 15 mill average salary).
All Pro game-changing 4-3 DEs are worth more than mediocre talent. That much we knew already.
Not for nothing, if JPP plays on the tag, I imagine we're going to get the best game he's going to play at this point in his career. That well might be worth 17 mill guar.
The Giants are not in bad near, medium, or long-term cap shape. Adding up numbers on a cap hit for this year tells so little of the story it's virtually not worth discussing.
There just aren't players on the market this year the Giants think are worth the investment.
I agree it will suck if he plays on the tag, leaves next year, and we lose Hankins in the interim. That's one reason I'd pull the tag, and use the money to resign Hankins. His demands should be a lot more reasonable now that the market has spoken.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
In comment 13393113 wonderback said:
He may be done playing with fireworks, but he's playing with fire now by not signing. If something similar were to happen to him (heaven forbid), the Giants could pull the tag and he'd get nothing. Given his past you would think he'd know better and be satisfied with a nice offer from the Giants. Too bad his ego is getting in the way and he wants an offer like UFA are getting. Maybe he forgot that he's not an UFA, but a tagged UFA, and they never get what UFA get.
Sorry JPP - sign a nice contract with some guaranteed money and play out the rest of your career as a Giants with plenty in the bank for you and your family.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
Right... I forgot you aren't to be taken seriously in JPP discussions. Talk about red herrings....
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
If the FO forgoes a long-term contract and instead relies on the 1 year tender, then I hope JPP does what's best for him as such a move is a clear indication that JPP is not in their long-term plans. At which point, the only leverage he has is to withhold his services. He can sit in Florida and show up the day before the regular season and get his 17 mil. If the Giants feel they will play hardball and pull the tender in training camp, then he becomes a UFA. There are teams that will still give him the money and long-term security that comes with it.
Quote:
The last time we tagged JPP he skipped off-season activities and then blew up his hand.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
Right... I forgot you aren't to be taken seriously in JPP discussions. Talk about red herrings....
The first time around the franchise tag with JPP I was one of the few people here that deserved to be taken seriously. Most people were shooting the same homer garbage you are. How'd that work out?
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
Might be best to see if JPP can make it through an entire year healthy.
And his eventual replacement will probably be on the roster via the upcoming draft.
There is some upside to playing on the tag. No long term commitment if he gets hurt/under performs and gives the Giants a season to see what they have behind him.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
JPP ain't Eli. Not in the same universe when it comes to impacting wins and losses. But I have said repeatedly that once Eli retires I would want to see the team move away from the franchise quarterback model. Given the enormous attrition and reduced practice time in the NFL I'd favor a greater emphasis on improving depth and simplifying the way we play the game.
I've also read that Hankins is less effective now playing farther away from the ball and that ideally he should be a nose tackle.
Also that this draft is so deep in DTs that the Giants can find a good pass rushing tackle with a middle round draft pick.
(Whenever I get the argument that it's fine to let a very good player walk because we'll replace him in the draft - and with a middle pick at that - it's just like, haven't they noticed yet how hard it is to hit on a draft choice, even with the 9th overall pick. Just because some lineman played really well in the Gator Bowl doesn't mean he's NFL Hall of Fame material.)
Those arguments for letting Hankins walk seem to make some sense.
The best argument for keep him, in my opinion, is "if it ain't broke don't fix it."
This defense we know was playing at a very high level with Hankins. How the defense plays without Hankins is just speculation.
I hope they get it done. If it reduces his cap number enough that we can bring Hankins and Robinson back, maybe even get a RB like Blount, this off season will be very solid and the draft can set us up for a run.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
The Giants could of gone after Jabaal Sheard 3 years/ $21 Mill) and re-signed Hankins, Robinson and possibly a better OT, and even s Vet RB.
As good as JPP is, you need talent all over your roster. Free agency is for filling holes and the draft is for a starter or 2, depth and the future. A DE could be selected in the first 3 rounds.
Can you imagine Little Bill being held hostage like this.?
He should have been gone and a comp pick awarded. No player - other than a QB - is worth 10% of your cap.
3 x 6 is much bigger than 1 x 18.
That's the real "new math".
Said it on another thread, but Vernon/Snacks already give the Giants a defensive line better than most. I still think a long term deal gets done, and if it doesn't, oh well - guess we're stuck with the best run stopping defensive player in the league and 1 of the best 2 way DEs in the NFL. Bummer.
Eli can than manage games and hit the big play as available.
We have the potential to again have a top 3 overall defense and special teams. All we need is for the offense to be productive. We added blocking so lets see how this works out.
Quote:
In comment 13393243 Go Terps said:
Quote:
The last time we tagged JPP he skipped off-season activities and then blew up his hand.
I wouldn't assume a good season.
Right... I forgot you aren't to be taken seriously in JPP discussions. Talk about red herrings....
The first time around the franchise tag with JPP I was one of the few people here that deserved to be taken seriously. Most people were shooting the same homer garbage you are. How'd that work out?
Another post and the same tired point is made, an irrelevant one at that. Continue to repeat yourself though.
In regard to what? Your sour grape reiteration that you didn't want JPP before he blew his hand up and now every mention of him in a thread requires you to flaunt your Nostradamus level of insight? No point can be made to you.
