Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
Its important to note that this is just a reported deal, though, because JPP himself says he has not signed anything.
Follow
Jason Pierre-Paul ✔ @UDWJPP
What the heck is people talking about I ain't sign nothing.
11:43 AM - 17 Mar 2017
1,086 1,086 Retweets 663 663 likes
Follow
Jason Pierre-Paul ✔ @UDWJPP
That's New York media for yah!! They always want the story first and they got it wrong.
11:45 AM - 17 Mar 2017
422 422 Retweets 345 345 likes
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
Art StapletonVerified account @art_stapleton 45s46 seconds ago
More
#Giants and JPP have agreement. Confident in that.
He has not signed contract yet.
I expect @UDWJPP responding to those saying he "signed"
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
And then go through this entire dance (and owe him even more money) next year? That would be very shortsighted.
RE: You can easily call that much guaranteed money, if it's true, a
mistake given JPP's health history. It's hardly an out there claim.
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode to defend other moves. If not in win-now mode, you don't lock yourself into that for this player.
Looking at Eli's age and trajectory and based on every move we've made this offseason, it's obvious to anyone with a brain that we're in win now mode. Not really a question.
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
Yeah I don't get it, just keep him on the one year deal, spend the year trying to get a longterm one. We have other avenues to free up money if needed
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
And then go through this entire dance (and owe him even more money) next year? That would be very shortsighted.
Listen, I like JPP and I hope it works out. But there's a big difference in guaranteeing a player with legit health issues $54M over $17M. Would we end up going through this dance again? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe after 1 more season, we realize his value isn't $17M a season anymore (I don't even think it is now) and we use that $34M we saved in 2018 and 2019 towards areas of need. That's ALOT of money!
Is saying the numbers that are out there aren't accurate. Plus everybody needs to stop looking at the 17 million a year number. It's fake. Guaranteed money is the only thing that matters.
RE: RE: You can easily call that much guaranteed money, if it's true, a
mistake given JPP's health history. It's hardly an out there claim.
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode to defend other moves. If not in win-now mode, you don't lock yourself into that for this player.
Looking at Eli's age and trajectory and based on every move we've made this offseason, it's obvious to anyone with a brain that we're in win now mode. Not really a question.
Look at the OL and seriously tell yourself that again. No clear win now team is starting the dreck we are at three spots, with a QB with a shot internal clock.
If anything, the Giants are in purgatory, neither win-now nor long term building, which makes giving JPP that much guaranteed even more suspect (and I say that as someone who wanted him back).
I think where we disagree is on JPP's worth today. I think he proved he's still an elite DE in this league (even with 7 fingers) and that's just what elite DE's command.
Is saying the numbers that are out there aren't accurate. Plus everybody needs to stop looking at the 17 million a year number. It's fake. Guaranteed money is the only thing that matters.
You keep saying that
Quote:
Guaranteed money is the only thing that matters.
I don't understand what you are saying.
Non-guaranteed salary/bonus does count against the cap when they are earned. The only time that non-guaranteed is not counted against the cap is if the player is released and has yet to be paid.
Now if you are referring to the last year or two of a multi year contract of a soon to be released player I'd agree with you. But if JPP has non-guaranteed salary in the first two years of the contract your statement is wrong. That money will count against the cap if he is on the team.
Is saying the numbers that are out there aren't accurate. Plus everybody needs to stop looking at the 17 million a year number. It's fake. Guaranteed money is the only thing that matters.
The guaranteed amount matters a lot, but you have to look at the entire structure
The guaranteed money alone is $13.5M per year if true... how low can his base salary possibly be in the first 2-3 years... under $1M?... then inflate the final number to like $30M, and essentially 3 year deal?
Guaranteed doesn't mean signing bonus, they are different. They guaranteed his salary for a portion of it.
Signing bonus is part of the guaranteed amount.
For example if the the signing bonus is 25mm then the remaining guarantees are 29mm (assuming 54mm guaranteed)
If the contract is 4 year at 54 mil and 35 guaranteed, that is bad enough, but acceptable, 17 mil with all of it guaranteed is a contract that the Giants would be out of their fucking minds to offer and I don't think they are out of their minds.
Of him in a dr office with his agent. Perhaps getting a physical prior to signing. Also was in Jamaica yesterday and flew back to NY early this AM, and based of his snaps he wasn't too pleased to have left his vacation.
are not realistic about where this team is right now.
You're looking at probably a (tops) 3 year window with Eli right now.
With this move they have effectively locked up all major players on the defensive side of the football through that window.
Let JPP walk and you are then trying to replace arguably the top 2 way DE in the league. Easier said than done, and everyone knows the value the Giants place on this position anyway. They don't let top DEs in their prime leave.
This team is right there, the goal now is to string together playoff appearances and hopefully let Eli do his thing when he gets there.
Even if 54M is accurate, which i am hesitant that is 13.5M guaranteed per year. If you take 30 for a SB that is 7.5M per year. That leaves 24M. You give him roster bonus totaling 4 (1 per year). that leaves you salary.
If you structure 4M in 17 and 11M in 2018 that gets you to 42M.
You do the same verbiage as Vernon. 11M guaranteed on 3rd day of 2019.
It saves money in 17, the 18 number is manageable and you then get to 2019
JPP gets more guaranteed money than Vernon. Righteous as far as I'm concerned. The league knows the value of the guy. The Cowboys were hoping they wouldn't have to face him this season, at least as a Giant.
Can't fault Reese. He got it done , paying what needed to be paid. He will have a leather noose tightening around his sacks as he begins deliberations for '18 , but right now, it's '17 that matters.
So here is the scorecard:
QB
RB
WR +
TE +
OL
DL -
LB -
DB
SP -
Minus grades at D-Line & LB presuming loss of Hankins & Robinson, respectively. Are they better? That's for you to decide .
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
Follow
Jason Pierre-Paul ✔ @UDWJPP
What the heck is people talking about I ain't sign nothing.
11:43 AM - 17 Mar 2017
1,086 1,086 Retweets 663 663 likes
Follow
Jason Pierre-Paul ✔ @UDWJPP
That's New York media for yah!! They always want the story first and they got it wrong.
11:45 AM - 17 Mar 2017
422 422 Retweets 345 345 likes
Quote:
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
over/under on days until JPP throws his ass in the Hot Tub
More
#Giants and JPP have agreement. Confident in that.
He has not signed contract yet.
I expect @UDWJPP responding to those saying he "signed"
What is the SB, what salary is guaranteed, when is the salary guaranteed.
That's New York media for yah!! They always want the story first and they got it wrong."
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode to defend other moves. If not in win-now mode, you don't lock yourself into that for this player.
Quote:
In comment 13396560 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
And then go through this entire dance (and owe him even more money) next year? That would be very shortsighted.
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode to defend other moves. If not in win-now mode, you don't lock yourself into that for this player.
Looking at Eli's age and trajectory and based on every move we've made this offseason, it's obvious to anyone with a brain that we're in win now mode. Not really a question.
Quote:
In comment 13396560 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
Yeah I don't get it, just keep him on the one year deal, spend the year trying to get a longterm one. We have other avenues to free up money if needed
Now I hear we are going to sign Geno... Say it isn't so Joe!!
JR has lost his mind if the Geno signing is true
The gtd money is a TON for a 4 year deal, you can't deny that and I'm somoene that really wnated JPP signed.
Quote:
In comment 13396579 Josh in the City said:
Quote:
In comment 13396560 Danny Kanell said:
Quote:
Here's hoping it isn't true. That contract would be - in my humble opinion - a big mistake.
How can it be a big mistake? What were you hoping to get a premier DE for? MAYBE $1-2mm less per year? And he's 28 years old, in the prime of his career, proved he can be elite in this defensive system, and it seems to only be guaranteed for the first 3 years. This signing was a must and even if we overpay by a little there is simply no way you can call this a big mistake!
That's not over paying by a little. I'd rather just give him the $17M tag on a 1 year deal.