I already said the market for a player of JPP's quality is well over a $10 mill cap hit. So, your argument that we could have 3 jags on D for that hit is a facile and silly thing. Others mentioned the same latter point. Do you have an actual point? Or are you just going to mention JPP's fireworks for the third time in a row and keep crowing?
Injured way less than strahan, tuck, osi
And that's even invludingbthe fireworks incident.
ron mexico : 8:31 am : link : reply
Is such bullshit.
Injured way less than strahan, tuck, osi
Strahan fail to play at least 15 games twice in a 15 year career(3 times if you look at his rookie year where he had 0 starts)
JPP failed to play in at least 15 games 3 times in a 7 year career (not including his rookie year when he had 0 starts).
In what capacity does that make Strahan more injured? Hell, you can almost make a case that Osi and Tuck missed less games proportionally to JPP too.
Osi missed 12 games in 9 years here. Tuck missed 14 games in 9 years.
Way less injured??
I don't trust him, to play 16 game seasons....
Reese had to know he was opening a can of worms, by signing Snacks and Vernon, to huge contracts.....he knew that Hankins and JPP would be in line at his door with their hand out too....
Doesn't every one remember the lack of pressure/sacks this defensive line had last season when it rushed only four? Yes, it shut down the running game, but QB's had time to pass..... Enough credit has not been given to the back 7, who played much better than the previous year, with Apple, Jenkins, and DRC back there....that and the stupid OC's that didn't take advantage of what we were trotting out there at FS....
Cap does not grow on trees......
Osi missed 12 games in 9 years here. Tuck missed 14 games in 9 years.
Way less injured??
FIC, Wouldn't it be nice if the poster you corrected would actually come back to the thread to thank you for correcting them? That way they don't walk around spreading false information. Instead it's almost always crickets
I don't trust him, to play 16 game seasons....
Reese had to know he was opening a can of worms, by signing Snacks and Vernon, to huge contracts.....he knew that Hankins and JPP would be in line at his door with their hand out too....
Doesn't every one remember the lack of pressure/sacks this defensive line had last season when it rushed only four? Yes, it shut down the running game, but QB's had time to pass..... Enough credit has not been given to the back 7, who played much better than the previous year, with Apple, Jenkins, and DRC back there....that and the stupid OC's that didn't take advantage of what we were trotting out there at FS....
Cap does not grow on trees......
That one trick pony was on pace for 10 sacks.
Chris Baker (DE) - $6
Domata Peko (DT) - $3.35
Eddie Lacy (RB) - $3
Chance Warmack (G) - $1.3
Greg Zeurlein (K) - $2.25
----------------------------
Total - $15.9
I'm not saying the Giants should have signed each or any of those guys. I'm just listing them to provide some perspective...JPP's cap number is enormous.
I think JPPs cap number has made him far too expansive for us and I think Reese should have known this. There had to be decent pass rushers out there in FA who he could have signed and saved a ton of money to spend elsewhere
"Not for nothing, if JPP plays on the tag, I imagine we're going to get the best game he's going to play at this point in his career. That well might be worth 17 mill guar."
That is based on what? My point, since you asked, is that the other time he was franchised he did NOT give the Giants great football. And even if he hadn't blown up his hand he was skipping all offseason activity. How was that going to result in him playing great football?
Homer bullshit is still bullshit. The Giants fucked up tagging him. Twice.
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Doesn't necessarily beat one very good DE. And some of those five are questionable at best AND we don't even know if the Giants wanted to or even could sign any additional players.
Good or great 4-3 ends don't grow on trees. Define great as you wish but compared to every other DE in the NFL, jpp is great.
If both Vernon and jpp miss a few games and come back for the playoffs? Yes. Worth every penny. If they miss too much time oh well you can't play that game. What if Eli gets hurt in 2010? Was his contract a mistake? Of course not.
JPP ain't Eli. Not in the same universe when it comes to impacting wins and losses. But I have said repeatedly that once Eli retires I would want to see the team move away from the franchise quarterback model. Given the enormous attrition and reduced practice time in the NFL I'd favor a greater emphasis on improving depth and simplifying the way we play the game.
people need to remember that the Ravens won the SB with Trent Dilfer so that proves your theory..
Sign him then trade him to the Browns (where the ingrate will never see another playoff game) for Joe Thomas. Resign Hankins and Robinson. Platoon Wynn (1st and 2nd downs) with Okwara and Odiggy (2nd and 3rd downs) and draft a DE in the first three rounds. Overall, the D will end up better off and you have a real LT.
From what I know re: comp pick calculation, only players on their initial rookie contract who leave are factored into the comp pick equation. JPP will be on his 3rd contract so no comp pick.
johnboyw : 7:32 pm : link : reply
How about now? They have painted themselves into a corner with JPP. They can't seem to sign him, because of him they can't sign anyone else (including their own) and if nothing changes he will cost them $17M which he will never come close to playing to. This guy is a myth.
Sign him then trade him to the Browns (where the ingrate will never see another playoff game) for Joe Thomas. Resign Hankins and Robinson. Platoon Wynn (1st and 2nd downs) with Okwara and Odiggy (2nd and 3rd downs) and draft a DE in the first three rounds. Overall, the D will end up better off and you have a real LT.