And then go through this entire dance (and owe him even more money) next year? That would be very shortsighted.
Listen, I like JPP and I hope it works out. But there's a big difference in guaranteeing a player with legit health issues $54M over $17M. Would we end up going through this dance again? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe after 1 more season, we realize his value isn't $17M a season anymore (I don't even think it is now) and we use that $34M we saved in 2018 and 2019 towards areas of need. That's ALOT of money!
Quote:
mistake given JPP's health history. It's hardly an out there claim.
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode to defend other moves. If not in win-now mode, you don't lock yourself into that for this player.
Looking at Eli's age and trajectory and based on every move we've made this offseason, it's obvious to anyone with a brain that we're in win now mode. Not really a question.
Look at the OL and seriously tell yourself that again. No clear win now team is starting the dreck we are at three spots, with a QB with a shot internal clock.
If anything, the Giants are in purgatory, neither win-now nor long term building, which makes giving JPP that much guaranteed even more suspect (and I say that as someone who wanted him back).
When all the contract details come out, it'll be easier to analyze.
Agree 100%.
You keep saying that
Non-guaranteed salary/bonus does count against the cap when they are earned. The only time that non-guaranteed is not counted against the cap is if the player is released and has yet to be paid.
Now if you are referring to the last year or two of a multi year contract of a soon to be released player I'd agree with you. But if JPP has non-guaranteed salary in the first two years of the contract your statement is wrong. That money will count against the cap if he is on the team.
The guaranteed amount matters a lot, but you have to look at the entire structure
People constantly say we're not in win-now mode...
...were wrong.
Now we wait and see the actual contract numbers so we can assess the impact on this years cap.
Quote:
was hoping it'd be lower than that.
The guaranteed money alone is $13.5M per year if true... how low can his base salary possibly be in the first 2-3 years... under $1M?... then inflate the final number to like $30M, and essentially 3 year deal?
Guaranteed doesn't mean signing bonus, they are different. They guaranteed his salary for a portion of it.
Signing bonus is part of the guaranteed amount.
For example if the the signing bonus is 25mm then the remaining guarantees are 29mm (assuming 54mm guaranteed)
I guess the JPP cap hit could come in around that number. I hope not.
You're looking at probably a (tops) 3 year window with Eli right now.
With this move they have effectively locked up all major players on the defensive side of the football through that window.
Let JPP walk and you are then trying to replace arguably the top 2 way DE in the league. Easier said than done, and everyone knows the value the Giants place on this position anyway. They don't let top DEs in their prime leave.
This team is right there, the goal now is to string together playoff appearances and hopefully let Eli do his thing when he gets there.
If you structure 4M in 17 and 11M in 2018 that gets you to 42M.
You do the same verbiage as Vernon. 11M guaranteed on 3rd day of 2019.
It saves money in 17, the 18 number is manageable and you then get to 2019
It is not that hard
Can't fault Reese. He got it done , paying what needed to be paid. He will have a leather noose tightening around his sacks as he begins deliberations for '18 , but right now, it's '17 that matters.
So here is the scorecard:
QB
RB
WR +
TE +
OL
DL -
LB -
DB
SP -
Minus grades at D-Line & LB presuming loss of Hankins & Robinson, respectively. Are they better? That's for you to decide .
Does this re-cement me as a certified asshat in addition to being a certified asshole?
I think you'll have to ask all the asshole asshole-certifiers at BBI.
Yup. NYG are trying to push for one more SB before the Eli window closes. I think it's obvious. We're all in right now.
...but sometimes ya gotta do it.
And sometimes ya gotta say good-bye to old friends.
Johnathan Hankins... so long it's been good to know you.
That's New York media for yah!! They always want the story first and they got it wrong.
No one has tweeted that out.
No one has tweeted that out.
Espns mobile app says that is per Schefter
Quote:
are folks seeing the $54M ($17M per year) figure?
No one has tweeted that out.
Espns mobile app says that is per Schefter
which explains the snapchat of JPP at the doctor's office with his agent.